sacx:


Works do not validate our salvation sir. They are a consequence of it. We work because we are saved. It is automatic. A well flowing out of our inward being.

Working is not a proof of salvation but a consequence of.

SocialJustice:
I am not your dear and saying Jesus only did partial salvation only shows how ignorant you are. You think if it is by works anybody will make heaven? You will also not make heaven. God is not a fool.

sacx:


You missed my point completely. Am I bored with the Holy Spirit? How can I be? Have you tasted of the bliss of his presence or even his amazing sense of humor? I'm far from bored. I can never be.

The point; when men in the world observe the quality of our lives, are they in awe? Does it incite in them the desire to know? Even men that observed Jesus exclaimed, 'what manner of man is this!'. Do we find that being done with respect to Christians today? No, our ministers are branded thieves because they do indeed employ gimmicks is extorting money from their members. Miracles are branded fake because they seem to be an exclusive reserve of ministers and are done only within the four walls of the church.

This is an anomaly, and it's our responsibility to correct it. We are sent to the world.

femi4:
yes, the prodigal son returned to his father and regain his sonship

alBHAGDADI:

So much false doctrine in one post. The sad part is that the person disseminating the false doctrine is the one accusing others of doing such.

Now, let's examine your argument.

You have clearly stated nothing here. Can mention just one name of man alive today who is without sin?



Saul Lost his throne, not his salvation. If he had lost his salvation, David would have killed him when he had the chance several times. But because he knew he was still under God's anointing despite his sin, David spared.

1 Samuel 24:6 (KJV)
And he said unto his men, The L ORD forbid that I should do this thing unto my master, the L ORD 's anointed, to stretch forth mine hand against him, seeing he is the anointed of the L ORD .

Judas was never saved because he never believed in Jesus from day one. Even Jesus said it.

John 6:70
Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?

Jesus didn't say he became a devil. He simoly said he's a devil. Even the entire chapter showed Jesus talking about some of his followers who didn't believe in him and the one who should betray him.

John 6:64 (KJV)
But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.

Annanuas and Saphira is not a case of lost salvation. It is a case of punishment for lying, same way we get punished for other things. Nowhere does the Bible say they lost their salvation.



Paul was not saying we should save ourselves. If we could save ourselves, why did Jesus die? Read the passage well.

Philippians 2:12-13 (KJV)
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Simple, Paul was saying we should show the salvation God has put in us. It's the same as God giving us muscles. When we Gym aka work out, the muscles become pronounced such that people admire us and even start hitting the gym too. God has saved us and now wants us to work out that salvation so others too will by that come to him.

To show your flawed understanding, below is Paul clearly stating that salvation is not of WORKS but by Grace through faith in Jesus.

Ephesians 2:8-9 (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.



You just called God a liar, and I will prove it to you.

How dare you say Jesus never said we are saved forever? First and foremost, what does eternal life mean? It means life never ending. What did Jesus say will happen to those who believe in him?

John 3:16 (KJV)
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


As seen above, Jesus said if we believe in him, we will have eternal life. Even the book of John says those that believe have eternal life. It doesn't say we will get the eternal life after we die. It says we have it already and it's in our spirit.

1 John 5:13
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

Now, if believe leads to salvation which gives eternal life, how come you say eternal life can be lost? If it can be lost, then was it ever eternal or never ending?

You have called God a liar by saying he didn't give us eternal life through his Son Jesus. You have denied the record he gave of his son.

1 John 5:10-11
10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

Did you see the bolded part? It says God has given us eternal life for believing in his son. It means we can't lose it otherwise it will mean it was never eternal.



You are misquoting Paul. The Paul I know said it is Grace that saves not our works.

Ephesians 2:8-9 King James Version (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.



You are simply saying the blood of Jesus is not enough to save man once and for all and that man has to contribute his own quota. Look at how you belittled the blood of Jesus.



@bold

It is the Grace of Jesus that keeps us saved, not our works of righteousness which God sees as filthy rags.

Ephesians 2:8-9 King James Version (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.



I'll advice everyone reading this to please flee from Pentecostal Churches which are devil's houses. Flee from any church that preaches Works Based Salvation e.g RCCG, Winners, Deeper Life etc and go find a Once Saved Always Saved Church e.g Baptist. Do that now before it's too late.

Continuing in the believe that you can lose your salvation is the same as saying you are trying to save yourself. It simply means you are not trusting in Jesus, instead you are relying on your own works. It means you don't believe in Jesus but yourself. The people below did the works but Jesus saud he never knew them. Note, he didn't say he use to know them. He never knew them despite then doing wonderful works, because they didn't do his father's will.

Matthew 7:21-23 King James Version (KJV)
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


Now what is the will of the Father Jesus said they didn't do?


John 6:40
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.


Those people didn't do the above will because they were depending on their works to save them instead of simply believing in Jesus.

sacx:


What if we stop working, will we stop being pleasing to God?

shadeyinka:

Would you conclude that what negates and destroy your salvation isn't SIN even though God hates sin.

Can someone become born again by righteous living,? No!
Can someone become unborn again by SIN? No!

When we look at the prodigal son, we are tempted to believe that he has lost his sonship.

Although the frightening thing about the prodigal son was that even though he was received back home by his father. [b]He lost EVERYTHING. His obedient elder brother owns ALL the father had.[/b]

Fran6ik:


Please what did Jesus say in Matt 25:36-41?

Or he wasnt right too?

femi4:
Rom 12

Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship.

Phil 2:12

Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling,

sacx:


Finish it:

for it is God who works in you both to will and do his good pleasure .

Stop trying to work to please God. You are already pleasing to him. The work is his. Flow with the Spirit

Profmaojo:
Good morning sir/ma, do you mean that you can be far room God and still attain eternal life?? Because the opposite of eternal damnation is eternal life. When one sin, you have to ask God for forgiveness but saying since you have been saved you are always save and can continue doing what you want is absurd

GoodBoi1:

If you go through my post you will notice that I said over and over again a believer will lose his salvation if he rejects it and choose to live a sinful lifestyle but God is ever ready to forgive us


Matt. 18:21-35
21 Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?”

22 Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.[g]

23 “Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. 24 As he began the settlement, a man who owed him ten thousand bags of gold[h] was brought to him. 25 Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt.

26 “At this the servant fell on his knees before him. ‘Be patient with me,’ he begged, ‘and I will pay back everything.’ 27 The servant’s master took pity on him, canceled the debt and let him go.

28 “But when that servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred silver coins.[i] He grabbed him and began to choke him. ‘Pay back what you owe me!’ he demanded.

29 “His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, ‘Be patient with me, and I will pay it back.’

30 “But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. 31 When the other servants saw what had happened, they were outraged and went and told their master everything that had happened.

32 “Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. 33 Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’ 34 In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.

35 “This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart.”


I so much emphasize on forgiveness because you can be saved but if you harbour unforgiveness in your heart God wil not forgive you too

GoodBoi1:

Yes, it happens. Just because slanders and negativity is being propagated against Christianity by unbelievers or flaky christians to the point of even rallying christians doesn't mean it has stopped happening. Same way you want to be people to be awed you should expected people to be irritated too just as they found the works of Christ and the apostles.

Branded thieves or not, what matters is that souls are being won for Christ

Philippians 1:15-18 New International Version (NIV)
15 It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill. 16 The latter do so out of love, knowing that I am put here for the defense of the gospel. 17 The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing that they can stir up trouble for me while I am in chains. 18 But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice.
Yes, and I will continue to rejoice,

GoodBoi1:

If you are alive, you are either pleasing God or not, there is no inbetween. Reverence for God should reflect in everything we do

Romans 12:1
12 Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship.

femi4:
Show me where its written in your Bible.

There is work after salvation not before salvation. This work is with the help of God

Phil2:13
for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.


Salvation is a GIFT, it can be lost!

pressplay411:

We're saying almost the same thing.
Your point is simply not all who call themselves Christians are truly born again, hence not all who think they're saved are saved.
Anyone who is truly born again, truly repentant is saved and can't lose His salvation. Right?

This too is contestable scripturally. One can truly repent from sin and iniquity such pride, mammon, sexual immorality, false revelations and false doctrines, even frustration can lead him to lose his belief and go astray.
That's why the scriptures exhorts us to flee from every appearance of evil-1 Thessalonians 5:22.
It's because we truly have to guard our salvation by putting on the full armour of faith. Ephesians 6:10-18

femi4:
you are in a haste, I concluded it that the work is with the help of God.

So, don't say we don't have work to do.

You have work to do with God's help

Yinyeon:


Very Correct, if ever one loves committing sin and is never bitten by it whenever he/she does so, it means the person was never saved to begin with, because the God who saved us is faithful and powerful enough to keep us.

It doesn't mean as Christian, we don't sin for we are in this evil flesh that strives to displease God hence, we have the Holy Spirit who is always in constant conflict with the flesh.
However, the sin of a Christian doesn't lead to eternal damnation just takes us farther way from God.

Yinyeon:


We never choose God, he chooses Us.

Without God saving us, we'd never go to him because of how much we love the bliss the world has to offer.

GoodBoi1:

If you go through my post you will notice that I said over and over again a believer will lose his salvation if he rejects it and choose to live a sinful lifestyle but God is ever ready to forgive u

pressplay411:
"Once saved, forever safe."
This is unscriptural.
Beware of Tares, false prophets and Grace abusers.
This has made Christians remain comfortable as lone-rangers, bench-warmers, onlookers, babes in the Faith and rebellious believers. Christians have become comfortable in sin and have become the ones establishing corruption and the kingdom of unrighteousness even worse than unbelievers.

Notable believers who lost their salvation;
King Saul in the Old Testament.
Judas Iscariot right under Jesus Christ, our Lord and Saviour Himself.
Ananias and Sapphira in the New Testament struck dead by the Holy Spirit Himself.

We are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling. We are to guard our salvation with all diligence.

Christ never said we're saved for ever just for believing in him, for demons do too but are not saved. He said, if we love him, we should keep his commands. He said, if judgement comes, will He find Faith? He said people will stray away from the Faith, unbelief will spread even among believers who will fall for false prophets.
Even Apostle Paul never said Grace saves anyone for ever because even He said He was fighting the good fight of Faith, to take hold of eternal life.

The precious blood of Jesus saves all who believe in Christ from being unbelievers and from living a disconnected life from God. Truly Christ refers to unbelievers as the dead, because to be carnal is death.- 1st stage of Salvation.

Discipleship; Learning of Christ. Obedience and Faith in the Words of Christ keeps us Saved. We start growing in the Likeness of Christ, bearing His Fruit and His Nature. We start doing greater works like Christ did winning souls, healing the sick, casting out demons, finding our place in ministry and establishing God's Kingdom on earth etc- 2nd Stage of Salvation.

When we die or are raptured, would it meet us still faithful and doing the works of Christ, keeping our Faith even in the face of Death?- Final stage of Salvation.

shadeyinka:

The Question is, how many times of sin does it take a person to loose his salvation?

biggy26:

You are correct in your submission, but it's not the Holy Spirit that's in constant conflict with the flesh, but the human recreated spirit.

sacx:


That scripture didn't say we work with God's help. It says God does the work . I didn't write it, so you can read it again.

The work flows effortlessly from us. It is God that do them. You should know this if you enjoy intimacy with the Holy Spirit.

femi4:
Go back and read again, that's English

It is "God who works in us" modifys " both to will and to work" for his good pleasure

xtgozie:


oboy, nothing can take away my salvation, nothing, because I've been predestined, justified, sanctified

shadeyinka:

You want a scripture?
Luk 15:28-31:
"And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came his father out, and entreated him. And he answering said to his father, Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might make merry with my friends: But as soon as this thy son was come, which hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the fatted calf. And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine ."
There was even no time when the prodigal vson lost his sonship
If the elder son has ALL, what does the prodigal son has?

Interestingly, you quoted a scripture to assent to my position

Phil2:13
for it is [b] God ,(not even me) who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.[/b]

sacx:


So who is doing the work?

femi4:
Show me where its written in your Bible.

There is work after salvation not before salvation. This work is with the help of God

Phil2:13
for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.


[quote author=femi4 post=78332260] Salvation is a GIFT, it can be lost!