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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin (38055 Views)
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Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 1:10am On Dec 10, 2021 |
GiantParrot:1. Again, Jesus Christ gave us about 100 commandments in total in the New Covenant Law of the Kingdom of God. Of almost 100, exactly 1 sin is listed as grievous, the sin of Blasphemy. Why? Because according to Jesus Christ, it is unforgivable, and it is in fact it is implied by Jesus Christ that death is what will follow the commiting of such sin. Now, imagine the case of a man who lusted in his heart after his neighbor's wife, and moments later had a heart attack and died - no time to seek forgiveness from God. Does this man not end up in eternal damnation(hell) alongside all men who commit the sin of Blasphemy? Is there a different hell for those who die after committing blasphemy? NO, the judgment for all sins is the same in scripture and that is eternal damnation irrespective of sin committed- Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46. No matter what sin a person commits, God's decision is that all those tainted by sin - the unrighteous - end up in eternal damnation. 2. God's justice system in no way compares to man's justice system which grades crimes and punishment as men see fit. According to God's Law, even the one who commits what you consider the least sin ends up exactly the same as the one who commits what men consider the greatest sin - eternal damnation. There are no small sins or big sins. All sins end in the same place - eternal damnation. 3. Well, read what Jesus Christ tells you of the process in Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46. There are only two ends for all those who belong in His Kingdom ... and all those who sin ,the goats, are headed in the direction of Eternal damnation, this according to Jesus Christ. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Humorme2(f): 1:40am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Lots of illiterates on this forum. Jumping to conclusions without understanding what he said. 1 Like |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by GiantParrot(m): 1:50am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie: You have now admitted that all sins are not equal even though you claim that only one is different from the others. So in your belief system, all but one sin are equal. You can choose to ignore Hebrews 10:29 (greater punishment) and Matthew 5:22 (different liabilities for different wrongs). You're claiming from Matthew 25 that there are only two possibe outcomes, eternal life and enternal damnation (which is broadly correct), and you suggest that there are no distinctions inside each of these two outcomes. A position unsupported by scripture. It is clear from 1 Corinthians 3:15 "If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer its loss, but he himself will still be saved, but only as through fire. " Those who suffer loss and have their soul saved clearly have a different experience from those who did not suffer loss and yet have their soul saved without experiencing anything like fire. And the difference between the experiences of these two groups is based their works. Can good works be burned by "fire" and the doer suffer loss? 1 Like |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 2:22am On Dec 10, 2021 |
GiantParrot:1. I am afraid you are still not following any of what I continue to say on this. One sin is listed by Jesus Christ as being greivous but when compared as in the scenario I presented, the consequence of said sin turns out no different from that which awaits those who commit any of other sins, dying right afterwards. According to Jesus Christ, there is only one judgement to take place after He returns. And that judgement, as you can see in Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46, is not of what sin was committed by whom and when, but instead of whether one is righteous or not righteous. 2. I am afraid I don't follow what you mean when you suggest Matthew 5 vs 22 indicates different liabilities for different wrongs. 3. According to Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46, there are only two possible outcomes as far as the Kingdom of God is concerned - Eternal reward for the righteous and eternal damnation for the sinners. Now as far as distinction inside each of those, well, Jesus Christ never indicated that there would be. In Matthew 20 vs.1 - 16, using a parable, Jesus instead indicated that those who will work in His Vineyard will be given the same reward for work done, this whether last or first. Should we dis believe Him in this? As for those headed for eternal damnation, how else can one qualify eternal damnation to make it seem any less than it sounds? 4. I am afraid your understanding of what Paul wrote there in 1 Corinthians 3 vs 15 is in question. Jesus Christ is the one to whom the Kingdom belongs He more than makes clear the fate that awaits the sheep(righteous) and the goats(unrighteous) as far as the Kingdom of God is concerned, in Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46 |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Map1(m): 4:44am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Righteousness2:Ask your self if truly Hell exist? |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Myer(m): 5:29am On Dec 10, 2021 |
headSmasher: Are you not guilty of sexual sins too? And the bolded must be in your village, not the bible sir. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Benoxvals(m): 5:44am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Righteousness2: Now I can confirm that you are insane indeed. If you had taken theological courses then you should understand how to manage humanity with a spiritual approach and stop chocking people with ur end time gibberish. Assignment—Discuss Anger and Murder as a sin. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Myer(m): 5:50am On Dec 10, 2021 |
maiquel: This is the result of failing comprehension in school. He never said sexual sins are little sins neither did he say they were not serious sins. He's simply opening your bloodshot eyes to what matters most which is humility, love, faith, and mercy. Matt 23:23 The opposite of which is pride, hate, unbelief and unforgiveness. These are the most serious sins than fleshy sins. Religious people are hypocrites (Christian's, Muslims and Jews alike). While condemning sins publicly, they are shamelessly committing their own sins in their privacy. They can quote scriptures and speak "religionese" and look holy publicly but be doing worse. They are quick to jump to condemn anyone who is caught, for what they themselves are guilty of. "Let he who is without sin be the first to cast a stone." This statement by Christ says it all. The Pope's statement is just what you would have heard from Christ. He stood against hypocrisy and never condemned sinners. He simply taught the better Way to live and overcome sin. 3 Likes |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by orisa37: 6:03am On Dec 10, 2021 |
POPE FRANCIS HAS BIBLE GENE IN HIM AND YOU DON'T HAVE IT. SO THE POPE KNOWS WHAT HE IS SAYING. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Benoxvals(m): 6:16am On Dec 10, 2021 |
DubaiLandLord1: Is not about the equality of sins.. It’s about the gravity of the punishment. Anger and killing are sins but the punishment for both are different. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by livebullet(m): 6:53am On Dec 10, 2021 |
oshozondii: I will give you full reply of the pope so you can make of it what you wish. Pope was questioned on why he accepted the resignation of the archbishop of Paris "Aupetit" this was his full reply "Before answering I will say: do the investigation, eh, do the investigation … because there is a danger of saying: he was condemned. Who condemned him? Public opinion, gossip. But what did he do? We don’t know, something … If you know why, say so, otherwise I cannot answer and you will not know why. Because it was his failure, a fault against the sixth commandment — but not total — of small caresses and massages that he gave to the secretary, so stands the accusation. This is sin, but it is not of the most serious sins, because the sins of the flesh are not the most serious. The gravest sins are those that are more angelic: pride, hatred. These are graver. So Aupetit is a sinner, as am I — I don’t know if you are aware … but probably — as was Peter, the bishop on whom Jesus Christ founded the Church. Why did the community of that time accept a sinful bishop, and with sins of such an angelic nature as denying Christ! But it was a normal Church, it was accustomed to everyone always being sinful, it was a humble Church. You can see that our Church is not used to having a sinful bishop. We pretend to say my bishop is a saint. … not this red hat … we are all sinners. But when the gossip grows, grows, grows, and takes away the reputation of the person. He will not be able to lead because he has lost the reputation, not because of his sin, which is sin — like Peter’s, like mine like yours — but because of the gossip of the people responsible for reporting things, a man who has lost his reputation so publicly cannot govern. And this is an injustice and that is why I accepted Aupetit’s resignation, not on the altar of truth, but on the altar of hypocrisy. This is what I want to say.” 1 Like |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Nobody: 6:54am On Dec 10, 2021 |
He didn't say it is not a sin. He didn't say it is not a serious sin. He said it is not the most serious sin. which is correct. If you sleep with someone before marriage, It is not the same thing as killing someone na |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by GumGum: 6:55am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie: Since you find it difficult to actually open a Bible to find out things, let me drop this. Matthew 22:34-40 Jesus Christ emphasises that we love God above all and then that we love our neighbours as ourselves. He ended by saying that all laws and commandments depend on those two. From this, you will see that love is greater than all, and if that is so, hatred and bearing false witness out of contempt is definitely the worst sin you can have. I still maintain that sins aren't weighted equally. Be more aware. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by GumGum: 6:57am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie: I still wait where Jesus Christ said this. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by freeborn02: 7:02am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie: The same Jesus Christ said all sins can be forgiven except sin against the Holy Spirit. How often do you study the Bible? |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by freeborn02: 7:07am On Dec 10, 2021 |
arazanbal: Did the pope say fornication is not grievous? No. He said it is not the most grievous sin. The Bible says sin against the Holy Spirit is the most grievous sin. 1 Like |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:21am On Dec 10, 2021 |
GumGum:If you had bothered to in fact digest there what Jesus Christ said in that there passage which you quoted, you would have come to the realization that Jesus Christ was in no way giving you or anyone a new commandment, but instead speaking of the Old commandments which God had given in His agreement with the children of Israel. 34 The Pharisees learned that Jesus had made the Sadducees look so foolish that they stopped trying to argue with him. So the Pharisees had a meeting.The Law of Moses is found written of in the books of Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy. and consists of 613 statutes/laws in total of which the most important, the shema, is as recorded in Deuteronomy 6 vs 4 - 9, and the second greatest is found recorded in Leviticus 19 vs 18. In the passage above, Jesus Christ simply pointed out the 2 greatest of the 613 commandments, as given by God to the descendants of Jacob- Deuteronomy 30 vs 15 - 20- are the culmination of all God's message to the people through His prophets of Old. The New Covenant Law of the Kingdom of God, however, is a different and separate Covenant from the Old - Matthew 26 vs 28 - 30 - and is as recorded in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John . |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by obailala(m): 7:26am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie:How do you mean? You mind explaining how it is against God? |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by GumGum: 7:29am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie: In all you have written, you haven't shown where Christ said that all sins are equal. I have shown you severally, and others too have, that sins are not equal. The life of Jesus Christ, which Christians should emulate, was full of love. He also highlighted it as one of the two greatest commandments. If there are commandments greater than others, then breaking some commandments will be weightier than breaking others. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:30am On Dec 10, 2021 |
freeborn02:All sins can be forgiven except one sin does not mean all sins are not judged the same, right? Consider this scenario. Mr. A lusts after his neighbor's wife and moments later dies of a heart attack, while Mr. B lies against the Holy Spirit, and hits the ground dead moments later. Both men never got a chance to ask forgiveness of sins. Will Mr. A end up in with a different judgment at the end from Mr. B? The answer, if you did not know this before now is No. Judgment for everyone, sinners and saints happens at the end - Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46 - and according to Jesus Christ, Mr. A and Mr. B will both end up in the same exact bag for eternity, regardless of the difference in sin and circumstance. No matter what you want to believe of sin or how you want to weigh them in your minds, the Truth according to Jesus Christ is that judgement will only happen after He returns and when He does judge, it will not matter what sin you committed or didn't commit but whether you are righteous or not - Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46. And I hope I don't need to tell you that sinners are unrighteous. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:33am On Dec 10, 2021 |
GumGum:Jesus Christ never said all sins are equal neither did He say that all sins are not equal. As far as His teachings and commandments to us, sin is sin and all sin is unrighteousness which will never enter into His Kingdom- Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46. The idea of weighing one sin against another is of men and not of God. The same punishment awaits all men , whether little sinners or big sinners. Again, the 2 greatest commandments are, as Jesus Christ made clear to you and all in Matthew 22 vs 34 - 40, of the Old Covenant Law or Moses and and prophets. The New Covenant Law of Kingdom of God is a different and separate zlaw fom the Old Covenant Law of Moses indicated. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:44am On Dec 10, 2021 |
obailala:God never indicated that pride and hatred are the most serious of sins. Suggesting they are, this where God Himself did no such thing, is against God. No man has authority to add, remove or change God's own laws. Also, if you think the other way around of what your pope said you will realize how wrong he indeed is. According to God, all sin is unrighteousness in His sight. If all sins lead directly to a eternal damnation, then how do you even begin to imagine any sin as being less serious than the other? |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:47am On Dec 10, 2021 |
GumGum:Read the entire books of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, in order to learn of the teachings and commandments of Jesus Christ - the terms and conditions of God's New Covenant Law and agreement between God and individuals , this in the Kingdom of God. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:48am On Dec 10, 2021 |
LoupGarou:Does the most serious sin land on in a different place of eternal damnation than the least serious sin will? If you sleep with someone before marriage will you not end up in the same exact place of eternal damnation that murderers end up? |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Khayil(m): 7:51am On Dec 10, 2021 |
headSmasher: See Esau, who did nothing. Then Saul who only disobeyed. Ask yourself how many per cent of mercy he has for you. How y'all worship a nepotic, partial being and project yourself as the special is crazy. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 7:52am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Benoxvals:Gravity of the punishment? As far as the Kingdom of God is concerned , Jesus Christ declared that all the unrighteous will end up in place of eternal damnation, this regardless of sin committed - Matthew 25 vs 40 - 46 You speak of gravity of punishment and here God is saying the sentence is eternal damnation for all sins, so what are you referring to? |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Ginomel(m): 7:57am On Dec 10, 2021 |
profmallor: You sounded so wise. Exactly what I tell close ones. But that doesn't mean that Adultery and fornication are not offensive unto God but don't compare with sin of pride and hatred. God detests the two sins more. No wonder God loves charity to repel hatred and He drove satan out due to pride. Only wise people understand this God's principle BUT DON'T GET IT WRONG, SHUN ADULTERY AND FORNICATION. Some people could not understand the Pope stand and statement |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by obailala(m): 7:58am On Dec 10, 2021 |
Kobojunkie:I'm sorry to say but if we claim all sins are equal, we only deceive ourselves. There's absolutely no way the sin of cold blooded mass murder can be on the same level as a 12 year old lad pilfering an extra piece of meat from his mother's pot. If the punishment varies, then the sins cannot be termed to be equal; punishment for some sins start right here on earth. Even Christ himself tells us all sins can be forgiven except the sin against the holy spirit. Isnt that sufficient evidence to prove to you that all sins aren't viewed equally by God? What exactly is the basis of argument on this thread? Or is your position just purely based on a prejudice against the Pope? 1 Like |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Khayil(m): 8:00am On Dec 10, 2021 |
stalwart123: Sin should always be a sin. Sin should be constant, if at any time, different situation, it stops being a sin, then it was never a sin. It would not matter if you create a social prison, marriage, for it to be engaged in. But, then again, how do they term sexual intercourse between married couples sinless, if we are all conceived in sin? Christians are dxmn dishonest... |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Ginomel(m): 8:03am On Dec 10, 2021 |
obailala: Commendably said. |
Re: Pope Francis: Sexual Sins Is Not Most Serious Sin by Kobojunkie: 8:09am On Dec 10, 2021 |
obailala:1. First you need to stop confusing Sin with crime. Sin, for those of us who are of the New Covenant, is as clearly defined in the almost 100 laws given to us by Jesus Christ, God's Law and agreement between God and individuals in the Kingdom of God. Sin refers to direct disobedience of any of the almost 100 commandments of God's Law to us, and the judgment at the end of all sins, regardless of how you personally chose to rank it in your mind is the same - eternal damnation. Whether a one is guilty of adultery or mass murder, the end is the same - eternal damnation. 2. I already been through this with others, but here again. Do you know what end awaits the one who blasphemes the Holy Spirit and the man who commits adultery- lust in his heart? You guessed it - eternal damnation in the very same hell where all sinners end up- Matthew 25 vs 40 - 46. If the end for every sin is the same - eternal damnation- on what basis do you then rule one sin as being more serious than the next sin? |
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