Ray McBlue:

I don't expect you to understand or agree, but I will explain anyway;

The creation of the Earth is closely tied to the formation of the solar system about five billion years ago.

The solar system condensed from a huge cloud of gas and dust, with the Sun forming as part of the cloud collapsed in on itself under the influence of gravity to the point where nuclear fusion could begin.

The Sun’s gravitational field attracted large amounts of material, which formed a disc-shaped structure around it, known as an accretion disc.

The Earth, like the other planets, was created around 4.54 billion years ago when some of the material from this disc came together to form a spherical body.

At some point early in its history, it is thought that a smaller planet collided with this body, increasing its size and resulting in the formation of the Moon.

This above is purely scientific.

Nyt.:
Wooow, do I say I'm intrigued

Since u obviously forgot to confirm from the bible it states d "earth" was without form and void

Nyt.:
It doesn't mean earth had been created. Simply put the entitity to be called earth was without form and void

Without form - no shape (earth is circular)
Void - empty (ur model earth is probably empty with all those nuclear fusion)

Nyt.:
And God said let their be light
I skipped geography classes in high skul but I rememba dat d sun is the only source of light other bodies reflect light so prof wat else was created now?

Nyt.:
I'm here 2 learn and I tink dat link you discarded was quite enlightening if u had tried to read just d FIRST paragraph

Nyt.:
So how was d earth created b4 d sun again **stun me**

Nyt.:
BTW u shuld change d title of this thread since d fallacies are from poster-boy Ray get a life dude
***No harm intended***

Uyi Iredia:

To the extent what you propose isn't observable, it isn't PURELY scientific. Purely scientific doesn't apply to things that aren't repeatable because they happened only in the past.

Ray McBlue:
Genesis 1:3 And God said, "Let
there be light," and there was light"

That light was the Sun.

Ray McBlue:
Ray McBlue: H

I love controversy...craves it, infact, a place without

And on that note, my first official post is as foll
ows;»»OH, this is gonna be good«« a little 'versy now and then is one hell of a sh$t hole.ey peeps, the name's McBlue and it's good to be here. A Nigerian bestie recommended me to this forum and so far so good, it's an ideal place to raise hell.

vickyO: the events I mentioned were done as God ordered them. the parting of the red sea was ordered to pave way for the Israelites, the opening of the earth to swallow korah, dothan and abiram,. tsunamis and earthquakes are disasters but God being the owner of the universe used these events to help his children and punish offenders. can you scientifically use disasters for your own purpose

Freksy:

Genesis account was not written to tell us the how/detail of creation, but the order in which things first appeared from the perspective of an earthly observer, had man been there.

Freksy: "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth" - Gen 1:1
Beginning means the time when something starts; the first part of an event.

Freksy: Gen 1:1 shows that God first created:
1. the heaven
2. the earth
Question: What made up this material heaven? Were the stars (including the sun) not part of this material heaven? Certainly, they were!

Freksy: God also created the earth in the beginning. The earth was formless, lifeless and in darkness. Gen 1:1,2


Subsequent events were no longer about the creation of the material heaven and earth, but the preparation of the earth for life.

Freksy: At Gen 1:3, the preparation of the earth for life commenced. "And God said, Let there be light: and there was light"... This was light from the long-existing sun in the outer space, but the sun itself could not be seen through the overcast.

Uyi Iredia: The sun's motion was apparent. Even till date, we make the mistake of saying the sun rises and sets, never mind the metaphor. Joshua's error was unintended.

Ray McBlue:

The same old excuses and tactics of yore...

When backed into a corner, just claim Allegory.

Typical.

Uyi Iredia:

No, I meant Joshua made a mistake.

ifeness: Which god are we taking about here?

Dan_de_Numeruno:

The flying spaghetti Meat ball.

Ray McBlue:

I don't think so. The bible certainly doesn't think so, and neither did Joshua.

I'm pretty sure that when he made that statement, he meant it in a literal manner.

Just like the bible claim that man is made of clay in a literal manner.

Certainly, the bible is full of fantastic tales and claims that have no credibility in the modern world.

Uyi Iredia:

Literal or not it was mistake. I told you why: the sun does appear to move and even now we wrongly say the sun rises which isn't true. There are also many stories in the Bible that teach moral lessons despite being fabulous and there are stories which don't make as much strange claims eg the story of Ruth, the story of the Israelies kings and the story of Nehemiah amongst others.

PhenomenonVFX: LOL. This guy opens a thread and spills drivel. Then he creates alternative accounts to like his own posts. He is even giving himself 6 likes for absolute nonsense.
How pathetic ur condition must be that u have relegated urself to such underhandedness.
Keep on with it. U will be disgraced soon. Shameless dolt.

unmask: I liked all he posted......anything else?

Freksy:

Genesis account was not written to tell us the how/detail of creation, but the order in which things first appeared from the perspective of an earthly observer, had man been there.

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth" - Gen 1:1
Beginning means the time when something starts; the first part of an event.

Gen 1:1 shows that God first created:
1. the heaven
2. the earth
Question: What made up this material heaven? Were the stars (including the sun) not part of this material heaven? Certainly, they were!

God also created the earth in the beginning. The earth was formless, lifeless and in darkness. Gen 1:1,2.

Subsequent events were no longer about the creation of the material heaven and earth, but the preparation of the earth for life.
At Gen 1:3, the preparation of the earth for life commenced. "And God said, Let there be light: and there was light"... This was light from the long-existing sun in the outer space, but the sun itself could not be seen through the overcast.

unmask: I liked all he posted......anything else?

Ray McBlue:
Genesis 2:1 And the earth was without form and void, and the darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
This verse showed that he had already created the planet itself. It was without form because of the darkness encroaching it. The void meant that it was devoid of any life(it was empty).
You don't seem to know your scriptures, do you?

Ray McBlue:

Kinda made sense...

I knew that...

I object!

In the biblical context, heaven represents God's home, which isn't visible in the corporeal universe, so thus couldn't be the stars. In fact, Earth is the centre of the universe, if you take the bible literally.

Ray McBlue:
Joshua told the Sun and moon to stand still and they complied, implying that Sun and the moon were revolving around the planet. Now, how is that logical?

Ray McBlue:
What overcast?

To go further, you need to understand the concept of Space.

Outside the protection of our ionosphere, the sun rays are deadly. A direct contact with the Sun would cause severe radiation resulting to cancer and death. What the ionosphere does is to filter the rays and reduce the harmful effect without reducing the intensity.

What I'm trying to say is that no amount of natural overcast(cloud) would stop the Sun from peeking through, take for instance, even when the Sun isn't shining on daytime, daylight remains present. That's because, the overcast(cloud cover) couldn't prevent Sunlight from peeking through.

Bottom line; Your overcast theory is invalid.

unmask: what I love most about the chritian-atheist argument is the amount of maybes it generates


in the article referenced by vicky, the poster siad the earth could have been created in six phases and not six days

another person said all things (electricity, cars and maybe computers had been created, just waiting for mañ to find it)

guess some people should be reminded that christians persecuted scientists for discovering most of the things they used today.....calling them heretics.....

I actually thought someone will say six days meant sixthousand yrs

Ray McBlue: First and foremost Freksy, I commend you for the pain-staking effort you must have put in the above posts, trying to explain away the fallacious, inconclusive, irrational, invalid, incorrect, sophistical, unreasonable, scientific unsound commentary known as the bible.

Let me take you back in time, before the modern period began.

You see, the bible was so literal in it's implications that the bible scholars took it at face value. From what they could garner from the passages, the earth was the centre of the universe, while heaven is celestial(otherworldly, not of this dimension). Pursuing their logic, since the earth was the centre, Everything else is secondary.

In fact according to their comprehension of the 'holy book' God lived directly behind the clouds and if you were able to navigate past the clouds somehow, you would see God. The tower of babel Story proves my point in that regard.

Most Christian Apologists of today are quick to plead allegory, claiming that most passages of the bible are metaphoric and shouldn't be taken literally. Somehow, I don't see the poetic state of God as he created man from dust, woman from ribs of man, or when he sent tower of babel crumbling down. All these are biblical literal manifestations of God and shouldn't be further undermine by unreasonable excuses.

In the beginning God was very literal and clear as he could be. He created the heaven and earth, Heaven being his home along with all his angels and what-not. From the biblical context, he wasn't referring to the 'starry Heavens or he would have mentioned the stars.

The earth was without form and void, in other words, the earth was very dark and completely empty of life. Now how could earth be that dark if the stars were already in attendance? [Even in very dark nights of nowadays when moonlight is not visible, Stars, give out some illuminance of their own, thereby creating a mini-moonlight atmosphere].

When God commanded light to appear, in the physical world it could be construed as daylight coming to the surface of the earth for the first time. In a Scientific world only two things could hide Sun rays from reaching the earth surface - Eclipse(caused by the moon), and, Night(caused by earth rotation) - thereby bringing everything to total darkness.

So how come that the Sun remained hidden from the earth until God commanded it to appear? If God had already created it, it should have illuminated the earths surface immediately, don't you think? Surely cloud cover isn't enough to keep out the rays of the Sun from reaching the surface(?)

In that regard, the bible was very literal. It meant everything as it left it, religious, sentimental, supernatural. Trying to attach scientific back-up(connotation) or calling it a metaphor would only serve to undermine it further.
Biblical Earth precedes Sun and no amount of excuses would change that. It's what was written in the first chapter of The Book Of Genesis.