₦airaland Forum

God bless you ow11 for the added scriptures.  I posted mine without reading yours.  Thank you too for the added understanding.

I believe those verses are also to discourage the prevalent pagan polygamous practices that are being carried wholesome into the church by the new converts of the early church (and us too!) so that they will know they can never be entrusted with service and leadership in the church.  Christians should not marry more than one wife.  References to marriage in the New Testament is always one man, one woman. People that practised polygamy in the Old Testament had terrible family lives.

There is no clear cut christian injunction that a christian cannot marry more than one wife. It really is an assumption with very weak biblical foundation. Only church leaders were instructed not to have more than one wife

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The fact that it was only church leaders that were specifically instructed not to have more than one wife implies that the rest of the church members could if they so desired

Let me start by saying the scripture posted by Jokepearl is a good place to start.  That is straight from the Lord Jesus Himself.  Let me expand more a little bit.

Matthew 19:
3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he (that is, GOD) which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they two shall be one flesh?
6 Wherefore they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

Notice the verses above and my emphases:  it's always 'a man', then 'his wife' (not wives); they 'two', not 'three', 'four', 'many', but 'two' shall be one flesh.  The same narrative is contained in Mark 10:2-12

I think this idea of one wife was introduced when european culture mixed with Christianity

Haba KunleOshob, is God a European?  Notice the verses 4-5 of the scripture above where Jesus was speaking, referring to what GOD said and did, in the beginning!  Note that GOD said it.  He instituted 'one man, one woman' marriage ever before culture, language, or even sin entered the scene!

Look at it in the beginning:

Genesis 2
22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

Now, how does that sound like a European culture, folks?  It is also not polygamy.  The tenses are very clear, and the number very specific.  From the beginning, the blueprint for marriage by the Creator of it was for one man, one woman.  That is how you get the correct optimal function.  Any other number is an aberration, a departure from the original design and is bound to malfunction!

Let me provide one more scripture before tackling one of the examples you gave.

Ephesians 5:
31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

Jokepearl, you are on the right track. Let's wait for KunleOshob.

Oooops! I replied before seeing your latest post. Does that alter your former position?

So KunleOshob, I ask you, where do the deacon and bishop come from?  Outside the christian community or from outer space?  Who are the ones that become deacons, bishops or any position of leadership according to the scriptures?  Are they not those whose lives and conducts have been found to be blameless, stable and responsible, according to those criteria you are alienating the rest of the church from?

I am willing to engage on this, but can you do this house a favour by highlighting where God approved polygamy in such a clearcut manner you are inviting?

Waiting. . .

Hi KunleOshob.  You are on a shaky ground here, very shaky!

LASIEFAIRE:
I don't know how and where to write this, but I will just write.
Well, the few people I conversate with on a daily basis will know I haven't posted for a while.
I've been planning to get something for a while, and I finally got it. This thing is Major (life changing.)
I wish I could discuss it in details, but the nature of it coupled with the attitude of some Nairalanders won't let me do that.
When you are saying your prayers, don't forget to thank God for me. Keep me in your prayers.
And to those that have lost faith, there is a God out there and He still takes people from the valley to the Mt. top.

Thank God for your life bro. May His blessings and mercies over your life not cease. Please we are eager to hear the details of the testimony and contact the same grace too. God bless you and all your endeavours.

OLAADEGBU, thanks so much for those kind words and prayers.  I pray the Lord continue to enrich you too with all His blessings in heavenly places.  May He continue to find us available for His use.  Amen.

Know that whatever we do here on this side of eternity is never in vain.  Keep sowing, keep watering, for in due season, we shall reap if we faint not.  Your exhortations, as well as others', are surely blessing lives.  May He coninue to find us as usable instruments in His Hands.

Pilgrim.1, where have you been hiding? Yours is being missed here. Do we begin to pray for a less workload?

Love y'all.

I couldn't agree more with you OLAADEGBU. God bless you richly.

God has so many ways of reaching out and speaking to us on certain issues. Dreams, visions, trances, out-of-body experiences etc are certainly some of them. The entire book of Revelation came as a result when John was banished to the island of Patmos.

So many issues in my life were revealed to me through such. I remember when I gave my life to Christ. After a dear friend of mine preached to me, I had a dream by around 2am (which I fondly call vision, because it was so vivid that I wrote it all down!) where I was going on a lonely path, got to a Y junction, with a sign post- one pointing to Heaven and the other pointing to Hell. I took the road down to Hell and was languishing in Hell before an ark of salvation came to fetch me (and some) from the torments of the demons of Hell and took us to back to the junction and to Heaven where the melodic voices of the angels permeated the whole place.

Saints, I still remember the song going on in Heaven when we got there:

Alive, alive my Saviour is alive
Alive for evermore, the sting of death is gone
And now He lives, I have eternal life
My Saviour is alive

Sing Halleluyah, sing Halleluyah,
My Saviour is alive for evermore. . . (2ce)

It was at this point that I woke up, wrote it all down, knelt down and prayed. This was 1st Jan 1991. Three days later I gave my life completely to Him who lives for evermore!

The same God still reveals things to us in such manner!

FifiO, you and these your posers!  

About your dream, you didn't die as people have said.  I believe the Lord is passing a message to you.  Ask the Holy Spirit to interpret it for you if you are not clear.  Pray meditatively and interceed for your mum.  God still speaks through dreams, visions and trances.

FifiO:
Hi guys,
Another question. I was in church on sunday and the pastor was relating a story where a certain lady dropped some money in the offering tray and wanted to collect change! Shocking ain't it? I was at first too, but the more I think about it I am begining to wonder if "giving willingly" "according to one's heart" doesn't cover that situation.
Just a perspective but, does any one have an opinion on this?

Blessings!

Nothing wrong if she wanted change.  Probably, she had high denomination with her and didn't purpose in her heart to give it all.  But wisdom should  have told her to change it first (from others/ushers) before dropping it as offering!  It will be difficult to convince anyone how much exactly she dropped into the tray full of notes, not to talk of even demanding some change!  Funny tale all the same  

Greetings to all beloved here.  Thank God for y'all.

OLAADEGBU:
The cities of refuge were a type of Christ, to whom we "have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us" (Hebrews 6:18). He is, to us, a strong city set on a hill, ready to receive all who come to Him in faith. He called Himself "the light of the world" (John 8:12), but then He also said that those who now have His light must also serve as lights--as cities on a hill that those who see them may "glorify |their| Father which is in heaven" (Matthew 5:16). HMM

You are so right brother!  That is why the scriptures also say:

Proverbs 18:10
The name of the LORD is a strong tower; The righteous runs into it and is safe.

He is surely our refuge!

God bless you and all.

@analytical4christ
How are u sir, ? hope u are well.?

Vicero, thanks.  I am cool.  How about you?  I trust God is able to establish you and settle you.  Hold on to Him.

Na2day, I rejoice with you. You know what? The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases and His mercies never come to an end. What more? He crowns the year with his goodness! Halleluyah!! As this year rolls by, may the Lord crown it with His goodness in your life.

NaijaEcash, Halleluyah o! I never cease to be amazed at how merciful this our God is. May He continue to renew His mercies over you.

My people, the Lord bless you all indeed. The remaining days this year are even too many for Him to turn your stories around for good. Maybe it hasn't happened yet, hold on folks! It's not yet over!!.

Bless y'all.

Donnie, I thank God for you and your friend for His deliverance. Meanwhile, expect His goodness to restore what you lost.

Stay blessed.

huxley:
Great it is that you have broken your silence to address the issues raised here. To some these issue might seem trivial, meriting no more than a passing mention. However, those with greater insights would be able to see that these strick at the heart of not only the christian message but also modern-day christian ministries.

No, not the christian message, sir.  That has been tested and found to be true, standing the test of time.  The Christian message is good news, that Christ came to the world, paid the price of sin, so that whoever believes and receives Him is saved.  The problem is what people have made of the message and how they have proclaimed it.

A true miracle would be something like the following:

1)   Make an amputated limb regrow

2)   Raise someone who has been death 10 years back to life

3)   Cause a river like the Nile to reverse its direction of flow

Could Jesus have managed any of these?    If Jesus could not perform miracle in Nazareth, doesn't that mean that he is not omnipotent after all?

You reveal how little you know about Jesus here, Huxley.  Let me ask you a question Jesus asked some skeptics when a case of paralysis was brought before him.  He forgave the sins of a man who was incapacitated and they asked him who gave him authority to forgive sin:

Matthew 9:5 "Which is easier, to say, 'Your sins are forgiven,' or to say, 'Get up, and walk '?

Huxely, which one is more difficult, to forgive sin or to perform a miracle?  Jesus went not only to forgive the man of his sins to the consternation of those skeptics, but went ahead to perform a miracle of healing by commanding him to get up, walk and carry his bed, which he did instantly.  Common sense should tell us that miracles are cheap to Someone who has the power to forgive sins (a sole prerogative of the Almighty!)

Jesus gave sights to those born without eyes, made born cripples to walk, raised dead bodies to life even after they were putrefied and stinking (by the way, is a dead person of 10 years 'deader' than 4 days old?), walked on river, spoke to a storm (compare Tsunami!) to be quiet and it obeyed (could it have been difficult for him to command the river to reverse its course when he could suspend associated laws of displacement, hydrology, gravity etc?)

Jesus could not perform much miracles in Nazareth because of their unbelief, not because of His inability.  This is where faith comes in.  It is always according to your faith.

One thing uniquely missing from your post was what the rank-and-file Christians could do to render themselves impervious to such clerical manipulations and deceptions.  Most modern day Christians are soft-headed zombified simpletons.  How do you address this problem?  The churches have become breeding grounds for such people, ill-adapted to the modern world.

Fortunately, your mind is not suspended when you decide to be a Christian.  Maybe most just do not want to engage their minds through the filter of the word of God or are just too lazy to do so.  The early church (at Berea, Acts 17 vs 11) always go back to confirm through the study of the Scriptures if those things they were taught were so.

Funkilicious, I said it is not too wise to tell your parents of every demand on your time; either by the church, service, school or even personal. Parents by nature are protective. This is good but could be counter-productive at times, especially when they are over-protective. Young adults should be given a certain amount of liberty to make choices and decisions on their own and take responsibility for its consequences. That is the way we grow and learn from experiences. As you grow up, your parents’ influence should change from that of controlling to advisorial. This way, you learn to be independent and stand on your own, while they offer good counsels. No parent wants a grown baby!

Funkilicious, it is better to obey God rather than man. You are also commanded to obey and honour your parents (you are still under them) so that it may be well with you. Then you should also obey those you are accountable to. However, there shouldn’t be conflict. A student studies. Working in the church and serving God are not the same things. You can do one without the other.

No one should be made to serve out of compulsion. It then becomes null and void. Your pastor should understand that. I don’t think it’s also right to keep insisting that you must obey him because he is Jesus’ servant when it is clearly jeopardising your studies. It is also not too wise telling your parents of every demand on your time that the pastor or service demands. Find a balance between the two. Discuss this with your pastor. If he persists, bring it to the attention of his superior or think of changing parish. Serving God is no excuse for failure.

Hi my people,

It's been a while. Thank God you are still standing! You know what? The Devil didn't know you will still be!! He would have devoured you long ago? But praise God, you are still standing tall for God. That means the devil actually lost you. Halleluyah!! Yes he did. You know what? You may not be where you want to be yet. But thank God you are not where you used to be!!

Think well, friend. You are not where you used to be. That means you are actually making progress. Hey! It does imply too that your tomorrow will be better than today. The path of the righteous is one that shines more and more. May your path shine more and more, beloved. You have what it takes. The Greater One is in you to achieve great things in your life. Go forth and be who you were meant to be in Jesus name.

Bless y'all.

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vicero give us more details about your friend (school, level, condition etc) and how we may help.

phemmy400, God bless you. Stay connected to the Lord. How is Bunmi faring? Love to her.

Men and Brethren,

I am very disturbed.  I am also very sad.  I followed this thread from post #1.  I have been very reluctant to say something in here for a number of reasons:

- I made a choice to be of blessing to people I come across and not a stumbling block
- I am careful not to dissuade others, since many people read one’s contributions
- Not wanting the name of Christ to be ridiculed, which the thread could potentially degenerate into
- I abhor arguments, especially the types that lead nowhere
- Hoping the issues raised will be addressed objectively
- Don’t want to be labelled ‘an accuser of the brethren’


However, having read up till now and seeing the way my brethren tend to divert issues and rather discuss/defend persons, I became very disturbed indeed.  Let me state here before I am wrongly accused, that:

- I am a believer (born-again, spirit-filled, tongue-talking. . .) and I believe in miracles, the healing ministry and manifestations of the Spirit
- I have ministered healings on people and have received healings/miracles myself by others’ ministrations
- I have been blessed by some of Pator Chris' teachings (and he can teach!)
- I see CE members as my brethren too, having the same heavenly Father (I am not a member of CE).

Knowing fully well that every idle word I speak will be accounted for, I speak therefore with every sense of responsibility.

SirJohn brought an issue up, backed up with strong evidences which can stand to any scrutiny in any court of law.  He supplied eye witness accounts (both his and his sick friend), names of those involved (including pastors, staff, workers of CE Healing school), pictures of people he saw during the healing sessions he attended as captured in the CE Magazine, other evidences including pictures from South Africa (also from the magazine) evidently showing a lady pictured using two different wheelchairs on the same day and captioned as ‘the wheelchair that has carried her all her life’.

Reading objectively as a Christian, this tales are too vivid to be fabricated and very disturbing to say the least, especially with the pictures (from CE source) corroborating his accounts.  Please my brethren from CE, take some minutes to read his accounts and check the pictures and links objectively and sincerely.  These things should make every Christian sad if true.  The poster is not saying miracles are not real, but he gave what could be exhibits of deliberate deception, mis-information, stage-management and hypocrisy!

A colleague of mine narrated how he saw a neighbour of his (who could talk and hear) on TV in one of those ‘Atmosphere for Miracles’ meetings posing as a deaf and dumb being ministered unto.  When he confronted him after he came back, he was told he was paid for it!  On the other hand, a woman testified in my church (not CE) how she got her healing in CE Healing School.  Even Jesus could not perform miracles in certain places like Nazareth. 

If someone was healed during a healing session why not say so?  If the healing took place before hands were laid, why present it as make-belief before a live audience?  Does it make the healing any more authentic?  If someone could walk before (according to SirJohn’s account) why put him/her on a wheelchair (s)he didn’t come with, only to be recorded as being crippled on that same wheelchair all their lives?  And if it happens the person didn’t get his/her healing, why make the public believe so?  It is this alleged deception that is the crux of this thread and not belief in miracles!  Ananaias and Saphirra paid dearly for deception with their own lives.  It is that serious to the Holy Spirit.

Without being presumptuous, I must say the responses from CE members have been disappointing.  The poster made it clear he is a Christian, believed in miracles, is a member of CE and also a financial partner and has been under Pastor Chris’ ministry.  Why then go ahead to attack his person instead of addressing the issues he raised? He doesn’t appear to have any reason to lie and discredit a ministry he is a member of if he hasn’t seen and witnessed certain things that are disturbing to him.  Also, he made it clear he has tried severally to raise it up with the hierarchy of CE but rebuffed, hence his decision to go public.

I understand the fact that we all have duties to defend our pastors and ministries (after all Peter tried to defend Jesus when he was being arrested), but does this mean they should not stand up to scrutiny?  Even when what appears to be concrete evidences of deception (or half-truth at best) are being brought up?

Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our Faith was examined and found blameless:

Luke 23:13-14 Pilate summoned the chief priests and the rulers and the people, and said to them, "You brought this man to me as one who incites the people to rebellion, and behold, having examined Him before you, I have found no guilt in this man regarding the charges which you make against Him.

John 14:30 "I will not speak much more with you, for the ruler of the world is coming, and he has nothing in Me;

Therefore it behooves us as followers of the Master to be blameless too when scrutinized:

Phil 2:14-15 Do all things without grumbling or disputing; so that you will prove yourselves to be blameless and innocent, children of God above reproach in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you appear as lights in the world,

Titus 1:7 Because an overseer is God's servant manager, he must be blameless. He must not be arrogant or irritable. He must not drink too much, be a violent person, or make money in shameful ways.

Brethren, instead of faith-speak let’s examine the things being brought up and refute the evidences if untrue.  This way we prove ourselves.  And if they are things we have no answer against, it is golden to say so or maintain silence.  I believe as followers of Christ, we shouldn’t be afraid of being tested/examined if we know those things we are being accused of are not true.

Sigh!  Lord, purge Your church.

Dear Saints, I thank my God upon every remembrance of you. Good to see you all enjoying the liberty that is in Christ Jesus. My heart rejoices to hear of God's goodness in your lives. God bless y'all richly.

Phemmy400, I bless God for that which He has done for your sister Bukky. I pray she recovers quick, with renewed strength from the Tower of Strength Himself. He will complete what He has started. She remains in our prayers.

JeSoul, what a blessing you are. Reading your poem is like reading Romans Chapter 7 Remix !! God bless you richly. More grace to you and more of those poems too.

[b]OLAADEGBU[/B], you have been a blessing. Please keep them coming. The Lord keep you warm in His embrace and load you daily with His benefits.

All, thanks be to God who gives us victory.  I trust you are all doing great.  I was actually down with fever for the past two weeks.  But thank God I am better now.  And what a priviledge to be among the saints here again.

A word for today:

Romans 8:

31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us?

35 Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or unclothedness, or peril, or sword?

36 Just as it is written, "FOR YOUR SAKE WE ARE BEING PUT TO DEATH ALL DAY LONG; WE WERE CONSIDERED AS SHEEP TO BE SLAUGHTERED."

37 But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us.

38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,

39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

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JeSoul, you are a darling.  Thanks for the thoughts.  May heaven open up its treasures upon you.  Love you.

Obinna5000, the Lord be with you as you open that new chapter of your life.  May His grace be sufficient for you.  May He grant you wisdom and success in your studies and strength to cope with the increased demand on your time and energy.  Remember, He who watches you neither sleeps nor slumbers.  Take charge, bro and do pop in once in a while.

phemmy400,  receive grace to grow in Him, strength to soar above storms, will and fortitude to break from whatever competes with the love of your Lord in your life.  There is this song I sing in my heart for you now:

Bring him back, bring him back there Lord
To the place where he first received you
Bring him back, bring him back there Lord
To where he first believed.

I pray your heart will pant after Him just like it was when you first received Him.  Life’s journey is not a sprint, but a long-distance race.  Receive that extra strength now to go all the way with Jesus.  You will overcome.  You will not end your journey half-way.  You will overcome I said.  It is him that overcomes that receives crown, I said you will overcome.  Receive encouragement.  Receive grace.  I prophesy over your life.  I speak to every deadness in you to come alive.  I speak to every dryness in you to receive heaven’s refreshing dews.  Let bone come to bone, sinew upon sinew, flesh upon flesh and receive the breath of life from heaven to rise up and becoming exceedingly great and vibrant as you read this.  As I was commanded, so I speak life to your spirit in Jesus name.

As for Bunmi Ajayi, may the Spirit that raised up Jesus from the grave quicken every cell in her body right now.  What the doctors at LUTH couldn’t do, I pray Dr. Jesus, the Physician of Heaven, step in now and lay those healing hands upon her.  Be healed, Bunmi, in Jesus name. She shall live to declare the goodness of God.

A_K_O, praise God for His mercies despite our inadequacies! I really thank God for that great deliverance. The gift of life is such a precious one. I praise God yours is preserved.

[Please don't overspeed again o.]

@Gamine,

Laziness will not allow Google and me to be best of friends yet! To be candid, I am just hearing of the words prenup and postnup!!!!

Now that I have an idea of what they are and mean, let me reply as a christian.  Paul asked who has bewitched the Galatians, because they started out in the faith but ended up in the flesh.

The scriptures say whosoever finds a wife finds a good thing and obtains favour of the Lord.  If someone has gone through the finding and located his wife- the very bone of his bones like Adam put it, why would such then prepare for a time she will depart?  

Are we then being conformed to the standards of this world?  The world will always have its own notions, schemes and standards, but as christians, we are to be that salt and light in the midst of a rotten and dark world.  Or have we lost that edge?

Why marry and spend all the energy preparing for the wedding but at the back of the mind is this pre and post whatever knocking and constantly reminding of an eventual and imminent divorce?  What then is the purpose of getting married?  Enough said.

Marriage is a journey of faith.  I found my wife and refused to do even genotype test.  Why?  I did not believe the Spirit of the Lord would have led me to a woman whose genotype will not match mine.  And as many as are led by the Spirit, they are the sons of God.  It wasn't until years later (after we have married) that my wife did her own blood test (because it was required and genotype came out with it) that she found out she was AA.  Up till now I don't know mine!!  It just wasn't necessary.

Let every one be persuaded in his own mind.  As for me, I have decided to live a life of faith and get the best of what God has for me.  Walking otherwise is to live in the flesh.

Shallom.

Pilgrim.1:
@Analytical,

How body? Lol, no mind me. . . I saw ur request about the YIM thingy; but I will find time to concentrate on yours when those "friends" go to sleep for a while.

No qualms. Will expect. I commend the 'new' pilgrim.

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JeSoul, go with the wisdom of the Lord.

Whistling past, checked the 1st post, what? Since 2005!  47 pages!! 1501 posts!!! 21000+ views !!!! And still no clear understanding? Then shakes head, strolling away and humming. . .

. . .remembering something, comes back, pausing for a while, okay dropping a line. . .

Blessings to everyone here.  Thanks for the debates and insights.

Pilgrim.1:
As anyone wishes. I have said again and again since last year that I don't argue tithes based on the LAW. Do I post you the several links to show how many times I have said so?

Pilgrim is very correct here.  She has always maintained that:

- Tithe precedes the Law.
- It is God-ordained but not mandatory.

The 2nd should not be too difficult to grasp as TV01 suggested, seeing they don't mean the same thing.  For example, marriage is God-ordained, but not mandatory.  Paul also chose not to marry but did not condemn those that did.  Does marriage have its blessings?  YES!!!  Are those who refuse to marry cursed?  NO!!  I hope this clears the seeming contradiction in that statement.

As TV01 puts it, if this is a christian liberty, let everyman be persuaded then.  If you choose to exercise this liberty to tithe, do it as unto the Lord.  If you will rather give other than tithe, do it also as unto the Lord.

Bless y'all.

. . . still humming, slowly walks away. . .

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TV01, how are you?  See you are back. Still awaiting some lessons from your retreat.  Bless you.

JeSoul, you know you are always a darling. I say Amen to your prayer. Thanks my sis.

Hello friends.  Hope you've all had a fantastic weekend.  Thank God for His love for and mercy over us.  If not for Him, where would we have been?

Sometime, we take His mercies for granted in our daily sojourn here on this side of eternity.  We run around looking for things and searching for the ephemeral while overlooking His goodness and mercy over our lives in countless ways.  One such mercy is the very gift of life itself.

Just this morning I was hit by the news of the passing away of a dear colleague yesterday.  Then I started wondering about so many things.  Certain things are more valuable than we actually think of them.  I wondered about his family left broken, his aspirations and dreams unfulfilled, his projects unfinished but definitely his journey here ended.

Beloved, shall we all learn to value many of God's gracious gifts to us more by being grateful to Him always for them?  Shall we live our lives all out for Him?  Shall we also learn to appreciate our loved ones and those dear to our hearts more while we still can?  Shall we mend those broken relationships in our lives and makeup for times lost seeing we have a sure appointment one day to answer that same call?  Shall we live more purposefully and make every moment count while we are yet alive?

Remember we shall only be remembered by those things we have done. . .Selah  Some people in the scriptures die and nothing is mentioned about them.  For some, their history is in just a sentence.  For some 1 paragraph or 2.  For some a whole book is written and for some we are still reading and blessed from their lives up till today!

Lord, at the end of our live's journey, may we be able to say like Paul that we have fought the good fight of faith and have finished the race.  Amen.

God bless.

@Gamine, what are pre-nup and post-nup arrangements?  Forgive my naivety, I don't want to make wrong assumptions.

Gamine, JeSoul, A_K_O, FifiO and all, I have enjoyed your discussion on the subject of Holy Communion (yet to digest the ones on Feetwashing and Anointing Oil).

Let me share a few thoughts of mine as well:

Gamine: Also, does the communion have special powers to give health and wealth?

A_K_O: None that I know of.

I think communion just gives us a chance to deeply reflect on what the death and resurrection of Jesus means to us as Christians.

It's remembrance time. . .

On their own, I will not say the bread and the wine have special powers the same way a bottle of oil (used in anointing) or bowl of water (in feet washing) or a piece cloth (mantle/garment) on their own do not carry any special power.

One has to have an understanding of the significance of a doctrine and commensurate faith to appropriate the virtues associated with such.  In the case of communion, yes, it is remembrance time.  But remembrance of what?  Is it to form a mental picture of Jesus on the cross?  This will be no more than a mere ritual.

Communion gives us the solemn act and moment to focus on Christ's sacrificial death (the offering of His body and shedding of His blood) and its significance (the purchase of the blood and the benefits of the broken body).  To only remember the death and not take advantage of the invaluable benefits purchased by the death is to not take full blessings of the total package thereof.

Christ came to destroy all the works of the devil (1 John 3 vs , of which sin is chief (the blood for the remission of sins).  But the total package also includes healing, divine health (by the stripes on His body), deliverance, abundant life etc.  Isaiah 61 vs 1-2, Luke 4 vs 18-19, John 10 vs 10, etc gave us the purpose of His coming.

So at Communion, we partake (share) of the body of Christ and drink of the blood, spiritually (this is where it is different from transubstantiation) using the elements of the bread and the wine as we remember what He purchased for us by His death.  It will not be out of place at all then, if someone extends his/her faith at such solemn moment to connect to the healing that is in the blood of Jesus and draw virtue from the shed blood, or connect to the beauty Christ purchased instead of the ashes the person may be having, etc

While I quite agree with A_K_O in his summation, I feel the deeper dimension offered by FifiO gives us a more comprehensive essence of communion. 

Gamine: but there is something about taking the communion unworthily

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I was taught that

If you take the communion and you werent born again

you are in danger of becoming sick, which also may lead to death

But if you take it as a Born again person

any ailment would be gone, if u believe

Posts #428 and #433 by A_K_O answer that.

1 Corinthians 11

30 This is the reason why many of you are weak and sick and quite a number [of you] have died.

If I may ask, then, what is in taking communion that can make someone weak or sick or even die?  It is taking it unworthily or not recognizing/discerning the Lord's body.  That is why someone who has not accepted Christ as the Lord and Saviour of his/her life should not partake.  It is damnation/curse upon such.  I daresay too, that the converse is true- blessing/virtues could be drawn by a believer that partakes after examining himself!

JeSoul already summarised ways to unworhilty partake, though I have a problem with the framing of no.3

3. Taking it for an unworthy purpose (for example like you mentioned Gamine, to get wealth or some kind of material favor)

This will be true if the purpose is a get-rich-quick syndrome, but I won't call a genuine need of healing (for example) an unworthy purpose.  The woman with the issue of blood got her healing by touching the helm of Jesus garment because her faith drew that virtue from the Master, despite multitude touching him without drawing anything!

JeSoul: The minute we start to add our situations, our problems, our needs we're taking the focus away from Christ and unto ourselves!

My dear this is not the purpose of communion as taught in 1Cor 11 and until someone shows me otherwise from the scriptures and not just our own inclinations or feelings I don't see how I can accept that teaching.

It will interest us to know that the Communion is also referred to in the early church as the cup of blessing!!!

1 cor 10
16 The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?

There are invaluable benefits of what the blood of Jesus and the body broken purchased for us by His death and resurrection.  What better time to apply these than during the solemn, 'blessing-full' and 'virtues-full' moment of communion?

John 6
48 "I am the bread of life.
55 "For My flesh is true food, and My blood is true drink.


@FifiO seemes to capture my thoughts well on this.

God bless y'all.

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Whaoh!  Have I just typed all that?   

Blessings to everyone in the house. It's been a challenging week for me but thanks be to God who causes us to triumph. I trust God is upholding you all in His everlasting arms. Folks, please don't let go of Him. Peter said 'Lord to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life' John 6:68

Will try and offer my thoughts on some issues I missed shortly.

Bless y'all.

_Queenisha, God bless you richly for opening this thread and for directing its focus.  I have always known a personal testimony is such a powerful tool in ministering to the souls of men.  The reason- there is no argument against a changed life! The same thing happened when a man's sight was restored by Jesus and the religious folks were turning the miracle into a theological argument.  His response- I don't know what you guys think about this Jesus, all I know, once I was blind, but now I can see (paraphrased).

Please you have a job to do by directing its focus so that this thread doesn't derail to what it's not.

All, Please let this thread not be turned into what it is not.  I believe separate threads can be opened to address issues as may be appropriate.  God bless everyone.

reindeer, it's nice to read how you are touched to repentance from reading the testimony.  I prayed for you when I read that, that the same peace that passes human understanding will become yours.  I pray you embrace the grace that brings salvation.  Have you surrendered your life to the only one Lord now?  Please do as _queenisha posted.  The Lord be with you.

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Pilgrim.1, I thank my God every time I think of you from the very 1st time we discussed here (can't remember which thread again).  I knew there must be a story behind it all.  And what a touching one!

I saw your zeal and vibrant energy and I knew then that you are a vessel being prepared for something you have not yet known sister.  It will come to pass, though you may not know it now.
I pray for you sister, that the Lord will uphold you and sustain you in your walk.  I pray you experience a deeper dimension of grace you have never experienced.  The Lord keep you and your family in His love.

I felt you abridged the testimony for a number of reasons.  But feel free to answer according to _Queenisha.  There are many yearning souls, so eager.  Bless you real good.

I wish we can talk more on I.M. or maybe at fellowship.

Obinna5000, I read your post (confession) the other time and felt your sincerity.  You know, godly sorrow brings repentance.  I have a word for you- stay connected to the Source.  Be grounded and firmly rooted in Him.  I pray you won't let Him down.  God bless.

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Where is kola oloye?  You messages are being missed here.  Hope all is well bro?