₦airaland Forum

interesting. no wonder A. W Tozer said "[b][b]The devil is a better theologian than any of us and is a devil still[/b][/b]." the christian Church is a great force for good no matter what force rage against her. it is sad to see people so worked up against what they cannot harm. powerful forces like communism have tried and crumblled before and will do again. as lashun pace said " dont ride with starngers"

carmelily:
let's vote to expel joshjosh from school! na p[b]aulipopo[/b] be lecturer not you! start your own thread.

Easyy:
If anyone attends a church where they don't feel comfortable, they should leave. Christrianity and salvation is an individual thing. As much as I don't like the excessive emphasis on materialism in many churches these days, I don't really bother myself because no one is forced to give any church or anyone any money. If I pay any tithes/offering, it is of my own accord.

exactly thank you. but that is too simple for some people to understand.

Jesus said some people are not comfortable with just buying one way ticket to hell but they want to make sure they have fellow travellers

matthew 23: 13 “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. [b]Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either[/b].[e]

15 “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell[f] you yourselves are!

16 “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ 17 Blind fools! Which is more important—the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? 18 And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. 19 How blind! For which is more important—the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred? 20 When you swear ‘by the altar,’ you are swearing by it and by everything on it. 21 And when you swear ‘by the Temple,’ you are swearing by it and by God, who lives in it. 22 And when you swear ‘by heaven,’ you are swearing by the throne of God and by God, who sits on the throne.

Gamine:
@Kunle. The tori too much! Turn your Eyes on Jesus, my pipu

i am so sorry to hear that. i do pray you find healing. i trust that you will pull through as you say by His grace. there is room at the cross for all of us

as i said before our faith is fragile and so must guard it well.  in doing that we must watch out for what  hebrews calls [b]root of bitterness [/b] and in ephesians  evil speaking

Hebrews 12: 14Make every effort to live in peace with all men and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord. 15[b][i][i][b]See to it that no one misses the grace of God and that no bitter root grows up to cause trouble and defile many[/b][/i][/i][/b]. 16See that no one is sexually immoral, or is godless like Esau, who for a single meal sold his inheritance rights as the oldest son

Hebrews 12  in the New Living Translation  says Watch out that no [b]poisonous root of bitterness grows up to trouble you[/b]


we are not allowed to have any tree of bitterness standing in our life? Bitterness towards God, Towards others or Towards ourself. we should Cut them down and forget them  because it only ever troubles the person having it

seeing that we are now students of the word let me just add here  Eph 4:31-32 "Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and [b]evil speaking[/b], be put away from you, with all malice: And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you."  

and   Hebrews 10:23-32   23 Let us hold tightly without wavering to the hope we affirm, for God can be trusted to keep his promise. 24 Let us think of ways to motivate one another to acts of love and good works. [b]25 And let us not neglect our meeting together, as some people do, but encourage one another, especially now that the day of his return is drawing near.[/b]

i will not take any offering today my sister seeing this is my first sermon attempt.

the good Lord is with you. underneath you are His everlasting arms of support and grace. He will see you through.  we will see you at the other side of victory. we do get pressed some times but we are never abadoned to the ways of the enemies. you carry a light that was not given by no church but Christ

KunleOshob:
@Joshjosh
As i said in my earlier post it is not only in Nigeria we have holy business men, infact the most success ful holy business men are base in America and some of the Nigerian ones ae receiving tutelage under them. i am sure you haveholy business men in Ghana too ( at least we have read about the problems a popular Nigerian Holy business is having with the erstwhile Managing Director bishop of their ghanian branch. It was the ghanian bishop that alledgly swindled the parent company church. As i said earlier, please don't let us personalize issues because it would only end up distorting the thread. The issue at stake is not native to Nigeria

i don't know anything about any church in nigeria or  ghana because i have never been there. i don't know what you have problem with here. i suspect seperating the "holy thieves" from the "unholy thieves".  

your signature link is (http://oshobi.successuniversity.com/successu/) how would you prevent the "holy ones " from coming on board?. is your business an unholy one if i may ask?  

get this poverty and christianity don't  go together. if you guys really love poverty so much why did you bother going to school and why do have jobs? or it is just your wish for christians?

like i said though luck prosperity is of God.

Room At The Cross For You "
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The cross upon which Jesus died is a shelter in which we can hide;
And its grace so free is sufficient for me,
And deep is its fountain - as wide as the sea.

chorus:
There's room at the cross for you;

There's room at the cross for you.


Tho millions have come,

There's still room for one-


Yes, there's room at the cross for you.

Tho millions have found Him a friend and have turned from the sins they have sinned,
The Savior still waits to open the gates
And welcome a sinner before it's too late.

The hand of my Savior is strong, and the love of my Savior is long;
Through sunshine or rain, through loss or in gain,

The blood flows from Calv'ry to cleanse every stain.

KunleOshob:
@Joshjosh  what problem do you have with Nigerians?? Are you not a Nigerian?? You seem to concentrate on critisizing Nigerians in all your posts wether it is relevant to the topic or not. After all it is not only in Nigeria we have holy business men

did you see any foreign names amongst the 5?  are they criticizing ghanian pastor's here?  what is wrong  in pointing out that if what is being alleged are true   that would be bacause of the nigerian stock from which they come out. that is fact. you have more satanic business men in nigeria than you will have your so called "holy ones"  you are not going to start blaming foreigners now are you?  it is the insatiable quest for wealth at all cost that nigerians have that is my problem not nigeria as a space of land. does that help and can i get a thank you please.

thanks a million. so are they thieves?

you are very clever. you are just twenty something and you was already in their system. you are fast girl.

which system are you in now and which brand of christianity must people follow?

you are a gem like i said before

God blesss you my dear

i have the feeling you dont really believe these men are business men as alleged. do you? do you believe they are thieves?

expose on the five biggest Holy Businessmen in Nigeria [b][b](David Oyedepo, Enoch Adeboye, Chris Oyakhilome, Temitope Joshua and Mathew Ashimolowo [/b][/b]in that order) and the vast businesses they preside over.

dipotepede:
@ Poster I am proud that we have Nigerians with such pensive, analytical and thoughtful write-ups; I believe write-ups like this are meant to question our loyalty to God rather than men.
Jesus demonstrated the best way to judge men and situation: allow the wheat and tears to grow, then you can remove the tears.
I believe we should learn from the mistakes we see and model a better solution.

It is difficult to build but easy to discard. These men you accuse have built something however imperfect they may be; we are expected to climb on their shoulders to proffer better solutions than they did; we are expected to do greater works than they have done.

God bless i just saw your web site. keep up the good work

paulipopo:
. What has success got to do with this?

you would have noticed my posts specifically mentioned my lovely brother david and the beautiful gamine. they are are very precious and important to me.

last time i checked God dont do umpires and human referees. it would be good if you kindly drop the name of your church and pastor here so others can start coming there seeing you are the sole custodian of genuine christianity. poverty and peity are not evidence of righteousness. the world has moved on from those narrow minded ungodly/unholy holiness your nigerian mindset allows.

God is not nigerian nor does He see things through our nigerian sanctimonious religious eyes.

if these unrighteous men do the great things that is provoking envy and these attacks upon them why dont you show us what you and your church righteousness have done so we make right choices.

i like evidence more than these attacks for attack sake. anyone can feel aggieved for whatever reason. our christian duty responsibilities forbids us from attacks based on hatred, envy and arrogance.

just go on and tell us your church or as the first responder asked tell us the right church so we all go there this sunday.

Livvvvy:
Can u imagine a pastor who raped a 12 year old girl to death. Can u imagine another pastor I know around my area (we call him pastor kerewawa-) who started by preaching to this girl i know, and later invited her to his house for prayers but instead forced her into having sex with him - anal sex for that matter- .

every time you hear of plane crashes amongst your news items, there are thousands other planes flying and landing safely. it is easy to pick the odd minority to use as excuse to trash the rest. nigeria is a morally bankrupt and lawless society. sadly from amongst the lawless people you get these few doing vile and wicked things. if you are fair you would know that every pastor in town didnt rape all the women they come in contact with because one of them did it. police are corrupt in nigeria because they are product of a corrupt society. there are other police force that corruption is not even 1% so you cant use what you see there to tarnish everyone.

there are loads of pastors all over nigeria's rural and urban cities doing great work.
anyway, being nigerian if you guys knew what you are saying here to be true you would have started your schemes long time ago. that is the nigerian way of doing things we all know.

did they say talk is cheap? below is the typical nigerian make believe lifestyle for you. habitual liars, actors and drama kings/queens

[b]How the story of magun set Uyo on fire[/b]
From JOE EFFIONG, Uyo
Tuesday, September 9, 2008


* More Stories on This Section

Uyo, the ever-busy Akwa Ibom State capital was made even busier on Tuesday, August 26, 2008 when the entire town was awash with a story that an illegal couple–a married woman and her boyfriend who were having sex in an uncompleted storey building were unable to disentangle after the act.

The couple said to have been found about nine o'clock in the morning by the workers in the uncompleted building were said to have been permanently hooked to each other since the previous evening when the married woman sneaked into the building to have a quickie before rushing back home to her influential husband.

The story also had it that the husband, said to be a permanent secretary in one of the ministries in the state, had since suspected his wife to be a serial adulterer and had thus decided to lace her with the dreaded ekpo nka owo juju, the version that the Yoruba call magun.
As at when Daily Sun learnt of the incident by 3.30 pm and rushed to the scene which is between 111 and 113 Abak Road, the place had been taken over by okada riders, motorists and pedestrians all coming to see the hooked couple.

Daily Sun learnt that the police had on several occasions come to dispel the surging crowd which had taken over the building. Some young men even mounted sentry and collected N50 from each person who wanted to go in and see the show live. Daily Sun had to pay and rush in to take photographs before the twosome could suddenly disentangle to kill a possible front-page lead.

Surprisingly, there was no couple inside the two-storey building. Our correspondent searched every room pointing camera like American soldiers guns searching for Sadam Hussien with machine guns, yet no love-making couple was in sight.

It was only after Daily Sun had struggled to get out of the choking building and asked those doing business around the place that it was revealed that the whole drama was a hoax.
A lady who preferred anonymity but who works at Ablaze Pharmaceutical and Distribution Limited, 113 Abak Road, told Daily Sun that the whole drama was scripted and acted by okada riders for the public to go crazy.

The True Story
The lady however said that that morning, the security man at the uncompleted building was accosted by a lady who accused him of putting her in the family way. "She started dragging the man but he took her inside the building to leave the crowd which had started gathering. "We never knew how the story of man and woman who could not disentangle came about. But it is the product of okadamen," she explained.

Another man selling motorcycles on the same premises confirmed what the lady said and wondered "why people would leave they business to waste their time on false rumours."

Hard Sell
But the true story was very unpalatable to thousands of pilgrims who had turned the building into a big tourist attraction. Even those who had entered the house and come out, still behaved like the "good men" of the Ali and the Angel story. "Chei! I have never seen such a thing in my life. See a married woman disgracing herself, her family, and her husband. She is even a deaconess on one church there," a young man who came down from the building about 10 minutes after Daily Sun had done a painstaking search, exclaimed.

With such exclamation, others who had wanted to listen to the true story rushed and paid the gate money and went upstairs only to come down garnishing the rumour with different species of spices to make the crowd go wild with ecstasy.

The South South bureau chief of Champion Newspapers, Tony Etim, even called from Port Harcourt same day to confirm the story from Daily Sun. He was shocked when told that it was just a hoax. How news flies!

To make the story even richer, the rumour mongers later in the evening said the police had carried the fornicators (or is it adulterers?) away to the hospital. But which hospital? Nobody could tell. Some said the police had arrested them and were at the state police headquarters at Ikot Akpan Abia.
But the police public relations officer, Akwa Ibom State command, Mr Gabriel Ngban, said there was nothing like that. "I heard the story just like that. But there was nothing like that. We never arrested anybody. Don't mind them."

An earlier hoax
False but palatable rumour-mongering appears to have become a pastime in Uyo. Two months ago, the city was turned upside down when the "local radio" which Uyo okadamen have turned into, broadcast that the corpse of an old woman deposited at a mortuary along Atiku Abubakar Avenue, Uyo, had turned into a large fish when the children came to remove it for burial.

For two days, passing through that road became a nightmare. All efforts by the police to dispel the mob proved abortive. People were ready to swear by the grave of their great grand fathers that they saw when the corpse transformed into a fish.

It was only after a week that the true story was revealed that the fish, rare specie was taken to the mortuary by a private fish farm called Little Spring Farm Ltd to avoid its decay since it was brought to the farm already dead, but for research purpose.

It was when the fish was being brought that the okadamen saw it and went to town with the woman-turned-into-fish story.

The state police commissioner, Mr Mike Zuokumor said there was nothing the police could do to stop hoaxes from being spread in Uyo. "We don't have any law to charge them with. We can only help to dispel the crowd. It only becomes a crime if they use the occasion to extort money from people like fraudulently collecting gate fees from people."
Well, with Uyo lacking recreation facilities, maybe, such hoaxes have come in handy as comic relief. Up okadamen!

http://www.sunnewsonline.com/webpages/news/national/2008/sept/09/national-09-09-2008-005.htm

that is nigerians for you. imaginators and as we to say telephone without wire. how did we not know cell phones would come one day?

wonders indeed funmi. keep up the good work

kev-d:
@ [b]we are intellectuals[/b].

intellectuals indeed. i see [b]you dont do humility[/b]! that is the problem with you people judging all these people and thier churches.
not that i expect any miracles from sanctimonious self righteous nigerians but the slow poison pills of this every church i dont attend is evil that brother david and you all propagate is absolute nonsense

by the way i dont attend a nigerian church. my faith is precious to me and i like to protect it by avoiding the silly poison of tribal/ sectarian sentiments you guys carried into your religion. if these guys are thieves as you people say, can i suggest that is because they are products of morally bankrupt society and people you call nigerians and nothing to do with Christianity.

enjoy your bitterness and hatred because it makes you happy and look nice but i am sure heaven does have a surprice awaiting some of you. that is if you and your choosen few gets there.

Gods heart is larger than any small myopic denomination feeding you people with religion of hating anything that is succesful. some people didnt show up on this earth to do small things and leave the next generation poorer than they met it if that brings hatred well though luck

mmmmmmmm so u are a mole now? i dont believe you. you are funny. keep your present temperature my dear

A_K_O:
josh josh, don't see every criticism as "tearing down"Remember there is something called Constructive Criticism.

i don't mind criticism of any sort. the my church is better than yours mind set of david and his gamgs is what i find strange  but you shouldn't expect anything better from already tribalistic nigerians.  it is very sad to see you people use the same bible you use to defend your various churches tear down other people. i guess it is acceptable in your small corner of christianity.

all is fair in war they say.

Gamine:
Joshy, im still shwweet na   when you correct a friend No one assumes to know it all here! Does it mean you know it all?

good to know you are still sweet and i like you know i always keep you in my prayers and have enormous respect for you because i have seen you on a greater playform and that was a better you. 
the wonderful english people would say  " with friends like these"  if you were a "friend" of david oyedepo and the others, you wont join david band wagon of seeing him and his work as of the devil and attacking him on nairaland  at every opportunity.

some of the write ups you guys are supporting there bothers on hatred and as a matter of fact if this web site was in the uk would fall foul of the religious hatred laws 

oooooops i can't remember telling you i know it all. i am just a human being like you. protect your faith my dear sister. there is more to these things than these arm chair analysts know

i wonder what happened to the sweet old you in the last year my dear sister.   we don't know it all and majoring on tearing people down is not a good virtue let alone christian and Godly one for that matter

thanks for the reply. God bless and keep you

what is happening to my great auntie?

why are you all of a sudden showing your soft and tender side funmi?
one moment you are looking for "3 reasons" the next you are being generous and seemingly caring what is going on?
is my auntie pregnant or what? what is bringing this new caring and less fiesty funmi?

anyway good afternoon and long may this new you reign my dear auntie

matthew 24. 28 (AV) [b]Wheresoever the carcase is, there will the Eagles be gathered together. Modern translations read ‘vultures’ for ‘eagles[/b]’.

david and gamine never fail to join the party.  i wonder if this topic was on muslim it will ever be allowed on seun's front page.  david's  "word of faith movement"  don't do jihads or have mullahs and talabans treatening fatwahs so they are fair game.

it is an open season on christianity on nairaland

long live david and other haters

davidylan:
good shot. But there's a world of difference, its one thing to have good natured fun . . . its another to rob [b]the faithful[/b] with the bible.  

oooops you are a faithful now? good. i nearly forgot you are a david and that you must be a david. God bless you brother keep looking

davidylan:
yeah that first one she had when she just joined newly blew me away. It had everything - cute face, curvy hips, boobs . . . personality.
Oya tope give us that picture abeg.  

ol boy no waste ya time, this girl dey above your league. Abeg no vex.

how are the mighty getting weaker? bro david you are supposed to be preparing for sunday school  here you are looking for boobs. God help you.  if bishop david was doing this now you will know and quote the scriptures they were violating

debosky:
for crying out loud,

who brought this obscene word into nigeria? must "for crying out looud" has to be in everything we say these days? how did we get through life without this not crying out loud?

anyway shell or no shell, i blame lawless nigerians for this iniquity

UBA is good and if you have good figures to leave with them thier interest rates are good too. it is like nairaland is anti uba

emmy4naira:
hey nairalanders why can't we just sit down and think for once, the case about premarital sex l've told u all cannot be discussed by those that don't have an open mind to issues because they are all beclouded by their so called religion.

[b]it is clear that marriage was brought by the white, does that mean that our fore fathers who had sex then will all go to hell?[/b] come to think of it, can't we clearly see that christianity has done more harm than good in our society unlike the good old days when things were right.

anyway no matter how we see it or qoute the bible which most of us don't even know when and where it was written, one fact remains and that is: Jesus Christ never mentioned pre marital sex as a sin

thanks all
emmy

it is always a shame when people argue rationally. you are here talking about the white man but you will use their phones and use their nike shirts and other things you like.

i hate the old days people just slept with women without marrying them. i hate the days good for nothing men had plenty wives they couldnt feed. i wont go on because you never had any good old days but poor sad old days again you may be too young to know better so enjoy seun's hospitality on nairaland.

Christianity is a global force for good wait until godless chineese start enslaving you again and let me hear your opinion

Sisikill:
You are a good, intelligent man. God Bless You.

in a free world everyone is permitted to agree or disagree without being villified. and it will be nice we have short memory rather than this hounding from page to page.

God bless and help my people from whoever wants to kill any of you

you need to see http://gtbankuk.com/ and see thier Standard tariffs and charges



Annual maintenance fee of £100 or monthly instalments of £8.95 this is just one of the various charges for a facility that is free all over the uk.

they will even charge you more than the others for paying into their accounts in nigeria.

personally i think they are all rogues

it is so easy my brother. you know here. unless you have a very close family or circle of friends it can easily happen. even if you belong to any of the religious groups.

may his soul rest in peace

Siena:
Tell me, who was Lepashandi?

^{A refurbished Nairalander?}

more of recycled. o boy how are you. long time no see? hope you are well and your cars shinning? how is the bank holiday going?

DeepZone:
.
For the umpteenth time, there is no reason to murder anybody whether he/she is your spouse unless you are defending yourself. These windbags called American nurses have a way of getting under your skin and it's not surprising they extend it to their homes by consistently treating their husbands like they are a pariah. The high school student and teacher scenario is a weak one because there is no romantic relationship between them. To further prove this hypothesis about nurses, are there not other Nigerian women in other professions in America? doctors, pharmacists, CPA's, engineers, lawyers, teachers,programmers etc and all the aforementioned clearly make more money than these nurses, why haven't you heard their husbands hacking them into pieces. Nigerian nurses are also notorious for sleeping with their coworkers, they are usually half educated because they didnt go through the main stream school system in Nigeria. If you see a girl that went to a Nigerian university and one that went to a nursing school in Nigeria, you'll understand what I mean. The one that attended the university is usually bright,hip and an all rounder. Her PR will be sound and not laid back. So, I think these nurses suffer from half education(education is not only maths, english and anatomy) and the ones that read the nursing in America in most cases did it as full grown adults(usually with kids) so, they never had a taste of any extracurricular activity in a standard tertiary institution.
In other words, most of them are "Jew" women. Pay a "Jew" woman that amount of money that she never fathomed in her life and see her start misbehaving like a Bohemian peasant that drank one pint of vodka.

How can you conclude that they murdered their wives because they were leaving them? For God's sake, some already left their husbands or vice versa but something that is innate transpired between both parties which you and I do not know. Look at this scenario, some people(both men and women) can kill because they caught their spouse cheating while others can walk away. It depends on the individual and varies to a large extent. Look at the case of the woman that killed her husband with a Mercedes Benz in Houston some 5 years ago, that was a temporary insanity and her husband did not deserve to die but he clearly aggravated and pushed her hard to the wall. If you must sleep with his friend or acquittance, Please, don't rub it in his face to bruise his ego because he may snap and overdo it(i heard a [b]rumor [/b]that it was what happened in one of the cases{the Maryland case} and not a money issue). I'm saying this because there is no need beating a dead horse. These women are dead and their husbands are facing the law but there could be potential accidents like these ones that is waiting to happen. a slight adjustment in attitude could prevent it. Remember, in most cases, these nurses were brought to America by their respective husbands, their college fee was paid by these men and they may never get the degree in the first place if they had to work 40hrs and read the nursing and it'll be very unfair for you to destroy the man's life after you have your degree and making "tonnes" of thousands to insult, aggravate and announce "To your tents O israel" while putting him in a situation where he may hardly see his children again. You are dealing with an emotional issue here and it's very very delicate.


I happen to know a lady now in MD that is rushing through nursing school as fast as she can because she's planning to leave the man that is footing her school bills citing that he's too old for her. is that not using somebody? How is it that we women complain about men and the way they treat and use us but will find a reason to justify ours? If she wanted to leave for legitimate reasons, why not leave now? why wait till you run up his debt, take his child and desert him? That's typical 419. If that man wake up tomorrow now and knife her like a demented maniac, y'all will start squealing like pigs.
.

gosh! auntie funmi you dont suffer fools gladly do you? in my book as i have said several times before most nurses and bankers are glorified hookers. but i would not wish death on any one. you are a powerful writter when your blood temperature rises

OpeLovely:
@ gamine, you're the one that hardly makes any sense because i never mentioned your name when i was posting my view.

@ josh, yes we know pre-marital sex is bad but do you want to honestly tell me you have NEVER engaged in it? Since when did nairalanders have their freedom of posting their honest views become a problem?

well since you asked - i have the pleasure of telling i married just last month and can honestly tell you we NEVER did it.

it is good to see you come out openly about we knowing pre-marital sex is bad. the argument here has not been about knowing but accepting. my lovely gamine whom i admire greatly is trying to re-interprete the word. all is forgiven now i must add quickly seing that we all now know and accept it is bad.

anything you do against your body is bad. excessive eating and even sleeping is bad for you so every one that calls Christ name should not be doing what "we all know is bad"

the great sage paul said that there are somethings that should not be mentioned amongst us believers because it brings shame to even unbelievers let alone us that carry Christ light to this dark world

if the world knew how to be committed to the words they say there would have been fewer lawyers and litigations anyway my dear you are permitted to live in your world. enjoy it and long live gamine's world of happy we are committed lets stay together

this does not change my love for you as a person

have a good weekend

Gamine:
That Ope pesin, hardly makes sense at all.

@Josh, please tell me where you saw any pre-marital in your bible.

and stop speaking lies.

If i have sex with one person till i die, and he does the same

without getting married, i will go to hell eh

I sincerely love you as a person and your ability to degedly hold on to wathever view you hold on any topic.

i will however say again [b]the road to hell is paved with good intensions[/b]. i am old enough to say i have heard afterall we will marry thing too many times
if you were to ask around you will find that not even 1% of the world live in your lovely paradise of [b]having sex with one person till they die. [/b]

hell should be of little wahala to the sexually active don't you think? it is good to know you are a member of the human race and that your flesh has weakness too.

you should know i respect you and your views even though we don't read the same page on this one

OpeLovely:
I can't believe this topic is still on. How many here are virgins? You know so much about the bible and quote scriptures yet you are engaging in pre-marital sex. [b]If it is bad, then don't engage in it.[/b] Its not enough to post replies quoting scriptures and you can't remove the log in your eye before removing the speck in others' eyes.

gamine is only saying that her favourite sin is no sin and should be allowed. it is like a pick and choose bible she is using.

she is a brilliant and lovely girl but she is gradually moving into the funmi argument for argument sake mode. she is wrong on this matter. pre marital sex is wrong full stop.

God help us. most people have sex thinking they are in love or they will marry but as someone said in this place how many of this people eventually marry? the road to hell is paved with good intensions the wonderful english people say

Octupus:
Windywendy,
I just stumbled into this thread.I find it amazing how you are spending so much energy trying to convince some people on the seriousness of infidelity and God's opinion about it.I guess your arguments are pretty sound and clear.

However,I want to make the following submissions:
1. ONLY a man who has trully had a personal encounter with Christ can stay absolutely FAITHFULL to his wife.This is a fundamental fact every wife needs to understand.If a woman is born again and her husband is not,she needs to understand this especially.Therefore,as she continues to wait on God to touch his life,she may have to put up with a few things.Unfortunately infidelity may be one of them!

2. An unredeemed man who has the financial resources and is not impotent,is INCAPABLE and I repeat,INCAPABLE of staying with one woman,no matter how pretty or good she is.This is because,by nature,all male creatures are polygamous.(If you don't agree with this point,it simply means to me,you are insufficiently experienced in these matters).This ranges from Lizards to Cocks,to Lions etc,who control territories of females.Unfortunately this tendency is also innate in homosapiens(MAN) albeit suppressed by social restraints. That such an unreedemed man has not been caught commiting adultery does not mean he is not doing it.Dont forget that even looking at a woman lustfully constitutes adultery.So one asks- When do you say a spouse has been caught in adultery?? Note that it is only a Spirit filled man that has the ability to flee from fornication.

3. Painful as cheating is,a wife needs to understand these facts before taking a decision to leave her husband on the grounds of infidelity.The question is,when you leave him,do you plan to remain celibate the rest of your life or do you plan to re-marry? If you re-marry,what's the guarantee that your new husband wont be worse than the first.And if your worse fears are confirmed,are you going to run off again.Now,counsellors will ask you: HOW MANY TIMES DO YOU INTEND TO RUN FROM ONE FAILED MARRIAGE TO ANOTHER? And if you choose to be celibate ,what is the gurantee that you can handle it without sinning against God?

4. I totally agree that adultery is a biblically acceptable ground for divorce but remember,you don't always have to apply this right especially when it may not be expedient for your situation.Past records of one's husband must be taken into consideration.I don't believe an incorrigible,indiscrete adulterer should be put on the same pedestal as a one time offender.This of course,is the same basis for judges in our courts commuting sentences or giving paroles or even outright acquittals to some offenders.Secondly,genuine repentance from the offender should be carefully assesed and considered.

5. One should be very careful not to say NEVER when it comes to matters of adultery.I fear so much when I people say "I will NEVER commit adultery". When one comes across the "RIGHT" person under the "RIGHT" circumstances,carefully schemed by the ever patient devil,will power alone may be insufficient to save.That is why the bible advises us to FLEE fornication.Dont wait to resist it,why? because we can't.

6. In summary,there is a place for forgiveness in cases of infidelity and I know countless marriages where wives or even husbands, have forgiven there spouses and the marriages have been TOTALLY healed and they have moved on as though nothing ever happened.If you consider all the points I raised above,you will see that it is an issue to be handled with a lot of tact and wisdom.Not one to rashly decide on.Some things ought to be weighed carefully before opting for divorce,which of course,is one's entitlement.Please don't get me wrong.Adultery is a serious breach of trust and must ALWAYS be viewed as such.

7. I WISH ALL OF US SAFE,TRUSTWORTHY AND BLISSFUL MATRIMONIES.

in the spirit of the olympics, i will award you gold for common sense. God bless you. it is always good to see people with brilliant mind in this forum

Gamine:
What are you saying?

Your post is rather incoherent

learn to say " there goes i but for the grace of God" it will really help you in the race called life

jokepearl:
lets assume pre marital sex is not sin (I don't agree sha).yet u have not sinned.[font=Lucida Sans Unicode][/font][/b]  if your body rules u then u are not of the spirit.  

Gamine link=topic=35449.msg2666627#msg2666627 date=1218924064:
Fornication.

[b]Sex with a committed partner is no sin, whether you don chop cake for white wedding or not[b][/b].
so at topic,IT COULD BE.

sodom had no bible. It is a long way from sunday school to broadway
Christians are not suppose to be singing sinners song. gamine you must have heard these words before.  i thank God you are still human  but preach the whole truth you said you preach. bible in ife is bible everywhere. no choping of no ugly cake in between satanic marraige or any fleshy one for that matter.

there is hope for you at the cross