Anyway you look at this problem the solution always lies with the people not the government... why are Nigerian citizens sequestering their money from the economy?

The GDP of Nigeria is around 2600 per capita, which is not bad at all. If all that money was keep in the financial system i'm positive the the banks would be able to loan at lower interests rates to SMEs.

Mr. Pleep, banks have the option to either lend to private individuals or to public individuals. Interest rates are set proportionally to how risky the loan taker is. The public sector is usually more trust worthy and less risky so banks prefer to lend to governments than private individuals (crowding out effect) Also government thru the central bank controls the inflation rate in an economy and one of the most effective tools in handling inflation is by raising interest rates thereby reducing the amount of money in circulation.
our private sector is in the mess it is because our currency is so messed up and we lack basic infrastructure such as electricity (governments always provide the bulk of generation capacity).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh-UbKaJxmQ

Expert urges Nigerians,private sector to partner with Govt on power projects

pleep: In the 1800's, before the united states government invested heavily into infrastructure, the sector was taken care of by private companies via the railroad system, toll roads and toll bridges.

Why cant Nigeria do the same? In Africa the private sector has not even provided the government any good companies to contract with, forcing them to rely on over-priced foriegn firms.

The federal government is just a skape-goat, the real problem with Africa is the people (private sector) especially those of us abroad.

You are talking textbook economics.
Private companies cannot embark on building public infrastructure. I think you are mixing up public with private. US govt built the 2nd largest road network in the world -The Dwight D. Eisenhower Inter-State Highway System--and it's said the most expensive public works expenditure . What's the work of govt?

How am i mixing public with private? The interstate system was made in the 1950's, i'm talking about the 1800's. Do you guys realize that there was a time when the U.S and the UK did not have 24/hour electricity or good roads, yet they were still able to industrilize?

When they were no roads they built railroads, no electricity they used steam power. The free market has proven time and time again that it can bring economic growth without the help of government. (i have my own theories to why it doesn't work in Africa, but they were shouted down in this thread https://www.nairaland.com/1001242/nigeria-must-leave-global-economy)

...So if we think Africa can survive in the globalism system, the responsibility for our failures fall squarely on the shoulders of the people

Consider the fact that maybe development begets a good government, and not the other way around.

WHATCHA'LL THINK OF A MILLION LITTLE PPL COMING TOGETHER,AND INVESTING IN AGRIC,SOLID MINERALS,INDUSTRIAL PARKS, REAL ESTATE,HEALTH AND TRANSPORTATION.NO BANKS, NO GOVT, NO "ORGANISED PRIVATE SECTOR ",NO BULLSHEET.JUS LITTLE PPL,SURVIVORS, SOLDIER ANT STYLE

pleep: How am i mixing public with private? The interstate system was made in the 1950's, i'm talking about the 1800's. Do you guys realize that there was a time when the U.S and the UK did not have 24/hour electricity or good roads, yet they were still able to industrilize?

When they were no roads they built railroads, no electricity they used steam power. The free market has proven time and time again that it can bring economic growth without the help of government. (i have my own theories to why it doesn't work in Africa, but they were shouted down in this thread https://www.nairaland.com/1001242/nigeria-must-leave-global-economy)

...So if we think Africa can survive in the globalism system, the responsibility for our failures fall squarely on the shoulders of the people

Consider the fact that maybe development begets a good government, and not the other way around.

It is impossible for the private sector to provide growth without the government or public sector. If you disagree, give actual examples. Did the Europeans buy the land they used for the railroads and industries they built in the US in the 18th and 19th centuries? Were the early settlers not supported by European governments? Did European governments not use free labour (Slaves) to develop US industry? Provide examples where the private sector paid for every factor of production. No where in this world is the private sector responsible for infrastructure. Private sector may be involved in the development of infrastructure that it needs but the government isn't willing to provide. For instance, sections of a road to link trunk roads or power for a part of a country.

pleep: How am i mixing public with private? The interstate system was made in the 1950's, i'm talking about the 1800's. Do you guys realize that there was a time when the U.S and the UK did not have 24/hour electricity or good roads, yet they were still able to industrilize?

When they were no roads they built railroads, no electricity they used steam power. The free market has proven time and time again that it can bring economic growth without the help of government. (i have my own theories to why it doesn't work in Africa, but they were shouted down in this thread https://www.nairaland.com/1001242/nigeria-must-leave-global-economy)

...So if we think Africa can survive in the globalism system, the responsibility for our failures fall squarely on the shoulders of the people

Consider the fact that maybe development begets a good government, and not the other way around.

Private=Profit first with restricted use. Public= everybody can use. In the US, railways are owned by private companies with exception of Amtrak which is heavily subsidized by US, which negates free market economy principles.
U can't be running your arguement with this one historical event of 1800s when Nigeria hadn't been conceived. Find better facts of 1960s to 2000s where private companies built railways, road, seaports, airports for public use.
This Internet u are using came as a result of Govt research and funding even though greatest beneficiaries today are companies.

The difference between us and the Europeans is we look for a scapegoats for our problems while they fix the damn thing.

It is impossible for the private sector to provide growth without the government or public sector. If you disagree, give actual examples. Did the Europeans buy the land they used for the railroads and industries they built in the US in the 18th and 19th centuries? Were the early settlers not supported by European governments? Did European governments not use free labour (Slaves) to develop US industry? Provide examples where the private sector paid for every factor of production. No where in this world is the private sector responsible for infrastructure. Private sector may be involved in the development of infrastructure that it needs but the government isn't willing to provide. For instance, sections of a road to link trunk roads or power for a part of a country.

The examples are endless

For example; The British East India company, who bought the charter for India, making huge profits from the silk & spice trade before colonizing the subcontinent with their private armies. The British Government owned 0 stock in this company and only gained direct control of India after it nationalized the firm in 1857.

.... Even Nigeria was controlled by the private Royal Niger Company until 1899.

When people wanted to create business that were too expensive, or to risky to be financed by the government or the banks, they created joint-stock companies, which essentially consisted of several wealthy individuals pooling their money together and liquidating the firm when the objectives where met

while now, in the 21th century, Africans just complain that the interest rates are too high and sit around blaming the government.

pleep: @99cents the "invisible hand" is a metaphor to describe the way the free-market self regulates.

no shiit. do you know where that metaphor came from and what it refers to?
keep reading ur voodoo economics textbook n calling it science

adconline:

Private=Profit first with restricted use. Public= everybody can use. In the US, railways are owned by private companies with exception of Amtrak which is heavily subsidized by US, which negates free market economy principles.
U can't be running your arguement with this one historical event of 1800s when Nigeria hadn't been conceived. Find better facts of 1960s to 2000s where private companies built railways, road, seaports, airports for public use.
This Internet u are using came as a result of Govt research and funding even though greatest beneficiaries today are companies.

Do you realize that Nigeria has not entered the industrial age by 2013?

While America entered it in 1865, England in 1750. Does that not sound a little bit ridiculous to you? If we want to analyse the interplay between the public and private sectors of pre-industrial Nigeria we have to compare it to the events in the pre-industrial west... not on the service based economies of modern Europe.

At this point in Africa development = industrilization, any other objective is wasting time. No nation has ever become a HDC without this step

99cent:

no shiit. do you know where that metaphor came from and what it refers to?
keep reading ur voodoo economics textbook n calling it science

http://www.emeraldinsight.com/journals.htm?articleid=1758839

99cent leave. This is a complex discussion, i don't have time for people who don't understand basic economic terms.

pleep: Do you realize that Nigeria has not entered the industrial age by 2013?

While America entered it in 1865, England in 1750. Does that not sound a little bit ridiculous to you? If we want to analyse the interplay between the public and private sectors of pre-industrial Nigeria we have to compare it to the events in the pre-industrial west... not on the service based economies of modern Europe.

At this point in Africa development = industrilization, any other objective is wasting time. No nation has ever become a HDC without this step

something u also omit is that America fought a whole civil war over whether or not it will adopt industrialization. Talk about invisible hand. politics certainly had nothing to do with it. You mention 1865. hmm I wonder what just ended during that time. hint hint civil war. and I wonder what that war was about hmm. u don't need slaves when u have technology. wow light bulb.

there is also something called patents and intellectual rights that enable industries to become rich at the expense of smaller business. again, state laws and regulations have nothing to do with this

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/02/business/global/top-court-in-india-rejects-novartis-drug-patent.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

in a free market, u won't have big american industries using legal means to try to stifle other small industries (at home and abroad) from competing (HIV medication of all things!!).
isn't that true?

99cent:

something u also omit is that America fought a whole civil war over whether or not it will adopt industrialization. Talk about invisible hand. politics certainly had nothing to do with it. You mention 1865. hmm I wonder what just ended during that time. hint hint civil war. and I wonder what that war was about hmm. u don't need slaves when u have technology. wow light bulb.

there is also something called patents and intellectual rights that enable industries to become rich at the expense of smaller business. again, state laws and regulations have nothing to do with this

^ Good god... Get out of here, You are ruining my thread.

Why can you people stay in the romance section instead of posting nonsense about subjects you dont understand?

"the civil war was about industrilization" what the hell? If anything, both the south and north benefited from industrilization. The cotton gin improved productivity of southern plantations, enabling them to expand and export to Europe, while industrilization helped to north develop a manufacturing industry, as well as a textile industry that benefited from the south's increased output.

... the civil war was about states rights, power dynamics and slavery kiddo, Go read a damn book. It is by force you must comment here

pleep: ^ Good god... Get out of here, You are ruining my thread.

Why can you people stay in the romance section instead of posting nonsense about subjects you dont understand?

"the civil war was about industrilization" what the hell? If anything, both the south and north benefited from industrilization. The cotton gin improved productivity of southern plantations, enabling them to expand and export to Europe, while industrilization helped to north develop a manufacturing industry, as well as a textile industry that benefited from the south's increased output.

... the civil war was about states rights, power dynamics and slavery kiddo, Go read a damn book. It is by force you must comment here

pleep: Do you realize that Nigeria has not entered the industrial age by 2013?

While America entered it in 1865, England in 1750. Does that not sound a little bit ridiculous to you? If we want to analyse the interplay between the public and private sectors of pre-industrial Nigeria we have to compare it to the events in the pre-industrial west... not on the service based economies of modern Europe.

At this point in Africa development = industrilization, any other objective is wasting time. No nation has ever become a HDC without this step

You are still running on historic and subjective theories. Name "free market" countries where private companies build public infrastructure? if you know someone WHO runs a business profitably, it's a big NO cos ROI is not guaranteed. If you have run a company, you are looking for the shortest way to make most the profit. If your only cited example worked, why is it that private companies have not towed that line?
Why do govts (public), federal, states, counties, and cities go to bond markets(private) to raise money for public works instead of having private companies fully fund those projects?
Also name one country where 100% free economy is practiced? Tell me why US runs a railway network (public) for Amtrak and uses tax payer's money (public) to subsidize( against free market economy) ridership?

pleep:

"the civil war was about industrilization" what the hell? If anything, both the south and north benefited from industrilization. The cotton gin improved productivity of southern plantations, enabling them to expand and export to Europe, while industrilization helped to north develop a manufacturing industry, as well as a textile industry that benefited from the south's increased output.

... the civil war was about states rights, power dynamics and slavery kiddo, Go read a damn book. It is by force you must comment here

the civil war was between industrial north and agricultural south. The south rejected the mass industrial factories and move into cities. They insisted on rural farm life blindly assuming that cotton is King and that industry wouldn't survive without the south. Yes of course they profited from the industry up north but they overestimated their own necessity.

u need to read up on ur history. if it were all about free markets and invisible hands, there would have been no need for a war. "states rights" is just another political fight over ECONOMICS. and of course, the industrial north won that war.

the reality of the USA would be very different had the south won. the industrial revolution most likely wouldn't have happened at the moment when it did.

adconline:
Also name one country where 100% free economy is practiced?

haha don't mind d clown. 100% free market= anarchy.
imagine the fool is talking about railroad. railroad is the prime example of govt project.

-----

Most of the engineers and surveyors who figured out how and where to build the railroad on the Union Pacific were usually engineering college trained Union Army veterans who had learned their railroad trade keeping the trains running and tracks maintained during the U.S. Civil War working for the U.S. Military Railroad (USMRR) which was established by the United States War Department as a separate agency to operate and repair any rail lines needed by the Union army or seized by the government from the Confederate States of America railroads during the American Civil War. Nearly all of the Union and Confederate armies were supported and transported by extensive rail networks which had to be built up, protected and repaired as the armies advanced and retreated. Most key workers and supervisors were trained by previous on-the-job training and knew what needed to be done and how to direct workers to get it done. Most of the semi-skilled workers on the Union Pacific were recruited from the many discharged Union Army and Confederate Army veterans and emigrant Irishmen escaping poverty and famine in Ireland.[7]

The Central Pacific had the same financial incentives the Union Pacific as well as some construction bonds that were granted by the state and the city of San Francisco. The Central Pacific hired engineers and surveyors who had extensive experience and training building railroads and knew what needed to be done and how to supervise others to get it done. The Central Pacific, facing a semi-skilled labor shortage, relied on some black employees[8] escaping the slavery and turmoil of the American Civil War and many emigrant Chinese manual laborers for construction. Most of these Chinese emigrants were escaping the poverty and terrors of the Taiping Revolution in the Kwangtung province in China. Supervisory, engineering and skilled jobs were done with "white" workers including a lot of Irishmen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Transcontinental_Railroad

the origin of the internet can be traced to the US Department of Defense.
this is so called technology Africa is falling behind in. In USA most of the breakthroughs come from govt funded research and development. NOT private sector. esp. if you trace the source.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANET

the invisible hand making all things work out for good Ah even the 'scientists' are now believing in the supernatural.
voodoo economics as it is called.

[img]http://greenewable.files./2008/10/invisiblehand.jpg?w=359[/img]

adconline:

You are still running on historic and subjective theories. Name "free market" countries where private companies build public infrastructure? if you know someone WHO runs a business profitably, it's a big NO cos ROI is not guaranteed. If you have run a company, you are looking for the shortest way to make most the profit. If your only cited example worked, why is it that private companies have not towed that line?
Why do govts (public), federal, states, counties, and cities go to bond markets(private) to raise money for public works instead of having private companies fully fund those projects?
Also name one country where 100% free economy is practiced? Tell me why US runs a railway network (public) for Amtrak and uses tax payer's money (public) to subsidize( against free market economy) ridership?

How is it a subjective theory when it has been proven in almost every western Europe country?

Please do not strawman my argument, im not here advocating for Laissez-Faire economics, i'm asking why capitalism is not working in Africa.

Again, why do you think it is appropriate to compare the interplay between the public/private sectors in modern, post industrial Europe with pre-industrial Africa? The reason i am using old examples is because those are the only precidents for capitalism in a pre-industrial society.

Every economy is a mixed economy to some degree, the united states increased its involvement in the economy mainly to stabilize the business cycle after the great depression in 29'. At that point the American economy had already developed in a largely unregulated enviornment.

maybe it isn't all about capitalism. maybe religion, culture, work ethic, history etc all play a larger role than so called 'invisible hand'
capitalism itself is argued to have emerged out of dutch Calvinism in 1600s.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Protestant_Ethic_and_the_Spirit_of_Capitalism

capitalism. the main word there is capital. ie pooling/mobilization of resources. this is best done by government or at least a powerful organization or company that has the permission of the govt ie charter to become a monopoly. the earliest ones in d west were chartered companies and they used stocks to build capital. they were also responsible for most of the colonization that took place all over d world by western nations. these were "private companies" that started the slave trade.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_West_India_Company

How is it a subjective theory when it has been proven in almost every western Europe country?
When it was not an entirely private initiative, but a collaboration with govt. Why it has not been replicated in modern times.
Name them and public projects done by private companies for public use .



Please do not strawman my argument, im not here advocating for Laisezz-Fair economics, i'm asking why capitalism is not working in Africa.

mixed capitalism works in Nigeria, but the govt has failed to provide basic infrastructure for businesses to thrive unlike in the west where govt lobbies and offers tax-break to business come to their jurisdiction. The most capitalist person is a Nigeria entrepreneur who owns a metal fabrication shop-- that welder, he started his business without any loan from govt, SBA, banks, credit card etc. He provides his security, pays bribe to govt officials to get permits,provides his own water, provides his own power,provides his space, provides his own road to his workshop. Now, what's the role of govt in this entrepreneur's life? The problem with folks like u is that the govt has not done anything and you are saying that everyone wants a handout from the govt.

Again, why do you think it is appropriate to compare the interplay between the public/private sectors in modern, post industrial Europe with pre-industrial Africa? The reason i am using old examples is because [b]those are the only precidents for capitalism in a pre-industrial society


So you are saying that Africa should adopt a singular medieval economic program that has been abandoned. Builders of the railways were mostly engineers from US Army Corps trained with public funds. Show me in modern times where private companies built projects for public use ( i have asked this question up to 6 times without an answer.)

Every economy is a mixed economy to some degree, the united states increased its involvement in the economy mainly to stabilize the business cycle after the great depression in 29'. At that point the American economy had already developed in a largely unregulated enviornment.

This is counterproductive to your argument that private sectors build infrastructure. It's govt job to invest in heavy RD and public infrastructure. Imagine if govt hadn't invested in space technology, private companies could not have afforded it, but private companies like Garmin and Google are greatest beneficiaries.

Katsumoto:

Bail out is market action because government is acquiring shares. Subsidies, I agree, distort markets. Are you aware that subsidies to farmers in the US is tied food stamps. Senators in states with huge farms support it as well as senators in states with huge urban centers. Subsidies keep food cheap and makes it easy for the US government to feed poor families (income distribution and reduction of inequality).

As for your comment about nothing happening in the banking industry, perhaps you can tell us why European banks are sinking, what happened to Leyman Brothers, Merill Lynch, why Ireland received bailout to support its banks, why Barclays was re-inforced by arab investors and why Buffett invested in Goldman Sachs? The problems with banks were real. Under the terms of the bailout, governments acquired the shares of those banks. US banks returned to profitability while European banks haven't.

If Capitalism doesn't work, can you explain why China reduced its poverty levels (according to the 1990 UN definition) from 84% in 1980 (when it embraced state capitalism) to 10% in 2010? Make no mistake, capitalism encourages inequality but it also enriches millions.

china became competitive globally because of its biz model and control of cost of production.

What im saying here is that absolute capitalism is not suitable for us in africa, we need to pick and choose from the system.
A chinese engineer earns400 dollars/mth whilst his counterpart in europe earns 1750-2000 dollars / mth. labour aspect of production is relativel controlled , high popuplation and social values are main ingrdients for their success.


i told you b4, its called transfer of wealth from the public sector to the private sector.
Dont forget we discussed in the past political systems where i said western democracy is capitalism. if the economy becomes unstable the political arena becomes unstable. So its capitalism that is used to sustain their democracy.
In the west no govt toys with the banksor else you gone for life.

i tell you capitaalism is dead in europe.

Like i said earlier, have you ever stopped to consider that maybe development creates a better government before the government returns the favor?

When it was not an entirely private initiative, but a collaboration with govt. Why it has not been replicated in modern times?
Name them and public projects done by private companies for public use .

Toll bridges, toll roads, railroads, ferry boats etc.

The word "public" is an attempt to strawman my arugment. I never said private companies should provide un-profitable social services, thats not the way the free market works. The goal is profit, and as a result of this quest for profit important social/business needs are addressed and the whole country benefits.

mixed capitalism works in Nigeria, but the govt has failed to provide basic infrastructure for businesses to thrive unlike in the west where govt lobbies and offers tax-break to business come to their jurisdiction. The most capitalist person is a Nigeria entrepreneur who owns a metal fabrication shop-- that welder, he started his business without any loan from govt, SBA, banks, credit card etc. He provides his security, pays bribe to govt officials to get permits,provides his own water, provides his own power,provides his space, provides his own road to his workshop. Now, what's the role of govt in this entrepreneur's life? The problem with folks like u is that the govt has not done anything and you are saying that everyone wants a handout from the govt.

Until you explain to me why you think its reasonable to compare the post industrial west to pre-industrial Africa this point is mute.

You guys are way to quick to scapegoat the government, but you fail to see the utter failure of the citizens, especially those of us abroad. Was it not the government that payed for your education k-12 and provides numerous public colleges for you to pursue higher education?

England did not even have that when they entered the industrial revolution in the 17 century.

How is the government supposed to build roads when the private sector cannot provide them low cost companies to complete the projects? In the U.S the gov can contract that work to hundreds of different firms all offering the lowest possible rates, while in Naija the gov pays some of the highest contruction costs in the world.

The failure of Africa rest squarely on the backs of its people, the quicker we realize that the better.

So you are saying that Africa should adopt a singular medieval economic program that has been abandoned. Builders of the railways were mostly engineers from US Army Corps trained with public funds. Show me in modern times where private companies built projects for public use ( i have asked this question up to 6 times without an answer.

Does the Nigerian government not also train people in its school system? Did the british not train Nigerian to build thier infrastructure projects when this nation was a colony?

The only difference is that the Nigerian private sector has failed to incorporate this huge pool of educated people, domestic and abroad.... While the Americans did

This is counterproductive to your argument that private sectors build infrastructure. It's govt job to invest in heavy RD and public infrastructure. Imagine if govt hadn't invested in space technology, private companies could not have afforded it, but private companies like Garmin and Google are greatest beneficiaries.

Mute point. You are talking about space exploration and i'm talking about entering the industrial age in 2013.... do you not see that the situation is different?

The American private sector has given its Government a 14 trillion dollar GDP to draw taxes from... What have the Nigerian people given their government?

[quote author=pleep]Like i said earlier, have you ever stopped to consider that maybe development creates a better government before the government returns the favor?
Toll bridges, toll roads, railroads, ferry boats etc.


Simple question? name companies and countries?

The word "public" is an attempt to strawman my arugment. I never said private companies should provide un-profitable social services, thats not the way the free market works. The goal is profit, and as a result of this quest for profit important social/business needs are addressed and the whole country benefits.

U cited one historic example

Until you explain to me why you think its reasonable to compare the post industrial west to pre-industrial Africa this point is mute.

keep churning out egg-head jargon

You guys are way to quick to scapegoat the government, but you fail to see the utter failure of the citizens, especially those of us abroad. Was it not the government that payed for your education k-12 and provides numerous public colleges for you to pursue higher education?

Another uninformed egg-head. Govt did not pay for my education and all my mates who went to school with me. A tad bit of education, it was after 1999 elections that some govt started paying for primary-secondary education. Awo did in first republic. Also, parents still have to buy books, uniforms and school supplies.


England did not even have that when they entered the industrial revolution in the 17 century.
Want us to go back to stone age?

How is the government supposed to build roads when the private sector cannot provide them low cost companies to complete the projects? In the U.S the gov can contract that work to hundreds of different firms all offering the lowest possible rates, while in Naija the gov pays some of the highest contruction costs in the world.

Speaking out of ignorance!There are a lot of companies ready to build roads, but the govt is not ready to do.

The failure of Africa rest squarely on the backs of its people, the quicker we realize that the better.

Ineptitude and corruption, Nigeria business people are resilient and far ahead of the govt in terms of efficiency and delivering services.

Does the Nigerian government not also train people in its school system?

University education is not adequately funded. US is on top because of University education


And no the builders of the railroads were not all trained with public funds... railroads are not actually that friggin hard to make. The answer to your question is above ^ Toll briges, railroads, airlines etc.

Mute point. You are talking about space exploration and i'm talking about entering the industrial age in 2013.... do you not see that the situation is different?

Talk is cheap. Come to Naija and start a business and become innovator of ideas.

The American private sector has given its Government a 14 trillion dollar GDP to draw taxes from... What have the Nigerian people given their government?


Another uninformed post.Nigerians contribute about 80% to her national GDP.

w'are done here. Next

pleep: The difference between us and the Europeans is we look for a scapegoats for our problems while they fix the damn thing.

The examples are endless

For example; The British East India company, who bought the charter for India, making huge profits from the silk & spice trade before colonizing the subcontinent with their private armies. The British Government owned 0 stock in this company and only gained direct control of India after it nationalized the firm in 1857.

.... Even Nigeria was controlled by the private Royal Niger Company until 1899.

When people wanted to create business that were too expensive, or to risky to be financed by the government or the banks, they created joint-stock companies, which essentially consisted of several wealthy individuals pooling their money together and liquidating the firm when the objectives where met

while now, in the 21th century, Africans just complain that the interest rates are too high and sit around blaming the government.

You haven't actually given an example of private companies building infrastructure. Examples of British firms looting Asia and Africa is a really bad example. For one, they forced themselves on local populations. Second, they looted the countries they forced themselves on. They may have financed their voyages to those places but they didn't build infrastructure with their own funds. Please provide examples or concede graciously.

they didn't build infrastructure with their own funds. Please provide examples or concede graciously.

Concede graciously, are you kidding me look guys... i've given you enough examples, i'm not your fuckin teacher ok?
The way you people are behaving is going to make this discussion go left very fast.

What more could you want: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Indian_Railway_Company That was a british joint-stock company that built railroads all across India, privately financing everything.

At this point, take it or leave it.

pleep: Concede graciously, are you kidding me look guys... i've given you enough examples, i'm not your fuckin teacher ok?
The way you people are behaving is going to make this discussion go left very fast.

What more could you want: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Indian_Railway_Company That was a british joint-stock company that built railroads all across India, privately financing everything.

At this point, take it or leave it.

The most absurd and incoherent arguement! Provide names in US and western EU, u provided an EU charterd company that served as a conduit for economic proceeds from colonialism.
So because of this company, India is now a developed nation?
Let me remind you, the THEME of your argument is that African businesses are not doing anything to industrialize Africa and its not the job of govt to build infrastructure in a capitalist economy.

pleep: Concede graciously, are you kidding me look guys... i've given you enough examples, i'm not your fuckin teacher ok?
The way you people are behaving is going to make this discussion go left very fast.

What more could you want: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Indian_Railway_Company That was a british joint-stock company that built railroads all across India, privately financing everything.

At this point, take it or leave it.

Any corporation in the middle ages could have built small patches of infrastructure to support its enterprise when it didn't have to pay for labour (slaves) and land was free. Second, building railways is also cheap when you are looting. Who wouldn't build railways if your produce is free and you are using free labour? Why isn't the private sector in countries such as the US, UK, China, Russia, etc. building infrastructure today?

With the way, you are going about your argument, I wouldn't let you teach my nephew, let alone me. If you think private sectors should be building infrastructures, then articulate how and why a company in Nigeria could undertake major infrastructural development. So lay down all that is required and then explain how such a company will make its profits. Please be very specific; I want to learn.