₦airaland Forum

Pls let's face the topic and keep our biases for Islam, Christianity or whatever out of it.

The topic is this:

Senator Yerima said that by marrying an under-age girl, he has not committed any crime and that he would obey the Koran rather than the Nigerian law on marriage. Some Moslem groups have come out to support him. As a Senator whose huge salaries and allowances are paid by Nigeria, has he not insulted Nigeria, and should he not be punished for his action? And is he justified to remain a Senator after such an utterance?

@ Jayzee_guy,

I think you strayed off the thrust of my questions.

First, those who criticize Yerima don't do so on Christian sentiments; they do so purely on medical, social and moral grounds. Egypt, Indonesia etc are mainly Moslems but their law forbids marriage to under 18. Why? Marriage is a personal decision. Someone who is getting married should understand what he or she is going into. Secondly, the body of a girl needs to mature before she can start bearing children. Why are there so many cases of VVF in Northern Nigeria and almost none in the South? It is simply because of early childbirth.

1. I have heard Yerima and some Moslems like you say that since the Koran allows marriage to minors, a Moslem should not disobey Islam and obey the Nigerian Constitution.

If my religion (Igbo Traditional Religion) tells me that twins are a taboo, an abomination and that they must be killed or else evil will befall my family and village, how can I obey the Nigerian Constitution not to kill those twins? Or if Amadioha or Ogwugwu tells me that where there are no boys, a daughter has no right to inherit her father's property but the Nigerian Constitution says it cannot be, should I obey my religion or the Constitution and discriminate against the girls?

2. I used slavery merely as an example. Christians practised slave trade and slavery in the past- we know. But what we are saying today is: since modern laws have banned it, can I say my religion tells me to practise it and go ahead to do so with impuinity?

Like someone asked earlier, have you seen the daughter of a rich man or political topshot marrying at 13 or 14 in Nigeria? If they are so strong about obeying the Koran, why don't they give out their daughters at 12 or 11? Don't you see that the elite use religion to punish the down-trodden?

I would appreciate a short response so that it will be easy to read. Thanks.

jayzee_guy:
@ Shokoloko,

Who is yeye man here?, you or the yerima, because nothing wrong with Yerima on this case (I dont care other things), I will say that million times, you are just wasting your time, and showing hatred against Muslims.

Show me your post where you say yeye Obasanjo when it was revealed that he slept with his son's wife, why all these double standards, and phobias?. Most of you ignore to comments or say bad things about persons like OBJ, but now so much interested in commenting about Yerima simply because he is Muslims, shame on you. And when Muslims indicate what he did is in line with his believe (Islam), you quickly start calling names, most of you here are nothing but bunch of Christians hypocrites whom ignore to even study their bible, because they know less about it (some they don't care about it), and were brainwashed by pagans idealogies.

Islam is here to stay, Sharia is here to stay, Muslims are here to stay , go to hell.

I don't want to believe you are conveniently avoiding my questions above? I am waiting for your response. And pls I ve seen that you are heated up. Calm down and respond to me without name-calling. Thanks (And mind you that the OBJ issue was broken by a Lagos newspaper (PM News)- you can search for it on Nairaland and see if any 'Christian' praised him as you are claiming here)

@Jayzee_guy,

I can feel your pain at some people trying to bash your religion. That's very bad.

But you must be careful not to let your view about other non-Muslims blind you into seeing every non-Muslim as an enemy, someone to be hated and despised, so you don't fall into the same pit you condemn.

You have already made up your mind that Christians are all thiefs, murderers, etc. And that they interfere in internal matters of Muslims.

Pls note: I don't think there is anywhere the Bible gives a law that Christians should not marry children or teenagers. So those who criticize Yerima don't do so on Christian grounds.

Pls answer these two questions for me: 1. There were slaves in the days of the Prophets of the Bible and the Koran; will you keep a slave today because it was practised in the Koran and it is no business of those who would complain about it?

2. I am an Igbo man. Let us assume that I worship the gods of my people. That god says that if twins are delivered, they must be killed? If I decide to kill my twins, is it your business and the business of Nigeria to stop me or prosecute me, even though my god has given me the order to kill all twins, and the twins belong to me, not to Nigeria or busybodies?

I await your answers. Thanks.

I wish I could get all of you, lie you down one by one on a slaughter table and wack you heavily with koboko on your bare back.

You just sit down and pour out your childishness and warped biases on screen thinking that by so doing you will win an argument or convince the other person.

It's a big shame. This has become worse than watching lunatics on stage. I am outa here. Hissssssssssssssssssssssssss.

I am extremely ashamed of the insults people peddle on these ethnically based topics. I wonder what values such peddlers pass/will pass to their children. People cannot make their points or disagree without disgusting insults to a person or a whole race.

The reason is because this is a forum where people use fake names. But someone says character is not what you do when people are watching but what you do when nobody is watching.

The topic of this discussion still remains why Igbos don't perform well when saddled with leadership. Is it true or false? Show examples or reasons or keep your ill-breeding to yourself pleeeeease!

Katsumoto:
My point wasn't about which region did the best; it was just to highlight certain actions by some of those that you listed. I have to say that I am not the most informed with regards to events in the current dispensation in Nigeria. I will however, say Dora did a marvelous job while at NAFDAC. Ribadu also performed admirably in my view. I am not too impressed by the others; as far as I am concerned, there isn't a single ministry that Nigerians can be proud of.

The thread cast aspersions on the ability of Igbos to perform when given a role, and I was trying to use facts rather than emotions to counter it from our history. And I expected other people from other zones to counter this falsehood. Igbos have their many weaknesses, but record shows that most of them hold their ground well when called to duty. That goes for many other ethnic groups in Nigeria. And Igbos like competition a lot because it helps them to showcase their abilities and skills.

Thank you

Katsumoto:
Yet OnlyTruth will come here and state that OBJ had an agenda against Igbos.

2. Ngozi Okonjo-Iweala - Finance - Debt forgiveness etc - Debt forgiveness was as a result of concerted global efforts by notable individuals to forgive the debts of third world countries. Several countries had their debts cancelled/reduced. Credit for that should go to individuals such as Bono who campaigned vigorously
3. Charles Soludo - CBN - (bank consolidation, etc We are all witnesses to the shady practices which went on during Soludo's time which were unravelled by Sanusi. The consolidation exercise in itself was brilliant but it was seriously undermined by gross incompetence or tacit collusion on the part of Soludo.

I won't want to argue with you on the debt forgiveness issue, but note that debt cancellation was not the only thing that woman did during her tenure as finance minister.

On Soludo, yes there were shady deals (as they will always be in Nigeria for some time to come) but he came with ideas that transformed the banking sector. There was Joseph Sanusi before him. History will judge Sanusi Lamido when he leaves.

My argument here is that in the concluded govt of OBJ, contrary to the claim by this post, the people who added the greatest value were Igbo appointed by him. If this is a lie, I would like you to counter it with the list of other zones who performed better than the Igbo appointees. When Yar'Adua/Jonathan term expires, we can judge the performance of their ministers/DGs.

Thanks

SEFAGO:
A significant amount of people in Obasanjo's cabinet were igbos, so this is expe ted. Why don't you give credit to the man who was responsible for selecting these ministers, as well as giving the confirmation for them to ago ahead with any projects.

Was that supposed to be a joke or what? Pls let's not peddle falsehood because we want to win an argument. There was never a time in OBJ presidency that there were more Igbos than Yorubas or Hausas. The constitution makes it mandatory that each state must produce at least one minister. And OBJ was duty-bound by the Constitution (whether he liked it or not) to appoint ministers from all states of the federation. There were Adeniran, Babalola, Fani-Kayode, Grange, Adelaja, Sarumi, Joseph Sanusi (CBN), etc, etc from Yorubaland too.

What I expected you to do was to mention the Yoruba ministers or others from other zones that performed excellently in the eyes of Nigerians to counter the topic of this post. Pls don't divert the direction of this debate.

Mind you, I don't share the thinking that OBJ did not like the Igbo. He just has some negative personal traits that made him lose the world fame that fate thrust into his lap between 1999 and 2007.

I will always ignore taunts and face facts.

Without sounding immodest, I think the people that gave the eight years of Obasanjo life and credibility were mainly Igbo:

1. Dora Akunyili - NAFDAC
2. Ngozi Okonjo-Iweala - Finance - Debt forgiveness etc
3. Charles Soludo - CBN - (bank consolidation, etc
4. Ernest Ndukwe - NCC (ie GSM revolution)
5. Oby Ezekwesili - Due Process
___________________________________
Non Igbo
6. Nuhu Ribadu - EFCC (North)
7. Nasir el-Rufai - BPE/FCT (North)


Pls if you have any minister/DG etc that performed excellently well in that regime to the eyes of most Nigerians, kindly put his/her name and ethnic group below.

Thanks

@ Katsumoto,

I have to commend you on this particular thread. Despite all the provocation, you did not revenge with personal attacks. That shows that you are a man of discipline and control. Pls keep it up. It is a rare trait.


For all Nigerians:

What I garner from this thread is that as always success has many relatives, but failure is an orphan. When a man does something good, he is called a worthy Nigerian, but when he does something bad, he is denied and deserted by other ethnic groups.

Yes in my area in Lagos, electricity supply has improved seriously- we get between 18-20 hours per day. But something worries me: shortly after Yar'Adua took over in May 2007, the supply of electricity went up so high as from June that we called Yar'Adua a miracle worker. Some said it was the water level that went up during the rainy season.

So I am sceptical about this improvement except that it started in March which is not the beginning of the rainy season.

Will it last for long? I pray so-ooooooooooooooooo! And let it gradually get to all parts of Nigeria. I wish Bros Gee Jay the best!

Had_one:
[size=18pt]And you now make it 6. What can we call you?[/size]

My post says: "There are about 5 IBB stories on the front page. Is Nairaland pro-IBB? What is happening?"

Was my English too difficult to understand or is this mischief at work? Is this post on the Nairaland's front page? No wonder the rate of failure at JAMB/WAEC/NECO's exams is so high. What a pity!

There are about 5 IBB stories on the front page. Is Nairaland pro-IBB? What is happening?

Excerpts of Bianca's interview with The Sun

How long have you been married to Dim Odumegwu Ojukwu
We have been into a relationship since 1989 but we got married formally on November 12, 1994. We have been together for over 20 years because we have been living together since 1989.

How old were you and how old was he at the time
Well I was 22 while he was in his mid 50s

People considered you too young for him at that time. How did you feel then.
Its not your conventional relationship. Looking back now I certainly realise that I was very young at that time but it didn’t seem to matter because we had so much in common and we had good communication. The gap was not there in our day-to-day interactions. People found the relationship a bizarre one because of the age difference but it is only now when I look back, now that I have children of my own that I realise that it was rather unusual.

You were so much in love at the time that you didn’t notice any disparity in your ages.
I don’t know whether I would classify it as being in love. I just know that the difference tended to melt away when compared to the common grounds that we had. We had a similar background and we had so much to talk about. We had common interests and we just did a lot of things together. We went to see plays at the theatre, we went on vacations and there was just no disparity in our interaction. I didn’t feel it at the time.

How come you are feeling it now
No I don’t feel it now because we have got used to each other having been together for so long. I always say to him I am like the furniture in your house. We are too used to each other. I can complete his sentences and he can complete mine. Really I think at the end of the day that’s what is imperative in every relationship. You must be able to communicate. He understands me fully and he appreciates that mine has been a life of dedication to him. I know the travails he has been through and I appreciate that a man such as him needs somebody to step in and play the role of wife, sister and mother simultaneously and give him peace of mind in his day to day life.

Would you say therefore that you were psychologically prepared to be Ojukwu’s wife
I come from a political family. If that is being psychologically prepared well I am not the one to say so. But I think I had to shoulder a lot of responsibilities beyond what somebody of my age would reasonably be expected to go through. I had to learn in the process. I think I have done well because it requires diplomacy and the fact that sometimes you have to get out of your skin to mediate in conflicts that will generally arise around a man of his stature. It’s been quite challenging but I thank God that I have been able to navigate the terrain.

Has it ever occurred to you that people never gave this marriage a chance, yet it has lasted this long. How does that make you feel

I feel blessed. I have known friends in more conventional marriages, who break up, remarry and break up again in this space of time and I am still here. I thank God for his grace because nobody gave this thing a chance of survival. In all honesty I was really young at that time and I did believe that I could handle it. Now when I look back I wonder how I did it. That was not a situation your average 22-year-old could handle. Normally the disparity ought to make the interests different. But the truth is that I didn’t miss those things the average 22-year old would want, like going to parties, clubs and the like. Those were not my interest. Though people have always said that I am very old fashioned and I didn’t have those things that propel people of my age. I wanted a stable marriage. I wanted to live with a man that I had a lot in common with and a man that I could spend the rest of my life with. Having said that the truth is that it requires a lot of sacrifice, commitment and hard work to be able to make it work.

Was it that you had to grow up to him or he had to come down to you? How was the mix
No question about that, I had to grow up to him. I had to learn to interact with people who were a lot older than I was. Generally from the time I was 22 people who were coming to our various homes were people of his age. They were his friends and by extension they have become my friends too. I give God the glory. He has some of the most dedicated, committed and loyal friends who are dedicated to him and to his struggle. I feel privileged to have met those categories of people. I consider them as family. So I had to grow up to his life.

You were not scared by that calibre of people
Don’t forget that I am the daughter of a former governor. My father was the Governor of old Anambra State, now consisting of Enugu and parts of Ebonyi. So I was certainly not intimidated because we had such regular high calibre people visiting us. There were Presidents, ex-presidents, Ambassadors, governors were frequent visitors. I was not intimidated in the least. It was just a progression. Just that the same calibre of people were now visiting in another house. The routine was basically the same, just a little bit accentuated.

Obviously he loves you and says it to anyone who cares to listen. What are the things he does differently to you that also gives you the impression that he really does love you

I think it is the absolute trust that he has in me, the faith. I think every man is looking for a replacement for his mother. That’s one thing I have learnt. In life every man looks for that woman who would not just be his wife but his mother, whose paramount objective is to ensure that he can be the best man he is meant to be. I wouldn’t say that he loves me in an irrational way.

Perhaps in me he has been able to find that combination of wife and mother. The mother element is very important because its only your mother that you would trust so absolutely to be able to deliver the best judgments and to be able to pull you back when they think you are doing something wrong. It is just to have absolute trust in your judgment and go to bed with both eyes closed. A lot of people don’t have that in their families. A lot of men find that their wives tend to be quite demanding and impatient and the men then reflect that in their attitude. But I think a woman cannot get the best out of any man by nagging him or making him feel bad and less of a man. But if you let him be a man then you get the best out of him. That’s what has helped this marriage to stay the way it is today.

MY COMMENTS

Single guys and babes on Nairaland should listen to Bianca and follow her words if they want to have the marriage of their dream.

The first time I went to Ojukwu's house and saw him feeding and playing with his and Bianca's kids, I was somewhat embarrassed that this IRON-MAN could be doing such menial and unbecoming things. He was doting over his kids and wife and behaving like a teenager in love for the first time.

But looking back, I saw that that is why young ladies usually prefer older men to young men, because older men over-pamper their young wives and children begotten at old age the way grandpas/grandmas 'spoil' their grandchildren, unlike young men who usually go into marriage with over-sized ego and lick their wounds soon after.

Just look at the rate our celebrity marriages are crashing in Nigeria and thank God that Ojukwu and Bianca have been together this far.

The first time I went to Ojukwu's house and saw him feeding and playing with his and Bianca's kids, I was somewhat embarrassed that this IRON-MAN could be doing such menial and unbecoming things. He was doting over his kids and wife and behaving like a teenager in love for the first time.

But looking back, I saw that that is why young ladies usually prefer older men to young men, because older men over-pamper their young wives and children begotten at old age the way grandpas/grandmas 'spoil' their grandchildren, unlike young men who usually go into marriage with over-sized ego and lick their wounds soon after.

Just look at the rate our celebrity marriages are crashing in Nigeria and thank God that Ojukwu and Bianca have been together this far.

Some Nairalanders are very funny people, always looking for any excuse to attack their perceived enemies.

Bianca never said she regretted her marriage to Ojukwu. She actually said that it was her parents' objection that made the union stronger. Since their marriage, there has been no single public scandal like so many beauty queens and celebrities usually ask.

The lady is only saying that any loving parent would not be happy for his/her young daughter to marry someone old enough to be her dad.

For those talking about teenage marriage, Bianca was in her 20's when she married Ojukwu.

Rasaq Okoya, Abubakar Atiku, Jacob Zuma, John McCain, Paul McCartney, etc all married ladies young enough to be their daughters.

Bashers of Ojukwu should pray that their own marriages will last for even 5 years.

No long ting: Bros GJ did well in that interview. The man spoke without bitterness or arrogance or equivocation. He even defended his perceived enemies. He smiled when he needed to. I hope he does not disappoint us.

But I think there are too many "inaudible" in this transcript. I heard everything Bros GJ said to Amanpour - EVERYTHING. If CNN didn't hear everything he said they should have contacted a Nigerian to help them out (One of GJ's aides would have done that for them gladly -free of charge). After all, I don't hear everything Obama or Clinton says, and if I were to interview any of them I would not fill the areas I can't decipher with "inaudible," rather I would get an American or someone who can decipher their exact words.

Imagine writing: "I reconsidered my cabinet" when our Bros said "I reconstituted my cabinet." (Someone seems to have corrected this). That was very unprofessional of CNN!

I think there are too many "inaudible" in this transcript. I heard everything Bros GJ said to Amanpour - EVERYTHING. If CNN didn't hear everything he said they should have contacted a Nigerian to help them out (One of GJ's aides would have done that for them gladly -free of charge). After all, I don't hear everything Obama or Clinton says, and if I were to interview any of them I would not fill the areas I can't decipher with "inaudible," rather I would get an American or someone who can decipher their exact words.

Imagine writing: "I reconsidered my cabinet" when our Bros said "I reconstituted my cabinet." That was very unprofessional of CNN!

I wish to state that I don't believe Obasanjo discriminated against the Igbos. He gave some key positions to Igbos - Finance, NCC, CBN, NAFDAC, Info etc. I am also proud that the most successful in the Obasanjo administration were Igbos: Okonjo-Iweala, Akunyili (NAFDAC), Ndukwe (NCC), Soludo (CBN). The other two perfoming guys in his tenure were Northerners - El-Rufai and Ribadu. We may have issues with these guys but the truth was that they stood out by getting some results.

Obasanjo was not against Igbos - it was just that he failed in several areas where he could have succeeded. Just like he abandoned Eastern roads, he could not even tar the Otta road that led to his home nor any road in Lagos.

Onlytruth:
Yea, I understand Igbo better.

[size=14pt]Was 1966 the first time Igbo were killed in the north?[/size]

Back to school.

@ Biina and Bk, kindly answer this question posed above truthfully. You can see from my posts that I don't curse or attack any ethnic group. I just want us to understand each other and learn from the past.

Let us assume that after the Jan 1966 coup Igbos provoked the North so grieviously that it was mandatory, as you said above, to retaliate and attempt to wipe them out. I asked in my former post: "When a Danish cartoonist made a caricature of Prophet Mohammed, what was the connection with the killing of Igbos in the North? Did Igbos descend from Denmark? Or was the mother of the cartoonist an Igbo woman?" Pls answer this question too. Did the Igbos provoke and ridicule the Northerners too to be attacked because of a Danish cartoonist?

I believe you are honorable men. So I am waiting for your truthful answer.