₦airaland Forum

chikweezy:
Lol...talking about saints whise bodies wia destroyed, remember we are spirit beings, and so their body will surely decay, however, their spirit sleeps and will resurrect in the fulness of time to either everlasting life or death.
Mind u, Elijah did not die, he was caught up by chariots of fire, and nobody knows d whereabouts of moses body as there is no record to say that moses died and was buried (so God took him). Therefore, they will not pass as perfect examples of pple who died. Broda, just look at it this way - there is going to be a white throne judgement were every1 will be judged both dead and alive. This is were the dead earlier mentioned will now resurrect for dia judgement. The Bible records dat "the waters will give up the dead in them,...even death and hell will do the same" meaning evry who has died will now rise to face judgement. They can't be in hell suffering, den after come for white throne judgement and after dat, suffering continues in fire. talk of a temporary place of torment is not biblical.

We all know there will be a white throne judgement. But base your findings on scriptures. What about this?

"But ye are come unto ... the heavenly Jerusalem ... to the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the SPIRITS of just men made perfect." (Hebrews 12:23-24) This clearly tells us that when believers die, their spirits go to heaven immediately.

1 Thessalonians 4:14 tells us that the spirits of believers who have died, are waiting in heaven until the day when Jesus Christ will bring their spirits and souls with Him at the second coming in the air to be rejoined with their resurrected bodies. "... them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him." Their dead bodies, buried in the grave will be resurrected to rejoin their spirits and souls which Christ will bring with Him from heaven. Christ bringing their spirits and souls, shows that they are with Christ in heaven after death awaiting the resurrection.

After the rapture (catching away of believers to heaven) many people get saved in the seven year tribulation. Many of these are killed by the Antichrist. Do their souls go to soul-sleep in the grave? No! Their souls are seen under the altar in heaven: "I saw under the altar the SOULS of them that were slain for the word of God ... they cried with a loud voice, saying ..." (Revelation 6:9-10)

These souls of dead believers are in heaven. They can cry out with a loud voice. They have memory of their death on earth, crying for revenge. They are not unconscious or soul-sleeping in the grave.

dolphinheart:
An expression of what! . Is it an expression of what he knows or what he feels. He made a statement , is that statement true or false. There is nothing like neither in determining if a statement is true or false

All spirits belong to God. Why? He is known as the Father of spirits.

All spirits will one day stand before God. But not all will spend eternity with Him.

So in an expression, there is fact but not to be taking literally like the examples I gave you.

So it is not an issue of whether it is true or not. But on the point being passed across.

But if you believe all spirits go back to God in heaven then you contradict the scriptures.

dolphinheart:
Pls can you answer my questions, then ask urs !. When he was expressing his emotions was he telling us truth or was he telling us lies.

Neither.

It was an expression.

When God said, " I will whet my sword and exact vengeance...." Deut 32:41. Well did he actually use a sword there?

Was it a lie or truth? Or an expression?.

dolphinheart:
So the writer of ecclestiatis was lying ? As in he is not saying the truth?

He was Expressing his emotions and thoughts just like when he said:

"Money answereth all things...."

Well, was he lying or saying the Truth?.

Poverty turns people to uncivilised creatures.

Jozzy4:
Another error :

If ADAM is a spirit that means he return to God when he dies , " and the spirit returns to God" Ecc 12:7 ?

That means everyone , either good or bad returns to God in heaven . Then Everyone is saved .

There is no error anywhere.

The book of Ecclesiastics is also know as a book of Perspective. What does that mean? life as viewed from the one speaking.

You need to understand that not everyone that said something in the bible spoke from God. But in their own limited understanding.

That is why Paul advised us to learn to rightly divide the word of truth.

Example. Not everything in the book of Job is considered to be Truth. When job blamed God for his problems he faced. He wasn't right with that accusation because all the while it was the devil.

Now because that statement was recorded doesn't mean it was Truth.

And BTW, u Can't take everything literally. When David said one time God was angry and smoke came out of His nostrils, did that really happen or was it just an expression?

What you said up there is an expression as given by the writer of Eccl.

Jozzy4:
Bro , God said Adam is dust , " for dust you are" , you are saying another thing ; who should I belive ?

" and the LORD God proceed to FORM THE MAN OUT OF DUST" . Gen 2:7

The man himself is what ? Dust .

The only thing that was given to him was breath of life in his NOSTRILS . probably this what you call spirit .

Yup.
The scripture says “and man became a living soul after God breath into him the breath of life”. The Hebrew bible or the original rendering of that passage in the Hebrew language says, “And man became a speaking spirit like God”.

You can research it out yourself.

Also,
The name Man is derived from a word meaning "to be red," and thus the first man was called Adam because he was formed from the red earth.

What makes man man is because of flesh. The spirit is not man but sprit. The Lord in eternity was not man but only God but when He came and put on flesh, He was known as the Son Of Man. Why?

Because he put on flesh (dust). So dust goes to dust and spirit to spirit.

Jozzy4:
Forget the Rabbis bro ; God said : " .. YOU return to the ground , for dust YOU are and to dust YOU shall return" , who is the " YOU " ? Adam himself or an ordinary flesh .

Why dont you read all that passage in its context. It says:

"For dust you are and dust you shall return" Adam was not all dust. But Spirit Soul and Body(dust). So dust returns to dust but where does the spirit go?.

His spirit is not made up of dust or is it?.

chikweezy:
Talking about a temporary place of torment applies to does who died before the fulfilment of Christ on earth, and not dose who died after him. They only are in a state of nothingness and await the white throne judgement.

So you mean that Moses and Elijah that appeared on mount of transfiguration to Jesus after Jesus died and rose, left Abraham's Bosom and back into their bodies in the grave to go to sleep?

What of saint's bodies that were never buried but totally destroyed in fire or even a bomb. Where do their souls sleep?

Why will there still be people in hell but the saints will be having a soul sleep with no consciousness.

If the saints are soul sleeping why will Paul say in Phil 1: 23 "But if I am to live on in the flesh, this will mean fruitful labor for me; and I do not know which to choose. But I am hard-pressed from both directions, having the desire to depart and be with Christ, for that is very much better; yet to remain on in the flesh is more necessary for your sake.…"?

Why will he even consider departing to be with Christ even if he know he won't see Christ immediately but soul sleep for millenniums before he one day sees Christ? Why don't he just desire to stay longer on the earth, since you know he won't still see Christ anyway?

Jesus used the term sleep for even his friend Lazarus that died before He went to the cross. And you've already agreed that ppl that died before the cross were in Sheol or Abraham's Bosom.

So because you see sleep, does not mean they are unconscious.

Jozzy4:
God said Adam will return to dust , is he lying or what ?

Humans were not created to die at first. But sin came and brought all kinds of death. Even physical death. So yes his physical flesh did return to dust. (Rabbis tell us from historical account that the devil had to train Adam and Eve on how to die, Adam after being sent from the garden was depressed and tried to kill himself many time but God would not allow)

But his flesh is diff from his soul and spirit.

Have you asked yourself why ppl in the old lived much longer than ppl of now.

Even scientists have said that they discovered that the human body is fashioned in a way that it is not supposed to die. That is why at the end we will still receive a new body but a more glorious one. Because us living in the flesh was God's original purpose for man. We need the flesh to live on the earth. And at the end the will be a new earth. We can't live on earth on the spirit.

That's why God said "Behold I make everything new" Because His original plan was thwarted.

It's a very complicated teaching my guy. I no too get time write all this tins down.

gatiano:
The sizes of some of those stars up there are much larger than our sun and solar system. It won't make sense for them to fall, one would be enough.

Those stars are thousands and millions of light years away. Know for a fact that our sun/solar system is not stagnant, it is moving at more than 66,000 miles/hour, other stars have the same speed, they won't catchup with us except only they revolve around us and we around them.

Nobody stated that the falling stars are going to cause any harm or damages. They are mainly a sign

There are more than 1800 satellites up in space, plus hundreds of thousands more junks. When they penetrate the earth atmosphere, the friction makes them light up and burst into fire.

The earth would not obey most laws that we are used to. like atmospheric pressure, nitrogen level in the atmosphere, etc.

They are just signs of the end of a world, Not The world.

But I hope you do know that from scriptures Stars are mostly used to represent angels right?

Jozzy4:
Lol , Official name
Where did you get all this unscriptural details?

Why don't you just work on having a more intimate relationship with the Lord and leave things that will not really help you alone.

If you want answers to your question go and do a deep research on the Greek and Hebrew original texts.

CaptainJune:
I liked your post. You are very knowledgeable, my friend. My aim of visiting this thread was to feed my eyes and keep my comment to myself until I saw your comment. Very nice.

There is more to say about this subject but I'm in no mood for argument. Besides, Op has already made up his mind about the possible place Adam is spending his eternity. Seeing that, why waste my comment?

Anyway, it's nice to know you know what many don't know, and don't want to know.

Tanx.

Yea. That's the problem with people they've made up their minds not to learn anything. They just want to live with assumptions.

malvisguy212:
Good you are a born again christian.
If evil must not exist, can man have the option to love God or reject Him ? Don't you think, without evil everyone will be like 'YES MAN' to God ? The bible say trial help our faith to grow, without evil there won't be trial.

Freewill doesn't just have to do with either loving God or rejecting Him.

It is also applied in instances when God decides to do something and you say something else and God changes His mind. That's the difference BTW Humans and the Angels.

Examples: Moses changing God's mind on destroying Israel, Hezekiah telling God to extend his life span, Adam naming the animals whatever he likes(remember man had not yet sinned here), Ezekiel or so changing the Lord's mind on causing a disaster and also NT saints choosing either to live in God's permissive will or not.

So it's not yes every time. But the difference in heaven is that we all are perfected and understand God more and know and can trust His wisdom and love. So instead we choose to follow Him in love.

God will not force anyone to do anything in the time to come. All will be motivated by genuine love for Him because we can see His face.

And besides that, when you physically see God in His Holiness and Love, you will be overcome with the desire to do what He tells you to. E.g Is 6 When Isaiah saw the Lord on His throne and He was overcome with awe, the Lord said "whom shall I send "Isaiah said I am I, send me"

You see for God to ask Him that question that tells you Isaiah had a choice but because Isaiah was overcome with awe and love for him, he said yes. This should give you a glimpse of what heaven is like.

@OP I love your honesty.

I have been in the presence of God before and I can say that all the pleasures in this world combined together is not worthy to be compared the the least joy or pleasure you can experience in His presence.

I mean you can just sit on His lap for all eternity and never get bored

malvisguy212:
good, God purpose of creating us is for us to chose to worship him or reject him, so evil must exist. Are you a christian ?

I am born again, Spirit filled, tongue talking, demon chasing, divine healing, prosperous christian.

Evil must not exist. It didn't have to.There wont be evil in the world to come. But we will still have our free-wills.

Jozzy4:
A literal Abraham Bossom . Nice .

How could Abel and Noah go to the bossom of Abraham who is not yet born ?

It's official name is Sheol Mr Man. And also originally know as paradise.

But later called Abraham's Bosom because he is the Father of faith. And Abraham was declared by God "the possessor of heaven and earth". It was an inheritance. Heb 7:6, Gen 14:19, Rom 4:13- "Clearly, God's promise to give the whole earth to Abraham and his descendants was based not on his obedience to God's law, but on a right relationship with God that comes by faith."

And all who followed in the footsteps of faith as believing Abraham before Jesus went there.

malvisguy212:
do you have freewill ? Explained to me, freewill without evil. How can it work ? What is partial freewill ? God purpose of creating human is 'worship' how can you worship God without freewill ?

Of course we have a freewill, that is why there is even evil in the world. Because we abuse it.

And there is no such thing as partial freewill.

Jozzy4:
Which scripture ? Do you agree with the same scripture others had post on this thread which says ADAM RETURN TO DUST ! ? DO YOU ?



Scripture that said sheol is divided into two ?



Come again ! You mean Abraham Bossom MEANS place of comfort and not a literal Abraham bossom? So are you nw telling us the story is a parable ? Coz you are not taking it literally , rather you are giving it different meanings .

I don't know what you said.

But know, that story was not a parable but real.

Abraham's bosom does not mean anything. The place was of comfort.

Scripture : refer to the parable.

Abraham talked of Moses and some prophets being on the earth at that time. And that ppl should listen to them.

They were all in Sheol. Abraham and Lazarus in the place of comfort and the rich man in place of torment. The two were separated by a huge gulf. So that no one could pass from one to the other.

When Jesus died, He went down to hell. And before He did, He told one of the theives on the cross that today you will be with Me in paradise. Paradise was also know as Abraham's bosom.

malvisguy212:
God has created everything that
ever has been, is, or will be (John 1:3).
This includes physical beings and matter as well as spiritual beings ( Colossians 1:15–17). The only person who has the power of being in and of Himself meaning He has no beginning or ending and is self-existent is God ( Exodus3:14).

How can God create something that is against His will and still fight it and be angry with it.

BTW, God created Lucifer and not Satan.

Satan means an adversary. Something that goes against the will of God.

That was why Jesus called Peter Satan at one time. Not becausehe was possessed but because he was against God's will of seeing Jesus go to the cross.

God did not create evil or the devil or Satan. Those are forces that go against God's nature.

I know some will say there is a scripture that says "God formed good and evil.." But it has been agreed by theologians and scholars that it was a !is interpretation of the original language.

God permits evil but does not create evil?. He permits it because we humans that He gave frewill to permits it.

James said "let no man say that that when he is tempted, that he is tempted of God"

And again "all good and perfect gift comes from above and the Father of light..."

malvisguy212:
God.

You don't even know how to debate the scriptures.

Can you show us scripture where it says God created Satan?

You err in interpreting the scriptures.

"Heaven helps those who help themselves"

"God knows my heart..." When busy committing sin. Yes He does know your heart alright.

"Thinking that because you just said some 'repentance' prayer on your death bed.. When all this while you've been knowingly practising sin will get you to heaven"

Repentance is from the heart and not just mouthing words.

Enlighten yourselves and stop being ignorant.

chikweezy:
They go nowhere bro..in fact in Jesus words, "they are asleep"...except u disagree with 1 thess 4 vs 10 - 17 were the bible urges us not to cry for dose who died in christ as they are just asleep, it also tells us in vs 16 dat the "dead in Christ shall rise first" den dose still alive will follow to reign with the Lord forever.

Your questions are answered here. Don't base your belief on assumptions.
https://www.nairaland.com/2544404/difference-between-hell-sheol-paradise

PRACTICAL APPLICATION FOR TODAY

A proper understanding of what the Bible teaches about Hell, Sheol, Hades, and the Grave dispels confusion over what happens to the soul at the time of physical death and guards against being led astray by those teaching the false doctrines of soul-sleep, eradication of the soul, the universal reconciliation of mankind, and the annihilation of the lost. All of these erroneous doctrines are of Satan, used of him to dishearten believers and blind the lost to the reality of the cost of spurning the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Our thinking, and therefore our life on a day-to-day basis, is influenced by what we believe. While some of the false doctrines mentioned above are diametrically opposed to each other, they still have one thing in common. They subvert the truth of the immortality of the soul.


Source:https://www.bereanbiblesociety.org/hell-sheol-hades-paradise-and-the-grave/

THE GRAVE

We have already looked at the word queber, the most common word for grave, or a burial place, in the Old Testament, and have shown that it is not the same as Sheol. As previously stated, of the sixty-four times it is used it is rendered “grave” thirty-four times, “sepulcher” twenty-six times, and “burying place” four times. Two other words that are used for a burial place in the Old Testament are Shah-ghath and Qeburah.

Shah-ghath: This word is translated “grave” once (Job 33:22). It is rendered “ditch” twice, “destruction” twice, “corruption” four times, and “pit” thirteen times. This word speaks of something that man can dig (Ps. 94:13; Prov. 26:27) and is used in reference to a hole into which a man can fall (Ps. 7:15; Prov. 26:27), and a hole used as a trap (Ps. 35:7). It is a place where the physical body suffers destruction through the corruption of decay (Ps. 16:10; 49:9; 55:23). The basic meaning is that of a hole of some kind that man digs for a particular purpose. Generally, it is used of a burial place, i.e., a grave.

Qeburah: This word is related to queber and means a grave or burial place. It is used of various types of graves and is found fourteen times and is translated “grave” four times, “sepulcher” five times, “burial” four times, and “burying place” one time.

In the New Testament we find three more words that refer to the grave, taphos, mnema, and mnemeion.

Taphos is used seven times and is translated “sepulcher” six of those and “tomb” once.

Mnema is used seven times, being rendered “tomb” twice, “grave” once, and “sepulcher” four times.

Mnemeion is the most common word for grave in the New Testament. It is used forty-two times, five times as “tomb,” twenty-nine times as “sepulcher,” and eight times as “grave.”

The grave is a place where the physical remains of those who have died are deposited. It can be a hole in the ground, a cave, or a specially prepared vault or other place used for interment. The soul and spirit having departed the body at death, there is no consciousness of life in the grave. It is a place of corruption that serves to point out man’s need of a Savior. The soul of man lives on after physical death and will always remain in a conscious state of being. The unsaved go to Sheol/Hades to await their resurrection unto condemnation while the redeemed go to heaven to await their resurrection unto life (see Jn. 5:25-29).

TARTARUS

The Apostle Peter used the word Tartarus in reference to “the angels that sinned” that God delivered to Sheol/Hades to await judgment (II Pet. 2:4). This word, which is translated “hell” in the KJV, was used in Greek mythology to refer to the place of punishment for the most wicked. It is not clear if Peter was using this word in reference to Sheol/Hades in a general way or if he was referring to a specific compartment of Sheol/Hades where a certain class of fallen angels are confined awaiting final judgment. Either way, this passage teaches that there is a place of confinement in which a particular group of beings are being held until the time of their judgment. This is consistent with the overall Biblical teaching about the existence and purpose of Sheol/Hades.

PARADISE

While Paradise is not now a part of Sheol/Hades it will be mentioned here because it was located in Sheol/Hades at one time. Before the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ everybody who died went to Sheol/Hades, which was at that time divided into at least two compartments. One was a place of torment while the other was a place of blessing, which was referred to as Abraham’s Bosom (Lk. 16:22-25). As we mentioned before, Tartarus may be a specific place in Sheol/Hades.

We know that Jesus Christ went “into the lower parts of the earth” (Eph. 4:9), that is to Sheol/Hades, “in the heart of the earth,” for three days and nights while his body was in the grave (Mat. 12:40). The Lord Jesus told the repentant thief that he would join Him in Paradise that same day (Lk. 23:42,43). This tells us that Paradise was located in Sheol/Hades at that time. We believe that this was the same place referred to as Abraham’s Bosom in Luke 16. However, after Jesus Christ rose from the dead He ascended to the Father, taking the saints who were in Abraham’s Bosom to heaven with Him. Thus, He took “captivity captive” (see Eph. 4:8-10).

That Paradise was moved to heaven is confirmed to us by the Apostle Paul who speaks of a man who was “caught up into Paradise” where he “heard unspeakable words” (II Cor. 12:3,4). With Jesus Christ’s work complete, the believers who had been confined to Sheol/Hades were now taken to Heaven to wait in God’s presence until the time of their resurrection to enter His Kingdom on Earth. Since that time, at death all believers go to Paradise in Heaven to await the time of their resurrection. This is true whether they belong to the Kingdom Church of the future or the Body of Christ Church of the present Dispensation of Grace.

EXAMPLES SHOWING THAT SHEOL IS NOT A BURIAL PLACE

1. After selling Joseph into slavery, his brothers stained his coat with blood and used it to convince their father that he had been killed by a wild animal (Gen. 37:26-36). Jacob’s sons and daughters tried “to comfort him; but he refused to be comforted; and he said, `for I will go down into the grave (Sheol) unto my son mourning’. Thus his father wept for him” (v. 35).

From Jacob’s words it is clear that he fully intended to eventually be reunited with his son in a tangible way. Obviously then, he did not simply have in mind the idea of joining him in burial as he believed that Joseph’s body had not been buried at all, but was eaten by an animal (v. 33). This being the case, it was impossible for Jacob to think he would join Joseph in burial. Obviously, he looked forward to being reunited with him in the place of the departed dead, not in burial. The word rendered grave in this passage is Sheol, the abode of the souls of those who have died.

2. After Jacob died, Joseph had his body mummified, a process that took forty days, then took him back to Canaan for burial (Gen. 50:1-14). When we add to that the thirty days of mourning (Gen. 50:2-4), and the time it took to travel to Canaan for the funeral (Gen. 50:5-13), we see that it was several weeks after Jacob was “gathered unto his people” (Gen. 49:33) before his body was placed in the cave that served as his burial place. Considering that he had been dead for well over two months before his body was buried and that the Scriptures state that at the time he died he was “gathered to his people” (Gen. 49:33) is telling. This shows that at the time of physical death, when “he yielded up the spirit,” his soul immediately departed his body to be with Isaac and Abraham. This cannot be a reference to his body being gathered together with their bodies, as that did not take place for over ten weeks. This is strong proof that Sheol does not mean a burial place for the body, but is the place where the souls of the departed reside.

3. That communication takes place in Sheol/Hades tells us that something other than a burial place is in view. In Isaiah 14:4-20, we find the prophet foretelling the eventual defeat and death of the king of Babylon. The nation that would eventually send Judah into captivity will itself be defeated and its mighty king will find himself among “the chief ones of the earth…the kings of the nations” (Isa. 14:9) who preceded him in death. These are the kings of nations that he had conquered with the sword and ruled over with a cruel hand (Isa. 14:6). These same men will serve as a welcoming committee for this once great “world ruler” when he arrives in Sheol/Hades. In mock surprise, they will ask this once powerful king, “Art thou also become weak as we? Are thou become like unto us?” (Isa. 14:10). They then taunt him by pointing out that the pretentious display of magnificence that he had demonstrated as the king of Babylon now meant nothing (Isa. 14:11).

All of those who find themselves in this section of Sheol/Hades, like the king of Babylon and the kings who greeted him, will be faced with the reality of how helpless and hopeless they are. One of the boasts these kings make against him is that, while their bodies have been placed in their respective tombs, or graves, he was not honored by a respectable burial, “But thou are cast out of the grave (queber) like an abominable (despised) branch…thou shalt not be joined with them in burial” (Isa. 14:18-20). Obviously, if his body was not in any grave at all, he was not simply joining them in burial.

What we see here is this man going into Sheol, while at the same time his body is cast out of its grave. Obviously then, Sheol cannot be the grave here as the body and soul are in different places, the soul going to Sheol while the body remains unburied, or outside of the grave (vs. 20) to be infested by maggots (vs. 11). It is true that this is a prophetic passage; and there are various opinions as to the identity of the person in view here (verses 12-15 are commonly thought to refer to Satan, the power behind the Gentile kings). But, regardless of who this prophecy is about, or whether it has already been fulfilled or not, does not change the fact that Sheol and the grave are to be regarded as different places in this passage of Scripture.

4. In the case of Samuel and Saul, we find another example of the Scriptures making a distinction between Sheol/Hades and the grave. In his conversation with King Saul, Samuel, whom the Lord had sent back from the dead to deliver a message to Saul, said that Saul and his sons would be with him the next day (see I Sam. 28:15-19). As foretold, Saul and his sons did die the next day while in battle with the Philistines (see I Sam. 31:1-6). However, their bodies were not buried the next day, so they did not join Samuel in the grave but their souls went down to Sheol/Hades where the person, or soul, of Samuel was. As it is said that Samuel “came up” it seems obvious that he went back down after speaking with Saul (I Sam. 28:8,11,14). As for the bodies of Saul and his sons, their remains were not buried for several days. As Samuel had said, they died the next day (I Sam. 31:1-6). But it was the day after they died that their bodies were taken by the Philistines and hung on the wall of Beth-Shan (I Sam. 31:7-10). After hearing of this, valiant men from Jabesh-Gilead went by night and removed their bodies, took them to Jabesh, burned them, and then buried their bones. All this took place at least three days after Saul had died, and probably longer. Saul and his sons joined Samuel in Sheol/Hades the day they died and the flesh of their bodies was burned with only their bones being placed in a grave several days later. Obviously Sheol/Hades and the grave are not the same thing, nor are they in the same place.

The story of the Rich Man and Lazarus that is found in Luke 16:19-31 gives us the record of a remarkable conversation that took place in Hades between the Rich Man and Abraham. Obviously, these two men could not have had this conversation at all if Sheol/Hades is only a place where dead bodies are buried. First, there could be no communication between lifeless, decaying corpses and second, Abraham’s body, which was buried in the cave of Machpelah over 1800 years earlier, had long since decayed. Also, the rich man’s body, regardless of whether it had decayed or not, would not have been buried in the burial cave of Abraham. From the context, it is obvious that these men were in the place of departed souls rather than a burial place.

There are some that contend that this is a parable that never actually took place and deny that it could have ever taken place. To these, who usually hold to a position of soul-sleep or the eradication of the soul at death, we answer; the Lord said that it did take place. Besides, as we have already pointed out, a parable by definition is a “true to life” story. To have meaning, it must be a story that could have actually taken place whether it ever did or not.

MuttleyLaff:
There are abundant verses in the Bible that show what the place of the dead is called but from the little I've known so far about your posts,
even if shown you, it seems the argumentative spirit overbears your learning & humble spirit

2 Timothy 2:23
Again I say, don't get involved in foolish, ignorant arguments that only start fights.

Just wondering, keeping in mind that Sheol is a Jewish concept, what you make of Sheol, what all your understanding of Sheol is/are.

That's why I just created a post on d diff BTW hell, Sheol, hades e,t,c go there and enlighten ureself.

A comparison of how Sheol and queber are used reveals eight points of contrast that tell us that they are not the same thing.

Sheol is never used in plural form. Queber is used in the plural 29 times.
It is never said that the body goes to Sheol. Queber speaks of the body going there 37 times.
Sheol is never said to be located on the face of the earth. Queber is mentioned 32 times as being located on the earth.
An individual’s Sheol is never mentioned. An individual’s queber is mentioned 5 times.
Man is never said to put anyone into Sheol. Individuals are put into a queber by man (33 times).
Man is never said to have dug or fashioned a Sheol. Man is said to have dug, or fashioned, a queber (6 times).
Man is never said to have touched Sheol. Man touches, or can touch, a queber (5 times).
It is never said that man is able to possess a Sheol. Man is spoken of as being able to possess a queber (7 times). (These eight points of comparison are adapted from “Life and Death” by Caleb J. Baker, Bible Institute Colportage Ass’n, 1941).
From the differences between how Sheol and queber are used in Scripture, it is obvious that they are not the same thing. The Greek word Hades in the New Testament would fit into the Sheol column of our chart, strongly indicating that it is the same thing as Sheol. Hades is used eleven times, being rendered Hell ten times and grave once.

Words associated with queber are quabar and qeburah. Quabar is a verb meaning to bury or to be buried and qeburah is a noun meaning a grave or place of burial. The use of these related words helps to reinforce the difference between queber and Sheol, as they clearly have to do with the grave as a burial place, while Sheol does not.

SHEOL/HADES: THE PRESENT HELL

Scripture passages in which Gehenna is used should be distinguished from those using Hades, which refers to a place of temporary torment that we might refer to as the immediate, or present, Hell. What we mean by this is that, at the time of death, the souls of the lost go directly to Hades, where they suffer in torment until the time of the Great White Throne Judgment when they will be resurrected and cast into the Lake of Fire. The souls of all the lost who have already died are presently there and those who die in their sins immediately go there to join them.

Hades is the New Testament equivalent of the Old Testament word Sheol. The Greek and Hebrew words speak of the same place, the present Hell. However, this is problematic because Sheol has been translated “grave” as often as it has “hell” and some have mistakenly taught that Sheol and Hades are only references to the grave rather than Hell. This erroneous teaching leads to the denial of the existence of an immediate or present Hell. The false doctrine of soul-sleep, and other ideas that teach the unconscious state of the dead between death and resurrection, spring from this error.

The common word for “grave” in the Old Testament is queber. Of the sixty-four times it is used, it is translated “grave” thirty-four times, “sepulcher” twenty-six times, and “burying place” four times. Queber is used five additional times as part of a place name, Kibroth-hattaavah, which means “graves of lust.” As we said earlier, Sheol is found sixty-four times, being rendered “grave” thirty-one times, “hell” thirty-one times, and “pit” three times.

There seems to be some confusion about the meaning of Hell and who goes there because of the way the Hebrew word Sheol and the Greek word Hades have been translated in our English Bibles. Since this confusion has led some into an erroneous understanding of what the Bible actually teaches about the intermediate state and the final state of the dead, we think that it is important that we address this subject here.

Sheol is found in the Bible sixty-five times. It is translated “the pit” three times, “the grave” thirty-one times, and “hell” thirty-one times. Hades is used eleven times, being rendered “hell” ten times and “grave” once. Adding to the confusion is that two other words are also translated hell in the New Testament. These are Tartarus, which is found once and Gehenna, which is used twelve times.

The term “Hell” is commonly understood to mean a place of torment where the souls of the wicked go after physical death. This is true. However, because Hades in the New Testament and Sheol in the Old are variously rendered hell or grave, there has been some misunderstanding about what hell and the grave are. Before looking at these words though, we should first give our attention to the Greek word Gehenna, which is always translated hell and used in reference to the Lake of Fire. It is found in Matthew 5:22,29,30; 10:28; 18:9; 23:15,33; Mark 9:43,45,47; Luke 12:5; and James 3:6.

THE FINAL HELL

The Lake of Fire, or Hell, is a literal place of everlasting fire that was originally created by God as a place of punishment for Satan and the angels that followed him in his rebellion against God (Mat. 25:41). Because it is referred to as the place of “outer darkness” (Mat. 8:12; 25:30), we believe that it is most probably located at the farthest reaches of the creation. Gehenna is described in Scripture as a “furnace of fire” (Mat. 13:42); “everlasting punishment” (Mat. 25:46); “the mist [gloom] of darkness” (II Pet. 2:17); the “hurt of the second death” (Rev. 2:11 cf. 20:6,14; 21:; “a lake of fire burning with brimstone” (Rev. 19:20; 20:10; 21:.

While Hell was created for Satan and the other fallen angels, the unsaved of humanity from all ages will be with them in this place of torment where “there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth” (Mat. 13:42). This is the “everlasting reward” of all that die in their sins.

While there is no one in the Lake of Fire at this time, it will one day hold a vast multitude. The first residents of this place of righteous retribution will be the Beast (Antichrist) and the False Prophet who, at the end of the Tribulation, will be “cast alive into a lake burning with brimstone” (Rev. 19:19-20). Joining them will be the unsaved of the nations who survive the Tribulation (Mat. 25:31-32,41-46). Also, at Jesus Christ’s return to earth, the rebel Israelites, i.e. unbelieving Jews, who survive the Tribulation, will be denied entrance into the Millennial Kingdom, no doubt to join their Gentile counterparts in the “place of everlasting fire” (Eze. 20:33-38; Mat. 7:21-23; cf. Mat. 24:29-31,45-51). Then, at the end of the Millennial Kingdom of Jesus Christ, Satan will be “cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever” (Rev. 20:10). And finally, the unsaved dead of all ages will be raised and judged at the Great White Throne by Jesus Christ and then cast into the Lake of Fire (see Rev. 20:11-15).

The name Gehenna comes from a deep narrow ravine south of Jerusalem where some Hebrew parents actually sacrificed their children to the Ammonite god, Molech, during the time of the kings (II Kin. 16;3; II Chron. 28:1-3; cf. Lev. 18:21; I Kin. 11:5,7,33). This pagan deity is also referred to as Malcham, Milcom, and Moloch in the Bible. This valley later served as the city dump and, because there was continual burning of refuse there, it became a graphic symbol of the place of punishment for the wicked. It was named the “Valley of Hinnom,” which translated into Greek becomes Gehenna. The passages where the word is found in the New Testament plainly show that it was a commonly used expression for Hell by that time. The word is found twelve times in the Scriptures, being used eleven times by the Lord Jesus and once by James. When we consider the context, it is clear the Lord used this word in reference to the place of everlasting punishment for the wicked dead and not to the city dump.

Gehenna, or the Lake of Fire, might be referred to as the future, or final, Hell because it is where all of the wicked from all ages will finally end up. Satan, the fallen angels, and all of the lost of mankind will reside in torment there forever and ever.