₦airaland Forum

chiommy123:
God saved Lazarus from death. the only person that has power over death like you are trying to say its Jesus Christ and his father God.

There she goes with folk tales

chiommy123:
why don't you believe in the existence of God Almighty.

Because I have no single prove that God exists, besides, believing in God has been shown to be a usless venture just like how I am showing that prayer is useless.

well that some people decide to close their eyes to the existence of God Almighty doesn't mean he doesn't exist and worshipped by men and women around the globe and angels in heaven and the 24 elders in heaven.

It also be the other way round...that u believe and worship a God concept does not mean that such exists. Or do you think Thor exists because some people worship it?

chiommy123:
human effort is nonsense when God is not involved in it. there are people that work tirelessly yet they have nothing to show for it.

Human effort can't be nonsense when u same religious book said faith without work is dead.
All the richest men in the world do no care about ur God. I particular don't even believe he exists... But my efforts pay big time.

Anyone who works tirelessly with nothing to show for it is obviously consciously or unconsciously doing something wrong

chiommy123:
certainly death is for every living even the Bible said it. that it is appointed unto man to die after that judgement.

Good now go and read ur post before the response u just quoted... And think harder before u respond.

Again this mean God saving people from death is actually nothing but a hoax. U cannot eat ur cake and have it... god cannot save anyone from inevitable death.

chiommy123:
but you believe prayer works at all

if i believe prayer works, why then will i be working my ass off on daily basis to provide for my family. Prayer changes nothing, our human effort does.

chiommy123:
but there are still people that would've died but God still saved them. you can't question him

are you saying God purposely allow some people to die?

do you know how many people that die on daily basis? death is an inevitable end even the ones u claim your God saved will still die.

enilove:
Faith is not prayer. You can have faith in your self , that is , in your ability. That does not mean you pray to yourself.

prayer is an act of faith

I can't share the details of the contract here for some security reasons .

i understand

As per the miracle of prayer , the gmail is not accepting it because it is more than 20 mb.
You can view it on YouTube . It is called "Christian Minister Brings A Baby Out Of A Coma Live on Camera" .or "The Christmas Miracle - The river Church Durham. NC. Sunday. December 13th 2009."

Hard work is a must , same with wisdom but without God these can fail someone.

no one has monopoly of success because no man is an island... activities of others can thwart our efforts. God does not intervene, except i ur mind. we can only do our best, everyone stands the same chance, both those who belive and those who dont. i can confidently say that is takes human ativities such as... hard work, connection, smartness, perseverance etc, to achieve. As long as u cant sit down in ur house and pray to get something done, prayer is useless. once u actively do something to get something done, then u have already told yourself tht ur prayer is useless.

There are so many things which can make ones efforts to fail woefully. It can be spiritual and it can be otherwise.

have u seen spirit before? have u seen spirit stoping ones progress?

Proverbs 3:5-6 KJV
Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
[6] In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

you can repeat the video over and over again, you must do something get something, but u can never just pray to get something.

If you are on whatsapp , I can send the video to you.

i will check is out on utube

enilove:
Prayer can get you a contract I am a testifier.

Pls share and I will show u how prayer actually did not thing. How exactly did prayer get u a contract?

The bible did not say PRAYER without works , but FAITH without works ...

Same thing to me. Prayer is an act of faith.

I have video evidence of prayer bringing back to life a baby that was in coma for more than 6 months in the hospital without any result. Prayer works and does what doctors and sciences cannot do.

Pls share

If you need the video I can send it to you .

xtfranks005@gmail.com

Deligence and hard works can fail you where you don't know people .
You can be hardworking and be deligence in your work place and someone who is not as hardworking and smart thinking like you can be promoted above , if he has the connections.
Do you believe this ?

Of course... Does that mean deligence and hard work failed u? No. It means u lack of familiarity with an important person made u lose the job.
Imagine if u are deligent, hardworking and have connection... The sky will be ur limit.

chiommy123:
how is prayers bullshit pls explain

Because prayer without work is dead... This shows how useless prayer is. Desiring something does not put food on the table.

chiommy123:
yes that there is no way they can survive this life without God their creator

Welcome to my world sis.

But wait... Are u trying to tell me that all the billions of people who have died did not have their creator?

enilove:
The OP did not say one should not be hardworking etc , he is saying when there are problems , instead of getting worried , one should pray.

Pray that what should happen? Pray that the problem should whisk away like magic?
When there is a problem one should look for solution by talking to others who can help or stand up and face the problem.

There some government contracts that you can't get because you are hardworking , deligence , smart etc , but by prayers the contracts can be awarded to you.

Lies, prayer does not give contract. If hardwork, deligence and smartness cannot get u contract, u move on to the next best thing. One must not get everything in life, we learn from mistakes and move one. Prayer is just meaningless mumbling... It gives nothing, that's why ur bible said prayer without WORK is dead. Work without prayer is not dead.

No amount of smart thinking can impregnate a barren woman neither can hardworking.

Both smart thinking and prayer cannot impregnate a barren woman. There are medical solutions to these... If someone is barren and have tried all medication, she can adopt.

Everyone must be hardworking , deligence and prudent in everything but when these fail ,instead of gething worried prayer is the answer. I think this is what the Op is saying.

Hardworking , deligence and smart thinking does not fail. Give me an instance where these failed. Don't teach ur generation that hard working, deligence and smart think fails... Remember prayer with out work is dead... Prayer in the bible quote above only implies desire, its not kneeling and mumbling. The statement simply means, desire and work towards ur desires.

StillX10:
when you are asked to pray it doesn't mean you should abandon thinking, hardworking, or smartness. You can commit your day to day activities (handwork, thought, job, or anything you do) in your prayers .

God answers prayers

Why will I pray when I have to work hard, think smart and persevere? What's the prayer supposed to do

chiommy123:
prayers actually works. there are times when your smartness and hardwork will fail you but God never fail his own

How can smart thinking, Hardwork and smart thinking fail u? Is this what u plan to teach ur children?

bummyla:
Worry never changes anything, prayer does. Make every matter a matter of prayer and you'll see the changes you want to see; God answers prayer.
From dark clouds we get precious water, from dark mines we get our valuable jewels and from our darkest trials come our best blessings from God and so stay strong, change is coming!
Do not fear, for I am with you; do not be dismayed, for I am your God. I will strengthen you and help you; I will uphold you with my righteous right hand. (Isaiah 41: 10).

Be Blessed!!
https://bummyla.com/2018/08/19/worry-never-changes-anything-prayer-does-god-answers-prayer/

Prayer does not change anything... Hardwork, smart thinking and perseverance does.

theunnamed:
True free thinkers believe in the existence of a Supreme Being.



The rest of you are just a bunch of angry children running around in defiance to those you believe to have done you wrong



Reminds me of Frank....Frank believes in Juju, but the existence of a Supreme Being is impossible.

Make una kwantinu

Which frank?

And how much did his gullible followers pay for this irrelevant information.?

nelsonoba:
Let me put it clear to you; you have not made any lasting progress and you cannot without Christ!

I am above your God. I know this is hard to believe.

Yahoo Yahoo boy's that use human beings for sacrifice also think they are making progress just like you have deceived yourself to think. Dani Abacha thought he was also making progress until his day of reckoning arrived, so don't threaten anybody with your so-called progress made outside Christ. No wonder Jesus said "what will it profit a man to gain the whole world and lose his soul?" He was referring to people like you who think progress is about making money without God.

Just like pastor Monroe was making progress until his day of reckoning. Stop decievin yourself. There is not difference between yahoo boys and all your thieving pastors. And what exactly do u mean by the day of reckoning here.

As for those suffering people you mentioned, why would God come down to help them when they don't ask for him to do so or have the faith to believe God? If things ever worked that way, by now you would have been a stronger Christian than me because God would have come down to force his help on you against your will. Think before you accuse the Almighty Wise God that you HATE!

Yessssss! why will God help infant kids with life threatening illness when she didnt pray. The child deserves noting but death.
Why should God held a five year old being molested by a 40 years old man, she didnt ask God for help so therefor she be molested over and over again.
why shouldnt God help change your F to C.... you gave God some money.... All praise to Almigthy and merciful God.

nelsonoba:
You see, when I was young and used to read where the bible says in psalms 14:1 "the fool says in his heart that there is no God......", I used to think that was a harsh statement of some sort, but as I grew older I started to realise it's just a statement of fact.

is that so? ok

What do we think of a man who sees a newspaper, and simply because he did not witness the printing of the paper, he then concludes that the newspaper created itself.....as in the newspaper he is reading just appeared from nowhere and by coincidence all the intelligent information in the newspaper appeared out of nothing? We would say that man "has lost it" or that he is fool.

of course,if the man cant figure out how the newspaper came to be, he should conclude that the newspaper was written by the oracle in his village and ask anyone who doubts this silly conclusion to prove it.

Have you ever heard of DNA? Scientists call it "the book of life". It contains coherent, intelligent information that defines the make up of every living thing. The age at which you grow beards is coded in your DNA, what your eye colour would be is coded in your DNA. The manner in which your skin heals when you sustain an injury is coded in your DNA. Everything about your body including your height, etc are all coded in your DNA.

and scientists got this info by reading the bible and believing in a jewish mountain God.

Being a programmer myself, I can appreciate the fact that no computer code has ever written itself, and any time I look at a code, I can see the intelligence of the programmer behind it. When I think of DNA, it makes me realise that the complexity and intelligence of the information contained within it could never have happened by accident. An intelligent being did it.

Good for you, mr programmer, who wrote the code of this your even more complex creator... what do you even know about his his system was coded?

That leaves me to conclude that it must really take a fool to conclude that there is no God! Either the person is a big fool or the person actually knows the truth but is a pretender who denies the truth to give justification for his sinful life of which he does not want to repent.

you have said absolutely nothing above, yet u are quickly to shout fool. continue

It will do you more good to study more about DNA for yourself and tell me how all those intelligence came from 'nothing'

You are the one claiming intelligence came from nothing not me... or is your God not intelligent?

nelsonoba:
This might make you sad, but I have to say it; GOD DOES NOT NEED YOUR APPROVAL TO KNOW HE IS MERCIFUL. THE ONLY PROOF WE ALL NEED TO KNOW THAT HE IS MERCIFUL IS THE FACT THAT HE HASN'T TURNED OFF HIS FREE OXYGEN SUPPLY TO YOU THAT YOU HAVE BEEN WASTING IN YOUR UNGRATEFULNESS TO HIM. I DON'T NEED ANY OTHER PROOF TO KNOW HE IS MERCIFUL!

PS: your God does not have the ability to turn of any oxygen supply to earth or to any human. Oxygen have been around before you were born and will remain even after u die. Your God lives only in ur head, what is merciful about a being stuck in ur head?

spongeisback:
You made this simple comment see his reply. That means in his heart he's beginning to doubt the so called power of seeds and tithes he just needs people like him to convince him that he's right.



OP am happy for you. Your god ignored all the millions of starving kids prayers and answered yours because you could sow dollars.
What a merciful god.

lol.. of course christians like Leah, who is currently in the hands of bokoharam deserve suffering because they dont pay their tithe. All those kids who are born with brain tumor should suffer because they dont pay their tithe. the op has a big God who will rather convince a lecturer to change his scores to C than help innocent kids starving and suffering from one ailment or the other.

Op if i start giving u exampls of some life progress I have made despite not giving tithe will that convince you not to give tithe?

oga, if u like give all your life saving to ur pastor.. its ur life. Just dont sell such bullshit to my household.

Glycolysis:
Thanks once again,...but I could be very wrong too. That's why the earth is too big that everybody can do his / her findings
But one thing I know for sure is that GOD exist !

if God exists so? how does this fact change the price of garri in the market

TATIME:
ATHEISM simply means arguing to justify whatever you think is right from your own perspective whether others think so or not,and the ability to liberate your mental powers from external forces. In conclusion we can define Atheism as a faculty that's totally against MIND CONTROL, so that you can decide what is good and bad on your own without having to consider what ANY OTHER PERSON BE IT MAN OR GOD think or say! Genesis 2:16,17 Many atheists are now saying there is God or Gods but they're not going to allow such to control them in any way because "if there exists anything like God or Gods, they are the very Gods themselves" It's just what Satan implanted in Eve back then in the garden of Eden so don't be surprised that it's now manifesting fully in this endtime! Genesis 3:4,5 That is why the Bible is emphatic about THE SONS OR CHILDREN OF DISOBEDIENCE! Ephesians 2:2,5:6

lies

ScienceWatch:
Yes the grave consequences of ignoring spiritual law very obvious even today.
The anti-slavery movement was lead by people who would today be called "the religious Right" and its organisation was created by conservative businessmen.

Moreover, what destroyed slavery in the non-Western world was Western imperialism, Nothing could be more shocking to the vision of today's intellectuals than the fact that it was businessmen, devout religious leaders and Western imperialists who together stopped human slave trade.

Slave trade is more shocking than the Jewish Holocaust. Greed separate nations from the Olodumares protection.

Oga u are messing up this thread with ur stupidity... My only issue is that Vaxx will not caution u neither would dead Jesus.
U are a disgrace to Christianity... people like u are a proof that ur God does not exist.
See u in hell

vaxx:
No it shows that the gods does not need us , it is human that needs gods. And when we fail to actualize the power of the gods living within us .which simply means failling to harness this power of olodumare living in us physically, we will become a subject and give chance to external agent to overcome us .

I hope u know what u are doing... This is an absolute case of pretending not to understand his post. He never said God needs us... But that, according to u, God does not act without humans acting. And this is very clear in all ur replies. Its seems it is our actions that determines what God actually did for us.
I don't want to believe that there were not persons that didn't want to resist the whites... My great grand father was a native doctor and he used everything within his means to fight the whites.
Its a bit of insult saying God help those who help themselves in their sitiation. U are implying our people did nothing, they just allowed themselves to be taken away because after all slavery was part of them.
For me, the captors helped themselves the best way they could, they ran, they fought, some succeeded in escaping and some where captured... But the gods where just looking... And saying those who escaped were really helped by the gods is total bullshit. But it also implies that those who were caught were not helped by the Gods.

So In IFA spirituality, we acknowledge the dynamics of nature as the dynamics of the Creator. And we knows Nature shows unapologetic battles between the hunter and the hunted. it is therefore mandatory for us to be the hunter. Ogun in you will then aid you in decapitating all your enemies.

Ya suddenly our natural desire for survival is that ways of the gods in us... Why didn't the Ogun in our enslaved ones help them. The instinct for survival and remain home with their families was already in them they couldn't stand against a stronger force with more sophisticated weapons. Pls do not insult our forefathers by saying they didn't bother to help themselves... Don't say god help those who help themselves, because they fought and were overcame.. The gods did nothing because they can so nothing.

vaxx:
Your comment is more frustrating than I thought. None of my writeup here suggest that african spirituality is a religion that teaches is adherent to be dependable. Therefore I consider your post as those I labell as strawmen conclusion.


My write up was talking about human instinct and decision making as this are the major foundation of African spirituality and not simply mysticism only.

Surely we are caught in a chaotic moment sometime where we don't know what to do. But remember that despite whatever chaos you face, there are still decisions to be made. And this is what African spirituality philosophy entails as that is the symbolical representation of eshu .And not to be dependant.

So If you drop the ball of decision-making, and allow babalawo to do it for You. You will be enslaved and subjugated, because you have neglect the philosophy of eshu which is making decisions regularly.

.So Control your path by controlling your decisions. This is how you venerate Eshu, deity of the crossroad.

But since Most mental-slaves always excuse this and say that they are not in control of their decisions. But you are. If you look deeper, you will see that even in oppression, you still have choices. You might not like the choice that will lead to success because it is too difficult, and this is the reason some take the easier choice (usually handed to them by the babalawo or priest tjey visit and they pretend they had no choice.

No matter how difficuilt it might be .choices are always available. If you don't see them that is because you are blind to difficult choices and only can see the easy ones. Eshu cannot be taken away by any oppressor; Eshu is always at the crossroads of choice.


So in summary African spirituality is about practicality in line with mysticism.

Omo ORUNMILA(the child of ORUNMILA) is full of wisdom and not a babalawo subject.

Ur topic was.... Where was orisha during slave trade?/how did they let it happen...

This suggests that orisha was expected to do something for humans. How does this not teach that we should be dependable on them?
Calling human instinct and decision making the foundation of african spirituality is totally misleading. Human instinct is human instinct and not orisha. Humans must make decisions based on environmental circumstances or biological situation. If man suffering from malaria makes a choice, same man will not make same choice if he is not sick. I fail to see how this has anything to do with the Gods.

Why do traditionalists pray? What do they desire from a supposedly undependable God when they pray?

kkins25:
Another disappointing comment.
I was only using Christianity in place of African religion. Or are you implying that traditionalist too dont wait for God to rain money from the sky? Isnt that why traditionalist visit babalawos? Isnt that why they engage in animal and human sacrifice? Because God can suddenly put money in a calabash, or make a sacrificial victim vomit money?

He was perfectly dishonest with his reply. U will see him hobnobbing with sciencewatch, a Christian, who has a different view on the matter, but as long as both call and accept the word God, they are OK and friends. But what is the difference between the two? Both will say nothing but will quickly differentiate the two when u bring in an example from either side.

Vaxx, I will take u seriously the u come out open on what u think about christian belief... Do u think they are slaves to the white?
U asked Martin why he chose to be a slave by answer a white name but fail to ask sciencewatch why he chose to be a slave by following a white religion and doing white wedding and calling his African Gods powerless power.

lol... sciencewatch is now a traditionalist.... just as long as u believe in the word called called. but when he goes to church he will singe... olodumare power powerless power

CAPSLOCKED:
GOD ONLY HELPS THOSE WHO HELP THEMSELVES IS ON THE LIST OF THE TOP 5 MOST STUPID STATEMENTS EVER MADE.
WHICH IDĮOT FIRST SAID SOMETHING THAT RIDICULOUS?

LIKE IF I READ FOR AN EXAM AND THEN PASS, GOD HELPED ME.
BUT IF I FELL ILL BEFORE THE EXAM AND THEREFORE COULDN'T PREPARE.. AND FAILED, THEN GOD DIDN'T HELP ME CUS I DIDN'T HELP MYSELF?
OR IF I JUMP OUT THE WINDOW OF A BURNING VEHICLE THEN GOD HELPED ME BUT IF I COULDN'T BECAUSE MY LEG WAS STUCK OR I COULDN'T SEE THROUGH THE SMOKE.. AND DIED IN THE FIRE, THEN GOD DIDN'T HELP ME BECAUSE I DIDN'T HELP MYSELF? WHY DIDN'T HE PUT OUT THE FIRE, OR PREVENT EVERYTHING IN THE FIRST PLACE.

THROUGHOUT HIS EXISTENCE, MAN HAS STRUGGLED TO MAKE HIS LIFE BETTER, HEALTHIER, AND LONGER. HE DEVELOPED VACCINES AND CURE FOR MANY DISEASES. HE HAS BUILT MACHINES AND CITIES AND TRIES TO UNDERSTAND AND EXPLAIN EVERY COMPONENT OF NATURE. OF THE UNIVERSE.
HE SAVES HIMSELF WHEN HE CAN AND PROVIDES WHAT HE CAN AFFORD.
HE ALONE DESERVE ALL THE PRAISE AND GLORY, AND NOT MYTHICAL DEITIES THAT ARE NOT THERE AND WILL NEVER BE.

This is why religious folks must define what Gods help really is

The op actually define orisha as mans survival instict

vaxx:
now. You just ask a reasonable question. Orisha is not one entity somewhere looking for whom to help .It Is you that symbolize oriaha. Orisha is in you . Therefore the power to help yourself lies in the dicision and indicition you will make.

"" ORUNMILA WI ENIYAN NI DORISHA . LITERALLY MEANS, IT IS HUMAN WHO TURNS TO ORISHA.

Hmmm in other words, if a people is not united, they have rejected orisha.. OK,this makes sense. Thanks

vaxx:
This thread is not for what its God role and purpose,it is where was dorisha/olodumare during slavery. In which I position my argument on disunity.

Orisha/olodumare already gave an approach to live as human and that is unity which Yoruba forsake....

However, if you will be interested in knowing the roles and duty of olodumare in the cosmos.Create a thread on that and give me a mention.

It is even a flaw to engage in a debate you had no knowledge about. Why don't you question the philosophy first . Then we can have a go.

How exactly would orisha have helped our fore fathers if they were actually united

hopefulLandlord:
What if God actually exists but only atheists would be allowed into heaven? I find it bizarre how theists never thought about that possibility. like we die and God goes "HopefulLandlord, I exist but the test is to weed out those that would believe something on no evidence, you passed. you may pass"

Lol, I have always wondered why exactly God will put an ordinary mortal like me in hell after judgement(if there is eventually one). Its not like I am in any competition with him for anything, i didn't sleep with his wife neither did I hurt him in any way... Am I even capable of hurting the creators feeling? I just fukking used the brain he game me... See no God believe no God.

I sometimes wish the judgement day was real. It will be the best day of my life or after life. Imagine talking one on one with God and asking him questions that will make him look silly just they way i have made Christians felt.

God will b like.. "U didn't believe me by faith, go to hell!"

Me: " seriously? U whole problem was that I believe u by faith? Pls get me the real creator, one who has real issues with me"

vaxx:
Be in unity is part of dicision making that eshu philosophy is all about which Yoruba tribe forsake when they were enslaved.

You need to ask question directly and not always in christain perspective.

Does our disunity affect eshu in any way? Why do humans need to follow eshu philosophy to know that they will progress better. This is common sense not eshu philosophy. Eshu should teach us what we don't know not what we know.

Further, does eshu even consider some of those inevitable circumstances that leads to disunity among humans? Unity actually comes with a price. What's eshu philosophy teaching about overcoming those inevitable circumstances that leads to disunity... Its not just about teaching unity which even animals know about.