Hmmmmmmmm
*walks in from the bar with bottle of udeme in hand*


I have been keenly reading the answers MyJoe has been proposing to this our Jamb Kweshun.

MYjoe:
But I agree that Nigerians don’t live right. It’s complex like I said and eat or you are eaten does not quite suffice to explain it. Nigerians are, generally speaking, just badly behaved, even in the smallest of things – leaving the outside lights on in the daytime, throwing thrash out of a moving car and into the drainage, wasting food, etc. Things were not always like. There was a time in this country things worked – when you reported a problem to a government agency you got a response. When a kid failed a class he repeated it. When you entered a fuel station you had no fear someone would sell you bad fuel as good one. I think the situation of your environment creates a mentality. I can’t produce the link with scientific precision, but some evidence points to it. Let me tell you an incident to illustrate how the general mood of the country can affect a people. Around 2001 – not sure I’m getting the year right but it should be about then – when a new party came to power in Kenya, after the long years of Kanu and Moi. Shortly after President Kibaki and his gang of former opposition crowd were sworn in, promising “zero corruption” and a brand new Kenya, an incident took place in Nairobi. The bus got to a police checkpoint and as usual, the driver produce a crumpled note and was offering it to the cop. Suddenly, the passengers erupted – “Nooooo, they don’t do that anymore! Nooooo, they don’t do that anymore!” The policeman and the driver were shamed into aborting their foul act. Of course, it didn’t take long to become clear to everyone that it was business as usual, as the new leaders not only failed to deliver on their promises to get to the bottom of old corruption but started their own new corruption, Kenya being one of those countries that would give Nigeria a run for its money if you make an Olympic event of corruption.

The very first part I totally agree with, Nigerians are very badly behaved and that is a fact. But as for the part when you say there was a time things worked in this country you did not mean a democratic dispensation did you? You have to compare apples with apples, back then buhari or idiagbon would wave a wand and things would happen overnight. Buhari could come in to fight corruption and cancel all naira notes overnight print new ones and no one would question him. Today it takes even a minority in some cases backed by a Godfather to shout all those in favour say Aye to take out a governor. So why are we expecting a keke napep to outdo a lambo? even if we manage to get a governor with such good intentions he would get bogged down by these useless elements.

Exactly. I have had course to argue this point than once. When I heard Dieziani Alison-Madueke saying that at 50 Nigeria was not doing badly because at 50 Britain was still fighting the knights of the roundtable, I shook my head in pity. Or when someone reminds us that it took the US over a century (or how long was it?) to extend voting rights to women and longer than that to extend full constitutional protection to blacks. For God’s sakes the US got independence in 1776, not 1976. How do you use the standards of the past to judge today? That the US did not give women the vote in 1776 was not because they were backward or corrupt and not progressing, it was because of the TIME. You have to compare Britain’s level of development at 50 with countries that were 50 at the time not Nigeria in the 21st century. Nigerian leaders are not siphoning their country’s money to foreign accounts because it is what is expected of leaders in the 21st century. Customs aren’t stealing at our borders because of the TIME and Mrs Madueke and her fellow ministers aren’t awarding contracts and oil deals to friends and relatives who aren’t qualified and without due process because our country needs to pass through that process to get it right. The indices of progress were there in the States back then. The people cared about the country – especially the elite. Even the colonialists that came here 150 years ago did not steal to line their own pockets. They stole for their queen and country.

Again yes we have only really practiced this madness for 50 years, out of which the only years that really count per say would be from 1999 till date. Going back and forth between the military and democracy did us no good at all. So here we are many years after military rule, in a democracy that is struggling to find its feet and really I have no hope that this model would work at all.

According to wikipedia:
While there is no universally accepted definition of "democracy,"[5] equality and freedom have both been identified as important characteristics of democracy since ancient times.[6] These principles are reflected in all citizens being equal before the law and having equal access to legislative processes. For example, in a representative democracy, every vote has equal weight, no unreasonable restrictions can apply to anyone seeking to become a representative, and the freedom of its all citizens is secured by legitimized rights and liberties which are generally protected by a constitution.

Aside from the "freedom" Nigerians do not really have the rest, equal before law and equal access to legislative process I laugh!! The current form of government as it is run gives no room whatsoever for the kind of fast paced development Nigeria needs. We are a very unique set of people and we would like the chinese did need to look inward and do that which is going to work for us.

Look, again, at corruption. It’s not uniquely Nigerian. In Indonesia, Pakistan, Mexico and countless other countries, including even first world South Korea, it happens that when a minister gives someone a contract, the contractor would give him a kickback of 10%. That is not what happens in Nigeria. Here, you can award a contract and collect 100%, that is, simply put the money in your pocket and let the grass grow on site. Alternatively, you can award a contract for N10 million and get the contractor to sign for N80 million. And then (this happens in the LGs) you can have someone hint the contractor that he has no business going to site because “we use that road to eat every year”.

Corruption is institutionalized in Nigeria, it is a way of life. Look, when the governor wants to run for election he needs to source for funds, especially in his first tenure, he goes to these political associates and then they fund his election in terms of money and giving him the necessary "votes". When he gets there finally he has to give these guys the contracts to pay them back and what do you think they would do?
We need a different model to this whole thing, I am pretty sure that if we look critically at this we would be able to come up with ways to prevent people from stealing. We have to stop this practice of trying to build strong men, we need to build strong institutions. Where is Nafdac today since dora left that position? Efcc since ribadu left? The list is endless. We need a different approach to the problem but first the people would have to wrestle their right to choose leaders from the elite. Then they would suffer from some very poor decisions such as sentimentally voting for GEJ and then we can see if there is any hope at all.

My cents don dey finish

Many discerning minds have seen and said it for a long time - corruption is not even our problem - it goes beyond it!

Mediocrity overtakes graft, wrecks Nigeria

‘NEEDLESS to say the politician is probably hailed by those awaiting part of the loot he is stealing; the writer might have got his sponsorship from buddies he has been sucking up to in hagiographies paid for by the subjects; and the young woman’s promotion is likely to be an exchange for sex or the expectancy of it. So, some form of corruption plays a role in all of these examples.

But corruption per se does not necessarily stand in the way of development. Otherwise, a country like Indonesia — number 118 on Transparency International’s Corruption Perception Index, not that far removed from Nigeria’s 139 — would never have made it to the G-20 group of major economies. An even more serious obstacle to development is the lack of repercussions for under-achievement. Who in Nigeria is ever held accountable for substandard performance?

Since I came here, I have been on a futile search for a stable Internet connection that does what it promises. I started with an MTN FastLink modem (I consider the name a cruel joke), and then I moved on to an Etisalat MiFi connection (I regularly had to keep myself from throwing the bloody thing against the wall), and now I am trying out Cobranet’s U-Go. I shouldn’t have bothered: equally crap. And everyone knows this. They groan and mutter and tweet about it. But still, to my surprise, no one calls for a class-action suit against those deceitful providers.

A one-day conference I attended last year left me equally puzzled. Organisation, attendance and outcome left a lot to be desired, if you ask me. But over cocktails, after the closing ceremony, everyone congratulated each other over the wonderful conference—that started two hours late, of which the most animated part was undeniably lunch, and in which not a single tangible decision had been made. This left me wondering whether we had attended the same event.

I thought these issues to be unrelated at first, but gradually I came to see the connection. Nigeria is the opposite of a meritocracy: you do not earn by achieving. You get to be who and where you are by knowing the right people. Whether you work in an office, for an enterprise or an NGO, at a construction site or in government, your abilities hardly ever are the reason you got there. Performing well, let alone with excellence, is not a requirement, in fact, it is discouraged. It would be too threatening: showing you’re more intelligent, capable or competent than the ‘oga at the top’ (who, as a rule, is not an over-achiever either) is career suicide.

It is an attitude that trickles down from the very top, its symptoms eventually showing up in all of society, from bad governance to bad service to bad craftsmanship.

Where excellence meets no gratification, what remains to be celebrated is under-achievement. That is why it is not uncommon to find Nigerians congratulating each other with sub-standard results. It is safer to cuddle up comfortably in shared mediocrity than to question it, since the latter might also expose your own less than exceptional performance. Add to this the taboo of criticising anyone senior or higher up and it explains why so many join in the admiration of the emperor’s new clothes.

I have been writing this column for the last year, and after 10 months, I realised my angles were getting more predictable and my pieces less edgy. I figured newcomers do not remain newcomers forever and therefore decided to round up the ‘Femke Becomes Funke’ series this month, a year after it started. Ever since I announced the ending, tweeps have been asking me to change my mind and in comments on the columns and through my website, I get songs of praise that make me feel my analyses of Nigerian society are indispensable. If I had no sense of self-criticism, I might be tempted to reconsider my decision to discontinue the series and start producing second-rate articles. Who would point this out to me if I did?

The hardest thing to do in Nigeria is to continue to realise there is honour in achievement and pride in perfection. I imagine the frustration of the many Nigerians who do care for their work, who take pride in their outcomes and who feel the award is in a job well done. When you know beforehand that excellence will not be rewarded, you are bound to do the economically sane thing and limit your investments to accomplishing the bare minimum. This makes Nigeria a pretty cumbersome place for anyone striving for perfection.

This piece by Femke van Zeijl, a Dutch journalist/writer who lives and works in Lagos, was culled from www.fvz-journaliste.nl/english.php. Van Zeijl is the author of the Gin-tonic and Cholera, a book on city life in Africa.

http://www.ngrguardiannews.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=118076:mediocrity-overtakes-graft-wrecks-nigeria-&catid=1:national&Itemid=559

^^ With that I agree. And here I was considering getting Cobra Net. Anyhoo, I agree with her. She's a womab, right? And how is she getting by on that ideology living and working (!!!) in Lagos, I wonder?

As far as I can see, the piece basically repeats what perceptive people have known for decades and basically says the same things 'every one' says: "there is a serious problem". Of course every one knows that.

The bone of contention on this thread has been: is that serious problem insoluble and, not only that, is it eternally insoluble?

Ihedinobi:

Didn't I already answer this? JeSoul, my sister, no need to make it look like I condone the murders and r.a'pes. I do not. I said that if he hadn't been out so late at night in Lagos, there is a probability those goons would never have got their operation underway at all. The whole thing happened to him because he indulged a false sense of security, false because of the social, economic and political realities of the city he was in.

Why do we always blame the victim?

Ihedinobi:



As for them picking that part of Lagos, it's primarily because, like I said, the upper classes slowly lose touch with the realities of Nigeria and get careless with their "it shouldn't be so" mentality. Because of this they're easier for such criminals to go for. Also considering the firepower I'm under the impression they had, they couldn't very well have gone for Ajegunle, could they?

Bro, couldn't it have been primarily for economic reasons that they chose Lekki? On the average a heist in Lekki should yield more rewards than same operation in Ajegunle .

Honestly if deepsight didn't show up another person would have showed up or they would have switched to plan B.

I am personally grieved by Deepsight's story because about that same time last year,we were virtually woken by armed robbers.

They meticulously cut the barbed wire on our fence,cut the burglarly proof bars on the windows without making a sound till they were in the house at that point,I could initiate any evasive or counter-attacking plans.

Anyway we were robbed,laptops,jewellery ,phones,the whole 9yards.

Thankfully there was no rape incidence and all

We went to the police station to lodge an incidence report,just for official documentation purposes the police insisted they will visit the crime scene(we had to pick up their transportation bill), let me not bore you with the whole details.

My main point is THE VICTIM IS JUST A VICTIM.

Enigma: As far as I can see, the piece basically repeats what perceptive people have known for decades and basically says the same things 'every one' says: "there is a serious problem". Of course every one knows that.

The bone of contention on this thread has been: is that serious problem insoluble and, not only that, is it eternally insoluble?

@bolded, exactly.

She described the problem even more cleverly, but she doesn't answer whether or not Nigeria is hopeless.

chukkynwob:

Why do we always blame the victim?

chukkynwob:

Bro, couldn't it have been primarily for economic reasons that they chose Lekki? On the average a heist in Lekki should yield more rewards than same operation in Ajegunle .

Honestly if deepsight didn't show up another person would have showed up or they would have switched to plan B.

I am personally grieved by Deepsight's story because about that same time last year,we were virtually woken by armed robbers.

They meticulously cut the barbed wire on our fence,cut the burglarly proof bars on the windows without making a sound till they were in the house at that point,I could initiate any evasive or counter-attacking plans.

Anyway we were robbed,laptops,jewellery ,phones,the whole 9yards.

Thankfully there was no rape incidence and all

We went to the police station to lodge an incidence report,just for official documentation purposes the police insisted they will visit the crime scene(we had to pick up their transportation bill), let me not bore you with the whole details.

My main point is THE VICTIM IS JUST A VICTIM.

I think you missed the point of my answer completely.

I was not exactly blaming Deep Sight for anything except for not accounting correctly for Nigeria's realities.

I'm sorry for what happened to him and to your family. But, I hold that his experience was avoidable. I don't think that anyone can do anything to prevent danger coming to his doorstep if the danger is determined to get to him. But, in Nigeria, driving past midnight is a danger in and of itself. As much as possible, one should avoid it, not say that it shouldn't be a danger because it isn't in the US or Europe.

That was what I was saying.

Ihedinobi:

I think you missed the point of my answer completely.

I was not exactly blaming Deep Sight for anything except for not accounting correctly for Nigeria's realities.

I'm sorry for what happened to him and to your family. But, I hold that his experience was avoidable. I don't think that anyone can do anything to prevent danger coming to his doorstep if the danger is determined to get to him. But, in Nigeria, driving past midnight is a danger in and of itself. As much as possible, one should avoid it, not say that it shouldn't be a danger because it isn't in the US or Europe.

That was what I was saying.

Do you ever accept...

never mind..

chukkynwob:

Bro, couldn't it have been primarily for economic reasons that they chose Lekki? On the average a heist in Lekki should yield more rewards than same operation in Ajegunle .

Honestly if deepsight didn't show up another person would have showed up or they would have switched to plan B.

I am personally grieved by Deepsight's story because about that same time last year,we were virtually woken by armed robbers.

They meticulously cut the barbed wire on our fence,cut the burglarly proof bars on the windows without making a sound till they were in the house at that point,I could initiate any evasive or counter-attacking plans.

Anyway we were robbed,laptops,jewellery ,phones,the whole 9yards.

Thankfully there was no rape incidence and all

We went to the police station to lodge an incidence report,just for official documentation purposes the police insisted they will visit the crime scene(we had to pick up their transportation bill), let me not bore you with the whole details.

My main point is THE VICTIM IS JUST A VICTIM.

Sorry about what happened to you brother...hope no such occurence since then and hopefully in the future.

Enigma: As far as I can see, the piece basically repeats what perceptive people have known for decades and basically says the same things 'every one' says: "there is a serious problem". Of course every one knows that.

The bone of contention on this thread has been: is that serious problem insoluble and, not only that, is it eternally insoluble?

...with Nigeria replaying like a broken record with stories like these everyday: https://www.nairaland.com/1225198/akpabio-defends-wedding-gifts-tuface

and nothing ever happens after the dust and initial shouting quiets down.

^^^ But there have been worse --- and there still will be worse! Even I pointed to one example recently: https://www.nairaland.com/1206607/surprised-no-one-posted

Meanwhile, such foolishness occurs in 'developed' countries too; only that if/when discovered, there will be apparent remorse and the public outcry will probably be bigger.

But in reality --- same ole same ole.

JeSoul: Sorry about what happened to you brother...hope no such occurence since then and hopefully in the future.

Thanks dearie. We thank God its been peace since then,but then we now sleep with one eye open,got three rottweilers too...*we are our own FG now*.

chukkynwob:

Thanks dearie. We thank God its been peace since then,but then we now sleep with one eye open, got three rottweilers too...*we are our own FG now*.

...and I quietly hope you're packing a piece a two underneath your mattress. Make we see the next lunatic that will try and inflict harm on innocent people minding their own business in their own houses. Gosh, I despise evil doers.

Enigma: ^^^ But there have been worse --- and there still will be worse! Even I pointed to one example recently: https://www.nairaland.com/1206607/surprised-no-one-posted

Which makes faithers like yourself & Ihe even more amazing ...naija needs people like you not me!

Meanwhile, such foolishness occurs in 'developed' countries too; only that if/when discovered, there will be apparent remorse and the public outcry will probably be bigger.

oooohhh...commot dia jor such 'foolishness' occurs everywhere human beings are...but the naija brand is in-disputably one of a kind.

Hmmmm

Maybe a drop in the ocean; maybe "they" are not all bad!

https://www.nairaland.com/1247943/good-samaritans-returned-lost-phones

Why are you all complaining?? Why dont you keep praying for Nigerian.

You have forgotten that the silliness of you religious people is what kills us.

Am an atheist and I dont give up.

I will be the change I want to see in my country.

ooman: Why are you all complaining?? Why dont you keep praying for Nigerian.

You have forgotten that the silliness of you religious people is what kills us.

Am an atheist and I dont give up.

I will be the change I want to see in my country.

Well said....every minute they waste in prayer, nigeria gets worse


If you want change, be the change.


I will do my best to make nigeria a better place for my children

What are you two ffools ranting about?

Logicboy03:


Well said....every minute they waste in prayer, nigeria gets worse


If you want change, be the change.


I will do my best to make nigeria a better place for my children

What do you know about making nigeria a better place??.......

ijawkid:

What do you know about making nigeria a better place??.......

You think oil bunkering is a good way to make nigeria better?

Ihedinobi: What are you two ffools ranting about?

what you dumb iddiots failed to see

This is possibly the best thread on the Religious section. I'm only halfway down the first page, so this post is just to mark it so it's easy to find when I come back.

I see that the last few posts have some yabbis in them. Oh well . . as long as they don't use it to overwhelm the rest of the thread.

I'll be back.

wiegraf: Basic cultures are incompatible imo. Problem identified? The hausa man thinks it should be solved this way, yorubas that way, enter ibos, then the motley crew. In many cases, what one views as a problem is certainly not so to other tribes. Even western nations that are supposedly more mature than us would have problems in these conditions. We need to split up.

Oga weigraf... this comment.. hmm..

^^i support him

systemseng: ^^i support him

Me too..

musKeeto:
Me too..

Take a knife and cut the country into how many ? ?

See them. Ibos planning biafra again.


When the Yorubas and other tribes abuse you guy in the politics section, you guys will be hollering.





Our first problem to tackle is that of corruption then religion. Division/tribalism can be tackled later

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The only division I could agree with is to throw away the north. They contribute nothing to the country apart from groundnuts and yam. Not that we dont have yam or groundnuts in the south.

Their islam has brought with it sharia law, terrorism and intolerance.


Their contribution is more negative than positive.


=========================================================================

@lb and @ooman: I'd advise you to visit Rivers State... not Port-Harcourt.... There's a difference..

musKeeto: @lb and @ooman: I'd advise you to visit Rivers State... not Port-Harcourt.... There's a difference..

Guy, make your point because I am not going to those places in the nearest future.


Lagos boy things

Logicboy03: See them. Ibos planning biafra again.
When the Yorubas and other tribes abuse you guy in the politics section, you guys will be hollering.

At least we're worth abusing..

Over time, I've come to realize Nigeria was never the dream of the individual components that it's made up of. It's just a drunk dream of a man called Lugard. We've been trying unsuccessfully for years to make this work. I'm not wishing the country breaks up. That might eventually happen in 2015...(yeah, I know we've always found a way to trudge on: curse or blessing)


Anyways, there's no ultimate solution to the Nigerian dilemma.

i still believe in my country sha

one great Nigeria

a Nigeria without religion

a successful nation.

I believe in the intelligence of the blackman

I believe in a better future

I dont just hope for a better future

I try to be the change I wanna see

if there is life, there is hope

ooman:
I believe in the intelligence of the blackman

I believe in a better future

I dont just hope for a better future

I try to be the change I wanna see

if there is life, there is hope

FIXED...