Onlytruth:

Posted by: Ibime
Not true. They became "ohu" or "oru". Not the same as Osu.
But, like I said, lets drop this topic and move on.
Aren't you even curious why this thread has remained here in Politics sections, instead of the usual "Secessionist, Racism and Tribalism" section?
Folks should really be smarter than this, honestly.
Move on bro. It is well.  

Was thinking the same thing. I came to the conclusion that because these fish-looking people called the "Ijaw" are giving everybody problems over land, this kind of thread brings a sense of unity,i guess. Its a problem than we all are experiencing.

Please educate me OnlyTruth,

What is the meaning of Oru in Igbo?

Why should a slave in Igboland be called Oru?

Oru is the real name of the Ijaw people. It was the whiteman who called us Ijo, but our proper name is Oru. This must mean that slaves to Igbo must have been traditionally taken from the Oru people.

In addition, a statement made by Abagworo struck me. He said that his people have a saying that "I am Oru, but I am not Ijaw". Are Abagworos people not colonised Igbos of original Oru extraction? Bear in mind Abagworo is from a riverine community in Imo State.

Posted by: ndu_chucks

hehehe, caught in a white lie and wishes to drop the topic and move on.  Typical

hehe!
Knew you were lurking around here still. Can't imagine life without us.
Well, I will make you a proposal before we can stay in Nigeria.

1- GEJ MUST RULE A SECOND TERM, and if possible sef a third term.
2- Power must NEVER return to the North for the foreseeable future.

You gree?

Posted by: Ibime

Please educate me OnlyTruth,

What is the meaning of Oru in Igbo?

Why should a slave in Igboland be called Oru?

Oru is the real name of the Ijaw people. It was the whiteman who called us Ijo, but our proper name is Oru. This must mean that slaves to Igbo must have been traditionally taken from the Oru people.

In addition, a statement made by Abagworo struck me. He said that his people have a saying that "I am Oru, but I am not Ijaw". Are Abagworos people not colonised Igbos of original Oru extraction? Bear in mind Abagworo is from a riverine community in Imo State.

Thought you could speak Igbo well.
Anyway, the tones are different.
Also, "Oru" as in slave is the Anambra/Onitsha, Idemili version
While "Ohu" is the Nnewi and others version for slave.

The "Oru" you mean is different.
We say "Oru na Igbo bu nwanne" (Oru and Igbo are brothers). That is the one Abagworo belong.

ndu_chucks, I'm still waiting for your answer to my terms.

1-GEJ must rule for at least 8 years
2-Political power (Presidency) must stay in the South for the foreseeable future (say 50 years).

You gree?
If you no gree, make you kuku begin chase ya cow go North, you hia? 

The study of linguistics tells me that Igbos used to take slaves from the Oru people.

The word slave is taken from the word Slav - as the original slaves were abducted from Slavic peoples of Eastern Europes.

The Northern Igbo may have come to assign the word Oru (slave) to represent the people from which they plundered slaves.

Secondly, if Oru and Igbo are brothers, then Oru is not Igbo. I am Oru. Any Ijaw from Nembe to Bonny was known as Oru as recently as 1900. Why would Abagworo's people need to say "I am Oru but I am not Ijaw"? These are the words of someone trying to distance himself from his true identity. A true Igbo man should have no need to disclaim Ijaw as he would be sure of his identity.

@Ibime, where you not the one that said your great grand dad was Igbo
I sense someone is not saying the truth.

As for Oru and Igbo, they are brothers. Ijaw is not Oru but mixed with Oru.

Oru (oh-r-u) means slave in Igbo.
Oru(aw-r-u) means a people.

Obiagu, I hope your education was not a waste, especially in the area of simple arithmetic. I believe you have 4 Great Grandfathers and so do I.

Ibime:

Obiagu, I hope your education was not a waste, especially in the area of simple arithmetic. I believe you have 4 Great Grandfathers and so do I.

LMAO! Caught in a lie and he's claiming 20 great grand dads.

Your paternal lineage was Igbo, mr. man.

Mr man, stop embarassing yourself after exposing your ignorance. I believe you have two granfathers and two grandmothers and they each have fathers. Its best you quit this show of shame and admit your goof. So far you have seen me talk about my Igbo great-grandfather and assumed that all 4 of them are Igbo. Dede, please call your brother to order. He is making a mockery of educational achievement in the South-East. Hehehehe.

Yes I remember Ibime saying he was partly Igbo and his grandfather / relatives ended up in some part of Bayelsa. Can't remember what part of Igbo land but I believe it was part of Anambra area or did he say Abia?

Ibime:

Mr man, stop embarassing yourself after exposing your ignorance. I believe you have two granfathers and two grandmothers and they each have fathers. Its best you quit this show of shame and admit your goof. So far you have seen me talk about my Igbo great-grandfather and assumed that all 4 of them are Igbo. Dede, please call your brother to order. He is making a mockery of educational achievement in the South-East. Hehehehe.

Mr man, your great grand dad was Igbo who gave birth to your grand dad, an Igbo man, and gave birth to your dad (Igbo man 'spiritually' acculturated and became Ijaw, probably a beneficially of abandoned property) and gave birth to you (Igbo by blood, Ijaw by delusion)

The other 3 dads don't count.

Mr Man, there's no need to set context which isn't there. I have assigned neither paternal nor maternal lineage to the I just spoke about, though if you must know "he's the one that counts" according to your criteria. Without delving much into family matters which are none of your concern, my Igbo is the most relevant since I was accultured solely in his village due to "estrangement". Just leave it there.

Ijaws!!!!

Ibime:

Mr Man, there's no need to set context which isn't there. I have assigned neither paternal nor maternal lineage to the I just spoke about, though if you must know "he's the one that counts" according to your criteria. Without delving much into family matters which are none of your concern, my Igbo is the most relevant since I was accultured solely in his village due to "estrangement". Just leave it there.

Quotable quote by Ibime, I think I should remind you, hope you pass the info to your kids.


Ibime (m)

#59 on: December 31, 2008, 02:00 PM

just an honest assessment. . . . my great grandfather himself is from Asa in Abia State. . . . I am only Ijaw by migration, not by blood.


You fit be Chinenye brother self.

The truth is that most so called Ijaw from Eastern Ijaw area are actually Igbos including GEJ. Whenever he says Igbo by the circumstances of his birth, you should know what he's talking about.
I really have to live among them to know how they feel and why extreme indoctrination is going on there.

killayut: If ancient Binis  never had a fight with Ijaws over any land why are Binis of today  doing same ?  Who is fighting the Ijaws in GELE GELE ?  are they Binis  who live in Gelegele   or  some Binis  elsewhere ?    People should reason,  Bini  people from another settlement can not come to GELE gele  TO Claim that  a town inhabited by another language group belongs to them .  The forest surrounding the town could be of dispute  but not the town itself .  Are there any historical evidence of early Bini residence or activity in gele gele ? cemetery, shrine  and family  to mention a few ,

My mother's  town in Rivers  state  called  Bakana today is originally named  OBA-AMA  which was named after the title of the king from where they migrated  from. The main founding family of that Kalabari Ijaw  town were from the Ijaw settlements of the GELE GELE area  at the Bini river  and at that  time  the area was  under  Bini empire (  Empire  does not mean they were  Bini people ). The rise of Bini empire  had the Binis  ruling over several non Bini  people ) and  every one respected  the OBA just as every one respect  the king and  queens of England under the British empire.  That area Gelegele  and the River  Benin  might be the original home of Ijaw  people from where they dispersed to different places  because  many other Ijaws in Rivers  state  traced  their root to the same spot,  People  should not lay claim to where  they do not live,

Why are you still trying this line of argument?

a) Gelegele was not uninhabited, even after the destruction of Gelegele. But few Binis returned, and the place became majority Ijaw.

The Ijaws don't get to decide all of a sudden after the discovery of oil that the demographics of the place become permanently Ijaw majority or that there exists an Ijaw traditional ruler there. This so called Ijaw traditional ruler of Gelegele is a shameless liar and fraud. He is merely the head of a settler group and is in no way a real royal or traditional ruler.

b) Gelegele is NOT an "exterior" territory of the old Benin empire or a different ethnic group's territory that the Binis conquered in ancient times or gained political control of and put under the empire.

It is a Benin founded place and "core" Benin territory. This is why people are not seeing eye to eye on this. Binis are trying to hammer it into people's thick skulls that very core Bini land is being claimed by people who are opportunists. This is why there is so much contention on this and why the Binis won't back down.

This will be second time after trying to explain the situation that I get all sorts of vague insinuations referencing the ancient Benin empire. This is an ordinary land dispute between the owners of the land and migrants, but because Benin is involved, people start insinuating things.

Humans are fundamentally territorial creatures by nature. It's easy for hypocrites, sitting back comfortably from outside the situation, to act as if they would agree to any part of the territorial land mass occupied by their ethnic group being ceded to and eventually owned by other groups in only a matter of decades. But would any of them actually abide by this in real life? Are they claiming that every single piece of land between their towns is fully occupied?

I would like Rivers and Delta state political and traditional leaders to put in writing in an official agreement with the federal government that they will abide by the principle that every single Nigerian group can settle in the southern part of Rivers state and the southern part of Delta state and claim as much land for their group as they deem fit, as long as that group is constantly physically present there. I know this would never happen, but this and this alone could be the only possible excuse anybody could use to demand that the Binis give up their claim to their own land to settlers.

That the British created a situation (burning it down) that made it unappealing to the majority of its former inhabitants to return there does not mean that a bunch of opportunists can start attacking Binis there and claiming it.  If Ijaws wanted to own that land so badly, they should have fought the Binis for it in 1897, not all this cowardly bullshit where a few ordinary civilians are selected and attacked with machetes. This whole situation involves cowardice, fraud, and hypocrisy.

If there is some group that the Binis would have to cede the land to, it would be the group that actually conquered the land and captured it, not opportunists who were even allowed to live there by the Binis.

c) Nobody is denying that the Ijaws had some "settlements" along the Benin river. That is quite another thing from laying claim to a specific area held by another group for centuries and claiming ownership of an area that they had no historical control of or authority in.

This talk of "settlements at the Gelegele area" is what is also somewhat annoying. What does this even mean? What are the names of these settlements? Or were they living at a place and not knowing what they called the place? How is that a real village or town? There were Itsekiri trading "settlements" in Bini areas, but they did not start claiming ownership of the land. All I could make out from your comments is that some Ijaws had traditions of settling near a Bini area in times past and then moving out.

d) This talk of a cemetery or shrine or question about any "any historical evidence of early Bini residence or activity in gele gele" is frustrating and annoying. How are you not getting what I've been saying? A group would only give up ownership of land that they occupied for centuries to another group if they formally ceded the land to that other group. In the absence of that formal cession, why should they possibly see it as anything other than their land? Did the other group conquer the land from them? Did the other group pay them the cost of the land? This isn't so difficult to understand.

Ibime:

The whitewashing of history by the likes of Dede is simply laughable.

I was reading on the internet when I stumbled across an interview with a slave woman from Umahia who was owned by my great-grandfather Chief John George (pure Ijaw man).

It is simply laughable to claim that slave owners were Igbo. It is well known that significant portion of Nembe and Akassa are descendant from slaves. Pray tell, who owned them?

The only difference between Ijaw-owners and Igbo slave-owners is that slaves to Ijaw become part of the family whilst slaves to Igbo become Osu.

I doubt this story, unless you can provide a link. There was nothing like Umuahia at the time of slave trade. Umuahia became Umuahia circa 1908. Furthermore, don't try and become an expert on Igbo culture overnight just because you read a few articles. We had our own ohu (slaves; also called oru in some parts of Igbo land) in my kindred and they could gain their freedom if they worked at it. We gave them land in our ama as well and they  now participate in all our activities except for Umunna (direct descendants) events, especially (some) marriage and burial rights. FYI, osu was not a general practice in Igbo land and we have nothing like that in my clan (Ibeku)

Generally speaking, I am not interested in land arguments but people should know that when the chips are down; both the he-goat and the man wey carry am go market get bia-bia, but when market set, we go know who carry who come market.

Obiagu1:

The truth is that most so called Ijaw from Eastern Ijaw area are actually Igbos including GEJ. Whenever he says Igbo by the circumstances of his birth, you should know what he's talking about.
I really have to live among them to know how they feel and why extreme indoctrination is going on there.

the truth

is this in the bible or quran

Ibime:

Please educate me OnlyTruth,

What is the meaning of Oru in Igbo?

Why should a slave in Igboland be called Oru?

[b]Oru is the real name of the Ijaw people. It was the whiteman who called us Ijo, but our proper name is Oru. This must mean that slaves to Igbo must have been traditionally taken from the Oru people.[/b]In addition, a statement made by Abagworo struck me. He said that his people have a saying that "I am Oru, but I am not Ijaw". Are Abagworos people not colonised Igbos of original Oru extraction? Bear in mind Abagworo is from a riverine community in Imo State.

Sometimes I admire your honesty even against the dead weight of current and treacherous revisionism. You accused me of whitewashing history yet you confirmed that Ijo was the making of Europeans, a fact I have stated amongst unwarranted abuse. The laughable aspect of the history is an attempt to convert Ijo to Izon. I guess the moronic imbeciles forget the plank of your argument that suggested Oru.

Onlytruth:

Posted by: Ibime
Not true. They became "ohu" or "oru". Not the same as Osu.
But, like I said, lets drop this topic and move on.
Aren't you even curious why this thread has remained here in Politics sections, instead of the usual "Secessionist, Racism and Tribalism" section?
Folks should really be smarter than this, honestly.
Move on bro. It is well.

I noticed the seemly oversight

I have read accounts that state clearly that the name Ijo derives from Ujo, a famous ancestor of the Ijaws and some of these accounts also acknowledge that this wasn't the original name for the Ijaws but that Oru was the original name. That the original name was Oru does not mean that the name Ijo, by simple elimination, derives from a European word.

Can someone (i.e. Dede) give a convincing linguistic argument showing that there is a particular reason that the Portuguese would use the word "Jos" or "Ijos" to refer to "boat people", "seamen", "sailors", "fishermen", "ferrymen", or "people of the river" or even "porter" "helper" "servant" or even anything similar? Portuguese dictionaries are accessible, and I can't see how there is a connection between the word "Ijo" or "Jos" and Portuguese words. Granted, languages change somewhat over time, but if the word "Jo" did not have a meaning in their language, I doubt they (the Portuguese) were the ones that made up the term.


As an example of one of the accounts I was referring to:

http://www.ijawfoundation.org/people.htm

^^^

Although there are several things stated in there that I disagree with completely (such as the false claim about a population of 14 million Ijaws and some of the historical claims), I have to say that I am more inclined to believe that the term Ijo is of African origin than Portuguese.

Indentured servants makes more sense to me when we talk about Ohu, not slaves. That's got a completely different connotation.

Relax101:




Quotable quote by Ibime, I think I should remind you, hope you pass the info to your kids.


Ibime (m)

#59 on: December 31, 2008, 02:00 PM

just an honest assessment. . . . my great grandfather himself is from Asa in Abia State. . . . I am only Ijaw by migration, not by blood.


You fit be Chinenye brother self.

For the sake of expediency, read post 194 on here: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-212856.192.html where I spoke about my .

Like I said before, my families take our identity from my Igbo due to an estrangement up the family tree that disenfranchised us culturally from pure paternal lineage, and for that reason, this matter is closed to further probity.

It was in the course of reserching my estranged lineage that I learned my pure Ijaw was the key political actor of his time, a regent, warlord and slaveowner. . . and it was in the course of my research that i stumbled across Bishop crowthers interview with one of his slaves. . . from Umuoji, not Umuahia as I previously and erronously stated. . .

FACE:


I doubt this story, unless you can provide a link. There was nothing like Umuahia at the time of slave trade. Umuahia became Umuahia circa 1908.

Your knowledge of history is strong. . . you're right, it wasnt Umahia. . .

 quote from PHYSICS I would like Rivers and Delta state political and traditional leaders to put in writing in an official agreement with the federal government that they will abide by the principle that every single Nigerian group can settle in the southern part of Rivers state and the southern part of Delta state and claim as much land for their group as they deem fit, as long as that group is constantly physically present there. I know this would never happen, but this and this alone could be the only possible excuse anybody could use to demand that the Binis give up their claim to their own land to settlers.

Bro you need to go round Nigeria to know more about your country. In Rivers  state  alone there are over 10 Edo settlements and the people  are distinct from the Ijaws. Some of them have become Ijaws  by reasons and never by any Ijaw presure.  Settlements like Degema  which is  about the Capital of the Kalabari  people is  home town to the USOKUN AND ATALA edos who are today refered to as  KALA  and Opu Degema  people, Obonoma and Bukuma  settlements  are also Edoid, Abuloma in Okrika is also an Edoid group. These are  Edo settlements  in Rivers state that even Ijaw  people of KALABARI AND OKRIKA would fight to protect, So let the GELE GELE IJAWS be  my friend,

The Ijaw language has a lot of similarities with ancient Egyptian language. This might just be coincidence.

ORU actually means deity in Ijaw . The Ijaws are a spiritual people and our culture is almost spiritism. a person in Ijaw is a kheme ( western and TEME ( eastern ) Ijaw. now KHEME means spirit person in ancient Egypt HENCE khemet meaning living being and khemetu which means living body. In Ijaw kheme otu means Living body and hence KHEME OTU BO means physical body of the living person.

In Ijaw Irua means the sun while in Egypt RAH which to me is IRua MEANS the sun and hence RAH is the sun God ( worship of the sun )
In Ijaw storm or wind or breeze is called FEROU or FAROU . a great strong powerful person could be refered to as FEROU meaning great one. This was how PHAROAH was pronounced in Egypt and hence PHAROAH was the title of the ruler of Egypt.

If you use your head you ll see that the ancient deity of Egyp HORUS wwhich was pronounced as HORU is similar to ORU in Ijaw
. in the BIBLE it is said and I quote, ( ye are gods ). and so the IJAWS referd to themselves as little gods ( ORU )

This should not lead to another Ijaw / Egyp sarcasm, This is just an insight to educate people about the meaning of ORU,

quoting Physics OED Gelegele was not uninhabited, even after the destruction of Gelegele. But few Binis returned, and the place became majority Ijaw.

From your post 695, Let the Binis of GELE GELE come up to challenge the IJAWS. From what we are seeing the Binis that are planning to wipe out the Ijaws are not from GELE GELE,

Previously some people have doubted GELEgele TO be an Ijaw word. I am not from Gele Gele so I d not really know but as an eastern Ijaw speaker I know that the word GELE GELE is an Ijaw word and it means BOLDNESS. Toru gele gele ( to be bold )

gele gele ma mien ( do it boldly )

killayut:

Bro you need to go round Nigeria to know more about your country. In Rivers  state  alone there are over 10 Edo settlements and the people  are distinct from the Ijaws. Some of them have become Ijaws  by reasons and never by any Ijaw presure.  Settlements like Degema  which is  about the Capital of the Kalabari  people is  home town to the USOKUN AND ATALA edos who are today refered to as  KALA  and Opu Degema  people, Obonoma and Bukuma  settlements  are also Edoid, Abuloma in Okrika is also an Edoid group. These are  Edo settlements  in Rivers state that even Ijaw  people of KALABARI AND OKRIKA would fight to protect,  So let the GELE GELE IJAWS be  my friend,

Killayut

toro-ebe state. I heard it will start from the ijaws in Ajegule Lagos to ilaje land and cover urhobo land and itsekiri

is it true that there are indigenous Ijaws in lagos. and if so how did they give land to awori and egun people of lagos ?

then I heard of ilaje people too were given land by the ijaws ? How true is that

also how come ilaje people are in delta state and what part of ilaje land do arogbo ijaw and apoi ijaw have

thanks

killayut:

Bro you need to go round Nigeria to know more about your country. In Rivers  state  alone there are over 10 Edo settlements and the people  are distinct from the Ijaws. Some of them have become Ijaws  by reasons and never by any Ijaw presure.  Settlements like Degema  which is  about the Capital of the Kalabari  people is  home town to the USOKUN AND ATALA edos who are today refered to as  KALA  and Opu Degema  people, Obonoma and Bukuma  settlements  are also Edoid, Abuloma in Okrika is also an Edoid group. These are  Edo settlements  in Rivers state that even Ijaw  people of KALABARI AND OKRIKA would fight to protect,  So let the GELE GELE IJAWS be  my friend,

I mentioned speakers of Edoid languages in Bayelsa and Rivers several pages ago in my first response to Dede1 on this thread. That there are Edoid speakers in those places is irrelevant to my point about land grabbing. Whose land did those people in Rivers land grab? If they are not the original inhabitants of the areas they now occupy, did they settle there and get on bad terms with the other groups there by proclaiming kingdoms in other groups' land? I don't see the similarities.

@ killayut,

Gelegele is an Ijaw word now? lol @ that. This is starting to remind me of that squabble over the word "ama" between some Igbo and Ijaw posters here. I'll refrain from calling you a liar, however, since I don't understand your language.

If you claim you can provide an Ijaw etymology for it, then what does "Gelegelegbini" (what Ijaws really called it, before they started pretending to own it) mean? "Bold water"? "Bold Bini"?

quoting  PHYSICS OED This talk of a cemetery or shrine or question about any "any historical evidence of early Bini residence or activity in gele gele" is frustrating and annoying. How are you not getting what I've been saying? A group would only give up ownership of land that they occupied for centuries to another group if they formally ceded the land to that other group. In the absence of that formal cession, why should they possibly see it as anything other than their land? Did the other group conquer the land from them? Did the other group pay them the cost of the land? This isn't so difficult to understand.

You have failed to prove that there were ancient Binis in the GELE GELE area  not to even mention Gele gele  town  since  there were no burial site  for such ancient people. no established  ancient shrine for such Bini voodoo loving people. No one single being in GELE GELE town has or could come up to claim his or her ancestors  founded  GELE GELE,  All what you people   would say  is the IJAWS  came there to trade. Does it not make sense  that  the Ijaws  came there first to settle and trade with the Binis  that came from their hinter land ? Ijaws do not just live in boats, They anchor the boats at river banks and make use of the land at the shore and make it a BOU ( small farming land for the production of potato and  plantain. The Ijaws may have settled there while the Binis  came from their hinter land to trade  if not why didn't the Binis  also live  among the Ijaws ?  These people w ere not even challenged  by the BINIS of those  days  so why  and what is making you Binis  of today challenge the natives  of GELE GELE,   You guys  should just stay at your own villages and let the IJAWS  BE,