budaatum:

You once used the word, "archetype", so I would expect you'd understand when John says "Jesus is the archetype of Logos", the Logos itself being the proper understanding of the Word of God, be it that from the Bible or Quran or anywhere, which is what enables one to enter Paradise also referred to by some as the Kingdom of God and the Lord's Tabernacle and heaven where those who worship God will dwell.
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gensteejay:

That's your own opinion, not what Qur'an says.

You've not answered my question at all.

Quote verses from Qur'an to back your answer. That shows you know what you're talking about.

Without any Quranic verse to back your claim, you've not said anything.

budaatum:

It might indeed not be anything to you, but that is my understanding of my reading of both the Quran, and the Bible, which all Muslims must read for a proper understanding instead of lazily relying on a single verse or hadith or three generations of Muslims and thinking that's it.

budaatum:

Lol. You are the one claiming I'm a sophists, as in, one who uses rhetoric to acquire payment. That is the reason I am grateful you will honor the bill that I will send you for the money you accused me of sophistry making you pay me.

Please add 20% service charge or tip when you pay, and thank you in advance.

gensteejay:

You understand Qur'an and yet you can't quote a single verse from this book you so much understand to support what you said about Jesus Christ's teachings.

You even said those of us that understand Arabic and know Qur'an well are brainwashed and indoctrinated.

But you that aren't brainwashed don't even understand Arabic language let alone being able to read Qur'an.

Lols.

budaatum:

Those who understand the Quran know those who worship God through Jesus will end up where Allah wills.

iamdannyfc:

I'm not talking about the payment aspect but the approach used in arguement
Anyway, respect!

gensteejay:

Lols. Allah says his will is to subject them to everlasting torment in hell fire. In almost all chapters of Qur'an, Allah says that clearly there.

Simple statements. No spinning or twisting required.

budaatum:

Chapter and verse!

budaatum:

The approach of sophistry is to lie for payment and I have enough faith in you to pressume you would not arrive at such a conclussion about me without evidence like the bill I sent you for the payment I demanded from you and which I very patiently gratefully respectfully anticipate receiving from you.

gensteejay:

Hope you know the term, "unbelievers", in Islam means Christians, Jews, pagans, people that neither worship nor believe in Allah, etc.

iamdannyfc:

When i said sophist here,i mean teacher of rhetorics.

budaatum:

That's the thing with basic knowledge in anything. Those who have it tend to think they have understanding when in truth they have none. Mostly, they know they have none so they fabricate and lie.

Below is Q.3:198-200 which specifically references Christians as "People of the Scripture" who believe what "was revealed to them":

And indeed, among the People of the Scripture are those who believe in Allah and what was revealed to you and what was revealed to them, [being] humbly submissive to Allah . They do not exchange the verses of Allah for a small price. Those will have their reward with their Lord. Indeed, Allah is swift in account.

gensteejay:

Are you now among the People of the Scripture? Those referred to as the People of the Scripture in Islam are certain Christians and Jews.

Too much confusion in your post. Pick one side and stick to it.

If you say you're among the People of the Scripture, are you submissive to Allah as that verse requires. Hope you know the term, "Muslim", means a person who is submissive to Allah.

Are you among the People of the Scripture (i.e. Christians and Jews) that submit to Allah?

budaatum:

It is not about sides nor about whatever you imagine Allah might do to me, but about a proper understanding of simple text!

It says there very clearly "those People of the Scripture who submit to Allah", which you now admit is Christians and Jews, and not unbelievers as you first implied!

But just so we are clear, buda is not a believer, as you can very easily confirm by searching.

gensteejay:

By submitting to Allah, hope know you've now become a Muslim. If in doubt, check the meaning of a Muslim again.

That verse you quoted applies to the People of the Scripture (Christians and Jews) in Muhammad's time that submitted to Allah on listening to the recitation of Qur'an from him and thus converted to Islam from Christianity/Judaism.

Good luck with your Islamic journey.

gensteejay:



Good luck with your Islamic journey.

Xmuslim:
By: Hassan Radwan

The human condition is one of continuous struggle and no one is exempt from the emotional ups and downs - whether religious or not.

It's true that many (but not all) who lose their faith go through a difficult period of readjustment, but it is precisely because they were religious! Because (for many) Islam consumed their whole identity, dictating every aspect of life. It created a dependence, much like a drug, which when taken away causes a period of difficulty. That is the fault of religion - not disbelief.

But once one gets through that phase, there is nothing in life better than facing the reality of life with all its joys and sorrows with honesty and clarity. The feeling that all humanity is one Ummah. The increased love, compassion and empathy for the human condition - without all the biases and group think.

I would never swap the indescribable feeling of being true to myself for the false promises of religion - which does not offer the complete peace and joy many Muslims claim.

budaatum:

And I don't need luck. Allah put a brain in my head and I've learnt how to use it.

gensteejay:

Maybe you should first read the history of some Jews and Christians that accepted Islam during Muhammad's time.

Then, you'll see you've been saying nonsense on this thread.

You don't even have basic knowledge of Qur'an or Allah. You don't have basic knowledge of Muhammad's Sunnah or his history.

It's really dumb discussing this way about a book you've not read from the front to the back (the ex-Muslim you're discussing with would have read the whole Qur'an not less than 10 times).

Depending on their age, a typical Muslim that understands Arabic would read the whole Qur'an at least once in a year, especially during Ramadhan.

It's really silly to say such kind of people don't understand Qur'an but you do, yet you don't even understand Arabic and can't even read Qur'an, except merely selecting one or two verses in English here and there to form an uninformed conclusion about a religion you don't have basic knowledge of.

Even Muslims would be laughing at your posts here because you don't even know the basics.

budaatum:
I'm certain those Muslims will point out my nonsense in due time. Your's clearly isn't it.

gensteejay:

Better you stop confusing yourself all about, claiming to be among the People of the Scripture (Christians and Jews) in one post, and calling yourself a follower of Jesus Christ in another, and yet in another post, calling yourself a worshipper of Allah. All rolled into one.

Better to choose one side, go back to atheism, or don't pick any one at all.

How can the same person keep jumping ship in a a matter of minutes (from Christianity, to Christ's followership, to Allah's worship)?

Utter confusion.

gensteejay:

You don't even understand Arabic and can't read Qur'an, except merely cherrypicking a handful of quranic verses in English to support your uninformed opinion about a religion you've never practised.

I said that because most of the things you're saying on this thread can only come someone with shallow knowledge about Sharia, Qur'an, and Sunnah.

You can't simply understand Islam like someone like OP that practised (practice against the theoretical knowledge you've) the religion for years or for someone like me that practised it for 30 years before eventually applying tests of logic and scrutiny to it.

You're even a follower (worshipper) of Jesus Christ. Lols and you're commenting about Islam, a religion you've never practised.

You can't even read Qur'an. That's a big joke.

You've no idea about what you've been saying on this thread. It's so glaring.

I'm sure you're merely joking around on this thread.

You don't discuss Islam without citing facts to back your claims from Qur'an and haadith.

You've been merely giving your opinion about Islamic concepts ignorantly. Even Sunni Muslims (Ahlu Sunnah) would laugh at your ignorance on this thread.

Please, stop commenting on a religion you've never practised.

Having practical knowledge about things (especially knowledge of Arabic) is different from merely checking a few things about Islam on Google to argue on Nairaland and cherrypicking few parts from Qur'an to support your ill-informed thoughts about Islam.

No true Muslim cherrypicks few parts of Qur'an and ignore the rest.

You don't even have the aqeedah (creed) required for a (Sunni) Muslim. I guess you need to start from the 6 articles of faith in Islam first because your comments on this thread show you don't even know any of those (hence, your love to cherrypick few parts of Qur'an that appeal to you).

tintingz:


You just said everything I've been trying to tell Budaatum.

Xmuslim:
Some people were made to believe.....

gensteejay:
Better to ignore some silly comments.

Xmuslim:


I wish you good luck in your Islamic journey

tintingz:


Budaatum anti-spam bot is banning me and hidden my post. I'm suspecting someone is doing it.

So I won't bother responding, so maybe in another thread.

Xmuslim sorry this isn't for you tho.

AbdulSleeky: