₦airaland Forum

ismhab: EVEN IF TO SAY THE LOWEST RANKING OFFICER USED TO EARN 1,000,000 NAIRA, HE WILL NEVER STOP COLLECTING 10 NAIRA FROM INNOCENT CITIZENS.

I COMPLETELY DISAGREE WITH YOUR OPINION. Poor pay encourages most of them to resort to other means in order to meet living cost. Our police should be well paid because the are doing a very sensitive job. If they were well paid and equipped, most of them will not resort to collecting bribes and will actually focus of doing their job.

In my opinion, minimum police pay should be N250,000 or more per month because of the importance and sensitive of their job. Pay for political office holders should be cut and this used to fund the police.

I am amazed at how many people on nairaland that think money is more valuable than Knowledge. This question is bit like asking someone to chose between Gold and Money. I will chose Gold anytime cos it will never loose its value and I can always exchange it for money.

I think the question here should be rephrased "Symfony vs Zend, which is better?" because really all the above mentioned PHP frameworks are trying to do exactly what these 2 PHP frameworks do best.

In terms of the 2 frameworks, I would have to give it to Symfony (especially version 2.0) as it is what I will call a fully mature PHP framework with all the features you need from a framework plus with Symfony you can develop and get your app to production at lightening speed ( which is really one of the main reasons why developers use PHP frameworks over straight PHP coding ). On the other hand Zend is also good but not a fully mature framework, it feels more like just a collection of classes/libraries rather than a full framework, though it gives you a lot of flexibility as to how you structure things. It doesn't allow you to develop at lightening speed like Symfony due to many configurations and set ups here and there that is needed. Documentation is very thin on the ground unlike Symfony.

For me Symfony 2.0 wins the day! http://symfony.com/

csharpjava:
Check the career section of the website of Microsoft, facebook and Apple which were started by the guys you have mentioned and see the people they employee. So why don't they advertise jobs for college drop out/self taught programmers?

Guy this is a pointless argument. If you have the opportunity and money to get degrees etc, by all means do it, it helps to develop you as a human. But just know that as far as programming is concerned, your paper qualification alone is not good enough to get you into the best jobs. The ppl with more experience even though no paper qualification will grab the best jobs and opportunities. So the earlier you finish your studies and start gaining experience, the better for you ( my candid advise )

csharpjava:
Well you are right the college drop out/self taught will get a job but will end up with NO LIFE AND NO MONEY.

You are so funny, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and Mark Zuckerberg don't have a life/money ? I hope you have more money and better life than them :-)

One particularly useful book was Professional Software Development. Chapter 4 can be read here: PSD: Chapter 4 .

A quote from the above link: A computer science graduate " might spend two days hand-tuning a sorting algorithm instead of two hours using a code library or copying a suitable algorithm from a book. The typical computer science graduate typically needs several years of on-the-job training to accumulate enough practical knowledge to build minimally satisfactory production software without supervision." On the other hand software engineering gratuates have already received this training during their studies at Uni.

@csharpjava, Dude, I am also a professional in the industry with years of experience and I studied it at Uni too. I can tell you categorically that the above write up is crap. During my undergrad days I had classes with both students in Software Engineering and Computer Science, and I can tell you Comp Sc. students spend more time programming than Software Engineering guys. Software engineering students spend majority of their time on things like requirements gathering, software architecture, software testing, and software deployment. In Software Engineering you will learn about working with people (communication, management, working with non-technical customers), processes for developing software, and how to measure and analyze the software product and the software process but you don't get much time in front of a computer writing code like a Comp. Sc. Student.

In any case, both Software Engineer and Computer Science students when they first graduate from Uni are no where as good as the college drop out/self taught dude that has been programming for years, they will require several years of experience and training to catch up with the college drop out/self taught dude. In practise, if all 3 were to apply for a Senior Programmer role, the college drop out/self taught will most likely get the job based on his experience and past contributions to projects. So it doesn't really matter what you study.

csharpjava:
You are very wrong, but this is not the right thread to discuss this further.

Hehehe, I am waiting for your explanation.

dammytosh:


Lol I feel you the fact that when you are at vacation, ur mac pro must be with u makes LIFE a capital NO,  That u can afford to stay at the beach all day in bahamas makes money TRUE.

I am a programmer too and i have not slept in my crib for days. I guess you know why. But Saying I Gat No Money, is damn false. Not too much though,  but enough to make some people feel oppressed 

I do not have to take my mac everywhere I go bro and unlike you I live life to the fullest despite being a programmer. I can chose my own working hours and location unlike most other professions and get well appreciated and financially rewarded for my effort. And  take holidays just like people in other professions when I practically don't even switch on my mac at all. So I don't know what you are on about lol

Plus I can get work in almost any part of the world

dammytosh:
PROGRAMMER ?


LIFE ===  NO




MONEY === YES


OTHERWISE === NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

LIFE === YES
MONEY === YES
OTHERWISE === MOST REWARDING PROFESSION EVER

I can lay in comfort on a beach in the  Bahamas in my beach shorts with my macbook remotely connected to my office in London and doing my job, where as you stay in a cramped up office somewhere in Europe or America shivering in subzero temperatures :-) . That's how rewarding this profession is, I can practically be travelling around the world living life to the fullest and still doing my job and getting paid lots of money :-)

@csharpjava, professional programmers (those who studied computer science) and  programmers ( self thought) don't matter these days, what counts most in the IT industry is your experience  and ability to use them to solve highly complex business problems in a very cost effective manner. Once you can do this and you are able to sell yourself in the right way, then you will get the best opportunities in IT, doesn't matter you have a degree or not.

Between, I am degree holder in Multimedia Computing from a UK University but it doesn't make me more of a programmer than a self thought programmer, what determines that is my ability to do the things I mentioned above. Getting a degree is one thing,being able to apply what you learnt in a commercial environment in a gainful and meaningful way is a completely different ball game.

Very humorous joke indeed.

Well we all know programming is one of the highly paid professions in developed countries and some developing countries. I know some programmers working in financial hubs like London and Zurich that get as much as 1000 euros/day. If you are lucky to come up with a fantastic product like Mark Zuckerberg, Steve Jobs or Bill gates did, then the sky is your limit in terms of financial rewards.

A lot of programmers these days are quite sociable unlike decades ago when some programmers used to lock themselves up in the basement of the flat writing code for the next ground breaking software.

@MrBible, Software Engineering and Programming are both branches of Computer Science. A Software Engineer by their profession deals with managing all the processes involved software development, from architecting the system, requirements gathering  to project managing it etc but has nothing to do with writing the actual software, that's the job of a programmer. So they are two different things. I would think employers would prefer a programmer with computer science instead of Software Engineering because a computer science graduate has had more hands on experience with coding than their Software Engineering counterpart. That's my take.

Kobojunkie:
I am convinced you are just trying to TWIST logic to score some brownie point for a policy you probably have little understanding for. Since when did FREE EQUAL Quality? Nigerians ehn!!! And you have access  to tons of free dictionaries online to help you if you have problems with word comprehension. I mean come ON!

The man is giving money for "FREE" education, and some of you here are now quick to claim it is auto-magically quality, when we know that Education is a rotten state nationwide, and has been for the better part of the last 3 decades.

So you sincerely believe that because something is not free makes it good quality ?? I have asked you to take cue from Sweden. The key is in the implementation/execution, not how much ppl pay. Ppl can pay millions yet the quality is rubbish, you can see this in some of our private Universities who charge outrageous fees and yet are not better than their state counter parts. For your information there is enough money in Imo to fund a world class primary and secondary education for free ! Rochas just need to cut government waste and plug loopholes, there is enough money in the state to fund it .

Kobojunkie:
Free Education = Quality Education??  

Expensive/Unaffordable Education = Quality Education ??, 70% of Nigerians live on less than $1 per day, so who will then attend your so called state of the arts schools, I guess the children of same crooks who are milking the rest of us plus foreigners who can afford the fees.

Yes free education = quality education if well executed. Take a cue from Scandinavia countries, Sweden in particular. They've got a very good standard of education yet none of their locals pay from their 1st day at school till when they graduate from University.

Emperoh:


That said, please show me any institution in the said Scandinavian countries that do not charge any fee?

That's why I said you need to do your research well before making any comment. Google is at your disposal, google any university in any Scandinavian country (Sweden, Finland, Denmark etc ) and see if they charge their local students and EU nationals any money to study. And even foreign students only pay in certain programmes not all.

I don't know where you ppl got the notion that free education equals low quality education, may be that's why politicians take advantage and rip us off, cos if they make it free we feel it is low quality. Go and do your research well, even certain Universities in Germany don't charge any fees, like the one in Cottbus

jumobi1:
We all know that. Do u think looting ends with this new regime? It doesn't. It may slow down but it will NOT stop. Rome wasn't built in a day.

The aim is to reduce corruption/looting and use these monies to do something for the common man.  Corruption/looting can't be eradicated, the are prevalent even in most advanced democracies

Emperoh:
The insincerity of past governments not withstanding, i doubt the workability of this directive
Not for anything but because i believe we are not doing it right.

Let's assume he has the money to properly cater for this venture and then does really sustain it.
Why not collect these fees and then use the money to upgrade ailing facilities and build non-existent facilities in these schools? This way, the school is up to date and then children get to learn better.

There is nowhere in the world quality education is free. Worse still in a country like Nigeria where we like to abuse any free venture, i am the least impressed by this. The saddest part of it is the state owned University.
Does the free education equally include non-indegenes?

How then does Rochas intend to build a research based institution of modern discoveries which is what Universities are meant to be? Is there any plan to fund research and development which these institutions are meant to champion? This is further promoting the ideology of our institutions being mere theoretical learning centres. theories that are not even properly thought i dare say.

What i suggest is sustaining the fees especially secondary and tertiary level. If the government is rich enough to sustain these free education, use the monies collected from fees to improve educational infrastructure and support research and development or encourage those willing to discover or that have discovered new things.

Free Education? It is not the best. Maybe till primary education!!!

@at the bolded statement, my friend will you shut up ! go and do your research well. Most Scandinavia countries don't pay any tuition up to university level and also only this year did they start charging foreign students tuition in those countries, but education for locals and EU nationals still remain free. Why can't we have such in Imo state and entire Nigeria ? You ppl are so blind not to see that the money looted away by politicians is enough to fund free high quality education in this country and we will still more than enough for infrastructure and other things.

Kobojunkie:
Stop with the silly pretense that this is the first time you have heard of people PAYING application fees for jobs.  We are talking Nigeria here where you pay for practically every thing, even some scholarship applications mind you.

Like I said we can go on arguing about this but it wouldn't change anything. Rochas will have to make more difficult and unpopular decisions such as this, if he is serious about transforming IMO, and ppl will call him names and say all sorts of things about him cos of these very difficult decisions he has to make but only if he preserves will he succeed and raise Imo from its ruins.

Imo ppl should brace themselves for some painful restructuring.

Kobojunkie:
WOW . . . what a pathetic response. So, jobs have been suspended -- and that is the end for you?  

Well if the so called "educated" young men were stupid enough to pay for something that is meant to be free, then they are getting what they deserve. The matter still remains that IMO can't afford to keep those jobs cos there's no money to pay them, you can argue this forever or challenge it in any law court in the land, it will not change anything. Better still you can go uproot Douglas House ( Official Residence of the Governor ) and take it back to your place, it will not change anything. Thats the point I am making.

@Dozieson, you are an outright lier ! they so called ppl that Ohakim employed have not been paid for any of the work they did. It is more than 6 months now !

I am not even sure any of the things you claim is true. You are just one of Ohakim thugs trying to rubbish Rochas.

These jobs by Ohakim is a fraud ! and personally I think Imo State has an overbloated public sector workforce, going forward Rochas needs to cut this down by removing ghost workers and unproductive/duplicate roles within the ministries, also executives in the ministries will have to take pay cuts. How can a small state like Imo spend N1.9billion per month on public sector wages alone ?

Dozieson, you  better go back to lag and start hussling cos we have no place for unproductive jobs within the public sector in Imo

kasiem:
never mind, edicolove is trying to stick to the antecedents of the laid down laws without taking into cognizance that the interests of the masses are paramount in times of emergency.

I like his antecedents but he needs to apply a bit more common sense to the Law, allowing for those emergencies where ppl's will/common sense prevail, we all see this in our daily lives for example when driving on a motorway in a snowy/rainy day on a road that says you should go no slower than 50 miles/hr. Highway code (the law) stipulates that you do not go lower than 50miles/hr but common sense tells you the road conditions are not good enough for such speeds, in the interest and safety of you and other road users, you have to break the law and go below the legal speed.

kasiem:
man, u dont need to totally blame our constitution for this  mishap, but u have to hang on the need to make out a space for emergencies like this "which i'm sure that delegated legislation/power can cater for", to be adequately treated with that doctrine of necessity. In all the constitutions of the world there are some places that needs some  rehab to cater for the need of time and that makes the doctrine of necessity as the only viable option.

I am not blaming it all on the constitution, even if our constitution was perfect, the Peoples power still have the final say and can overrule the constitution at anytime. I just couldnt understand why edicolove would stand so high to defend the Nigerian constitution in this case, seeing that our current constitution is riddled with signs of fraud in every angle. It does not at all reflect the will of the majority

If it were possible to prosecute Ohakim for all the billions he carted away while he is still a sitting Governor, then Rochas will not have to go against the law to protect the interest of the majority

@edicolove, I don't know why any sane person will stand up to defend the current constitution of The Federal Republic of Nigeria ? Our current constitution is a complete fraud! it does not by any means reflect the will of the majority nor protect their interest, it was particularly crafted to protect the interests of a few LOOTOCRACTS. A constitution that gives immunity from prosecution to a serving LOOTOCRACT public office holder does not protect the interest of the ppl at all.

I would suggest to the next National Assembly to put up Nigerian constitution for a debate, as it is a fraud and does not protect the interest of the common Nigerians. Until this is done, we will have a lot of cases where the ppl will jettison the constitution and act outside the law to protect their common interest since the constitution has failed completely to do this.

1025:
rochas at the moment is not able to decide anything for the state govt. all he can do is to wait patiently till the 29th of may 2011 before he starts acting. all these noises will end as soon as he becomes the gov. this is my fear about these rulers. i want that time when criminal rulers will pay for their evils deeds while in office but we are yet to see that happen.

Well he knows what he will get from Imo People if he is not what we expected, everyone is enlightened now and we are waiting, if he under performs or follows Ohakim's foot steps, we will show him the door like we did to Ohakim.

edicolove:
you can accept what you want. my only suggestion is that you dont use double standards, i will be watching out for you to see if you will complain when someone else uses non legal means and it affects you negatively. since you think it is ok, you must accept it when it doesnt favour you or you will be an hypocrite. 2 wrongs dont make a right. you dont correct a wrong with another wrong.

The constitution, law or whatever you call it, is a guideline as to how things should work but the final power lies with the ppl. The constitution is a mere document that can be changed by the people when they see it fit, it is not meant to overide the People power. With regards to ppl trying to use non legal means to achieve things, if it does not have the full support of the ppl , we will stop it ! at least we have shown that in Imo, and Rochas knows this very well that he risks being removed by the ppl of Imo if he does something unpopular.

edicolove:
and please stop being assuming and speculative. did you conduct a poll to know how many people in Imo agree with this? people power is not determined by mob on the streets. that is why we have constitutional conferences. otherwise, the almajiris in the north would have been right to kill those corpers. you are talking like buhari who sits in an armchair and says everybody likes him. you should never make generalised statements because even the most loved people in the world have their enemies who dont like them. Rochas did not win by 90% so dont make such assumptions. i can guarantee you that before the end of his first year, he will have people talking about his flaws. thats the way the world is. just be truthful and just. those are the only virtues in life that can stand the test of time.

You are not on ground here in IMO, so don't say what you don't know.  In Owerri (the state capital) and other areas, the feeling is that we will do anything to stop this tyrant (Ohakim). And who told you Imo ppl voted for Ohakim ? He was busy distributing money to traditional rulers and INEC officials in the open when he was supposed to be campaigning and trying to convince us why we should vote for him. He Ohakim knows clearly well that he is the most hated individual in IMO and all the votes he got was the one his unscrupulous INEC officials managed to award him (not from the IMO ppl ). Please don't say what you don't know cos you are not on ground in IMO.

@edicolove, people power/support supercedes any law or constitution any country might have. 9 out of every 10 Imo citizen support the step Rochas has taken whether legal or not legal. Also like someone mentioned earlier, the banks are private entities and are not obliged to take this directive from the Gov. elect but have chosen to do so to protect their business interest and may be in sympathy for the plight of Imo citizens whom Ikedi Godson Ikiri Ohakim has continously looted, flogged and maltreated without any iota of respect.

We welcome the pro-activeness of Rochas, we do not want a reactive leader like you suggest. Waiting till he is sworn in and then to start probing Ohakim is a waste of time and state resources which we imolites can't  afford, we are already in debt to the tune of N120billion (thanks to Ohakim), our monthly internally generated revenue has shrunk to N530million and he also left us with educational, health and agricultural sectors which are in a very bad state (worse state since the creation of Imo in 1976).

We don't have time to probe past regimes and wasting precious state resources (follow the legal process ), he needs to get to work as soon as he is sworn in, he needs funds to do this and his actions is in our interest, WHETHER LEGAL OR NOT LEGAL. CASE CLOSED !

rasputinn:
Has Rochas been sworn in yet?
Where did he derive the powers to freeze the accounts??

He derived it from the ppl of Imo State, thats what we asked him to do. He may not be acting constitutionally but he has the ppl's backing to take this pro-active step. The ppl's power supercedes the bogus Nigerian constitution that is based on LOOTOCRACTIC tendencies.

enyojo:
You took the words straight from my mind.
The bankers who are more happier to obey an unseen instruction from A governor-elect rather than do the biddings of a constitutionally-backed Substantive Governor know better. Remember that those bank officials stay in Imo state and they know the looting of the treasury taking place there.
They know better.

So what are you saying ? It is constutitional to allow Ohakim empty the state treasury ? while we wait for inept Nigerian Judiciary and Law enforcement to catch and prosecute him (if that will ever happen ). Dude I suppose you don't live in Nigeria, so you dont know whats on the ground. Nigeria doesn't practise the democracy you were taught about during your school days, at the moment Nigeria is practising LOOTOCRACY supported by a bogus constitution which protects public office holders from prosecution.

Hope one day we will start practising democracy like we studied during school days and like it is done in US and other advanced democracies. Until then we need proactive Governors like Rochas, and if the bankers do not carry out his directive, those accounts will be moved to another financial institution come May 29th !

Chikena !

For all those talking about legality of Okorocha's action, we all know it is not legal but definitely a step in the right direction. There is very little chance that the law will catch up with Ikiri (Ohakim) for all the looting after leaving office on the 29th. If Okorocha allows him to empty state account before he is sworn in, then he has already put himself in a more difficult situation.

We need more proactive Governors like Okorocha in our democracy who can think on their feet and respond to envolving situations, not reactive Governors that wait for the damage to be done, then they try to remedy it when it is already too late.

Ride on Owelle, the whole Imo is with you !

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Buhari and the Islamisation Project for Nigeria
What follows below are excerpts from various weighty articles from academia. They are words not to be taken with any levity, I leave you to contribute and expand the knowledge bank, research further and make up your mind. Its chilling stuff, read on:

Quote
It is part of the history of Nigeria, that General Olusegun Obasanjo, as the successor of General Murtala had problems with pushing through, the Islamization Plan of Murtala. The believers in Murtala's Islamization Plan in the Supreme Military Council, Shehu Yar'Adua, Babangida and Buhari were not powerful enough to push the plan through. They had problems with the avid defenders of the secularism in the Supreme Military Council led by the Service Chiefs {General TY Danjunma (Army), Commodore Isa Doko (Airforce) and Rear Admiral Adelanwa (Navy)}. Tinkling with what the Constituent Assembly approved was what General Obasanjo's regime could do and it did precisely that

Prof. Omo Omoruyi

Research Fellow
African Studies Center
Boston University
Boston, MA, USA

http://www.nigerianpeoples.info/fw-enyimba-please-read-an-article-by-omo-omoruyi

Quote
Although Babangida took the rap for Nigeria's sneaky upgrade to full membership of the Organization of Islamic Conference (OIC), according to a study on Nigeria funded by the US Defense Department in the early 1990s, it was actually Buhari who without any regard whatsoever for the sensibilities of Nigerians of other faiths, submitted the application to upgrade Nigeria's membership from the observer status it had enjoyed since the Gowon regime to full membership. The OIC's review of the application was concluded after Babangida's palace coup. Rather than reverse Buhari's action, Babangida quietly allowed Nigeria's new status as a full-fledged member of the OIC to stand. Buhari's OIC action exposed him as a religious zealot, who will have no qualms in rousing and ginning up Sharia issues, quiescent for several years now, following its aggressive unveiling in Zamfara, where Buba Bello Jangebe's wrist was amputated for stealing a cow, and Safiya Husseini was sentenced to die by stoning for adultery while her co-participant in the act was not prosecuted because he was male.

-Matthew Uzukwu, Ph.D.

http://nigeriaworld.com/articles/2010/dec/171.html


Quote
The move by Nigeria to join the Organization of Islamic Conference (O.I.C), initiated by Buhari and amplified by Babangida,
also almost tore the nation apart. General Babangida, whose regime was welcomed because of his restoration of the freedom
of speech after the days of Buhari/Idiagbon, shocked many Nigerians with this development. It was ironic that many of the
key members of his government who were Christians claimed to be ignorant of such move

- Clarion University of Pennsylvania, Clarion, Pennsylvania

http://www.jsd-africa.com/Jsda/V12No5_Fall2010_A/PDF/Religious%20Politics%20and%20its%20Implications%20for%20Sustainable%20Development%20(Familusi).pdf

Very Interesting Titbits
Quote
But the period of General Babangida (1985-1993) represented the beginning of unmitigated Islamization of Nigeria. General Babangida was one of the loyal followers of General Murtala. This was why General Babangida took the fateful decision in 1986 to face the Nigerian Christians in particular and Nigerians in general with the plan of Muslims. He without the approval of the governing organs of the Federal Military Government organized a mission led by a non-member of the Government, the Sultan of Sokoto to formally admit Nigeria into the Organization of Islamic Conference (OIC). When the Chief of General Staff, Commodore Ubitu Ukiwe complained that he knew nothing about it and definitely said that he could not remember the matter coming to the Armed Forces Ruling Council (AFRC), he was shown his way out. The Christians took it. The Christian leaders bought the plan of the Military President to keep them talking under the auspices of a 20-man panel to 'examine the implications of the country's full membership of the organization'. This was a diversion and the Christians were victims. This was not all.

Prof. Omo Omoruyi

Research Fellow
African Studies Center
Boston University
Boston, MA, USA

http://www.nigerianpeoples.info/fw-enyimba-please-read-an-article-by-omo-omoruyi
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I am not a big fan of any of the presidential candidates, but Beaf the idea about the possibility of one man being able to impose Sharia on 150million people in a democratic despensation is rubbish ! If a President can do that, then it is time to vote out your good for nothing  PDP senators and House rep. members because they are no longer representing our interests. It is called government of the people by the people and for the people, for a reason. He had a golden opportunity to Islamize Nigeria as a Military Dictator, if he didn't do it then, It is impossible to do it now. It is impossible to get such thing through NASS