₦airaland Forum

These verses make it clear that the Word-Jesus is God and creator.

https://www.nairaland.com/2047342/jesus-god/1#29179048

When the Word became flesh, He became under the Father which is easy to understand, as in the OP verses.
But He didn't stop being God, how could God stop being God?

The following scriptures make it plain that Jesus is God.


Matthew 1:23 - “Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which is translated, “God with us.”

Isaiah 9:6 - For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Isaiah 43:10,11 - “You are My witnesses,” says the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, and understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me. I, even I, am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.”
Revelation 1:17-18; Revelation 2:8 - (Jesus is the First and the Last)

Isaiah 44:6 - (God is the Redeemer)
2 Peter 1:1 (Jesus is the Redeemer) - “To those who have obtained like precious faith with us by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ”

Isaiah 44:24 - (God created the world by His self alone)
John 1:3; Colossians 1:16 - (Jesus made all things)

John 1:1 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... 1:14 - And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us,

John 5:17,18 - “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.

John 5:23 - that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.

John 8:24 - “Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I AM He, you will die in your sins.”

John 8:58 - Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

John 10:30-33 - Jesus answered them, “I and My Father are one.” Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?” The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.”

John 14:6-7 - Jesus said to him, “I AM the way, the truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.”

John 14:9-11 - Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?”

John 20:28 - And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”

Acts 4:12 - “Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

Acts 20:28 - (God purchased us with His own blood)
Revelation 1:5,6; Revelation 5:8-9 - (Jesus' blood purchased us)

Philippians 2:5-7 - Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bond-servant, and coming in the likeness of men.

1 Timothy 3:16 - And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory.

Titus 2:13 - looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ

Hebrews 1:8,9 - But to the Son He (God) says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”

2 John 1:7 - For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Revelation 1:8 - “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Revelation 22:13 - “I AM the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”... 22:16 - “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches.”


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Hebrews 2:17,18 - “Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.”
Hebrews 4:15,16 - “For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.”
1 Peter 2:24 - “who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we having died to sins, might live for righteousness - by whose stripes you were healed.”

He went from sovereignty to shame and from deity to death? Why!? For you.
John 15:13 - “Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one's life for his friends.”
Romans 5:8 - “But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”

dolphinheart:
I'm not a scholar in English language , so sometimes I tend to misunderstand some sentences, so I do appologise , I also yet to ask about words used in sentence so as to understand the person using the words better.
When the word "could" is attached to a statement, I tend to believe the person who used the word is not sure of the facts attached to the word. If I'm wrong , pls correct me.

Could means: might, may. You can always look up the meaning of a word on a online dictionary.

On the issue of the word authority, I said I dnt understand the whole sentence, not the word authority.

The sentence means you ask me questions as if I should know all the answers.
for example:

Ill wait till you tell me ur view on questions 2 and 4. The questions came about due to a need to better understand ur beliefs.

And why don't you answer my questions.

Do you know the answer to those two questions?
will you tell us?
That would save me time searching for the verses.

dolphinheart:
I'm sorry if I misunderstood you, it just that word "could" can be understood as "not sure" when trying to understand ur statement.
Sir , what of question 2 and 4

Sir, I dnt understand what u meant by the words "why do you think I'm an authority"

You say you don't know what authority means, and yet you use the word yourself.

2. Is jesus of equal authority to the father when he went back to heaven after leaving earth ?

4. Jesus, father, holy spirit has same name, pls what is that name.

Do you know the answer to those two questions?
will you tell us?
That would save me time searching for the verses.

dolphinheart:
You are not certain on trinity right?
But you believe trinity that you are not certain on right ?

Wow! Interesting!
You believe in what you are not sure about?

Nothing can be gained from a discussion with you when you keep misquoting me.

I believe God is one God, and I believe He could be three persons in one God as well.

Merry Christmas

dolphinheart:
You are not certain on trinity right?
But you believe trinity that you are not certain on right ?

Pls if you are certain that jesus is God, answer the questions I posted earlier

Why do you think I'm an authority, I will answer a couple and then you can try and convince others that Jesus is not God. You have failed with me.

1. Jesus is not the same person as the Father, Jesus is the Son. They are the same God.

3. God cannot die and go to hell, but a flesh and blood body can.

dolphinheart, I am now certain that Jesus is God, thanks, even though that is not what you wanted.

And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross Philippians 2:8.

dolphinheart:
Ok sir .
Now I'm asking, do you believe in trinity ?
If yes , what's the concept behind your believe?

I don't know for sure about the trinity doctrine and that is why I haven't been posting on it.

I believe God is one God, and I believe He could be three persons in one God as well.

Can God stop being God? when the Word became Jesus He did not stop being God, but He humbled Himself taking on flesh, no longer being in the form of God, that is why He became lower than the Father and that is why all those verses in the OP are true about, not God, but the Son of God.
Things in Heaven are not the same as things on Earth, I believe Jesus is God and also the son of God when He became flesh, one of us.
He lowered Himself, that is why the Father was greater, for before that they were equal.
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Isaiah said Jesus is the Holy Spirit (Counsellor) and Father.
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Jesus said the Father, He and the Holy Ghost have the same name.
Mat_28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

dolphinheart:
So are you saying the trinity doctrine is false? Or are you trying to tell us you have ur own form or type of trinity ?

Dnt wanna derail the thread

I haven't been talking about the trinity as I said before, I have been talking about Jesus being God which is the title of this thread.
Jesus was God - the Word, and when He became man, He became the Son of God. Flesh is not God, God was in Him as we can have God within us.
The Word never stopped being God, the Holy Spirit was in Jesus but is everywhere else also, filling the universe.
I believe the Word is the Holy Spirit.

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
Joh 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

dolphinheart:
On this thread, if you want to prove that the pagan doctrine of trinity is biblical, then answer the questions posted by the op.
Dnt derail, answer from number 1 to last.

Hi, I never mentioned trinity which would includes the holy Spirit, I showed from scripture that the Word of God, when He was born to flesh became the Son of God, John 1:1&14 and Luke 1:35.

We know that God who became the Father when Jesus was born is God, and
we know that the Word who became Jesus is God

God became man and dwelt among us.
Joh_1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Php 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

The Word is God, God became the man Jesus.

I wrote in another thread that Jesus is the Son of God, the flesh and blood Jesus is the Son of God.
Luk_1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

But before that He was the Word of God, God Himself.
We cannot understand all things of God until we are changed in the twinkling of an eye. Some things on Earth are not like things in Heaven.
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

OLAADEGBU:
Gold is a precious metal and as such was a very valuable commodity. Its value could very well have financed Joseph and Mary’s trip to Egypt.

The frankincense and myrrh could have been sold or traded for food and accommodation as well, for their long stay in Egypt.

Anyi3:
I like your input. Let me rephrase my question. While on earth, in flesh, do you think Jesus was GOD himself? Or he stopped being GOD while he was on earth?

1Co 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

Anyi3:
Is it that Jesus isn't GOD?

Jesus was the Word of God, He became man, the Son of God.
I don't think we will understand everything about God until we are with Him and like Him, then we will know as we are known.

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

1Jn_3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

1Co 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

Mary is the mother of the Son of God.
Luk_1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

BrightEye:
Sure! I am hoping to meet Jesus, but i don't think it is as easier as just saying it, claping, shouting, dancing and paying tithe/offerings, but by living a natural life, the type Jesus lived on earth. Loving the creation you find yourself, loving your neighbor as yourself- then you have done the will of God, thus loves Him.

Yes
1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

lafflaff123:
Just curious, so how did you guys meet Christ? through Nigerian churches? i do not trust this our wealth flashing pastors. Share your experience on how you actually met him. Did you just pray? did you just say God i give you my life?share please.

After living a bad life and becoming more and more troubled by it, I fortunately turned to Jesus and He has turned my life around.
I don't go to a church, I study the Bible and read what people say at Christian forums that is according to scripture, and learn that way.
I have the most important thing - "faith" which is God given just for seeking.

Luk_11:9 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

When we seek Christ He comes to us, and by His influence we have faith in Him, it is His gift to us for seeking him.

Same for me, I was on a road to destruction before I let Christ in.
Now what a road I'm on, there is joy and hope even in affliction.

Samneer:
Hello Nairalanders, I need your opinion on this.

There I was on my bed inside my small dungeon hostel whilst the ears piercing mega phone of a neighbourhood church (one of the mega church around) when I heard the district pastor feeding the church with what I call deception and heresy. I have listened to several messages on forgiveness, repentance and total turning away from sins; but never for once have I in my theological and escathological knowledge of the scriptures seen undoubtful truth about eternal security. Brethren, is it true that, "once saved always saved" or can we lose our salvation through disobedience or unbelief?

My take: Eternal security is a false gospel and counterfeit grace message, which is built upon partial truths and Scripture removed from its context. Many are in hell now because of the once saved always saved doctrine.

what's your own opinion? Should a true Christian believe in such doctrines, or sway it aside as heresy?

That's a good question and a difficult one to answer for me.
A believer should have Christ working in him.
If someone say's he is a believer but is producing bad fruits, is he truly saved?
It's to much for my worn out brain to know, I would like to see a discussion on it using scripture to back up what is said.

frosbel:
Why would the story be made up? Perhaps to fulfill an old prophecy of a virgin birth, which the Gospel of Matthew cites:
Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (Isaiah 7:14)

Some scholars say “virgin” was a mistranslation in the Septuagint (the Greek translation the gospel writers used), and should have been translated “young woman.” That means the story might have been based on a mistranslation!

Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
A young woman giving birth would not be a sign from God, but a virgin giving birth would be a sign from God.

Blonde joke:

A blonde calls her boyfriend and says, “Please come over here and help me. I have a killer jigsaw puzzle, and I can’t figure out how to get it started.”
He asks, “What is it supposed to be when it’s finished?”
The blonde says, “According to the picture on the box, it’s a rooster.”
Her boyfriend decides to go over and help with the puzzle. She lets him in and shows him where she has the puzzle spread all over the table.
He studies the pieces for a moment, then looks at the box, then turns to her and says, “First of all, no matter what we do, we’re not going to be able to assemble these pieces into anything resembling a rooster.”
He takes her hand and says, “Second, I want you to relax, and then…..” he sighed, “we’ll put all these Corn Flakes back in the box.”

asalimpo:
Rotten theology @d least.

Tell me what's wrong with it so I can learn.

A bit away from the op, but how can one believe what jw's say?


JW's say Jesus is not God but an angel.


Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.


Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Heb 1:4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
Heb 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

Is Jesus really God?

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Gombs:
We mean, why wasn’t he forgiven when he rebelled and subsequently cast down?

I suppose satan was not forgiven because he wanted to be above God, his creator, and never changed in his attitude.
We do know according to Revelation that he will never be forgiven.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

This beast's number is 600+60+6, not 6+6+6, and so 6 being for evil man and three 6's meaning more evil does not work.

Six hundred and sixty six is the number of this end time beast's name.

Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

paulGrundy:
"The countdown that has proceeded for some six millenniums now nears its zero hour. So close is it that people who were alive in 1914, and who are now well along in years, will not all pass off the scene before the thrilling events marking the vindication of Jehovah's sovereignty come to pass" [size=18pt]The early members of this group are now in their 60's or 70's or older[/size]. Jehovah did not allow the ingathering of this group to begin too soon. The "great crowd," including many of the earliest members thereof, will survive into the "new earth." Survival into a New Earth (1984) p.184-185

"Prophetic information in the Bible about our day details the following: ...The survival of at least some of the generation that saw the beginning of "the conclusion of the system of things." True Peace And Security (1986) p.70

"Some who saw the events of 1914 will also see the complete destruction of the present wicked world." Reasoning from the Scriptures (1989) p.200

Young JW's, say 20 years of age in 1914 would be 120 years old today.
Someone just born in 1914 would be 100 years old today.