₦airaland Forum

nawa o ^^^

Dark blue jeans
Black top,
grey/black n white jacket
Black scarf
grey beanie
blue/white/grey sneakers

The terms could be confusing though.

What i am talking about is the point at which you accept Jesus,
im not talking about 'believing'. The Devil believes in God,
but has he truly repented (God sees the heart) has he accepted Jesus? No.

Let me share two things, i just learnt about
its still fresh in me mind, but i would like to see if others share the same views.

http://www.stempublishing.com/authors/hole/Faith/Propitiation.html

If you can read that, that is where the discussion i was having off the internet lay.

There is no working for salvation, once you believe in Jesus, and truely repent. .
you are saved. When you die, you wont be damned. sin will always take its toll on us
thats why we dont live very long on earth here anyway. but the hope is eternal life afterall.

If working for your salvation was the way to be 'saved', the illustration given by Zikky,
where one repents on his death bed and still gets damned, would be totally unreasonable
thats why as long as you are on this earth, you are a sinner, repented or not.

Those that reject Christ as their Savior and refuse to believe in Him have no hope of salvation.
They can only look forward to facing the wrath of God that they have stored up for the coming day of judgment
There is no other propitiation or sacrifice that can be made for their sins.

http://gracehead.com/index.php?p=388&more=1&page=2

The highlighted above isn't exactly right. one isn't "saved" at that point of accepting Jesus; rather one begins the journey towards being saved.
Several verses in the bible attest to that fact(Some I've posted earlier in the thread).
Accepting Jesus brings about a change in a person's life but not the final change which is referred to as being "saved".
Being saved is a future event put into motion by our acceptance of/belief in Christ

So even if we have become a part of Gods kingdom,
we arent quite there yet, we still need to wok out our salvation.

I would be very great-ful if you could highlight those scriptures from the pile.

Another question is, What exactly does Jesus dying mean. why did he have to be 'sacrificed'
why him and not the goats, i need this to be really clear.

As regards losing it, it only makes sense that since a thing has not been fully achieved, it is possible to lose it or not achieve it.

i dont get this, if someone gives you something you dont deserve, you are still saying, you would need to work to keep it
why would the person give you then in the first place.
i

- what constitutes saved?
- when is that point reached?
- what if anything happens prior, at that point or after
- how does one know

This is what i understand so far,

Saved: The point at which you acceptance Jesus, When you become 'Born Again'
Before that point, you lived without the ''blood' on your wall, <egypt/passover/angel of death>
how do you know?, i believe everyone makes a conscious decision to either accept Jesus or not.

- do you earn it
- work to keep it
- can possibly lose it after attaining it.

No, nobody earns 'grace'
There is no work to be done to keep grace,
it has nothing to do with anybody.

Losing it? now that is the question,
thats where the discussion here lies mostly,

Please, i will not reply to rantings or further thread derailments.
Because i made myself clear from the beginning.

Thanks.

dgreatrock:
It is yes and no

1. Yes= If you are saved and you maintain your relationship with the Lord, yes you are saved for life

2. No= If you were saved and did not follow the Lord and allow the things of this world to cloud your eyes and you stray away, if you die without reconcilling with the Lord, then your first salvation will not save you
Ezekiel 18:1-5; 7-end

You insinuate that we have to be born again again again,
with no scriptural backing

I suggest you read through the thread again

My attitude is, i dont have time to read through things,
unrelated to the topic at hand. Dont post scriptures out of context
telling me to read it. . .as to what? please just be clear.

I am also having this discussion off the internet, and i just presented it here
because it seems like many people dont teach, dont talk about it.

If you feel, its over your head and you dont want to contribute, there is no problem
in that.

Thank you

Right.

Dont join discussions you cannot contribute reasonably to.

Indeed you should really read it yourself again.

I am just asking questions, which you guys wonderfully evade.

Cheese balls n chin chin

Funny,
You are the one twisting it.


Because from Pauls statement, i did not get this

This is PAUL himself warning us that it is never too late to be damned!!!!

So we need to continually watch ourselves to be sure we have not left what God has placed in our hands.

What exactly has God placed in our hands?

What im getting from the majority on this thread,
is that we are the ones saving ourselves.
Christ's death is of no consequence then,
We should have just kept on sacrificing goats n things

@Sharpman,

From that scripture, Paul wasnt talking about the ability to save himself,
He was talking about living life according to what Jesus preached,
i didnt find him stating anywhere that he'd be cast off from the presence of God

I use pink sha

Yup, yup

you are welcome TV01.

lol.

Thank you very much, kind sir.

Dude,
you have to be clear.

When you bunch everything together, i cant see.
cos one, my eyesight aint the best
two, i dont have so much time on my hands

thats all i am asking.

Put bible verses in quotes, e.t.c

ok. thanks.

@Ttalks,

I see you are constantly derailing the topic,
This is why one cant have a honest discussion on Nairaland, *sigh*

Its a pity i cant read the plenty stories you post

Its not MY theory,
its whats in the book.

That verse didnt say, All sinned and came short of Gods glory.

I can see where many Christians have their problems,
the thought that they can never 'sin'  ROTFLMAO!
If indeed we had to work for our salvation, there will be overcrowding in 'Hell'


(Romans 3:10) says

"There is none righteous, no, not one"

.

sara j:
I have two cousins who are gay (one whis is very open and one not so open,
because of his parents) I knew they were not interested in women since I was
5 yrs old because they always wanted to play with my barbie dolls, my little
ponies, and they always did my hair up!!!) Plus when we were playing King
and Queen they always wanted to be Queen and thats big give away.

this doesn't follow.

You have confused me too.
Because the source of yours isnt clear.

I have been very busy and could only manage to drop a few lines
especially that i was posting from my phone
anyway,

Lets take it from the top,

Romans 3:23

All have sinned. .

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, (NIV)
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;(KJV)

We will always fall short of JESUS, who is the Glory, maybe
except some people like ttalks who can never 'sin' because they Love God.

I hope this is understood atleast

Hmmmm, i guess what you are saying here is once a person becomes a member of a family, he remains a member for good (even if there is a change in plan and the guy decide to go worship satan part-time). Oh well, i guess there is something you are not telling me here (i.e. you are privy to some info i dont have). Please share, dont be stingy.

I am sure, the bible talks about something that is unforgivable. .
Denial of the Holy Spirit.

One can certainly get punish by family members for being a bad (i.e. dont get to share in the spoils of the family inheritance). I see things like that around daily. Of course minor matters can be tolerated and the person counselled, but it has its limit.

No one is disputing this
and The wages of sin is death.

again, i believe generally Guys tend to cook better

Christ's sacrifice is like provision of a load of food to quench hunger along with a blank cheque to get more food.
The hunger here represents the inherited sins which is taken care of by the sudden supply of a load of food.
the blank cheque is the necessary stuff to get more food when fresh hunger(fresh sins) strikes again.
the provision has been made to get what is required to quell the hunger, but if not used, the hunger remains.

Wrong.

You need to go understand the meaning of propitiation and redemption.

i just understood a couple of things myself, and im just trying to see what other 'christians'
really understand about Christs death.

Because from what i see you posting, its like he shouldnt have died afterall.
if you need a 'blank cheque', get a goat

Let assume i use to be a sinner, and i accepted Christ as my saviour and believe in all that he did for me. I am saved right? Now does that give me right to do things like going on a shooting spree (with my AK47) in a shopping mall? Am i still saved? I personally don’t think so

Dude, we never stop being 'sinners'
it doesnt give you the right to do what you like in the same vein that being a member of your family
doesnt give you the right to do what you like.
Thank God you said personally.

The thing is if i have truly accepted Christ and i am saved, i must live according to Christ’s commandment and not indulge myself in activities that go against it.

True, and what is Christs Commandment? To love God and others, is it to NEVER 'sin'

But when i do, it means i have derailed and sever myself from Christ. What do i need to do to connect once more?

When you do something wrong in your family, are you 'severed' from them?
Do you stop being a member of that family?
Even though you say 'mom im sorry' does it mean, you stopped being a member of the family, then your 'sorry' now
brought you back?

Deceit no go kee some

Apple vinegar for weight loss??!

Ok, question to the house

whats your natural regime if in colder regions/months

Get Tree-oil

Any product that is based off it

We could not attain any forgiveness provided by Christ's sacrifice until we acknowledged our sin and repented.

Yes.

the same situation applies in any other sin we commit; repent and attain.

This doesnt make sense.

If it isn't necessary to constantly seek forgiveness and cleansing through the blood of christ,
there is no point in the expectations of a Christian by the bible; we should just accept Christ and then live life as usual,
committing sins at every whim and be sure that we are ok no matter what.

No, thats why Jesus said The greatest commandment is love, if you love someone
why would you want to hurt them.

Christ's atonement is like a blank cheque that we can always make use of when the need arises.
possession of a blank cheque would not get u anything unless u put it to use when the need arisies.

i dont buy this, <no pun intended>

Two fold.

I thought Jesus Died for ALL.

I didnt see any two-fold condition on the cross

As i said before, Christ is that atonement which is available for us to get forgiveness of sins which we commit after we repent of them.

in other words, God keeps sending Jesus to die on the cross after every sin we commit and ask for forgiveness

See dem, be deceiving themselves.
Terrible month this october,

Which translation is that one, 'if we make it a habit'