₦airaland Forum

NinjaMetahuman:
lol dude.

That's the whole point. There won't be other retail store as big as Amazon if bezos didn't create the idea and show the world it is possible.

It's like saying you think there won't there be other plane companies if the wright brothers didnt invent planes.(assuming they are alive and current owners of Boeing)

Ofcos there won't be other plane companies cos planes will never exist.

I hope you don't believe what you just typed lol. People have come up with same ideas independent of each other. Who told you that won't be planes or shops without them? Have you not seen people registering patent for the same things?

sylvalord:
What sort of useless and stupid analogy is this? If Jeff Bezos didn't create Amazon, where would those 575,000 Employees earn $22,000 median wage a year from?


Did you donate your brain to be used to further the research on Human stupidity?

K

raumdeuter:
The workers can stop the work if they believe they deserve more than they are getting you know? Bezos pays some people $500k a yearand some people $15k a year. You know there is a reason for that. If anyone is unsatisfied with their income they can seek better opportunities elsewhere

Why does a driver at Amazon deserve much more than a driver for Fedex just because the owner of Amazon is richer than the owner of Fedex?

What kind of question are you asking and how does it relate exactly? Bizos has already siphon value off of people's labor and use economic pressure to keep them in line so they can't just leave.

NinjaMetahuman:
would the 570000 workers exist if bezos didn't create Amazon to begin with?

would Amazon ever exist at all to employ that 570000 people if bezos greed (that he could make 20k usd per second) didn't motivate him to create Amazon?

Greed kickstarts innovation, innovation gives people things to do, and make the world a better place.


Although I agree capitalism is out of control in USA.
What you should be clamouring for is way to strike balance between capitalism and socialism and not just punish people because they do what else no one know can do.


I for one believe essential human needs shouldn't be put in the hand of capitalist..
Things like food, housing and shelter. Government should be in total control of those things and not profiteers like we see in America today. ..

Then they should free private sector/capitalist to go nut on non essential things and tax them enough to provide the essential things.

Your thinking is flawed. Amazon will be nothing with those workers.
Amazon will make Zero with out the interstate and airports or shipping docks and internet and electric grid and on and on and on.

What makes you think if there was no Amazon they won't be another retail shop? Do you think bezos is the only one that came up with an online retail shop idea.

Bville02:
Bruv. You are talking in the nonsense.

k

Bville02:
Is your rich employer treating you bad?

You don't seem to be concerned about the poor, you are concerned about the employers that already has a fat paycheck their lifes is already on the upward way and can't even complain.

What have you just typed? Guy if you don't anything don't jump.

raumdeuter:
No need to go that far, Melvyn anything you are earning now, there are random people on your streets making less, why not just share your income with everyone

How can you correlate paying your workers their actual worth and giving money to random people on the street. Stop saying silly things jor

Expert17:
Sorry, can't give you that,

But, they pay per hour, . and their pay is huge.

Amazon has 575,000 employees, making a median wage of $22,000 a year. Amazon has a total market value of $888 billion. If workers all collectively owned Amazon like I said before give employees their fair shares in the company, they'd be worth $1.5 million each, not making $22,000 a year. Instead, Bezos makes $22,000 every 10 seconds (literally) so his employees can make that in a year. Do you see what I am talking about? Billionaires should be considered criminals. No one earns a billion dollars. They steal it from the state and people wages.

Godx:
We honestly need to institute an "income cap" at a business by business level to ensure that everyone contributing to the success of the company is rewarded for their contribution with a percentage of that success.

Exactly no one makes a billion dollars from their own labor, it takes the labor of thousands or millions of other people. Having a billion dollars means paying the people who labored to create revenue for you a billion dollars less than they're worth.

gensteejay:
Which kind argument be this? If a person is innovative and designs a novel product/service that millions of people benefit from, is there any crime if they earn millions/billions of dollars for their ingenuity?

Should they give out a product/service, which they invested money in designing, for free?

What's really the argument all about?

In a working system the term Billionaires won't be existing.
Fair share of taxes would turn billionaires into millionaires. Also, you dont get to a billion without the ingenuity of others. Keep that in mind.

Expert17:


I work as a Cloud solution architect for Microsoft here in Edinburgh, ... So I know what am saying..

Even Nathan's Tek expert in Lagos, Nigeria that offers support to Microsoft users pays well...Entry level still get 119k per month, plus paid certifications, 70% transport fee given, 13th month salary, many more

What is the minimum wage of a Microsoft and Amazon worker ?

Ibime:
How do you differentiate between founders and investors. You seem to have a problem with founders.

What if I'm not the founder, and I just bought large shares in the business this year. Will you take some of my shares and give to employees by next year? If so, why should anyone invest in a business?

This is ill-conceived poppycock

Now you are sounding ignorant.

Griffon:
Bia are you even a Chelsea fan? Why you just come here dey wreck havoc since afternoon, wey your licence to argue for we domot?

K

Griffon:
Dude I don't want to point out the 'rotten attitude' jibe, but pray NihilistJnr doesn't see the emboldened.

I should give a damn because?

Expert17:
Say it again please......
.....Fat account balance
..... Eye watery bonuses
.....Paid certifications and trainings

I am tempted to even drop the value self.... They fucking pay well

You don't Know what you are talking about. What is the minimum wage of a Microsoft employee?

nihilistjnr:
This boy is so stupid.

How do you tax them very HIGH? Do you know that there are already niggas living on super yachts to avoid tax domicillary regulations?

Do you know that big corporations like Facebook and Amazon are already aggressively minimising their tax liability as much as possible?

What do you think would happen if UK government were to employ a more aggressive approach to taxing to big business?


You say they should share stock options to employees. Facebook reduced their tax liability by 8 million pounds doing just that.

That's 8 million pounds that could have been invested in infrastructure to impact the common man on the street, instead facebook gave the money to a few employees, whilst depriving millions of people of the impact of infrastructure of tax revenue.

Guy I have completing ignored ever since. Get the memo and stop jumping into my mentions with your rotten attitude.

wman:
There is no Microsoft, Facebook or Google employee that lives in poverty. They are well to do with a bright future ahead of them.

All these is just envy and whataboutism.

It reminds me of Judas accusing Jesus of using perfume for his feet when several poor people exist. Or those vanity upon vanity crew.

Then you don't know anything. Go and read about Amazon and how they pay workers.

wman:
Kindly mention a working system in the world where it is impossible to be a billionaire.

Even in the Scandinavian countries where the difference in standard of living between the rich and poor is the lowest in the world, billionaires still exist.

Scandinavian countries have free education, free healthcare and guaranteed pension payments. Yet, they still have billionaires.

Did you not see where I said billionaires only exist because of failed policy and system. Under capitalism, billionaires do not earn their money, they extract it from the value produced by the workers. The billionaires do nothing but own capital while those that actually produce value are alienated from the fruits of their labour and have that value taken from them. You are not entitled to wealth that someone else produced while the people who produced it live in poverty.

wman:
Lol. My name is Sergey Brin of Google. My partner's name is Larry Page. In 1998, while everyone in the world was satisfied with AOL, Altavista and other search engines, I and my partner PhD project at Stanford was on building a better way to index web pages and search them.

I could have been lazy like others and look for something easier, or something uninventive. But no, we revolutionized search as the world knew it. We launched our company Google in a garage. From a mere search engine, we worked our ass off to add a mobile OS, maps, advert engine, browser and several other products.

In 2020, I hire a fresh 25 year old Jim who I pay $240k a year. Most people in the US do not earn $240k a year.

So why should godx of Nairaland be pissed that Jim isn't being compensated like me or my partner who created an avenue for Jim to earn more than most people on earth.

If I and Larry Page never took that risk of starting a company, Jim would have no company to work for. My company Google wouldn't be contributing so much to the GDP of America.

Did he say they should be paid equally?

wman:
All that analogy is pure envy. Another man's wealth is none of your business. All that wealth watching is pointless and needless.

If I stayed in a three bedroom apartment with my wife and kids, I could as well wonder why Madonna, Michael Jackson and other celebs live in 18-room mansions with acres of space wasting.

If I was an almajiri in Kano, I could wonder why someone will spend N5000 for a meal in a restaurant.

N5000 that I can manage for a month.

Speak for yourself and your mindset. That analogy should tell you it's not possible to be a billionaire in a working system. The system is trash that's why they are billionaires.

Ibime:
Are you well at all? Anything taken by force is seized. So how do you plan to distribute Bezos wealth to his employees if not by seizing?

Do you know the meaning of policies at all? They are many ways of shrinking the possibility of billionaires and wealth distribution either by taxing them very HIGH or creating a policy that require them to give employees a certain amount of stocks so that the workers can benefit from their own hard work.

Godx:
The funny thing is if Billy,bezos etc just own 3% or 2% shares of their current companies they will still be billionaires.

If you made $7000 from the birth of Jesus till now you won't still be richer than bezos or gate. It's that ridiculous.

Ibime:
Most companies have share options as loyalty bonus for employees currently, so what is your problem with the current system. This is capitalism my friend. Microsoft has to buy those employees skills with share options otherwise they can go work for IBM. Those employees have a skill they are selling and they sold that skill at a price that suits them. Their talent or invention earned then money same as Bill Gates invention earned him money just like Raumdeuter was telling you earlier? How does that equate to seizing billionaires assets?

Why should I start a business knowing that if my business blow, Govt will seize it and give it to any Okoro or Ekaite I employed. How would economy grow if no one starts business because of that. Are you well so? You are a child.

Are you thinking at all? Who said anything about government seizing owners assets. You don't even what you are debating.

Ibime:
Only among the employees?

And what of the 90% of citizens who don't work in a Billionaires company?

Your ideas are half-baked, infantile, gobbledygook.

Shut it. Sharing stocks among employees made ordinary people millionaires in Microsoft. That's an example of wealth distribution. Your idea of liquidating all the billionaires was stupid. I brought you an idea that actually worked in wealth distribution and you still chatting Crabs. You have nothing to say.

Ibime:
How do you redistribute wealth from billionaires if not seizing all assets at the same time? Or is it only Bezos that you will seize? Or maybe you plan to do it turn by turn. And other billionaires will stand like odē and pay money to buy Bezos' shares knowing their turn is coming?

There are 3 major reasons for increase in supply of money in USA for example the last decade that have seen share prices rise

1. Obama printing $2trillion dollars during 2008 crisis put more money supply in the system

2. Foreign Direct Investment

3. American companies remitting money gained in other countries back to America.

Start nationalising billionaire assets and those share prices will fall steeply for 2 reasons

a.) Foreign Direct Investors will withdraw back to their own countries reducing money supply available to liquidate assets at a fair price

b.) By taking out billionaires from demand-side, you reduce market participants and the percentage of money supply available for buying these assets.

When one man's assets are liquidated, another man's cash must be illiquidated at the same rate to hold the same value of assets. You dey yarn opata.

You don't have to seize or liquidate all their stock . You can easy redistribute the wealth by sharing the stocks amongst the employees. The average worker is only getting paid a fraction of the value they create (for the company, and the world). Getting stock in a successful company can be a great way to lift people up economically. Look at all of the employees at Microsoft (not executives, just normal people) who became millionaires as their shares gained value.

Ibime:
Supply of money in a system is fairly fixed at any one time and defined by currency in circulation plus bank deposits.

Because Bezos liquidated, you don't understand that other rich people or institutions had to give up liquidity to allow Bezos cash out, and supply of money in the system remains the same.

Let all Billionaires assets be seized and put on market at the same time, let's see if there is enough supply of money from non-billionaires to liquidate them at a fair value. You cannot take demand out a market and expect value to hold, simples. You dey yarn opata.

All billionaires asset are not being seized. Your scenario doesn't hold water. Every billionaire can show you 100million if not more at any given day.

Ibime:
Just like you can liquidate your car but if Govt is chasing you for debt, you will give them the car rather than liquidate and they will sell it for fraction of it's worth.

Let Govt start chasing all Billionaires for their assets, let's see if Govt can liquidate. You think someone else will put money for those shares knowing Govt can take it any time?

You can ask Fidel what he gained in value from appropriating privately held assets in Cuba. You cannot take demand out of any market and expect to hold the same value. Ask Mugabe in Zimbabwe

The point is all those billionaires that have 10%, 16% or even 2 percent of shares in trillions or multi billionaire companies can get their hands of millions anytime they want. Bezos who has 16% shares of Amazon which is a trillion dollar company can get his hands on 10billion dollars if he wants at anytime. Bezos wife already sold some of her shares and pocketed 400million at once. They can liquidate any time they need cash.

John Bezos liquidate 1 billion every year for blue origin. Few months ago he liquidated 2.8 billion from his shares in one week. They can liquidate any time they want flow of cash. Billionaires diversify and sell stock almost every chance they get, and they don’t live their lifestyle with just a few million of liquidity. Keep believing super stories from musk

seankafor:
calm down. How is he spewing trash?

You can go back and look at the context of the argument to know he is spewing trash.

TeeBabss:
Are you proposing they should sell their products for free?
Their wages should be reviewed?
They should pay their employers more, or they should be more taxed?

In this scenario, they're selling products the whole world is ready to buy - which implies, the money will keep piling up. Technically, they don't even have a choice than to be a billionaire.

1. You can actually tell us how they won't or how we can stop them from being a billionaire
2. When they die, what should happen to their companies

The term billionaires should not even exist. Nobody will be allowed to be worth that much in a working system or policy. As spillo1 said they should be a salary cap. Do you know the meaning of a billion. A billion is 1000million then talk of 100billion. If the wealth is redistributed it doesn't make them poor.

wman:
Why do these people even think these billionaires have all these billions in their account?

Do they even understand the concept of net worth?

That Bill Gates is worth $100 billion does not mean that he has $100 billion in his account. Most of his wealth is tied up in stocks.

Your net worth is far more than the N500,000 in your account. It consists of your cars, your investments, your houses, your convertible skills, your stocks, your 401k, your retirement funds etc.

If you're a musician, your music catalogue and popularity will make up the bulk of your net worth.

You can have a net worth of $50 million and not have a single dime in your bank accounts. You might even be in severe debt.

So, how do you redistribute net worth to others?

Guy you have been spewing trash. If you don't know the context of an argument just sit down .

raumdeuter:
They should be giving people for free

Who is saying it should be free? Damn just forget it you are lost.