₦airaland Forum

johnydon22:
Ok everybody is commending Abraham who almost murdered his son because God asked him to, even though it is wrong to kill your son..

They also think Jesophath is justified for using his daughter as a burnt offering to Yahweh cus he made a promise.

Now my question is
Can You Kill To Prove Your Faith In God

ayoku777:
And about me killing you.

There can never be any justifiable reason for me to kill you (unless argumentatively in a case of self-defence). But your death and your blood can do nothing positive for me before God.

So no, I will not kill you.

ayoku777:
Its finally and obviously clear that you don't believe the bible is the word of God.

First you implied that the writings of the apostles are not trustworthy. Now, you say not all the 'thus saith the Lord' of the scriptural books of the bible prophets are the words of God.

So how do you know which 'thus saith the Lord' is true and which is false? Your opinion decides it?

How do you know the writings of Matthew and Luke are trustworthy but the writings of Paul and Peter are not? Your opinion tells you? So your opinion now defines truth?

I can't debate doctrine with someone who uses his opinion as the foundation for truth, because no matter what portion of scripture i quote you will say, that scripture is not trustworthy, its not the word of God.

And how do you know that? Your opinion says so. Just come out plain, you don't believe in the scriptures as the word of God. You even equate the 'thus saith the Lord' in the bible to the koranic texts of muslims. What absurdity!

Whenever a scipture contradicts your opinion, you throw it out as "not trustworthy"; or "that verse is not the word of God". So now, "The word of God" is whatever your opinion agrees with.

I've shown you from the old testament how it was the Father's will to bruise the Son and make His soul an offering for sin. Showed you from the gospel how Jesus said it was A MUST for Him to be lifted up on the cross just like the serpent of Moses in the wilderness. And showed from the epistles how that the death of a testator is compulsory to give life to a testament.

Yet all these scriptures are not trustworthy to you. If you don't believe the prophets, the gospels and the epistles; or you only choose what you want to believe in them, then YOU DON'T BELIEVE THE SCRIPTURES! Simple.

You ask questions, and we use bible passages to give detailed answers; and you say those verses are not trustworthy, or that 'thus saith the Lord' is not the word of God.

At this point, maybe we will need you to write out what portions of the words of the old testament you consider inspired and not inspired; what portions of the statements of Jesus you consider true and not true; and what portions of the epistles of the apostles you consider trustworthy and not trustworthy. So we know what part we should not quote from when answering your questions from the bible.

Its impossible to edify someone like that with the scriptures. Because you've made your personal opinion the foundation of what you define as true and trustworthy in the scripture. And that is the recipe for self-delusion.

I think my work on this thread is done for now.

Expressions:
I appreciate the Bible passages you quoted here (of which I'll expand upon in the next post), for the viewers to see and understand that God cannot be an author of confusion.

ayoku777:
That is why I said read the bible very well, and ask the Holy Spirit for understanding and He will give you.

If you had studied the scriptures well, you would have seen God do that on more than one occasion. Judging a people after they fulfilled a prophecy that was the will of God; or judging a nation after they carried out a judgment that was the pleasure of God.

God used the Assyrians to judge the nation of Israel after they turned their backs on Him and went after idols. After repeated warnings of judgment against them; He used the Assyrians to fulfil the prophecy of judgment against the nation of Israel and carry out His will against His people.

Yet God still judged the Assyrians for what they did against the nation of Israel even though what they did was carry out God's prophecy of judgment against His people; somethinng that was His will.

God also used the Nebuchadnezzer and Babylon to judge and punish backslidden Judah after repeated warnings to repent. God delivered Judah and her people into the hands of Babylon and they fulfilled God's pleasure upon idolatrous Judah. God even called Nebuchadnezzar "My servant" and babylon "My Army"; to show that He used them to do His will and perform His pleasure against Judah.

Yet God still punished and judged Babylon for what they did to Judah the same way He punished and judged Assyria for what they did to Israel.

2Kings 17v22-23 -For the children of Israel walked in all the sins of Jeroboam which he did; they departed not from them;

Until the Lord removed Israel out of His sight, as He has said by all of His servants the prophets. So was Israel carried away out of their own land to Assyria unto this day.

Jeremiah 34v21 -And Zedekiah King of Judah and his princes will I give into the hand of their enemies, and into the hand of them that seek their life, and into the hand of the king of Babylon's army, which are gone up from you.

Behold, I will command, saith the Lord, and cause them to return to this city; and they shall fight against it, and take it, and burn it with fire: and I will make the cities of Judah a desolation without an inhabitant.

Jeremiah 25v8-9,11 -Therefore thus saith the Lord of hosts; Becasue ye have not heard my words,

Behold, I will send and take all the families of the north, saith the Lord, and Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon, MY SERVANT, and will bring them against this land, and against the inhabitants thereof, and against all these nations round about, and will utterly destroy them, and make them an astonishmetn, and an hissing, and perpetual desolations.

And this whole land shall be a desolation, and an astonishment; and these nations shall serve the King of Babylon seventy years.

Can you see all these scriptures?

It shows that everything that happened to Israel and Judah was the will of God, it was Him that commanded it. God kept saying "I WILL" to show it was Him doing it. Assyria and Babylon were instruments of judgment in His hands, so much that God called Nebuchadnezzar my servant.

Yet look at what God did later. He still judged and punished Assyria and Babylon for what they did to Israel and Judah.

Jeremiah 25v12-14 -And it shall come to pass, when seventy years are accomplished, that I will punish the king of Babylon, and that nation, saith the Lord, for their iniquity, and the land of the Chaldeans, and will make it a perpetual desolations.

And I will bring upon that land all my words which I have pronounced against it, even all that is written in this book, which Jeremiah hath prophesied against all the nations.

Jeremiah 50v17-18 -Israel is a scattered sheep; the lions have driven him away: first the king of Assyria hath devoured him; and last this Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon hath broken his bones.

Therefore thus saith the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will punish the king of Babylon and his land, as I have punished the king of Assyria.

Babylon did what God commanded (His will); God said "I will command" Babylon. And yet He still punished and judged Babylon for what they did to Judah.

So can you see now? That the fact that judgment was pronounced on a nation or a people doesn't mean what they did wasn't part of God's plan, will and pleasure.

God still judges His instruments of judgment.

Jesus came to die, His death was according to the will and pleasure of the Father. Even so the nation that delivered Him and the person that betrayed Him (Israel and Judas) were both judged.

If you have issues with this character of God, seek Him by His Spirit He will put you through. God judges His instruments of Judgment. When God judged the sin of the world in Christ according to His will, He still judged the nation and the people that delivered Him to be killed. Just as He judged the nations He used to judge the sins of Israel and Judah.

Assyria performed God's purpose upon Israel, Babylon carried out God's command upon Judah; and Israel worked out God's will for Jesus. Yet they were still judged and punished.

So yes Jesus came to die and give His life as a sin offering. And the fact that judgment was pronounced on the nation and people that delivered Him to be killed doesn't mean His death wasn't the will of the Father or a performance of His pleasure.
Shalom!

An2elect2:
Hi , well i don't belong to any denomination. Am yet to see one that is not a sham...

*takes a deep breath* huuuh. Thank God there was no fight. Murmurs to herself *is this guy for real? others would jump on me and devour me with their 'dogma'*

I just saw some of your posts and you don't think some books in the bible are valid or have much authority like the others

Ayoku 777 is really dividing the word....rightly. Am glad the both of you are still on it o.

If even one verse in the bible is not God-breathed and sovereignly allowed by Him then it is enough for us to doubt the whole scriptures. You don't think so?

mamsong9:
You see you people are always confuse about this topic, NOBODY crucify Jesus. NOBODY kill him and he did not die for our sins.

Xiadnat:
EXACTLY !!

That's all I am saying. And that is why Newton's laws of motion is in agreement with the law of God and reproductive biology.

Isn't God mysterious, yet when we examine the universe, it's all spelled out and in perfect harmony?

Hi Expressions am sorry for being away from this thread...

Okay. The distinct people are those chosen by God himself to believe and be saved. Am going to cite scriptures but before that there is nothing like being a christian before accessing salvation. The moment the gospel comes to us in word and in power and in much assurance by the holy ghost 1Thess 1:5. we become Christians. Christians are saved people in Christ.

The bible is so clear about this. Its not something to debate over...

Ephesians 1:5 "Blessed be the God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ.
According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world that we should be holy and without blame before him in love."

2Timothy 1:9 " Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began."

verse 10 is crucial! look how our calling was made to come to pass,

10 "But is now made manifest by the appearing of our saviour Jesus Christ who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel.

Those who eventually believe when the gospel is preached do not choose by themselves to believe but rather they believe because they have been chosen by God from the beginning!

Acts13:48 "And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed

Well well you thought i was only pulling your legs? hehehe that's like playing with fire to me. i meant all the ques i asked and am glad you realised that on time. Apology accepted

Okay, this post is really long but i still managed to pull through by God's grace but am afraid once more that you are putting the cart before the horse.

You are giving too much credit to man and his supposed "free will". I understand the place of works Expressions but what i can't accept is that man works for and sustains his salvation. Its like accepting that a house can be built without foundation and can stand on its own with nothing holding it beneath... oh wait a minute, that's not what you are saying? you recognise the place of grace but it can't be effective without man's will?

According to you, God has no right to save a man without his permission! neither does HE have the right to cause a man to work according to HIS precepts except man does something first such as "obedience" . If man can obey God without the power to obey which is in Christ, then all things that we need for life and godliness would not be in Christ. You see...

You imply that grace is available but only if we draw near. If there is a condition to fulfil before obtaining salvation and it rests upon man then salvation would not be by grace through faith. Salvation wouldn't be a gift but a reward for our obedience. Which is it? a reward or a gift? Ephesians 2:8,9 says salvation is by grace through faith. It is not of works so none can boast. The faith is that of the Lord Jesus and comes with the hearing of the word: not what originates from us.

Wait, did i miss something?

As we become more consciously aware, we come to the conclusion that there is something intense and unbalanced about the way that we create “celebrities” in the world. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people all putting their focus on individual people – movie stars, musicians, and even politicians… for those on the receiving end of such mass attention, it can send one off the deep end. This is also in-part why so many “celebrities” have "redonkulous" ego’s and strong drug problems…

Here is a list of 3 amazing people who from their own merits have been put in the public eye and spotlight, and instead of using their attention to build up their ego’s, they use the attention to spread information and awareness and ideas that are otherwise considered unorthodox and out of the box… and it’s awesome!

Russell Brand

You’ve probably seen Russell Brand being a total bad assT over the past few years, reminding the world what’s really going on and spitting out
some spiritual truths. He’s been on various news shows, podcasts and interviews where he discusses the importance of connection, the government, media, the fact that we aren’t just material beings and much more!

The message he brings is especially important coming from someone who has lived within the Hollywood realm, and now wants to break free from it. He’s taken part in the games the media and corporations play, endlessly distracting and
distorting our perception of the world. Now he wants to set this paradigm right by bringing the people together to create a consciousness revolution!


Joe Rogan

Remember the host of the show Fear Factor? Maybe not, and if you do he seemed like a very ’3D’ oriented person, focusing on realities shows
and making money. He has shifted to the desire of spreading truth and awakening the world. His podcast The Joe Rogan Experience features
various friends and celebrities discussing three hours of whatever they’d like.

The topics range from float tanks, mysteries of the world, government ongoings, what needs to change, health and fitness, the positive effects of certain drugs and the list goes on. His show ‘Question everything’ has a good message and ideas behind it even though each episode seems to have him be overly skeptical about each topic
they explore. It feels like he needs to put on that vibe because its on television.


Jim Carrey

Jim Carrey has always been exceptionally strange, and amazing. In this speech he talks about an awakening he experienced after reading Eckhart Tolle. He says thought is responsible for the suffering we all experience and that in this experience he could look at the thoughts from another’s perspective.

It was through this that he experienced a transcendant and expansive feeling of freedom. An experience that many have described
experiencing as well. In that state, the individual “he” became everything and everyone all at once, Jim ceased to exist, and in his place was
no longer a fragment of the universe, but the universe itself.

iamjane:
He could use some fork

channelz:
That is like trying to understand the reason behind this

ejones144:
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"There's no such time as now to find peace and love, but the simple and unwise will tumble over what fate has brought them"

Joe

Xiadnat:
Informative post.

It is because women receive and men release.

Think about it:

What is ejac*ulation? Process of expulsion.....fosters detachment.

And who is the receptacle ? The genetically XX.... Fosters bonding.

Hmmm Right??

Positively charged substances are repelled from other positively charged substances, but attracted to negatively charged substances; negatively charged substances are repelled from negative and attracted to positive.

ayoku777:
Expressions

So you don't believe the bible is a complete book? Or that not all the books in the bible are correct and true? That is a fundamental flaw in your faith or lack of faith. One that gives you the unholy right to cherry-pick what doctrine you accept as true and not true -relative to your opinion.

I can go on and on to rationalize the questions you asked me with scriptures; but it won't help. Because you will just say the writings of Paul cannot be trusted.

The question is what makes you trust the writings of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John that you've been quoting since?

What yardstick did you use to define them as true as opposed to saying those of Paul are not true? What truth-premise makes you think Matthew or John are right and Acts and Ephesians are wrong or false?

I believe the bible is the word of God, and that God never lost control of preserving the truth of His sacred word; even when bishops and all, sat to deliberate over it. God is still sovereign and He rules in the affairs of men, much more in the affairs of preserving His word.

I believe that God never lost control of the preservation of the truth of His word. And that the books that are or are not in the bible are part of His sovereign will to preserve its truth.

If you don't believe that God was still in control of the preservation of the truth of His word, not matter the people who deliberated over it; I can't help you much. Because you have given yourself the right to define truth relative to your opinion. Implying that Matthew is correct, Ephesians is wrong. John is right, 1John is false etc.

How do you come about those standards of defining truth? Your opinion now defines truth?

If scriptures seem inconsistent to you, ask the author. The one who inspired the writers -The Holy Spirit. And He will show you that the entire scripture is one and true.

You don't have the authority to define truth relative to you. Its either you believe the bible is the word of God -OR YOU DON'T.

This is the first hurdle you need to cross; before we can now move to using scriptures to establish doctrine. But as long you keep implying some portions of scripture are correct and some portions are not correct -i can't help much now.

How did you arrive at such self-definition of what is true and what is not true in the bible? What yard-stick did you use to know that Paul's writings are false and that of John or Luke is correct?

obongproff:
No sir. Am actually into social science. I only had a science background back in secondary school.