OLAADEGBU:


Thanks for bringing this to his remembrance. He has probably forgotten. I just hope and pray that he smells the coffee before it becomes too late.

The guy is really messing himself up here. What a pity.

Where is this coward called IanDiamond who had to register with a new ID to debate me out of fear , lol.

Don't hide, come out MAN. MAN Up !!!



View IanDiamonds's Profile
Nairaland Forum / IanDiamonds's Profile
(Follow This Member)
Send E-Mail Message To IanDiamonds
Time registered: December 13, 2014
Time spent online: 3 hours & 20 minutes
Last seen: 11:11pm
View IanDiamonds's posts (7)

frosbel:
^^^^


I can't help you Pal, it's difficult to de-brainwash religious fanatics, you just need to stop trusting in man and read the bible for yourself to check if what your MOG is parroting every Sunday is true.

Alas, you won't , you are too fearful to embark on this journey to quest for TRUTH.

ANSWER THE QUESTIONS I ASKED YOU OR FOREVER HIDE YOUR FACE IN SHAME. I quote the questions again below.

.

honourhim:


Do you even know God? Is it not a height of foolishness for one who does not believe that God can cause a virgin birth to believe that that same God could raise Jesus from the dead?
That the same God could create such a complex world?
That the same God will cause the dead to rise from their graves on the last day?
Is it not a height of foolishness for you to believe the bible at all with all the miracles and mysteries recorded in it which are beyond human understanding with such a claim on virgin birth? Honestly you are a pathetic case.
If those MOG's you mentioned are agents of satan then obviously you are the chief priest of satan.

honourhim:

I thought you were wise but behold your foolishness stinks to the high heaven. If you were reasonable you shouldnt even be quoting bible. A book you dont know those who wrote it.
A book that tells you that there is a God living in heaven beyond the sky when you ve not seen that God.
A book that tells you of great miracles performed by God through his son Jesus Christ and through his people.
If you dont believe the virgin birth and believe in a God you ve not seen, and believe the bible at all then that makes you look so so foolish. Stop fooling yourself bro. Stop playing the middle game( standing in between christianity and atheism). It makes a mockery of you..

honourhim:

So your faith in the existence of God is based on emotion? Your faith in the resurrection of Jesus and of the dead on the last day are based on emotion? your faith in the many miracles in the bible is based on emotion? Be reasonable young man and stop messing yourself up here.

honourhim:


ANSWER THE QUESTIONS I ASKED YOU OR FOREVER HIDE YOUR FACE IN SHAME. I quote the questions again below.

.

Questions ?? Where are they ?


What I read is just a weak rant by a confused church goer.

Ask me the questions in a neat and orderly fashion so I can respond accordingly.

[quote author=frosbel post=28841059][/quote] you say the God impregnated mary? May God forgive you.the bible is clear for us to understand, the spirit of God overshadow her,a holy seed was implanted in her, the seed is called the son of God,even the demon called him the Holy one in mark1:24. mary was not the first person in the bible the holy spirit come upon.the bible make it clear that God gives life via the holy spirit in the book of job,in job 3:34
''The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the
Almighty gives me life.'' This make perfect sense because isaiah prophesied the virgin birth,and the spirit of God give life,however jesus is the fullness of God (collosians 1)

Read the following verses;
Luke 1:35
New International Version
The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come on
you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow
you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God.
Acts 1:8
New International Version (NIV)
8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit
comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in
Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the
ends of the earth.”

Should we say the holy spirit impregnated this people? (God forgive me) may God help those who your are misleading. Don't lie against the holy spirit, thank you.

[quote author=frosbel post=28841059][/quote] you say the God impregnated mary? May God forgive you.the bible is clear for us to understand, the spirit of God overshadow her,a holy seed was implanted in her, the seed is called the son of God,even the demon called him the Holy one in mark1:24. mary was not the first person in the bible the holy spirit come upon.the bible make it clear that God gives life via the holy spirit in the book of job,in job 3:34
''The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the
Almighty gives me life.'' This make perfect sense because isaiah prophesied the virgin birth,and the spirit of God give life,however jesus is the fullness of God (collosians 1)

Read the following verses;
Luke 1:35
New International Version
The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come on
you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow
you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God.
Acts 1:8
New International Version (NIV)
8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit
comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in
Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the
ends of the earth.”

Should we say the holy spirit impregnated this people? (God forgive me) may God help those who your are misleading. Don't lie against the holy spirit, thank you.

This was the second times am typing this, my post is mysteriously missing.

frosbel:

What students, students of what? and who is their teacher, I hope not you, lol. Paul's letters and epistles were written and recorded closer to the time of Jesus than Matthew and Luke. Does it not shock you that Paul did not mention one of the most important tenets of our faith ?? You try to sweep this under the carpet while stifling debate and expect people to just agree with your gross illogic for the sake of orthodox harmony. I say nay, Paul, Peter, James, Thomas etc never once mentioned a virgin birth because it is a LIE and a concept concocted very much later by so called 'church' fathers.

Since your argument still stands at "Paul never made mention of the virgin birth in any of his writings about the person of Jesus Christ." even though I had given an answer to this before, I'll try my best once again to try give simple basic answers.
You see silence on an issue does not necessarily build a case against it and Paul’s failure to mention the word ‘virgin’ does not mean that Mary was not a virgin. There are support to show that Paul was “alive and quite familiar with the Gospel accounts written by Matthew and Dr. Luke (a physician!)—and yet never questioned or refuted it”. A Christain theologist (Boice) also states that Paul and Luke were companions and that Luke wrote about Paul’s travels, yet there is no evidence of Paul rebutting this belief and Luke’s accounts of the virgin birth.
I think for clarity purposes, it is worth highlighting some points, *pardon my straw man*. Let's look at some differences between the virgin birth and the resurrection. As we’ve already seen, the latter was the focus of the Christian message and was also essential theologically. Paul wrote that ‘if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile’, but the virgin birth plays no such theological role. So the fact that Paul doesn’t discuss it doesn’t seem surprising. If still you're not convinced then the followin' questions should
How did Mary become pregnant? (Matt. 1:20; Luke 1:34-35)
How do we know Jesus wasn’t the son of Joseph? (Matt 1:18; Matt 1:25)
The Jews said to Him, “We were not born of fornication” (John 8:41). What were they implying?
In Jesus’ day, people were known by their father's name, unless his identity was in question. How do the townspeople refer to Him in Mark 6:3?
Why is Jesus’ absolute holiness so critical to our faith? (1 John 3:5; 2 Cor. 5:21)

frosbel:

Okay, I don't believe in the virgin birth but I believe in Yeshua. Do you consider me saved ?

Do you believe in the word of God?

Look at this dunce , grin , what are you talking about.

The devil is sitting on you. You have yourself fooled.
Please do remeber to format your copy and paste articles before you post them here, it's quite annoying and stressful having to align and format the normal Jibberish you copy and paste.

frosbel:


Questions ?? Where are they ?


What I read is just a weak rant by a confused church goer.

Ask me the questions in a neat and orderly fashion so I can respond accordingly.

You are running away from your shame. Your usual style. You have no reasonable answer to give. Period.

IanDiamonds:

Do you believe in the word of God?


The devil is sitting on you. You have yourself fooled.
Please do remeber to format your copy and paste articles before you post them here, it's quite annoying and stressful having to align and format the normal Jibberish you copy and paste.

brother, ignore him, he is an atheist, he got this write up from this site http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unreasonablefaith/2008/06/why-i-deny-the-virgin-birth-of-jesus/#comments

malvisguy212:
brother, ignore him, he is an atheist, he got this write up from this site http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unreasonablefaith/2008/06/why-i-deny-the-virgin-birth-of-jesus/#comments

see this one, I clearly posted the link and you are posting it again as if it was not originally posted, see what religious fanaticism can do to people.

honourhim:


You are running away from your shame. Your usual style. You have no reasonable answer. Period.

You have nothing to offer , get your thinking hat back on and come back so we can discuss further.

IanDiamonds:

Do you believe in the word of God?

What is the Word of GOD ?

The devil is sitting on you. You have yourself fooled.

Please do remeber to format your copy and paste articles before you post them here, it's quite annoying and stressful having to align and format the normal Jibberish you copy and paste.

Your comprehension skills are abysmal, go back and read that article again.

frosbel:


see this one, I clearly posted the link and you are posting it again as if it was not originally posted, see what religious fanaticism can do to people.

ok, I got your attention now, narrate the birth of jesus or yeshua, let here your own view, thank you.

frosbel:

So the early church believed the same thing and yet , none of the greatest apostles Paul did not deem it fit to be reemphazise this core doctrine for the future churches ? It was good for the early church but not good for the later church, right ?

The feeding of the thousand multitude, did they have to re-emphasize? No
The raising of Lazarus the dead, did they have to re-emphasize? No
Why because the single account was deemed to be perfect as the virgin birth only proved the divinity of Jesus.
In Conclusion
Objections against the validity of the virgin birth are based mostly on preconcieved notions - in the main, that the miraculous is impossible. There is no reason, other than pre-conceived notions, to reject it as historical; and to be fair, no reason other than own's own perceptions to accept it as such. It simply depends on our starting point.

I asked you a few questions but you either were dumbfounded with no answers or dishonest and dogmatic in your belief of myths.

Now, help me answer these questions again :

1. Who was the Father of Jesus, Holy Spirit or God the Father ?
2. Was Jesus an adopted Son to Joseph or a real blood Son ?
3. Show me in the entire old testament where mention is made of a virgin birth apart from Isaiah 7.
4. Why would a prophecy be made to a King about a specific event and be fulfilled in Isaiah 8 only to be again fulfilled hundreds of years later in a totally unrelated event.
5. If Mary thought Jesus was God and that there was a virgin birth, why did she ponder his words in her heart not knowing his mission on earth, why did his brethren not talk about it.
6. Why are the 2 biographies in Matthew and Luke contradictory.

Straw Man detected. Nevertheless I had answerd most of this in my previous posts under my previous username (BossTTDiamonds) before the Mods banned me for rebuttalin' an argument.

frosbel:


What is the Word of GOD ?

Then No you can't be saved. As it is, the devil is sitting on you farting and laughing while at it.

Your comprehension skills are abysmal, go back and read that article again.

See tis' half baked polytechnic graduate dey talk. What has tis' got to do with what I pasted.. You're level of insanity intrigues me to no end.

IanDiamonds:


Since your argument still stands at "Paul never made mention of the virgin birth in any of his writings about the person of Jesus Christ." even though I had given an answer to this before, I'll try my best once again to try give simple basic answers.
You see silence on an issue does not necessarily build a case against it and Paul’s failure to mention the word ‘virgin’ does not mean that Mary was not a virgin.

Hmm, okay oo.

There are support to show that Paul was “alive and quite familiar with the Gospel accounts written by Matthew and Dr. Luke (a physician!)—and yet never questioned or refuted it”. A Christain theologist (Boice) also states that Paul and Luke were companions and that Luke wrote about Paul’s travels, yet there is no evidence of Paul rebutting this belief and Luke’s accounts of the virgin birth.

You are a dishonest fellow, why not paste the link to the article from where you got this comment. Stop plagiarising friend.

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aiia/virginbirth.html

Anyway, let me forgive you and comment.

Paul wrote his letters way before the gospels so your argument falls flat on it's face. I repeat if he never questioned it or refuted it then he must have held one of the core doctrines of our faith in very high regard and reinforced it to the churches. Yet he did not , despite being the apostle to the gentiles. He left them in confusion as to the veracity of the virgin birth.

I think for clarity purposes, it is worth highlighting some points, *pardon my straw man*. Let's look at some differences between the virgin birth and the resurrection. As we’ve already seen, the latter was the focus of the Christian message and was also essential theologically. Paul wrote that ‘if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile’, but the virgin birth plays no such theological role. So the fact that Paul doesn’t discuss it doesn’t seem surprising. If still you're not convinced then the followin' questions should

hahaha, I am sure most of your church going folk will disagree. To them without the virgin birth Jesus would not have been sinless and therefore the following miracles and signs would have been inconsequential.

Paul mentioned the resurrection, atonement, salvation and many other core doctrines but not once did he mention the foundation of all these doctrines, i,e the Virgin Birth

Confusion has gone on a riot.

How did Mary become pregnant? (Matt. 1:20; Luke 1:34-35)
How do we know Jesus wasn’t the son of Joseph? (Matt 1:18; Matt 1:25)
The Jews said to Him, “We were not born of fornication” (John 8:41). What were they implying?
In Jesus’ day, people were known by their father's name, unless his identity was in question. How do the townspeople refer to Him in Mark 6:3?
Why is Jesus’ absolute holiness so critical to our faith? (1 John 3:5; 2 Cor. 5:21)

I don't want verses thrown at me, I want logical deductions based on these verses in your own words.

Waiting..................

malvisguy212:
brother, ignore him, he is an atheist, he got this write up from this site http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unreasonablefaith/2008/06/why-i-deny-the-virgin-birth-of-jesus/#comments

I know bro, I just want to take him to school. And probably advice him to go write Jamb again maybe he'd develop on his cognitive skills should he give the Varsity system a second chance.

IanDiamonds:


I know bro, I just want to take him to school. And probably advice him to go write Jamb again maybe he'd develop on his cognitive skills should he give the Varsity system a second chance.

Stop plagiarising articles off the net, it smacks off as fraudulent, I want your own arguments.

frosbel:


You have nothing to offer , get your thinking hat back on and come back so we can discuss further.

Again you are hiding from your shame. Answer my questions or forever carry the shame of your inability to answer them.

honourhim:


Again you are hiding from your shame. Answer my questions or forever carry the shame of your inability to answer them.

Is shame the only word left in your vocabulary ?

OLAADEGBU:


Birds of the same feather.

Noted....

frosbel:


Is shame the only word left in your vocabulary ?

No. Its exactly what you are displaying. When you display another thing i will tell you. Deal with your shame first.

frosbel:


Hmm, okay oo.

The Drunkard begin's to agree

You are a dishonest fellow, why not paste the link to the article from where you got this comment. Stop plagiarising friend.

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aiia/virginbirth.html

You're extremely stupid if you think I'd restrict myself to a single source of information. And thanks for the link you posted I'll be sure to read on what they have there. I would have listed sources, but the last time I did, I got banned.

*Modified*
I've gone through the link you posted and I can't find anythin' related to my posts. Do you smoke weed? Or is atheism driving you nuts. Please do see a doctor quicly you need medication

Anyway, let me forgive you and comment.

Paul wrote his letters way before the gospels so your argument falls flat on it's face . I repeat if he never questioned it or refuted it then he must have held one of the core doctrines of our faith in very high regard and reinforced it to the churches. Yet he did not, despite being the apostle to the gentiles. He left them in confusion as to the veracity of the virgin birth.

Dude I know the page where you copied most of your rebuttals from, the fact that I am not posting it here means I'm trying at best to turn you off your stupidity.
Now back to the argument
The bolded confirms my first assertion that you lack cognitive and deductive skills. Where did I state that Paul's letter came after the gospels?

I think I'll take the attack approach which 'lld yeild this question
If Paul did not write about the virgin Birth, does it prove the other accounts where it was written in the bible wrong?

hahaha, I am sure most of your church going folk will disagree. To them without the virgin birth Jesus would not have been sinless and therefore the following miracles and signs would have been inconsequential.
Paul mentioned the resurrection, atonement, salvation and many other core doctrines but not once did he mention the foundation of all these doctrines, i,e the Virgin Birth

Confusion has gone on a riot.

Your Insanity is quite annoying to say the least. Yes the virgin birth conforms that Jesus is a Diety but his ressurection is what brought about salvation. Paul did not have to mention the foundation of the doctrines because someone else had.
If you're a physics students and you're in your final year, would your lecturer go back to teaching you basic elementary physics? No, why? Because someone has taught you before. Even though it was paramount that you know the origin, someone else had cleared the issue.

I don't want verses thrown at me, I want logical deductions based on these verses in your own words.

Waiting..................

Then you're foolish for quoting bible verses answering other person

frosbel:


Stop plagiarising articles off the net, it smacks off as fraudulent, I want your own arguments.

I'd challenge you to prove this with solid facts and evidence

[quote author=IanDiamonds post=28861038]

You're extremely stupid if you think I'd restrict myself to a single source of information. And thanks for the link you posted I'll be sure to read on what they have there. I would have listed sources I cited, but the last time I did, I got banned

Fa fa fa foul, I paste links all the time and they work. Please use your own arguments or stop plagiarising off the net. Quote your sources or I will quote them for you.

Dude I know the page where you copied most of your rebuttals from, the fact that I am not posting it here means I'm trying at best to turn you off your stupidity.

Nope, if you are an honest person ( which 90% of Nigerian Pastors are not ), quote my sources if you think I cced off the Internet.

Pal, these are my own words and arguments.

The bolded confirms my first assertion that[b] you lack cognitive and deductive skills[/b]. Where did I state that Paul's letter came after the gospels?

I think I'll take the attack approach which 'lld yeild this question
If Paul did not write about the virgin Birth, does it prove the other accounts where it was written in the bible wrong?

Now you have shifted the goal post, lol. Well Paul was the apostle to the gentiles, was he not ? So why did he not mention this to his gentile church to buttress their faith ? Oh, he forgot, or did he ?

And why did the CORE Apostles not mention a word about this so called MIRACLE ?

Your Insanity is quite annoying to say the least. Yes the virgin birth conforms that Jesus is a Diety but his ressurection is what brought about salvation. Paul did not have to mention the foundation of the doctrines because someone else had.
If you're a physics students and you're in your final year, would your lecturer go back to teaching you basic elementary physic? No, why? Because someone has taught you before. Even though it was paramount that you know the origin, someone else had cleared the issue.

So who was the father of Jesus ?

a. Joseph
b. God the father
c. God the spirit.

Also, can you quote 2 prophecies from the old testament that talk about the virgin birth other than Isaiah 7.

frosbel:

Fa fa fa foul, I paste links all the time and they work. Please use your own arguments or stop plagiarising off the net. Quote your sources or I will quote them for you.

you are foul brained liar possessed by r€tarded ghosts. You copied 90% of your rebuttals all of which you did not edit, neither di you format them properly. Don't lie to intelligent folks, it's bad for your health.

Nope, if you are an honest person ( which 90% of Nigerian Pastors are not ), quote my sources if you think I cced off the Internet.

Pal, these are my own words and arguments

the bolded don make me laugh like say tomorrow nor dey. I never forget "You and your Cohorts". Mstcheeeeeew.
Now back to the argument
Someone already did quote your sources so I don't have to. Same way Paul didn't have to write about the virgin birth; because someone did.

Now you have shifted the goal post , lol. Well Paul was the apostle to the gentiles, was he not ? So why did he not mention this to his gentile church to buttress their faith ? Oh, he forgot, or did he ? And why did the CORE Apostles not mention a word about this so called MIRACLE ?

@bolded, I never knew we we're playin' soccer.
Believing in the death and resurrection of Jesus was what was pertinent, the Virgin birth was not a neccessity at that time. He was more concerned about the cleasing of the sins of the unbelievers and the salvation of their soul which was tied to the death and ressurection of Christ. How many times person wan repeat tis' one to you eh?.
Na people like you with Low understanding dey frustrate Lecturers for class.

So who was the father of Jesus ?
a. Joseph
b. God the father
c. God the spirit.

Also, can you quote 2 prophecies from the old testament that talk about the virgin birth other than Isaiah 7.

Another Straw man's fallacy

IanDiamonds:

you are foul brained liar possessed by r€tarded ghosts. You copied 90% of your rebuttals all of which you did not edit, neither di you format them properly. Don't lie to intelligent folks, it's bad for your health.
the bolded don make me laugh like say tomorrow nor dey. I never forget "You and your Cohorts". Mstcheeeeeew.
Now back to the argument

I quoted links to any articles I posted unlike you who tried to pass them off as your own .

Can you please post the links to any comments I made without references . Obviously you cannot because you are just one of those cheap fraudulent pastors with a half baked knowledge of scripture , coming here to spout total nonsense that does not add up or make any sense.

Post the links to my rebuttals or remain a Liar for eternity , lol.

Someone already did quote your sources so I don't have to

Same way Paul didn't have to write about the virgin birth; because someone did.

There is nothing christ-like about plagiarism.

@bolded, I never knew we we're playin' soccer.
Believing in the death and resurrection of Jesus was what was pertinent, the Virgin birth was not a neccessity at that time. He was more concerned about the cleasing of the sins of the unbelievers and the salvation of their soul which was tied to the death and ressurection of Christ. How many times person wan repeat tis' one to you eh?.
Na people like you with Low understanding dey frustrate Lecturers for class.
Another Straw man's fallacy

Mate , you are totally confused, I thought I was debating with someone who had a strong grasp of the bible or how on earth could you have come up with this strange statement ;

"the Virgin birth was not a neccessity at that time"

You are actually making inferences based on fallacy and not fact. You cannot assume something to be true based on ambigity.

Abeg go sleep jor.

frosbel:

Why would the story be made up? Perhaps to fulfill an old prophecy of a virgin birth, which the Gospel of Matthew cites:
Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (Isaiah 7:14)

Some scholars say “virgin” was a mistranslation in the Septuagint (the Greek translation the gospel writers used), and should have been translated “young woman.” That means the story might have been based on a mistranslation!

Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
A young woman giving birth would not be a sign from God, but a virgin giving birth would be a sign from God.

Now the mystery remains, who truly shagged Mary? Who fathered Jesus? Definitely not the holy spirit cos he don't shag. Guess we'll never know.

Good Old Frosbel now denies the virgin birth. Lol.

I used to say you were like a malformed baby boy. Having so many problems but still alive.
Now I realize that you are inching very close to death. If you are not dead already. For you deny the fact that Jesus is THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD. You therefore deny your salvation and have condemned yourself.

Oh! Frosbel! Who did this to you?
What made you this gullible and foolish to ignore the veracity of the word of God and daily fight against the very God you claim to serve...or have you been like this since? Have you always been a crafty serpent in our midst? Waiting to gain gullible trust and turn peoples hearts against truth?


Truth cannot be stopped. People like me are still alive you know. Too bad.
Truths victory is already won. Victory resounding through the ages.

OLAADEGBU:


Thanks for bringing this to his remembrance. He has probably forgotten. I just hope and pray that he smells the coffee before it becomes too late.

Its too late.

My guy denies the fact that Jesus is the Only begotten Son of God