EvilPOTATO:

The divine plan follows a sequence that it is meant to show the supremacy of the Creator above all things that was and will ever be.

Well but this divine plan has a flaw and thats what we are addressing

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With this in mind and when compared to the general population you will come to realise that only few people have accepted jesus and even those who claim to have accepted jesus don't live according to his will. So you know they are about 2,500 religions worldwide christianity is only one among them. With these you will have realised that billions of people don't practice christianity and with these about billions of people will go to hell. Puting this into consideration the idea of jesus dying to save the world becomes a massive failure!

Why because majority of the world population whom jesus died for are have already been condemed to hell fire.

Here, you are reporting as if you are in possession the True report of The Number of souls who have taken up The Sacrifice of Christ, which in Truth you can not know neither are you in possession of The True Records of those who have Accepted Christ!!

But I Recognise that your True observation is that many who claimed to have followed Christ or did in Truth follow Him, have fallen out of the Way, thereby nullifying their former Acceptance of His Sacrifice!

This is Very True, for I see it too!

EvilPOTATO:

The divine plan follows a sequence that it is meant to show the supremacy of the Creator above all things that was and will ever be.

But this divine plan has serious flaws.

How do you reconcile divine plans and freewill?

Dtruthspeaker:


Here, you are reporting as if you are in possession the True report of The Number of souls who have taken up The Sacrifice of Christ, which in Truth you can not know neither are you in possession of The True Records of those who have Accepted Christ!!

But I Recognise that your True observation is that many who claimed to have followed Christ or did in Truth follow Him, have fallen out of the Way, thereby nullifying their former Acceptance of His Sacrifice!

This is Very True, for I see it too!

now this also points out the fact that whether you accept jesus or not they is still a high probability that you will end up in hell.
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Now take note over 3.5 billion people are going to hell all for not accepting jesus do you consider this appropriate

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Well since it was satan that lead us into sin it would not be bad if we heap the blames him na

How did Satan lead you into sin?
God does not blame him, Satan, for man's sins so why should God punish or kill Him?

Kobojunkie:
How did Satan lead you into sin?
God does not blame him, Satan, for man's sins so why should God punish or kill Him?

Well following the bible knowledge it was the devil that tempted eve to eat the apple and according to bible verses the devil also tempts humans to commit sin. Like he tempted jesus in the wilderness.

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Well following the bible knowledge it was the devil that tempted eve to eat the apple and according to bible verses the devil also tempts humans to commit sin. Like he tempted jesus in the wilderness.

Where are you told that the devil did it? In Genesis, we read that the serpent did it and it, the serpent, was punished for it too.
Satan tempted Jesus Christ but Jesus Christ withstood temptation, so why is Satan to blame again?

Kobojunkie:
Where are you told that the devil did it? In Genesis, we read that the serpent did it and it, the serpent, was punished for it too.
Satan tempted Jesus Christ but Jesus Christ withstood temptation, so why is Satan to blame again?

İ dont really understand your specific kind of stupiid, but i do admirer your total commitment to it..

Kobojunkie:
Where are you told that the devil did it? In Genesis, we read that the serpent did it and it, the serpent, was punished for it too.
Satan tempted Jesus Christ but Jesus Christ withstood temptation, so why is Satan to blame again?

because he keeps tempting people up till today please don't ask me how i knew this.

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Well following the bible knowledge it was the devil that tempted eve to eat the apple and according to bible verses the devil also tempts humans to commit sin. Like he tempted jesus in the wilderness.

Genesis 1 and 2 are most likely mythical stories where a serpent speaks, but it was taken as a true account of creation by the Israelites. The story has profound meaning and tells us that from one man came all the families of the earth, but this man was thrown out of the kingdom of God after knowing good and evil ( losing his innocence). So what the story is saying in essence is that the first man and woman ( our ancestors) in their quest for wisdom like a serpent they lost God's presence, but even now that they have this knowledge of good and evil ( like the gods), they can still reach out for the tree of life to claim their previous state nonetheless.
The story is a myth that gives a summary of the truth of how our Ancestors lost it with God.

Okay let’s apply logic on the Bible and see where it takes us.

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Using simple logic
premise: if someone commits a crime or sin he/she gets punished for that sin.

Yes that’s sound logic. In fact it’s in line with Romans 6:23 which says that the punishment for sins is death so since we are conceived in sin, we pay the ultimate price with our lives. Ezekiel 18:4

argument: if satan commits a sin then logically satan is supposed to be punished for his sin but how come Jesus gets to be sacrificed

A once faithful angel rebelled against God’s authority which made to lose a favoured relationship with God(2Peter 2:4) and in the process, he made himself Devil and Satan. John 8:44
As it is, Satan is currently on deathrow because of his defiance(Genesis 3:15) and Jesus outlined the final outcome of Satan and his horde of demons. Matthew 25:46 compare with John 12:31 and Revelation 20:10
So where did you get the idea that Satan was off the hook? Because of the numerous claims misinformed religionists make?
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argument 2: if human beings commit evil logically humans are supposed to pay for the evil but how come Jesus gets to be the one to be sacrificed While humans who did the evil go to heaven

Here is where wisdom comes in. The first man Adam committed the most gross sin ever by eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil because by doing so, he showed that he had no regard for God’s rulership i.e. he chose to be independent from God and this brought disastrous consequences on both him(Genesis 3:19) and all his offspring, which includes you and me today. Romans 5:12

So in order for perfect justice to be attained in our case, since the God of the Bible loves justice(Psalm 37:28)—that is—given that it was not our fault we were conceived in sin and error(Psalm 51:5), a life equivalent to the perfect life Adam had, needed to be given as a replacement for we to be released from sin and death.
Romans 5:19, 1Corinthians 15:20-22

This is what the Bible calls a “ransom” i.e. a price paid to release someone from under bondage which Jesus paid for with his own perfect life(please see Matthew 20:28) because as it were, we were sold into slavery to sin and death due to Adamic sin—in that no matter what we do—we cannot release ourselves from the pangs and threat of death(despite the trials of alchemists in the Dark Ages). Psalm 49:7-9

So that’s the perfect logic right there. The summary being that Adam is the first father of the human race(Acts 17:26) who brought suffering, sin and death on all humans(Romans 5:12) and that Jesus is the second father(Isaiah 9:6, 1Corinthians 15:45) who is responsible for releasing us from the conditions of sin, sickness, suffering and death, which Adam put us under. John 3:16, Romans 8:21, Hebrews 5:9

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because he keeps tempting people up till today please don't ask me how i knew this.

Well, is it listed somewhere that you know of that tempting others is a sin?
Punishment, and even death, is doled out for sin. So, why do you accuse him of sin when you are not even sure that what you claim he does amounts to sin, at least by any definition that you know that God has given?

EvilPOTATO:
The divine plan follows a sequence that it is meant to show the supremacy of the Creator above all things that was and will ever be.

Interesting claim... show the supremacy of the Creator?

GeneralDae:

Genesis 1 and 2 are most likely mythical stories where a serpent speaks, but it was taken as a true account of creation by the Israelites. The story has profound meaning and tells us that from one man came all the families of the earth, but this man was thrown out of the kingdom of God after knowing good and evil ( losing his innocence). So what the story is saying in essence is that the first man and woman ( our ancestors) in their quest for wisdom like a serpent they lost God's presence, but even now that they have this knowledge of good and evil ( like the gods), they can still reach out for the tree of life to claim their previous state nonetheless.
The story is a myth that gives a summary of the truth of how our Ancestors lost it with God.

You quite understand that it is a myth. Thats the first step towards enlightenment.

Adam and eve story is a recast of an earlier Babylonian epic about Adapa. İt tells of how man lost the chance to dwell on earth indefinately or how man lost imortality..in the original tale it tells of two serpent one for the good tree(Ninghiszida) and one for the evil tree(Dimuzi).

(Google is your friend).

The devil(Nanna) or Satan(Enlil) where never in Eden..


İ guess why God created humans was because he had already created a spiritual perfect realm. Where they do as they are told. So probably wanted a realm where choices can be made.

GeneralDae:

Genesis 1 and 2 are most likely mythical stories where a serpent speaks, but it was taken as a true account of creation by the Israelites. The story has profound meaning and tells us that from one man came all the families of the earth, but this man was thrown out of the kingdom of God after knowing good and evil ( losing his innocence). So what the story is saying in essence is that the first man and woman ( our ancestors) in their quest for wisdom like a serpent they lost God's presence, but even now that they have this knowledge of good and evil ( like the gods), they can still reach out for the tree of life to claim their previous state nonetheless.
The story is a myth that gives a summary of the truth of how our Ancestors lost it with God.

Genesis chapter 1 & 2 are nothing but mythical stories? How come Jesus quoted from one of those so-called “mythical” chapters? Does that mean also, that Jesus is a “mythical” character and that you are no longer a Christian like you claim?
Your comments are so absurd and out of the ordinary I must say because if Paul(whom the Jesus you claim to follow appointed at Acts 9:15) could say that “ALL SCRIPTURE(Genesis to Revelation) are inspired of God” who are you to say otherwise? 2Timothy 3:16

DappaD:


Genesis chapter 1 & 2 are nothing but mythical stories? How come Jesus quoted from one of those so-called “mythical” chapters? Does that mean also, that Jesus is a “mythical” character and that you are no longer a Christian like you claim?
Your comments are so absurd and out of the ordinary I must say because if Paul(whom the Jesus you claim to follow appointed at Acts 9:15) could say that “ALL SCRIPTURE(Genesis to Revelation) are inspired of God” who are you to say otherwise? 2Timothy 3:16

Truth is bitter...jesus is a mythcal character...there is really no way round it..virgin birth and all. İt has roman/greek mythology written all over it..

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now this also points out the fact that whether you accept jesus or not they is still a high probability that you will end up in hell.

Acceptance of The Lord Requires Further Acceptance and Compliance with The Law.

And this where many fall, they want to escape His Anger but do not want to stop Offending which is what The Law is seeking to do as seen in the Statement

"The Tenets of The Law is to Live Honestly, Harm No One and To Give to Each, His Due!"
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Now take note over 3.5 billion people are going to hell all for not accepting jesus do you consider this appropriate

As a Victim of kidnap, if they took you before a Court that the 30 persons who Robbed you, Beat you and kept you in inhumane conditions,, damaged your vehicle have been caught and are in court, would you spare because they are many?

Victims of endsars and Police Brutality have already shown us The Truth!

Even if they are 100 Billion Souls EVERY SINGLE OFFENDER MUST PAY FOR THEIR CRIMES!

That is the Magnitude of What Judgement Day Represents.

Let me blow your mind, even Cain has not yet been Judged and Neither has Abel received his cry for "Just is"!

Everyone Born into this world has A Case to Answer on Judgement Day!

sonmvayina:


Truth is bitter...jesus is a mythcal character...there is really no way round it..virgin birth and all. İt has roman/greek mythology written all over it..

Please tell this to GeneralDae because apparently, he happens to be a follower of that same “mythical” character so try and form a bond with him and convince him that his Jesus is just a mere “mythical” character. Please do carry on with it. I want to be amused.


P.S. It does not matter if Jesus is a fictional character or not. After all, you claimed the events penned down in the Torah were also not real that means Moses is a fictional character, isn’t it? And the fact that you’re also expecting a real Messiah from made-up stories is quite absurd.
So why feel strongly only about Jesus’ case, when Moses is also a mere fictional character like your assertions have made clear? Careful, so you do not suffocate yourself with this information.

DappaD:


Genesis chapter 1 & 2 are nothing but mythical stories? How come Jesus quoted from one of those so-called “mythical” chapters? Does that mean also, that Jesus is a “mythical” character and that you are no longer a Christian like you claim?
Your comments are so absurd and out of the ordinary I must say because if Paul(whom the Jesus you claim to follow appointed at Acts 9:15) could say that “ALL SCRIPTURE(Genesis to Revelation) are inspired of God” who are you to say otherwise? 2Timothy 3:16

Jesus did not know everything as a human being (else he would not be a human). Also even Jesus admitted he doesn't know when the end would come. He was a complete human vessel like you and I inhabited by God in full (Like no other before him). God gave jesus the spirit without measure and he can be rightfully called the son of God.

Jesus also used the myths and stories of his culture and his people in their context especially when these mythologies had the teachings of God hidden in them for the wise in spirit who hear from the father. All that the people knew then as accounts of creation were the accounts in Genesis, and Jesus as a man who grew up studying the Torah was also limited to the culture of his people, that isn't a problem at all.

Mythologies are not necessarily false, they are used to pierce the soul of the wise. Jesus loved stories and myths so much and I love them too because they allow free thinking and deep revelations.

Paul saying all scriptures are inspired by God or God breathed does not mean there are no myths in scriptures. Besides, God's inspiration may take many forms and may not necessarily mean God's dictation. Even Paul at a point gave his personal advice in his letters and in that 1 Timothy, Paul (or whoever wrote it in paul's name) was referring specifically to the scriptures in the Torah, and at that time the new testament wasn't even compiled and accepted as scripture.

GeneralDae:

Jesus did not know everything as a human being, even Jesus admitted he doesn't know when the end would come. He was a complete human vessel like you and I inhabited by God in full (Like no other before him). God gave jesus the spirit without measure and he can be rightfully called the son of God.
Jesus also used the myths and stories of his culture and his people in their context especially when these mythologies had the teachings of God hidden in them for the wise in spirit who hear from the father.
Mythologies are not necessarily false, they are used to pierce the soul of the wise. Jesus loved stories and myths so much and I love them too because they allow free thinking and deep revelations.
Paul saying all scriptures are inspired by God or God breathed does not mean there are no myths in scriptures. Besides God's inspiration may take many forms and may not necessarily mean God's dictation. Even Paul at a point gave his personal advice in his letters and in that 1 Timothy Paul was referring specifically to the scriptures in the Torah, and at that time the new testament wasn't even compiled and accepted as scripture.

It seems you have a different definition of what “myths” really are because since you are now caught in your own web which you made by yourself, you’d do anything to get out of it including misdefining what “myths” are.

If the Biblical accounts are all myths like you claim, then they can never be fundamental truths and Jesus was just quoting from falsehoods? Compare Genesis 2:24 with Matthew 19:5

When Jesus said that “[God’s] word is truth” at John 17:17, was he implying that some part of the Scriptures were false and other parts were true? Or was his statement completely in harmony with Paul’s words at 2Timothy 3:16?


Please enough, you have already rendered everything Jesus said as mere stories/fables with no meaning so please focus on sonmvayina for now let me observe what comes out your discussion with him since he has said that your Jesus is a “mythical” character.

DappaD:


It seems you have a different definition of what “myths” really are because since you are now caught in your own web which you made by yourself, you’d do anything to get out of it including misdefining what “myths” are.

If the Biblical accounts are all myths like you claim, then they can never be fundamental truths and Jesus was just quoting from falsehoods? Compare Genesis 2:24 with Matthew 19:5

When Jesus said that “Your word is truth” at John 17:17, was he implying that some part of the Scriptures were false and other parts were true? Or was his statement completely in harmony with Paul’s words at 2Timothy 3:16?


Please enough, you have already rendered everything Jesus said as mere stories/fables with no meaning so please focus on sonmvayina for now let me observe what comes out your discussion with him since he has said that your Jesus is a “mythical” character.

I never claimed the biblical accounts are all myths but there are some myths in them. All ancient cultures had myths in their historical telling but the bulk of these stories were meant to be historical accounts to the people.

Apart from the Author of Timothy claiming all scriptures are inspired, we do not find this anywhere else. The Author is simply teaching Timothy that scriptures are useful for our learning, that's all. The bible is a collection or volume of various scriptures and even the Torah as a whole does not claim it is the complete word of God. Scribes in the time of Ezrah also wrote history to the people like Chronicles and they edited the so called five books of Moses, you cannot claim God dictated everything. The inspired word of God is in the bible and we must rightly divide the bible to find them and allow them minister to us but it is not the entire bible.

Jesus saying your word is truth doesn't mean the entire bible is true, the word of God is not limited to the Bible.

Jesus is not a mythical character but the true son of God who walked the earth.

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If the price has already been paid by Jesus why not just live life the way you want after all jesus has already paid the price na

So therefore you wish to return to the Filth and Dirt/Death from which you were plucked up and Removed and Cleaned up from!

It is your choice but it is clear to us all who see you do that, that you say you love your Dirt/Death and that you should be left there!

Exactly as person who was removed from Ajegunle to Banana Island then returns to Ajegunle is Clearly saying he loves his Ajegunle!

Thus having made his choice, he cannot complain for he has gotten what he wants!

yanabasee1:

Because, Satan is his child....His creation...

LWKMD
Another son of God be dat.
From which mother dis one?

truespeak:


So therefore you wish to return to the Filth and Dirt/Death from which you were plucked up and Removed and Cleaned up from!

It is your choice but it is clear to us all who see you do that, that you say you love your Dirt/Death and that you should be left there!

Exactly as person who was removed from Ajegunle to Banana Island then returns to Ajegunle is Clearly saying he loves his Ajegunle!

Thus having made his choice, he cannot complain for he has gotten what he wants!

If we call you guys fanatics now it will be as if somebody is not good.
please can you tell me how ajegunle or going back to dirt is related to the sacrifice of jesus now

Dtruthspeaker:


And I have answered it!

That's not an answer it's an opinion and an elementary one at that.

Kobojunkie:
Why kill Satan?
Was it not man that sinned?
What is Satan's crime against man that man should want him punished?

Satan sinned before man's creation that's why he was kicked out of heaven and sent to the bottomless pit. Try again.

Akuruoulo:
WHO IS YAH ?

The name of the one and only true God.

khiaa:
Satan sinned before man's creation that's why he was kicked out of heaven and sent to the bottomless pit. Try again.

Interesting claim! Do you have any scripture references for this ?
If Satan is still falling down a "bottomless" pit, how and when did he "escoop" said pit only to take on the role of tempter of man?

khiaa:

Satan sinned before man's creation that's why he was kicked out of heaven and sent to the bottomless pit. Try again.

I think you guys are reading too much into Isaiah and Revelation.

yanabasee1:



Ok...



God doesn't entirely forsake anyone... He loves all his creation and only punishes those that goes against his will....

Satan is his beloved child as well...

Satan is also a tool to know other of his children that truly believes and worship him without doubts.

If you ask me about the people dieing..I'll say that, their spiritual bodies or souls will always rise to his kingdom. Which is why science can never give a clearer meaning to the existence of the afterlife....


God can not kill Satan, Satan is under punishment and not manipulating anyone... It is the evil in men. Also know that, there are other evil forces that is also powerful as satan. and satan is in chains and powerless.

Hmmm!!! Let's dissect your theory.

1. The Bible says Yah did not love all his creations, he hated Esau before Esau was even born because Esau inherited Adam's hatred for Yah.

2. Yah can kill whomever he chooses and it has been proven biblically.

3. Satan is a master manipulator.

4. What are the evil forces that are as powerful as the Prince of Darkness, and don't tell me the king of darkness?

5. There have been those who truly loved Yah but we're tempted by Satan, like we all know he is a master manipulator and man is just a weak vessel of flesh.

GeneralDae:

I think you guys are reading too much into Isaiah and Revelation.

The fact is it's not about your opinion but what the scriptures tell us.

yanabasee1:
Ok...
God doesn't entirely forsake anyone... He loves all his creation and only punishes those that goes against his will....
Satan is his beloved child as well...

Where do you find this claim that Satan is a Son of God though? We are told in Job that Satan presented himself in a gathering of the Sons of God, but we are not in fact told that Satan is one of them.

yanabasee1:
Satan is also a tool to know other of his children that truly believes and worship him without doubts.

Ok. I can concur since from the Old testament accounts and even the Gospels, Satan seems to occupy the role of God's quality control manager of sorts where man is concerned.

yanabasee1:
If you ask me about the people dieing..I'll say that, their spiritual bodies or souls will always rise to his kingdom. Which is why science can never give a clearer meaning to the existence of the afterlife....

God condemned all unbelievers to perish in their grave(cease to exist) since the time of Adam. Man was never created as an eternal being and since Adam did not eat from the Tree of Life, he and his descendants who rejected God perished in their graves(returned to dust).

yanabasee1:
God can not kill Satan, Satan is under punishment and not manipulating anyone... It is the evil in men. Also know that, there are other evil forces that is also powerful as satan. and satan is in chains and powerless.

Satan is under punishment? Where do you get this idea from?