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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus (12785 Views)
A Question For The JWs: Why "Jehovah Witnesses" And Not "Jesus Witnesses"? / The Site Of The Burial And Resurrection Of Jesus Christ, The Tomb Is Empty / Five Things You Never Knew About Jehovah's Witnesses. (2) (3) (4)
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 4:37pm On Mar 23, 2019 |
Barristter07:In other words, Jesus didn't eat after Resurrection? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 4:37pm On Mar 23, 2019 |
Barristter07:Did Jesus ate and drank after resurrection or not? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 5:34pm On Mar 23, 2019 |
Emusan: It's beyond your grasp , Matthew 15:17 is still there. if Christ is Human, after eating , What happen to the food ? #Question tagged M1
Emphasis on " at that very moment " That doesnt mean the Angel is actually human. @Red , Same applies to Jesus, he was flesh at that moment he materialized . that doesn't mean that's he is actually human .
Your knowledge is so low, why the prophecy if materializing can produce Blood for forgiveness of sins ? Leviticus 17:11 the Life of ANY FLESH is in the Blood . A Materialized flesh, its life doesn't depend on blood ... It was a just a tangible appearance. The manifesting spirit doesn't need blood for survival like EARTHLY beings.
---- Dead point, after saying this he went ahead to EAT ... If he was human, would he visit the toilet or not ? Further reference to the angel saying he was a Man to Manoah
I though you said SAME BODY he died In ? Why transformation again confused human being
Blood is LIFE of an human , a materialized person isn't human and needs no blood to survive . 1 Like |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 5:51pm On Mar 23, 2019 |
Shepherd00: If he Materialized, It doesn't matter if he ate or not. It vanish once he returns to its spirit form . To get a clearer Picture, angels are SEXLESS ... But they appear as MALES when Materialized , doesn't mean they are actually males, that Vanish once they return to their Spiritual realm . But since you claim Jesus is HUMAN, then he must visit the toilet after eating , according to Matthew 15:17 . and defecating ONLY proves he is mortal who needs to defecate to survive. Comprehende ? 1 Like |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 6:14pm On Mar 23, 2019 |
Barristter07:This is the presumptions upon which Charles Tass Russel built the Watch Tower Organization. You leave what is obvious to talk about what you presume. Answer me, Did Jesus have flesh and bones after resurrection? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 9:04pm On Mar 23, 2019 |
Barristter07: Show us the bible passage that said jesus Christ went to toilet or didn't go to toilet after resurrection You are trying to force down a narrative based on your assumptions down peoples throats. The bible never said jesus Christ resurrected as a spirit took someone else's body your leaders said so. Bible never said jesus Christ went to toilet or didn't go to toilet you just assumed. All your assumptions not even one bible verse to justify it. Smh |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 7:08am On Mar 24, 2019 |
Hairyrapunzel:These people are a terrible bunch of heretics. They say Jesus was Angel Michael by assuming that since Angels are messengers of God and Jesus was also a Messenger, Jesus was Angel Michael. When you show scriptures winch says no Angel was ever called a Son of God, they'll skip from it and say something else. Anyone who has a problem with the personalty of Jesus is not of God. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 8:23am On Mar 24, 2019 |
Shepherd00: Seems you are on freezing mode, go back to that post and highlight any presumptions you found . If None. Keep quiet 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 9:04am On Mar 24, 2019 |
Barristter07: See your presumptions below. Barristter07: Bible never said anything about Jesus visiting the toilet after eating. So your statement is just your assumption. No proof of your statement. You can edit your Bible and put jesus Christ defecating or not defecating since it will make you feel better. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 9:05am On Mar 24, 2019 |
Barristter07: Did Jesus Christ have flesh and bones after resurrection? Answer the question abi shame dey catch you? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Emusan(m): 2:12pm On Mar 24, 2019 |
This is the point I actually want and I've gotten it "he was flesh at that moment he materialized" My further reply is just to expose your ignorance the more... Barristter07: Or beyond your stupidity. Emphasis on " at that very moment " But the angel must ACTUALLY be a HUMAN within that time frame... isn't it @Red , Same applies to Jesus, he was flesh at that moment he materialized . that doesn't mean that's he is actually human Now you agreed Jesus was a FLESH at that very moment and you've been shouting that the life of FLESH is in the BLOOD, shouldn't there be a BLOOD running in those MATERIALIZED bodies Confused idiot... But Jesus told His disciples that "It is I myself" Why would Jesus lie when He knew He was not the actual Human To extend that He said, "touch me and see for a spirit has not flesh and bones as you see me have" Your knowledge is so low, why the prophecy if materializing can produce Blood for forgiveness of sins?[quote] See how confuse you are: 1. the life of ANY FLESH is in the blood 2. Jesus and angels materialized IN FLESH... 3. Yet there own FLESH doesn't need blood to function...then it's obvious they can't be alive since there's no BLOOD that holds LIFE The irony of it all is that, you don't believe a spirit reside inside the flesh, how come this their FLESH can now function without blood? Finally, you shot yourself in the leg by claiming "The manifesting spirit doesn't need blood for survival like EARTHLY beings." I've proven it to you that to MATERIALIZED means to become human at that very moment which means their flesh must operate and become fully EARTHLY BEING, that's why they can eat like human does. So, for them to operate under this earthly new material, it means their spirit was COVER with the earthly flesh. This is what you're trying to subscribe to but unfortunately you don't believe in spirit dwelling in human flesh... Dead point, after saying this he went ahead to EAT ... If he was human, would he visit the toilet or not ? But you just agreed that he was FLESH at that very moment, isn't FLESH conote that He was fully human Will those angel also visit the toilet You think you're discussing with your hall people. I though you said SAME BODY he died In ? Why transformation again confused human being Jesus said not me...He even challenge them to come and touch, it's JWs that denied that fact. Blood is LIFE of an human , a materialized person isn't human and needs no blood to survive . Liar then materialized didn't take place if they aren't FULLY human (EARTHLY BEING). But how come can they eat and drink if they weren't human You keep dipping yourself into more wahala... |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Emusan(m): 2:16pm On Mar 24, 2019 |
Hairyrapunzel: He agreed with me that Jesus has FLESH but still in his delusion that it's not actually real Jesus. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 2:19pm On Mar 24, 2019 |
Emusan: Lol. Even jesus Christ is not the real Jesus. Hmmm |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 6:49pm On Mar 24, 2019 |
Barristter07:See how you are dodging? This is from the Lord Himself. Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. Again, did Jesus resurrect with flesh and bones? If you doge this, then it will be obvious that you are dubious. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Nobody: 8:08am On Mar 25, 2019 |
Shepherd00:Why would there be any dodging in what neither my father nor my family penned down? Jesus was resurrected in the body or in the flesh is truly a matter for debate,but we must consider all the scriptural references before coming to agree on a conclusion. If he was resurrected in the same body,how come his own disciples failed to recognise him after the resurrection? Luke 24:15-32, John 20:13-18 Luke's account said their eyes failed to recognise him,he called them 'senseless' because they're still confused as to all that he had taught them,finally they recognised him through actions NOT appearance! So if some people now say Jesus was resurrected in the spirit form[1Corinthians 15:42-45] which could be changed at any given period for a purpose,i don't think such a person or group of persons should be attacked or antagonised! Angels are spirits,yet they often put together a form of body to do certain things. ¤Eat with people. Genesis 18:1-8 ¤Wrestle with people. Genesis 32:24-28 |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 9:51am On Mar 25, 2019 |
Maximus69:Why did you dodgeLuke 24:39? Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. This is what I have noticed you JWs, you leave what is obvious to dwell on what is presumed. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Nobody: 10:40am On Mar 25, 2019 |
Shepherd00:That is not dodging Sir,it is called overall comprehensive conclusion! I quoted several verses pointing to the fact that Jesus suddenly became unrecognisable after his resurrection,and there must be a reason for that! So if JWs concluded that Jesus wasn't resurrected in the flesh,then they needed to explain why he said that to Thomas. Of course they explained that Jesus taught his followers a lot of things out of which many couldn't be grasped within those few years he spent with them,but gradually the holy spirit will remind them of all the things he taught them in order to compare with other events and come an accurate knowledge of the TRUTH! If you are saying that Jesus resurrected in the flesh,it's also a welcome development but you'll have to explain why he continued to appear in UNRECOGNISABLE bodies! This is how to reason together from the same book[Bible] not when you stick to an event and refuse to consider what the other person is pointing at! 1 Like |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Shepherd00: 11:09am On Mar 25, 2019 |
Maximus69:Treat that scripture sir. Does Spirits have bones? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Nobody: 1:24pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Shepherd00:I am not a doctor Sir, just a student of the Bible that's ready to observe all those claiming Christians and those criticizing FACTS. So if you aren't competent enough to explain why Jesus became unrecognisable after his resurrection,then the JWs got it right! Jesus became a spirit person after his resurrection, every other event happened to convince Thomas who's understanding by then can't grasp the whole issue. Why did you think Paul wrote that letter and included those explanations? Of course God's holy spirit guided this fast learner to help many of them grasp what Jesus taught them later. People like you would have castigated Paul for rebuking Peter publicly,you would be saying he has no right to correct Peter who spent almost all his life as a relation and disciple of Jesus. Yet Peter became truly confused in a case involving Jewish and Gentile Christians, why? Jesus taught them that he came for the lost sheep of the house of Israel,and Jesus never eat with a Gentile so how will Peter treat all that now that God's holy spirit have counted gentiles as part of the Christian family? Jehovah's Witnesses have made themselves clear that Jesus did so many things while teaching his followers but not all could be fully grasped until much later. John 16:12 Spirits don't have bones,but how will Thomas be convinced that this person is his master that was killed since he has vowed never to believe until he SEE somethings? Hmmm Jesus must do something to help this faithful and loyal friend to fully understand that he is now alive,so Paul was given the wisdom to explain that what they all saw wasn't the same body but a spirit person! 1Corinthians 15:42-44 God bless you Sir. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Nobody: 2:01pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
The body we carry is what makes us recognisable,so any slight changes could make us UNRECOGNISABLE. Road side artists do make paintings to advertise there skills and what they do is making paintings of popular public figures or celebrities. This will convince a passersby that if i should give him/her my photograph he could do something like this with it. So they truly needed pictures of easily RECOGNISABLE celebrities. Jesus wasn't that popular by face to the public because he is always in the midst of a crowd after those in the neighbourhood has heard that Jesus is around,but his family,friends and disciples have no problem in recognising him. So how come the whole thing changed suddenly after his resurrection,that even his closest confidants can't recognise him until they notice his ACTIONS? Apostle Paul explained to all Christians that during the resurrection of spirit anointed persons[those baptised in spirit], they will become spirits and so their former fleshly body is no more needed! Jehovah's Witnesses teaches that 144,000 from amongst humankind will become part of this group,while millions will live in the flesh as humans on earth! Jesus is the first to die and become resurrected as number one of those going to live forever in heaven,so John saw the lamb[resurrected Jesus] and 144,000 with him on mount Zion[heavenly government house]. Revelations 14:1 Zion means Jerusalem and that's the earthly government house where God's chosen king over his people of ancient time resides back then,but since Jesus is now changing the government house to heaven,those that will rule with him are going there. So they must become spirit persons to live in heaven,that's why they must become born again[baptised in water first as a Christian and God chooses them by anointing of his holy spirit] this happened to Jesus himself first. So these is the explanation of the Jehovah's Witnesses that all those belonging to that group will never be resurrected in the flesh but in spirit bodies! God bless you all! 1 Like |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 2:16pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Shepherd00: No one is dodging anything. He Materialized, he was ' put to death IN FLESH, Made ALIVE IN SPIRIT ' . he wasn't made alive in Flesh ( 1 Pet 3:18 ) He didn't ressurect with flesh and bones, the same account said , He went ahead to EAT Mr, you once agreed he will visit the TOILET after that, didn't you ? You just declared him a mortal who need to defecate to stay alive 2 Likes |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 2:17pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Shepherd00: When a Spirit materialize, it has bones ... That's why an Angel could combat with Jacob. 2 Likes |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 2:19pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Barristter07: Quote the bible verse that said when a spirit materializes it has bones. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 2:22pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Barristter07: Luke 24:36-40 read it again and again. Jesus Christ resurrected as himself he said so himself abi you want to change his words? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 2:36pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Matthew 15:17 is still there for you to ponder on, if he ATE as human , Flesh and blood function ... Would he visit the toilet ? Emusan:One FACT is dusted already: That a Spirit appeared as a man doesn't make it a man . what the beholder see is just an appearance in human form. Lets enlighten you a bit. When the Bible speak of humans , the expression " Flesh and BLOOD " is used because an human body life can only be sustained by Blood. Then If Jesus Materialized Body has no blood, He wasn't human , Now let's visit the account at John again . When Jesus ask Thoman to touch his scars and wound. A human wound or scar , nail holes would be bleeding Blood , because of it's make up. Just as Jesus human body bleed blood when tortured by the Romans But in this account, Do you see anything like Bleeding wounds ? What Thomas touched was Materialized body. Years later, John who was present at the scene wrote. 1 Jn 3:2 " now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we shall be. We know that, when He appears, we shall be like Him, because we shall see Him just as He is." Jesus Spirit form was never beheld by anyone of them, and that's what they look forward to. He won't have said this if they are ignorant like you to conclude what appeared to them was what Jesus looked like . 1 Like |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Nobody: 2:48pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Barristter07:I think the problem here is the word MATERIALISE, most people don't understand that word! Of course spirits don't have bones but when they materialise,everything needed is present until they dematerialise again. That word is coined out of the word MATERIAL meaning something to do with matter[having weight and occupying space] hence the English will say something is immaterial meaning lacking content! If Jesus resurrected with the same body[flesh],did he also went to heaven in that body? Hmmm Jehovah's Witnesses, thank you! 2 Likes |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Emusan(m): 2:59pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Idiot...diverting attention to another thing... You agreed that Jesus posseses FLESH...After I burst your bubble about the Leviticus you've been shouting that THE LIFE OF FLESH IS IN THE blood...now you've to come out from baseless angle. Everyone reading here can see how myopic you are. Barristter07: Agreed. Then If Jesus Materialized Body has no blood, He wasn't human Then it means HE DIDN'T MATERIALIZE because to MATERIALIZED means to FULLY become HUMAN... You can see how lost you are here... Now let's visit the account at John again . When Jesus ask Thoman to touch his scars and wound. A human wound or scar , nail holes would be bleeding Blood , because of it's make up. Just as Jesus human body bleed blood when tortured by the Romans Olodo rabata...how can injury bleed for a whole 3 days, is that how you bleed when you sustain injury Is that what you were taught in school? Years later, John who was present at the scene wrote. A lost soul is talking about someone is ignorance. This verse exposed many wrong doctrines of your lie organization: Yet your lie organization said Jesus has appeared INVISIBLY in 1914 when the Bible says "When He shall APPEAR... we shall SEE HIM just as He is" |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 3:01pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Emusan: O ma se o . To have or has flesh as u said, IS NOT the same as being Human . Angels does that many times . but no one ever called them human. They ain't " Flesh and BLOOD " Creations . 1 Like |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 3:05pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Barristter07: So you are saying we should disregard jesus Christ's words in the Bible and swallow the assumptions made by your gb members right? Luke 24:36-49 36 While they were still talking about this, Jesus himself stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.” 37 They were startled and frightened, thinking they saw a ghost. 38 He said to them, “Why are you troubled, and why do doubts rise in your minds? 39 Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.” 40 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and feet. [/b]41 [b]And while they still did not believe it because of joy and amazement, he asked them, “Do you have anything here to eat?” 42 They gave him a piece of broiled fish, 43 and he took it and ate it in their presence. 44 He said to them, “This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms.” 45 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures. 46 He told them, “This is what is written: The Messiah will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day, 47 and repentance for the forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 You are witnesses of these things. 49 I am going to send you what my Father has promised; but stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.” You want us to believe your assumptions and throw Jesus Christ's own words in the Bible because Jesus Christ is wrong and you are right. Jesus Christ said he is made of flesh and bones, he even told them to touch him and he ate with them. He said he will die and rise from the dead. Do you intend changing these and inserting your assumptions in the Bible? |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 3:11pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Barristter07: Jesus Christ had flesh and bones. He took the food given to him by his apostles and ate it in their presence. This one you are quoting flesh and blood creations hope no issue? You want to stylishly shift from flesh and bones to flesh and blood so we will say jesus was not flesh and blood. Lol. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Hairyrapunzel: 3:18pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Emusan: Help me ask him how somebody will bleed for 3 days straight. I think their religion helps keeping them in ignorance. They love assuming what's not in the Bible to justify their doctrine. Now see him saying if jesus Christ was a human being he will have blood from those sites to justify their assumption of Jesus Christ using someone's body after resurrection. |
Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And The Resurrection Of Jesus by Barristter07: 3:19pm On Mar 25, 2019 |
Emusan: A spirit being life isn't depended on Blood, they don't become human . they appear bodily
Okay listen materialize - /məˈtɪərɪəlʌɪz/ verb 1. become actual fact; happen. 2. (of a ghost, spirit, or similar entity) appear in bodily form. Appear NOT Become . If they become humans , Angels of Noah's day won't have born giants or Nephilims, aren't they humans, They should have given birth to normal men like human? Sense is above you.
Where is your thinking faculty ? Did Thomas touch blood! ? He said touch the WOUNDS . showing its a broken skin , deep cut. Wound definition : 1. an injury to living tissue caused by a cut, blow, or other impact, typically one in which the skin is cut or broken. Cut or broken indicates presence of blood in a human skin. When a wound is dressed, blood doesn't come out ? They would have become like Him to See. Read Why this statement if they were ignorant like you to believe what they saw is what Jesus looked like ? 1 Like |
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