cdoffx:

i've not taken side between Gbagbo,Quattara and french force

MyJoe:

when civilians are being slaughtered on the streets?[/quote]
This was the same reason Hitler gave for invading poland in 1939 saying the ethnic poles were killing Polish Germans.
My Question to Sagamite earlier way this, at what point do you intervene? and who verifies that the reason given for intervention is actually taking place?
If not tomorrow foreign powers can distort information and enter one country for bombing armed civilians(Libya), while if Isreal bombs Gaza they just cry out,

cdoffx:

@Sagamite
i'm not one of those that doesn't pick out the sense in other peoples point  even though we've contrasting opinion so i won't say you're senseless but a fool will know that i've not taken side between Gbagbo,Quattara and french force i only talked as an independent observer but because you insult me though i hate insulting people but yet i'll sum up your folly in two sentence and will not respond to you again cause silence is the best answer for a fool like you
1.I see you stay in london so wind there has blown out of your head the African sense of courtesy that respect is reciprocal and that you don't just talk to people anyhow not even children.
2. Your parents have failed to instill properly in you wisdom and respect that is why the wind there could easily blow them out of you head.
Remember this is not poundsland but nairaland, we've respect in Africa. Goodbye

superboi:

This was the same reason Hitler gave for invading poland in 1939 saying the ethnic poles were killing Polish Germans.
My Question to Sagamite earlier way this, at what point do you intervene? and who verifies that the reason given for intervention is actually taking place?
If not tomorrow foreign powers can distort information and enter one country for bombing armed civilians(Libya), while if Isreal bombs Gaza they just cry out,

MyJoe:

Just a quick point, sir.

There is nothing necessarily wrong in taking sides, as long as you retain your objectivity and intellectual honesty. When there is a clash been good and bad, between an election winner and an a goon who wants to override the people's wishes, between saving lives and bloodletting, it is wrong not to take sides.

Sagamite:

You are reeetarded!

That is why Ouattara was announced the winner?

The cap28 guy honestly has mental issues. I bet he looks outside his window every 45 seconds for the "imaginary" white men planning to bring him down.

MyJoe:

We can talk about double standards till tomorrow but go convince those whose lives have been saved in Benghazi or the Abidjan residents who can't wait for their city to return to normal that just because Israel kills people in Gaza and no one intervenes, every dictator on earth should be given carte blanche to do the same.

cap28:

Shagamite, Ouattara was announced the winner because he is an IMF stooge imposed on the ivorien people by France, the US, the EU and US controlled UN, the west regard him as a safer pair of hands because he will implement the complete privatisation of the ivory coast public sector by foreign investors, and he will also allow the implementation of IMF conditionalities which will focus on paying off ivory coasts debt rather than the economic development of ivory coast- he has an impeccable track record in the economic enslavement of african nations to the US owned bank, in his previous job with the IMF  he was responsible for implementing Enhanced Structural Adjustment Facilities (ESAF) in a number of west african countries which subsequently led to the collapse of those countries educational and health institutions, that is all he has to offer the ivory coast people, and the smart ones know this, therefore start using your brain and learn to see the bigger picture before you open your big mouth to talk about "peace and democracy", yeah like the "peace and democracy" in nigeria abi.

People like you deserve whats coming because your dense brain can not tell the difference between fantasy and reality, perhaps when you are back in chains a light will go on in that your dense head, in the meantime keep hallucinating about "freedom and democracy" in africa, fool.

bawss1 said:
Cap28, I find that you are disturbingly pro Ghadaffi and pro Gbagbo. You cut the picture of one who prefers that tyrants and dictators hold a people to ransom as long as they fit into (imagined) western conspiracy theories.

Sagamite:


Moooron, were the AU and Ecowas who approved the election also stooges of the "dangerous, colonialist white men that are hellbound on taking cap28 back to slavery" as well?

Sick muthafucker!

cap28:

I really now see why the whites laugh at us - with  illiterates like you they will continue to run rings around us for centuries to come - so in your dense brain you actually think a toothless bulldog like the AU has the balls to defy america, the EU and NATO when the majority of the leaders of those AU member states owe their very existence to these same organisations, dumbo, nigeria receives millions of dollars in military aid from the america, britain and the EU - do you serously think that with that they are going to go against the very people who are making it possible for them to remain in power?  why do you think nigeria cowardly voted in favour of the no fly zone over libya - because they are pawns of the west - they are owned by the west you dummy, nigeria is not a soveriegn entity it has to get clearance and approval on anything it does from the US and the UK before it does it, the same goes for the majority of the AU member states with the exception of libya which is why libya is now under attack, boy you really need a wake up call.

Sagamite:

Don't be as DAFT as cap28!

Don't be as STEWPID!

Where the fck is your education!

In your education, they did not teach you to evaluate critically? They taught you to generalise?

Why are you comparing 1993 to 2011? Governments don't change? Philosophies don't change? Ideologies don't change? Cultures don't change? People don't react differently based on experience? Different people with different outlooks are not in power?

How dumb are you to be comparing what leaders in early 1990s did to what leaders in 2011 are doing?

You are so dumb you think Obama will or has to do exactly the same thing as HW Bush? Sarkozy to do what Mitterand did? Are you really that daft?

You think Obama or Cameron will send troops into Libya after experiencing the difficulty and prolongness such a decision produced in Iraq? You think they will be willing to go gong-ho into countries after Somalia?

How dumb can you be to expect a static approach to issues despite changes in generation, governments, powers and thinking?

What a dumb simpleton mind!

Where the fck do reeetards like you and cap28 get your education?

dapoola:

MyJoe,

You talk about a buffer zone created by the french in 2002, the history goes way beyond that. Let me help you out. Alassane Ouattara, who was an official of the World Bank and the IMF, was brought into the government of President Houphouet- Boigny and later made prime minister to put the economy into shape. He then became involved in a battle with Kone Bedie, who took over after the death of President Boigny in 1993. The economy, however, never regained its strength and poverty deepened as a result of a military coup in 1999, led by General Guei. Since Guei was confronted with mass resistance in the streets, he had no other choice but to call another general election.

dapoola:
At this time the preferred candidate of western imperialism, Ouattara,

dapoola:
was disqualified from the elections on the grounds of his alleged Burkinabi citizenship.

dapoola:
Ouattara then took political power into his hands and tolerated very little opposition to his IMF-dictated economic reforms. This brought him into conflict with Laurent Gbagbo, who came from the Ivorian radical left.

dapoola:
Ouattara began his IMF-dictated privatization program with French companies as his primary clients. But these reforms quickly cost him his political power.

dapoola:
Guei, who had called an election which he then lost to Gbagbo, was forced out of power by the Ivorian masses after he insisted that his party had won the election.

dapoola:
Gbagbo won the election with the firm promise that he would throw out all IMF programs and refuse to pay the foreign debt, which he insisted has never served the interests of the Ivorian people. Shortly after his election to the presidency, he set forth his mission to reclaim the sovereignty of Côte d’Ivoire from international control.

dapoola:
Among the promises he made to his people was the commitment to open expiring commercial contracts (then largely controlled by French interests) to the bidding process, and to rebuild the economy of his country. Both France and the international financial institutions saw that their interests were at stake and would not take such opposition lightly.

dapoola:
Unfortunately Laurent Gbagbo, who came to power not only by winning a general election but also through popular mass resistance against military dictatorship on an anti-imperialist program, never grounded this victory with the masses. Obviously corruption, ethnic and religious sentiment would prevent him from acheiving these noble goals.

dapoola:
The same french forces you say provided a buffer zone for him in 2002 were the same forces responsible for decimating the Ivoreian airforce in 2004 after Gbagbo's forces killed 9 french troops then.

dapoola:
Becos of Gbagbo's stand on non implementation of IMF policies in the country he became an ememy of France and even the international community. Quattara on the other hand has over time proved to be a ready pawn in the hands of the IMF and by extention serves the policies of the french.

dapoola:
In terms of ideals and mentality the 2 leaders are the same. They would easily resort to violence to solve their differences.

dapoola:
The french know this but would rather work with the leader who is ready to serve as a pawn in the their hands to ensure his survival in this case Quatarra.

cap28:

its really strange how even white intellectuals understand that africans are exploited by western imperialists and yet some brain dead africans DEFEND and make excuses on behalf of their own oppressors, i would really like to know how an illiterate like Sagamite can claim to be more knowledgeable than an esteemed academic like Noam Chomsky or an intellectual juggernaut like Michael Parenti, how is it that a gibbering illiteerate like sagamite can actually think that he is more credible than this man:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eKMspN-7Co

Sagamite:

God bless you!

I am waiting for him to answer my question.

And someone will tell me this reeetard does not have mental problems?  

Moooron, were the AU and Ecowas who approved the election also stooges of the "dangerous, colonialist white men that are hellbound on taking cap28 back to slavery" as well?  

Sick muthafucker!

2muchlogic:

cap, why are you wasting time on educating the lost souls? some of us are born to lead and other are born to follow. There would be no balance if we were all leaders or all followers - you are needed here: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-642516.0.html

Princek12:

I don't see why some people don't get it, as in why they are using the imperialism theory to justify the actions of a brutal dictator who had not only refused to conduct elections since 2005 but had also killed hundreds of Ivoriens who dared to publicly criticize him. Some of these people are even saying that Ouattara's victory will not please the minority that voted for Gbagbo. That argument misses the point. They forget that  essence of any election is to sit the candidate who earns the majority vote. These people have also failed to offer an alternative.

Their argument would be the equivalent of a hypothetical Nigerian election where a candidate, say Buhari, wins a free and fair election with 60% of votes, while Jonathan earns 40% of the votes. Further, that because 40% of the candidates who supported Jonathan in this hypothetical election would be displeased at Buhari's victory, Jonathan as the incumbent should now cancel the entire election, hold the entire country hostage, kill any public supporter of the opposition, and cause a de facto civil war rather than handover peacefully. All Gbagbo had to do was to handover to the winner of a free and fair election.

Even assuming for argument sake that the election was rigged in favor of Ouattara, which we all know not to be the case, the right thing to do was to handover and challenge the results of the election in court. The executive should not unilaterally refuse to cede power to the purported winner of the election. And judging by Gbagbo's track record of failing to hold elections since 2005, it is hard to give any thing this man says any weight, as he has behaved like a Ghadafi-like dictator who wants to cling unto power at all cost.

Sagamite:

I hate mooorons with a paaassion.

I keep on telling you all mooorons make the world a less happy and safe place for the rest of us to live in. You will say Sagamite is insulting.

ala hadiza:

America left Ivory coast 2 their faith cos they don't have oil, thy refuse to live Libya because of their oil.

Princek12:

I don't see why some people don't get it, as in why they are using the imperialism theory to justify the actions of a brutal dictator who had not only refused to conduct elections since 2005 but had also killed hundreds of Ivoriens who dared to publicly criticize him. Some of these people are even saying that Ouattara's victory will not please the minority that voted for Gbagbo. That argument misses the point. They forget that  essence of any election is to sit the candidate who earns the majority vote. These people have also failed to offer an alternative.

Their argument would be the equivalent of a hypothetical Nigerian election where a candidate, say Buhari, wins a free and fair election with 60% of votes, while Jonathan earns 40% of the votes. Further, that because 40% of the candidates who supported Jonathan in this hypothetical election would be displeased at Buhari's victory, Jonathan as the incumbent should now cancel the entire election, hold the entire country hostage, kill any public supporter of the opposition, and cause a de facto civil war rather than handover peacefully. All Gbagbo had to do was to handover to the winner of a free and fair election.

Even assuming for argument sake that the election was rigged in favor of Ouattara, which we all know not to be the case, the right thing to do was to handover and challenge the results of the election in court. The executive should not unilaterally refuse to cede power to the purported winner of the election. And judging by Gbagbo's track record of failing to hold elections since 2005, it is hard to give any thing this man says any weight, as he has behaved like a Ghadafi-like dictator who wants to cling unto power at all cost.

cap28:

Its funny how you refer to a similar situation happening in nigeria when it has already happened - have you forgotten June 12 1993? did IBB not annull the election and transfer power to abacha in complete disregard of the wishes of the nigerian people, can you explain why the west did not intervene then to restore MKO to his rightful position? didnt IBB hold nigerian to ransom? wasnt there wides scale violence and killing of many of MKO's supporters by the police and military? IBB unilaterally annulled an election , did anything happen to him, did the west send UN troops to bomb him out of the presidential palace.

[b]the problem with people liek you is that you cant think critically, learn to understand situations holisticall[/b]y instead of accepting western propaganda - a US senator is going on record to say that there was massive electoral fraud and that ouattara did not win the presidential elections , listen to him describing how ouattara's trooped lined up men women and children against the wall and put bullets in their heads, listen to how women were gang violated and had their throats cut by ouattara's troops, listen to how foreign UN troops cried when they saw the brutallity meted out by ouattara's troops to young men women and children :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3pUE9_Syg0&NR=1

the senator puts it very poignantly when he says noone cares about sub saharan africa.

Gen. Abdul Hafiz to Choi: "We Are Not Here to Kill Ivorians! "

Mar 19, 2011 - 9:44:01 AM


"We're not in Cote d'Ivoire to kill Ivorians and I, I stop because I do not want to remain in the wrong," said Major General Abdul Hafiz, outgoing commander of the troops of the United Nations Operation in Cote d'Ivoire (UNOCI). According to our sources close to UNOCI, he made that statement a few hours after the presentation of his resignation. Hafiz, whose country is one of the poorest in the world knows that by doing such an act, he loses a lot of money, but he did it, for his dignity and respect for human life.
But officially, UN authorities accuse him of having provided ''top secret'' information to the author of the documentary film entitled ''Laurent Gbagbo in the the Gulf of Guinea whirlwind.'' This documentary film highlights the neo-colonialist appetite of France facing its African ''territory'' and the huge interests for which France is engaged in a war for the control of the Ivorian State. General Abdul Hafiz, whose functions come to an end, next Tuesday, March 22nd, was replaced by Maj. Gen. Gnakoudè Berens, a citizen from Togo. In reality, the senior officer of the Bangladeshi army, making his resignation, refused to endorse and participate in the genocide that France, the United States of America and the United Nations are scheming.


Who is General Abdul Hafiz ?


After a Master of Defence Studies, National University of Bangladesh, that Abdul Hafiz joined the infantry corps as an officer, May 8th, 1977. After a long journey, he was promoted Major General of the Bangladesh Army, December 31st, 2005.

General Hafiz replaced General Fernand Marcel Amoussou of Benin, who served the Mission for more than four years. Prior to assuming his new role, he Headed the military component of UNOCI (United Nations Mission in Côte d'Ivoire) from 2003 to 2004 and Deputy Commander of the United Nations Operation in Côte d'Ivoire ( UNOCI) from 2004 to 2005.


His experience within the UN peacekeeping operations began with his participation in the reconnaissance mission preparing for deployment of Bangladesh in November 1993 in Rwanda and Bosnia in August 1994.

General Hafiz also took part in the planning and coordination for the deployment of troops from Bangladesh to Somalia, Mozambique, Rwanda, Bosnia and Haiti from 1993 to 1994. From January to March 1992 he was appointed Chief Military Liaison Office in Zagreb. Previously, he was part of the Observation Mission of the United Nations in Iraq and Kuwait from 1991 to 1992.

In October 1994 he participated in a mapping exercise of Operations Peacekeeping at the seminar on the Operations of Peacekeeping Nations held at the United Kingdom School of Staff , Camberley , and in October 2006, the 11th Committee on Defence Forum held in Tokyo, Japan. He also attended the first national seminar on sustainable development.

General Hafiz holds several degrees and certificates. He attended various courses and training in both his country and abroad.

General Hafiz is a graduate from the School of National Defense, School of Staff and Defense Services (DCES).
General Hafiz took a course on small and heavy arms of infantry in China and Advanced Infantry Officer's course in the United States of America. He is also a graduate from the Defense Intelligence College of France. He speaks fluent English and French

2muchlogic:

   cap, why are you wasting time on educating the lost souls? some of us are born to lead and other are born to follow. There would be no balance if we were all leaders or all followers - you are needed here: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-642516.0.html

morpheus24:

Where are you leading us too. That fictitious utopia where all black people are free of the opressor and living in harmony with one another under the umberalla a unified black race.

Wolfs in sheeps clothing is worse than the blind leading the blind.

Decipher that!!

morpheus24:

@sagamite

I thought I was the only one who could see through some these conspiracy theorist,  black supremacist, IMF obsessed, Neo-colonial hating babbling buffons. Wolfs in sheeps clothing who would do exactly the same thing if given the opportunity. I was almost beginning to think the world was going mad.

Carry on please!

I dey your side!

morpheus24:

Where are you leading us too. That fictitious utopia where all black people are free of the opressor and living in harmony with one another under the umberalla a unified black race.

Wolfs in sheeps clothing is worse than the blind leading the blind.

Decipher that!!

cap28:

vamoose, you fool, all those years of cleaning up the shi.t and pi.ss of elderly white people in those american retirement homes has made you eternally grateful to your white slave master, i dont blame you without white massa your entire family in nigeria would have died of starvation , ah beg place your head back where it belongs -in between massa's butt cheeks.