The Roman catholic denomination people are lying of course when they say that Luther removed 7 books from the Bible! On this very thread I have also shown how their own "pope" Gregory, "cardinal" Cajetan* and even Jerome all "removed" Apocrypha books too.

*EDIT Meanwhile Cajetan was the one who interviewed (or 'interrogated') Luther in the wake of Luther's 95 theses; yet he too agreed with Luther about the Apocrypha! Yet people are lying about Luther. smh

try69:

Did anybody in the bible ever ask #olodo ukuts gp to wear trousers?

i know dat u people wil nt hv any answer?

Ukuts gp: i know dat u people wil nt hv any answer?

One needs firstly, a brain to engage in debates

Let us put the lies of the Roman Catholic denomination people on this thread in stark relief. Here are three extremely prominent Roman catholic denomination people also "removing" books from the Bible --- what they liars here are accusing Luther of.

Note the ranking of these people in the Roman catholic denomination

Jerome: Roman catholic denomination people call him a "church father"; he is the one who came up with the Roman catholic people;s own very bible i.e. the vulgate!

"PopeE Gregory I aka Gregory "the Great" --- a whole Roman Catholic "pope"! In fact the Roman catholics think so much of him they call him "the Great"!

"Cardinal Cajetan --- a whole Roman catholic cardinal; the one who interrogated the same Martin Luther

Yet all these three people also "removed" books from the Bible ---- just like Luther is being accused of here at least with half truths (to borrow the words of one of my crybabies).


Jerome:

"As the Church reads the books of Judith and Tobit and Maccabees but does not receive them among the canonical Scriptures, so also it reads Wisdom and Ecclesiasticus for the edification of the people, not for the authoritative confirmation of doctrine."


Per "pope" Gregory I or Gregory the Great

Just before referring to the Maccabees, he said

“With reference to which particular we are not acting irregularly, if from the books, though not Canonical, yet brought out for the edifying of the Church, we bring forward testimony.”


Per "Cardinal" Cajetan

"Here we close our commentaries on the historical books of the Old Testament. For the rest (that is, Judith, Tobit, and the books of Maccabees) are counted by St Jerome out of the canonical books, and are placed amongst the Apocrypha, along with Wisdom and Ecclesiasticus, as is plain from the Prologus Galeatus. Nor be thou disturbed, like a raw scholar, if thou shouldest find anywhere, either in the sacred councils or the sacred doctors, these books reckoned as canonical. For the words as well of councils as of doctors are to be reduced to the correction of Jerome. Now, according to his judgment, in the epistle to the bishops Chromatius and Heliodorus, these books (and any other like books in the canon of the Bible) are not canonical, that is, not in the nature of a rule for confirming matters of faith. Yet, they may be called canonical, that is, in the nature of a rule for the edification of the faithful, as being received and authorised in the canon of the Bible for that purpose. By the help of this distinction thou mayest see thy way clearly through that which Augustine says, and what is written in the provincial council of Carthage."



Now, according to the Council of Trent, each of the "church father", the "pope" and the "cardinal" would now be anathema because they all excluded books which the Roman Catholics include in their canon at Trent --- in 1546!

try69:

One needs firstly, a brain to engage in debates

stop bragging, answer the question.

Ukuts gp: If any catholic member can answer this, i wud rest my case. The question is, did anybody in the bible ever ask mary to pray for him or her? Waiting 4 ur answer.

KJV John 2:1-8
1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: 2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. 3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. 4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come. 5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. 6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. 7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim. 8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it. 9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,

Meanwhile, let us play the Roman catholic denomination people at their own game!

Why did the Roman Catholic denomination people remove books from the Bible.

Many of the liars on this thread are ignorant that versions of their own Vulgate included more books than the 73 that they now have and that they say anyone who disagrees with is anathema.

What is more, the Bible of the Ethiopean Church contains 81 books ---- why did the Roman catholic church denomination remove 8 books?

From another one I made earlier https://www.nairaland.com/1104124/problem-catholism-an-introspection/18#14940233

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible

The Bible (from Koine Greek τὰ βιβλία, tà biblía, "the books" ) is a canonical collection of texts considered sacred in Judaism or Christianity. Different religious groups include different books within their canons, in different orders, and sometimes divide or combine books, or incorporate additional material into canonical books. Christian Bibles range from the sixty-six books of the Protestant canon to the eighty-one books of the Ethiopian Orthodox Church canon.

Meanwhile, people please note another thing!

The above post again shows that the Roman Catholic Church and its apologists are lying whenever they say they canonised the "Bible" in the 4th century!

1. The Ethiopean Church was part of "the Catholic Church" of the 4th century; how come then that its Bible and canon is different from that of the Roman Catholic Church?

2. Jerome was part of "the Catholic Church" of the 4th century, how come what he believed to be the canon in the 4th century is different from what the Roman Catholic Church actually canonised in the 16th century?

3. "Pope" Gregory I lived and was pope in the 5th or 6th century; he was part of what was known as "the Catholic Church"; how come what he believed to be the canon of the Bible in the 6th century differs from what the Roman catholic church later canonised in the 16th century at Trent.

4. Even in the 16th century in the early parts, "cardinal" Cajetan lets us know that the Roman Catholics did NOT have the canon that they were only to set later in that same 16th century! Shortly, before Trent and the so-called "counter reformation" of the Roman Catholic denomination where they set a canon that included the Apocrypha, "Cardinal" Cajetan of the very same Roman Catholic denomination stated clearly that the Apocrypha is not part of the canon!


These matters confirm that the Roman Catholics are lying repeatedly on this thread.

Before I go to bed, one more thing people should note (two in fact)!

1. Jerome ('church father'), Gregory ('pope'), Cajetan ('cardinal') --- all Roman Catholics; all major Roman Catholics (all speaking before the Roman Catholics finally set their own canon) ---- all AGREE with the so-called "Protestants" about the books of the canon!

2. To clarify further, the King James version (originally and for a long time and still in some editions) took the same approach as Jerome, Gregory I, Cajetan as well as Athanasius that the books of the Apocrypha are not in the canon but can be useful in a secondary role. Thus the KJV used to include the Apocrypha but place them in a different part to mark their distinction from the main canonical books.

A further note of interest, even today, there are still "protestants" who use books of the Apocrypha in this secondary role.

The Roman Catholics like to muddy the waters, throw confusion and hope people will not notice their lies if they are not familiar with or clear on the history and development of the canon (or even canons) of the Bible.

What did you see?

And what are you seeing in your new "church?"

asco15:
The bible says that by their fruits you shall know them. what i see and observed in the cath ch shows lack of the spirit of God in the members.

Did any pastor in the Bible use the tithe and offering money to buy private jet?

Ukuts gp: If any catholic member can answer this, i wud rest my case. The question is, did anybody in the bible ever ask mary to pray for him or her? Waiting 4 ur answer.

[quote author=italo]Did any pastor in the Bible use the tithe and offering money to buy private jet?

[ /quote]

I think the question should have been did any christian in the bible demand or receive tithes

We have so many awesome guys on this thread

I think the subject of the matter now is the 'the bible and its books'

@Italo, the septuagint first compiled the ot and it has more books than you have in your ot today, do you agree with what they compiled?

If you do, why do you have lesser books in your ot today by removing some considering them apocrypha and whats the reason for the removal?

If you dont, then why do you disagree (with what they compiled)?

Dear friend,

Permit me to ignore you. I have found that truth is you biggest enemy.

One who serves you truth is only wasting time.

adsonstone: We have so many awesome guys on this thread

I think the subject of the matter now is the 'the bible and its books'

@Italo, the septuagint first compiled the ot and it has more books than you have in your ot today, do you agree with what they compiled?

If you do, why do you have lesser books in your ot today by removing some considering them apocrypha and whats the reason for the removal?

If you dont, then why do you disagree (with what they compiled)?

nnagozie:
KJV John 2:1-8
1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: 2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. 3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. 4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come. 5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. 6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. 7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim. 8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it. 9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,

does this look like praying through mary to you?show me someone wu ask mary to pray for him or her and u are ignorantly posting what is not even related to my question. U really amaze me

Ukuts gp: does this look like praying through mary to you?show me someone wu ask mary to pray for him or her and u are ignorantly posting what is not even related to my question. U really amaze me

Bros you are yet to show us where pastors in the bible collected tithes or used it to buy private jets

italo: Dear friend,

Permit me to ignore you. I have found that truth is you biggest enemy.

One who serves you truth is only wasting time.

Brother,
I don't mind if you ignore, divert or perhaps, change (or twist) the whole topic as these are your usual actions when facts are stated and you have no explanation or defence or just to put it simply, when you cant refute them cos when you attempt to, it will further expose the corruption and lies (half-truths) you advocate.
Well, I say thank you for all your replies so far as they have revealed hidden (not necessarily bad) things in the catholic church. I stand for the truth. God bless you and guide you.

Ukuts gp: does this look like praying through mary to you?show me someone wu ask mary to pray for him or her and u are ignorantly posting what is not even related to my question. U really amaze me

I have tried to show you where Mary asked her son for a favour even though Christ stated it wasn't yet time for him to. This is why the catholics pray through Mary to take their prayers(request) to her Son Jesus. Now you have to show us where it was written in the bible where CHRISTAINS SHOULD NOT PRAY TO MARY

nnagozie:
Oga that doesn't answer my question, by the way what's the name of your church? Your church has a LEADER/HEAD abi? Or is there no HEAD/LEADER in yours? And I didn't Mention I was Catholic and why did you call the head of my church POPE FRANCIS?

Sorry. the way you said sounded as if you were Catholic. Am JW. Jesus is the head(col. 1:18), no human takes that position. Body of elders direct our work in line with the scriptures as done in the past, not a one man's decision. Yours?

JMAN05:

Sorry. the way you said sounded as if you were Catholic. Am JW. Jesus is the head(col. 1:18), no human takes that position. Body of elders direct our work in line with the scriptures as done in the past, not a one man's decision. Yours?

Amongst the Body of Elders there will always be a leader/General Overseer abi?

nnagozie:
Amongst the Body of Elders there will always be a leader/General Overseer abi?

No. no leader. one could chair the meeting, just like James did, but he doesnt have the authority to over members. Any such imposition against what others say, can result to removal. of course he cant tell the secretary what to write, he is the same elder as u are, ur chairing the meetin doesnt change that fact. and chairmanship is rotational.

woky: @Italo


pls leave dis dude, their is nothing u wil tell him dat wil make him blv the truth for he has already made up his mind not to accept the truth.(even when its obvious)

argue with him from now till 2moro, it wil neva arrive at a compromise

I think the guy is more open minded than Italo. carefully read the discussion without bias. Italo keep repeating what the guy didnt say.

Happy feast of all saints!!!

answer to op; because xtianity is the most confused religion, so somepeople(pastors) feel special when they think they have answers, and others are wrong, not knowing that they are expanding the confusion

JMAN05:

I think the guy is more open minded than Italo. carefully read the discussion without bias. Italo keep repeating what the guy didnt say.

you have already don what you ask me not to "by reading their discussion with bias". Now re-read it again without bias and come and tell me what you observe..

Think.

That Pope Francis is the visible head of the Church on earth ddoesn't mean Jesus isnt the head of the Church.

That Jesus made Peter our shepherd Doesnt mean he Jesus isn't the Shepherd.

That Jesus made Peter the rock doesn't mean Jesus isnt the rock.

That Jesus gave Peter the keys to the kingdom doesn't mean Jesus doesnt hold the keys.

Dont let us start with JW as we did with Deeper Life o.

You remember how many times you people have lied that Jesus is coming back to earth abi? One time, when the date came and Jesus didnt return, your people lied again that Jesus had already come invisibly and had returned.

Take time o!

JMAN05:

Sorry. the way you said sounded as if you were Catholic. Am JW. Jesus is the head(col. 1:18), no human takes that position. Body of elders direct our work in line with the scriptures as done in the past, not a one man's decision. Yours?

What did I keep repeating that he didnt say?

Evidence please!

JMAN05:

I think the guy is more open minded than Italo. carefully read the discussion without bias. Italo keep repeating what the guy didnt say.

italo: Think.

That Pope Francis is the visible head of the Church on earth ddoesn't mean Jesus isnt the head of the Church.

That Jesus made Peter our shepherd Doesnt mean he Jesus isn't the Shepherd.

That Jesus made Peter the rock doesn't mean Jesus isnt the rock.

That Jesus gave Peter the keys to the kingdom doesn't mean Jesus doesnt hold the keys.

Dont let us start with JW as we did with Deeper Life o.

You remember how many times you people have lied that Jesus is coming back to earth abi? One time, when the date came and Jesus didnt return, your people lied again that Jesus had already come invisibly and had returned.

Take time o!

Seriously I am just watching this russell-the-wife-beater-follower

Shebi adsonstone has kept shut?

try69:

Seriously I am just watching this russell-the-wife-beater-follower

Shebi adsonstone has kept shut?

try69:

Exactly!!! This first is pure deeper life attitude.. Mr asco 15 is now God the ultimate judge.

Have you heard the word "theoria" and how it concerns theology in the early church?

Your problem is that you don't even read.

no b me talk am o! Na d bible wey una compile talk am. The person dat has d spirit of God can't go on committing sin like drunkenness, idolatory, immoral dressing etc as i observed in d cath ch.

italo: What did you see?

And what are you seeing in your new "church?"

Atleast, i dn't see people dress indecent, i dn't knw my members wit drinking alcohol and even d words out of dia mouth tells alot. D truth is dat i cn see a big diff.

asco15:

Atleast, i dn't see people dress indecent, i dn't knw my members wit drinking alcohol and even d words out of dia mouth tells alot. D truth is dat i cn see a big diff.

Okay, tell us the sins you saw among members of the Lord's Chosen. Or are they without sin?

By the way, it is not a sin to drink alcohol. Only drunkenness is.