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Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 12:07pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
TAO11: Point it out are afriad, You cant put your lying mouth to a test again Lol, TAO11 bring the evidence |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 1:16pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
gregyboy:I know for sure that I’m about to pieces and shatter your wooden heart because you must have prayed hard that I should ignore you, so you can continue deluding yourself to bed tonight. This is about the third time or fourth time I will be posting this to you, yet you pretend each time that I haven’t quoted any such thing despite attempting once to reply to it but only to end up shooting yourself in the skull. Here you go again dullard. Read carefully and cry yourself to sleep again: I wrote that A.F.C. Ryder, 1965’s hypothesis as well as Williams, 1974’s (which Lawal, 1977 follows) have been thoroughly debunked by subsequent archaeological finds. I also noted that Ryder’s unfamiliarity with certain information such as the significance of Oba Eweka’s morning ritual to Ife while facing eastward towards the rising sun at dawn also contributed to his confusion and misinterpretation. The following are Ryder’s precise words which I have now over-quoted : “Curiously, Ryder, in pursuing his argument, does so in full awareness of a fact which one might have expected to moderate his enthusiasm for it. Here, I refer to the ritual in which the Oba of Benin addresses prayers to his forefathers at Ife through an eastward facing window at dawn, thus making an identification (albeit a symbolic one) between Ife and the east.* Far from sounding a note of caution in the face of this fact, he regards it as yet further evidence that the original home of the Eweka dynasty was not Ife but some more easterly or north-easterly center. His reasoning seem to be that, since the symbolism of dawn and east is alien to Ife or indeed Yoruba religious life, the ritual must represent a relatively recent grafting of the idea of Ife as dynastic home, on to a more ancient practice directed to the real dynastic home in the east or north-east. In fact, as further information now makes plain, Ryder’s interpretation of this ritual is misguided. To start with, if we turn to Dahomey, on the opposite margin of our region, we find much the same identification. Thus Maupoil, in his classic account of Dahomean religion, tells once more of a strong association of Ife with dawn and the east. He adds that although in this area the association is one that actually does correspond with geographical reality, in the minds of the people it is not so much a summary of geographical observation as a highly appropriate piece of symbolism. For Dahomeans, dawn and the east are in this context first and foremost symbols of certain admired attributes of Ife.* Again, several scholars have noticed, there is an epithet widely current in our region which praises the city as: “Ife, creator of the world, whence come the dawn”.* Far from being something isolated and alien, then, this symbolic association of Ife with dawn and the east is something highly characteristic of the region. Had Ryder known of this background to the Oba’s dawn prayers, he would surely have drawn somewhat different conclusions ... And had he taken this into account, he would surely have been less enthusiastic about his “look anywhere but west” approach. Further information has also cast doubt on the iconographic arguments with which Ryder buttresses his case. Thus we now have several examples of the Maltese-cross symbols on terra-cotta materials excavated at Ife.* And the presence of this symbol in the city’s archaeological deposits vitiates the argument [with which Ryder buttresses his case], ... Again, we now have several examples of the “cat’s-whisker” facial mark on terra-cotta heads excavated at “classical” Ife sites. And the presence of this mark vitiates yet another argument.* ... Oddly, he himself acknowledges in a footnote the existence of one “cat’s whisker” head excavated at Ife. But rather than allow it cast doubt on his argument, he treats it as the exception that proves the rule. With discovery of several such pieces, however, such special pleading, already dubious, becomes totally unacceptable. Nor are the Maltese cross and the “cat’s-whisker” the only Bini motifs for which Ife counterparts have been established over the past few years. On the contrary, recent excavations at Ife have revealed a whole series of motifs previously thought to be peculiar to Benin.* Along with the new iconographic findings, we have also acquired an impressive series of dates. Application of carbon-14 and thermoluminescience [sic] techniques to excavated materials has enabled us to assign approximate absolute dates to several major Ife settlement levels and to the terra-cotta and brass works associated with them. Dates for terra-cotta pieces range from c. A.D. 1000 onward; whilst dates for brass pieces range from c. A.D. 1275 to c. A.D. 1440. Application of these techniques to materials from Owo and Benin has also enabled us to assign dates to some of the ”classical” terra-cotta and brass-work associated with these cities. Significantly, the Owo and Benin date-series begin slightly later than their Ife counterparts. One particularly interesting Benin date is for a brass piece previously assessed by Fagg and Dark as early on the ground of its Ife-type naturalism. Thermoluminescence tests give it a date of c. AD. 1420 — just what it should be on the premises adopted by these authors.*.” ~ Robin Horton, “Ancient Ife: A Reassessment”, Journal of the Historical Society of Nigeria, Vol. 9, No. 4 (June 1979), pp. 85-87. 26 Likes |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 1:35pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
Continuation. cc: gregyboy "This is not to say that some of the facts to which Williams in particular has drawn attention pose no difficulties for the consensualists. But it is to say that the difficulties are no longer insuperable. Indeed, I myself can think of at least one way in which one might plausibly reconcile the undeniable technical differences between the Ife and Benin brass traditions with the consensual postulate of Ife inspiration of the Benin work. Thus one can start by supposing that when the Ife brass-casters went to Benin, they encountered an already flourishing terra-cotta or mud-sculpture tradition, in which considerable quantities of dung were mixed with the moulding clay, and in which complex armatures were used to hold large figures together. Given the dependence of brass-casting on clay work, the in-coming Ife technique might well, in such circumstances, have been grafted on to the indigenous Benin terra-cotta or mud technique to produce a new tradition. Such a tradition would have been distinct in technique from both its sources, but would also have owed something to both.* Other ways of reconciling the new facts with the earlier orthodoxy may occur to the interested reader. As regards the alternative interpretations offered by Ryder and Williams, the recent evidence makes these look decidedly improbable. By-passing Ife and looking to the Benin confederacy, Jukun confederacy or Idah as possible homes of the Ogane now seems far-fetched, to say the least. By-passing Ife and looking to sixteenth-century Portuguese craftsmen for the origin of the Benin brass tradition would now be nothing short of perverse. ... Summing up, I would say that Obayemi's critique, like the efforts of Ryder and Williams before him, has been rendered out of date by fresh information.” ~ Robin Horton, “Ancient Ife: A Reassessment”, Journal of the Historical Society of Nigeria, Vol. 9, No. 4 (June 1979), pp. 87-90 17 Likes |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by GarangDeMabior: 2:30pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
It pains and bleeds my heart seeing yorubas and binis arguing. how can two brothers be so foolish in allowing unnecessary arguments put knife in what binds them together. That's bad to see this display by two brothers that are heavily bonded. gregyboy TAO11 Samuk Areafada2 |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 2:32pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
GarangDeMabior:Lol ... It’s obvious that I was simply teaching. 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 2:50pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
TAO11: I need pictures of the Maltese cross found on ife sculpture, I need a dahomey website agreeing to ife as a supreme kingdom fron the east You fool, ryder was not working with oba eweka11 statement although maybe he did he made use of old documents from benins to have know or determine the location of oghene Eweka11 statements were said, for political and cultural gains from yorubas which Ryder and Thornton noted, ryder was fully aware of eweka11 statements so definitely he was not confused he consider it too, and it know that the benis were altering their history for reasons known to them Even if ryder had the evidence on dahomey acknowledging ife as east that wont still chsnge anything because dahomey is not benin, the Portuguese never stood in dahomey when the benins gave them that information, Anway still i want to see the evidence from dahomey acknowledging it, for my curiosity and for me to determine the degree of your lies and desperation because it wont still alter a thing from ryders work if found to be true Finding wiskers on ife or owo artwork still wouldn't alter anything the only people in osun that has the cat whiskers are not from ife, Nevertheless, owo cultures has nothing to do with whiskers in their culture but we have seen some owo Terre cotta sculpture with whiskers same could be said for ife..... This again boils to my fact that this various non cultural features to this sculptures was because the artsains who made and sold the sculptures to ife and owo were not msking them to Refrence the culture of both tribes but to his own taste olowo made it know that art merchants in the Olds sold this sculptures to them and it was not unique to their people unlike the benin, this same purchasing can be associated with ife because of lack of evidence of artesians at ife who made the artworks , and also lack of cultural identities of the sculpture from the ife people, willams also made it known in his article Again i need to see pictures and articles supoirting ife sculptures dating from 1100 above And further evidence that shows ife to be older than benin and owo because the last evidence i read was owo palace was the oldest palace amongst all other Yorubas palace So bring evidence to all this to me 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 2:53pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
gregyboy:Like I did sometimes in the course of the week, I also won’t be pushing this page further so that your joke, downfall, and delusions can be witnessed by as many views as possible. I have obviously done you strong thing. Your original plan was to defend Benin kingdom, but now you’re disgracing Benin kingdom. www.nairaland.com/attachments/12309685_668c998e8893433fbaf39d9b378b2578_jpeg_jpeg0e2b6593918df46451be74114847971c Moreover, evidence for your lie about the Olowo or 600 years for your. www.nairaland.com/attachments/12301183_ff6b85c3ad57474484c063b093181dc3_jpeg_jpeg8421690b69e5da85ef6252256d76dc5e I really pray that you eventually recover from all that have hit you lately. Cheers! 11 Likes
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Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 3:09pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
TAO11: Bring me my evidence dont laff it off Etinosa1234 AreaFada2 Sarah20A Samuk Valirex Ghostwon Prolog Please help me beg her to bring my evidence 1 Like
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Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 3:11pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
gregyboy:Stop disgracing Benin Kingdom. 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 3:13pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
TAO11: I need your nunh for apology and compensation for wasting my time defeating you on your lies |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 3:16pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
gregyboy:Many people have seen your picture on Nairaland before, some of these people know your family. I have “uselessed” you enough, stop further disgracing yourself, your family, and Benin. Have some self-dignity. Haba! 2 Likes |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by Keraxes: 6:07pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
BornRicch:Yes I’m from Ibadan. You don help your useless wretched olofo oba of Benin first and your worthless family |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by BornRicch(m): 8:35pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
Keraxes: Guy I done tire for your nuisance behavior. I bet you're a very low life person. I'm trying to be reasonable with you and entertain our conversation but you're just a pain child. I wish to see you and Bleep you up. I swear to God, I don't know you but I'm very certain I'll beat you up.... |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 10:28pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
Ofunwa111:@gregyboy, it appears that my job of letting folks realize that you’re a nuisance actually works out after all. cc: Mraphel, Christistruth00, ..., AreaFada2 4 Likes |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by Keraxes: 10:31pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
BornRicch:Just tell your useless family to get your casket ready because you’re going down |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 11:28pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
TAO11: I want ur nunu i dont mind if it smell like fish i will wear my dick mask 2 Likes
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Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 11:30pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
gregyboy:Stop disgracing your family. 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 11:37pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
2 Likes |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by TAO11(f): 11:57pm On Sep 11, 2020 |
gregyboy:That Igbo young man begs to differ. I actually warned you, but you won’t listen until everyone found that you’re a nuisance. cc: Ofunwa111 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by AreaFada2: 12:13am On Sep 12, 2020 |
gregyboy: Na cross dresser. No nunu anywhere. |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by AreaFada2: 12:18am On Sep 12, 2020 |
gregyboy: Chai! You forced a Conehead-Igbo collabo on top Benin matter. If you know they are water and oil, you'll see what a massive thing you have done. You really pepper them. Ere n'ekhere. 2 Likes |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by gregyboy(m): 12:20am On Sep 12, 2020 |
AreaFada2: Eviboh niyan awozwor 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by GarangDeMabior: 2:04am On Sep 12, 2020 |
AreaFada2: mtcheew. Stop selling fake Igbo Bini history. it won't fly. 1 Like |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by BornRicch(m): 12:53pm On Sep 12, 2020 |
Keraxes:Funny dude.... Thanks for your time, I'm out. |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by Keraxes: 3:07pm On Sep 12, 2020 |
BornRicch:You are in already for this |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by Nobody: 10:43pm On Sep 12, 2020 |
Not only that. Most of them had haltcast children for the whites those days. A good example is shan George and so many I know and read about. According to history, the whites dominated some parts of rivers while working at the oil well and the women there frolicked around them not knowing their stay was temporal until these white go back to their countries unannounced, leaving many of them pregnant. They really had a lot of dealings with the whites in the early years. You'll also hear names like Harry Smart Brain Franklin this one was a haltcast my childhood friend. I never saw his dad. His mum was ebony black. His younger brother Smith was black ( guess she had him for another man). So I wanna believe that's the reason. |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by iObEy(m): 4:15am On Sep 22, 2020 |
No kind of rubbish people no go talk here in the name of history. |
Re: About The Surnames Of Rivers State Indigenes by LogicBomb8: 4:33pm On Jun 22, 2022 |
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