₦airaland Forum

plappville:
I will ignore other of your Posts

Why not. Because your bible has been exposed and you can't defend it. Typical Christian response. I'm not surprised.
It's now obvious which scripture preaches killing innocents. You twisted verses of the Quran, but you were refuted and the verses, explained. But when plain, sheer violence is shown from your bible, you hide under the shadow of ignoring my post. I'll leave it for the audience to judge, which is violent, and which is not.

because I have to forcefully accept ur religion before I can reply you. Its disgusting and irritating but I have to do it in order to continue to expose the evil (isl.a.m).

I think you meant to fabricate lies against the Qur'an, while not being able to defend a single passage from your bible, of which there are tons, as evil, or even more evil than that, which I'll be exposing if I'm chanced, In shaa Allah.

YOU HAVE NOTHING TO REFUTE.

That should be directed to you, a million folds. It's obvious who has nothing to refute. One who explains his holy scripture, or one who shies away from her scripture, because it is full of disgraceful passages.

THE ONLY THING I KNOW AND ITS A FACT IS THAT. ISIS,ALQUAIDA AND ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST GROUP KNOW THE KORAN BETTER THAN YOU WHO TWIST IT.

Of course. When you've been brainwashed, you can only know one thing, nothing else. Little wonder that's all you know.
But amazingly, yet unsurprisingly, the KKK, LRA, Army of God, and all Christian terrorists happen to understand the bible, a gazillion times better than you who twists it, and can't even defend a single passage. These guys would gladly accept that passage, and act on it, along with many others, in which are inherent, more violence, such that the one I quoted in my previous post becomes a mere bedtime story for children.

THESE GROUPS ARE PROUD MUSLIMS.

Obviously, I just mentioned proud Christians, core Christians, who follow the bible to the core.

THEY ARE THE PEOPLE WHO FOLLOW THE STEP OF MUH.AMM.ED.

They follow the direct commands of Jesus (AKA, Yahweh)

THEY KILL BECAUSE MUHA.MMED KILLS.

They kill because Jesus (yahwey) orders them to.

CHRISTIANS DO NOT KILL BECAUSE JESUS DID NOT KILL. AS SIMPLE AS ABC.

Go and see your brothers, following the orders of Jesus (Yahweh). If you want to go to your heaven, better go and join them in killing others, else, you are going to hell. Simple as chewing water, since ABC will be pretty hard for an illiterate.

THE QURAND DEFENDS THIS. AND THE BIBLE DEFENDS THIS.

Obviously, the Qur'an makes it clear that killing is a great sin, but unsurprisingly, the bible makes it clear that not killing is a great sin, punishable by death, and if you want to attain heaven, and the favour of Jesus (Yahweh), you have to kill, not tens or thousands, but tens of thousands, and even more, before you can be worthy of heaven. What a disgrace. Along with all the pornographic content present in it. Little wonder all Christians hide these bible passages, that is if they are even aware of their presence. In shaa Allah (If God wills), I'll be bringing up a post to expose a little of the pornography in the bible, when I'm chanced.
You are going to have a lot of fun refuting them, or maybe just feelings of shame and disgrace.

plappville:
Go and sit somewhere go to the US come to the West with ur PHD you will be reduced to an undergraduate

OK

I have known many Nigerians like you. Brag with your forged diploma that you canned even defend outside Nigeria.

Brag? forged? You really should become a comedian. Even from my post, I made it clear that I am not referring to myself as someone in that category, but simply making a point. I could be in, above or below that category. Stop jumping to conclusions, "educated westerner"

The truth is that, You do not present any quality/prove of a phd holder.

A PhD holder (again, not saying that I am), does not need to prove anything to you. Simple and short.

You are just been arrogant and pained.

Your opinion of me, doesn't matter at all.

Back to the OP or you keep silent forever.

If you mean the original op, it was dismissed a long time ago. You go and defend your bible.

plappville:
'I Am just back from a ban. Its difficult to expose the evil in Islam. Some of my comments are deleted. You Muslims are favoured in NL. Thats not fair! But i will continue even if i get ban after this post again.
How perfect is the Quran as seen below:
If it needs to be seen by everyone

You are right, the perfection of the Quran needs to be seen by everyone.

why deleting comments that do not even relate to insult but only expose the truth?

This statement is funny. Go and meet the person that deleted your post, not me.

Keep faking yourself.

What's this? How can one fake himself? Please, be serious.

Here are some characters of The man you call prophet.

God Almighty appointed him a prophet.

Its even prohibited for me to call his name name because i might get ban.

That's your business.

FIGHTING:

Bukhari:V4B52N50 "The Prophet said, ‘A single endeavor of fighting in Allah's Cause is better than the world and whatever is in it.'"

I should not even be wasting my time explaining these to you, because even though you picked out of context, some of them are still self explanatory. Reread, this time, with your eyes open. I'm pretty sure you'll come across "in Allah's Cause".

Qur'an 9:88 "The Messenger and those who believe with him, strive hard and fight with their wealth and lives in Allah's Cause."

Again, "In Allah's cause". Just in case you don't know what fighting in Allah's cause is, look up Qur'an 4:75;
"And what is [the matter] with you that you fight not in the cause of Allah and [for] the oppressed among men, women, and children who say, "Our Lord, take us out of this city of oppressive people and appoint for us from Yourself a protector and appoint for us from Yourself a helper?"

Qur'an 9:5 "Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war."

I'm surprised at you. Please, read the verse in context.

Qur'an 9:112 "The Believers fight in Allah's Cause, they slay and are slain, kill and are killed."

"in the cause of Allah has been defined above. Apply it.

Qur'an 9:29 "Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission."

There's no issue with this. "Fight" doesn't always mean physical combat, like "beat" isn't always physical. If you have no problem with the government going after someone for not paying their taxes, then, you should have no problem with the government of an Islamic state going after people (non-muslims) who do not pay their taxes.
NOTE: The taxes of the Muslims is the zakat, and it is even more than that for non Muslims.

Qur'an 8:39 "Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah."
Qur'an 9:14 "Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, lay them low, and cover them with shame. He will help you over them."

TERROR
Bukhari:V4B52N220 "Allah's Apostle said, ‘I have been made victorious with terror.'"
Qur'an 8:12 "I shall terrorize the infidels. So wound their bodies and incapacitate them because they oppose Allah and His Apostle."
Qur'an 8:57 "If you gain mastery over them in battle, inflict such a defeat as would terrorize them, so that they would learn a lesson and be warned."
Ishaq:326 "If you come upon them, deal so forcibly as to terrify those who would follow, that they may be warned. Make a severe example of them by terrorizing Allah's enemies."
Qur'an 8:67 "It is not fitting for any prophet to have prisoners until he has made a great slaughtered in the land."

WAR
Ishaq:472 "Muhammad's Companions are the best in war."
Qur'an 8:7 "Allah wished to confirm the truth by His words: ‘Wipe the infidels out to the last.'"
Qur'an 8:12 "Your Lord inspired the angels with the message: ‘I am with you. Give firmness to the Believers. I will terrorize the unbelievers. Therefore smite them on their necks and every joint and incapacitate them. Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes."
Qur'an 8:15 "Believers, when you meet unbelieving infidels in battle while you are marching for war, never turn your backs to them. If any turns his back on such a day, unless it be in a stratagem of war, a maneuver to rally his side, he draws on himself the wrath of Allah, and his abode is Hell, an evil refuge!"
Qur'an 8:39 "So, fight them till all opposition ends and the only religion is Islam."
Qur'an 8:45 "O believers! When you meet an army, be firm, and think of Allah's Name much; that you may prosper."
Qur'an 8:57 "If you meet them in battle, inflict on them such a defeat as would be a lesson for those who come after them, that they may be warned

I could go one and on, but typing isn't easy.
Read the verses you quoted in context, you'll get the true meaning.
Consequently, look up Luke 19:27. I guess Jesus (pbuh) according to the bible was commanding violence.

Like I said before, you and your ideologies, of which majority are lies, can be dismissed twice in a minute.

Salaam.

plappville:
Really? then how about the terrorism verse i posted earlier

It was perfectly explained. Now, you go defend your bible, because I exposed a lot of violence embedded in it. But like I promised before, you will hardly be able to defend it without making a fool of yourself.

and also Quran 8:60 where your Allah

This is the verse I least expected you to quote, because, if you are smart, you'll notice that I quoted 8:61, just in my above post, as a verse which terrorists, and amazingly, bigots like you, ignore.

says in Arabic a language that you cannot speak read or write perfectly like the ISIS. A terrorist language.

Funny, because you just exposed yourself. Amazingly, Kkk, LRA, Army of God, etc happen to understand the bible far better than you.

It says:


ﯘﯙﯚﯛﯜﯝﯞﯟﯠﯡﯢﯣﯤﯥﯦﯧﯨﯩﯪﯫﯬﯭﯮﯯﯰﯱﯲﯳﯴﯵﯶﯷﯸﯹﯺ
SAHIH INTERNATIONAL
And prepare against them whatever you are able of power and of steeds of war by which you may terrify the enemy of Allah and your enemy and others besides them whom you do not know [but] whom Allah knows. And whatever you spend in the cause of Allah will be fully repaid to you, and you will not be wronged.

I could write pages upon pages, explaining the virtues of this verse. But you are not worth it. So, I'm gonna dismiss your ideology in a few seconds.
If your hate didn't blind you, you'd have seen the immediate next verse. But I guess you can't.
8:61 And if they incline to peace, then incline to it [also] and rely upon Allah. Indeed, it is He who is the Hearing, the Knowing.

So your Allah is saying that Muslims should terrorize their enemies and the enemies of Allah and you come and tell us that there is no terrorism in Islam?

It's actually you and your lying brethren that say such nonsense. Go and defend your bible.

How come you did not know that? So are you reading the same quran that we kuffar, ISIS and BOKO read?

Seriously? I least expected that from you. Go and defend your bible verses. Also, my promise still stands. You get a refutation, and two extremely violent bible verses, most of which you can't defend without making a fool of yourself. Also, as a bonus, I could also expose some of the x-rated, pornographic content of the bible.

Now why the lies and fabrications you telling NL?

Go and defend your bible, or give up on you folly.

I urge you to leave islam and be free from the Arabs

That's quite funny. I could say the same for you. Leave Christianity and be free from the lies and brainwashing of your christian missionaries.

and their imperialism and their god who tells your likes to terrorize the rest of humanity.

If self defense is terrorism, that means the verses of the Qur'an on that aspect are mere bedtime literature for kids, compared to the bible which commands extermination of entire nations, for glory and honour, and even for reasons as stupid and trivial as "nothing". Quote me, the bible, and Yahweh command killing of people for absolutely nothing
A typical example is in the verses in my above post. What a joke!

YOUR GARBAGE IS IGNORED..

Funny you say that, since in your next post, you replied the same post you called garbage here. Seems like you are confused.

Mods, please make this thread open to all, to comment. I see no reason why it should be restricted. I don't shy away from religious discussions because the Qur'an is a perfect Revelation, and the truth about it needs to be available for everyone to view, know, and In shaa Allah, accept.
Take the thread back!

Cc: Seun

plappville:
It is coward of you to tag him a Christian when He does not meet up to the definition of a true Christian according to the bible.

So also, it is a mere show of cowardice on your path, to tag Boko Haram, Isis, etc, as true Muslims, when they do not meet the definition of true Muslims according to the Qur'an, as seen in 10:99, 2:256, 16:125, 2:195, 8:61, 109:1-6, 5:32 and many more.
You sure do know how to twist things, when it comes to Christianity, yet, fabricate lies, when it comes to Islam. You sure amaze me!

Romans 8:14 ►
For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.

That's quite interesting. Since according to the verses I quoted above (my above post), the spirit of God led Saul to exterminate a nation for no reason. But he was reluctant, and I wonder why. Maybe it was the devil dissuading him from killing people, and making him disobey the blood thirsty Yahweh.

What are the characters of the Spirit of God according to the bible?
Galatians 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

Well, the bible tells me that this is also a character of the spirit of God (according to you).
Deuteronomy 13:
6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

Did you see terrorist there?
The verse above has refuted you.
The verse above is enough.

Go read you bible, you will not only see terrorists, but extreme terror, genocide, extermination and wickedness of a bloodthirsty God.

Same Qur'an that said this:
indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures

So? What's the problem with Quran 98:6 which you quoted above. I keep telling you that anyone can make rules, but what matters is making them count.

The analogy that God loves everyone is fallacious. How would it make a believer feel that with all of the good deeds he has performed and all the love that he showed towards God when he finds out that God loves the corrupt people who showed hatred towards Him as well? It is not fair. It is illogical. Also, it would mean that God loves satan. I wonder how that makes sense. If you have a problem with this verse, then, you are gonna have to contend with tons of them in your bible.
E.g,
Psalm 5:4-6
4 You are not a God who takes pleasure in evil; with you the wicked cannot dwell.
5 The arrogant cannot stand in your presence; you hate all who do wrong.
6 You destroy those who tell lies; bloodthirsty and deceitful men
the LORD abhors.


Psalm 11:5
5 The LORD examines the righteous, but the wicked and those who love violence his soul hates.


Leviticus 20:23
23 You must not live according to the customs of the nations I am going to drive out before you. Because they did all these things, I abhorred them.


Leviticus 26:30
30 I will destroy your high places, cut down your incense altars and pile your dead bodies on the lifeless forms of your idols, and I will abhor you.


Romans 9:13
Just as it is written: " Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated."

And many more.

I don't expect Christians to accuse me of committing the tu quoque fallacy, for I am not trying to defend the Quranic perception of God by simply pointing out that it exists in the Bible as well. I don't see anything rationally objectionable against the idea of God hating someone in the first place.

How contradictory is all.ah?

How contradictory is Yahweh.

You are laughable. ..

That's debatable. But you, you keep on making rules that don't count, and can be refuted simply by logic, not just once, but even twice in a minute. That's the true meaning of being laughable.

How old are you? It seems I am talking with a kinder here

Maybe. But I'm sure you know there's something called masters degree, ph. D, etc. If someone in that category (not saying that i am) is a kid to you, you must be quite an old lady. Or, it was just a rhetorical question. Pick whatever option you like.

He died of the poisoned food PERIOD ! ! The Hadith is not at your favour here.

You basically have no point here. Also, I don't know why you laid emphasis on the word, "period", because it drives home no point. It's simply a term in Physics, used to define the time taken to make a complete revolution, or oscillation, for objects moving with simple harmonic motion.

Please do. It will expose you more..

I guess you are right. It will be a means to expose more of the true teachings of Islam, not the fabricated lies of majority of Christians, of which you are included.

This is one word Muslims misuse. They know no peace. Yet they say "peace. You should say "war" instead. Brainwashed abo.k.i.

You should really become a comedian.
First, from what I've gathered from my northern brothers, "aboki" means "my friend". Also, it's not an acronym, so, I don't see why you are using the "." in it.
Lastly, apart from the last word, "aboki", every other thing you have written is irrelevant. If you want to know true peace, then come to Islam. You may experience the peace due to "absence of war". But I'm talking about true internal peace, that only comes from worshipping your Lord, Creator, without partners, and submitting to His will totally.

Salaam.

Like I promised, here is just a tip of the iceberg of the extreme terror in the bible.
Let's start with Saul, and a little of David.
Unlike the lying, fraudulent Christians, I'll bring the verses in context, not out of context. Here goes;

So, who was Saul? He was the first king of the United Kingdom of Israel, divinely appointed to this position by the Jewish prophet Samuel. His first task as king was to ethnically cleanse the land of the Amalekite people:

1 Samuel 15:1 Samuel said to Saul, “I am the one the Lord sent to anoint you king over his people, over Israel; so listen now to the message from the Lord.
15:2 This is what the Almighty Lord says : ‘I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
15:3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and utterly destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'”

Notice that it was God Himself (AKA Jesus, according to christian trinity) who ordered Saul to slaughter the Amalekites, for no reason at all, What nonsens! And so King Saul led the Israelites in war against the Amalekites. Per God’s directives, Saul “put to death men and women, children and infants.” He killed every human being with the lone exception of the Amalekite king; he also spared some animals. By sparing King Agag’s life, Saul failed to complete the mitzvah (the religious obligation) of genocide–something which was completely unacceptable to the God of the Bible[/quote]:
15:7 Saul attacked the Amalekites all the way from Havilah to Shur, to the east of Egypt.
15:8 He took Agag, king of the Amalekites, alive, and all his people [b]he utterly destroyed with the sword.
15:9 But Saul and the army spared [King] Agag and the best of the sheep and cattle, the fat calves and lambs—everything that was good. These they were unwilling to destroy completely, but everything that was despised and weak they totally destroyed.
15:10 Then the word of the Lord came to Samuel:
15:11 “I am grieved that I have made Saul king, because he has turned away from me and has not carried out my instructions.” Samuel was troubled, and he cried out to the Lord all that night.
Saul tried to defend himself, but God stripped him of his kingship:
15:13 When Samuel reached him, Saul said, “The Lord bless you! I have carried out the Lord’s instructions.”
15:14 But Samuel said, “What then is this bleating of sheep in my ears? What is this lowing of cattle that I hear?”
15:15 Saul answered, “The soldiers brought them from the Amalekites; they spared the best of the sheep and cattle to sacrifice to the Lord your God, but we totally destroyed the rest.”
15:16 “Stop!” Samuel said to Saul. “Let me tell you what the Lord said to me last night.”
“Tell me,” Saul replied .
15:17 Samuel said, “Although you were once small in your own eyes, did you not become the head of the tribes of Israel? The Lord anointed you king over Israel.
15:18 And he [the Lord] sent you on a mission, saying, ‘Go and completely destroy those wicked people, the Amalekites; make war on them until you have wiped them out.’
15:19 Why did you not obey the Lord? Why did you pounce on the plunder and do evil in the eyes of the Lord?”
15:20 “But I did obey the Lord,” Saul said. “I went on the mission the Lord assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag, their king.
15:21 The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the Lord your God at Gilgal.”
15:22 But Samuel replied: “Does the Lord delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the voice of the Lord? To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams.
15:23 For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, he has rejected you as king.”
15:24 Then Saul said to Samuel, “I have sinned. I violated the Lord’s command and your instructions. I was afraid of the people and so I gave in to them.
15:25 Now I beg you, forgive my sin and come back with me, so that I may worship the Lord.”
15:26 But Samuel said to him, “I will not go back with you. You have rejected the word of the Lord, and the Lord has rejected you as king over Israel!”

Saul repeatedly repented for his “failure”:
15:30 Saul replied, “I have sinned. But please honor me before the elders of my people and before Israel; come back with me, so that I may worship the Lord your God.”

And God was sad that He had chosen such a sissy to be king:
15:35 The Lord repented that He had made Saul king over Israel.

Saul was stripped of his kingship, which was given to David –who was frankly just much better at killing civilians. In fact, all the Israelite chicks fawned over David for being a more proficient killer; all the girls wanted him and all the guys (including Saul himself) wanted to be him:

18:6 When the men were returning home after David had killed the Philistine, the women came out from all the towns of Israel to meet King Saul with singing and dancing, with joyful songs and with tambourines and lutes.
18:7 As they danced, they sang:
“Saul has slain his thousands, and David his tens of thousands.”
18:8 Saul was very angry; this refrain galled him. “They have credited David with tens of thousands,” he thought, “but me with only thousands. What more can he get but the kingdom?”
18:9 And from that time on Saul kept a jealous eye on David.

Certainly, killing thousands just doesn’t cut it. The mass murderer field is just so saturated, that you really need to kill tens of thousands to be considered competitive for Heaven University. No wonder Samuel felt like an absolute idiot for sending a sissy to do a man’s job; realizing this, he cleaned up Saul’s mess:
15:33 Samuel put Agag to death before the Lord at Gilgal.

King Agag was not the only one who was killed: God was so upset over the whole not killing everybody thing that He killed Saul and his three sons. The prophet Samuel explained to Saul why this was his fate:

28:18 Because you did not obey the Lord or carry out his fierce wrath against the Amalekites, the Lord has done this to you today.

According to the Jewish texts (as reproduced on p.76 of Vol.11 of The Jewish Encyclopedia), Saul had protested the commandment to “utterly destroy” the Amalekites, saying:
For one found slain the Torah requires a sin offering [Deuteronomy 21:1-9 ]; and here so many shall be slain. If the old have sinned, why should the young suffer; and if men have been guilty, why should the cattle be destroyed?

What Saul didn’t realize was that obeying the Lord’s commandment–in this case to kill women and children–was more important than anything else. The Bible explains the reason for Saul’s demise:
1 Chronicles 10:13 Saul died because he was unfaithful to the LORD. He failed to obey the LORD’s command …

Yet, these lying Christians tell me that defending oneself and one's people, like the Qur'an allows is bad, whereas the bible allows people to kill for no reason at all. What a Joke!
If I'm chanced, In shaa Allah, I'll give an x-rated part of the bible, as a bonus.

Cc: Plappville

plappville:
The thread is moved here to avoid what? Sigh***

The thread being moved is not my doing.

To you Muslims, there hasnt be anytime an atheist has done anything wrong.

I never made such a statement. Rather, what I said is that it is cowardice and stupidity to blame something clearly done by a Christian, with support from the bible, on an Atheist. Simple and short.
A Muslim kills, you say he is a true Muslim. Yet, a christian kills, instead of also saying he is a true Christian, you say he is an atheist. Such nonsense.

You keep Tagging all atheists as Christians.

You are so ludicrous. Your brothers are killing millions, keep telling yourself they are atheists.
#SelfDeceit.

Christian and Jews are your greatest threats. Your quran commanded you to kill them.

The only verse you brought has been explained. Also, my promise to give two violent bible verses in return still stands. Also, as a bonus, I may give an x-rated verse of the bible in addition.

Since Muhammad was not strong enough to force Islam in their throat, He commands you to hate them with so much passion.

Yet the Qur'an says the closest to Muslims are Christians. You have no point.

Thats why you muslims kill Jews and Christians.

Because your bible allows people to kill for things like glory, honour and other meaningless things does not mean that the Qur'an allows people to kill, for such. Please, be reasonable.

And also tag them with Criminal names even when the bible condemns such.

The same bible that allows you to kill for glory and honour? Nonsense.

I tell you the truth. You will fail.

Do you mean my exams?

Just like Muhammad failed when He ate the poisoned food.

Yet he lived for 3-4 years after, and completed his message.

I may not come here again. Since the thread has landed in here. So keep fooling and deceiving urself.

OK.

I want to appeal to the mods to make this thread open for all to make comments.

Salaam.

plappville:
You can only tag any terrorist a Christian only if you can prove that Jesus and his Apostles kill a soul.

There is nothing to prove. According to your mentality, Christian terrorists are practising Christianity better than moderates like you, and they have the bible to support them, simple and short.

Or instructed Christians to do so.

Please, there are many instances in the bible. If you want quotes, I can give them to you.

No Christian will/can kill for Jesus.

But the LRA, KKK, Army of God and others are doing it.

Muhammad and his army killed and they pass this command to be repeated in order to preserve Islam.

Your opinion, of no importance or relevance, at least, not in this case.

Stop twisting and tagging angry Atheists terrorists as Christians. Stop killing their loved ones, They will stop attacking you.

Seriously? I'm not surprised. I guess that's a Christian tactic. Show them the works of their brothers, and they blame it on atheism. Funny.

The only thing that really makes sense in your post is the verse you cited, and I will be dealing with it. But I know you don't want to be convinced. But I pray you are, In shaa Allah.

"And slay them wherever ye catch them.." [Noble Quran 2:191]
Let's read the verse in context.
"Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loves not transgressors. And kill them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out; for persecution and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, kill them. Such is the
reward of those who reject faith. But if they cease, God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God; but if they cease, let there be no hostility except to those who practice oppression. The prohibited month, for the prohibited month, and so for all things prohibited, there is the law of equality. If then any one transgresses the prohibition against you, transgress ye likewise against him. But fear (the punishment of) God, and know that God is with those who restrain themselves." [Noble Quran 2:190-194]
How many times do we see the above verse repeating the message to make it clear? These verses were revealed at a time when Muslims of Madinah were under constant attack from the Makkans. An example would be when the Makkans conducted the public crucifixion of the
companion of the Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), Khubaib bin Adi. These would be classified as 'terrorist activities'
according to the modern usage of the term. So what does this verse say in this context? "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you", "unless they (first) fight you there" - the context of this verse applies to those who initiate the attack against Muslims. And even after they attack, the verse makes it clear:

"But if they cease, God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful." [Noble Quran 2:192]
And it also makes clear the purpose for what Muslims fight:
"Fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God". [Noble Quran 2:193]
It is the duty of Muslims to defend humanity from oppression and persecution and to establish justice. Muslims believe that God has placed us here on earth as his deputy or viceroy, and thus, it is our duty to enjoin the good and forbid the evil, to establish peace and justice in the land.
Dr.Maher Hathout writes the following on verses 2:190-194:
These verses were applicable to a particular situation or if, hypothetically, the same situation was to be repeated... Historically, fighting back against the aggressors was prohibited during the thirteen years of the Meccan period. After the migration to Medina and the establishment of the Islamic state, Muslims were concerned with how to defend themselves against aggression from their enemies. The aforementioned verses were revealed to enable them to protect the newly formed state by fighting in self-defence against
those who fought them. However, the Quran clearly prohibits aggression. The verses explain that fighting is only for self-defence. Thus, a Muslim cannot commit aggression and kill innocent men, women, children, the sick, the elderly, monks, priests, or those who do not wish to fight. A Muslim is also mandated not to destroy plant life of livestock. (Hathout, Jihad vs. Terrorism; US Multimedia Vera International, 2002, p.49, emphasis added)
The historical context is something that must always be considered where developing an understanding of Quranic verses. Without
knowing the circumstances behind the revelation, one cannot apply the verse as accurately.
Sheikh Salman Al-Oadah writes about the general principles in Jihad:
Jihad can never be fought for worldly gain, for conquest, or even for revenge. Muslims must only fight to protect the lives, property, and freedoms of people, especially their freedom to worship Allah when that freedom is forcibly attacked.
They are never allowed to attack innocent people, even when they are themselves attacked by the countrymen of those innocents. Any people that go against this established principle of Islamic Law and murder civilians are fighting against Islam and everything that it stands for. It is ludicrous for them to call this fighting a Jihad, a
word that means striving in the cause of Islam. They are in fact murderers in the light of Islamic Law and should be treated as such.
There are strict and detailed laws in Islam, which Muslims must follow carefully. A military Jihad must be performed under these regulations.

Abdullah Yusuf Ali writes about verse 2:190:
War is only permissible in self-defence, and under well-defined limits. When undertaken, it must be pushed with vigour, but not relentlessly, but only to restore peace and freedom for the worship of
God. In any case strict limits must not be transgressed: women, children, old and infirm men should not be molested, nor trees and crops cut down, nor peace withheld when the enemy comes to terms. (Yusuf Ali, The Holy Quran, Text, Translation and Commentary)

He then re-iterates the general principles behind
Jihad in his commentary on verse 2:191: In general, it may be said that Islam is the religion of peace, goodwill, mutual understanding,
and good faith. But it will not acquiesce in wrong-doing, and its men will hold their lives cheap in defence of honour, justice, and the
religion which they hold sacred. Their ideal is that of heroic virtue combined with unselfish gentleness and tenderness, such as is exemplified in the life of the Apostle. They believe in courage,
obedience, discipline, duty, and a constant striving by all the means in their power, physical, moral, intellectual, and spiritual, for the establishment of truth and righteousness. (Yusuf Ali, The Holy
Quran, Text, Translation and Commentary)

This is the true focus behind Jihad, and Muslims must never lose this focus. Jihad is solely for the purpose of aiding humanity and bringing justice and freedom to the oppressed. Therefore, all actions must be in-line with this focus and the strict regulations governing Jihad. The focus is to defend, not destroy. One who focuses on the betterment and aid of humanity will realize that destruction will never achieve this.

PART 2

There is much talk these days about the allowance Islam gives to the existence of other religions in the world. Some of the opinion that Islam orders that Muslims fight the world until everyone becomes Muslim, creating ill feelings without actually knowing what the
religion actually says in this regard, much more the existence of non-Muslims within an Islamic country.
In terms of residence within Muslim society, non-Muslims are classified into three types. To understand these types will deepen one’s understanding of the relationship between Muslims and people of other faith in an Islamic society:

Classification of Non-Muslims
A. Permanent Residents
Muslim jurists use the term ‘ People of the Covenant ’ (Arabic ‘dhimmi’ or ‘Ahl ul- Dhimma’ ) to refer to non-Muslim residents. It is not a derogatory term, as some have made it seem. In Arabic language the word 'dhimma' means a treaty of protection for non-Muslims living in Muslim territory. A similar term, ‘Ahl ul-Dhimma’ , means ‘People of the Covenant ,’ because they are protected under the covenant extended to them by Prophet Muhammad and the Muslims. Non-Muslims are guaranteed protection in the Muslim society as long as they pay a head tax and abide by the specific legislations mentioned in Islamic Law. This covenant of protection is not limited to a specific duration; rather, stays in effect as long as those with whom the covenant is made abide by its conditions. The good intent behind the term ‘dhimmi’ can be seen in the letter written by the Caliph Abu Bakr as-Siddiq to the non-Muslims of Najran:

‘In the Name of God, the Beneficent, the Merciful. This is the written statement of God’s slave Abu Bakr, the successor of Muhammad, the Prophet and Messenger of God. He affirms for you the rights of a protected neighbor, in yourselves, your lands, your religious community, your wealth, retainers, and servants, those of you who are present or abroad, your bishops and monks, and monasteries, and all that you own, be it great or small. You shall not be deprived of any of it, and shall have full control over it…’

Another example is the statement of a famous classical scholar of Islam, Imam Awza’i in his letter to the Abbasid governor Salih b. ‘Ali b. Abdullah about the People of the Covenant,

"They are not slaves, so beware of changing their status after they have lived in freedom. They are free People of the Covenant."

Acknowledging this fact, Ron Landau wrote:
‘In contrast to the Christian Empire, which attempted to impose Christianity on its subjects, the Arabs extended recognition to religious minorities, and accepted their presence. Jews, Christians, and Zoroastrians were known to them as the People of the Covenant; in other words, the nations who enjoyed a protected status.’

B. Temporary Residents
This category includes two types:
1) The residents of non-Muslims countries who are at peace with Muslims through specific peace agreements, international treaties, or other mechanisms, who temporarily come to Muslim countries for work, education, business, diplomatic missions, and so forth. Muslim jurists refer to them in Arabic as mu’aahadoon, which means, "those with whom there is a pact".

2) The residents of non-Muslims countries with whom Muslims do not have a pact of peace, or who may be at war with Muslims, who temporarily come to Muslim countries for work, education, business, diplomatic missions, and so forth. Muslim jurists refer to them in Arabic as musta’minoon,
which means, "seekers of protection".

All classes have general rights common to them, and exclusive rights specific to each group. We will limit our discussion mostly to the most general, common rights to avoid excessive details.

The General Rights of Non-Muslims
The expression "human rights" is relatively new, having come into everyday usage only since World War II, the founding of the United Nations in 1945, and the adoption by the UN General Assembly of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights in 1948. Although its emergence in international law is a relatively recent development, the idea of human rights itself is not new. If one were to study and
compare the Universal Declaration of Human Rights to the human rights granted by Islam 1400 years ago, one can clearly see the level of high moral ground achieved by Islam before the Universal Declaration. This moral standard did not come as a result of human intellectual endeavor. The source of Islamic morality is
God. The divine standard provides true comprehensiveness and depth in human needs. It provides for everything that benefits the human race and shields it from any harm. Objective study is likely to conclude, ‘there is no religion or moral code on earth that has given more generous attention to faithfully affirming these rights than Islam, detailing them, clarifying them, and expressing them.’
The Shariah, which is the legal and moral code of Islam, does not confine itself to giving rights to Muslims only. One of its distinguishing features is that non-Muslim share many of these rights. As a matter of fact, the general principle is that non-Muslims have the same rights and obligations as Muslims. This aspect of religion is unique to Islam, and perhaps has not been attained by any other
world religion.
If we look at Christianity, for example, Professor Joseph Heath of the University of Toronto, says,
‘It should go without saying that you can scour the Bible and not find one single mention of "rights." You can also pick through the following 1500 years of Christian thought without finding any rights. That’s because the idea is entirely
absent.’
Non-Muslims have many rights in Islam. We will limit our discussion to the most important of them, such as the freedom of belief, right to work, housing, freedom of movement, and education.

PART 1.

By Imam Kamil Mufti (Originally by Dr. Saleh
al-Aayed )
Published on 03 Jul 2006
Last modified on 04 Jan 2015
Printed: 1962
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Introduction
Islam is a religion of mercy to all people, both Muslims and non-Muslims. The Prophet was described as being a mercy in the Quran due to the message he brought for humanity:

"And We have not sent you but as a mercy to all the worlds." (Quran 21:107)

When a person analyzes the legislations of Islam with an open mind, the Mercy mentioned in this verse will definitely become apparent. One of the aspects constituting an epitome of this Mercy is the way the legislations of Islam deal with people of other faiths. The tolerant attitude of Islam towards non-Muslims,
whether they be those residing in their own countries or within the Muslim lands, can be clearly seen through a study of history. This fact is not only purported by Muslims, but many non-Muslim historians also accept it.

Patriarch Ghaytho wrote:
‘The Arabs, to whom the Lord has given control over the world, treat us as you know; they are not the enemies of Christians. Indeed, they praise our
community, and treat our priests and saints with dignity, and offer aid to churches and monasteries.'

Will Durant wrote:
‘At the time of the Umayyad caliphate, the people of the covenant, Christians, Zoroastrians, Jews, and Sabians, all enjoyed degree of tolerance that we do not find even today in Christian countries. They were free to practice the rituals of their religion and their churches and temples were preserved. They enjoyed
autonomy in that they were subject to the religious laws of the scholars and judges.’

These just relations between Muslims and people of other faiths were not due to mere politics played by Muslim rulers, but rather they were a direct result of the teachings of the religion of Islam, one which preaches that people of other religions be free to practice their own faith, only accepting the guidance
offered by Islam by their own choice. God says in the Quran:

"There is no compulsion in religion…" (Quran 2:256)

Not only does Islam demand their freedom to practice religion, but also that they be treated justly as any other fellow human. Warning against any abuse of non-Muslims in an Islamic society, the Prophet stated:

"Beware! Whoever is cruel and hard on a non-Muslim minority, curtails their rights, burdens them with more than they can bear, or takes anything from them against their free will; I (Prophet Muhammad) will complain against the person on the Day of Judgment." (Abu Dawud)

How far is this mannerism than the majority of nations, to this day, which not only suppress the rights of foreign religions, but also foreign people and races! In a time when Muslims were being tortured to death in then pagan Mecca, Jews were being persecuted in Christian Europe, and various people were being subjugated due to their particular race or
caste, Islam called to the just treatment of all people and religions, due to its merciful tenets
which gave humanity the right to their
humanness.

plappville:
You Muslim's brothers who know the religion better than you carry out Allah's command. Stop defending a glaring truth.

Funny statement. You are right, I defend the truth, unlike terrorists, and amazingly, you, who distort and twist it, to make it appeal to your whims, desires and ideologies.
I made a simple statement, "show me where the Qur'an says to kill non Muslims, for no just reason". But you failed to do so, and have automatically labeled yourself a liar.
You come here, showing me some articles, which are of no relevance to the subject. Since they practice Islam more than me (according to you), that means that Christian terrorist groups like the Lords Resistance Army, Army of God, Ku Klux Klan, etc practice Christianity more than you, because they are following the teachings of the bible, which permit you to kill. Congratulations, your reasoning method just exposed you as a fake christian, until you start killing people like the LRA, or KKK does.

And this....

Didn't bother reading them, because they are irrelevant to the subject.

Note the dates...I can give you more and more of this kind of info all coming from Islamic states. Shame

I could also give you more info, coming from your terrorist christian brothers, which amazingly, the mainstream media conceals.

Salaam.

plappville:
There is nothing to see in the quran than kill the infidels anywhere you find them etc.

This statement is like a 2-edged sword. Show me the verses, and if I give the truth about them, and clear the misconceptions, you have automatically labeled yourself a biased liar. If you do not bring the verses, you have labeled yourself a lying coward. Or, you can withdraw your statement. The choice is yours.
Note; For every verse of the Quran you bring to show the so-called violence you claim, I will refute you, and give you two violent verses of your bible, most of wish you won't be able to refute, without making a fool of yourself. The choice is yours.

And also, Islam knows no peace stop deceiving yourself.

This statement can be translated to mean that Christianity does not know, never knew and can never know peace, because, while Islam allows fighting in self defense, the bible makes us to know that God (Jesus, peace be upon him), according to Christians commanded people to kill for things as meaningless as glory.

https://www.nairaland.com/3609375/paris-louvre-shooting-terror-attack

Seriously? I've told you before that anyone can make rules, what matters is making them count.
I can give you far worse atrocities carried out by Christians. But I guess you still wouldn't change, and see the truth, because you are being deceived by the mainstream media.

Salaam.

QUR'AN 3:85

This is even simpler to understand. Here's the translation of Qur'an 3:85
"And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers.” Quran 3:85

Will your parents or Family accept any other religion for you other than the one you are following?

Before explaining any further I want to ask you will your parents accept any other religion for you other than what you already are following? If they cannot accept then what is wrong if the God in Quran says the same?

The verse immediately preceding 3:85 builds bridges between Jews, Christians and Muslims like no other religion-

To know the context and meaning of verse 3:85, please read the verses BEFORE and AFTER it.

(3:82) Then whosoever shall turn away from this covenant they are the transgressors.

(3:83) Do they now seek a religion other than prescribed by Allah even though all that is in the heavens and the earth is in submission to Him – willing or unwillingly – and to Him all shall return?

(3:84) Say: We believe in Allah and what was revealed to us and what was revealed to Abraham and Ishmael and to Issac and Jacob and his descendants, and the teachings which Allah gave to Moses and Jesus and to other Prophets. We make no distinction between any of them and to Him do we submit.

(3:85) And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers.

The subject starts with Allah saying Why do you reject the signs of Allah even though you yourselves witness them? By “Allah” you should know that I am not talking about a specific god with specific power. He is the God of everything according to the Quran. If you are a believer in One supreme God, then it is this God I am talking about.

Say (to all people): “Call upon Allah, or call upon the Most Gracious: by whatever name ye call upon Him, [it is well]: for to Him belong the Most Beautiful Names.” Quran 17:110

“The most beautiful names belong to Allah: so call on him by them; but shun such men as use profanity in his names.” Quran 7:180

In the next verse i.e. 3:83 Allah i.e. God describes the basic principle characterizing the universe, Allah says, “Do they now seek a religion other than prescribed by Allah i.e. God even though all that is in the heavens and the earth is in submission?” in so far as the universe is in a state of total obedience and service to the Will of God, we say that it is in a state of Islam, the word “Islam” meaning “Submitting to the will of God in Peace”. Here people are asked if they would follow a way of life different from Islam though they are part of the universe which is characterized by submission to God (Islam).

Then in the next verse i.e. 3:84 the Muslims are told that it is not the habit of Muslims to selectively believe in few Prophets and reject others based on their whims. It is the Command of Allah to us to bear witness to the truth of every Messenger of God. By name the Quran takes the name of 6 Prophets in this verse – Abraham, Ishmael, Issaac, Jacob, Moses and Jesus, peace be on all of them, in this single verse. In this ONE verse the Quran builds a bridge of peace between 1.5 billion Muslims and 2 billion Christians and Jews of the world. Every Muslim has the utmost respect and reverence to the religious figures of these two major religions and does not require any Christian or Jew to tell it to him. These are verses of peace.

To my Christian and Brethren, If you are not satisfied then produce a verse from your scriptures in parallel to this which asks people to respect religious figures of Muslims when the Muslims have produced this regarding your figures!

Allah says that all prophets have been sent with same religion i.e. “Submission to him” which in Arabic is called as “Islam”. Hence he says what he says in 3:85 i.e. “And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers.”

There is no Compulsion in Religion according to the Quran –

“There shall be no compulsion in the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in false deities and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.” Quran 2:256

Allah says in the Quran that you are free to choose whatever you like as long as you are alive in this world. But once you die then you have no control over the flow of events that happen to you after your death unless you believe in the silly notion that you cease to exist after your death!

Once you die, your Creator is free to judge you in whichever way he feels fits. In the Quran he gives us valuable information about what to expect after death. And one of the things that you can expect is what verse 3:85 says, i.e

“And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers.” Quran 3:85

Dear brother, I urge you to look at these words and reflect, “and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers”. The hereafter is very real. If you are a believer in God and believe that he has created the earth and everything in it, then you should not have any problem in believing that God can create a place much better than this called “Heaven” for the good doers. Similarly you should have no problem in believing that he can create a place much worse than this called “Hell” for the wrong doers. Allah says

“What is the life of this world but amusement and play? but verily the Home in the Hereafter,- that is life indeed, if they but knew.” Quran 29:64

In our impatience and ignorance we hurry to gather the good things of this world, but Allah your Creator knows the truth and he says:

“…You desire the good of this world, but Allah desires (for you) the Hereafter. And Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise.” Quran 8:67

I hope this is clear. Please, tell me the next verse you wish, to be addressed, and In shaa Allah (If Allah wills), I'll address them, when I'm chanced.

Salaam.

QUR'AN 2:191

Critics as usual apply ‘cut and choose’ approach with regards to this passage (Quran 2:191). They only quote, “And kill them wherever you find them…(2:191). However, when we read the passage in its context (2:190-192) it says opposite what they portray of the verse.

Quran 2:190 – 192

2:190 Fight in the way of God those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. God does not like transgressors.
2:191 And kill them wherever you find them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah [Persecution] is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al- Haram until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers.
2:192 And if they cease, then indeed, God is Forgiving and Merciful.

It’s important whenever one reads a Quranic verse, to read it in its context. As you have read, critics only quote the part which suites them, they isolate previous verses and the ones after. When the passage is examined in context, it is clear that nowhere does it sanction the killing of innocent people. From verse 2:190 to 2:192, when read, Allah makes it evident to fight those only who fight them, fighting in self-defence.

Another thing some love to do with the verse is, change the Arabic word’s meaning. Example, the Arabic word ‘Fitna’ used in 2:191, they deceptively have translated the word as ‘disbelief’. So, when it’s read in that perspective, the passage is implying to fight to those who are disbelievers, just because of their religion. This again when we examine it, it will turn out to be a lie. The Arabic word ‘Fitnah’ means ‘persecution’, ‘corruption’, ‘sedition’. But when the word ‘Fitnah’ is used in verse 2:191, it means ‘persecution’.

Non-Muslim Translation

Arthur John Arberry

2:191 And slay them wherever you come upon them, and expel them from where they expelled you; persecution is more grievous than slaying. But fight them not by the Holy Mosque until they should fight you there; then, if they fight you, slay them — such is the recompense of unbelievers.
it means ‘persecution’.

So, I hope that is clear. In shaa Allah, when I'm free, I'll correct the others.

Salaam.

prince9851:
I want to learn brother
It could be dat we kristans are misunderstandin somtin here

You are right. There is a misunderstanding. I like the fact that you are willing to know the truth. So, I'll answer the verses one by one, whenever I'm chanced

prince9851:
I'm not sure
But I will nid an explanation from d Muslims here

I could give it to you, but you have to make your intentions known. Do you want to learn, and know the truth behind all this unfounded and false attributions to the Quran, or you want to follow the trends of people without knowledge, or even of they have knowledge, lack truth. Your answer will determine my response.

Salaam

alBHAGDADI:
You ended up saying nothing.

OK

We Christians don't hate you,

Wash

rather Muslims hate us.

Your opinion, doesn't matter, in this case.

The Quran even told you Muslims not to take CHRISTIANS for friends and even greet them.

Still your opinion, and still doesn't matter.

Since Christians don't believe in Allah, then it means they are among the unbelievers

True

Allah ordered Muslims to kill.

False

Now, who's the hater?

Still you, telling lies against the Qur'an.

You are right, he's second coming is for judgement. His judgement is to wage war on all his enemies which includes those that killed him, those that persecute his disciples and all those Muslims who chased away Christianity from North Africa, turkey, the middle east by killing them.

OK.

Ezekiel 30:6

Cush and Libya, Lydia and all Arabia, Kub and the people of the covenant land will fall by the sword along with Egypt.

OK.

Your Lord and master is Satan aka allah

Still your opinion, and still doesn't matter.

In the name of Allah, most Gracious, most Merciful.
I normally wouldn't dignify this kind of post with an answer, but I have some spare time, so, here goes.

alBHAGDADI:
Satan is not omnipresent, has never been and will never be.

How can be be omnipresent when he has been kicked out of heaven, which means his presence is not there?

Even on earth, where he has been permitted to rule for a period so that all creation can see how awful his rule is, he still doesn't have full control because of Christians. He currently has the atheists, Muslims, homosexuals and wicked people in his bag, but not all humans. That's enough reason to say he is not omnipresent cos his evil is not effective in some people.

OK

When the Antichrist comes, that man possessed by Satan himself, he will be fighting against a united mankind. His forces will be atheists, Muslims, gays etc. What do those people have I. common? They all hate Christianity.

I wonder what to call this, ignorance? Maybe.
From your write up, it seems you are the one whose heart is filled with hatred towards Islam. The only thing Islam has in common with those you mentioned is humanity, because we are all humans. If you say I hate you, while I don't, then it's obvious that you hate me, and want me to hate you, in order to give you something to hold on to. Just stop deceiving yourself.

Have you ever wondered why the countries Christ will be fighting against are Muslim countries e.g Libya (North Africa), Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Somalia, the Arab world etc?

Seriously? I thought you Christians say his second coming is for judgement, where righteous people will ascend with him to heaven. I never knew you believed that he would come and fight Muslims.

These are mentioned in the Bible but in their ancient names.

Please show me.

Muslims know this,

Is that so? Well, I don't know this, and have never come across it. Maybe you could show it to me.

that's why they have increased their level of persecution of Christians. Guess what? Atheists, Muslims, Gays etc are not complaining or cautioning them cos they know they serve the same master.

I know who my God, Lord, Master and Creator is, seems you don't know Him.

I would have love to go into full details but typing is quite difficult.

Salaam.

plappville:
Dont congratulate me for i never told you i discovered anything new.

Well, you are the one trying to show us "faults" in Islam aren't you, so, congrats.
Word of advise: If you applied even half of this method of critical evaluation to your bible, you'll definitely know that it can never be the truth, and if you applied even a little open-mindedness to the Quran, you'll see things, which hatred, bigotry and criticism prevented you from seeing.

By the way, what do you mean salaam?

It simply means peace, extracted from the Islamic greeting, Assalamualaikum, meaning, may peace be upon you.

Salaam.

plappville:
U are laughably and i will not take you serious if you continue to accuse me of calling Jesus God. No where in our conversation have i said that. You are just trying to divert the OP and i am not going to give you such room to do so. As usual, whenever Muhammad/all.ah is caught red handed of falsehood, all you do is raise up irrelevant issues from the bible to derail the OP. If i may say, You are the pitied fellow here. Its obvious allah failed no matter how hard you will try. Hajj has talking too many lives. Yet it was promised you to return back home safely after hajj.

OK. Congrats on your "discovery".

Salaam

plappville:
Hahaha, broke his leg and Muhammad healed him..hahaha. you will never stop making a bigger fool of Muhammed I thought He did performed Miracles like healing a Leprosy, raising the dead, etc. My grand mum used to heal broken legs. She was also a prophetess

OK

Muhammed was attended to because he was considered the most important person among them.

Still no evidence.

Besides, 3 years is too short to be proud of. He would have survived it.

Yet his companion died immediately. Be reasonable.

Hopeully, Aisha told us he died of the illness from the food poison.

OK.

Keep a blind eye as if you didnt see it.


Narrated ‘Aisha: Allah’s Apostle in his fatal illness said, ‘Allah cursed the Jews and the Christians, for they built the places of worship at the graves of their prophets.’ And if that had not been the case, then the Prophet’s grave would have been made prominent before the people. So (the Prophet ) was afraid, or the people were afraid that his grave might be taken as a place for worship.” — Sahih Bukhari 2.23.472

You are misquoting me. You said that Muhammad (peace be upon him) made those statements because he was poisoned, and I asked for evidence. From the above hadith, why he made those statements is mentioned. So, I don't know why you had to lie that it was because he was poisoned because it's obviously not.

The fatal illness is as a result of the food poison he ate. Can you deny that? See how wicked he is. Even at point of death he keep cursing people..

OK.

You got it already, Read text....

OK

You see, simply? I pity you. A man who called himself a prophet, who cannot see what is forth coming about him, neither hiu nor his apostles saw the food poison coming. They all where socked in sin that day abi?

Like I said before, anyone can make rules. What matters is making them count.
Again, let's apply your method of reasoning.
“For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom. “ (Matthew 16: 27, 28)

Examining this verse, from your reasoning point of view, it proves that Jesus (peace be upon him) can never be God, or part of God. Because, God knows everything, and keeps to his words. Because it is obvious from the above quoted verse of your bible, that Jesus (peace be upon him) made a statement which never came to pass, and can never come to pass because the time period for the execution of that promise/statement is gone.

So you see, I pity you. A man whom you call God who cannot see what is forth coming? Neither him nor his disciples saw that the statement was actually false. They were all soaked in sin that day abi?

Seriously? Again, your method of reasoning is astounding!

I dont think so

I SEE A FALSE PROPHET.

I see a man that can never be God.

A MAN WHO SUBMITEDHIMSELF TO BE USED BY SATAN TO DESTROY THE WORLD BY FULFILLING BIBLICAL PROPHESY.

A man who never ascribed Godly qualities to himself, yet, those qualities were and are ascribed to him by some people, and it became the doctrine of their descendants, to ascribe Godly qualities to him, even though he never for once said so.

One question i ask Christians is; "if Jesus (peace be upon him) came to preach trinity, why didn't he ever mention he was God? Was he trying to deceive people, or he was practicing Al taqiyya (concealing ones true intentions), which even Paul did.

t seems you do not understand it. It worth reposting it.

I understand my Prophet (peace be upon him and his words). You are the one who doesn't, or at least, you may, but decide to twist it. Your choice.

Salaam.

plappville:
Whats your problem with this verse?

What's your problem with the verse of the Quran you quoted?

Plz take note of the bold.
41 So they took away the stone. Then Jesus looked up and said, “Father, I thank you that you have heard me. 42 I knew that you always hear me, but I said this for the benefit of the people standing here, that they may believe that you sent me.”

Well, thank you for your quote. My point is made.
"Father, I thank you that you have heard me. 42 I knew that you always hear me".
You come here and give distorted and unfounded meanings to verses of the Qur'an to satisfy your whims and desires, yet, you fail to see the glaring truth in scripture. Typical behavior of a Christian. Biased interpretations.

Now show me where i said Jesus didnt prayed to God?

I never said you said that.

You said Jesus prayed to God to save him and God answer his prayer. But yet did not save Him.

I didn't say so, your bible did.

You lied.

In other words, your bible lied. I only copied and interpreted it, just like you copied and interpreted the Quran. Only difference is, while yours is false and unfounded, mine is actually correct, even confirmed by truthman. I don't know why you are denying it. You obviously do not know your bible.

Here is the verse again

Luke 22:42 ►
"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."


Is it difficult to understand this simple verse? If He had not said "Yet not my will, But yours be done" you would have been right. But He clearly says Gods will be done. And it was done perfectly.

Still doesn't change what's in the above verse.

Which even shows that His prayer was answered Because it was God's will that He should die.

This is not the question. The question is; did he pray to be saved, yes/no? Did God answer his prayer, yes or no? Was he saved, yes/no?

Scripture is so plaine on this! It is always the Will of God that is to be done. JESUS Even taught his disiples how to pray to God:

I wonder how you people reason. This again clearly shows that Jesus (peace be upon him) can never be God. If he was God, he would have commanded them to worship him. Yet, you say he is God. If so, then you worship 3 different beings, because your speech above shows that he made himself distinct and different from God.

Matthew 6:10 ►
your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.

Once more, thank you for exposing the falsehood of trinity.

As you can see, Jesus did not only taught his Disciples to pray to God “Your will be done” He modeled these very words in his own life and ministry and God does answered Him.

Yet again, you show the falsehood of trinity.

Its a lie and misleading to say God answered Him but yet couldn't save Him.

Apply that to your bible

You must be dreaming. Jesus a muslim yet didnt kill a soul?

That even makes him a Muslim.

The founder of Islam is a T..R...R...T

What does that mean? I would have said "totalitarian", but that doesn't fit.

He found islam roughly 600 yrs after Jesus.

Almost correct. You are right that the time was 600years, roughly, and that prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) came after prophet Jesus (peace be upon him). Every other thing is wrong.

You Muslims with ur alla.h submission issue.

Well, we have to submit to our Lord, Creator
of all that exists, don't we? I guess that's better than engaging in idol worship by saying God is 3-in-1, which is not even possible.

You wont stop tagging my Lord with ur moon g.od. Continue to deceive yourself,

OK.

We know The people who submit to allah.

In case you don't, amongst them are All the prophets of God (peace be upon them) including Jesus (peace be upon him) and Muhammad (peace be upon him) and other pious Muslims.

Go and look for someone else. I am not stupid to Discuss trinity with you.

Well, you just indirectly said that trinity is stupid. Thanks a lot.

Your tactic to divert the OP.

Typical excuse of a Christian, when he is cornered. CONGRATULATIONS!

Answer or you keep

Like I said before, my answer is in my first post on this topic. Go back and read.

Typical Muslim

الحمدالله

I have done that. Leave trinity out of this thread. All.ah failed or not? See hajj death list and answer

Go back and read.

See your hateful lies. E too pain you say i exposed all.ah for not able to keep to his promise of hajj.

OK.

Salaam.

Plappvillemoi:
Muhammad did not heal one person did he? Jesus and even his Apostles healed sick people. PlEase

I told you to do your research very well, but it seems like you don't like assignments.

Abdullah ibn Ateek broke his leg and Muhammad healed it by wiping his hand over it. Abdullah said it was as if nothing had happened to it! The person who witnessed the miracle was another companion, Bara’ ibn Azib[b] (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)

Al-Bayhaqi stated, in the Dalail (The Signs), “ Abu Sad al-Malini informed us quoting Abu Ahmed b. Adi, quoting Abu Yala, quoting Yahya al-Himmant, quoting Abd al-Aziz b. Sulayman b. al-
Ghasil, from Asim b. Umar b. Qatada, from his father, from his grandfather [b]Qatada b. al-Numan, that his eye was wounded at Badr and that its pupil came down on his cheekbone. They were about to slice it off, but asked the Messenger of God (SAAS) who said they should not do this. He then said a prayer for him, covering his cheek with his palm. And later you could not tell which of his eyes had been struck!”
According to one account, this became the better eye.
An account came down to us from the Commander of the Believers, Umar b. Abd al- Aziz that when he was told this account by Asim b. Umar b. Qatada, he also recited:
“I am the son of him on whose cheek his eye descended,
which was replaced so well by the hand of the Chosen-One .”

I have seen People who manage to stay 6 yrs after eating a poisoned food with good herbal treatment.

Please, show me your source.
Also, assuming what you said is true, the argument would still be meaningless because you must be aware that the other companion, Bishr died immediately hence, it could only take divine intervention for someone to survive that, and for that long.

The fact that he (Muhammad) was treated

Evidence?

is evidence for him to survive it gor few months.

Well, it was more that that.

But we still see how he cried and keep cursing the Jews [b]because of the poison[b].

Evidence for the phrase in bold?

If He had knew he wouldn't have eaten the food that led to his death.

He simply accepted a gift presented to him.

JUBRIL didnt give him revelations the night before the poison event took place.

Ok.

Use your sense.

Already using it.

Glance through this story you will see what i see.

From what you've been writing, it's obvious you see nothing, at least, nothing that makes sense.

‘A’isha and Abdullah reported: As the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) was about to breathe his last, he drew his sheet upon his face and when he felt uneasy, he uncovered his face and said in that very state: Let there be curse upon the Jews and the Christians that they have taken the graves of their apostles as places of worship. He in fact warned (his men) against what they (the Jews and the Christians) did.” — Sahih Muslim 1082

“Narrated ‘Aisha: Allah’s Apostle in his fatal illness said, ‘Allah cursed the Jews and the Christians, for they built the places of worship at the graves of their prophets.’ And if that had not been the case, then the Prophet’s grave would have been made prominent before the people. So (the Prophet ) was afraid, or the people were afraid that his grave might be taken as a place for worship.” — Sahih Bukhari 2.23.472

I already know this, so why'd you quote it?

Plappvillemoi:
You did not give any answer to the OP. STill waiting for one.

Go back and read.

You are still missing the message of the bible annoucing the coming of the Messiah right from the OT to the NT.
Yahwen told his people about the Birth of the Messiah and how He will die. Everything was fulfilled perfectly. Even the apostles of Jesus confirmed this

.
Go and read John 11:41-42

Why would you say Yahwen failed when He did not?

Seems like you've got problems of double standards.

All.ah promised you Muslims will return home after the hajj. Yet we see thousands of Muslims die almost each hajj, you are trying to twist the Glaring truth showing that alla.h has actually failed.

Again, go back and read.

You are been biased by saying Yahwen answered Jesus's Prayer.

Go and read John 11:41-42

Jesus told Yahwen if it be His will.

OK.

Of course it was Yahwen's will for Jesus to be killed.

What a God!

He already said it in the OT. The Scripture says Jesus was willing to submit to the will of His Father. See John 18 Jesus allowed the soldiers to bind him and lead him away.

Now you are confirming that Jesus (peace be upon him) was a Muslim, I.e, he submitted to God. This shows that your trinitarian doctrine is false, because God doesn't submit to himself (if you say they are one), unless you agree that you actually worship 3 different beings as gods, and Jesus (peace be upon him, according to you), being the lesser god, submitted to the higher one. Your choice.

He never was praying against the will of God never!

But he prayed to be saved from crucifixion, and wasn't.

If killing of innocent people to you is perfection then you need to see the doctor.

OK
#DOUBLESTANDARDS

Isla.m/all.ah is killing innocent people and even his own people. You call that perfect?

Please show me.
Also, go and read your bible for the atrocities of Yahweh, AKA Jesus (peace be upon him, according to you), via trinity.

Pathetic

Ok

Mind you, so much lies in your previous post that was why i cancelled it.

Point them out if you are truthful.

Salaam.

truthmans2012:
The sum total of your post.is that Muhammad knew allaah's revelations better than Jubril who brought them. How reasonable? Hummmm !!!

We are told in islam that Jubril was coming to rehearse the quran with Muhammad to avoid him making mistakes, but you are here saying Jubril didn't know the meaning of the message he was carrying. How reasonable?

Seems like you are not getting me. I said that Allah gives knowledge of what He wills to whom He wills. Therefore, it was possible that Jibrail did not know the meanings of some of the Revelations, whereas Allah (Glorified and Exalted is He) gave Muhammad (peace be upon him) the capacity to understand them, as shown in the garden, when Adam named that which the Angels couldn't. This doesn't mean that the Angels didn't have knowledge of anything at all.

Also, if you've been following my posts, I gave 2 conditions; assuming that he (Jibrail) knew, and assuming that he didn't. So, either way, you've been answered.

You are yet to say anything about why Muhammad wasn't praying for anyone for healing,

Like I said, do your research very well.

not even for his jihadists who were dying of poison.

OK.

For your information, there were many prophecies about Jesus coming and dying.

OK. But he prayed, his prayer was answered, yet he was betrayed.

God of the Bible does not change his prophecies like Allah.was changing his revelations calling the change the better ones (Quran 2:106).

Sorry to burst your bubble, here's your quote:
"Such of Our revelations as We abrogated or cause to be forgotten, We bring (in place) better or the like thereof. Knowest thou not that Allah is Able to do all things?" (Qur'an 2:106)
First, you should go and check your dictionary for the meaning of "abrogation".
Second, show me a single prophesy in the Quran that has been abrogated.
Please, make arguments that count, not baseless claims.

Salaam.

truthmans2012:
Muhammad could not heal anyone, Gabriel could not heal anyone,

Except by Allah's permission.

Allah could not heal anyone, even his jihadists who ate poison,

Yet he (Muhammad, peace be upon him) lived for 3-4yrs after eating the poison, whereas the other companion, Bishr died immediately. THAT CAN ONLY HAPPEN BY DIVINE INTERVENTION

but they could take lives, na wa o !!!

OK.

You should believe now that allaah is not God.

OK.

God cannot be that weak.

You are right, just like Yahweh promised Jesus (answered his prayers) to save him from crucifixion but failed. So, you should realize now that Yahweh is not God, God cannot be that weak.
What is the point of the above statement? To show you that anyone can make rules also.

You know what, I haven't heard of Muhammad praying for anybody as a prophet,

Please do your research very well.

not even for his jihadists who ate poison.

OK.

Did the jihadists also choose to go to heaven?

If you've been following, you'll realize that it's only a privilege accorded to Messengers of God.

This is not credible.

That's your business.

Firstly, the speaker in that hadith was not in a position to know that Allah had informed Muhammad of his death, even Jubril as an angel didn't know.

That's like saying that Adam was not in a position to know the names of what was asked by God, because the Angels were not aware.

Secondly, Muhammad was said to be receiving messages from Jubril and not directly from allah. Then, from who did Muhammad receive the message of his death when Jubril didn't know?

From my previous post, the message was in form of a verse, therefore, it is possible that Jibrail conveyed the verse, not knowing the meaning, because Allah had not given him knowledge of it.

If Jubril had known Muhammad was going to die, he would not pray for him and promise allah would heal him.

From the above, it's obvious that he couldn't have known.
But, let's assume for a second that he did, that doesn't change anything. Drawing a similitude on a lower level, it's like saying that because the doctor has confirmed that your mother will die, and your mother has knowledge of it, then you shouldn't pray for her and even assure her that she will be well, or healed.

“This must be false.

Again, that's your business

How did Muhammad know "Allah has given a slave the choice between immortality in this world for as long as Allah wills, or meeting his Lord, and he has chosen to meet his Lord.” [Mishkat al-Masabih, 2/546]" when Jubril didn't tell him so? Did he have other sources of revelations other than Jubril?

Allah gives his servant knowledge of whatever He wills. Your statement is like asking how Adam knew the names of what was presented before him, when he wasn't told by an Angel. Like I said, Allah informs his servant of whatever he wills.
But even if Jibrail was the one Allah sent to give Muhammad (peace be upon him) the message, it still doesn't change anything, because, like I said, he (Jibrail) conveying the message doesn't mean he understands the meaning of it.
Again, drawing a similitude on a much lower level, it's just like you being sent on an errand, to pass and envelope to someone. You do not know what it contains, but the sender and receiver most definitely have knowledge of it.

Salaam.

.

plappville:
Check my signature. ..

Stop diverting. Allah said you will return back home after the hajj. Yet history shows there have been numerous stampedes and other deadly incidents during hajj since 1975, thousands of pilgrims have lost their lives when they were supposed to return back home safely according to all.ah.

I'm not going to waste time repeating myself because it seems like you don't read. I already gave an answer, go back to the post you canceled, my answer is on the first paragraph. After reading that, then answer my question which comes in the second paragraph, if you are truthful.

You are here ranting, spewing garbage thinking you are making sense.

OK

Again, Did alla.h failed or not?

If you read my post, you will know that you should be asking yourself if Yahweh failed or not.
But I guess you are not here to seek truth, just to throw baseless accusations in a desperate attempt to fault Islam, which mind you, is perfect.

Salaam.

truthmans2012:
If Gabriel is not Allah and therefore his word or promise should not be taken seriously, it means the quran he brought is not credible.

I most definitely said that Jibrail is not Allah, because he is not, but I never said his words shouldn't be taken seriously. Rather, what I implied is that Angel Jibrail (peace be upon him) can not heal anyone. He can certainly pray as he did, but it is ultimately Allah Almighty that decides what takes place and what not.

Was Gabrie not aware as an angel that Muhammad chose heaven before praying for his healing and still promised Allah would heal him?

Volume 005, Book 059, Hadith Number 713.
Narrated By Ibn Abbas : 'Umar bin Al-Khattab used to let Ibn Abbas sit beside him, so 'AbdurRahman bin 'Auf said to 'Umar, "We have sons similar to him." 'Umar replied, "(I respect him) because of his status that you know." 'Umar then asked Ibn 'Abbas about the meaning of this Holy Verse: "When comes the help of Allah and the conquest of Mecca..." (110.1)
Ibn 'Abbas replied, "That indicated the death of Allah's Apostle which Allah informed him of." 'Umar said, "I do not understand of it except what you understand."
This means that the prophet of Allah (peace be upon him) was informed of his death, but whether Angel Jibrail knew or not, I do not know. But one thing that is certain is that the Angels do not know, except what Allah has permitted them to know, as shown in the garden when Adam named that which the Angels couldn't name.

Where did he say he chose heaven?

“Allah has given a slave the choice between immortality in this world for as long as Allah wills, or meeting his Lord, and he has chosen to meet his Lord.” [Mishkat al-Masabih, 2/546]
This is what he said at the end of his life. Abu Bakr wept, and the people were surprised that Abu Bakr wept at these words. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was the one who was given the choice, and Abu Bakr knew the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) better than any of the people.

annunaki2:
You must really think we are as daft and stoopid as yourself.

Ok.
Salaam.

truthmans2012:
But when Muhammad was dying, Gabriel prayed for him and promised allaah would heal him, which was not fulfilled.

Well, Jibrail is not God. Besides, if the Prophet of Allah (peace be upon him) had chosen to live for more years, when he was asked to choose between this life and the next, he would be healed, but he chose heaven.

Again, the quran you call a miracle was recited on him but no miracle happened, he died eventually.

OK.