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Unless he transformed back to his real spirit nature otherwise HE CAN'T SEE GOD AS A MAN!

Remember what happened to him on the torture stake (cross as you people call it) Jesus shouted "My Go My God why have you forsaken me?" Matthew 27:46

Even a toddler knows that it's when a child can't see his dad or mum around that such statement can make any sense!

So Jesus can only see God if he transformed back to his spirit nature, but as a man he must kneel down and make supplications to the one HE CAN'T SEE!

livingchrist:
No man can see God, how about The fact that Jesus sees God even as a man he is.

livingchrist:
No man can see God, how about The fact that Jesus sees God even as a man he is.

Jesus can't see God's face as a man. Proving he is no longer a man

No man can see him and live.

Barristter07:
Jesus can't see God's face as a man. Proving he is no longer a man

No man can see him and live.

Jesus is a mediator and high priest as a man . Proving he is a man

MaxInDHouse:
Unless he transformed back to his real spirit nature otherwise HE CAN'T SEE GOD AS A MAN!

Remember what happened to him on the torture stake (cross as you people call it) Jesus shouted "My Go My God why have you forsaken me?" Matthew 27:46

Even a toddler knows that it's when a child can't see his dad or mum around that such statement can make any sense!

So Jesus can only see God if he transformed back to his spirit nature, but as a man he must kneel down and make supplications to the one HE CAN'T SEE!

Jesus is not a spirit!

Luke 24:39
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

livingchrist:
'Carnal' or 'natural' can never be interchange for spiritual.

Of course it can. In connection with 1Corinthians 2:14-15.

DappaD:
Of course it can. In connection with 1Corinthians 2:14-15.

there is no connection anywhere

It's OK Sir!

livingchrist:
Jesus is not a spirit!
Luke 24:39
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

livingchrist:
there is no connection anywhere

1Corinthians 2:15
“The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one.” ESV

“But the spiritual man judgeth all things;and he himself is judged of no man.” Douay Rheims

“The spiritual man judges all things, but he himself is not subject to anyone’s judgment.” Berean


I don't think I'm the one who inputted “spiritual person” into these Bible translations. Even Amplified Bible put “mature Christian” in box brackets in that scripture. Again, that passage has nothing to do with your false claim.
“Man” whether physical(carnal) or spiritual(religious) is flesh and blood according to Genesis 5:2. Or are you saying Paul wasn't flesh and blood when he wrote that letter to the Corinthians?

MaxInDHouse:
It's OK Sir!

I don't think he should be given attention any more because even someone whose eyes has been torn out can see the way he's contradicting himself.

livingchrist:
Jesus is not a spirit![therefore, has flesh and bones] Italics mine

Luke 24:39
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

livingchrist:
Jesus said he had flesh and bones

livingchrist:
Jesus is not flesh and blood

He's just interested in arguing blindly!

Melchizedek has no father, no mother, no genealogy, no beginning nor end of days. Our friend kept arguing that Melchizedek must be a man!

DappaD:
I don't think he should be given attention any more because even someone whose eyes has been torn out can see the way he's contradicting himself.

DappaD:
1Corinthians 2:15
“The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one.” ESV

“But the spiritual man judgeth all things;and he himself is judged of no man.” Douay Rheims

“The spiritual man judges all things, but he himself is not subject to anyone’s judgment.” Berean


I don't think I'm the one who inputted “spiritual person” into these Bible translations. Even Amplified Bible put “mature Christian” in box brackets in that scripture. Again, that passage has nothing to do with your false claim.
“Man” whether physical(carnal) or spiritual(religious) is flesh and blood according to Genesis 5:2. Or are you saying Paul wasn't flesh and blood when he wrote that letter to the Corinthians?

Go back to my first post and read again.

DappaD:
I don't think he should be given attention any more because even someone whose eyes has been torn out can see the way he's contradicting himself.

flesh and bones
flesh and blood,
Mr Dappa are they the same?

livingchrist:

flesh and bones
flesh and blood,
Mr Dappa are they the same?

So what makes up the human being? The tissue called blood which represents the life says Leviticus 17:14
The bones help keep the body framework(flesh),that is we ourselves, in place? Should somebody give you an anatomy lesson?

DappaD:
So what makes up the human being? The tissue called blood which represents the life says Leviticus 17:14
The bones help keep the body framework(flesh),that is we ourselves, in place? Should somebody give you an anatomy lesson?

you are simply describing the natural body not the spiritual body.

livingchrist:
you are simply describing the natural body not the spiritual body.

Exactly, the human has flesh, bones and blood that enables the human to live.
So according to the scriptures, what is the makeup of a ‘spiritual’ body? Oh so it has flesh and bones but cannot operate with blood is that it?

DappaD:
Exactly, the human has flesh, bones and blood that enables the human to live.
So according to the scriptures, what is the makeup of a ‘spiritual’ body? Oh so it has flesh and bones but cannot operate with blood is that it?

A natural body cannot function without blood but a Spiritual body like that of Jesus can function without blood.

Humans can live without blood eg Jesus, His body was resurrected without blood.

livingchrist:
A natural body cannot function without blood but a Spiritual body like that of Jesus can function without blood.
Humans can live without blood eg Jesus, His body was resurrected without blood.

But life is in the blood of an earthly creature according to Genesis 9:4 & Leviticus 17:14 so if Jesus is still human in heaven, he has blood. Do the maths.

DappaD:
But life is in the blood of an earthly creature according to Genesis 9:4 & Leviticus 17:14 so if Jesus is still human in heaven, he has blood. Do the maths.

That is for the natural body

Barristter07:
Omoh, I like this kind situation.

No MAN can see God Face and Live . The Almighty cannot lie. To claim humans see God's face in heaven is to make him a liar .

What Stephen see is an ordinary vision, not the Almighty himself.

Act 7:59 he said I saw the heavens opened.

That's Vision. Not that heavens actually opened! The sky remain as it is!!!

See the Oponu radarada....

So what Stephen saw isn't Almighty Himself, then Almighty Now has duplicate or fake form, continue...

Whether vision or not MAN HAS SEEN GOD'S FACE which negates your lying mouth that man can't see His face.

Wasn't the same thing I said earlier when I said MORTAL MAN can't see His face, but only a regenerated man can see God's face.

Whether you like it or not, human are already in heaven beholding God's face, I know none of your members can achieve that because they're not of Christ.

Emusan:
See the Oponu radarada....

So what Stephen saw isn't Almighty Himself, then Almighty Now has duplicate or fake form, continue...

Whether vision or not MAN HAS SEEN GOD'S FACE which negates your lying mouth that man can't see His face.

Stephen - Heavens actually opened in the Sky ?

So God lied when he said No man can see his Face . Interesting

Wasn't the same thing I said earlier when I said MORTAL MAN can't see His face, but only a regenerated man can see God's face.

Whether you like it or not, human are already in heaven beholding God's face, I know none of your members can achieve that because they're not of Christ.

So you want to Make God a Liar because of your tradition ?

Barristter07:
Stephen - Heavens actually opened in the Sky ?

Scripture says "Heaven opened" the lying liar JWs says scripture is lying.

So God lied when he said No man can see his Face . Interesting

God didn't lie as NO MORTAL MAN can see His Face and live.

Stephen was FULL OF THE SPIRIT at that time.

So you want to Make God a Liar because of your tradition ?

You're the one making scripture a liar, because Jesus went to heaven in the presence of All His disciples IN HUMAN FORM and your lying mouth says No!

Emusan:
Scripture says "Heaven opened" the lying liar JWs says scripture is lying.

With Emphasis on " I SAW " , I , a personal pronoun

Did Heavens Actually opened or it was all in Stephens Mental sight ?

God didn't lie as NO MORTAL MAN can see His Face and live.

Stephen was FULL OF THE SPIRIT at that time.

You're the one making scripture a liar, because Jesus went to heaven in the presence of All His disciples IN HUMAN FORM and your lying mouth says No!

Life of a liar , So Stephen U MENTIONING is not a Mortal man ? And yet he died ?

THAT MEANS JESUS IS A MORTAL MAN, COS THE WORD MAN USED AT 1timothy 2:5 was used for the same men u called mortal .

Exodus 33:20 please show me MORTAL in there ?

livingchrist:
That is for the natural body

That’s why I asked, what is the make up of a ‘spiritual’ body? Flesh and bones but no blood? Can you back up your claim with any scripture?
And no, don’t quote Luke 24:39 because it doesn’t solve the riddle for you because Jesus was no longer human after his resurrection and according to John 21:1, he manifested himself to his disciples. The Greek word here is ἐφανέρωσεν[ephanerōsen] which means to make something visible so 1Peter 3:18 is correct that Jesus indeed was raised as a spirit(invisible) but on these occasions he made himself visible in flesh to his disciples. The Strong’s Greek even made it clear that his appearance wasn’t as a real human but apparent. Compare Genesis 18:1-8&Hebrews 13:2

DappaD:
That’s why I asked, what is the make up of a ‘spiritual’ body? Flesh and bones but no blood? Can you back up your claim with any scripture?
And no, don’t quote Luke 24:39 because it doesn’t solve the riddle for you because Jesus was no longer human after his resurrection and according to John 21:1, he manifested himself to his disciples. The Greek word here is ἐφανέρωσεν[ephanerōsen] which means to make something visible so 1Peter 3:18 is correct that Jesus indeed was raised as a spirit(invisible) but on these occasions he made himself visible in flesh to his disciples. The Strong’s Greek even made it clear that his appearance wasn’t as a real human but apparent. Compare Genesis 18:1-8&Hebrews 13:2

Just one question, what happened to Jesus' body?

livingchrist:
Just one question, what happened to Jesus' body?

Jesus existed in flesh(John 1:14, 1Timothy 3:16) before he was completely offered up as a ransom sacrifice once and for all for the forgiveness of sin. Hebrews 10:5,10-12

In the book of Leviticus, when the priests offered up the burnt and sin offerings at the altar, would the said animal be retrieved or would it have served its purpose for atonement of sins? Leviticus 5:5-13

That’s the same in Jesus’ case. By reason of being the Lamb who would take away sins of obedient humans(John 1:29), his death and resurrection had to take place so that the scriptures would be fulfilled. Isaiah 53:8-12, Daniel 9:26, Psalm 16:10
Jesus’ death served as a propitiatiory sacrifice for sins(1John 4:10)so at his resurrection, he was restored back to the same spirit state he was before coming to the earth—only this time—he was gifted immortality. John 17:5, Romans 6:9,10

DappaD:
Jesus existed in flesh(John 1:14, 1Timothy 3:16) before he was completely offered up as a ransom sacrifice once and for all for the forgiveness of sin. Hebrews 10:5,10-12

In the book of Leviticus, when the priests offered up the burnt and sin offerings at the altar, would the said animal be retrieved or would it have served its purpose for atonement of sins? Leviticus 5:5-13

That’s the same in Jesus’ case. By reason of being the Lamb who would take away sins of obedient humans(John 1:29), his death and resurrection had to take place so that the scriptures would be fulfilled. Isaiah 53:8-12, Daniel 9:26, Psalm 16:10
Jesus’ death served as a propitiatiory sacrifice for sins(1John 4:10)so at his resurrection, he was restored back to the same spirit state he was before coming to the earth—only this time—he was gifted immortality. John 17:5, Romans 6:9,10

You didnt answer my question!
What happened to Jesus body?
Also remember that the animals offered were never brought back to life again?
Going by your logic since Jesus life was restored then it was never a sacrifice?
Answer my question

livingchrist:
You didnt answer my question!
What happened to Jesus body?
Also remember that the animals offered were never brought back to life again?
Going by your logic since Jesus life was restored then it was never a sacrifice?
Answer my question

Remember he gave his perfect life while in flesh so if he was raised back in flesh, it would cancel out the sacrifice. Matthew 26:26-28

DappaD:
Remember he gave his perfect life while in flesh so if he was raised back in flesh, it would cancel out the sacrifice. Matthew 26:26-28

Are you saying Jesus did not get back the life he laid down?
Because the life Jesus laid down was his Human life
So Did Jesus take it up again?

What happened to Jesus body?

John 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.


If Jesus did not resurrect as a human ot would mean he did not take back the life that he laid down.
Jesus must be resurrected to have his life back, not just life but the one he laid down, which is his human life.

STOP DECEIVING YOURSELF!
Even the dumbest person knows that Jesus' life never start from Mary's womb, he laid down his life when he volunteered himself in heaven not when he got here! So the life he is taking back wasn't what he laid down when he got to earth but the life he had from the beginning "Spirit life" Philippians 2:7

livingchrist:
Are you saying Jesus did not get back the life he laid down?
Because the life Jesus laid down was his Human life
So Did Jesus take it up again?
What happened to Jesus body?
John 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. If Jesus did not resurrect as a human ot would mean he did not take back the life that he laid down.
Jesus must be resurrected to have his life back, not just life but the one he laid down, which is his human life.

livingchrist:

Are you saying Jesus did not get back the life he laid down?
Because the life Jesus laid down was his Human life
So Did Jesus take it up again?What happened to Jesus body?John 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
If Jesus did not resurrect as a human ot would mean he did not take back the life that he laid down.Jesus must be resurrected to have his life back, not just life but the one he laid down, which is his human life.

If it’s the same human life he resurrected with, then you must also accept the following:

1. His baptism at the River Jordan was a charade and a joke because that would mean he was never anointed by God’s holy spirit. Matthew 3:17, Mark 1:9
Because according to Jesus, anyone born of spirit is SPIRIT. John 3:6

2. His sacrifice was in vain and his blood was never poured out meaning our sins cannot be forgiven. Hebrews 9:22

3. He resurrected as a full human with flesh and blood and hence, never inherited God’s Kingdom. 1Corinthians 15:50

This is where your assertion has landed you.

Mr livingchrist, why do you choose to overstep God’s word because of your faulty traditions? Matthew 15:3

MaxInDHouse:
STOP DECEIVING YOURSELF!
Even the dumbest person knows that Jesus' life never start from Mary's womb, he laid down his life when he volunteered himself in heaven not when he got here! So the life he is taking back wasn't what he laid down when he got to earth but the life he had from the beginning "Spirit life" Philippians 2:7

maybe you should step in for Dappa,
While Did Jesus get his life back since anything sacrificed should not be gotten back?

so Jesus died in heaven?

The greek word for life was psychen was is literally interpreted as soul life, referring only to human or animal life.



Oya explain yourself

DappaD:
If it’s the same human life he resurrected with, then you must also accept the following:

1. His baptism at the River Jordan was a charade and a joke because that would mean he was never anointed by God’s holy spirit. Matthew 3:17, Mark 1:9
Because according to Jesus, anyone born of spirit is SPIRIT. John 3:6

The last time I had encounter with you guys on this issue of being born again, you people ran away.

2. His sacrifice was in vain and his blood was never poured out meaning our sins cannot be forgiven. Hebrews 9:22

How?

3. He resurrected as a full human with flesh and blood and hence, never inherited God’s Kingdom. 1Corinthians 15:50

This is where your assertion has landed you.

Mr livingchrist, why do you choose to overstep God’s word because of your faulty traditions? Matthew 15:3

Jesus didnt need to have blood anymore because He lived by the power of the spirit not by the power of the flesh.

Lol you forgot Jesus is not flesh and blood, which represent the corrupt human nature.