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PhiliptheArab:
And a lot of the waste is due to subsidy chopping the money that would have been spent on infrastructure.



The reason why we have a functioning telecoms sector is because Nigerians tolerated high prices for a few years enabling the teleco companies to earn enough cash to build enough infrastruture to support the telco sector AND eventually prices came down. (mY firt sim cost N7000.My more recent one, bught some seven years later cost 1000.).



In 2012 we were paying N2 as subsidy per liter of fuel. In 2015 it had gone up to N35...plus our income from crude was falling...and we were running into debt keeping the t hing up. And you ask me why subsidy is a bad thing?




And most Americans regard the subsidy as a waste. Plus it is being paid because American agrculture has become so sUCCESSFUL that it runs at a surplus meaning lower prices of crops...bad for business.


Price of petrol in the UK is 633 naira per liter

Also, electricty works in the UK because the electric companies charge for power aBOVE THE cost of production/generation...and because everyone pays for their power...not like Nigeria where the opposite happens.(IN some parts of Nigeria 50% of the customer base of THE dicos dont pay)

In Nigeria we paid for power at N30 per kwh. In the UK it is N86 per kwh on average.

As for transport....UK taxes per gdp is 33.5% . Nigeria is 5.8% Thus UK has cash to pay for good public transport...and a bus ticket can cost as high as 500-600 naira per trip.

You still do not get it. Telecom wasn't such a necessity. It was in their interest to have the price crash in order to have more customers. That's what happened with Telecoms. It was that simple, use it if you can afford it and if you can't, life goes on.
No body will clamor for subsidy on cars or Apple phones and the likes. There are still villages in Nigeria without access to network. They still have no business with owning a phone. And that hasn't reduced their life span.

Such a policy can't go into Agriculture, or transportation. How will people feed and go to work earning our minimum wage? Do you ever go to the island and see people trekking when transporters hike price? Your argument might make sense to you probably because you're not at the lowest strata of the society.

You did humor me with the saying about Americans seeing subsidy payment to farmers as a waste. Affordable food prices should be the goal of humanity not profit and all the world powers have strived to achieve that for their people.

There is no world power that does not pay agricultural subsidy and it's not a co incidence.

You prefer not to hold the irresponsible government accountable for the challenges of Nigeria. Rather more austere measures should be implemented to further beggar thy country men. It's sad.

An economy that people keep looting billions with no consequences and you're making analysis about tax to GDP ratio? When more than 50% of your populace are extremely poor?

PhiliptheArab:
And the reason why the Chinese economy is that stable is because they depend on domestic manufacturing for local and also as a part of their export revenue

Menaing they have enough cash to keep their economy at an even keel.

Nigeria is an import dependnet economy whose revenue comes from oil.

Unlike china whose revenue comes from manufacturing.

So Nigeria has lower income because oil prices fluctuate. China does not

And then because china is manufacturing well well, they have enough of a surplus to keep prices normal.




Also glad you are an importer. Yet the idea you support of government controlling the economy could in principle mean that government forces you to sell the stuff you imported below the cost you imported it at and they pay you a subsidy that does not cover for your losses.

That's what has been happening in the oil sector, and why it is in the mess it is. And even when we were refining oil at home we sold it at a price below the cost of refining it.

My point is the problem of Nigeria has little or nothing to do with price control. Stop the waste in the system and use the money to provide infrastructures that will offer succor to the masses in the face of deregulation. But they don't want to do that.

They want to deregulate leaving the masses to battle with low wages, high cost of food commodities, housing and transportation. It's never going to work.

You talk as if subsidy is a bad thing. It's one of the ingredients that ensures a stable economy when done in a transparent manner. Nigeria has to come up with subsidy for farmers asap or else we will be buying a bag of rice for #50,000 next year.

The American government paid farmers $22 billion last year in subsidy. And this year they are expected to receive about $40 billion. Mind you, America is the headquarters of capitalism.

An average UK citizen has no business with PMS. Most don't even know the price. They don't need it to generate electricity, they really don't need a car too because public transportation is perfect.

Madmohamed419:
second anini is burn .look at his face you will know this one is very dangerous his will kill whit out mesy

It's what our society is producing. Cases like this should be handled from a more humane perspective.

Ministry of human affairs should take this up and get him educated or learn a skill while going through serious mentoring. Sadly, it's never going to be done. He will end up being locked up for years with the real harden criminals in prison and in 5years a more deadly criminal will be unleashed on the society.

PhiliptheArab:
So you would agree if government forces you to sell your good and servies below the wholesale and production price?

okay, got it. You are really altrusitic.

And you would be bankrupt within months..unless you sell your goods on the black marekt, or smuggle them abroad to sell at higher prices.

I don't get you. You want government to bring in price controls in one sector so that you can make money...

You're looking at this whole issue from a personal point of view. Sugar and flour has remained almost at same rate in Europe in the last 20years. It was the government that made it possible. No body is forcing anyone to sell anything at any price. And their economy has been stable. When you make a profit of 1€, you will get real value in spending it.

You can't have a stable economy when private sector is in charge of basic needs of the society. The role of government can't be over emphasized. That is my position. But an average business man in Nigeria is blinded with let's increase price to meet cost and make good profit. Forgetting that there is a limit to that thinking.

Why are bakers fighting against new tax imposed on them by the Kogi state government? If they go by your thinking they should simply increase price to meet up. But let them try it and see how demand will drop drastically as people start looking for cheaper alternatives of not staying hungry.

So it's in the interest of a good business man to have a stable economy. I import things from China and I can tell you that most Chinese merchants have been selling their products at same price for more than 5years now same price. They are not even interested in price increment.

Can same be said about Nigeria? Price of rice has done 200% and still moving upwards within the last 5years. With the health of our economy anyone advocating for free market is an enemy of Nigeria and its poor masses.

PhiliptheArab:
So let government spend more of our scarce resources on subsidy, let us miss out on investment in our oil industry which could generate jobs and lets let the corruption get worse because subsides fuels more corruption because you want fuel at 40 naira per liter?

All i can say is if you were a businesses person and government brought in price controls to your business you wouldn't like it

You're still looking at the problem the wrong way.
What job are we talking about? Nigerian government have no interest in creating jobs.

No average income family will give out inflated contracts to construct his little 3 bedroom bungalow. If the family has unemployed persons they will be involved so they can survive from the project. But that is not the way Nigeria is managed.

Nigeria prefers to export jobs by awarding inflated contracts to companies with little or no pedigree leaving millions of her citizens in abject poverty with no form of employment. Because that's the means for our politicians to cash out.

Who invested in China? It's funny when we believe we must get Foreign Direct Investment. China grew with serious state control of means of production.


And the point of me not liking it when government implements price control if I'm a business man, is really not relevant. I'm a business man. But what the society needs transcends beyond profit. If you leave your economy in the hands of business men, they will rape your economy and move their profits elsewhere to continue their pillaging.

PhiliptheArab:
Niger, Benin and many other African countries buy fuel at higher prices than we do, and many of them are just as poor or even porrer than we are.

So we should buy PMS at #400 so we can be poorer?

This argument will not be fruitful but I will make it anyway, for the benefit of people reading through. The price of PMS is not what made the Nigerian economy unstable or made our refinery not to work. Simply put, it's the irresponsibility of the government over time that brought us at this point.

The monies that has been stolen by every administration is more than enough to build new standard 200000 capacity refineries every four years without the masses having to battle with poor wages, high cost of food commodities, rent and transportation.

The argument from capitalist business school always completely disregard the 99.9% main issues bedeviling third world countries. And rather, they focus on coming up with recommendations and policy framework to treat 0.01% of the issue. And they know the greedy mofos we have at the helm of affairs will always accept it since the economic reality of the masses is not their reality.

Even if PMS sells for #1000 per litre, while maintaining the same style of management of our commonwealth we will continue to import fuel or worse still would have doubled the current figures of being the poverty head quarters of the world.

This argument for deregulation was made with cement and today we know better. The housing deficit of Nigeria keeps expanding. At the last count it was about 17 million units. How has the privatization of government owned cement companies and the following price increases of cement aided Nigerians in building their houses?

What an average Nigerian understands is that is that since government institutions don't work we should sell them to private sectors and increase price. But let me shock you. Since Babangida's regime that pursued the privatization agenda move than 400 state owned companies has been privatized and only about 10% are still operating today. What happened? Same issues of irresponsible leadership that watch as the so called entrepreneurs like Jimoh Ibrahim and co asset strip the companies and abandon them.

In summary, let's stop talking nonsense about price of PMS being reason for the sorry state of the Nigerian economy.

PhiliptheArab:
As usual on this thread there is so much weeping and gnashing of teeth that no one is thinking about the reason why we are importing fuel from Niger.

In Nigeria for over 4 decades, fuel until recently was subsidised. In practice this meant that fuel was sold below its production price, and government paid the difference between the production price and the sale price

The problem is this led to zero profits which in turn has led to low cash in the system plus zero incentive to fix and maintain refineries

And the truth is our refineries have been operating below capacity long before Buhari arrived.

In Niger, they are too poor to pay a subsidy like we do. Subsequently fuel is sold at N350 or more per liter in Niger. This means profit is enough to sustain a working refinery producing surplus product

In Nigeria, people love low prices for fuel, which is why Buharista fans voted for Bubu because he promised 40 naira per liter, or GEJ fans love GEJ because fuel sold for 86 naira from 2009 to 2015. Nlc wants fuel now at N120.

The problem is, insisting on 40 naira per liter for fuel or even 90 naira not only makes our downstream sector uncompetitive, and also makes smuggling fuel attractive (especially as one can buy fuel at 170 here and sell at 350 over the border and make a smooth profit)..it also means there is no profit in refining fuel in Nigeria.

If we want to buy refined in Nigeria fuel, we must deregulate the downstream sector. Even if it means fuel at 360 naira or 400 naira. It is the only way we can end sharp practices in yhe sector like smuggling, spending millions on 'maintenance ' and so on. We cannot refine fuel here at what i think is 160-200 naira per liter ( we dont have actual values from the petroleum ministry) and sell at 90 naira and expect profit to fix or build refineries

Buying fuel at #350 or #400 as in how? With the level of poverty in Nigeria?

Abeg make una take am easy with these una Harvard economic analysis.

What is the Governor waiting for to produce is former employee?

snowland:
Lol..as funny as it sounds, it's the reality nowadays. What's the lesson learned? You wanna share?

UyaiIncomparabl

Arbitrary pricing is the bane of that business. Lack of standard measurement. You go use your Lagos sense and get there, you will think you got a good deal only for the retailers that come to buy in Mile 12 to price your yam like you got it free from Zaki Ibiam.


My advice for a new person going into commodity trading is avoid yam totally unless you plan on doing the retailing yourself. Potatoes is good because it's sold in sack. But concentrate on mainly grains because of the standard of measurement that is already part of the business.

As a new person never sell on credit. Many of these market women are chronic debtors. They can play the game very well. Almost 100k is still with some of the people I supplied yam about 5years ago. Every day story.

snowland:
Absolutely true. No biz is for novice actually, though complexity may vary from biz to biz..

That business screwed me. These market women will use native intelligence on you.

snowland:
Chai, see biz opportunity. How I wish I fit get someone reliable to manage this for me..

Abeg how much does it cost to buy an average sized tuber in Lagos?

This business no be for novice ooo. If you jump in you will jump out with almost same velocity

Habiodunz:
$35 GNS at #380 from Balance for sale

Scammers should stay away please !!!!

I need this

Her blood relationship with the criminal is of no relevance here unless it can established that she was an accomplice.

The Judiciary just like the other arms of government is proving to be a symbol of oppression.

What the hell is the 1M bail for?

The people who are castigating the Youths for speaking out have no idea of the danger we're in.

Next step, police command will deny the incident meaning the poor police officers fate lies with their families ability to negotiate for their release.

I believe we have gotten to that point we need to chase these incompetent greedy mofos away from the seat of power. 2023 might be too late to rescue the soul of Nigeria.

If police officers can be adopted while in their convoy then, what is the fate of the average Nigerian? And we have to carry on like this?

This is just a waste of time. As far as the underlying issues are not addressed with all sincerity; peace and normalcy will remain a tall dream.

Uyi213:
They are asking that my account be current not savings n they don’t do debit internationally

You don't need an account with UBA to get Africard. Some bankers are actually clueless about what their bank offers so I'm not surprised. Go to another branch and speak with the customer service. It's only your valid KYC documents that is required.

Get an Africard from UBA. Naira international high. It should work

MrAkata:
You either want a functional energy sector or u don't. The government has proven they're incapable or unwilling to run businesses.

Don't compare it to America because in the public sector nobody is buying jets and living lavishly.

It's the reverse in Nigeria. The public sector executives are the ones living ostentatious lifestyles.

This is a win for the people of Nigeria. It doesn't matter if their sold at a loss if the plants were losing billions annually

Bros, that is why we have laws. Let the laws hold whoever that is found culpable.

A country with over 100 million extremely poor people representing over 50% of the population can't run free market capitalism. It will end in total chaos.

The stable economy we yearn for will never come from the private sector. Instead, few billionaires will emerge with more extremely poor people.

I was younger when cement factories were privatized. Today, has it actually improved our ability to own houses? Rather, Housing deficiency continues to grow. At the last count we needed about 20 million units of housing. How can we come close to solving that when cement has become more expensive in Nigeria than what it's sold in the international market?

shine12:
My friend, the argument has always been "The government is not an enterprise and will always incur losses in trying to be one".

Neoliberal and free-market capitalism argues for the privatisation of national assets in order for it to be run efficiently whilst also reducing the state liability. This theory proves true and further reinforced with the crumbling of the old USSR who had a very augmented state control of assets. This obviously was part of their demise.

China came and proved it wrong that the state can indeed be a profitable entity and use the gain from enterprise ownership for nation-building.

I think Nigeria and other poor countries are not ripe for total neoliberal economic policies as manifested in Canada, UK, USA. After all, these aforementioned countries had their time of state owning everything. The UK government use to own British steel, BA, Leyland trucks etc.

My notion is that poor countries need concerted and strategic policies to procure statewide infrastructure and subsequently privatise if need be.

That's what China have done, they are now finally opening their country to foreign financial institutions to come and have 100% ownership of assets which before use to be a joint venture at best.

Apt.
Sadly, most educated folks in Nigeria are just clamoring for privatization with no deep understanding of the peculiarities of the Nigerian state.

A country where more than 50% of its populace are extremely poor wants to practice free market by force. It will end in total chaos

Madness... Assets built with about 4 Trillion will be sold at about 10% of the value. It's sad. We keep selling off national assets for crumps and leaving huge debt profile.

We can't leave the economy of this country in the hands of the private sector.

Onlinesmart:
Government have no business in business.

Who told you Government has no business in business?

We should be careful how we push this capitalism narrative. What the society needs transcends beyond profit.

Why has America the capitalist headquarters of the world maintained United States postal service that has made losses of about $70 billion in the past 11 years?

Why haven't they sold it to DHL or Ups?

Most European countries today that we want to run to operate socialist economy to a large extent. You go to Germany today citizens are entitled to free education, subsidized housing and health care. England, Sweden, Denmark, Holland same thing. Price of food commodities has been at almost same rate in the last 20years.

Let them leave the economy in the hands of the private sector and see if they will have the stable economy they have today.

sammy329:
It was the interim president that resigned, their real president, president Vizcarra's was removed few days.

So you want Buhari to resign because of a protest , Nigeria is not Peru. Just like how Donald Trump didn't resign during the BLM protests.

Trump is just an educated version of Buhari. What I want is irrelevant. My position remains that any incompetent government should not be allowed to remain in power.

sammy329:

The president of Peru did not resign because people were shot, the interim president sworn in 5days ago was forced to resign by parliament because of massive protests against the impeachment of the substantive president that led to the killing of 2 persons.

And your point is? The fact remains that the protest led to his resignation.

We're not yet serious in this country. When the condition becomes unbearable for us we will hit the street. Nobody will wait for a fraudulent election to chase away these vagabonds in power.

We're talking about increase in PMS coupled with high cost of food commodities and same useless government is planning another increment in vat

Peru President Merino Resigns Following Street Protests

Peru’s President Manuel Merino resigned Sunday, just five days after taking office, sparking celebrations in the capital Lima following street protests against him and the ousting of his popular predecessor.

“I want to let the whole country know that I’m resigning,” Merino said in a televised address, a day after a police crackdown on protesters left at least two people dead.

Merino, 59, resigned shortly after a crisis session of Congress called on him to quit power before 6:00 pm (2300 GMT) or face censure.

Congress is expected to appoint a new president — the South American country’s third in a week — in a new session called for 6:00 pm.

Thousands have taken to the streets in days of protests against Merino following the ouster of his predecessor Martin Vizcarra, who was impeached on corruption allegations on Monday.

Congress’ ultimatum came after the health ministry said two protesters were killed on Saturday during a massive and peaceful march in Lima, which was repressed by police firing shotgun pellets and tear gas.

Merino said that in order to avoid a “power vacuum” the 18 ministers he swore in on Thursday would temporarily remain in their posts, though almost all had resigned in the wake of Saturday’s deadly protest.

The resignation was greeted by noisy celebrations in Lima, with demonstrators taking to the streets sounding horns and banging pots.

Source
https://www.channelstv.com/2020/11/15/peru-president-merino-resigns-following-street-protests/?fbclid=IwAR2KV8sRWXYN_13h_0XuNKbLpKE4-cZPTLH0kGz_6CTWOoW6_Jxe9jt-1xQ

.

NwaAmaikpe:



Just like it is with women.
If these policemen want to go, the IGP should let them go. "Never beg who doesn't want to be with you to be with you."

Agbamuche learnt the hard way that when a woman tells you that she is fed up; you should neither try to beg, coerce, blackmail or cajole her to stay back when he found out that the pastor whom he begged to counsel her on the importance and sanctity of marriage was the father of their 3rd child.

The IGP should not be scared.
The truth is that; even if all these policemen choose to retire today, there are many of us who are willing to pick up their batons and guns and replace them at those checkpoints collecting every 50 naira bribe with the truest diligence.

Welcome back Boss

Badonasty:
i believe nnpc should be privatised and government should not have more than 45% shares in it.......... the corruption in that place stinks to high heavens, saudi aramco is one of the best companies in the world according to forbes and na this same oil business dem dey do

Why Saudi no privatize their own? We have refused to hold government accountable for their mismanagement of our commonwealth. Now, a country as poor as Nigeria shouldn't be talking about privatization in whatever disguise.

Privatization doesn't make anything better. You're only going to make few people rich while the income gap keeps widening

Lucwaizy:
Do you even know what you're saying

I will school you both on paypal and transferwise. Just close down the thread. You have no idea of what you're talking about going by the feedback from someone that bought into your program

Until the masses hit the street nothing is going to change. These rascals have no allegiance to the Nigerian state. Their allegiance is to their pocket.

A country with over 100 million extremely poor people keeps giving out fraudulent contracts to enrich just few people.

It's simple, the masses just have to get back their country from these animals. And that will be the only patriotic thing to do.

Missyajoke:
What if they're from countries like Liberia, Sierra Leone, Ghana.

For Ghana the best to use is mobile money. That's what an average Ghanaian understands.