₦airaland Forum

I-man
The link to the website says it all. Its not my style to go viewing a video that screams "am bias" a mile off.

Why not stop market women from wearing bubba and wrapper as well. Lets all kit up, the American way. Let me dust my suit.

@superman
abi you don drink your ogogoro again?

Hello, Mr President, it's Ehud. How is Washington today? I want to apologise for bombing your installments in Egypt in 1954 and also the Slaughter on USS Liberty in 1967. We regret all the casualties. We didn't know you'd find out it wasn't those bloody Arabs.

You know sometimes we a have to employ trickery in warning you against your true enemies. I just didn't like seeing you shake hands with President Nasser, you know I'm a very jealous friend.

However, we'd like to know how you unveiled our plot in order that we may take corrections in case of next time. We may plan another false flag attack in the future maybe on September 11th of 2001. Well, one never knows.

Thank you very much. Shallom and happy Yom Kippur.


PS: stay away from any low flying planes around the World Trade Centre or the Pentagon. I just have a hunch that's all.

By the way, do you have some of those injections that can put a serving prime in coma for years? I'm just asking. It may come in handy in a case whereby one of these bloody peaceloving niceguy prime ministers start implementing the peace plan.

By the way, how is little George Jnr? When do you think he'll be ready to take over power?

F*cking brilliant.

One thing you quickly learn about the Israel/Palestinian issue is no two historians will agree on any specific event hence am not going to comment on Phillistine, Palestina or whatever. With the proliferation of communication technology e.g mobile phone, internet etc. Jewish monologues (our forefathers narration of events) are now deemed as part of history, since they largely control this new technology. The barbaric cabal of rich and influential American Jews and the "Christian right" control the flow of information in America, and also seek to rewrite history while carrying out their demonic agenda. Many people get brainwashed into believing this bunkum (google"Outfoxed"

On the previous page, we were meant to believe the intifada was started by Palestinians to "extract more concessions from Isreal". You wonder what news channel these people watch. To you and me Israeli police killed seven Palestinian youths who were protesting Sharon's visit to the Temple mount hence the intifada. We were also told Barak made "generous" concessions from a pragmatic standpoint. This was the same Barak who was not ready to allow all Palestinians to return. After the Nigerian civil war, I bet it would have been right for Gowon to stop all Ibo's from returning to Nigeria, in case they re-arm and start the secession all over again. The right of return was enshrined in UN resolution 194. Generous concessions ke? Why should the Palestinians accept an offer of a non-contiguous state? How come he wanted Arafat to renounce Palestinian claim to East Jerusalem, we give you small parcel of land here and another there.
Arafat was hijacked by Clinton and Barak and we know this, how do you negotiate with your adversary when he makes a pre-condiction that you either accept or the deal is off. Is this the basis of a meaningfull negotiation? What we were not told was the concessions made by the Palestinians, give me a f*cking break.


It is sad to see fellow Nigerians applaud the systematic annihilation of a people whose only crime is to fight for independence. It really is sad that some people tend now to distort history and heap praises on the Jewish people. This is what gets my goat.
Which side were these people during the South African struggle? Are these not the same genteel Jews that armed and supported apartheid South Africa?
Can't we see the parralel between what happened in the eighties and now? Is the biggest sponsor of the then apartheid regime in South Africa not the same sponsor now?
Same America failed to see the handwriting on the wall as regards South Africa, less than 20yrs
later "Terrorist Nelson Mandela" of the "Terrorist ANC" is now one of the world's true statesman.
People tend not to learn from history, give it 15yrs and see if "Terrorist Ismail Haniyeh" of
the"Terrorist Hamas" won't be given a Nobel prize for peace in light of Israel's onslaught against his people.
I stated in my opening gambit that we have new information and communication technology yet people tend to remain misinformed, sometimes by "choice" (no names please) by "location" or through "ignorance". The "choice" category are the most militant, they have myopic views of events. In a few years, those that champion the Palestinian rights in their struggle would be smelling of roses. I leave it to your imagination what Jewish supporters will smell of. To borrow davidylan's quote I won't "bury my head in the sand" why this nuclear powered nation,
bully's its neighbours to capitulation.

@Afam
When I saw this tragedy on the news, I could picture I-man and davidylan having in front of them kobe beef or foie gras (no cowfoot and eba) and well truffled brioche bun, (yum yum) time for them to watch the Palestinians kill themselves.
Even though we don't support Israel in its desire to wipe out the Palestinians, at least we don't hold a morbid view of Israel. We would not rejoice in the destruction of Israel unlike our Likud (Oops!) Nairaland users . If supporting Palestinians against the American funded almighty IDF makes me an extremist so shall it be.

P.S
The world must be full of extremist since over half of the world supports the Palestinians.

I did everything to log on to nairaland this morning and yes - its there. I see I-man beat davidylan to the news in Gaza. Predictable.
I see I-man has modified his position to reflect the present situation in Palestine. He's now saying the Jews won't negotiate with the Palestinians because of the situation in Gaza. Did the Jews negotiate when there was peace in Gaza. Why is Israel and its supporters always looking for new ways of deferring the road map? They always find a minute excuse, today Arafat, tomorrow Hamas etc.
And who created this enviroment of tension in Gaza?
Since Gaza is helmed in on all sides by the almighty IDF, is Israel not trying to make Gaza the Guantanamo bay of the middle east?
Is Israel any more secure today than yesterday? "Those who make peaceful change impossible, makes violent change inevitable". The sad truth is, expect more rockets to rain down on Israel as a result of this new development.

All is not lost in Israel, here is former Israeli minister of education Shulamit Aloni on Israel's intransigent behaviour.

"I cannot live with the fact that our sharpshooters are killing people. I cannot live with the way we continually wail that we are the victim, and do not examine our own morality. It's important to realise that appalling as suicide bombings are, aerial bombardment kills more. While we feel the pain of our 900 dead, we tend to forget that we have murdered 3000 Palestinian civilians. We are the violent ones; we are the cheats. Our very foundations have been undermined by our adulation of force, and all this is called a democracy. There cannot be democracy when we rule over three million people who have no voice."

@davidylan

Just in case you have forgotten, here is Hamas REAL INTENTIONS:
Article 7: , the Islamic Resistance Movement aspires to the realisation of God's promise, no matter how long that should take. The Prophet, God bless him and grant him salvation, has said: "The Day of Judgment will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews, when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Muslims, O slaves of God, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharqad tree would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews."

You've held on to this article like a leech. Even the Jewish govt is not raving and ranting about a
supposed clause in the Hamas constitution. Recognizing Israel seems to be the crux of the problem on the Jewish side not article 7,8 or 9. Who says Israel won't look for other reasons for not granting them independence?
Israel under Sharon argued they couldn't do business with Arafat, since they poisoned Arafat how
come they didn't do business with Mossad appointee (Abbas)? If they'd done peace with Arafat,
would this not have rendered Hamas unemployed? The link I-man gave on the previous page says
Israel wants to make peace with Syria. Why stop with Syria, why not go the whole hog and make peace
with the Palestinians?

@I-man

Remind us again when the Palestinian intifada

started when Clinton was in the White

House and Barak was PM.Are they both neo-cons?

Barak offered full withdrawal from

Gaza,withdrawal from 90% of West Bank and

international control over the Temple Mount in

Jerusalem.What happened after that? The

Palestinans launched the bloodiest terror

campaign in recent memory.It was actually after

this that my views changed.Up till then,I used to

be like you

Barak though a good man was generally perceived as all talk.
You were also economical with the truth the intifada


started with a certain man through his provocation

on the Temple Mount I think his name is Sharon- a

name synonymous with violence all through the

history of the Jewish state. (If you want I could

recount his savagery in Lebanon and other places).

@davidylan

This is a symptom of Isreal bashers. You keep
hanging on to these false rhetoric about Isreal's
refusal to return to pre-1967 borders as a
condition for peace when in actual fact Hamas
main goal is NOT land but the complete
destruction of Isreal. Return to pre-1967 borders
as a condition for peace presupposes that there
was peace with Isreal before 1967, however one
wonders what borders the palestinians, Iraqis,
Jordanians, Egyptians, syrians were fighting for
when Isreal was attacked in 1948 and 1967 before
these "contentious borders" were seized by Isreal!

Of the five nations you mentione above, Israel
have made peace with two (Egypt and Jordan), its
in the process of making peace with the third (Syria)
here is I-man's link to the story: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/06/09/wmid109.xml&CMP=ILC-mostviewedbox
Cannot make peace with the fourth (Iraq) because of the chaos its chief sponsor caused there.
Cannot or do not want to make peace with the fifth because
(1) It shot itself by bringing in ultra right wing European settlers
(2) Gets 49% of its water from Gazza.
(3) Does not want to share Jerusalem.

@chidichris
Having just returned from church where I was confronted with a very poignant sermon, it was nice for you to post your latest comic masterpiece.
It was comical to read your latest effort to
justify the apartheid regime in Israel.
I needed cheering up, thanks again.

"am not troubled with names but i am troubled with inabilities to face facts."

What are the facts? Mmm lets see

"among all these conflicts with Isreal, could you please mention in a case where it is isreal versus another government."

If its not Israel versus Iran/Syria then its Israel versus Hamas/Hezbollah.

"i have asked here before and nobody answered that. what do you suggest Israel will do for peace to reign? 1967 baundries is out of it as it is not in the demands of the hamas led government. do you think isreal should withdraw totally as the hamas is calling for"

Did it escape you or did you glossed over the fact that the stumbling block between the Israeli govt and Hamas is, Hamas refusal to recognize the state of Israel and Israel's refusal to go back to pre 1967 border?

"should isreal be wiped out of the surface of the earth as the iranian president is calling for?"

I have said over and over again that its mere rhetorics and saber rattling. Iran does not possess the means of wiping out Israel.

"what is the solution in your terms?"

1Isreal to withdraw to pre 1967 borders
2Hamas to recognize Israel
Its as easy as that.

"in the lebanese current war, there is no terms like human shield even when the terrorists are using palestine refugee camp."

These "Terrorist" as you called them are Palestinians, and they live in those camps.

"factions fighting government are termed terrorists while when to fight with isreal, it becomes a crime to call them terrorists."

When they fight Israel they are freedom fighters=fighting to have a country of their own.

"UN has on several occassions reconfirm that self defence is allowed and isreal will always defend herself from any foriegn agression."

Assassinating Palestinian political leaders, wanton destruction of houses and firing live ammunition on stone throwing children can hardly be justified as self defense.

"it will be simple for you and your group to tell us that UN is stupid and foolish while you are the wisest men ever in history."

I still have faith in the "American" controlled UN even with all its flaws. Can I remind you Israel together with America has broken more UN resolution than any nation.

"i wish i could find my ways into your minds to know exactly your preffered solutions to middle east crises since you are not saying it out."

My solution was explained earlier.

"i want to ask again, if isreal does not want peace, who wants peace?"

I would refer you to G Levy's article for answers and add these also.
1While we are asking the de facto Hamas govt to recognize Israel, Israel is busy taking delivery of the latest American made fighter jets, is this peaceful?
2No initiative will work as long as we have neoconservative control Israel and America. These people are opposed to any resolution of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict on any terms other than having an Israeli general ruling Palestine.
3 Americans also mistakenly believe every Jew supports the govt's apartheid policy, the American media never report the Israeli opposition like G Levy, when they become fairer the truth will be open.
4Jordan and Egypt has hardly attacked Israel since a peace treaty was signed by both sides, but Jewish paranoia would make us believe that they would be wiped out as soon as Palestine gets independence. They forget what Palestine wants is sovereignty and human rights.
5We all know With the almighty IDF, Israel's war with the Palestinians is a colonial war rather than a war of survival. This is why all men of good taste from the Pope to Nelson Mandela will never support Israel.
6 The US should stop financing this expansionist policy of creating a greater Israel.
7Stop pumping out 49% of its daily water requirements from the West Bank if they want peace.

My friend after reading the above facts and still not convinced, then get I-man and davidylan to send you some of their resources on distorting historical facts.

@I-man

So because its an "internal matter",we should keep quiet about civilian casualties?Should it matter whether a civilian died at the hands of Jews or at the hands of fellow Arabs?

Am still waiting for your comments regarding federal high-handed approach in the Niger delta.

@davidylan

The question you are stridently avoiding is one you raised yourself. You claimed the blame was on Isreal last yr since she was using US made weapons to attack hezbollah using "home made weapons" (a claim that has shown u up to be ignorant of what you are loudly posting about). Now that it has been proven that the same Lebanon is being armed by the US you turn around to start chasing shadows about the US being hated for supplying weapons to others to kill themselves!

Here is what you need to defend: now that the US is also supplying Lebanon as they supplied Isreal last yr are u prepared to start reprimanding the "disproportionate display of force" from the Lebanese army and start weeping profusely for the innocent women and children being killed as you did last yr?

Am afraid you still failed to grasp the logic in my post. The US is flaming the embers of war in the middle east. On one hand it helped Israel to destroy Lebanese infrastructure, now it is helping Lebanon to destroy itself. Can't you see what the insidious evil mind in Washington is doing. Lebanese fighting Lebanese is an internal matter. Why are you not calling for UN involvement in the Niger Delta? Is this because it is an internal matter. I would like to hear from you when the US decides to send plane load of arms to the delta.

@I-man
Don't worry I have the Telegraph link.

@davidylan

This is confusion of the highest order! Grin Grin Now the "hatred" has shifted to the US for supplying Lebanon with weapons to defend its territorial integrity? So are we to hate the market woman who sells your wife a kitchen knife if she ends up using it to kill you?

WHO ARE THOSE ARMING THE ISLAMIC MILITANTS? Where you not the same person praising the Syrian support for hezbollah? And what has the Italian trial of CIA operatives got to do with this? Another attempt to avoid your own confused babble?

Is it strange that the imperialist US was the same country supplying Israel last year? The CIA reference was for you to add to former friends who are becoming foes. And the cold war is about to restart.

@I-man
Why did you remove the link you provided earlier.? Am sorry I have the link and will be visiting that topic on a later date. Israel can run but it can hide.

@davidylan

Lebanon is currently being suplied with US weapons to fight the islamic millitants in Beirut!

Now you know why the US is hated. Instead of being a peacemaker, they'd rather arm the Lebanese to kill themselves. This is why he's having troubles on all fronts.
Check this out, the Italians are trying in absentia some CIA operatives, who went to a friendly country to abduct an Italian citizen.

They want peace but not at any prize , can't see Syria taking the bait. Why now for the moribund govt of Ehud Omert?
A govt that have very little support at home, a govt whose foreign minister is actively gunning for the number one position. First reaction by Syria would be to accept, but the small print makes for uncomfortable reading. For instance why should Syria stop its support for Hezbollah? Is Israel
thinking of moving back into Lebanon again? Am sorry but the Jewish state can't be trusted.

P.S
Isn't it strange that Syria (a member of the axis of evil) is now being wooed by the US and Israel.
With the latest Iranian missiles all pointing at Tel Aviv, is this a way to checkmate Iran?

@I-man

Strange. . for someone who uses the term,"Jew" perjoratively, and who just attacked attacked Charles Moore for asking a rhetorical question and purpotedly working for the Daily Mail

Have they stopped being Jewish. You and I know when I say Jew, I don't mean being tight fisted.

Nothing has changed except the identity of the "killers".Last year,it was Isreal,this year Lebanon.Could that explain the difference in reaction?

This is an internal matter between the Lebanese factions,you can't compare this internal conflict with last years war when Israel deployed the best the IDF could muster. Would you invite the UN to the Niger delta, considering there's a lot o killing there?

@ebeledi
Why don't you join Igbo kwenu instead of bothering us here?

@Angel101
Have you got the link to this story?

@davidylan

If you bothered to read our replies beyond merely going paranoid

I wonder who is paranoid.
You accused someone who merely said "This is stupid" of insult.

Does being a "European wide boycott" lend any shred of legitimacy to this show of shame?

Afraid so, the entire continent of Europe can't be hoodwinked like America.

Why didnt the Europeans boycott the South African media and academia during the apartheid regime?

Maybe Europe has learnt its lesson, but don't forget your friends in the pariah state of Israel helped build that formidable SA apartheid army.

When Ahmedinajad TWICE advocated the wiping out of the jewish race

Saber rattling

What if Ehud Olmert had advocated that Iran be wiped off the map, would you and your fellow appologetics not be making this a worldwide boycott?

Israel has the wherewithal, Iran does not and you know this

The Lebanese army is busy destroying TWO palestinian refugee camps (who by the way are only defending themselves with stones!) and we are yet to hear of sanctions from the UN,

Lets look at that logic.
If your son(Hezbollah) hits you(Lebanon) in front of your employer(UN) and your employer(UN) feels disgusted and refused to pay your wages who will surfer? Is it not Lebanon that will surfer if their was sanction?

Yet more arrant nonsense! The whole world held Libya to ransom for more than 10 years because of two Libyan citizens implicated in the 1989 Lockerbie bombing. Was the bombing a universal decision of all Libyans?
If those same "islamic militants" were Jewish, would you be typing that drivel? Since when did we start these sick game of allowing terrorists to get away with their crimes on the excuse that palestine is not a nation?

How do I explain Palestine is not a recognized state, so can't be held responsible for the many terrorist activities there. Who would you hold responsible? Is it Hamas, Fatah, Islamic jihad or the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
If Islamic Jihad was to claim responsibility for a terror outrage, how do you punish them without inflicting pain on the innocents as well. Are all these different groups not fighting each other as we speak? For the uptenth time stop comparing a member of the united nation to a people who are fighting for freedom.

@I-man

It all goes to show that much of the hoopla sorrounding civilian casualties in last year's conflict involving Isreal had more to do with anti-Isreal sentiments than sympathy for suffering Lebanese civilians

I see you can't stop using the old Jewish trump card of accusing any one that questions Israels apartheid policy of anti-semitism?
Am not going to let this stifle our debate as it has stunted middle east debates in America for decades.

Tell me you're referring to a different war?
It seems you turned a blind eye to Israel using the latest Sherman tanks and American made B52s to fight an army largely based on volunteers. Was this not the same Israel that flew over 3000 sorties to inflict the worst structural damage to Lebanon?
According to you we are supposed to sympathize with an army Hitler would be proud of. Am sure you did not see the overkill of Israel in that war.

more to do with anti-Isreal sentiments

Were we suppose to empathize with Israel who was using the latest munitions manufactured and supplied by the
militarily superior USA against an opponent using homemade rockets? This is a joke right?
If it was meant as such, you forgot the punchline.

@chidichris
In my earlier debate with you I genuinely thought you were interested in rational discourse not knowing you were even more swayed by biblical leanings than the usual cheerleaders here.
It seems you are not seeking the ultimate answers to the fundamental questions of the middle east (considering you live there).
Paradoxically, it seems it is easier for you to side with the heavily armed Israeli army than stone throwing children, because of your faith.

If you had followed this thread from the beginning, you would have found out some of us believe in syncretic politics rather than the gun boat diplomacy of the usual suspects.

You come across like a raw recruit from the davidylan a.k.a I-man school of (Fox) indoctrination. Hehehe!

Don't you think your religiosity is making you a laughing stock? I believe you are not already too brainwashed beyond salvation?
O'l boy its your fault if you decide to believe people who qualify to be listed in the 100 most decorated "Jewish" cheerleaders. Hehehe, good luck o.

As long as Bush remains in the white house war of any kind is possible.

@I-man

This is arrant nonsense.That article was written with regards to a proposed Law that will prohibit remarks viewed as offensive to religion.If asking "Is Muhammad a pedophile"? makes you a "known racist"(wondering whether Islam is a race),what about all those who raise questions about one religion or the other.Is Bill Maher a "known racist" because he makes fun of Christianity?Is Chris Ofili a "known racist" because he made fun of Catholicism?

Was it not his intention to annoy or why else would he make a comment knowing some of his audience will be disgusted when using such pejorative language.
It may be fun to you but this is how the Moslem's viewed it. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,1373009,00.html

@I-man
Google Charles Moore and see how much Google coughs up.
See his disdain about Moslem's and Islam
Is the prophet Mohammed a pedophile by Charles Moore http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2004/12/11/do1101.xml&sSheet=/opinion/2004/12/11/ixop.html

Am sure you'll be happy he's taking on the Moslem's, forgetting these are the same tactics used by historical racist like Joseph Goebbels. You look the other way because you're not on the receiving end.
The intellectually bankrupt Charles Moore may take on Moslem's today, rest assured it'll be black people next.

I agree, some guys are funny. . . .including the ones who wrote Resolution 242,which demands Isreal withdraw to pre-1967 borders in the context of a comprehensive peace agreement where all the parties renounce claims of belligerency and recognise each other's right of existence.In other words,what I just outlined earlier which requires a peace partner on the other side.

You may prefer a unilateral withdrawal by Isreal but what you prefer is not what is required of Isreal by 242.As Davidylan pointed out,there was no peace prior to the 6 day war.The occupation of the West Bank and Gaza came about because of the belligerence of the neighbouring Arab states.As a result,the Security Council a.k.a funny guys, resolved that for Isreal to withdraw,there must be a comprehensive peace agreement where all the states renounce their belligerence and recognise each other's right of existence.

Your litany of excuses is exactly what made Gideon write the article. Israel refused the American road map to peace (which calls for a 2 state solution) the Saudi and European initiatives, and countless UN resolutions. There won't be peace as long as Israel with its almighty army remains a pariah state. Anyway the balance of power will soon change when Iran becomes nuclear.

@davidylan

The idea is not merely to look at the author's name and rubbish the article, it is meant for individuals who at least make an effort to READ and DIGEST the article with a view to thrashing out the ISSUES as part of the debate!

I wish you had done the same thing with the Levy article.

On what basis is Afam's "copy and paste" different from the above?

Afam don't go rummaging the racist archives to produce works of known racist and fiction writers.

It is not about bias but about whether the issues raised are valid or not! British journalists and
scientists recently voted to boycott Isreali media and universities!

Its a European wide boycott, since the academics, are complicit with the Israeli apartheid govt.

What of the issues raised about Alan Johnston?
What if he were captured by Isreali terrorists? Would the Brits/BBC be pretending as if all is well?

According to the BBC Mr Johnson was abducted by Islamic militants. I've searched the web and can't find any nation called "Islamic militants". Since Israel is a state you can hardly compare them to the occupied land of Palestine. If Jewish militants had done the same thing, Brits would have pressured the Israeli govt to see he was released.
Its not like there was a universal approval in Palestine to Alan's abduction. Most Palestinian journalist have been protesting the kidnapping of Mr Johnson. In the absence of the rule of law due in large part to Israel's occupation what do you expect them to do. Would it make Alan any safer if the British press was advocating fire and brimstone?

@davidylan

huh? From whence camest thou? . . . and the very first statement is to insult people?

Where was the insult?

He said: "Some guys are funny"

What is insulting in that statement? To most sane people you are a comedian.
Why else would you paste articles by known racist? You can visit them in their racist hangout, but spare us the pain of regurgitating their vile views here.
Is it not a joke that Charles Moore was accusing the BBC of bias, while writing for the (British) daily mail, a known racist propagandist machine.
Did he forget (unlike the Mail) the editorial independence of the BBC is etched solid in its charter. One of the true media outlet you can actually trust. Are we to rely on Fox News that pass opinion as facts?
Lamenting Israel getting a rough ride in European press is like Tyson sobbing for not getting good press while dishing out his finest uppercuts to Robin Given.
Israel gets good press in America because the 4 big news networks, are owned by Jews hence work in tandem with the mighty Jewish lobby.
Stop reading synopsis of the Israel/Palestine conflict by biased authors, else we'll continue to think you are comic genius.

@I-man

That fantasy is expressed in demands for a "right of return" in order to use demographics as a weapon.

Did you say demography?
So Israel can build settlements on occupied territories filled with Soviet, European and American Jews, but Palestinians living in the region can't return?

Most Arabs do no wish to have a 2 state solution.If the Arab Govts were elected,like in "Palestine",they will chose Govts that call for Isreal to be wiped off a la Ahmedinejad

What do they want?
This is rich coming from a man who trumpets democracy in Iraq as an achievement, you want them hand picked or selected?

It is this attitude,not Isreal,that constitutes the biggest stumbling block to the search for peace in the Middle East

The stumbling block has always been who leads Israel. Expect negotiations to start when their's a change in leadership in Israel. The delay tactics explained by G Levy would cease if their was a Labour govt.