₦airaland Forum

Iamgrey5:
Before rebasing our GDP by the Goodluck in 2013, they went through several survey to capture the True nature of the Nigerian economy.

They carried out research to determine the highest contribution to our GDP.

They simply make an estimation since then largely based on governormnent spending and money in circulation.

lol, I do not need all these your statistic to know the value of goods and services coming out of the sector, I can simply look at the VAT to arrive at it.
For open markers lol LADIPO where VAT is not paid, you will never know

Iamgrey5:
They only take a sample size that is statistically going to give them a 90 to 95% accurate rate of data. They don't have to go to markets.

Empirical research in social sciences is carried out like that too.

What data are you talking about?

The value of goods in shops and warehouse or the amount of sales they make per day?

What useless statistics can capture that?
We do not have the structure in Nigeria to know this.

Iamgrey5:
By asking the markets owner directly. The estimation of goods in the market.

Isn't that why we have market leaders.

you really do not know how open markets in Nigeria run, do you?

Iamgrey5:
You can do this by carrying out a survey from the business owners themselves.

Do an average in the receipts of transactions from the markets.

GDP is an estimation not a perfect reflection.

this would babe been the job of the local government if they know what they are doing. But sorry, no one goes to these market to actually know the GDP contribution of these markets. No one knows, the values you see is based on the data available

Iamgrey5:
You can do this by carrying out a survey from the business owners themselves.

Do an average in the receipts of transactions from the markets.

GDP is an estimation not a perfect reflection.

okay, so you think Nigerian government usually go to marketz to carry out survey on each shop's financial records and flow of goods and services? 😂

Iamgrey5:
@ emboldened

How exactly was this different from what I wrote

I said you look at the industry as whole not a single market.

They look at receipts of sales of from market and make an estimation on the sales of the markets in that location

I already talked about Agriculture in my first post.

How will know the sales of market that leaves an open market in Nigeria? Are you reasoning?

How do you know the value of good and service in LADIPO market? When most of the services are not properly documents, and government do not collect data from traders to value their transactions?

Iamgrey5:
They don't need to determine the GDP of ladipo alone. They break it down to industry by industry

We have Telecommunications industry

Manufacturing industry

Commercial and Trading you industry

Agricultural industry

Etc.

I will give you another example.

To know the how much the telecommunications industry contributes to the GDP, you need data from all telecommunications sectors. You even need the actually value of big telecoms like mt, airtel etc to be able to know how much that sector contributes.
If you do not have data form MTN, you cannot know how much MTN contributes to the GDP of this country.

If you do have data from LADIPO market, you cannot know how much ladipo market contributes to the GDP of lagos state frm the commerce sector.

Iamgrey5:
They don't need to determine the GDP of ladipo alone. They break it down to industry by industry

We have Telecommunications industry

Manufacturing industry

Commercial and Trading you industry

Agricultural industry

Etc.

Dude, you don't know anything about GDP.
Bring it down into industry means that you will need to know the value in terms of financial flow, product and service that this sector provide.

It means that, you need data to be able to evaluate such. Even in the agricultural sector, for states where there huge subsitent farming, and sells of farm products that goes to open market, those service are usually not captured in the GDP.

So how to you Wan to measure the commercial contribution of a market in commerce sector when you don't have data from that market?

You think the figure comes from think air? They collect data, analyze it then conclude. The result depends on the data available

Iamgrey5:
I don't think you understand economics..

give e formula on how you can determine the GDP contribution of for example LADIPO market to Lagos state.

Please kindly tell me how to collate the data from LADIPO goods valuation to be estimate the GDP contribution of that market.

Iamgrey5:
I don't think you understand economics..

okay, teach me

For any expert in economics, you will know that the GDP figures coming out of anambra and Abia states are not the true reflections of what's happening there and I also think that places like Kano and Lagos have much larger GDP than recorded.
The reason being that it's difficult to get data to estimate GDP values of open markets but estimating that of cooperations and servicing companies is much easier.
It's highly impossible for your to get the GDP value for open markets in Nigeria, you will not be able to evaluate the amount of trade, goods inflow and outflow and financial transaction coming into that market on a daily basis. It's why whenever I see the GDP of states with large open markets like Kano, Lagos, Abia and Anambra, I usually don't believe it because I know that they will not be able to factor what we call the "underground economy" which is mostly what open markets in Nigeria are all about.

Underground Economy
The underground economy (or black market) refers to cash and barter transactions that are not formally recorded in GDP and are often used to support the trade of illegal goods and services (i.e., drugs, weapons, prostitution, etc.). The scale of underground economies varies greatly between nations, and, in some cases, they make up a substantial percentage of a country’s economic output.

The underground market is almost impossible to estimate or value, and due to its illegal nature, it is rarely incorporated into a nation’s published GDP figure. Thus, some nations’ economic output may be understated by GDP. In the case of open markets in Nigeria, you can hardly value the amount of goods a person owns because that information is not available for government to know.
Lagos state government does not know the actual value of goods that goods that a typical Alaba tradet has in his shop or warehouse. So Lagos state cannot factor such into her GDP.
For a place like onitsha, that is almost completely a market, it's hard to even factor the worth of those markets into the GDP.

For example, how do you think you can estimate the GDP value of Ariaria market without know the exactly amount of goods every shop has and the exact financial transaction in that market annually. These data are not available, you can only get a glimpse of them buy going to be banks around Ariaria market but still, it won't be enough to know the GDP contribution of the market.

The best way to know the economic strength of any state is to look at the data in the bank in terms of cash flow. GDP is Nigeria is highly inaccurate because of lack of data and unregulated open market nature.

PoloG:
lol... Just two yoruba companies are richer than the richest state in igboland ..
Flutterwave and calendly ...

Know your levels igbos

Ibeto group is richer than flutterwave, I don't have time for all these dick measurement because most of these companies are in Lagos

PoloG:
flutterwave is worth $3b and anambra gdp as at last year was $6b...

Your innoson is not even upto sujimoto in networth

Ibeto group is worth 3.8billion, thats larger than the GDP of Ekiti. Can we now say that Ibeto is more valuable than Ekiti?

No be so

Pleasant01:
How many times have Yoruba gotten power? We all know obj wasn't the Yorubas choice and he didn't do anything for us.. even small Lagos-abk expressway e no do.....this is the first time Yorubas are getting power

Na you sabi

PoloG:
flutterwave is worth $3b and anambra gdp as at last year was $6b...

Your innoson is not even upto sujimoto in networth

Well, that figure seem to be bigger than the GDP on Ondo, Osun and ekiti as well, can we now say that flutterwave is richer than Ekiti state? . Think about it.

Does comparing companies worth to GDP of states make any sense?

Pleasant01:
How many world class cities have ibo built?

none sir, but Yoruba has built none as well. Even after having to get power and even enough time. It's a reflection of the elites ripping the people while the people remain loyal

Pleasant01:
Well except Google earth is capping, the beautiful part of Enugu no big reach old bodija alone

this a map distance discribing transverisng the two farthest points in the two cities, Ibadan is bigger but Enugu is not as small as you think.

PoloG:
Flutterwave alone is half the GDP of anambra .. I don't want to now mention other fintech companies owned by yorubas ...

Igbos should just stick to their 2x2 shops and stop disturbing us....

There is NOTHING igbos have that yorubas will learn from

flutter wave is valued at 1billion dollars, that's lower than the net with of innoson motors

skj1377:
Why cant you stay permanently in your city why come to our undeveloped cities and start insulting or claiming ownership. Like I always say very soon you will need a visa to come to our cities.

we can't because of one Nigeria.

You won't be better than any place in SE without Oyel money

skj1377:
How are the corrupt leaders in Yoruba land dragging everybody back? Did they stop you from developing your Region? You left your region to make a life in our Region and your still comparing. See me see wahala! Am sure if yorubaland is as poor as Somalia even you will not comearound. Like I always say the generation that is holding one Nigeria together is dying out. It is only a matter of time. Not to distant from now it is with your valid visa you will use to come to southwest.

Lol, I have said what I said. The IGR thing is a mirage that does not reflect in the lives of averag Yorubas

BanyXchi:
Osu, a picture of a village in abk doesn't change reality. Check the stats ebonyi is poorer than jigawa and most northern poor states. Again Ogun is more developed than your alaibo. You're very delusi0nal and you should seek help.

this is Abeokuta City centre, you can see the famous Opic tower and the new Mall been constructed.
This place is in GRA, I know Abeokuta very well, aside from this place is the picture, the other parts of Abeokuta are in extreme poverty with dilapidated houses and poverty stricken Yoruba residents.
This is the most developed place in the whole of Abeokuta and then you keep asking yourself what they even do with this humongous IGR.

You better open your eyes to the deception.
I know what I am saying because I do business in southwest

skj1377:
Stop misleading people. I served my NYSC is Eboyin state please don't compare it to just ijebuode or Abeokuta. Stop this propaganda nonsense.

Ijebu ode has wealthy men, no doubt but the wealth no circulate. It's hegemonized.

Go to Ijebu ode today, nothing dey there aside the flyover on the express road and Lagos garage. The whole of ijebu has bad roads aside from Ibadan road and ijirin road. I know what I am saying. Poverty is in the town, while we have some wealthy sparsely scatter but more people are poor. Have you ever tried boarding a bus from ijebu ode to Lagos? You will see extreme poverty within the the called Yorubas.
The fastest growing business in ijebu ode is yahoo yahoo. You know what I am saying.

You people are too loyal to your corrupt leaders, and it's dragging everyone back because you are giving them unwarranted power

skj1377:
I think Yoruba people should tidy up their society and have their independent government. Ours will work well be stable and efficient. Yoruba land will be a very beautiful place to live very sure of that. We are more in to academia, research and development as well as industrialisation. These are the things that give a society money to function properly and cater for it's citizens . What we have is a people exploiting the economy with excessive importation of cheap substandard or secondhand goods. Let me ask you do we have Alaba market in USA? Do we have computer village in Dubai? Yoruba people need to use their intelectualism do develop their society we are not an importation and trading mass of people. Let us simply organise ourselves better as a people, as a state as a civilisation. Visitors can be allowed to work and stay with relivant documentation.

Yorubas cannot build any world class city on their own except if the federal government comes in like they did in Lagos. Give Yorubas power many times, they will still not leave the Lagos clutch.
Aside Lagos, no city in Yoruba land is anything near developed, including Ibadan. A yoruba system is all about oligarchy, where elites squander the wealth of the people, the followed are very loyal to their corrupt elites and little human capacity development will thrive.

Look at osogbo, Ado Ekiti, Akure and Abeokuta, are those cities competitive even within Nigeria? Think about it.

You all think you can build anything because federal government built Lagos. We built our own cities by ourselves without the help of federal government and we did that in less than 60 years.

BanyXchi:
you're mentally deranged and you should seek help Osu. Ebonyi is on top 3 poorest states in the country, poorer than most northern states. That place should be turned to a massive national cemetery.

I've been to all the states in your shithole region, don't you find it ironic talking about bad roads. Again don't compare your shithole to SW, we're far apart. Just keep your delusions to yourself

one is the capital of the state with big IGR, the other is the capital of ebonyi. You can easily spot from the landscape of the two cities where money circulates more. You can easily know where more people are living in more exteme poverty with low quality of life.

What's now the purpose of the IGR if the citizens cannot feel the impact, get enough money to renovate their houses and live quality lives?

The money is usually stock with the elites while the poor citizens come online to defend them

They accommodated them in Lagos

Elemosho478:
You are the one not reading my post

You think Tinubu not being in USA would stop US government from filing a criminal charge against him if they have strong evidence to prove it?

and you think they would let him get more than half of his money back from the Civic forfeiture if they have enough evidence to nailed and confiscate the whole 1.4 million dollars? You think they would let him get 1$ out of the total funds of 1.4million seized if he was really guilty ? . You think US government is that generous and benevolent ?

You guys are lost cause

he remains a criminals that Connot be accessed hence civil forfeiture

Elemosho478:
How can he be a criminal if he was never charged for any crime ?

who told you civic forfeiture is for criminals who don't reside in the US?

Did you read my post and the various example of civic forfeiture cases listed there ? lol

He was a criminal but the US Government only seized 460,000$ out of 1.4 million dollars ?


why would they let him got half of the money if he was truly guilty ?

Because Tinubu have nuke like Russia and China ?

do you have issues reading the picture that I posted?

Nice2023:
Thank u for this and pls,stop advising them on how to rig elections pls.

Your analysis was great!

And I thank u once again.

they already know this.

Elemosho478:
You are the olodo lol

for criminal forfeiture to happened the defendant must be convicted.

The case could not be settled out of court and some of the funds forfeited if he was charged for the crime in the first place.

Tinubu was never charged for any crime, his account was freezed with a total sum of 1.4 million dollars as a civic Judicial Forfeiture case, but he challenged the forfeiture in court before he later decided to let them have half of the money.

You think US government will let a guilty drug dealer get away with most of his seized money ?

Even if he's civil forteiture, he's still criminal.
Civil forteiture is for criminals who don't reside bythr united States or cannot be reached by thr government as at the time when the legal process was happening hence the property will be the defendant instead of the person. So he remains a criminal that cannot be accessed

There has been this argument that Tinubu was not indicted in the United States for drug dealings. His supporters that he only some money hence cannot be called a criminal. Well, let's see what the United States law says about asset forfeiture.


1.Criminal Forfeiture
An in personam (against the person) action against a defendant that includes notice of the intent to forfeit property in a criminal indictment. A criminal conviction is required, and forfeiture is part of the defendant’s sentence. Criminal forfeiture is limited to the property interests of the defendant, including any proceeds earned by the defendant’s illegal activity. Criminal forfeiture is generally limited to the property involved in the particular counts on which the defendant is convicted. As part of sentencing, a court may order the forfeiture of a specific piece of property listed in the indictment, of a sum of money as a money judgment, or other property as substitute property. The government must establish by a preponderance of the evidence the requisite connection between the crime of conviction and the asset. After a preliminary order of forfeiture is entered, a separate, ancillary proceeding begins to determine any third-party ownership interests in the property the government seeks to forfeit.

2. Civil Judicial Forfeiture
An in rem (against the property) court proceeding brought against property that was derived from or used to commit an offense, rather than against a person who committed an offense. Unlike criminal forfeiture, there is no criminal conviction required, although the government is still required to prove in court that the property was linked to criminal activity. The proceeding allows the court to gather anyone with an interest in the property in the same case and resolve all the issues with the property at one time. In a civil forfeiture case, the government is the plaintiff, the property is the defendant, and any person who claims an interest in the property is a claimant. Civil forfeiture allows the government to file cases against property that would not be reachable through criminal forfeiture, such as property of criminals located outside the United States, including terrorists, and fugitives. Civil forfeiture also permits recovery of assets held by deceased defendants or where no defendant can be identified.



3. Administrative Forfeiture.

An in rem (against the property) action that permits property to be forfeited to the United States without filing a case in federal court. The administrative forfeiture process occurs before the agency that seized the assets when no one has filed a claim contesting the seizure. There are many procedures in place, including strict time limits and noticing requirements designed to protect the interests and rights of property holders. Any seizure of property subject to administrative forfeiture must be based on probable cause. The primary benefit of administrative forfeiture is to avoid burdening the courts with judicial actions when no one contests the forfeiture of the seized property.


Tinubu's kind of forfeiture is number 2, he remains a criminal but because he resides outside of the United States as at the time of the legal process, he cannot be charged but his property in the United States can be charged hence it can be forfeited. Tinubu to united states was a criminal of united states that was living abroad.

Thank you

Elemosho478:
Read about civic forfeiture in the United States

Olodo, Tinubu was charged, he forfeited in court and not by the law enforcement agencies. Olodo

You can't be in court if you have not been charged in the first place, hence Tinubu's case is a criminal forfeiture and not a civil forteiture.

I am an indigene of Abia state and I have been worried with what is actually happening in Abia state. Before the gubernatorial elections, one of my friend who resides in Umuahia told me that he was going for INEC adhoc staff job, it didn't even occur to me all these while that I had a friend who could even tell me what happened. Unfortunately for him, this my friend was posted to Obingwa LGA inec collation centre. Not until this morning when I called him and he said that they were held hostage for two days by obingwa thugs and the police with food.
On getting to the centre, they were first welcomed by labour party agents, they were given refreshments and off they started doing the mathematics. During the whole collation, they had several offers in dollars from PDP agents who wanted them to manipulate the results, but due to the number of accredited voters by the BVAS, it became impossible for them to yield to the demands of those PDP agents.
These PDP agents got frustrated and then invited PDP strong men in Obingwa and Abia state to the collation centre after realizing that the collated results means that PDP lost woefully. These PDP members induced thugs and youths of Obingwa to stage a riot to the INEC LGA office. They blocked the entrance with buses, force themselves into the premises. While this was happening, my friends and other INEC staffs had already locked themselves inside a coaster bus in the INEC office premises, the thugs entered and threatened to burn the bus if they don't announce the results for them to hear it.
The INEC staffs argued that governorship results are supposed to be announced at the state collation centre, before then the presiding officer already called the police. The police got there and these thugs were adamant, led by their strong PDP men. Few minutes later, the army got there and still the thugs in their hundreds threaten that the army would have to kill every single one of them to allow ths INEC staffs leave with those results.
The commissioner of police arrive and still could not pacify the PDP members and thugs. At this point, the presiding office was forced to announced the result of the 2 obingwa state assembly constituency results which PDP won.
Few minutes later, the governor arrived with some men, asked to see the presiding officer, locked him in a room and called all the adhoc staffs back into their office to start manipulating the results. According to my friend, they were manipulating it without regard for the number of accredited voters captured by BVAS. While all these were happening, the electoral officer already informed Proffessor Mahmood Yakub hence INEC had to make it public on their social media handle and then suspended collation. After the whole manipulation, Obingwa thugs and PDP members allowed them to leave.

The next day, which was on a Sunday, the police escrorted the INEC staffs to Umuahia. On getting to Umuahia, nobody was present at the INEC office. So the police insisted that they have to sleep at the office because they are required to officially handover the result to the state presiding officer. After a while, they were taken to Zone 9 with the results, they slept in the police station with the INEC results. The governor called that night suggesting that they bring the result to the government and let them go but the INEC staffs insisted that the result cannot be taken to the government house as that will be culpable.

It was on Monday that the result was finally handedover to the state returning officer, who's the vice chancellor of FUTO. She immediately rejected the result after seeing the unbelievable figures. According to the result, only Obingwa gave PDP 108,000 votes, which is way more than 23,000 accredited voters recorded by BVAS machines in the LGA.
The result was taken to Abuja along side the BVAS machines on Monday for review. The machines are back to umuahia this morning and the recollation will restarted by 11am at the INEC state office in umuahia to make sure that the figurea matches with what is recorded in BVAS. The state INEC collation centre will resume by 4pm and then a winner will likely be announced today.

Well, this is how elections are been rigged now. I am sure this happened in many LGAs accross the country but Ikpeazu is too dull that, he only relied on Isiala Ngwa local government and Obingwa which is the traditional rigging camp of PDP in the state. He didn't learn anything from the presidential election.
He was suppose to lay seige at all local government areas in Abia state, manipulating the result across board like every other state governor did.

This is the structure they were talking about.