₦airaland Forum

dalaman:
That's his opinion. How did he jump from atheism leads to scientism, materialism and finally to nihilism. I am and atheist and I don't know see any reason to be a nihilist. Pls explain to me how atheism leads to nihilism. I don't want you to beg the question.

i assure you..
He will bore you with useless rigmaroles and random bullsheet!

He will never present an explanation backed with fact!

KingEbukasBlog:
You can't kill God because Its existence is a fact . But you can kill atheism because its an idea

i was correct when i said your blind hate for atheism makes you shove everything under ''atheism and religion'''/any other alternative...

Were you blind when i said ''religious god idea''?

You are the one who is deluded apparently . Because all facts prove that atheism is declining . You just don't want to accept that your desire for the world to abjure their beliefs in God is quixotic

the shame is that your article clearly stated that atheism is increasing at rates higher than before...

Im done with your argumentum ad nauseam bro!

You don't need to click the link . Its on front page already

then why did you send it to me?

dalaman:
But atheism has nothing to do with nihilism.

i just taya for them!

KingEbukasBlog:
How does education and internet kill a living immaterial being

stop playing dumb!

Actually facts have revealed that atheism is dying even with the presence of the internet

all through...ive been saying ''religious and irreligious''

but your blind hate for atheism would want to shove everything under ''atheism and religion''


and keep on basking on the delusion that atheism is reducing!

https://www.nairaland.com/3290599/3-bad-trends-atheists

did you expect me to click the link?

KingEbukasBlog:
You say the stupidest things

with your numerous argumentum ad nauseam?
Oh please! Spare me some bull !

They are non-theists .

see umbrella..lol
they rejected God ideas bro!...christianity in particular... They have no creation story..
Wetin again?

KingEbukasBlog:
What does education and the internet have to do with atheism

oh you're lost!

Okay..hang on to this stick and follow me..let me guide you to safety...

Landlord said :atheism is here to stay,,,,education and the internet will kills gods

i said: it will kill virtually every religious god idea..

The internet and more exposure to knowledge(education) creates irreligious persons more than it creates religious persons!

I also said:Take New zealand as a case study!


Now son...do you understand?


Say Yes sire

KingEbukasBlog:
Shut up

another stupid rant!

They are not atheists .

what are they? Christians?

KingEbukasBlog:
Atheism can't kill religion because it is a not a philosophical doctrine . It just says there is no God and that is it .

the internet and education bro...
Not atheism

dalaman:
Upset about what? I am just calling you out on your dishonesty. You tried to say that atheist are nihilist until I challenge you to name one atheist apart from the one we all know about here on nairaland and his statement in support of nihalism but you couldn't, instead you went on some imaginary extrapolation on atheiesm and nihilism saying that so so amount of atheist are nihilist out of some numbers you imagined in your head.

im yet to see the connection between atheism and nihilism..

KingEbukasBlog:
Atheism is a man made idea started by a crazy guy called Diagoras 2,500 years ago

very stupid thing to say!

It is not here to stay , it is unnatural

the piraha people

hopefulLandlord:
This is one of the critic of religion, no matter how huge your sins are, you can always "wash" it all away by talking to your imaginary friend

and yet they still have the effuntry of saying people become ''atheists''(irreligious) because they want to ''sin''

Let us imagine what the society would be like if we wait for an agreed-on god to punish wrongdoers?

they keep saying morality is not subjective..but want ''the law'' to exist...
If Gods are going to judge us for our crimes after death then the law should not exist..
Simple...

mental illness exacerbate religion?
Is there a difference? One could make a case for religion-as-a-mental-illness. And thats not meant as an insult to the religious

of course!
Pidgin2 said she's ready to kill her child..if a stupid tiny voice in her head..tells her to

Atheism is here to stay, internet and education is what would eventually kill every god idea

virtually every religious idea..

Take new zealand as a case study..
As they got more exposed to the internet for a number of years...religious beliefs fells significantly

The simple fact that we abolished slavery despite almost every god especially Yahweh not abolishing it shows our morals come as a way of survival of the human race

If I'm the only person in the world, I won't need any moral code, any law to live by, I can sheet anywhere, piss anywhere but once you form a society laws and codes need to be made

i dont know whats hard to understand in this simple one/two lined sentence


nice write up tho!

jonbellion:
It sure felt good when Earth was flat, Earth was the center of the universe, Earth was only about 6,000 years old, life on Earth originated as the handiwork of a supernatural creator(that is probable but likely a diestic entity), and when species were fixed and didn't evolve. And it felt really good when humans were "special", created separately from other life on Earth, not descended from a common ancestor.
Charles Darwin brought the human race to reality and because of this he is hated by the creationist crew
Unfortunately for us they still want to keep us in the stone age
Why do they like the stone age
The theory of evolution explains how life diversified on earth. They're may be a few holes but the puzzle is pretty much complete
Creationists don't like Charles Darwin and reality
They have made fruitless efforts on the last two centuries to disprove this groundbreaking theory
So far it hasn't really been holding up
Things you have to ignore to not ackwledege evolution

-stratigrahpy
-fossilised footprints
-fossils
-fossils of extinct species
-plate tectonics and continental drift
-same fossils on the edge of continents
-carbon dating(it's accurate)
-dendrochronology
-peer reviewed papers
-scientists that do actual peer reviews
-genetics
-Heredity
-universal genetic material
-Stanley miller
-speciation
-the codon table
-mutations
-molecular clock mutations
-mithochloridial DNA
-mithochloridial eve
-Y-chromosomal Adam (not biblical)
-Neanderthal DNA in humans
-homology
-embryos
-neoteny
-vaccines
-marsupials
-transitional fossils (yes they exist)
-adaptations
-sickle cell disease
-flightless birds
- artificial selection ( creationists use this for the bizzare science of Noahs ark like the rise of such a wide variety of species in just 6000 years ) .............
-the peppered moth
-fruit flies
The Galapagos islands
-taxonomy
-E Coil experiment( this has been attempted to be disproved by butthurt creationists. So far similar to their attempts to disprove the theory it isn't working out so well)
-ring species
Please creationists
Charles Darwin meant no harm
He really didn't

you forgot atavism and somme others

shehuolayinka:
will the world become peaceful if religion is to be extinct?

Yes!...
Non-religious people are more opposed to violence than religious people...
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jan/06/peace-on-earth-atheism

According to the Global Peace Index of 2014,

''...according to their most recent
rankings, among the top ten most
peaceful nations on earth, all are among
the least God-believing – in fact, eight of
the ten are specifically among the least
theistic nations on earth. Conversely, of the bottom ten – the least peaceful
nations – most of them are extremely
religious.''

My beliefs still remains, I still remain a Deist and a Humanist. The way I see religion still stand: as a means to swindle gullible and undiscerning people.

humanism is cool...
Really!

DoctorAlien:
There you have it people! Richard Lenski's experiment did not prove "molecules-to-man" evolution, as many deluded people think.

see as your proclaiming thrash!
''there you have it people'' like it was your article..
You couldnt be civil enough as to reference your source..

Your misinformed article has been rubbished tho!

Instead, it showed that the E. coli couldn't have turned into another species because they gained no new information in their genetic makeup.

such rubbish claims!
From Michigan university,where the experiment is carried out
[url=myxo.css.msu.edu/ecoli/genomicsdat.html]Genome sequences of ancestral and evolved strains[/url]
analyze and see for yourself!

The existing information was either disrupted, degraded, lost or rearranged.

dont be lazy..
[url=myxo.css.msu.edu/ecoli/summdata.html]At least visit the website of the research and view their summary data's[/url]

DoctorAlien:
This finding suggests that any fitness benefits from these mutations were due to a disruption of function.

rubbish!
Tabled data utterly disproves this lie

10. Interestingly, many bacterial populations evolved resistance to a certain virus even though they were not exposed to that virus throughout the experiment. The protein that the bacteria use to transport and metabolize maltose, an energy source that was not present in their experimental environment, is the same protein that the virus targets to infect the bacteria. Since there is no maltose in the growth media, downregulating this unused metabolic pathway would be beneficial for the bacteria and just so happens to confer viral resistance as well. Genetically this change resulted from a mutation in the malT gene, the regulator of maltose metabolism through positive regulation of the LamB surface protein. Mutation in malT likely rendered its protein product nonfunctional thereby eliminating expression of LamB.

another misinformed statement!
The aig publishers do not know that this viral experiment is a separate expiremental study..done under separate conditions...

Also another stupid conclusion that once a deletion mutation occurs...it is a ''hindering'' event!

DoctorAlien:
[s]The hokB-sokB gene locus in E. coli is a toxin-antitoxin system. When found in bacterial chromosomes, these systems are commonly involved in responding to stresses and bringing about programmed cell death. The authors hypothesized that the observed insertion mutation would have knocked out this gene[/s] and a disruption of hokB/sokB would likely be beneficial in the experimental environment

.
Im guessing you and your article writers do not understand the simple statement in blue..

Evolution has always stressed on the importance of environment

5. The researchers observed that all 12 populations of E. coli lost the ability to catabolize D-ribose, an energy source that was not available in this experimental environment. Furthermore, this loss of function was remarkably quick—within 2,000 generations all populations had lost the ability. It was noted that this loss was caused by deletion mutations in the rbs operon. Interestingly, ribose is one of the energy sources that commensal E. coli use in the intestine.

so now the absence of the ribose operon is now a loss of novel information and not a ''re-arrangement/variation but the presence of the Cit+ gene is not a gain of novel information but a variation of normal function..
I laff at you in swahili

---

One thing you and the author of your article do not understand/know about biology is that
the envionment determines whether a mutation is beneficial or harmful

it is not just by listing a loss of genetic info that makes it a harmful mutation.....
The shame is on you and your AIG because the researchers themselves found it to be beneficial to the fitness of the E.coli

The
ribose deletions were shown to occur at a high rate
as well as to confer a fitness benefit under the
LTEE conditions

[url=mbio.asm.org/content/5/5/e01377-14.full]Richard Lenski;chromosonal changes[/url]

Richard lenski and two other researchers published a data/article on the significant role of deleterious mutations in evolution
www.pnas.org/content/110/34/E3171.full

---

there are many other cases in which a deletion became a beneficial mutation..
E.g
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1377146/

The CCR5-Delta32 deletion obliterates the CCR5
chemokine and the human immunodeficiency virus
(HIV)-1 coreceptor on lymphoid cells, leading to
strong resistance against HIV-1 infection and AIDS

even a creationist website..
www.Creation.mobi confirms this..
www.creation.mobi/ccr5delta32-a-very-beneficial-mutation

etc..

So you and your site need to learn biology...really!

Blitzerz:
Allow him to swim in his "vestigial" swimming pool.

Even scientists have admitted that they are still learning the physiology of organs.

The guy is wishing the unknown.
"
If we dont know the function. Then it must have belonged to "ancestors"

What a funny thought.

another ignorant dude...

Did he refute any of the five i listed?
NO..
can he?..No

You're the person swimming in fantasy...if you believe the stuffs i listed have not been researched extensively...
NVM you may not be able to comprehend what i intended saying to you.

DoctorAlien:
2. Second was an insertion mutation in the regulatory region of the pbpA-rodA operon. This operon (which is a cluster of genes under the control of a similar regulatory unit) encodes two important proteins involved with cell wall synthesis. As all 12 E. coli populations evolved larger cell volumes, the authors hypothesized that altered cell wall synthesis or timing of synthesis may have been beneficial. , The exact mechanism of this mutation regarding a gain or loss of novel information is unknown.

3. A single nucleotide polymorphism (SNP) mutation was found in the mutS gene. This SNP produced a premature stop codon and truncated the MutS protein leading to a defect in DNA repair. This particular mutation was of importance because it greatly increases the number of mutations a bacterial population will accumulate over time.

i was greatly correct when i said you and your article do not understand the experiment...
This SNP mutation was during the first stages in the experiment...The dna repair mechanisms of the cell still corrected it in the next few thousand generations..
The article i gave you..confirms this...

This particular mutation was of importance because it greatly increases the number of mutations a bacterial population will accumulate over time.

i saw you stylishly ignored this statement by your blind search..

If you understand the experiment..you'd know that this was a green card.

DoctorAlien:
LENSKI'S EXPERIMENT DEMONSTRATES THAT THE VAST MAJORITY OF FITNESS GAINS ARE AS A RESULT OF LOSS, DISRUPTION OR DEGRADATION OF GENETIC INFORMATION

Publications allege that several genes underwent a genetic mutation that conferred a benefit to the bacteria. In no particular order, I will review each of these examples and discuss the known or hypothesized biochemical basis of how this benefit was achieved. The scientific jargon may be confusing, but take special note of the bolded phrases.

1. First is the pykF gene. This gene encodes one of two pyruvate kinase enzymes that catalyzes the transfer of a phosphate group from phosphoenolpyruvate(PEP) to adenosine diphosphate(ADP) yielding a molecule of adenosine triphosphate(ATP). PEP is also used to help drive the uptake of glucose, a limited energy source in the experiment. The researches noted an insertion in this genetic region that they hypothesized to have inactivated this gene leading to a greater amount of PEP available to drive glucose uptake.

this statement is based on an old data..long before the citrate utilization by the bacteria..
And was just a hypothesis..



The real fitness data of the researchers taken from various measurements showed that the E.coli Gained More fitness and sustained the fitness gains..
You can check it out yourself and understand that ''gene'' input..
www.datadryad.org/resource/doi:10.5061/dryad.gd3dq

DoctorAlien:
I did not say "if". In Lenski's experiment, no novel information was gained by the E.coli.

the utilization of citrate...
Is the novel information gained...

You're lost in the experiment...or the biological terms used are confusing you!

DoctorAlien:
You're a seriously confused human being. The link you gave me as the "article published by the researchers themselves" is nonfunctional.

its an error from me...
I added www. Ive corrected it
Does that warrant an insult?
Are you okay?

Provide in clear terms the novel information which the E.coli gained through mutation in their genetic makeup.

even when i simplified it...you still cannot understand ''clear terms''
i even had to give you a beginners course on how mutations work...yet you still couldnt comprehend..
I also gave you the data released by lenski and co on the mutations
here:www.nairaland.com/3511938/demystifying-evolution-exposing-it-fraud/34#51916097
and expected you to simply connect the dots like every rational human would do...but clearly rationality aint your forte..

---

The novelty that was produced is the creation of the Cit+ phenotype as stated by the data released by the researchers themselves

In Ara–3, [b]numerous deletions,
duplications and amplifications were detected in evolved clones by using genome sequencing data,
including a specific tandem duplication and further
amplification events involved in the production of a novel Cit-positive (Cit+) phenotype

[url=mbio.asm.org/content/5/5/e01377-14.full]E.coli,chromosonal changes:ASM Journal[/url]

Rearrangement of existing information is not the same as GONI.

You so much love the word re-arrangments...but you have no idea what the statement means or what it potrays...
Either your AIG knows this and are trying to deceive you'all or they are ignorant themselves...

Here...

We used whole-genome mapping (optical mapping)
combined with genome sequencing and PCR
analysis to identify the large-scale chromosomal rearrangements in clones from each population
after 40,000 generations. A total of 110 rearrangement events were detected including 82
deletions, 19 inversions, and 9 duplications with
lineages having between 5 and 20 events

i believe you know what deletions,inversions,duplications and insertions are...
They are Mutations


[url=mbio.asm.org/content/5/5/e01377-14.full]E.coli:Chromosome changes,Journal of The American Society Of Microbiology[/url]

---

the thing is that you and your article do not understand the experiment at all..

If it were a rearrangement of normal functions of the bacteria in the sense you speak of
Then
1)Other researchers on E.coli would have gotten the same results so easily

2)It would not be called ''Mutations'' but it would be called a normal cell functions like
the ability of some animals to see at both day and night...

---

If you cannot understand that
The inability of the E.coli to digest citrate aerobically is what defined it as a species
And that the Triggers of these chromosonal curve or digression/ or variations or re-arrangements as you call it are Mutations then maybe you dont understand the biology involved in all these terms..
And i suggest you start reading from here to gain basic knowledge

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation

and also start here
www.dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/gain

and here
www.dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/ability


since words are your problems

If you cannot produce it, but are only intent on posting irrelevant sentences, back off!

Youre a certified Joker! I swear down

NB:The American society of Microbiology Journal was a citation of the data released by lenski et al as can be seen in the bottom of the page#Citation

jonbellion:
Bullshit
It is extremely wrong to apply the second law of thermodynamics to the biosphere or life
Entropy is not "disorder" in the broad sense
It is the degree of dispersion of energy in a system
Disorder is a stupid oversimplification
Entropy decreases when water freezes
So basically ice is more "ordered" than liquid water
Your misconception will ultimately disprove
-the formation of snowflakes
-orbits in the solar system
-growth in living organisms
And
-the formation of rocks
Say NO to pseudoscience

i asked him how life itself does not violate the 2nd law of thermo' if evolution does...
He didnt reply!

4kings:
On "ASSUMPTIONS and SUPPOSITIONS" : Evolution is inconclusive therefore it's not a "fact" yet.
But it's a valid "theory"

this is one misconception...
Evolution is a fact...like gravity is a fact...

Darwins theory of evolution tries to help us understand evolution more...just like einsteins theory of relativity...

Darwins theory may be correct..it is a valid theory...

A better theory may replace it...the same way einsteins general relativity replaced much of newton's idea of gravity..

damogul:
Your words below



How can you look at me can call me dishonest when your dishonesty is repulsive. Why would you call the appendix a vestigial organ to digestive functions

therein lies the problem...

I used the word ''vestigial'' as an adjective...not a noun...
Thats what you cant see...

when it is not a vestigial organ AT ALL?

so what you are directly saying is that an organ can not
have/ had a previous or alternate use?

If its function is based on the immune system why would you dishonestly refer it to the digestive system? Are you alright at all?

I have told you that this discussion is over. People who make dishonest arguments piss me off and you are clearly doing so

says the person who has numerous dishonest arguments...




Please save your mentions for someone else. Thanks for the time[/b][/quote]please am not bugging you...
You can choose not to respond...

damogul:
I am done with you! YOU ARE BEING GROSSLY DISHONEST!

You claimed you knew the appendix had immune system functions yet you called it a vestigial organ

abeg see wetin i talk here

2)the appendix is still vestigial...ille est on digestive
functions...
Just like the wings of the emu are considered
vestigial to flight..but can be used as a shelter from
cold

ille est means ;That is (i.e)
you can misinterprete or misunderstand my statement all you want...

when the article said IT HAD CRITICAL FUNCTIONS in the immune system (I suppose you missed that word). And they ruled it out as a vestigial organ yet you were still parading it as a vestigial organ.

You are a dishonest fellow.

Discussion ends. Thanks for your time.[/b]

you are the dishonest person here...
Take your time and understand a thing before concluding..

I Never called the Appendix a vestige/vestigial organ
it is you who re-interpreted my words and did so...

damogul:
[b]MrMontella i have given you scientific proof from a credible scientific journal that categorically states that the Appendix is not a vestigial organ will you now admit to being wrong?

on the contrary...
He said ''in a way'' exactly inline with what i said...

Will you say that ATAVISM which listed the appendix as a sure proof of evolution is still right?

shey i talk am say you dont understand atavism?

There was never a time the appendix was listed as an atavistic feauture...by any site,journal or anything...

Atavism still stands brother

damogul:
Extract from

http://www.livescience.com/10571-appendix-fact-promising.html
You are obviously not in touch with current positions.

whats with the rambles?
From the page

In a way the idea that the appendix is an
organ whose time has passed has itself become
a concept whose time is over. Maybe it's time to correct the textbooks," said
researcher William Parker, an immunologist at
Duke University Medical Center in Durham, N.C.
"Many biology texts today still refer to the
appendix as a 'vestigial organ.'"

how does it negate what i said?
Im not sure you got what i said...

Look at the underlined

I said...the appendix is vestigial to digestive functions
i then callibrated my statement with the situation of the emu..for you to grasp the idea..
I know the appendix has immune system functions...
If i considered it a standard vestige...
Why didnt i list it when you asked for a list of vestiges from me?

damogul:
This was the same way the appendix was so vehemently painted as an evolutionary authority until it got debunked.

there's no debunking that...
Unless the embroyonic tails in humans cease to be a developing coccyx...


2)the appendix is still vestigial...ille est on digestive functions...
Just like the wings of the emu are considered vestigial to flight..but can be used as a shelter from cold.

damogul:
You never ever see anothers point but you expect your point to be seen. If you cannot carry out your own research as the self acclaimed intellectual you are then drop it

because there is none...

Its just his textbook...from a scientist...


Its like saying stephen hawking's ''a universe from nothing'' is the standard science proposed by academies of science,,government science orgs.,,peer reviewed journals and the general body of science as fact...

damogul:
Sometimes when you talk with so much arrogant ignorance i laugh at you.

Click this link and simply type a search with the word small and it will take you to all the vestigial organs and all of them are considered small or reduced in size

Ignorance is not an excuse

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_vestigiality

i dont think you checked what you asked me to..


1)wisdom teeth is larger than modern teeth

2)''small size'' is not a defining standard for vestiges...
Variables of ''Non functionality'' are.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vestigiality

.

damogul:
[b]I seriously suggest you do your research and stop asking me silly questions. "People" did not interpret the 86 to be 180...EVOLUTIONARY SCIENTISTS did.

not evolutionary scientists...it was never stated there...the quote of the zoologist in that page sef...seems to be anti-evolutional...
Doesnt mean no evolutionist did tho...
That aside
what do you understand by ''interpretations''?

I wouldnt want to give you links since you are already biased so help yourself with your own private research.

please do..because i checked his page on wiki and couldnt find any links to journals or thereabouts...

let me give you some of his initial list of vestigials...please look at them carefully

Adenoids
Appendix
Nipples on males.
Nodes on ears, "Darwin's points"
Parathyroid
Pineal gland
Pituitary gland
Plantaris muscle
Thymus
Toes bones III, IV, V
Tonsils
Valves in veins
Wisdom teeth

How many of those few i dropped there look familiar to you?[/b]

and this proves what?
I dont see your point!...honestly