Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / New
Stats: 3,194,223 members, 7,953,853 topics. Date: Friday, 20 September 2024 at 07:49 AM

Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic - Religion (5) - Nairaland

Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic (2989 Views)

Polygamy Is Not Sinful Before God, Only Pastors Are Barred - Presbyterian Pastor / God Only Wants You To Be Holy, Healthy And Highly Successful - Rev Tony Akinyemi / This Will End Fulani Killings. This Thread Is For Sons Of God Only (2) (3) (4)

(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (Reply) (Go Down)

Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by Kobojunkie: 8:51pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
this is boring wink
It's all you. undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 8:53pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
Don't believe in everything you see on YouTube grin
That was why I first gave you a portion to read.

https://answering-islam.org/Green/seven.htm

I hope you will read the lengthy but scholarly material.
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 8:55pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
there is no truth. It's just what you believe. smiley
If you claim there is no truth, then I can understand why you are a Muslim!

Truth mean nothing to Muslims who can practice Taqqiyya as long as Islam is propagated
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by DonroxyII: 8:57pm On May 27, 2022
Kobojunkie:
And I am only interested in you actually answering the OP'S question which again is something like why do Muslims everywhere pray the 5 daily prayers in Arabic and not in English or even yoruba or any other language out there? undecided
Arabic was the Language God communicated/Instructed Prophet Mohammed on the tenet of Islam and Arabic was preserved in Islamic Doctrines just to maintain the authenticity of each aspect of service to Almighty Allah:

Some Meanings can be lost or misconstrued during translations or transliteration.
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by Kobojunkie: 9:00pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
Arabic was the Language God communicated/Instructed Prophet Mohammed on the tenet of Islam and Arabic was preserved in Islamic Doctrines just to maintain the authenticity of each aspect of service to Almighty Allah:

Some Meanings can be lost or misconstrued during translations or transliteration.
I think it has already has been established at this point that the authenticity of the Islamic message diminishes when exposed to different languages. Though those errors have existed even from the beginning, the remain even after almost 1400 of keeping Islam to just the one language. . undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 9:03pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
These are all assertions you deduced from YouTube links of some of the people trying to screw with your mind. The Qur'an is one and the message is thesame. Anyone can fabricate pretty much anything and post them online wink I'd assume you know this already.
I've given you a non YouTube website if you will read.

https://friendlyexmuslim.com/holes-in-the-quran-textual-variants-and-lost-verses/


Again another YouTube site

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ax5S7Vg9-Yw

Here is a Muslim speaking on the same topic you refute vehimently


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsikKJg4ETw
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by DonroxyII: 9:10pm On May 27, 2022
Kobojunkie:
I think it has already has been established at this point that the authenticity of the Islamic message diminishes when exposed to different languages. Though those errors have existed even from the beginning, the remain even after almost 1400 of keeping Islam to just the one language. . undecided
The Authenticity of any Philosophies/
Principles Diminishes when subjected to Translations or Transliteration: Because the Descriptions in each language may not connote what the letters of the Arabic are actually Conveying:

Yoruba language for instance doesn't have exact word for word language for Hausa nor English Same goes for Arabic ....

Also, You don't dictate to Islamic Adherent what to do with their Doctrines or culture, they have right to do what they wanna do with it and Your Reasonableness doesn't have any binding on it as far as over 1.2bn Muslims all over the world are comfortable with the Natural Language of Prophet Mohammed as the Operational Language of Islam cheesy

Culture differs so is People's documentation of their description of Phenomenon in their culture which is called language:

Come with sense and reasoning not Spiritualism!

I'm a Yoruba man and all My life I learnt English(England language) all the Books I read were never translated to Yoruba from Primary school to Masters ...

I didn't cry to Queen Elizabeth because English owns My Educations/Philosophies/Principles of My Courses if I'm not comfortable, then I need to drop My Course and Learn Ifa Education where I shall be taught in Yoruba:

Islam is from Arabia and we keep the Arabic Same way we keep English for our Educations here for our Discipline even now I'm chatting you in English cool
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by haekymbahd(m): 9:10pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

I've given you a non YouTube website if you will read.

https://friendlyexmuslim.com/holes-in-the-quran-textual-variants-and-lost-verses/


Again another YouTube site

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ax5S7Vg9-Yw

Here is a Muslim speaking on the same topic you refute vehimently


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsikKJg4ETw
which topic is that there is only one Quran read with different accent. A Yoruba man and Hausa man are bound to speak English differently due to their accent will you now call that different versions.


@wis3 don't mind that guy he is only deluding himself.

Dialect is different from accent get that...

And not accent are accepted when reading the Quran as some can change the context of the Quran any Qiraat to be accepted must follow 3 basic rule


All of the accepted qirāʾāt follow three basic rules:
1. Conformity to the consonantal skeleton of the ʿUthmānic muṣḥaf.

2. Consistency with Arabic grammar.

3. Authentic chain of transmission.

Those qirāʾāt that fall short of these conditions are shādhdh (anomalous/irregular).

All this Qiraat has their chains traced to the prophet himself...
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 9:14pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

I've given you a non YouTube website if you will read.

https://friendlyexmuslim.com/holes-in-the-quran-textual-variants-and-lost-verses/


Again another YouTube site

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ax5S7Vg9-Yw

Here is a Muslim speaking on the same topic you refute vehimently


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsikKJg4ETw
I stopped taking you seriously the minute you started posting excerpts from YouTube grin . The summary of all this is they're all written in Arabic. This can be likened some words in English where (Deceive/Decieve) both mean thesame thing but different spellings.

1 Like 1 Share

Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by Kobojunkie: 9:18pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
You and Your Myopia:

1. The Authenticity of any Philosophies/
Principles
Diminishes when subjected to Translations or Transliteration:

2. Yoruba language for instance doesn't have exact word for word language for Hausa nor English Same goes for Arabic .... Culture differs so is People's documentation of their description of Phenomenon in their culture which is called language:

3. Come with sense and reasoning not Spiritualism!
1. So the authenticity of Life diminishes when subjected translations and transliteration? undecided

2. That pretty much applies as far as every language out there and the fluid nature of human languages compensate well in such situations. undecided

3. Spiritualism? What the frell does that even mean? undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 9:19pm On May 27, 2022
haekymbahd:
which topic is that there is only one Quran read with different accent. A Yoruba man and Hausa man are bound to speak English differently due to their accent will you now call that different versions.


@wis3 don't mind that guy he is only deluding himself.

Dialect is different from accent get that...
Muslims are not happy that their standard narratives is being bursted.

Muslims are like:
Don't confuse me with the truth as I have made up my mind.


It's okay to feel as you are feeling except that this should make you to ASK RELEVANT QUESTIONS and beware of what you take at face value.

If Uthman destroyed ALL the variants of the Qur'an and circulated ONLY the Hafs version of the Qur'an, Where are these other Qurans coming from?
1. Did Uthman fail in his mission?
2. Did Uthman preserve the other 7 or 10 dialects?
2. Did the Hadiths lie about Uthman?


Any way you look at your narratives, there are still questions begging for answers!
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by DonroxyII: 9:24pm On May 27, 2022
Kobojunkie:
1. So the authenticity of Life diminishes when subjected translations and transliteration? undecided

2. That pretty much applies as far as every language out there and the fluid nature of human languages compensate well in such situations. undecided

3. Spiritualism? What the frell does that even mean? undecided
are you from England ? If no why was your education and all the theories therein were not translated into your fathers/mothers tongue?

Why did you use English all through Your life !
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 9:26pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
I stopped taking you seriously the minute you started posting excerpts from YouTube grin . The summary of all this is they're all written in Arabic. This can be likened some words in English where (Deceive/Decieve) both mean thesame thing but different spellings.
Lame excuses as I ALSO gave you at least TWO website links to read. But no! You've sealed up your mind against knowledge of the truth.

At least Muslims are agreeing that there are other Qurans BUT they are only DIALECTS!

If these are Dialects, then the narrative of perfectly preserved Quran down to the letter is deflated!

You've not answered this question o:

If Uthman destroyed ALL the variants of the Qur'an and circulated ONLY the Hafs version of the Qur'an, Where are these other Qurans coming from?
1. Did Uthman fail in his mission?
2. Did Uthman preserve the other 7 or 10 dialects?
2. Did the Hadiths lie about Uthman?


Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 9:29pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

Lame excuses as I ALSO gave you at least TWO website links to read. But no! You've sealed up your mind against knowledge of the truth.

At least Muslims are agreeing that there are other Qurans BUT they are only DIALECTS!

If these are Dialects, then the narrative of perfectly preserved Quran down to the letter is deflated!

You've not answered this question o:

If Uthman destroyed ALL the variants of the Qur'an and circulated ONLY the Hafs version of the Qur'an, Where are these other Qurans coming from?
1. Did Uthman fail in his mission?
2. Did Uthman preserve the other 7 or 10 dialects?
2. Did the Hadiths lie about Uthman?


spamming
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 9:29pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
are you from England ? If no why was your education and all the theories therein were not translated into your fathers/mothers tongue?

Why did you use English all through Your life !
grin
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by DonroxyII: 9:35pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
grin
Kobo no well like that o grin
He who Controls the Philosophies controls the language :

People no for dey say book difficult if our education were to be in Our Mother's tongue:

I know How much I Tey suffer for oral English grin ... My Teeth nearly comot and Person go dey bite tongue anyhow grin ....

But na Arabic be their problem and we have been using English since when was African Colonised and Missionary Pops Up
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 9:36pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
spamming
Why dodge the question as if you are blind?

Tongue tied?

Uthman destroyed every variant Qur'an and preserved and circulated only the one from the Quraysh dialect. Where are the several Dialects of the Qur'an from?

This narrative was used to defend why there exist only one Arabic Quran in the world. Any answer?
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by Kobojunkie: 9:41pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
1. are you from England ? If no why was your education and all the theories therein were not translated into your fathers/mothers tongue?

2. Why did you use English all through Your life !
1. Where do you get this silly idea that they aren't or can't be effectively translated to my father/mother tongue? undecided

2. Probably because English is the lingua franca in Nigeria and since I never really lived full-time in my mother or father's village, English simply made more sense. undecided

Are you planning on dropping this ridiculous line of argument anytime soon cause it ain't getting you anywhere.. undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by Kobojunkie: 9:42pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
Kobo no well like that o grin
He who Controls the Philosophies controls the language :

People no for dey say book difficult if our education were to be in Our Mother's tongue:

I know How much I Tey suffer for oral English grin ... My Teeth nearly comot and Person go dey bite tongue anyhow grin ....

But na Arabic be their problem and we have been using English since when was African Colonised and Missionary Pops Up
Controls what philosophy abeg? Na conspiracy theories you want attempt now? undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by DonroxyII: 9:43pm On May 27, 2022
Kobojunkie:
Controls what philosophy abeg? Na conspiracy theories you want attempt now? undecided
tongue
grin
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 9:44pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

Why dodge the question as if you are blind?

Tongue tied?

Uthman destroyed every variant Qur'an and preserved and circulated only the one from the Quraysh dialect. Where are the several Dialects of the Qur'an from?

This narrative was used to defend why there exist only one Arabic Quran in the world. Any answer?
I'm sure you're getting all these theories from your YouTube links. I'd advice you find something someone to lend you a copy of the Quran. Try not to download it online because you'd probably just end up getting a doctored. Just like the fabricated YouTube links you have been posting smiley
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by DonroxyII: 9:45pm On May 27, 2022
Kobojunkie:
1. Where do you get this silly idea that they aren't or can't be effectively translated to my father/mother tongue? undecided

2. Probably because English is the lingua franca in Nigeria and since I never really lived full-time in my mother or father's village, English simply made more sense. undecided

Are you planning on dropping this ridiculous line of argument anytime soon cause it ain't getting you anywhere.. undecided
Qur'an had been translated to more than enough of all the languages of the World:

Research before you speak so as for you not to sound myopic:

Allahu Akbar is not a big deal
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by Kobojunkie: 9:50pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
Qur'an had been translated to more than enough of all the languages of the World:

Research before you speak so as for you not to sound myopic:

Allahu Akbar is not a big deal
I see you have nothing tangible to add any of what has been said so far. undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 9:53pm On May 27, 2022
DonroxyII:
Kobo no well like that o grin
He who Controls the Philosophies controls the language :

People no for dey say book difficult if our education were to be in Our Mother's tongue:

I know How much I Tey suffer for oral English grin ... My Teeth nearly comot and Person go dey bite tongue anyhow grin ....

But na Arabic be their problem and we have been using English since when was African Colonised and Missionary Pops Up
beats me. grin
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 9:58pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
I'm sure you're getting all these theories from your YouTube links. I'd advice you find something someone to lend you a copy of the Quran. Try not to download it online because you'd probably just end up getting a doctored. Just like the fabricated YouTube links you have been posting smiley
I can never forget my 200L years ago. I was almost reciting the Shahada! My first English Qur'an was the Meaning of the Glorious Qur'an by Marmaduke Pickthall. I was following Ahmed Deedat like a fly will follow a rotten corpse.

Everything came to a stop because I WAS READING the Qur'an. I saw so may irreconcilables! Unlike you Muslims who should not question the Qur'an, I asked questions and the answers fell flat. So many things were wrong and didn't add up.

The final blow was wrecked when I started reading the hadiths in the state library. I'm sure Arabian night stories could have done better.

So bro!
I've come a long way with Islam, the only difference is that unlike you, I just don't memorise, I ask questions!

On my phone, I have at least five or six Qur'an Apps. The more you seek the truth, the farther it will lead you away from Islam.

Sorry bro to disappoint you!
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 10:05pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

I can never forget my 200L years ago. I was almost reciting the Shahada! My first English Qur'an was the Glorious Qur'an by Marmaduke Pickthall. I was following Ahmed Deedat like a fly will follow a rotten corpse.

Everything came to a stop because I WAS READING the Qur'an. I saw so may irreconcilables! Unlike you Muslims who should not question the Qur'an, I asked questions and the answers fell flat. So many things were wrong and didn't add up.

The final blow was wrecked when I started reading the hadiths in the state library. I'm sure Arabian night stories could have done better.

So bro!
I've come a long way with Islam, the only difference is that unlike you, I just don't memorise, I ask questions!

On my phone, I have at least five or six Qur'an Apps. The more you seek the truth, the farther it will lead you away from Islam.

Sorry bro to disappoint you!



You seem to have a knack for getting wrong information. Get someone to lend you a copy of the Holy Qur'an. Hard copy oo..
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by haekymbahd(m): 10:07pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

Muslims are not happy that their standard narratives is being bursted.

Muslims are like:
Don't confuse me with the truth as I have made up my mind.


It's okay to feel as you are feeling except that this should make you to ASK RELEVANT QUESTIONS and beware of what you take at face value.

If Uthman destroyed ALL the variants of the Qur'an and circulated ONLY the Hafs version of the Qur'an, Where are these other Qurans coming from?
1. Did Uthman fail in his mission?
2. Did Uthman preserve the other 7 or 10 dialects?
2. Did the Hadiths lie about Uthman?


Any way you look at your narratives, there are still questions begging for answers!
Ahruf (dialect) is different from Qiraat (ways of reciting/accent) don't confuse the 2.

Uthman only made the Quran in one dialect and not one Qiraat?


Uthman never circulated only the the Hafs version that is a false statement from you. But he circulated the Quran written in the dialect if the Quraysh (the tribe of the prophet).


All of the accepted qirāʾāt follow three basic rules:
1. Conformity to the consonantal skeleton of the ʿUthmānic muṣḥaf.

2. Consistency with Arabic grammar.

3. Authentic chain of transmission.

Those qirāʾāt that fall short of these conditions are shādhdh (anomalous/irregular).

All this Qiraat has their chains traced to the prophet himself...
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 10:27pm On May 27, 2022
haekymbahd:
Ahruf (dialect) is different from Qiraat (ways of reciting/accent) don't confuse the 2.

Uthman only made the Quran in one dialect and not Qiraat?


Uthman never circulated only the the Hafs version that is a false statement from you. But he circulated the Quran written in the dialect if the Quraysh (the tribe of the prophet).


All of the accepted qirāʾāt follow three basic rules:
1. Conformity to the consonantal skeleton of the ʿUthmānic muṣḥaf.

2. Consistency with Arabic grammar.

3. Authentic chain of transmission.

Those qirāʾāt that fall short of these conditions are shādhdh (anomalous/irregular).

All this Qiraat has their chains traced to the prophet himself...
Pets get the truth straight
1. Uthman collected the manuscripts of the Qur'an from Hafsah
2. He made sure a standard copy of the Qur'an was made in the Quraysh dialect
3. Uthman collected all other Variants of the Qur'an whether in full or in fragments and Burned them with fire
4. Copies of the standard Quran were distributed to Muslim communities.

If all these above are true
1. There must only exist in writing the Hafs Qur'an (because it is written down)
2. How you pronounce the words does not matter as the words remain the same as the original (only intonations can differ)
3. Therefore ways of recitations should not affect the written Qur'an (it is amazing how one Nigerian Muslim who thinks he speaks Arabic was almost humiliated by a man of Arab disent: his intonations were bad)


Now, the problems we have with the Qur'an is NOT how it is recited BUT how it is WRITTEN! Two different things.

Where did the other variants of the Published Qur'an come from?

Any change in the written text of the Qur'an to adjust to human pronunciation (as different from how Allah pronounced the word) is called EDITING.

Was the Qur'an edited?
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 10:33pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
You seem to have a knack for getting wrong information. Get someone to lend you a copy of the Holy Qur'an. Hard copy oo..
I can only laugh at your mulish ignorance.

You asked me to get a Qur'an, and I told you my first English hardcopy Qur'an .

Reading the Qur'an took me away from Islam permanently.

I am sure you don't know Ahmed Deedat ? I read all his books then.

Dr Zakir Naik is a disciple of Ahmed Deedat.

The book you asked me to Read was what drove me away from Islam just as I was about reciting the Shahada.

Ask Questions!
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by haekymbahd(m): 10:35pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

Pets get the truth straight
1. Uthman collected the manuscripts of the Qur'an from Hafsah
2. He made sure a standard copy of the Qur'an was made in the Quraysh dialect
3. Uthman collected all other Variants of the Qur'an whether in full or in fragments and Burned them with fire
4. Copies of the standard Quran were distributed to Muslim communities.

If all these above are true
1. There must only exist in writing the Hafs Qur'an (because it is written down)
2. How you pronounce the words does not matter as the words remain the same as the original (only intonations can differ)
3. Therefore ways of recitations should not affect the written Qur'an (it is amazing how one Nigerian Muslim who thinks he speaks Arabic was almost humiliated by a man of Arab disent: his intonations were bad)


Now, the problems we have with the Qur'an is NOT how it is recited BUT how it is WRITTEN! Two different things.

Where did the other variants of the Published Qur'an come from?
The Quran when uthman compounded it in one dialect didn't have the diacritical marks so it was open to several Qiraat/accents.

One thing you need to know is that the Quran was revealed orally and not in written form in a book so the prophet and his followers were only memorising it even though some were written down in various fragment but we're compiled in one place in a book. Which means the Quran is what is being recited and not what is written.

If two or more Muslims read your so called versions of the Quran you might not even detect any difference you will only detect it when you see it written down because the Quran was later written down in the approved accents with diacritical marks.


All of the accepted qirāʾāt follow three basic rules:
1. Conformity to the consonantal skeleton of the ʿUthmānic muṣḥaf.

2. Consistency with Arabic grammar.

3. Authentic chain of transmission.

Those qirāʾāt that fall short of these conditions are shādhdh (anomalous/irregular).

All this Qiraat has their chains traced to the prophet himself...
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by wis3(m): 10:36pm On May 27, 2022
TenQ:

I can only laugh at your mulish ignorance.

You asked me to get a Qur'an, and I told you my first English hardcopy Qur'an .

Reading the Qur'an took me away from Islam permanently.

I am sure you don't know Ahmed Deedat ? I read all his books then.

Dr Zakir Naik is a disciple of Ahmed Deedat.

The book you asked me to Read was what drove me away from Islam just as I was about reciting the Shahada.

Ask Questions!

I didn't realize Zakir Naik wrote the Qur'an? Or that Ahmed Deedat was the prophet? undecided
Re: Is Islam God Only Understand Arabic by TenQ: 10:42pm On May 27, 2022
wis3:
I didn't realize Zakir Naik wrote the Qur'an? Or that Ahmed Deedat was the prophet? undecided
Taqqiyya is in your blood!
Why change topic?

(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (Reply)

What Can You Die For? / The Sin That Defeats Jesus / Mansions In Heaven…..

(Go Up)

Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health
religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket

Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10)

Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 75
Disclaimer: Every Nairaland member is solely responsible for anything that he/she posts or uploads on Nairaland.