AjanleKoko:

Not true at all.
PhDs are needed in any R& environment. Not the least IT.
IT is more than installing MS Exchange oh, bros. That's sysadmin work. You don't even need a Bsc to do that.

drzed:

@ballabriggs and Ajanlekoko: Well said guys.

@obi2012: people like you will continue to operate in the 'factory floor' of your companies. The big money you think you are making now will only help you outshine your mates for a while. The only thing your so-called CNNP, CISSP, PDP, GQRX and other certifications will get for you is career advancement for a decade or so. At a point in your life (when your hairline starts to recede), you would want to leave the factory floor or banking hall and get an office in the top floor or penthouse. You would want to sit on company board as a director. At that stage, even someone with ordinary Masters degree will overtake you and all your CQPXZ certification. You read it here. Mark my words.

In other words, all what your certification does is allow you to implement the solutions that PhD holders and researchers have designed. Or to carry out instructions they are dishing from the top. In short, your certifications only makes you a very good 'worker'. Certification is unnecessary for a PhD holder. He has led the way in his field and will continue to be a leader in his field.

The people who actually run things in Google, Apple, Microsoft, Shell, GM, Samsung, etc all have PhDs. Check all the major corporations in the world and study the profile of those who make it tick (not those who own it, we can only have a few Bill Gates and Steve Jobs). Check those who decide on major issues at board level. Even in Nigeria here, many board members of serious companies have PhD holders. Those who have PhDs will continuously invent and innovate and make decisions...for people with CNSSP to implement on the factory floor.

Those who refuse to think will forever be the prisoners of other people's thoughts.

kpolli: A PHd is only useful if your going to lecture

kpolli: A PHd is only useful if your going to lecture

drzed: It is only in places like Nigeria (where people are allergic to progress) that PhD is synonymous to lecturing.

For the avoidance of doubt, a PhD gives you expertise (in your chosen area).

Whether you elect to use this expertise in a lecture hall, research institution, a multi-national or your private entrepreneurship is entirely up to you.

PhD holders are problem solvers (in their own domain) but they also have a wider grasp of research methodology than most folks. Unfortunately, some so-called PhD holders in Nigeria (including a few associated with leadership) have failed to demonstrate the minimum level of intellectual acumen, commensurate with the title. But that is not the fault of all other PhD holders. Can you now say all strikers including Van Persie, Messi or Suarez are useless simply because Yakubu Aiyegbeni missed an open goal (unmarked) from just 0.1 centimeters away?

Now as for the OP (and other Nairalanders/Nigerians who associate PhD with stupendous wealth) let it be clear that the richest black man today (Dangote) does not have a PhD. In fact, Bill Gates did not even finish college (degree). So what does that tell you about degrees and money? Having a university degree (of whatever level) is not a guarantee for success in life.

Problem is that too many Nigerians associate success with money, money, money. If it is ONLY money you want, then just go into trading. After all, Dangote, with all his billions, is just a trader (yes, I said it). He made (and makes) money selling sugar, salt, spaghetti, flour and cement. Chikenan! What stops you from doing same?

You dont need a PhD to make money. On the flip side, having money also does not make you (or guarantee that you would be) educated. You should define success according to your own terms and stop this wanton pursuit of kudi, ego, owo. This is why Nigeria is so corrupt because everyone wants to 'make it'. And while there is nothing wrong with making it, most Nigerians think 'making it' only means being VERY RICH and annoyingly, they want to 'Hammer' overnight.

I tire for my people.

Finally, let me answer the question posed by the title of the thread (with a JAMB question): What is the worth of ignorance financially?

Over to you.

the rest of this post has been hidden

drzed:

Theory, abi? Please stop wasting your time on Nairaland. Go back to your spare-part business or whatever it is you do to make the 'millions' that makes you so restless. If or when 'that disease' finally catch you, you will know the value of PhD or research.

Just listen to yourself: what is the worth of poverty financially? The statement is grammatically correct, but it is illogical and senseless. Did you actually 'think' about it in your own head as you conceived or typed it? Or you just recycled the question I posed earlier? Let me rephrase YOUR question to make you understand what you are asking: What is the worth of wealth financially? Now does that sound logical or answerable? You can ask: what is the worth of poverty to an economy, to a family, to a society BUT not financially. Thats like asking what is the worth of letter 'Q' alphabetically.

No wonder you despise PhD. I wont be surprised if you hate primary school certificate too

Like one clever fellow observed above: We dream of Nigeria being like China, Singapore and Malaysia, but we dont want to take the steps those countries took to make progress. You wan go heaven, but you no wan die, ko?

Nigeria is backward because of this your kind of thinking.

#80million:
*speechless*

PHD means Poverty of the Highest Degree.

If you are not financially free yet,instead of spending your money and time on a Phd,us e that money to feed your family or better START A BUSINESS!

ballabriggs:

If there is any area where you find a lot of PhD's it is in the IT industry. From Apple, to Google, to twitter, to Intel, you find loads of PhD's contributing, redesigning and re-engineering processes and products in these companies.

These are organisations that know their worth and not those your "IT companies" at Otigba street Ikeja.

AjanleKoko:

Not true at all.
PhDs are needed in any R and D environment. Not the least IT.
IT is more than installing MS Exchange oh, bros. That's sysadmin work. You don't even need a Bsc to do that.

drzed:

@ballabriggs and Ajanlekoko: Well said guys.

@obi2012: people like you will continue to operate in the 'factory floor' of your companies. The big money you think you are making now will only help you outshine your mates for a while. The only thing your so-called CNNP, CISSP, PDP, GQRX and other certifications will get for you is career advancement for a decade or so. All those certification only means you can install software or run it on a network without making mistake and when there is problem, you can trouble shoot and find it. Chikenan! No more no less.

At a point in your life (when your hairline starts to recede), you would want to leave the factory floor or banking hall and get an office in the top floor or penthouse. You will be tired of installing Microsoft Exchange and trouble-shooting CISCO Network Routers. You would want to sit on company board as a director. At that stage, even someone with ordinary Masters degree will overtake you and all your CQPXZ certification. You read it here. Mark my words.

In other words, all what your certification does is allow you to implement the solutions that PhD holders and researchers have designed. Or to carry out instructions they are dishing from the top. In short, your certifications only makes you a very good 'worker'. Certification is unnecessary for a PhD holder. He has led the way in his field and will continue to be a leader in his field.

The people who actually run things in Google, Apple, Microsoft, Shell, GM, Samsung, etc all have PhDs. Check all the major corporations in the world and study the profile of those who make it tick (not those who own it, we can only have a few Bill Gates and Steve Jobs). Check those who decide on major issues at board level. Even in Nigeria here, many board members of serious companies are PhD holders. Check serious governments in the US, Canada, UK, Japan and see who are those creating policies on economy and development: they have PhDs.

Those who have PhDs will continuously invent and innovate and make decisions...for people with CNSSP to implement on the factory floor.

Those who refuse to think will forever be the prisoners of other people's thoughts.

PhD holders are thinkers. Enough said.

obi2012: Guy, please stop spreading misinformation.. A phd is good for research and for teaching.. IT is one of the few fields where a phd is not as valued as experience..

obi2012: Do you really think a company will hire a phd with no real world experience whose topic of research was penetration testing over a bachelors degree, ccie with real world experience? Dude, book knowledge only counts for so much.. It definitely isn't real valuable in the IT field.

obi2012: You mentioned phd's running stuff at google, apple, microsoft, shell..I find it funny that all the companies you listed do not have one phd on their board of directors.. .

obi2012: So basically aside from the co-ceo of google, most tech companies do not have phd's on their board of directors.. What exactly are phd's running?

obi2012: The only place where a phd in CS (i.e. computer science) might be valuable is on wall street as a quant or designing trading systems but even then you'd have to be very good at programming and you wont be getting hired into management.

Coolcube: The worth of a PhD degree can not be quantifed in term of what it will add to the human development of the bearer (I mean those who did it honestly without bribing their way through). I believe that the bedrock of a nation's development not only lies in its natural resources, but on how developed are its human resources which will handle the natural resources. One of the ways of developing the human resources is quality education which its apex is PhD. In terms of money, a fresh PhD holder is paid 134k before tax in the Federal universities while private employers of labour or other govt jobs may pay more or less. However money should not be the motivating factor for getting a PhD. Either one wants to lecture or not, developing oneself intellectually is GOOD.
I'm 21 yrs old currently doing my Masters degree and I hope to get a PhD before 27 because I want to develop myself intellectually and conduct researches to proffer solutions to some of the problems facing the human race.

drzed: My guy, you funny no be small o! Let me try and respond to the key issues you raised in your long, but meaningless and misguided post.



Who is spreading misinformation. Don’t sit in your face-me-I-face-you shop with a laptop loaded with Airtel credit and be spreading ignorance. Teaching and research is only ONE among many things you can do with a PhD. Clearly you have no idea the kind of jobs that are waiting for PhD holders in companies like Google, Apple and Microsoft. But by the end of this post, you will know better. For now, let me just tempt you with just one link to exclusive PhD jobs @ Microsoft:

http://www.microsoft-careers.com/key/microsoft-phd-jobs.html (accessed 09 Feb 2013) There are about 4,349 PhD level jobs advertised on by Microsoft as at time of writing.



Yes they will hire and they do hire. I am not talking about the sort of backwater IT firms you probably rub shoulders with in Nigeria. Check the real world and see how many firms hire PhD holders (see more examples much further below).

And who told you PhD holders dont have any real-world experience? It is moronic, nay, imbecilic to conclude that people with PhDs have only being reading books all their lives. People like you not only suffer from stereo-typing PhD, you actually dont know what PhD is all about. Afterall, in your own words, PhD is good for teaching and research (you could have added 'only' at the end of that sentence to complete your ignorant assessment).

What their superior (PhD) knowledge and skill will give them, your 12 years of trouble-shooting networks will not give you. Your certification in the long run is just for routine day-to-day work. Jaki work. You are handicapped when it comes to deep-rooted thinking and original research which will pave the way. In fact, PhD is such a unique degree that even Google hires FRESH PhD graduates in software engineering, regardless of whether they have 10 years experience and 17 CISCO certifications (see down below).

Most patented technology that is at the core of Google, Microsoft, Apple and Samsung technologies were designed by PhD holders. Fact. Siddon dia wit ya CISCO certifications. Relative to your civil servant friends, I am sure your CV looks damn good.



You are not exactly very smart are you? I said PEOPLE who ‘run things’. I am not referring to the sole heads, owners, founders or CEOs only. Are you sure these companies dont have 'one' PhD on their boards? ARE YOU VERY SURE? Your children and grandchildren will read this post in future o! Anyway, see evidence and example from Google below.



Heow. Chineke mei! Your propensity for ignorance is flabberwhelming and overgasting. There are 6 members of Google’s Executive and the THREE top members each has a PhD (or the PhD is ongoing). As for those that don’t have PhDs, check their designations: they are marketers, legal people or songitos who make noises around). See their names and refer to the link below.

GOOGLE'S EXECUTIVE OFFICERS
(1) Larry Page (Chief Executive Officer) - Ph.D. at Stanford University
(2) Eric E. Schmidt (Executive Chairman) - Ph.D. in Computer Science, University of California, Berkeley
(3) Sergey Brin (Co-Founder) - currently on leave from the Ph.D. programme in Computer Science at Stanford University
(4) Nikesh Arora (Senior VP and Chief Business Officer) - MBA from Northeastern University
(5) David C. Drummond (Senior VP, and Chief Legal Officer) - Bachelor’s degree, Santa Clara University
(6) Patrick Pichette (Senior VP and Chief Financial Officer) - Master’s in Philosophy, Politics and Economics, Oxford

Source: http://www.google.co.uk/about/company/facts/management/

Also the top two members of Google’s Senior Leadership have PhDs
(1) Alan Eustace (Senior Vice President, Knowledge) Ph.D. in computer science, University of Central Florida
(2) Amit Singhal (Senior vice president) PhD in computer science, Cornell University

Infact, PhD degree is sooooo VERY important that Google actually created a unique website to attract people with PhDs, who can think and come up with new ideas. See the link below:

http://www.google.com/intl/en/jobs/students/tech/phd/ (accessed 09 Feb. 2013)

Available opportunities
• Software Developer, PhD New Grad 2013 - Montreal
• Software Engineer, PhD New Grad 2013 - North America
• Software Engineer, PhD New Grad - Europe
• Software Engineering Intern, PhD, Summer 2013 - North America

WARNING: don’t apply for the above positions with your CNSP certification because you will not be shortlisted, but instead you will be blacklisted for not reading instructions for applicants. This will negatively affect your future chance of being hired by Google Nigeria, as a multi-purpose network/router checker and errand boy

So my dear obi2012, you now see why proper research is good isn’t it? Someone reading your post will look at only the CEOs and conclude that people that run these companies don’t have PhDs.

Continue with your CNSPSP certification for the rest of your life. One day, Google will invite you to come and head their Lagos Office because you have 13 certificates from CISCO and 7 from Microsoft, abi?

Again, let me be clear: your certificates will help you stay employed and win some consulting jobs in your early career. But remember this: A very good Masters degree will last longer and carry your career further in the long run than 15 CISCO, JAVA and Microsoft certificates put together. Ask yourself this question every morning: "Am I going to continue writing software or trouble shooting networks all my life?" If the answer is no, then think ahead and when I say ahead, I mean like 20 years down the line, when your mates start becoming Directors and so on.

PS: I have not even bothered to dig deeper and show you other middle management staff of Google. Plenty of them have PhDs. Anyone who cares can review other global IT and Engineering companies and investigate those behind the scenes, helping to make top decisions not only at executive level, but on the technical side too. See examples:

Microsoft board:
Dr. Maria M. Klawe
Dr. Helmut Panke

Apple board
Arthur D. Levinson, Ph.D.
Ronald D. Sugar, Ph.D

NOTE: this ‘argument’ about PhDs is not only about IT industry. It applies to most science, medical and engineering professions. And when I say 'run things' it is not only for director/management level jobs. As you can see from the Google link above, software engineers with PhD degrees are currently in demand. And this is just Google only. You will find the same demand in other IT firms.

Most of those PhD jobs in IT as advertised by Google end up going to Indians and Chinese, because Nigerians (like you, obi2012) are busy sweeping cobwebs from LAN networks and trouble-shooting routers.

Please, carry your CISCO certificate and apply to Google for these jobs now? You can argue with the selection panel that your CNNSP (or whatever) gives you the same skill sets as a PhD holder and you deserve the same salary. Mtcheeww! You are pathetic.

Agreed that in some professions, e.g. Journalism, if you want to be the editor of say, Vanguard Newspaper for example, you may not need a PhD. Just toil away, writing stories about MEND and Boko Haram terrorist and in 20 – 25 years, you will luckily be promoted to the editor position (if your tribe and religion fits into the quota, that is).

I frankly don’t know why I am even wasting my time going back and forth with someone like you who cannot even carry out ordinary google search about the management and employees of global firms.

No wonder people like you despise research and PhDs. And yet you want Nigeria to be technologically advanced. How? This can only happen when we respect research and development. Why didnt we build and launch the satellites (like Nigcomsat) ourselves? Clue: we dont have the right quality and quantity of engineers to do so. Indians, Chinese, Malaysians, South Africans, Iranians, Brazilians and Egyptians are FAR ahead of us in this regard. Meanwhile, our own software and hardware engineers are busy obtaining CISCO certificates so that they can 'hammer' and drive Honda EODs.

Little knowledge is dangerous (Dr Alban, 1992)

drzed:

In the light of overwhelming evidence of PhD jobs in computing as shown above, can you now see how dumb your above statement sounds for the whole world to see on Nairaland? So PhD holders in computers science can only work for wall street and have to combine their programming skills with juju isnt it? Oya go and tell Microsoft to delete those thousands of PhD vacancies. And since according to the Gospel of Obi2012, PhD holders wont get into management, then lets start a campaign so that Google and others will sack their current management staff who have PhDs. Mtcheew!!!!

So Mr (or Mazi) Obi2012, every level of education has its rightful place and whether you agree or not, a PhD is at the top of the knowledge food chain....unless of course your skewed way of thinking tells you that Microsoft and Google will pay PhD holders the same salary as people who have CCNP certificate plus 10 years experience. Tufia!

Little knowledge is dangerous (Dr Alban, 1992)

obi2012: LOL.. you emphasize the need of people using their search properly..

Anyone knowledgeable would know that Larry Page never earned his Phd.. So when you finish preaching about using search, u sef use search yourself..

http://sparks.wisdomjobs.com/20-sergey-brin-and-larry-page.html

obi2012: Of all the jobs you posted that were looking for phd's, not one of them was a management job like you claimed.. They were all engineering jobs not management. Rarely do engineers make it out of engineering into management. Dont tell me about my field.. I have worked and currently work here.. Of all the board members you posted, less than 20 percent of what you posted is made up of Phd's..

Phd isnt the ticket to money.. In the end, its just a degree

obi2012: You can have a phd and be a failure in life, you can have a bachelors or even no degree and be a success.. If phd's were the ticket to prosperity, how many nigerian leaders have phd's? How many are educated? How are the less educated managing to rule the so called educated phd's while they sit back and watch?

You have a phd right? Which kind of phd are you? How many company boards are you on? How much are you making?

obi2012: It is this mentality that always puts nigerians behind everyone else.. We are overeducated as a society and underemployed.. If your goal is to make money, figure out a way to make money.. If you are genuinely interested in a field and see yourself long term in a field and feel a phd is the edge you need to get ahead, go for it and if you are good at what you do, money will come with it.

obi2012: A man that picks up trash can be a multimillionaire, a toilet cleaner can be a multimillionaire if he comes up with a great plan and is very good at it, over education such as a phd is not the key to success..

obi2012: How will i learn advanced security concepts where most things are theoretical, where my professor hasnt heard of pico, emacs, vi or cant even use basic unix functions like ls -l or grep? How am i supposed to learn vulnerability testing when my school network is still on dialup and the IT department is entitled to one server running windows 2000 server? How am i supposed to perform any penetration testing when the network wont even stay up long enough for me to telnet into a different server? How am i supposed to learn anything when the internet is so slow that i cant even login to the server through a remote session because the connection keeps timing out?

obi2012: Oga, please you sound like one of those people that got a phd because they wanted doctor next to their name and couldn't get accepted into UNILAG for medicine so they decided to compensate by getting a phd in zoology or something..

obi2012: People dont get phd's for money, they get phd's because they love the material and are genuinely interested in it.. All a phd prepares you for is to become an employee for someone else..

obi2012: People need to stop using education as a means to earn a living.. Be open minded, explore other options..

obi2012: How much is a phd earning in nigeria even after all their education? If you are lucky, you might hit N500k a month, highest N1 mill a month.. Is that money? Pleeeassseee..

drzed:

Kai, see mumu-rism at its peak! I am relying on official Google documentation for Larry Page's PhD claims, while you are quoting a blog? So the blog is more authoritative than Google, abi? FAIL! https://www.google.com/about/company/facts/management/

Is your brain running Windows 95?



I believe that I have demonstrated with clear examples, the vast array of jobs available to PhD holders: from executive level, to management level, down to software and engineering jobs using Google as a focus/case study. This was to counter your dumb argument that PhD is good for teaching and research (only).



I know you will fall back to money, money, money. Like I said, success and progress of a society is not all about money. And wetin consyn you with my salary? Make I send you credit ne, abi wetin? If na money you want, carry gun and stand for Express road nah? Why you go school



Fail! We are not nearly as educated as we need to be. Dont confuse the preponderance of Federal, state and private university with education. Quality before quantity. Most of our graduates are half baked. You said it (and proved it) yourself down below. And PLEASE our goal as a society is not to make money. It is to make progress and develop. Some of us can and will make money in the process.



Ehn, we don hear. Mr millionaire.



Okay, we get it and we sympathize with you in the sense that: (a) your are not able to grasp advanced theoretical concepts like your Indian and Chinese contemporaries; (b)Your school is primitive in IT; (c) your professors are using stoneage curriculum. But lets stick to the core issue: how is that the fault of PhD as a whole? Are you sure you are not half-baked?



At least I am not half-baked. And I am not trouble-shooting CISCO networks. Thats beneath me. If only you knew.



How on earth would YOU of all people know WHAT motivates people to get PhDs? and how many PhD holders do you employ? Mr employer!



Okay, from your angle, education is not to be used to make a living, abi? We should all go to school and get degrees just because we dont have something to do with our time abi? You are a deluded person who does not understand how a modern society works! Listen to yourself!! Please stop posting on Nairaland. Some innocent, naive kids may take you seriously and think that education is not meant to make a living. Are you a member of Boko Haraam? Just asking o, because your words sound awfully similar to what those guys are aiming for.



Life is much more than money. When I spoke about people (Nigerians) who just want to 'hammer', I was talking about people like you, apparently. If Nigerians dont value PhD, does that make the degree a useless endeavour? We are backwards in terms of development because too many of us in Nigeria think like you.

You should be banned in Nairaland for spreading and encouraging ignorance.

drzed: @obi2012:
I dont know why this PhD thing dey pain you so much that you despise it and people who aim for it. But you proved it above that your brain cannot handle advanced theories. Maybe thats why.

All these 'I oversee 13 PhD holders in my department' and 'Texas University' and 'my CISCO colleagues earning 120K per annum' doesnt fool me one bit. Scan your degree with your passport photo attached, let us confirm that you went to Texas, YabaTech or wherever. I have never mentioned the schools I have attended because it is not about me, my qualifications or my ego. It is about the issue at hand (PhD) and its worth.

In summary, anyone who reads what you have been writing since yesterday can deduce the following:

(1) You dont know what PhD is all about (what the degree entails and what you can do with it)
(2) You are incapable of grasping advanced theories, which means you cant do research (i.e. why you hate PhD)
(3) You think the goal of the human race or any society is to make money (hint: try Okija shrine)
(4) You have inferiority complex, relative to PhD holders (get over it)
(4) You make dumb and stewpid assumptions about things (e.g. PhD degree, need for education, human development) and about people (e.g. myself, PhD holders) which you know very little about.

You dont know jack about me. Stop assuming and making it personal.

Arguing with you is waste of time. Go and make money. Obingote!

obi2012: Sorry, I don't deal in theories, I deal in practical.. Keep with your yabatech abi na lasu theories, let other people keep growing your economy and doing stuff with themselves..

drzed:

Behind every practical issue, is a solid scientific fact and explanation. But how would you know?
Oh, sorry, you are theoretically-challenged. Go and troubleshoot windows abeg!

obi2012: Lol, I will. Right after you go and sell tests to your Lasu students to pay rent