gj22:


Am not much of a reader, sorry, didn't read all that.

Don't forget that robb wasn't fighting for the iron throne.

The Lannisters could barely get by the Baratheons if not for tyrion's genius and robb had a better army.

Was robb not also termed a master planner? Seriously though, a lot of game of thrones forums online say the same.

He was. Though he didnt have the better army when he went campaigning(some 20,000 out of the North's 40,000-50,000) . Quality beats Quantity in this case.

Gbola5:


Only Robert and others think it was rape. Ned didnt, Barristan didnt. And its not said he tells Benjen, or that Elia knew.

Lyana was betroded to and in love with robert baratheon and the starks are if not anything else, principled, to think that lyana gave herself willingly to rhaegar after she was kidnapped and held his prisoner is preposterous. Before the tournament at harrenhal where everything began the starks were loyal subjects of the crown and had no quarrels whatsoever with the iron throne and when rhaegar rode past his wife publicly to give his favour to lyana after his victory at harrenhal, it was a public embarrassment and affront to the martells and the baratheons and at that time a PR nightmare to the starks who knew not that calamitous events would unfold after so even after the fate that befell her brother and father you would have me think that lyanna ever gave herself willingly to rhaegar and his wife ellia who was publicly humiliated at harrenhal had no idea what he was doing to ellia in her own home? Pleeeeeeese

BraniacX:


Lyana was betroded to and in love with robert baratheon and the starks are if not anything else, principled, to think that lyana gave herself willingly to rhaegar after she was kidnapped and held his prisoner is preposterous. Before the tournament at harrenhal where everything began the starks were loyal subjects of the crown and had no quarrels whatsoever with the iron throne and when rhaegar rode past his wife publicly to give his favour to lyana after his victory at harrenhal, it was a public embarrassment and affront to the martells and the baratheons and at that time a PR nightmare to the starks who knew not that calamitous events would unfold after so even after the fate that befell her brother and father you would have me think that lyanna ever gave herself willingly to rhaegar and his wife ellia who was publicly humiliated at harrenhal had no idea what he was doing to ellia in her own home? Pleeeeeeese

It wasn't her home. It was at the Tower of Joy, a Targ resort, although its located in Dorne. Lyanna wasn't inlove with Robert, Robert was in love with Lyanna.
"Love is sweet, dearest Ned, but it
cannot change a man's nature."- Lyanna about Robert's promiscuity.
“Robert will never keep to one bed,”
Lyanna had told him at Winterfell, on
the night long ago when their father had
promised her hand to the young Lord of
Storm’s End. “I hear he has gotten a
child on some girl in the Vale.”- Ned's thoughts.
Everyone thinks she was kidnapped. But Ned doesnt, shouldn't that say something. If you know the story of the tourney, then you must needs know the Knight of the Laughing Tree,no ? And if you know that, you must know Rhaegar was sent after the mystery knight. The knight was someone who knew of Howland Reed's experience with the squires, who worshipped the old gods due to the tree on his shield, who spoke in a booming voice which is fake and was used as a disguise, who encountered Rhaegar at somepoint, when he was sent after tkotlt. Its theorized this may be Lyanna. Well my point is she wasn't kidnapped. I think where you went off is the timeline, Rhaegar and Lyanna went of before Rickard and Brandon were killed, which is yet before Rhaegar died on the Trident.

Gbola5:


He was. Though he didnt have the better army when he went campaigning(some 20,000 out of the North's 40,000-50,000) . Quality beats Quantity in this case.

So, in your opinion, did Tywin stand a chance against robb as at the time of the red wedding? And why do you think so?

Gbola5:


I know all this. Im asking how you came to know them, since you're show only, and non of them are in or have been mentioned.

Another game of thrones forum. A book reader used it as a point that the freys are d1ck riders for favour. No honor or code.

I think robb's mom tried to warn him too.

gj22:


Am not much of a reader, sorry, didn't read all that.

Don't forget that robb wasn't fighting for the iron throne.

The Lannisters could barely get by the Baratheons if not for tyrion's genius and robb had a better army.

Was robb not also termed a master planner? Seriously though, a lot of game of thrones forums online say the same.

Tyrions genius wasn't what stopped stannis at the blackwater, stannis would have won that battle were it not for the armies of the reach allying themselves with tywin at harrenhal and riding to kingslanding to defeat stannis baratheon's forces for the promise of queenship to maegery tyrell

Rob was an astute commander who was good with battlefield tactics but he wasn't a master planner, his mother katherine stark and even his beheaded bannerman rickard karstark were, they understood that wars were about alliances and counselled rob as much and rob heeded until his heart betrayed him and he fell in love with the daughter of a lannister bannerman(according to the books) and his failure to discipline his heart, cost him his life and his army and there is also the fact that the starks were principled and obeyed unwritten codes of conduct in life and warfare that others simply obeyed when convenient or ignored totally

If at the beginning of season six..

It's a flashback scene..

They show Nedd stark after a fierce battle in a tavern..getting drunk. Then he pulls a LovePeddler to himself then they go outside.

And the BAM! He is fvcking her furiously and he comes in her. 9 months later, she gives birth to jon snow.


I will love d&d forever.

BraniacX:


Tyrions genius wasn't what stopped stannis at the blackwater, stannis would have won that battle were it not for the armies of the reach allying themselves with tywin at harrenhal and riding to kingslanding to defeat stannis baratheon's forces for the promise of queenship to maegery tyrell

Rob was an astute commander who was good with battlefield tactics but he wasn't a master planner, his mother katherine stark and even his beheaded bannerman rickard karstark were, they understood that wars were about alliances and counselled rob as much and rob heeded until his heart betrayed him and he fell in love with the daughter of a lannister bannerman(according to the books) and his failure to discipline his heart, cost him his life and his army and there is also the fact that the starks were principled and obeyed unwritten codes of conduct in life and warfare that others simply obeyed when convenient or ignored totally

This is wrong. Stannis would have taken kings landing long before Tywin got there if not for tyrion. Don't forget cercei was already almost killing her children. They hardly scrapped by.

gj22:


So, in your opinion, did Tywin stand a chance against robb as at the time of the red wedding? And why do you think so?

At the time of the Red Wedding, they had the Tyrell forces with them.

gj22:


Another game of thrones forum. A book reader used it as a point that the freys are d1ck riders for favour. No honor or code.

I think robb's mom tried to warn him too.

Ok then.

gj22:
If at the beginning of season six..

It's a flashback scene..

They show Nedd stark after a fierce battle in a tavern..getting drunk. Then he pulls a LovePeddler to himself then they go outside.

And the BAM! He is fvcking her furiously and he comes in her. 9 months later, she gives birth to jon snow.


I will love d&d forever.

Why ? To piss people off ? Then its bad writing.

gj22:


This is wrong. Stannis would have taken kings landing long before Tywin got there if not for tyrion. Don't forget cercei was already almost killing her children. They hardly scrapped by.

True. Tyrion gave Tywin enough time to reach the Blackwater. Not because he knew though.

gj22:


So, in your opinion, did Tywin stand a chance against robb as at the time of the red wedding? And why do you think so?

Yes a very good chance

gj22:


This is wrong. Stannis would have taken kings landing long before Tywin got there if not for tyrion. Don't forget cercei was already almost killing her children. They hardly scrapped by.

Yes and tyrion only delayed the inevitable but for tywin's intervention

Gbola5:


It wasn't her home. It was at the Tower of Joy, a Targ resort, although its located in Dorne. Lyanna wasn't inlove with Robert, Robert was in love with Lyanna.
"Love is sweet, dearest Ned, but it
cannot change a man's nature."- Lyanna about Robert's promiscuity.
“Robert will never keep to one bed,”
Lyanna had told him at Winterfell, on
the night long ago when their father had
promised her hand to the young Lord of
Storm’s End. “I hear he has gotten a
child on some girl in the Vale.”- Ned's thoughts.
Everyone thinks she was kidnapped. But Ned doesnt, shouldn't that say something. If you know the story of the tourney, then you must needs know the Knight of the Laughing Tree,no ? And if you know that, you must know Rhaegar was sent after the mystery knight. The knight was someone who knew of Howland Reed's experience with the squires, who worshipped the old gods due to the tree on his shield, who spoke in a booming voice which is fake and was used as a disguise, who encountered Rhaegar at somepoint, when he was sent after tkotlt. Its theorized this may be Lyanna. Well my point is she wasn't kidnapped. I think where you went off is the timeline, Rhaegar and Lyanna went of before Rickard and Brandon were killed, which is yet before Rhaegar died on the Trident.

It may be lyana true but that doesn't give a motive as to why she would want to escape with rhaegar who was already married with kids, and who sent rhaegar after the mystery knight?

And also, after ned killed sir authur dane the sword of the morning with the crannogman's help at the tower, who was left to have killed lyanna? She was found in a pool of her own blood without any obvious injuries, what does that say about the nature of her stay at the tower of joy?

Gbola5:


True. Tyrion gave Tywin enough time to reach the Blackwater. Not because he knew though.

Exactly!!!

To the best of his knowledge all he had to stop stannis with were his wits and their meagre forces

BraniacX:


It may be lyana true but that doesn't give a motive as to why she would want to escape with rhaegar who was already married with kids, and who sent rhaegar after the mystery knight?

And also, after ned killed sir authur dane the sword of the morning with the crannogman's help at the tower, who was left to have killed lyanna? She was found in a pool of her own blood without any obvious injuries, what does that say about the nature of her stay at the tower of joy?

Rhaegar found something in a book that changed his life forever. Here's Dany at the HotUndying;
Viserys, was her first
thought the next time she paused,
but a second glance told her
otherwise. The man had her
brother’s hair, but he was taller,
and his eyes were a dark indigo
rather than lilac. “Aegon,” he
said to a woman nursing a
newborn babe in a great wooden
bed. “What better name for a
king?”
“Will you make a song for
him?” the woman asked.
“He has a song,” the man
replied. “He is the prince
that was promised, and his
is the song of ice and fire.”
He looked up when he said
it and his eyes met Dany’s,
and it seemed as if he saw
her standing there beyond
the door. “There must be
one more,” he said, though
whether he was speaking
to her or the woman in
the bed she could not say.
“The dragon has three
heads.” He went to the
window seat, picked up a
harp, and ran his fingers
lightly over its silvery
strings. Sweet sadness
filled the room as man and
wife and babe faded like
the morning mist, only the
music lingering behind to
speed her on her way.

The woman is Elia by the way. So this means, Rhaegar thought Aegon and Rhaenys were heads and that he needed one more, since Elia was frail at this point and couldnt give birth anymore without dying, it would make sense why Rhaegar who was married and with 2kids needed Lyanna, might be Elia was in on it. Its unclear why Lyanna followed him, but i doubt we'll find out. Aerys sent Rhaegar after the mystery knight when he thought the mystery knight was going to oppose him. I did not say anyone killed Lyanna.

BraniacX:


Exactly!!!

To the best of his knowledge all he had to stop stannis with were his wits and their meagre forces

Yes and if tyrion hadn't held his sh1t together, unlike some inbred child, stannis would have taken kings landing.

So, in other words, Tyrion saved the Lannisters. They wouldn't have survived if not for tyrion.

Whether he did it knowingly or not is not the point.

Gbola5:


Why ? To piss people off ? Then its bad writing.

Not to piss people off.

What if that's the story they always wanted to tell but fans got hyper and created their own story. How is it their fault. Even in literature, misleading the audience is good storytelling.

gj22:


Not to piss people off.

What if that's the story they always wanted to tell but fans got hyper and created their own story. How is it their fault. Even in literature, misleading the audience is good storytelling.

Not when there are clear hints. When GRRM gave D& who were fans also, the right to televise his story, he asked them; "Who is Jon Snow's mother ?" and they got the answer. Now why would any writer try to change a story because fans figured something out. Its not like it was going to be spelled out in other for toddlers to understand.

BraniacX:


According to L.A times, the theory is that Jon snow actually does die but , he is actually more than just the bastard of ned stark, scratch that, he is actually not ned starks son, he actually is the nephew of ned stark born by lyanna stark in her dying bed and conceived of rape, rape by rhaegar taegeryon the last dragon meaning jon snow is a legitimate or illegitimate if you like dragon and he is half taegeryon, half stark and according to prophecy, the prince that was promised, he will be the second of the three dragons(after daenerys) and ned stark protected his true identity from even himself because he was his sisters son taegeryon or not and ned loved his sister dearly and the truth of his paternity would have been a threat to robert baratheon neds beloved friend and king and robert might not have killed him but he would have been sore tempted to but other great houses like the lannisters would have wanted him dead while others like the tyrells, the martels and the greyjoys might have used his existence as an excuse to rebel against king robert baratheon
How things play out with this possible revelation I don't know as the book ended with book five at the wall where jon snow was murdered so it is all touch and go and guesswork henceforth
But some things are now known, snow was on set for the filming of season six and GOT will have a season eight at least eventually.

Really??
Nice to know..Jon doesn't have the normal taegeryon Sandy hair though. Happy to hear this, really looking forward to watching season 6. TeamJonSnowKnowsSomething afterall . Can't wait!
Second bolded. ..music to my ears

gj22:


The red wedding just shows you how genius Tywin actually is

...and his Genius took him to his grave(Wicked Man) killed by an oppressed Son. I now understand why Cersei's Wicked.

Forwetinnah:


Really??
Nice to know..Jon doesn't have the normal taegeryon Sandy hair though. Happy to hear this, really looking forward to watching season 6. TeamJonSnowKnowsSomething afterall . Can't wait!
Second bolded. ..music to my ears

The Targ gene is recessive. Black hair is dominant.

Gbola5:


Rhaegar found something in a book that changed his life forever. Here's Dany at the HotUndying;
Viserys, was her first
thought the next time she paused,
but a second glance told her
otherwise. The man had her
brother’s hair, but he was taller,
and his eyes were a dark indigo
rather than lilac. “Aegon,” he
said to a woman nursing a
newborn babe in a great wooden
bed. “What better name for a
king?”
“Will you make a song for
him?” the woman asked.
“He has a song,” the man
replied. “He is the prince
that was promised, and his
is the song of ice and fire.”
He looked up when he said
it and his eyes met Dany’s,
and it seemed as if he saw
her standing there beyond
the door. “There must be
one more,” he said, though
whether he was speaking
to her or the woman in
the bed she could not say.
“The dragon has three
heads.” He went to the
window seat, picked up a
harp, and ran his fingers
lightly over its silvery
strings. Sweet sadness
filled the room as man and
wife and babe faded like
the morning mist, only the
music lingering behind to
speed her on her way.

The woman is Elia by the way. So this means, Rhaegar thought Aegon and Rhaenys were heads and that he needed one more, since Elia was frail at this point and couldnt give birth anymore without dying, it would make sense why Rhaegar who was married and with 2kids needed Lyanna, might be Elia was in on it. Its unclear why Lyanna followed him, but i doubt we'll find out. Aerys sent Rhaegar after the mystery knight when he thought the mystery knight was going to oppose him. I did not say anyone killed Lyanna.

Hmmm, is there an online site where i can download the comprehensive and more detailed version of the book you're quoting from?

And i take it you accept the possibility of jon snow being lyanna's son by rhaegar?

BraniacX:


Hmmm, is there an online site where i can download the comprehensive and more detailed version of the book you're quoting from?

And i take it you accept the possibility of jon snow being lyanna's son by rhaegar?

What have i been saying. Yes, R+L=J. Its the same books. I just remember the quotes and find the complete quotes.

Gbola5:


What have i been saying. Yes, R+L=J. Its the same books. I just remember the quotes and find the complete quotes.

Am sure the books I read might not be the original version and my be edited or abbreived online versions because am a GOT buff and would definitely remember these lines if ever I read them, my memory is not that bad not yet anyway

BraniacX:


Am sure the books I read might not be the original version and my be edited or abbreived online versions because am a GOT buff and would definitely remember these lines if ever I read them, my memory is not that bad not yet anyway

I dont have a link. Try google.

Gbola5:

I dont have a link. Try google.

Shyte!!!!
Sorry

Finally finished my second reading of the ASOIAF series. It's time to subscribe to this forum. Lets do this!

Basics007:
Finally finished my second reading of the ASOIAF series. It's time to subscribe to this forum. Lets do this!

Nice.

Gbola5:

Nice.

Thanks

Gbola5:


Not when there are clear hints. When GRRM gave D& who were fans also, the right to televise his story, he asked them; "Who is Jon Snow's mother ?" and they got the answer. Now why would any writer try to change a story because fans figured something out. Its not like it was going to be spelled out in other for toddlers to understand.

They also asked "who is LSH?" and got an answer

"How did shireen die?" and got an answer

"Can fire hurt Danaerys?" and got an answer

Is it today they started changing stuff?

They are not trying to change it because fans figured it out. They want to change it because that's how they want to tell their story. Like every other thing they have changed already.