₦airaland Forum

BERNIMOORE:
Can you tell us the character that is saying that 'my servant' who is also telling another character 'the servant' in the old testament isaiah 42:1 before Jesus came to the earth

isaiah 42:1 kjv
Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
And why Jesus fuffilled 'the servant' word for word according to the vision isaiah saw and recorded above in isaiah 42:1

Mathew 12:18 kjv
Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

God will be, whatever God will be.
God will be, whatever God needs to be.
God will be, whatever God wants be.
God will be, whatever God can be.
God will be, whatever God has to be.

The character is God, who says: I AM, THAT, I AM

BERNIMOORE:
are you saying that God is calling himself 'my servant' in anticipation before he obtain that human body and why did he not refer to ''my chosen; my beloved that shall shew judgment to the Gentiles. as God the son? but my servant?

Of course I am. Why not?
Its enough to say, God is Omni-Know-All. God is Omniscient
At this juncture, am however sorry to say this,
but you really are being unnecessarily fussy over nothing
and being myopic about this info about the need of a body bro.

You must be able to see it by now.
You must be able to know it by now, be able to note that Adam (i.e. as in, Man or human beings) is a product of, necessity is the mother of invention
And also note that, a need and/or problem(s) encourages creative efforts to meet the need and/or solve the problem(s)
God will be anything necessary or will do anything necessary, and that's anything necessary within the rule to meet a need(s) and/or solve a problem(s)

Anyway, back to the original matter. What does it matter? (i.e. ...God the son? ...my servant?)
Dont your Dad/Mum/Brother/Sister/Son/Daughter/waiter/house-servant/etcetera minister to you or serve you?

BERNIMOORE:
note again further assurrance from the God and father to his servant Jesus before he came to the earth;

isaiah 42:6
I the LORD have called you in righteousness, and will hold your hand, and will keep you, and give you for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

Again, God will be, whatever God will be.
God will be, whatever God needs to be. God will be, whatever God wants be.
God will be, whatever God can be. God will be, whatever God has to be.

This is a prerogative, us human beings, dont have

Now allow to be appeased with this instructive ''draw-a-straight-line-between-these-two-points'' Matthew 20:26-28

26But among you it will be different. Whoever wants to be a leader among you must be your servant,
27and whoever wants to be first among you must become your slave.
28For even the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve others and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
- Matthew 20:26-28 NLT

26But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;
27And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant:
28Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many
- Matthew 20:26-28 KJV

BERNIMOORE:
your response is needed here sir

BERNIMOORE, in addition to all above
if, God You want something done right & well, the first time,
God You might has well just, do it Godself Yourself,
and especially DIY, if God's you're Good at the something that needs done

God came to serve us and not be served
Arent we blessed that, even as we now speak, God is still performing and serving all

Sir, now, permit me to remind you of some responses you ought to have attended to,
but for reasons best known to you, you've chosen to leap-frog over and leave outstanding:
#1 BERNIMOORE and Jozzy4
What is your understanding of what the word God means and/or what the word, God is all about?
https://www.nairaland.com/1491321/satan-default-angel-prove-it#38808844

#2 Maybe if you explain what a liberal Trinitarian is
and what a liberal Trinitarian is about, I might be able to confirm whether you're correct or not that am a liberal Trinitarian
https://www.nairaland.com/1491321/satan-default-angel-prove-it/4#39120364

#3 I said: Why not?
Is it impossible for God to pull something like this off? Yes OR No!
https://www.nairaland.com/1491321/satan-default-angel-prove-it/5#39194185

johnw74:
@ bold and red and underlined, you can obviously fool yourself, and your fellow non believers

but you cannot fool Christians

you don't believe the bible and you preach the opposite to it:

Let God and posterity be the judge of whether or not I believe the bible and preach the opposite to it

johnw74:
Heb 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
Heb 1:13 But to which of the Angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

You're becoming like a broken record,
instead of answering the question, you're unnecessarily repeating yourself

All these efforts of yours to squirm out of responding to the question is useless
so just answer the question asked earlier above about who is the Angel of the Lord
then as previously said, I too will give you something scripture(s) to really ponder on or writhe at

johnw74:
I can assure you once again, that I am not on the same journey and destination
as those who don't believe the Bible, and teach the opposite to it.

Dont worry, its a matter of a combination of maturity and time (i.e. a future date) to later appreciate we actually are on the same train, and that you happened to have been in a middle or rear coach then

johnw74:
Heb 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
Heb 1:13 But to which of the Angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

Answer the question asked earlier above about who is the Angel of the Lord
then as previously said, I too will give you scripture(s) to ponder on or writhe at

truthislight:
The above statement is one of such that I find impossible to sweep under the carpet.
honestly, an explanation wont be a bad idea. I mean! How can an imperfect offspring of Adam have had what Adam had? How would he have had perfection not to talk of having the prospect of eternal life that Adam was.

Ah, well spotted. Exactly.

That right there, is the ''delusion of grandeur'' the King harboured about himself
- the king was blessed, no doubt, but he let the blessings, wisdom, knowledge etcetera go to his head

Ezekiel was narrating the king's conceitedness and God's disapproval towards the king over it.

truthislight:
Such statements is what we can do without

Which, possibly, is why you've hardly got your feet wet, on matters of the sort or like, then

truthislight:
what Adam lost was great.

Get over it truthislight, the loss was inevitable, and that's the bad news part.
The good news is, the loss is temporary and etcetera, anyway

Boomark:
Bros I saw your replies. wink

This Jehovah witness johnw74 don give you plenty plenty names. Na wa o.

Dem plenty plenty names na occupational hazard bro.
Comes with the territory, once you have a thick skin, the names will mean nothing. They're like water off a duck's back to me. It doesnt bother me

johnw74:
the Angel of the Lord and ordinary Angels are all Angels mutt

Yes, we know that much johnw74
Thank you God you agree and admit that the Angel of the Lord and ordinary Angels are all Angels (i.e. messengers)

Now johnw74, who is the Angel of the Lord?

johnw74:
mutt and jw - legion, there is no point telling anything to those who disbelieves the Bible and says the exact opposite

SMH. Wow take some deep breaths. Try having a chill pill because this your remark doesnt apply to the likes of moi who 110% believes the Bible and isnt afraid to say the Bible exactly as it is

johnw74:
Heb 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
Heb 1:13 But to which of the Angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

Answer the question above, then I too will give you scripture(s) to ponder on or cut your teeth with

BERNIMOORE:
@ MuttleyLaff:

sorry i could nt continue, but i will be back, i was too busy for now but expect my reply soon, thanks.

Okeydokes

johnw74:
and yet you addressed two more posts to me after this one

take your demonic lies and insults with you legion

I don't do insults, you've mistaken me for someone else

You've mistaken an honest observation to be insults

johnw74:
"legion" that's what your allies from anomymous call themselves

The only allies I know and have are those of the body of Christ. Don't know what you're talking about there

johnw74:
you and jw are led by the same demons-legion

is why you support one another

Truth is hard to face at times, I admit it can be a bitter pill to swallow at times too. I feel you bro.

johnw74:
demon, i am definitely not your bro,

https://i57.tinypic.com/34sp9j4.gif
Get used to the bro endearment,

johnw74:
you must be deluded

https://s27.postimg.org/j7eg0h42b/train.jpg
I call you bro, as we are on the same train going on journey to a common destination,
The obvious fact and truth is, you just are few carriages behind that's all...
No delusions

johnw74:
Thread Title:

Re: Was Satan By Default An Angel? Prove It If You Think Jesus Never Exist As Angel

Jesus Christ was not an Angel:

Yes Jesus Christ was an Angel
and a bona fide one sent by God for that matter too

johnw74:
Heb 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
Heb 1:13 But to which of the Angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

You need know the distinction between the Angel of the Lord and ordinary angels of low rank status bro

johnw74:
Father God has never called an Angel "His Son".

Yes, He, God the Father has called an Angel ''His Son''

johnw74:
Father God has never said to an Angel "sit at my right hand"

Yes, He, God the Father, has/had said to an Angel ''sit at my right hand''

johnw74:
Thread title:

Re: Was Satan By Default An Angel?
Prove It If You Think Jesus Never Exist As Angel

satan was an angel:

This much is certain Satan is an invisible or celestial being

Another certainty is, Satan at one time would have been an angel or be an Arch-angel (i.e. a step above an angel)

Satan right now, no more is God's angel.
Satan is now ''his own man or own person''

Bottom line, albeit in an inverted manner, Satan is a ''man of his own invention''
- Satan found some unique thought(s) within self,
stirring up the thought(s) or acting upon them was unsuccessful
and led Satan to become a persona non grata, which Satan now is

johnw74:
Eze 28:13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

Isa 14:13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Eze 28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire

All of the descriptions in that passage and the previous chapters are about the king mentioned in it

That earthly Tyre king wasnt in that literal ''Eden'' but was in this Eden mentioned in ''A Lament for Tyre'' in Ezekiel 27:21-23:

²¹The Arabians and the princes of Kedar sent merchants to trade lambs and rams and male goats in exchange for your goods.
²²The merchants of Sheba and Raamah came with all kinds of spices, jewels, and gold in exchange for your wares.
²³“Haran, Canneh, EDEN, Sheba, Asshur, and Kilmad came with their merchandise, too
- Ezekiel 27:21-23

The reason Ezekiel, was suggesting the King was in Eden, the garden of God, was because the King was so blessed by God, that the blessing, knowledge, might etcetera was virtually the same as like being in Eden, the garden of God
The king in essence, was on par with Adam and all Adam had, before Adam's fall from grace.

For what you havent known yet, is, he, the King of Tyre and not satan, is the object of discussion in those verses you quoted.

Further to the bit explained above, it is the King of Tyre and NOT satan, who was compared to and/or called a cherub

Satan is more of a seraphim than being a cherub or cherubim

johnw74:
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Here, you're falling into the trap of playing eisegesis with Rev 12:9

johnw74:
stop stealing my truths and turning them into lies

Except for your kindegarten and delusional twisted truths, you dont have any truths bro

johnw74:
you know that you are the pharacee hypercrites

You are Far-Away-To-See

johnw74:
demons without tether flock together

You would know, wouldnt you

truthislight:
Well then, you are insinuating that the incident recorded at Rev 12:9 Took place before Adam sinned inevitably:

I've nowhere on this thread made any insinuations about Rev 12:9
I havent yet made any reference to Rev 12:9
You brought up Rev 12:9, not me
but since you want and are corralling me into Rev 12:9,
would you now, please advise, what the action carried out by serpent/Satan in Genesis 3:1 is called

Now the Shining One was more clever than any animal of the field that the LORD God had made.
It asked the woman,
"Did God actually say, 'You are not to eat from any tree of the garden'?"
- Genesis 3:1 ISV

Now the serpent was the most cunning of all the wild animals that the LORD God had made.
He said to the woman,
"Did God really say, 'You can't eat from any tree in the garden?"
- Genesis 3:1

What is that kind of behaviour in the garden displayed by serpent/Satan called?
Is that behaviour a sin or not? (i.e. as in, is it missing the mark or not?)

truthislight:
Rev 12:9 So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him
...................................................

Please, confirm that the above is what your stand is on this matter before any further questions.

Peace.

truthislight, please dont fall into the trap of playing eisegesis with Rev 12:9
What I would suggest, is to read the whole of Rev 12, to:
#1 establish the dinstinction(s) between heaven and Heaven
#2 establish what occurred in Rev 12:7 before Rev 12:9 came to pass

BERNIMOORE:
Dont worry again i have gotten what i need and enjoying the conversation steady. in fact i am learning!

Though I first said, suit yourself, but actuaaly hoped you'd obliged, as your feedback, possibly would have led to giving you something to really worry a bit about

BERNIMOORE:
So when Jesus Died for Good three days, even at Death in those three days he is still God! yes or No!

I said: Why not?
Is it impossible for God to pull something like this off? Yes OR No!

Am still waiting for responses to this

truthislight:
Before Adam sin in the garden of Eden, had Satan been sent out of heaven?

I am inclined to that school of thought.
- my mental disposition gravitates to it

truthislight:
In other words, between Adam sinning in Eden and Satan being sent out of heaven, which came first?

The latter came first

Note that Adam (i.e. as in, Man or human beings) is a product of necessity is the mother of invention
Also note that, a need and/or problem(s) encourages creative efforts to meet the need and/or solve the problem(s)

johnw74:
what a girlie, you wouldn't say Boo to anyone face to face, you would run
i have learned that all big mouths are yella

All these jw sly innuendoes you make, the Jehovahs Witnesses jabs
and your ''demons gathering together'' devotion borders on obsession
jw, Jehovahs Witnesses, demons, ''demons gathering together'' etcetera are dominating your thoughts.
Until checked, the obsession is not normal.

johnw74:
well of course you have joined the chorus of demons in saying that
but it's impossible for those, like demons, that gather together, to be anything other than false accusers

You're not one, but are two Pharisee (i.e. you're too Far-to-see) is all I say to this

johnw74:
you sound and look like a demon, don't you

This is an unfounded accusation
because the Guy Fawkes anonymous mask, created by David Lloyd (comic) and Gloria Steinem silhouette combo
is the equivalent of wearing a burqa on an anonymous forum, which incidentally and conveniently is what Nairaland is.

Bro, it's clear, that you're having a serious bout and a very bad case one for that matter, of anonymophobia

truthislight:
To the above two Questions I tagged in your post above. I answer thus:

1. No, Satan is still not a prince in heaven.
2. No. he is not, in fact, he was casted out. According to Rev.12:9.

These responses then exonerates me from the claim of making an overstatement

truthislight:
But, if I may ask, was it Before the fall of Adam?

Re-package this, as I am not sure what you're asking of before the fall of Adam

truthislight:
I know and hope you won't look at making sense of this matter as inconsequential.

Peace.

If I do or did, I wouldnt be requesting you rephrase the question

johnw74:
demons gather together

https://i57.tinypic.com/34sp9j4.gif
Boo! Scaredy-Cat

johnw74:
and of course say anything except truth that is

You cant handle the truth bro
You have a strong dislike of hearing the truth and a strong opposition to the truth because you don't want your illusions destroyed

The fact is truth will set you free, but first, will get you pissed off on hearing it, just like you right now, are pissed off.

BERNIMOORE:
Dont worry again i have gotten what i need and enjoying the conversation steady. in fact i am learning!

Suit yourself

BERNIMOORE:
So when Jesus Died for Good three days, even at Death in those three days He is still God!

Why not?
Is it impossible for God to pull something like this off? Yes OR No!

BERNIMOORE:
Yes or No!

Make that a resounding Yes!

BERNIMOORE:
wow,

This statement above just convinced me to believe that you are a liberal Trinitarian, am i correct?

Maybe if you explain what a liberal Trinitarian is
and what a liberal Trinitarian is about, I might be able to confirm whether you're correct or not that am a liberal Trinitarian

BERNIMOORE:
God obtain a body, in another person (of jesus) so as to operate on earth

What were you expectin?.
Were you expecting God to bend the protocol or rules with some abracadabra?

BERNIMOORE:
i need more explanations

God made a motion in Genesis 1:26 for making man to rule, operate and have dominion on Earth,
in Genesis 1:27, there, man is made, after which in Genesis 1:28 decreed by blessing of:
"Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it;
and rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky
and over every living thing that moves on the earth."

You dont need further explanation other than, God, an Invisible being, is a Spirit.

truthislight:
Actually, why I am asking is because I have heard some people insinuating that Satan fail before the fall of man (whatever that means).

So, now that you came up with similar statement, I had no other option than to ask for evidence.

Well, if you don't provide evidence for the claim, taking it with a pinch of salt then is an over statement.

Bro, whatever I posted wasnt an overstatement,
and so the original ''Satan, from time immemorial, has always been an ex-Heaven resident'' premise still holds
- you read too much into ''time immemorial''. I thought it was dolphinheart alone who was into nitpicking & legalistic exercise

Is satan still a resident in Heaven?
Is satan still a prince in the court(s) in Heaven?

dolphinheart:
Yep, that I'm waiting for too

What are you waiting for then?
C'mon, spill the beans, share with all your understanding of what a celestial being is and/or what celestial being means

dolphinheart:
Need scriptural proof of the bold above

What!?
You must be having a laugh. That is Bible 101...
Go to Genesis Chapters 1 and 2 to start with for scriptural proof. That much would do

dolphinheart:
Numbers 22:20-34 says otherwise.

The angel that guarded the isrealites on earth did not always take on a physical human body when he guided the Isrealites

SMH, I marvel at this your nitpicking legalistic exercise

dolphinheart:
The holy spirit did not take up human body when operating on earth

SMH, here we go again

dolphinheart:
At bold, God obtained a body for jesus, the angel told Mary that the son she will bear will be called "gods son"
Not "god the son", that sentence does not exist in the scriptures

Seriously step your game up bro
Bulk up, to fill into the, at the moment, oversized Holy Spirit shoes and suit

truthislight:
On the red, not so fast Watson.

You forgot to add Watson at the end

truthislight:
can we have some particulars? what evidence do you have for the statement on red?

Permit me to qualify the statement on red with this:
Satan, from time immemorial, has always been an ex-Heaven resident stopped having influence in the Heaven

truthislight:
I am keenly interested. when did that "time immemorial" started. and the evidences for that statement.

peace.

Please dont start asking a, how long is a piece of string, question.

Peace, love & hair grease.

BERNIMOORE:
ok, satan ''is'' a celestial being, are you ok with that now

Am not saying, you tried pulling a fast one on us there,
but only wanted to see how you stood, on whether satan is a celestial being or not a celestial being anymore
- one cant, on a matter like this, sit on the fence, like you first tried to do bro

BERNIMOORE:
But you know that satan Has no place among other celestials in heaven anymore! he has already fall out of Gods arrangements.

Rev 12:8 and 9
8 but they (Devil and his angels) did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer.
9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him

Yes, Satan, from time immemorial, has always been an ex-Heaven resident
and long gone lost favour with God

dolphinheart:
I think one issue should be cleared, are all invisible beings celestial?

https://i57.tinypic.com/34sp9j4.gif
Clearing this will depend on what ones understanding of what celestial is or what celestial means

You used to live in sin, just like the rest of the world, obeying the devil
--the commander of the powers in the unseen world.
He is the spirit at work in the hearts of those who refuse to obey God
- Ephesians 2:2

The earth was redeveloped/re-created for human beings (i.e. man)

and as such the only beings legally allowed to operated on earth are human beings
(i.e. beings with a BODY made from earth)

All celestial or invisible beings know this
They all understand that a body is needed in order to be legally living and operating on earth
- if any interested, can expatiate and give examples about this

This is how serious this is, even, God, Himself abided by this decree
and didnt make Himself an exception to it
God obtained a body in the person of Jesus, God the Son, to legally operate on earth

Boomark:
Please answer these questions honestly.

1. Do you agree that Jesus is a Messenger of God? E.g. "'Behold, I send My messenger,... And the Lord, whom you seek,... the Messenger of the covenant,... says the LORD of hosts" (full details at Malachi 3:1). Rev 1:1, God gave him a message to deliver to us of things to come(this is true no matter who finally deliver the message to us)

Yes, the word used in Malachi 3:1 is the Hebrew word ''Malaika'' which if in Greek ''Angelos'' would have been used.
Whether in Hebrew, Greek or English, angel means messenger or someone sent on errands
- a short journey undertaken in order to deliver a message, collect or do something, often on another's behalf.

Few examples could be:
Angels that after death, carried Lazarus to be at Abraham's side (i.e. Luke 16:22)
Angel from heaven, appearing at the Mount of Olives to strengthen God the Son before the crucifixion (i.e. Luke 22:43)
An angel sent to protect the Israelites on journey to the promised land and lead them safely to this place God prepared for them
(i.e. Exodus 23:20)

Boomark:
2. Do you agree that Angels are messengers of God?

Affirmatively, Psalm 103:20

Praise the LORD, you angels,
you mighty ones who carry out his plans,
listening for each of his commands.
- Psalm 103:20

Boomark:
3. Do you agree that in 1 and 2, Jesus and the Angels are messengers of God, doing similar work for God at different levels?
Use a Yes or No answer before adding your reasons.

A 'Yes and No' ONLY answer is not allowed.
Do not start by telling us how Jesus christ is God, use bible verses about messenger and, or Angels to support your submission.

Would like to hear from MuttleyLaff too.

Affirmatively, Malachi 3:1, Luke 16:22, Luke 22:43, Exodus 23:20 etcetera are instructive

BERNIMOORE:
did the bible says that satan was a cherub? show me word for word
did the bible say that satan was an angel word for word show me.

Tjayjosh:
You asked two questions. The answer is Yes for both.

#1 The bible doesnt and did not say that satan was a cherub

#2 The bible doesnt and did not say that satan was an angel
but from deductive and inductive reasonings based on scriptures like Jude 1:9, Revelation 12:7
it is evident that satan, at least, is a Seraphim and an ex-Arch-angel
(i.e. woldnt be an average typical or ordinary angel
but would have possibly been a Chief/Arch angel; one of the princes in God's court)

Demons as a matter of fact are fallen angels,
who instead of being God's angels, are now are satan's angels (i.e. satan's messengers)

Tjayjosh:
Trying to understand the scriptures deductively, may never give you the answers you truly need

If you believe this, then, looks like you arent familiar with Proverbs 25:2

It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.
- Proverbs 25:2

Deductive reasoning with the guidance of the Helper, the Holy Spirit, are a perfect match to understanding the scriptures bro.

Tjayjosh:
"You may frequently be like a blind man grooming in a dark room for a black cat which is not there". Most words as used in the Bible are metaphorical in nature. As you cannot seperate fish from water, you cannot seperate metaphor with the writen word of God. And the disciples came and said unto him, why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mystries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given (Matthew 13:10-11). Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said this is an hard saying; who can understand it? When jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you? What if ye shall see the son of man ascend up where he was before? It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that i speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life

Tjayjosh:
You need the spirit of God in you before you can fully understand and interpret His word.

Tut-tut-tut, ah that famous ''You need the spirit of God in you before you can fully understand and interpret His word'' cliche

Most, already have the spirit of God on
but the thing is, most havent grown out to fill the spirit of God they have on
Most need to ''bulk up'' to fill into the Spirit of God issued out

https://s15.postimg.org/y7dmr8ejv/Oversize_Suits.jpg
The spirit of God is like the shoes and clothes put on in the above picture
For some of us it is dangling on us because we havent grown to fill and fit into the shoes and suit
hence there would be issues with mobility due to this not bulking up
Progressing or moving from one truth to another will be impeded by the hanging and loosely fitting spirit of God

Tjayjosh:
Prophecy in Ezekiel 28:11-19 talked about the king of tyre. However, some of the descriptions in this bible passage go beyond any mere human king

All of the descriptions in that passage and the previous chapters are about the king mentioned in it

Tjayjosh:
In no sense could an earthly king claim to be “in Eden”

That earthly Tyre king wasnt in that literal ''Eden'' but was in this Eden mentioned in ''A Lament for Tyre'' in Ezekiel 27:21-23:

²¹The Arabians and the princes of Kedar sent merchants to trade lambs and rams and male goats in exchange for your goods.
²²The merchants of Sheba and Raamah came with all kinds of spices, jewels, and gold in exchange for your wares.
²³“Haran, Canneh, EDEN, Sheba, Asshur, and Kilmad came with their merchandise, too
- Ezekiel 27:21-23

The reason Ezekiel, was suggesting the King was in Eden, the garden of God, was because the King was so blessed by God, that the blessing, knowledge, might etcetera was virtually the same as like being in Eden, the garden of God
The king in essence, was on par with Adam and all Adam had, before Adam's fall from grace.

Tjayjosh:
or to be “the anointed cherub who covers” or to be “on the holy mountain of God.” Ezekiel 28:11–19 is a dual prophecy, comparing the pride of the king of Tyre to the pride of Satan as described in Isaiah 14:12-14. This exceptional long prophecy against Tyre shows a veiled description of satan (28:11-19) as the real power behind the king of Tyre.
Satan was not directly called an angel in the bible. For what we know, he was called "a cherub." A cherub/cherubim is an angel. A tiger my not be called a cat, but it is still a cat.

For what you havent known is, he, the King of Tyre and not satan, is the object of discussion in those verses.

Further to the bit explained above, it is the King of Tyre and NOT satan, who was compared to and/or called a cherub

Satan is more of a seraphim than being a cherub or cherubim

BERNIMOORE:
lets leave the guy out before he attacks you

I hear you, loud and clear

BERNIMOORE:
so that we can have a meaningful discussion, He is reduced to one Dimensional

Hmm

BERNIMOORE:
i think both (''is'' and ''was'') in my own context fits the fact that satan still remains celestial and invincible!

Haba Chief, you can't have your cake and eat it (too)
Wetin be ''i think both ''is'' and ''was''?''

It's either satan is a celestial being and due to the limitations of human beings' vision, is invisible to human beings' korokoro eyes
and satan, as up to now, remains still being a celestial being and invisible
(i.e. satan had not for a fraction of a second, EVER stopped to be a celestial being or at any time stopped being invisible to human beings)

No one, no human being, bible recorded or not, has ever seen satan before,
so what's with ''i think both (''is'' and ''was'') in my own context''?
What's that all about?

BERNIMOORE:
its a mind set,
most of the believers are not ready to come out of their comfort zone (what they are persuaded to believe)
and honestly test their convinction because of fear of failure so they hung to their 'untested beliefs' with a 'made up mind'
yet they get irritated when you prove your own convinction.

BERNIMOORE:
thats just the case of one john74 on this thread who never knew me from adam
and yet not interested in my topic yet calling me names
its funny anyway because since he has got no proof tangible i dont think i will have his time.

johnw74 knows what he is doing,
the jw name calling is a cunning plan designed to turn the state of affairs to his own advantage

Every time jw is typed, regardless of you saying you arent jw, it's used to try to drown you out or done to try and emasculate you

BERNIMOORE:
Of course yes, i agree that satan was a celestial beign and invincible being

Is the bold meant to be a past tense (i.e. ''was'') or present tense (i.e. ''is'')?

ifeness:
How has your god been behaving to you to make you trust it?

Whether it's acknowledged or not,
whether you care enough or dont care enough to admit it, if not controlled, everyone has a god of some sort, which behaves to them in a manner, enough for them to trust it

God, in this good relationship built on faith and trust behaves like a gentleman, and gave me power, love, sound mind and self-control.

BERNIMOORE:
The sentence above (in bold) is where i am driving my argument to, i decided to put the thread in a way that it will draw answers in a practical and comparable way, you think i dont know that satan was an angel?

I had previously gone through almost all your threads/posts if not all, and already came to realise you're in the ''Satan was an angel'' camp

Thats how I got to quote part of your previous thread which is relevant to this present one

BERNIMOORE:
of course you rightly quoted part of it, or that jesus was also an arch angel that run errands for God while some angels are under his control, some of my works in 2012 dealt with that. the thread was directed to the trinitarians that i have engaged before like OLAADEGBU and co.

Trinity or trinitarians, ah, a topic not good for the faint-hearted and/or religious bigot

BERNIMOORE:
i want to thank you for your sincerity since i discovered that we both agree on some of these issues

I want to thank you too, as you come across as level-headed.
Your postings are calm and sensible, you seem not afraid to get your feet wet feet,
nor dont mind delving further into deep waters,
I dont know why you dont mind the deep end,
maybe its because you know how to swim out or maybe it's due to the life-jacket you've strapped on

BERNIMOORE:
but there are areas we will still need to reconcile

1, satan as an Arch ange

Let start with this first,
do you agree that, first and foremost, satan is a celestial being

Satan, before angel or Arch-angel (i.e. which a step above an angel) comes into the picture, fundamentally, is an invisible being.

Secondly, its vital to agree that, not all celestial beings or invisible beings are angels, however all angels are celestial or invisible beings
Some celestial or invisible beings are stationed or have offices and dont go on errands
Some celestial or invisible beings, are stationed or have offices and combinedly, do go on errands

BERNIMOORE:
2, Jesus The Almighty God same as his father

This cant be adequately and satisfactorily addressed, until, what the word ''God'' means and/or what the word, ''God'', is all about, is expressed or put into words according to your understanding.

ifeness:
If claimed I paid some money into your bank account, won't you check you account balance or would you go shopping without being sure.

This is an easy question to answer, as the outcome of the answer is determined by the way in which we regard each other and how we've been behaving towards each other.

If the regard is high and the behaviour alright, of course, your word is bond,
faith and trust kicks in, so gladly, would go shopping without being sure

If the regard and behaviour is otherwise, there's need to check the account balance

ifeness:
If I don't find the Tomb,I wont believe the story.

Blessed is he, who, without finding the Tomb believes the story.