₦airaland Forum

Empiree:
hummm

Empiree what do you have to say?

Toks2008:
I can see you are very intelligent and I must admit it....nevertheless,that Quran 4:157 is the only obstacle standing in the way of Muslims to enter Jannah.

How can you be so sure?

That citation was a mockery of the thoughts of the enemy of Jesus who thought they killed him...Read again expecially the start.."that they boast"

It is only casting more light to the fact that though it appears to them that they killed Jesus, he was not killed because JESUS CAN NOT BE KILLED but he only went through a transition by willingly giving up the ghost which was why he said these last words.."Father into your hands I commit my spirit" because on the third day,he rose and just as the Quran rightly reported..."He was taken up whole by Allah"

What you are doing now sir is explaining the Quran with holy spirit except the use of holy spirit in discerning verses of scriptures has no basis in islam isn't applicable.

when Allah tells us he wasn't killed, we take it as such except there is an evidence to the contrary. Only then we would then see how these statements can match without contradicting each other. So we don't need to be lead by the spirit to differentiate black from white.

If he never went through transition then why this quote from the Quran...

Quran 19:33
"So peace is on me the day I was born, the day that I die, and the day that I shall be raised up to life (again)!"

That's because in Islam as recorded in an authentic hadith (sayings of the prophet Muhammad s.a.w), he isa pbuh will live on earth again and die. So he was making reference to this event that will happen in future

Toks2008:
What false premise?

I would have prefered the Quran has its own original contents then I would have seen a reason to quote it to buttress my facts but I can not use a copy of the original facts to buttress the original facts.

Were all these not written about Jesus straight from the Quran? are these really not known already from the Bible?

Let's have a run through of what the Quran says about Jesus and we will realize that any Muslim who does not believe in Jesus is indeed a Bad Muslim.

Quran 2:87
We gave Jesus the son of Mary Clear (Signs) and strengthened him with the holy spirit.

2:136
We believe in Allah, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) prophets from their Lord: We make no difference between one and another of them . . .

2:253 . . .
To Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and strengthened him with the holy spirit.

3:45
O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah.

3:46
"He shall speak to the people in childhood and in maturity. And he shall be (of the company) of the righteous."

3:48
And Allah will teach him the Book and Wisdom, the Law and the Gospel.

3:49
And (appoint him) a messenger to the Children of Israel, (with this message): "I have come to you, with a Sign from your Lord, in that I make for you out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allah's leave: And I heal those born blind, and the lepers, and I quicken the dead, by Allah's leave; and I declare to you what ye eat, and what ye store in your houses. Surely therein is a Sign for you if ye did believe."

3:50
(I have come to you), to attest the Law which was before me. And to make lawful to you part of what was (Before) forbidden to you; I have come to you with a Sign from your Lord. So fear Allah, and obey me.

3:52
When Jesus found Unbelief on their part He said: "Who will be My helpers to (the work of) Allah?"

3:55
Behold! Allah said: "O Jesus! I will take thee and raise thee to Myself and clear thee (of the falsehoods) of those who blaspheme; I will make those who follow thee superior to those who reject faith, to the Day of Resurrection: Then shall ye all return unto me, and I will judge between you of the matters wherein ye dispute."

3:59
The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam . . .

3:84 . . . and in (the Books) given to Moses, Jesus, and the prophets, from their Lord.

4:157
That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";-but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not.

4:163
We have sent thee inspiration, as We sent it to Noah and the Messengers after him: we sent inspiration to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and Solomon, and to David We gave the Psalms.

4:171
O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) a messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His messengers. Say not "Trinity": desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth.

4:172
Christ disdaineth nor to serve and worship Allah . . .

5:17
In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ the son of Mary.

5:46
And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.

5:72
They do blaspheme who say: "Allah is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode.

5:75
Christ the son of Mary was no more than a messenger; many were the messengers that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food.

5:78
Curses were pronounced on those among the Children of Israel who rejected Faith, by the tongue of David and of Jesus the son of Mary: because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses.

5:110
O Jesus the son of Mary! Recount My favour to thee and to thy mother. Behold! I strengthened thee with the holy spirit, so that thou didst speak to the people in childhood and in maturity. Behold! I taught thee the Book and Wisdom, the Law and the Gospel and behold! thou makest out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My leave, and thou breathest into it and it becometh a bird by My leave, and thou healest those born blind, and the lepers, by My leave. And behold! thou bringest forth the dead by My leave. And behold! I did restrain the Children of Israel from (violence to) thee when thou didst show them the clear Signs, and the unbelievers among them said: 'This is nothing but evident magic.'

5:112
Behold! the disciples, said: "O Jesus the son of Mary! can thy Lord send down to us a table set (with viands) from heaven?" Said Jesus: "Fear Allah, if ye have faith."

5:114
Said Jesus the son of Mary: "O Allah our Lord! Send us from heaven a table set (with viands), that there may be for us-for the first and the last of us-a solemn festival and a sign from thee; and provide for our sustenance, for thou art the best Sustainer (of our needs)."

5:116
Allah will say: "O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah'?" He will say: "Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart . . ."

6:85
And Zakariya and John, and Jesus and Elias: all in the ranks of the righteous.
9:30 The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah.

9:31
They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).

19:19
He said: "Nay, I am only a messenger from thy Lord, (to announce) to thee the gift of a holy son."

19:20
She said: "How shall I have a son, seeing that no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste?"

19:21
He said: "So (it will be): Thy Lord saith, 'that is easy for Me: and (We wish) to appoint him as a Sign unto men and a Mercy from Us': It is a matter (so) decreed."

19:22
So she conceived him, and she retired with him to a remote place.

19:27
At length she brought the (babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms). They said: "O Mary! truly an amazing thing hast thou brought!"

19:30
He said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet."

19:31
"And He hath made me blessed wheresoever I be, and hath enjoined on me Prayer and Charity as long as I live."

19:32
"(He) hath made me kind to my mother, and not overbearing or miserable."

19:33
"So peace is on me the day I was born, the day that I die, and the day that I shall be raised up to life (again)!"

19:34
Such (was) Jesus the son of Mary: (it is) a statement of truth, about which they (vainly) dispute.

19:88
They say: "(Allah) Most Gracious has begotten a son!"

19:91
That they should invoke a son for (Allah) Most Gracious.

19:92
For it is not consonant with the majesty of (Allah) Most Gracious that He should beget a son.

21:91
And (remember) her who guarded her chastity: We breathed into her of Our spirit, and We made her and her son a sign for all peoples.

23:50
And We made the son of Mary and his mother as a Sign: We gave them both shelter on high ground, affording rest and security and furnished with springs.

33:7
And remember We took from the prophets their covenant: As (We did) from thee: from Noah, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus the son of Mary: We took from them a solemn covenant.

42:13
The same religion has He established for you as that which He enjoined on Noah-the which We have sent by inspiration to thee-and that which We enjoined on Abraham, Moses, and Jesus: Namely, that ye should remain steadfast in religion, and make no divisions therein: to those who worship other things than Allah, hard is the (way) to which thou callest them. Allah chooses to Himself those whom He pleases, and guides to Himself those who turn (to Him).

43:57
When (Jesus) the son of Mary is held up as an example, behold, thy people raise a clamour thereat (in ridicule)!

43:61
And (Jesus) shall be a Sign (for the coming of) the Hour (of Judgment): therefore have no doubt about the (Hour), but follow ye Me: this is a Straight Way.

43:63
When Jesus came with Clear Signs, he said: "Now have I come to you with Wisdom, and in order to make clear to you some of the (points) on which ye dispute: therefore fear Allah and obey me."

57:27
We sent after them Jesus the son of Mary, and bestowed on him the Gospel; and We ordained in the hearts of those who followed him Compassion and Mercy . . .

61:6
And remember, Jesus, the son of Mary, said: "O Children of Israel! I am the messenger of Allah (sent) to you, confirming the Law (which came) before me, and giving Glad Tidings of a Messenger to come after me, whose name shall be Ahmad." But when he came to them with Clear Signs, they said, "this is evident sorcery!"

61:14
O ye who believe! Be ye helpers of Allah: As said Jesus the son of Mary to the Disciples, "Who will be my helpers to (the work of) Allah?" Said the disciples, "We are Allah's helpers!" then a portion of the Children of Israel believed, and a portion disbelieved: But We gave power to those who believed, against their enemies, and they became the ones that prevailed.

It's not just jesus, any Muslim who disbelieves in any prophet of Allah isn't a Muslim.

That said, let's have one battle at a time. If you think by pasting those verses in a lengthy form would distract me from the course, you are clearly mistaken.

Toks2008:
Can you now see that this thread is laden with vivid citations from the Quran and I'm so glad your eyes are now open to see that the original Arabic writing NEVER CLAIMED THAT SOMEONE'S FACE WAS MADE TO RESEMBLE JESUS FACE...but it was the interpreters that added that lie from the pits of hell.

I can only imagine how you must be leaping with joy as I did when Messi scored Manchester United with a header in uefa champions league final. I know that feeling. A feeling of victory and achievement. This feeling makes sense if such victory is true.

I NEVER SAID THAT SOMEONE'S FACE WAS MADE TO RESEMBLE HIS FACE. so why are you celebrating like I finally admitted to something I refused to admit to before.
Besides I already explained why translators of the quran would put forward such scenarios. It's all because, such cases wouldn't nullify the statement " appeared so to them but wasn't killed nor crucified". Personally I go with the translation that doesn't tell me how it happened since Allah didn't give explicit and cupious details on that.

That quote.."That they boast" that they crucify him...was not and can never be a denial of the true vivid account of Christ crucifixion but a mockery of those who thought they killed him.

Pls explain.

Just imagine for a moment that the Quran will ever dare to report that Jesus was not crucified when the bible that was written years before the Quran reported a vivid account by those who witnessed it first hand..sometimes it baffles me how people who claim to be intelligent reason.

Unfortunately for you, quran reported it since 1400 years ago. And in the history of Islam, we have Christians who accepted Islam and dropped the view that jesus was crucified or killed. So what's your point here exactly

Muslims may believe that Jesus never died for them but saying he was never crucified is not only foolish but very absurd.

In Islam he was neither killed nor crucified. If the matter pain you for body, come and beat me. I dey my house

Toks2008:
Let me be blunt with you,the Quran is only a copy version of the bible with some alterations in the stories so why should I quote an altered copy of the original truth.

HAhahahaha. So why don't you just go ahead and call Muslims Christians.
Quran in the face of Muslims is their holy book and your opinion on alteration of Bible to form quran is another argument for another day. But as it is now, bring your proof from the quran or stop calling your lies facts

So if you can't counter those "facts" I wrote from the Quran please do the needful by keeping mum.

Go and learn the meaning of fact / facts. Until you provide evidence to support your claims from 1 to 10, you are a liar.

Why should I quote a book that only copied original facts and altered them? I quoted several Quran citations about Jesus and these are what we already know from the Bible except the funny alterations in the true stories and using funny names.

Perhaps you should have first created a thread to address this pressing concern. When it's been proven that truly quran is an altered version of the Bible, you can then go ahead and create a thread and you will be allowed to use same stroke to flog both faith. BUT AS IT IS NOW, YOU CANNOT BUILD YOUR FACTS ON FALSE PREMISE.

Toks2008:
Looking further into that sane Quran verse about Jesus crucifixion, here are 7 very parallel translations and I guess it is some of these translations that added the fact that someone else took the face of Jesus that led to the while confusion but the original Quran verse never included that

It's important to state that no matter how accurate a translation might be, once a language is translated, to some extent, some meanings are lost.
It is true that the quran originally never specified how it was made to appear so to them... .... So as a Muslim, the best reply would be what the quran says "he wasn't KILLED NOR CRUCIFIED but he was made to appear so to them". How did it happen, Allah knows best.

7 Parallel translations in English for the 157th verse of chapter 4 ( sūrat l-nisāa ).

Sahih International : And [for] their saying, "Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the messenger of Allah." And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain.

Pickthall : And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah's messenger - they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain.

Yusuf Ali : That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-

Shakir : And their saying: Surely we have killed the Messiah, Isa son of Marium, the messenger of Allah; and they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them so (like Isa) and most surely those who differ therein are only in a doubt about it; they have no knowledge respecting it, but only follow a conjecture, and they killed him not for sure.

Muhammad Sarwar : and their statement that they murdered Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of God, when, in fact, they could not have murdered him or crucified him. They, in fact, murdered someone else by mistake. Even those who disputed (the question of whether or not Jesus was murdered) did not have a shred of evidence. All that they knew about it was mere conjecture. They certainly could not have murdered Jesus.

Mohsin Khan : And because of their saying (in boast), "We killed Messiah 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the Messenger of Allah," - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of 'Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not [i.e. 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary) ]:

Arberry: and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messenger of God' -- yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him; they have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they slew him not of a certainty -- no indeed;

What I also find interesting in this is that out of the 7 major English translators of the quran, only 3 try to tell us that someone else was killed or crucified instead of him. But all the translations agree that he (jesus pbuh) wasn't killed or crucified and stopped at "it was made to appear so to them"

So we can see where the misconception came from.

However, a renowed Professor and Islamic scholar Mahmoud M. Ayoub sums up what the Quran states despite interpretative arguments:He said

You only see what you want to see. All translations said he wasn't killed nor crucified and you are quoting a scholar that tells us otherwise? Are you high on something? Which translation was used by this scholar? Or is there a different evidence to this that his claim was deduced?

"[s] The Quran, as we have already argued, does not deny the death of Christ. [/s]Rather, it challenges human beings who in their folly have deluded themselves into believing that they would vanquish the divine Word, Jesus Christ the Messenger of God. The death of Jesus is asserted several times and in various contexts."

again, you are using the opinion of a scholar as irrefutable proof. Did it occur to you that there are many more scholars that totally reject this fallacy?

And I perfectly agree with him so with this,no Muslim has any reason not to accept Jesus as his or her saviour who was crucified to take away his or her sins

of course, why won't you? It's what a dishonest Christian would do.

A denial of this by any Muslim is an automatic eternal denial of having access to Paradise when he or she leaves the world. Simple and straightforward...GOD is not an author of confusion

All Muslims believe that isa (pbuh) wasn't killed nor crucified. However there are difference of opinion on the statement " it was made to appear so to them" as its very vague and different scenarios can be inputed that still wouldn't nullify the context.

Toks2008:
*yawns*
Do you know why I never bothered about any reference from the Quran?because I want people like you to prove me wrong.

Are you alright sir? You don't make a claim and ask the audience to prove you wrong. You make a claim and back it up with irrefutable evidences and it becomes a fact. So far you have failed at this

I just quoted verses upon verses from the Quran but you refuse to see even the overwhelming references in the Quran about Jesus on this page andi could simply pick anyone as Quranic facts that support my position.Read through the pages ad you will see overwhelming citations from the very Quran..

If you were drunk when typing this, I implore you to be sober before besmirching your hard earned reputation in this forum. You just admitted up there that you deliberately didn't include references from the quran and here you are saying speaking like a fibber.

An imam just few minutes ago was humbled when he discovered that the original Arabic text never made mention of anyone taking the face of Jesus and crucified in his place.

Present proofs to back up your false claims, and you are talking about an imam. Am I supposed to take what transpired between you and an imam as proof.

Many of your type are so blinded with hate that they refused to see vivid facts

Until you back up your claims with irrefutable evidences, your points remain your opinions and you have no right to call them facts if you are unwilling to prove them.

I challenge you to counter all the facts I listed from the quran...at least I gave references from the bible
Waiting

With all due respect, the post concerns both faith. You of all people should know that honesty demands you support your claims for both faiths using their scriptures. Giving references from the Bible in a post that concerns Islam and Christianity isn't enough. If you can't agree with this simple fact, then I have nothing else to say to you than leave you to bask in your ignorance.

Perhaps let me repeat myself in clearer terms. You mentioned 10 "facts" and you never gave any proof form the quran to back them up. You only gave reference in the 9th point and it wasn't supporting the claim.
And as for the second proof you gave I never disagreed with with you. I only asked that you would be wise to know what belief in a prophet means in Islam.

adepeter2027:
HAhahahaha

How dare you talk of our toks2008 like that..


Toks is fighting for god

checkout my rebuttal and you would have a second opinion to that

Toks2008:
It is quite disheartening that the world has turned upsidedown in the name of religion and rather than for religion to bring peace to the world,it has instead brought chaos,enmity,death and so much negativity.

The Muslim parents try to make their children "Good muslims" and Similarly, Christian parents try to make their children "Good Christians",but unfortunately,this seemingly innocuous act makes a child biased or at least strongly inclined towards a particular religion and when the child grows up, he/she has a strong set of beliefs and practices and automatically considers all other "religions "wrong". hence any attempt to convert to another religion faces a lot of problems.

For how long shall we continue in this unwarranted bugaboo in the name of defending a certain religion?is it really worth the stress?

I present to you 10 facts about Islam and Christianity that will leave many dumbfounded.

Let's see these facts.

1.Christianity and islam were not created by God but are man made. While Islam in its conceptual meaning simply means "to surrender to God" which automatically means anyone who submits or acknowledges GOD as his or her creator is practising Islam.
And talking about christianity,God never called anyone this and in fact the pagans at Antioch were the first people to use that word to describe the apostles (Acts 11:26; 26:28)

Perhaps you should focus on Christianity alone. Allah called our religion Islam and addressed His believers as Muslims. So how is this quoted trash a fact when it's actually false.

2.God does not recognize any religion but only those who truly worship him in truth:

Whether you claim to be a Christian or a Muslim, whether you convert from Islam to Christianity or visavs, it is inconsequential to GOD and he cares less but only recognizes those who worship him in spirit and in truth.John 4:24

So your reference was to support your fact for Christianity. Where is the reference for Islam. You have no proof as regards Islam and yet you call it a fact?

3.Whether you pray to God in a mosque or in a church,whether you celebrate eld fitir or easter or whether you celebrate Eld kibir or Christmas, it does not matter to GOD but only the salvation of your soul matters to him.

Romans 14;6-8 says..
"He who observes a special day does so to the Lord; he who eats does so to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us
lives to himself alone, and none of us dies
to himself alone.If we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.…

Again, another set of empty words with no proof. This thread was supposed to be about Islam and Christianity and here you are only focusing on Christianity. Perhaps you have no evidence to support your supposed facts about Islam. You should change the title of this thread promptly

4.In Paradise(Jannah),there are no Muslims or Christians, no religion,no mosque or church but only those whose names are written in the book of life.

Revelation 21:22
"I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple".

Revelation 21:27
"Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life".

Same shit



5.Both Prophet Muhamed (S.A.W) and Jesus christ are from one man, Abraham:

It may surprise some people to know that Ishmael the first son of Abraham is the ancestor of prophet Muhamed(S.A.W) and Isaac the second son of Abraham is the ancestor of Jesus christ.

Ishmael is recognized as an important prophet and patriarch of Islam.Ishmael was the firstborn of Abraham, born to him from his second wife Hagar. Ishmael is recognized by Muslims as the ancestor of several prominent Arab tribes and being the forefather of prophet Muhammad(S.A.W)

And the book of Mathew chp1 clearly highlighted the lineage from Isaac to Jesus.[/quote]The only unarguable fact

6.No one will ever enter paradise just by being a good Christian or good Muslim but the only condition to get into paradise is to believe in Jesus and it is a good thing that both religions believe in Jesus but anyone who does not believe in Jesus and his redemptive power will never enter the kingdom of GOD no matter the good works he or she does as a Christian or Muslim.

John 3:15
"so that everyone who believes in him will have eternal life".

This is the mistake you guys make. You would use the bible to justify your claims against Muslims. If Muslims believed in your bible, there won't be Muslims. I am actually disappointed that you are equally guilty of this

7.Christians and Muslims believe in one GOD and pray to one GOD but only call him different names..

Muslims call him Allah which is the Arabic name while Christians call him Jehovah or Yaweh which is the same GOD in Hebrew language.

True in most cases.

8.Christianity and Islam are the same when you compare the stories of the bible and the Quran except some variations which makes it look different and regarding Jesus,there have been misconceptions by the Muslims who say Christians call Jesus the son of GOD.

The truth is that Jesus is not the biological son of GOD but a divine son chosen by GOD himself to be just as any earthly father can choose to make anyone a son by adoption and give him authority so GOD made Jesus his son divinely and gave him powers beyond human comprehension.

I thought this thread was supposed to point out irrefutable factsabout islam and Christianity but this point here shows how biased you are. If I were to refute this, we would start a whole new argument. I think you should learn to stick tothe scope of the discourse.

9.The only condition that will take us to paradise has nothing to do with religion but only if we accept Jesus as our saviour by accepting his sacrifice on the cross.

And here you finally exposed your true intentions. But I have to admit your method of evangelism is pathetic.

Many Muslims say Jesus was never crucified because the misconstrued that part of the Quran that states;
"That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him , but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not. (4:157,Yusif Ali)

This part of the Quran was in no way discrediting the true account of the cruxifiction of Jesus but only making it clear that Jesus was in the real sense not killed but only went through a transition while his enemies were foolish and myopic in their thoughts boasting that they crucified him just like the Quran clearly states.

If after reading a very explicit statement that HE WAS NOT KILLED NOR CRUCIFIED from the quran and you are still trying to input what wasn't written in the quran into it, then I have to say you are worse than the nairaland bigots sir.

So in essence,those Muslims claiming that Jesus was never crucified got that Quran verse all wrong because the Quran agrees in totality the divinity of Jesus and the Quran also agrees that he was born of a virgin,that he did many miracles and that he was actually crucified and that he is coming back again

May God deliver you from falsehood. Bring a proof from the quran that supports that claim I just striked out or apologise for making such erroneous statements.

10.There is no need for anyone to change his or her religion either from Islam to Christianity of visavis in order to enter paradise.

As a Muslim,you can continue to practise Islam by going to mosque to pray,by observing all the daily prayers,by performing hajj or observing the Islamic festivals and many more...as long as you accept Jesus as your saviour(even without changing your religion) you are automatically a believer in Jesus christ which is never the same as being a Christian.

There are many people who practise Christianity but are not believers in christ and such will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

I think you are confused. You should have focused on romance section

*Islam urges Muslims to believe in Jesus and in fact any Muslim who does not believe in Jesus is not a good Muslim.

Quran 5:46
And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.

The next question should be "in Islamic terms, what does belief in a prophet entail?" you would do yourself a huge favour knowing what it means in Islam than translating it in Christianity terms.

Here are 5 interesting facts also in the Quran about Jesus...

Here are 6 facts Muslims believe about Jesus

-Jesus , Mary, and the angel Gabriel are all in the Quran » (as are Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, and a bunch of other Bible characters).

-Muslims believe that Jesus (called "Isa" in Arabic ) was a prophet of God, was born to a virgin (Mary), and will return to Earth before the Day of Judgment to restore justice and to defeat al-Masih ad-Dajjal ("the false messiah", also known as the Antichrist. All of which may sound pretty familiar to many Christians.

-Mary (called " Maryam " in Arabic) has an entire chapter in the Quran named for her — the only chapter in the Quran named for a female figure. In fact, Mary is the only woman to be mentioned by name in the entire Quran and strangely, Mary is mentioned more times in the Quran than in the entire New Testament.

-Just as with all the other prophets, including Mohammed , Muslims recite, "Peace be upon him" every time we refer to Jesus.

-Muslims believe that Jesus performed miracles: The Quran discusses several of Jesus's miracles, including giving sight to the blind, healing lepers, raising the dead, and breathing life into clay birds

true.
.

In conclusion, while the world worry their heads about religion,God is only interested in those who are believers in christ because it is only this set of people that matters to God .

One of the simplest definition of fact is a thing that is indisputably the case. Pretty sure by now you must have seen how disputable your facts opinions are

Came here to see the facts...... ... As always, just false facts. Toks, you should continue with your topics in romance. You do better there.

lastbaff:
Nice choice

TThanks

lastbaff:
Which one?

Got A1

Very stupid thread. Supposed adult asking for what to do especially when its as simple as abc. Go marry her now. On your wedding night, I will send my little nephew to go and have a taste of her too. ( just kidding).

But it's annoying when you guys ask for advice on simplest of things. Cheating on you with an anonymous person is one thing, but with your brother or any relative of yours and you are still confused on what to do? You are truly sick. You need prayers sir. Wishing you a quick recovery

chingy012:
I'd suggest you get the Gionee A1 Lite with 20MP front camera and 16MP back camera, Octacore processor and 4000mAh Battery.

Thanks but I already got the senior brother.

Empiree:
They rely on certain ahadith (Al-Bukhaari (4101) and Muslim (2039) where nabi(sa) and a companion(ra) ate young goat. But there seems to be condition to that. Although generally, there is no age limit of animal we eat. I personally would not eat vile (baby) animal talkless of newborn. But in this context, it is about Udhiya, there is age in animal we choose for qurbani.

Under the heading which this baby animal is cited, is under defected animal not eligible for Udhiya. So what's the point of slaughtering the baby since mother is considered defective and needs to care for her baby?.

Well, it is fiqh issue of certain people. It is not binding. Spare the baby and let it grow. There are other options. These ahadith seem to refute slaughtering baby animal for "sacrifice" (eran ileya) al-Bukhaari (5556) and Muslim (1961)

I believe the rules of Islam are fair and just. And I believe there has to be a proper explanation for this.
Islamic morals supercedes every other cultures'. So I find it surprising that it's permissible to kill a premature baby animal for consumption that ordinarily most customs would despise. Allahu a'alam

neighy:
amin.. Wa iyyakum..

No not on the account of udhiya buh as a product of the animal meant for the sacrifice.. Thats why u can either slaughter it or give it out

For now, Let's say it's on that account. Do we have a daleel to support the permisibility of slaughtering the baby of animal meant for sacrifice?

neighy:
https://islamqa.info/en/129231 this should help

jazakallahu khairan for the link.
The link stresses that as long as an animal is for consumption purpose only, there is no restriction in age. But this little lamb (kid) that is to be slaughtered is slaughtered on account of udhiya. And we all know an animal for Udhiya must be matured. So I find this confusing.

neighy:
it is stated in d article.. "its better to give it out in chartity and alternatively slaughter it and give the meat as sadaqa to d needy"

I think you haven't been following our discussions. Perhaps you should check my first comment in this thread. How do you slaughter a newly born animal and give out the meat for consumption?

DocHMD:
I know I inflammed your pro-abooki nerves with the truth I slammed on your miserable anti-IPOB pseudo-intellectual skull.

It doesn't change the fact that the major aim of every bail is to keep the defendant within the reach of the court and that hasn't failed so why rescind the bail to arrest because hyenas and zombies are disgruntled about his growing power?

I became speechless after seeing about 200 ignorant fools liked your comment.
I believe you have been schooled by blue3k already. Read and learn

Lukgaf:
it should be slaughter because it is product of the Animal we intend to kill as Udiya

Do our have any daleel for this comment?
Are you saying Allah commands us to slaughter a premature animal or its just your view? If we slaughter it, we can't eat it and that's just unjustified murder. If you don't know it's better to say so than speak what's not right.

Lukgaf

9) If an animal purchased for Udhiya gives birth (before being slaughtered), then the newly born animal should also be slaughtered.

This isn't clear. Does this mean the little baby will equally be slaughtered as udhiya

Newnas:
I don't know links but I can list books for you. They're in Arabic though. Even if I send links they will be Arabic link.

As for your last statement, it's a complete evidence against you. You can't blame anyone for your lazy approach to knowledge.

Please help with the names of these books.

Newnas:
So you think you have made a point? Olodo!

Anyone who wishes to get the right explanation of these hadiths should read Sheikh Ibnul Uthymeen's commentary on Ibn Taymiyyah's Aqeedatul waasitiyyah.

Spending my time with a dull headed deviant is a plot of shaytaan. I ask Allah to save me from such waste of time.

assalamualykum. Please help me with a link for their explanations. Albaqir isn't the only Muslim on this thread. I want to learn too and so far he has a point that sounds very convincing

iamgenius:
It's nonsense sir, if you want to do it makesure you do these tests also: 1) if the girl wil be a good wife 2) if she will bear you children 3) if ur children will be good. 4) if u'll have gud family. If you can do these four tests plus d genotype bro, u are free to go.

What do you mean?

AhluSunnah:
Very funny. . a kafir quoting hadith on akam issue. . u belief in akam and u disbelief in aqeedah. . k . alba.qir. aqir

Wallahi, you can be so annoying. Kafir or not he has made good points to refute the op. What contribution have you brought forward? If you have nothing reasonable to say, keep quiet and learn.
@usermane I really wish you had answered abdelkabir's questions. You brought a verse to support your claim and you feel explaining it will derail the thread? How illogical

Joysmart
Do you still sell

Empiree:
She should have zipped it when she is quite aware of her religious status. She crossed the line.

And playing professional football is not "path of iblis" unless there is decisive evidence to suggest so. It is simply a sport. It is not a simple haram issue. The conditions the brother brought up as evidence of its haram apply to many other legitimate businesses, jobs (restaurants) and other activities. Does it make working in restaurant haram?. So this is not haram or halal issue. It is a matter of ijtihad but they wanted to make it sound like it is haram to play professional football. If it is not haraam, then, it is not path of shaytan.

The Iblis angle wasn't for the permissibility and the impermissibility of professional football but to let You know that Iblis didnt feel guilty in disobeying Allah. He never repented nor was he sorry for his action. Disobedient and proud is what the sister is trying to avoid.
She acknowledges her faults and she sees them as sins and she has the will to overcome them someday and that counts.
But one who tries to justify his faults by advocating disobedience of Allah is no better than Iblis.


Also just because Mr A drinks doesn't mean he can't enjoin what is Good and forbid what is evil.

Empiree:
so you admit you are not even a right Muslim and you passing silly fatwa here? .I thought you are some religious hadhead. Please be quiet in this matter. Thank you

Haba Empiree. She admits she isn't perfect. No one is. Just because one is guilty of something doesn't mean he should lead Others astray. Are you expecting her to tow the path of iblees?
Digging her profile pic out was wrong as she never claimed to be better than anyone.
You want to know what's worse? Not keeping quiet after she told you she didn't want to be iblees who was proud and disobedient.

Let us preserve what must be preserved, perfect what can be perfected and prune practises that ought to be prohibited.

Mariinee:
LOL.

Don't use my lifestyle as judgment. I know that my dress code is against Islamic rules, you don't have to tell me. I'm hoping to change, Allah willing.
I'm not like you. I'm not trying to defend what's wrong.

Have a nice day, brother.

Your comment really touched me. It tells us that just because we can't practice what Allah has said doesn't mean we should then discourage others. May Allah reward you abundantly and make you to be more practising and increase you in eemaaan.

AhluSunnah:
Newnas you are saying absolutely nonsense. i gave u the reference to those alfa proof . and better still, its that quran ayah that they both use to support their claims . . . . . . . if you cant google up and download the pdf format of the book to check and read all the book content... thats your problem. , . . u that u keep shouting NO ALFA SAID ALL BIDA IS KUFRU. U NEVER BRING AN EVIDENCE FROM ANY OF THOSE SCHOLARS BOOK NOR REFERENCE NOR TITLE OF THE BOOK. I gave u quran verse suratul maidah verse 3 and its explanation that all bida is kufru and u ignore it and stil shouting alfa. . . w HDG gdga0iaayah

Just like I suspected, you make statements you can't back up and When proof is demand Or you, you require your audience to use google. What kind of da'i are you?

AhluSunnah:
TOOR, I REST MY CASE.

Don't even think about it. Rest what? All the time you will be starting threads and when asked for proof, you chicken out. Not today. Bring the proof for the 2 scholars you claimed are in support of your "kulla bid'atin kufr" and don't think about asking us to check google. When you make a claim, the onus is in you to provide evidence
هاتوا برهانكم إن كنتم صادقين

tintingz:
Lol, So what about homosexual among animals? What makes some animals gays?

So, has it gotten to a point where we now compare our moralities with that of animals?

Science have found genes that could be gay gene, and not only that, gender dysporia is also a disorder that gays are facing, how does "Allah" give cure for them? Are harmaphrodites opposed by Allah creation? Who created them? You need to be logical when you wanna argue with me, you can't just give some imaginary claims that a god has given a law against homos.

Are hermaphrodites gays? And here is someone who wants to talk logic.

Killing gay is the solution? Is it part of Allah's law to kill gays? Oh sorry he destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of gay pratice why didn't the merciful all-knowing god destroy ancient Greeks that practice gay?

Oh mine is to take what Allah has decreed. I am not here to defend his laws to you and neither is He answerable to you. You not okay with the laws, take it up with him. And by the way why didn't you answer my questions?

Don't be surprise when all scientists agreed there is gay gene in the future, I wanna see how you folks will react, people once taught abiku(child death) is a curse from some entity until scientists revealed the genetic cause .

Did Islam teach such? I also want to see how you will react when scientist reveal that there is no gay gene.

Your religious book need to give scientific evidence to prove there is no gay gene.

Maybe to an atheist. The last time I checked, you still identified yourself as a Muslim