₦airaland Forum

jamesid29:
Like I said earlier, the article you are pointing to doesn't agree with your understanding of infinitive absolute when used as an adverb to make emphasis(repetition of words twice).
Here are the statements I'm interacting with:





All this are incorrect statements because that is not what the Hebrew grammar is conveying and that's definitely not what the article you are linking to is saying.
Like I said in my previous post, I am not interacting with your theological conversation. If you don't agree with the fact that they died spiritually that day, that's fine; You just have to come up with the type of death that happened that day(cos obviously they didn't drop dead physically). Or you can alternatively try to exegete that "beyôm" doesn't necessarily mean " in that day" literally and that it could be taken as anyday in the future in which God decides. That's another way of going about it(And that's the way your article went, even though I do not find his arguments convincing as there were a few unexplained positions taken e.g;He takes "beyôm" literally for the spiritual death but not literally for the physical death, but does not give any real reason why the switch up.... But again that's a different conversation & not the one we are having).

What you cannot do though is use the Hebrew grammar in the text to say they entered into a "state of dying", or a state of slow/gradual death, or that it means they will die a slow death(begin the process of deterioration).
That's not what "muth tamuth" means and that's not how infinitive absolutes in that form functions boss.
"Muth tamuth" just means,the certainty of their death is assured but as I pointed out above, you can play around with the "in that day(beyôm)" part and make the claim that it's not meant to be taking literally and God even though He has already decreed the certainty of their death, would in his sovereignty decide which day He would take their life.
But as I also said earlier though, personally I don't buy that line of argument and I believe there are better arguments that are more faithful to the text and explain better how physical death entered into the world. But in all fairness,its also not a bad argument.


And that's what I was bringing to your attention. Not that you were totally wrong with your understanding but that You were conflating the different functions of infinitive absolute. A) Infinitive Absolute used to express certainty of a verbal action ,when paired with a finite verb of the same root(i.e same word repetition but one functioning as an adverb as a way of laying emphasis on the certainty of an action/word)
B) Infinitive absolute used to express progression or continuance of verbal action, when used with the specific root "halowk (הלךְ/going)".


I believe you are not still getting my point,but It's fine bro.
I think I also need to work on my art of rhetoric(part of vision 2021 lol).

Happy New year bro. And may we be here again in good health and joyous peace by this time next year.

paxonel:
Initially, the pastor rightfully pointed that in Genesis 6:4 angels contaminated the earth by breeding giants with men which was the reason God destroyed the eath during Noah days.

He then quoted Jesus statement in Matthew 24:37 saying that...

Matthew 24:37 [As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.

But meanwhile, he failed to consider what Jesus said in that same Matthew 24

Matthew 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Infact, the pastor was even suggesting that since there were hybrid men(giants) in the days of Noah, hybrid men is coming in our future

JojoAbeka:
“When you take the vaccine, it makes your DNA alterable - so you are ready to become a genetically modified human being,” the Christ Embassy Founder asserted without scientific backing.

matrix199:
What's the point listening/watching when the ones listened to/watched during the lockdown were full of gibbers.
.

Martian:
There is no supernatural Jew coming to save you petra1, and if the “end time” comes, you will end up dead in the cataclysm like the rest of the damn planet. Have you Christians been exempt from COVID-19 fatalities?

paxonel:
wait o! Is this man your pastor?
Omo! You don enter

lexy2014:
I didn't ask u what it is or what it isn't. This is what I asked u:

By carrying cameraman to d "mountain" to video him while he is praying, will that not quench d spirit?

MuttleyLaff:
What do you take me for?
How do you think I was able to make my comments if I didnt cringeworthily listen to the entire thing.
It's just finished and closed with an outro, same as the delusional and ludicrous faking the gift of speaking in tongues intro.

Apostle Peter and Jude quoting from the BoE, isnt them accepting the content they were paraphrasing and quoted.

lexy2014:
By carrying cameraman to d "mountain" to video him while he is praying, will that not quench d spirit?

Obc1234:
Hmmm
We don't want any prophesies

MuttleyLaff:
Tell me something I dont already know.

I know the bad teaching started at the 30 mins mark because you already said so in the original post.

MuttleyLaff:
TRanscript sic for an over two and a half hours video?
What a delusional and ludicrous faking the gift of speaking in tongues intro, smh sigh

paxonel:
When the hybrid men did not come, After he go change am say i meant Robot.

Robot are coming!

Image123:
This people don't learn. Go and learn about Jesus.

jamesid29:
I believe you are conflating two different concepts:
1) An Infinitive absolute verb form paired together with the finite verb of the same root word as a way of expressing the certainty of an action (That is: repeating the same root word twice with one of them being an infinitive absolute inorder to lay emphasis).

2) Infinitive construct used with certain prepositions like "ke(כְּ/as)" to denote the commencement of an action or use the infinitive absolute of the specific root "halowk (הלךְ/going)" to convey a sense of continuance of the action of the main verb.

This two concepts are different and convey different meanings.

Basically when a word is repeated twice with one being in an infinitive absolute verb form and the other,a finite verb form, the infinitive absolute acts as an adverb in expressing intensity, certainty or completeness of the main verb. Hence in most cases, translation would use words like "surely", "definitely", "certainly", "without doubt" etc to try an convey what the text is saying.

E.g .
Gen 37:33 "Joseph has surely(or without doubt) been torn to pieces" ( here we have the word taraph(to tear) repeated twice "taroph toraph". The infinitive absolute verb form followed by the finite verb form to convey the conviction in Jacobs mind that without a doubt, Joseph has been torn to pieces.

Same concept is conveyed in Gen 2:17 the word "die" is repeated twice in the form of "dying" and die "moth tamuth" and is translated as "surely die" to convey the certainty that in the very day they eat of the fruit, they will surely die(not that they would be in a state of dying).

The link you posted from answersingenesis also agrees with petra1 that in that very day, Adam and Eve died( spiritually).


A popular example of the other usage(2) in my write-up is Judges 14:9, where you have the infinitive absolute "halowk(going)" used with the verb "akal(to eat) to express a continuing action of eating.
"He took some of it in his hands and went going and-eating".
Translated as: "He scraped it out into his hands and went on, eating as he went".

MuttleyLaff:
It mattered to you enough to what to make a case with both words, try to hard to make phrase count and mean what your preconceived idea was with them

MuttleyLaff:
Should in case you dont realise, "that" and/or "same" aren't even in the original Hebrew text for the word(s) to be emphasised

MuttleyLaff:
The operative word "to" in the "to die" Hebrew original saying, disqualifies any consideration of instantaneousness.

Lucifer1419:
similarities to other stories
unavoidable contradictions
the logical explanation
Similarities to Other Stories
The similarities between the stories and characters in the Bible and those from previous mythologies are both undeniable and well-documented. This would be obvious if it weren’t for early indoctrination of these beliefs into children, which usually makes them unassailable as adults.
In this short piece I’ll attempt to show extraordinary similarities with regard to two of the most important Biblical narratives: the genesis story and the character of jesus christ.

The Book of Genesis’s Flood Story Mirrors The Epic Of Gilgamesh From Hundreds Of Years Earlier

Here are a number of elements that both Gilgamesh and the flood story in Genesis share:

God decided to send a worldwide flood. This would drown men, women, children, babies and infants, as well as eliminate all of the land animals and birds.
God knew of one righteous man, Ut-Napishtim or Noah.
God ordered the hero to build a multi-story wooden ark (called a chest or box in the original Hebrew), and the hero initially complained about the assignment to build the boat.
The ark would have many compartments, a single door, be sealed with pitch and would house two of every animal species.
A great rain covered the land with water.
The ark landed on a mountain in the Middle East.
The first two birds returned to the ark. The third bird apparently found dry land because it did not return.
The hero and his family left the ark, ritually killed an animal, offered it as a sacrifice.
The Babylonian gods seemed genuinely sorry for the genocide that they had created. The God of Noah appears to have regretted his actions as well, because he promised never to do it again.
Keep in mind the level of detail in these similarities. It’s not a matter of just a flood, but specific details: three birds sent out, resisting the call to build the ark, and a single man being chosen by God to build the ark. Then consider that the first story (Gilgamesh) came from Babylon — hundreds of years before the Bible was even written.
Do you honestly think, based on the similarities above, that those who wrote the Genesis story had not heard the Gilgamesh story? And if they had heard it, and they were simply rehashing an old, very popular tale, what does that say about the Bible?

MuttleyLaff:
"Sin came into the world through one man, and his sin brought death with it.
As a result, death has spread to the whole human race because everyone has sinned."
- Romans 5:12

"So you see, just as death came into the world through a man,
now the resurrection from the dead has begun through another man."
- 1 Corinthians 15:21

Maybe you missed that I crossed out "very suddenly" in your post. You are parking in ordinarily "muth" when the verse focused on "muth muth" Besides, "very suddenly. . ." in that Strong's Concordance excerpt, has a prepended "X" to it. The "X" means, "very suddenly. . ." when used or taken into consideration, multiples the original meaning of the word, it now is trying to associate with.



You need to become familiar with Hebrew infinitive absolute construct

The scripture clearly states that through one man death came into the world. From reading Romans 5:12 & 1 Corinthians 15:21, what death do you think Genesis 2:17 is talking of and that true to form, did so happen to man?

MuttleyLaff:
"Muth, muth", means "slow death" period.

. . .surely, x very suddenly. . .

MuttleyLaff:
"¹⁶And the LORD God commanded him,
“You may eat freely from every tree of the garden,
¹⁷but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil;
for in the day that you eat of it, you will surely die."
- Genesis 2:16-17

The Hebrew words "muth, muth", used in Genesis 2:17 above, when translated from meaning "to die", says "for in the day that you eat of it, you will begin to die" and that is exactly what happened, in that A&E surely did begin to die.

There's nothing in the verse nor chapter that put forward a consideration of spiritual death. This is erroneous assumption passed down from bad learning

MuttleyLaff:
.
Spiritual death, is instantaneous. It occurs immediately, whereas, physical death, though the process has started, it is delayed. It is slow, its dragged out and often is over a long time period, lmso.

"You will not sureply die

Tookool:
Looks like a very wayward woman to me. Since the state government had agreed to investigate the matter why go on social media?