ijawkid:

Hey your so wrong my bro....

The meaning of Yahweh isn't I AM...

We humans use I AM in our day to day lives...

We are not Yahweh are we??

Please go do research and tell me what the name Yahweh means.....

Go and do research.....

Use your google and check the meaning of the tetragrammaton......

Let the trinity not dull you....

I AM does not exclusively and clearly define what Yahweh means.....

Ubenedictus: i think u are d person wu have allowed ur bias to dull u, and u can google it up. Yaweh, Jahveh, means he we causes to be, he was, he is, or he will be, it come from the same verb as i am, the verb 'to be'. Go and make ur research.

frosbel:
You have now moved on to another level of scripture twisting. I settled down to read your latest post with the intention of responding point by point until I saw the above.

Has explaining God now been reduced to the deduction of equations

Since scripture no longer supports the Pagan Trinity , must you start making things up as you go along ?

Admit it, if the Trinity were true you would not have stooped this low to make a point that in all honesty is pointless because it cannot be substantiated by facts.

aletheia:
1. Your post is disjointed. What equations?
2. Is this the "comprehensive" rebuttal?
3. Are the names given in that order in the Bible or not?
4. Are those not the meanings of those names or not?
5. What I have written concerning the genealogy of Noah is verifiable from the bible. . .but you don't really read the bible.

While you are it, go and consider the meanings of the names of the sons of Jacob, and contemplate the order in which they are presented in the book of Revelation. . .and why Dan is omitted.

You have a penchant for discombobulated ramblings without having taken time to digest what you read. Not surprising seeing as most of what you post are second-hand articles by others. It is long past time for you to do proper bible study instead of pasting articles from such as Jews for Judaism etc or rehashing well worn Islamic arguments.

And they saw the God of Israel: and there was under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness. And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink.[Exo 24:10-11]

The language here is clear. It is not allegorical.

ijawkid:

""HE WHO CAUSES TO BE"" sounds more of an explicit definition of that name ..""Yahweh""

But like the scriptures I put up there,Yahweh and YehshÙa are 2 different names...

.The father Ànd the Son bear different nÀmes.......

They are 2 ÐiffÉrent distinct persons...

You guys wanna make the name ""Yahweh"" sound like the surname of your so called triune Godhead.........that's an epiÇ lie

The scriptures do not support your stance.....

ijawkid:

And haibe I just got some scriptures for u to prove Jesus doesn't answer the same name with his Father......since they are different persons they must have different names and the bible has shown us that clearly,,....but the trinity won't let u guys see it...

Let's analyze these scriptures....

Revelation 3:12

New International Version (©1984)
Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.....

Revelation 14:1....

++New International Version (©1984)
Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads.

##New Living Translation (©2007)
Then I saw the Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with him were 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads.....

God the Father(Yahweh) having a name different and distinct from his sons name(Jesus) is shown in those verses up there...

I wonder why I'm even arguing this??....

Do the names Yahweh and Yehshua mean the same thing??

SMH!!!!!

aletheia:

You have a penchant for discombobulated ramblings without having taken time to digest what you read.

Not surprising seeing as most of what you post are second-hand articles by others. It is long past time for you to do proper bible study instead of pasting articles from such as Jews for Judaism etc or rehashing well worn Islamic arguments.

God is God because of certain attributes that He has. If Jesus Christ were God, he would have to have the attributes of God. Most theologians agree that these attributes are: unoriginated, self-existent, immortal, unchanging, omniscient, all wise, all good, all-powerful and omnipresent. But Jesus denied every one of these.

He was not unoriginated: Christ was begotten of God. “The Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in himself” (John 5:26).

He was not self-existent: “I live because of the Father” (John 6:57).

He was not immortal. Jesus died and God resurrected him (See # 44 above).

He was not unchanging. He grew and learned, and he died and rose in a new and different body.

He was not omniscient. There were things he did not know (See # 38 above).

He was not all wise. Jesus “grew in wisdom” (See # 37 above).

He was not all good. He said the only one good was God (See # 20 above).

He was not all-powerful. Whereas “nothing is impossible with God” (Luke 1:37), Christ said “the Son can do nothing by Himself” (John 5:19).

He was not omnipresent. After Lazarus died, Jesus told his disciples, “I am glad I was not there” (John 11:15).

The attributes of God are what make Him God, just as there are certain attributes that make a man what he is. There is a common saying that “if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it’s a duck.” This could easily be applied here. God “walks and quacks” like God.

Jesus “walks and quacks” like a man, and Scripture says very clearly that he is a man. We assert that the Bible is clear in its teaching about who God is and who Christ is, and we ask Christians to carefully consider what they believe and why.

We also think that believing that Jesus is God, “the Holy Spirit” is God, and the Father is God actually demeans the Only True God. Making God one of three co-equal “persons” takes from Him His exalted position as the Only True God, the Creator of the universe, the Author of the plan of Salvation, the Father of Jesus Christ, and our one God.

Besides robbing God of His exalted position as God supreme, believing that Jesus is God also demeans him. One cannot appreciate how great Jesus really was until you make an effort to live like he did for even one day. His courage, mental tenacity, love and great faith are unparalleled in human history. His true greatness is lost if you believe he is God, for “with God all things are possible.” Believing Jesus is God also demeans God because Jesus himself said, “my Father is greater than I.”

Believing that Christ is God also means that he could not have sinned [which makes sense given that “God” cannot sin]. Christ must have been able to sin, for Scripture says he was “tempted in every way just as we are.” Christ went through life like each human does, with doubts, fears and concerns, and with the possibility of sin. To believe that Jesus could not have sinned makes it impossible for us to identify with him.

By restoring the Father to His unique and singular position as God, we give Him all the worship, credit, respect and awe He deserves as the One True God. By restoring Christ to his position as the man accredited by God, the only-begotten Son of the Father, the Last Adam, the one who could have sinned but voluntarily stayed obedient, the one who could have given up but loved us so much that he never quit, the one whom God highly exalted to be our Lord, we give Jesus Christ all the worship, credit, respect and awe that he deserves, and we can draw great strength and determination from his example.

[quote author=haibe]Whats the big deal in a one God theology, even pagans believe in one god too, some two, some three, some millions, so whats the big deal.

For ur information, trinitarians beliv in one God, i dont expect how you will understand when you try to use ur intellect to understand the nature of God[/quote

Ihedinobi: ^^^^ says the man who demands that God be small enough to fit into his intellect. Do you even know what blasphemy is, Frosbel? You really spout a lot of ignorance and confusion. . . . .

Edit: I see that there is still quite a bit of confusion in your perception of these things. It gives me hope. If you can say that Jesus is divine or deity because His Father is while swearing that the Father and the Son are not both God, there may still be some hope. Because the two things are contrary. Only one of the two is true and the other is false. They cannot both be true.

frosbel:

Because God is not 3 but 1 , expressed as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

The concept of Trinity , where we have a godhead with the Father as the head, Son in the middle and Holy Spirit at the bottom is just plain false and not at all biblical.

Jesus Christ is the express image of the person of GOD , He is the radiance of God's glory, He is the Alpha and Omega , he is GOD.

"The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven." - Hebrews 1:3

He only became a little lower than the father because he humbled himself as a man to die for our sins. This is the great mystery.


You will ask me , if Jesus was GOD , then where was the father.

Answer :

"If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?[/b]Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."


"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: [b]God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." - 1 Timothy 3:16

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." - Isaiah 9:6


Look at this striking comparison between Christ and God , from the new testament and old testament.

New Testament :

"The hairs of his head were white, like white wool, like snow. His eyes were like a flame of fire, 15his feet were like burnished bronze, refined in a furnace, and his voice was like the roar of many waters." - Revelation 1:14

“As I looked,thrones were placed,and the Ancient of Days took his seat;his clothing was white as snow,and the hair of his head like pure wool;
his throne was fiery flames;its wheels were burning fire.A stream of fire issued and came out from before him;a thousand thousands served him,
and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him;the court sat in judgment,and the books were opened." - Daniel 7:9

frosbel:


1. No Semantics, the Trinity is a pagan doctrine

2. Jesus Christ is fully divine, so we agree here

3. Jesus Christ is GOD , or is he not, and yet God is one this is the mystery.

Let's see how Paul put it.

"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." - 1 Timothy 3:16

This verse jumped at me about God's spirit, a very good explanation from the bible.

1 Corinthians 2:9-14 "But as it is written: "eye has not seen, nor ear heard, Nor have entered into the heart (mind) of man the things which God has prepared for those who love Him." :10 But God has revealed [them] to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. :11[u] For what man knows the things of a man (how can man know or think and understand and perceive and have consciousness of "self" except (through) the spirit of the man which is "IN" him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God[/u]. :12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is from God, that we might know the (spiritual) things that have been freely given to us by God. :13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. :14 But the natural man (the natural mind) does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know [them,] because they are spiritually discerned."

haibe:

Lol you make me laugh, should i start telling you that there are different names of God and christ.

Of course yahweh and yehshua cant mean the same thing, The Son only started bearing Jesus(yehshua) when he came in flesh.

Ok God said he was the king of king, lord of lords, first and last in the old testament right?
Did jesus not claim those names too?

Your question should have been which name are u talking about.
Have you forgotten jesus is called wonderful counsellor, mighty God, prince of peace?
Have you forgotten that jesus is called the word of God?

Anyway rev 14:1 says they had the name of the father and of the lamb on their forehead and rev 22:4 says the fathers name only. Does that not give you a clue.

Dont forget there is also a name that jesus alone knew.
So the father and son have more than one names and there are some exclusive to the son like "wonderful counsellor, son of God" e.t.c' so u cant just conclude that the name yahweh belongs to the father only just because you saw some different names. They also have the same names, the father is i am, the son also, father is 1st nd last, son also.etc

I will prove to u later why yahweh cant be exclusive to the father

Enigma:

I am making this post simply because of the words that I have bolded in blue and also in the hope that this post will cause Frosbel to pause ---- maybe even stop posting or responding to posts on the Trinity for a day or two ---- and go back to think carefully a little bit.

Here we have Frosbel arguing that Jesus only came into existence when he was conceived and born and that Jesus is not God. But please Frosbel read your own words as recently as February this year.




PS I added the large font and blue (and some black) bolding. Also, because the quote is long, I will keep the example in this post to one and use a next post for another example.

Ihedinobi:

Quite right, sir. I am immensely conflicted by this guy. I do not want to ignore him but I really cannot see how being a Christian he could say things like this. Making sense of it is incredibly difficult for me. I pray the Lord has mercy upon him and delivers him from this increasing foolishness.

Enigma:

I am making this post simply because of the words that I have bolded in blue and also in the hope that this post will cause Frosbel to pause ---- maybe even stop posting or responding to posts on the Trinity for a day or two ---- and go back to think carefully a little bit.

Here we have Frosbel arguing that Jesus only came into existence when he was conceived and born and that Jesus is not God. But please Frosbel read your own words as recently as February this year.




PS I added the large font and blue (and some black) bolding. Also, because the quote is long, I will keep the example in this post to one and use a next post for another example.

Ihedinobi: @aletheia

Lovely read that post was. Those names.........wow! I'm not just gladdened, I'm humbled by the fact that I am seeing these wonders written by another and so long ago too. God is greatly merciful to me. Before I started to really use nairaland, it felt like I was the only one who knew what I knew. And that is a very dangerous position. It easily results in either burying the revelation committed to one or growing very pompous because of it. Since I started to really discuss on nairaland, God has been bringing able brethren that I can share with without losing the quality of the revelations.

And I find the fact that you are so articulate in delivery very very humbling, because it says that these things have been perfected in you. I am greatly blessed to be your brother, sir. Thank you so much for being available to the Lord.

It's looking like I'll go to that old thread to read up the discussions. I wish threads like that were current. It'd be great if we could share things of that depth more often.

haibe: @ ijawkid

"In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was a god" (John 1:1 NWT)

How many true god do we have here?

Ubenedictus: Im surprised as well, there are posts where frosbel say Jesus is God and others he says Jesus isnt God. Are there two frosbel here? 1 hates d catholic church so much that he would disagree with scripture that Jesus is God, the other believes Jesus is God. How does this guy keep both ideas? Well i do hope and pray that he is able to open his heart to the holy spirit. GOD isnt the author of confusion, christ cant be God and isnt God at the same time.
Peace

frosbel:

I am a very keen and curious student on religion, hence my knowledge increases on a daily basis as I take in more information, analyse this information and make informed decisions.

This is my training as an IT professional. I receive data , collate it , analyse it and derive certain facts which lead to a specific Truth . Reason has taught me to accept such a Truth.

I do not rely on the whims , notions , excitements and erraticity of fallible men . Any article I post is usually subject to intense scrutiny using ONLY Sola Scriptura

Why this long explanation you may ask.

Because the more knowledge we have , the better positioned we are to make more factual assessments which lead to certain solid truths.

Just because I made a decision based on the stale data I had in February does not mean that on receipt of new data , my perception or understanding will not change.

Ubenedictus: You have decided that anything that points toward God as one in 3 distinct person is wrong. You cant analyse because u already have a precondition, it is like the 'if' character in a flow chart, if the data points to the trinity delete, if not analyse

If GOD = Trinity Then
If GOD = 3 Or Jesus = GOD Then
Return FALSE
Else
Return TRUE
End If
ElseIf GOD = Unitary Then
If Jesus = Son of God Then
Return True
Else
Return False
End If
Else
Send to the Rubbish Bin ( )
End If
End Function

ijawkid:

Frosbel grew in knowledge to understand that the trinity has always being a hoax and that Jesus isn't Yahweh......

Its crystal clear to him...

His mind is not as obstinate as the mind of u guys who choose to hold on to a pagan trinity....

frosbel:

I am not a Programmer , must every IT person be one

But your are right when you say :
"it is like the 'if' character in a flow chart, if the data points to the trinity delete"

Ubenedictus: i remember asking u somewhere, how come "the fullness of the deity" dwells in christ wu u call a creature? Or are u going to tell me that angels posses "the fullness of the deity" too and Jesus is ur arch angel?