cocoduck:
OMG the extent people will bury their heads In sand. The evidence is all around you. have you forgotten what happened in Ghana the other day. when ghanaian authorities arrested Chinese people for illegal mining in Ghana. I bet you chose not To listen to their(Chinese ) stories of poverty and desperation. okay look at Chinese companies in Nigeria. they being their own people to do the work(menial) Nigeria are supposed to do. They were driven out of Cameroon for that at one time.

I asked a simple question and you start a histrionic display like a fishwife
There is poverty all over the world. You made a claim so provide us with evidence to back up your claim. I have not said it is false or true. Just provide facts. At any rate even if it is true it proves nothing.

When I saw dis topic, I knw its a thread 4 ELITES. It didn't disapoint because I just dicovered 2day dat nairaland still gat it in all fields! Kudos 2 d economic analysts in d houx!

When I saw dis topic, I knw its a thread 4 ELITES. It didn't disapoint because I just dicovered 2day dat nairaland still gat it in all fields! Kudos 2 d economic analysts in d houx! I have really benefited a lot frm dis revelation!

Ola one:
Imagine that! They devalue their currency so clandestinely and they want to lead the world economically by becoming an alternative platform to the dollar? I laugh in Mandarin

I have never supported Chinese model of govt nor their business practices such as devaluing their currency, however, I join them in saying it's time to De-Americanize the world. Chinese are no saint either, they have as much fraud and crime as the U.S., BUT the focus is more on the economic and what impacts us as global trading entities.

maximunimpact: When I saw dis topic, I knw its a thread 4 ELITES. It didn't disapoint because I just dicovered 2day dat nairaland still gat it in all fields! Kudos 2 d economic analysts in d houx! I have really benefited a lot frm dis revelation!

Do not be deceived what you see on display is mostly jokers who think they know a lot whilst in reality they know very little and therefore cannot profit from education

abubaka101:
China's current setup has helped move over 600m people out of poverty, Americas population is less than 400m.

Please provide the indices. We've been reading these nonsense stats since the 1970s. Russia claimed all kinds of figures until their own bubbles bursted.

Ola one:
Imagine that! They devalue their currency so clandestinely and they want to lead the world economically by becoming an alternative platform to the dollar? I laugh in Mandarin

That's where China is failing a bit, banking. With there monopoly in banking, also in petroleum and agriculture, they don't really have to fear any competitor.

0monnakoda:
I asked a simple question and you start a histrionic display like a fishwife
There is poverty all over the world. You made a claim so provide us with evidence to back up your claim. I have not said it is false or true. Just provide facts. At any rate even if it is true it proves nothing.

See you. You included this rider because you know the facts are out there.

Read more:
http://www.economist.com/blogs/analects/2013/02/chinas-poor

http://www.ruralpovertyportal.org/country/home/tags/china

BTW, I expect you to discredit these sources.

manny4life:

I have never supported Chinese model of govt nor their business practices such as devaluing their currency, however, I join them in saying it's time to De-Americanize the world. Chinese are no saint either, they have as much fraud and crime as the U.S., BUT the focus is more on the economic and what impacts us as global trading entities.

Exactly what I want. But alternatives out there are scarcely desirable. A case of frying pan into fire.

manny4life:

I have never supported Chinese model of govt nor their business practices such as devaluing their currency, however, I join them in saying it's time to De-Americanize the world. Chinese are no saint either, they have as much fraud and crime as the U.S., BUT the focus is more on the economic and what impacts us as global trading entities.

It is better to be with a known devil than an unknown deceptive angel. Why is it that they are the one calling for de-americanization and not other parties?

I don't see the need for these argument, I understand both sides, but here's my take on this.

Is China or even Russia ready to lead the world to order, answer is NO.

To become a global leader, you need a better Legal, Political, Economical, Militarily superb system in place, which right now, China seems to be lacking in almost three of them with exception to economy. For the world to accept China, they have to go through a lot of surgery because the world is changing fast and many nations are fast rising. Right now, the odds are against China that it is for the U.S., China isn't ready to lead BUT they are on the path.

The key issue here is should the dollar continue to be the world's reserve currency and what risks does that pose for those who hold their currency in dollars. Also the fact that most commodities are priced in USD e.g oil. The Chinese are suggesting that in the light of the recent squabbles in the US,the inability of the US to live within its means and with no plan to change its profligate course that the whole world is at risk because the US continues to "Print" money without consequence. It is basically living on "stolen" money each time it prints more dollars because the rest of the world bear the consequences. Any other country doing the same would face massive inflation. China is holding $1.3 trillion of US paper and has come to realize that that is very risky paper and it would like an exit path. That is the issue not whether Chinese folk can afford ice cream or air conditioning
Does leading the world mean the right to key the world economy permanently on to the $ and then just print off as much as you like? Bear in mind the difference betwen US debt being dominated in $ and any other currency. In $ in the worst case it can print any amount if push comes to shove. Any country with that kind of power should be expected to live within its means

0monnakoda:
Do not be deceived what you see on display is mostly jokers who think they know a lot whilst in reality they know very little and therefore cannot profit from education

Joker! Why not educate us? You are just an e-expert on "anti-postulations" on this thread.

0monnakoda: The key issue here is should the dollar continue to be the world's reserve currency and what risks does that pose for those who hold their currency in dollars. Also the fact that most commodities are priced in USD e.g oil. The Chinese are suggesting that in the light of the recent squabbles in the US,the inability of the US to live within its means and with no plan to change its profligate course that the whole world is at risk because the US continues to "Print" money without consequence. It is basically living on "stolen" money each time it prints more dollars because the rest of the world bear the consequences. Any other country doing the same would face massive inflation. China is holding $1.3 trillion of US paper and has come to realize that that is very risky paper and it would like an exit path. That is the issue not whether Chinese folk can afford ice cream or air conditioning

Why not let us know these alternative reserve currencies? What are your suggestions?

Ola one:
Exactly what I want. But alternatives out there are scarcely desirable. A case of frying pan into fire.

Yeah, the alternatives are SCARCE which is what I addressed in my post on the previous page. Back in 2011 OR 2012, when all the nations gathered at the UN for a meeting (all finance ministers), BRICS nations where discussing about a new currency they would use amongst themselves, but I don't know how far pr even how successful they are.

Ola one:
Why not let us know these alternative reserve currencies? What are your suggestions?

Why must I suggest? I do not pretend to be what I am not or to know what I don't. I know my limits unlike some patzers. Much has been written on the subject and that is available on the internet so you can exert some energy and educate yourself

ckkris: Please provide the indices. We've been reading these nonsense stats since the 1970s. Russia claimed all kinds of figures until their own bubbles bursted.

Here is a world bank report: www.worldbank.org/en/country/china/overview
Also note dat China's population was living in abject poverty before reforms started in the late 1970's. Politically nothing changed, economically they removed a lot of anti-liberalization policies of Mao era.
Do correct me if am wrong.

[quote author=manny4life]

Yeah, the alternatives are SCARCE which is what I addressed in my post on the previous page. Back in 2011 OR 2012, when all the nations gathered at the UN for a meeting (all finance ministers), BRICS nations where discussing about a new currency they would use amongst themselves, but I don't know how far pr even how successful they are. [/quote

Forget the BRICS! They are more or less toothless. Do you expect South Africa or even Brazil to engage America in a standoff? Impossible!

nitrogen:
It is better to be with a known devil than an unknown deceptive angel. Why is it that they are the one calling for de-americanization and not other parties?

Which is why my post addresses that China isn't ready to lead. Many other smaller countries would rather side with the U.S. than China or Russia which gives America an advantage. As for leadership, China or Russia aren't ready, but for the De-Americanization, this is strictly based on facts that Americas currency (debt and shutdown) pose a GREAT threat to the global economy. This is the reason they are calling it out loud.

Ola one:
Exactly what I want. But alternatives out there are scarcely desirable. A case of frying pan into fire.

Ola one has given links. Naysayers SHOULD also provide verifiable, & logical counter-opinions. Not just blind,clumsy, and often Arab-inspired anti-Americanism.

Billyonaire:

Obviously Absurd, the value of the dollars will not be largely affected except by speculation which will make dollars to temporary lose value. This shake down is largely on the macro economic level.

What will happen, which sometimes make me wonder if US politicians decide to default on purpose, is that, this is a legitimate means of decimating or outright wiping out of debts they owe other countries. Remember that Security and Bonds will automatically lose value and its like you had funds in America's treasury today and tomorrow, the fiscal dynamics renders your investments a total lost.

If America defaults, China and Japan will be the biggest losers, other countries will lose a lot too, and America will be free of much of the debts LEGITIMATELY, but also lose their fiscal ratings and credibility. The dilemma will raise another salient question: Where is safe for nations to invest their External Reserves, where is safe heaven for Sovereign wealth funds and again, which currency should replace the dollar as a universal legal tender.

A universal currency backed by all nation. It must be a new currency and every nation will have equal stack in it.

0monnakoda:
Why must I suggest? I do not pretend to be what I am not or to know what I don't. I know my limits unlike some patzers. Much has been written on the subject and that is available on the internet so you can exert some energy and educate yourself

Now you claim you don't know yet you berated us all for saying what you know nothing about? Tell us all you know about this saga. We want to learn from you

manny4life: I don't see the need for these argument, I understand both sides, but here's my take on this.

Is China or even Russia ready to lead the world to order, answer is NO.

To become a global leader, you need a better Legal, Political, Economical, Militarily superb system in place, which right now, China seems to be lacking in almost three of them with exception to economy. For the world to accept China, they have to go through a lot of surgery because the world is changing fast and many nations are fast rising. Right now, the odds are against China that it is for the U.S., China isn't ready to lead BUT they are on the path.

You are absolute right. China is NOT CAPABLE of leading the world economically and politically at this stage and USA, I believe could purposely elect to default in order to "get rid" of the burden of debts she has enmeshed herself. This could change the entire Economic Dynamics of the World, and reposition them to start all over again with a better Economic Model. This is more assertive since there is no other country capable of taking the lead.

0monnakoda: The key issue here is should the dollar continue to be the world's reserve currency and what risks does that pose for those who hold their currency in dollars. Also the fact that most commodities are priced in USD e.g oil. The Chinese are suggesting that in the light of the recent squabbles in the US,the inability of the US to live within its means and with no plan to change its profligate course that the whole world is at risk because the US continues to "Print" money without consequence. It is basically living on "stolen" money each time it prints more dollars because the rest of the world bear the consequences. Any other country doing the same would face massive inflation. China is holding $1.3 trillion of US paper and has come to realize that that is very risky paper and it would like an exit path. That is the issue not whether Chinese folk can afford ice cream or air conditioning

It has and should always been a vicious cycle, all that are bound to happen, just corrections are needed and everything is back to normal. That is why the business and economic cycles theories exists.

Forget what china has got, it is a disguise like the famous TROY gift, the implications on the economies of countries will be worse, China is nowhere near America at all.

0monnakoda:
Do not be deceived what you see on display is mostly jokers who think they know a lot whilst in reality they know very little and therefore cannot profit from education

That's harsh and a little insensitive, considering that u may not knw any of us, wat we do, or wat we knw. And also, there is no bad thing in sharing ideas and making a good discussion.

Chei..see discussion; Truly; i am a learner for here.
***sits on the sides and records the convo whilst sipping Baileys Irish cream...

The only solution is for Obama and co to raise the debt ceiling - and quick! After that, the whole world can start the debate on what would be best to replace the dollar. One thing is certain though - it cannot be another currency. There really is no alternative currency-wise. China employs deceptive tactics with its currency, the euro isn't stable enough, and the GBP would portend the exact same problem we encounter with the dollar - too much debt!
One thing is certain though: if they choose to default, China, Japan, et al will suffer huge losses - and that has its disadvantages.

olabukola: A universal currency backed by all nation. It must be a new currency and every nation will have equal stack in it.

I haven't heard about a universal currency, heck if U.S and her Europe allies won't be part of it, then such decision is DOA. What I knew back then was BRICS wanting to initiate a new trading currency, but guess what, I think they've been unsuccessful about the idea. Brings us back to the question

How do you DE-AMERICANIZE THE WORLD ?

manny4life:

Which is why my post addresses that China isn't ready to lead. Many other smaller countries would rather side with the U.S. than China or Russia which gives America an advantage. As for leadership, China or Russia aren't ready, but for the De-Americanization, this is strictly based on facts that Americas currency (debt and shutdown) pose a GREAT threat to the global economy. This is the reason they are calling it out loud.

Don't mind them, I am sure this post below stressed my opinion and I think it is the best.

Billyonaire:

You are absolute right. China is NOT CAPABLE of leading the world economically and politically at this stage and USA, I believe could purposely elect to default in order to "get rid" of the burden of debts she has enmeshed herself. This could change the entire Economic Dynamics of the World, and reposition them to start all over again with a better Economic Model. This is more assertive since there is no other country capable of taking the lead.

[quote author=Ola one][/quote]

Lol, the BRICS were just having an idea, I'm sure they've tried to come up with solutions but they have a stumbling block and that's why we haven't heard about anything (a new trading currency amongst the BRICS). Well, let's keep all fingers crossed, meanwhile, I know they can't stand the U.S. but military is another discussion for another day since I'm not too versed in their military capabilities.

Don Magic here, anti-spam daft machine banned me .

So if the Chinese dump the dollar what other currency would they opt for? The Euro is over valued and is currently buoyed by the German economy alone.


The Chinese also don't want to see a weakened dollar or a crashed American economy because the Chinese are the biggest investors in the American Economy and to a large extent China economy is highly dependent on the American consumer market. The sweat shops of Shanghai do more business with the U.S. than they do with the rest of the world.

Chinese investments in Treasury Bonds ensure much needed liquidity into the American economy which provides much needed capital for both domestic investments and spending and since China dominates the U.S. consumer market, this investment on their own part in the U.S. economy ensures that factories in China keep producing goods.

Billyonaire:

You are absolute right. China is NOT CAPABLE of leading the world economically and politically at this stage and USA, I believe could purposely elect to default in order to "get rid" of the burden of debts she has enmeshed herself. This could change the entire Economic Dynamics of the World, and reposition them to start all over again with a better Economic Model. This is more assertive since there is no other country capable of taking the lead.

That's one idea, then again, this is fiat money, the U.S. will eventually want to wipe out all her debt and start all again, however, I strongly believe this action will have serious and immense negative impact on them. My fear is that military action be be involved if this is the idea because a lot of the worlds reserves are held in the $$$, well let's see what happens.