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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus (8359 Views)
"What Does The Bible Say About The Virgin Mary?" / Question: Did God Fulfil His Covenant With King Ahaz? (Virgin Birth) / Final Dagger To The virgin birth Crap (2) (3) (4)
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Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by honourhim: 11:09pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU: The guy is really messing himself up here. What a pity. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 11:13pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
Where is this coward called IanDiamond who had to register with a new ID to debate me out of fear , lol. Don't hide, come out MAN. MAN Up !!! View IanDiamonds's Profile Nairaland Forum / IanDiamonds's Profile (Follow This Member) Send E-Mail Message To IanDiamonds Time registered: December 13, 2014 Time spent online: 3 hours & 20 minutes Last seen: 11:11pm View IanDiamonds's posts (7) |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by honourhim: 11:14pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel: ANSWER THE QUESTIONS I ASKED YOU OR FOREVER HIDE YOUR FACE IN SHAME. I quote the questions again below. . honourhim: honourhim: honourhim: 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 11:16pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
honourhim: Questions ?? Where are they ? What I read is just a weak rant by a confused church goer. Ask me the questions in a neat and orderly fashion so I can respond accordingly. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by malvisguy212: 11:31pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
[quote author=frosbel post=28841059][/quote] you say the God impregnated mary? May God forgive you.the bible is clear for us to understand, the spirit of God overshadow her,a holy seed was implanted in her, the seed is called the son of God,even the demon called him the Holy one in mark1:24. mary was not the first person in the bible the holy spirit come upon.the bible make it clear that God gives life via the holy spirit in the book of job,in job 3:34 ''The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life.'' This make perfect sense because isaiah prophesied the virgin birth,and the spirit of God give life,however jesus is the fullness of God (collosians 1) Read the following verses; Luke 1:35 New International Version The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God. Acts 1:8 New International Version (NIV) 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.” Should we say the holy spirit impregnated this people? (God forgive me) may God help those who your are misleading. Don't lie against the holy spirit, thank you. 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by malvisguy212: 11:32pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
[quote author=frosbel post=28841059][/quote] you say the God impregnated mary? May God forgive you.the bible is clear for us to understand, the spirit of God overshadow her,a holy seed was implanted in her, the seed is called the son of God,even the demon called him the Holy one in mark1:24. mary was not the first person in the bible the holy spirit come upon.the bible make it clear that God gives life via the holy spirit in the book of job,in job 3:34 ''The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life.'' This make perfect sense because isaiah prophesied the virgin birth,and the spirit of God give life,however jesus is the fullness of God (collosians 1) Read the following verses; Luke 1:35 New International Version The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God. Acts 1:8 New International Version (NIV) 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.” Should we say the holy spirit impregnated this people? (God forgive me) may God help those who your are misleading. Don't lie against the holy spirit, thank you. This was the second times am typing this, my post is mysteriously missing. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 11:37pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel: Since your argument still stands at "Paul never made mention of the virgin birth in any of his writings about the person of Jesus Christ." even though I had given an answer to this before, I'll try my best once again to try give simple basic answers. You see silence on an issue does not necessarily build a case against it and Paul’s failure to mention the word ‘virgin’ does not mean that Mary was not a virgin. There are support to show that Paul was “alive and quite familiar with the Gospel accounts written by Matthew and Dr. Luke (a physician!)—and yet never questioned or refuted it”. A Christain theologist (Boice) also states that Paul and Luke were companions and that Luke wrote about Paul’s travels, yet there is no evidence of Paul rebutting this belief and Luke’s accounts of the virgin birth. I think for clarity purposes, it is worth highlighting some points, *pardon my straw man*. Let's look at some differences between the virgin birth and the resurrection. As we’ve already seen, the latter was the focus of the Christian message and was also essential theologically. Paul wrote that ‘if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile’, but the virgin birth plays no such theological role. So the fact that Paul doesn’t discuss it doesn’t seem surprising. If still you're not convinced then the followin' questions should How did Mary become pregnant? (Matt. 1:20; Luke 1:34-35) How do we know Jesus wasn’t the son of Joseph? (Matt 1:18; Matt 1:25) The Jews said to Him, “We were not born of fornication” (John 8:41). What were they implying? In Jesus’ day, people were known by their father's name, unless his identity was in question. How do the townspeople refer to Him in Mark 6:3? Why is Jesus’ absolute holiness so critical to our faith? (1 John 3:5; 2 Cor. 5:21) |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 11:44pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel:Do you believe in the word of God? The devil is sitting on you. You have yourself fooled. Please do remeber to format your copy and paste articles before you post them here, it's quite annoying and stressful having to align and format the normal Jibberish you copy and paste. 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by honourhim: 11:48pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel: You are running away from your shame. Your usual style. You have no reasonable answer to give. Period. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by malvisguy212: 11:49pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
IanDiamonds:brother, ignore him, he is an atheist, he got this write up from this site http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unreasonablefaith/2008/06/why-i-deny-the-virgin-birth-of-jesus/#comments 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 11:51pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
malvisguy212: see this one, I clearly posted the link and you are posting it again as if it was not originally posted, see what religious fanaticism can do to people. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 11:51pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
honourhim: You have nothing to offer , get your thinking hat back on and come back so we can discuss further. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 11:53pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
IanDiamonds: What is the Word of GOD ? The devil is sitting on you. You have yourself fooled.
Your comprehension skills are abysmal, go back and read that article again. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by malvisguy212: 11:54pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel:ok, I got your attention now, narrate the birth of jesus or yeshua, let here your own view, thank you. 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 11:56pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel:The feeding of the thousand multitude, did they have to re-emphasize? No The raising of Lazarus the dead, did they have to re-emphasize? No Why because the single account was deemed to be perfect as the virgin birth only proved the divinity of Jesus. In Conclusion Objections against the validity of the virgin birth are based mostly on preconcieved notions - in the main, that the miraculous is impossible. There is no reason, other than pre-conceived notions, to reject it as historical; and to be fair, no reason other than own's own perceptions to accept it as such. It simply depends on our starting point. Straw Man detected. Nevertheless I had answerd most of this in my previous posts under my previous username (BossTTDiamonds) before the Mods banned me for rebuttalin' an argument. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 11:59pm On Dec 13, 2014 |
frosbel:Then No you can't be saved. As it is, the devil is sitting on you farting and laughing while at it. See tis' half baked polytechnic graduate dey talk. What has tis' got to do with what I pasted.. You're level of insanity intrigues me to no end. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 12:01am On Dec 14, 2014 |
IanDiamonds: Hmm, okay oo. There are support to show that Paul was “alive and quite familiar with the Gospel accounts written by Matthew and Dr. Luke (a physician!)—and yet never questioned or refuted it”. A Christain theologist (Boice) also states that Paul and Luke were companions and that Luke wrote about Paul’s travels, yet there is no evidence of Paul rebutting this belief and Luke’s accounts of the virgin birth. You are a dishonest fellow, why not paste the link to the article from where you got this comment. Stop plagiarising friend. http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aiia/virginbirth.html Anyway, let me forgive you and comment. Paul wrote his letters way before the gospels so your argument falls flat on it's face. I repeat if he never questioned it or refuted it then he must have held one of the core doctrines of our faith in very high regard and reinforced it to the churches. Yet he did not , despite being the apostle to the gentiles. He left them in confusion as to the veracity of the virgin birth. I think for clarity purposes, it is worth highlighting some points, *pardon my straw man*. Let's look at some differences between the virgin birth and the resurrection. As we’ve already seen, the latter was the focus of the Christian message and was also essential theologically. Paul wrote that ‘if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile’, but the virgin birth plays no such theological role. So the fact that Paul doesn’t discuss it doesn’t seem surprising. If still you're not convinced then the followin' questions should hahaha, I am sure most of your church going folk will disagree. To them without the virgin birth Jesus would not have been sinless and therefore the following miracles and signs would have been inconsequential. Paul mentioned the resurrection, atonement, salvation and many other core doctrines but not once did he mention the foundation of all these doctrines, i,e the Virgin Birth Confusion has gone on a riot.
I don't want verses thrown at me, I want logical deductions based on these verses in your own words. Waiting.................. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 12:01am On Dec 14, 2014 |
malvisguy212: I know bro, I just want to take him to school. And probably advice him to go write Jamb again maybe he'd develop on his cognitive skills should he give the Varsity system a second chance. 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 12:02am On Dec 14, 2014 |
IanDiamonds: Stop plagiarising articles off the net, it smacks off as fraudulent, I want your own arguments. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by honourhim: 12:03am On Dec 14, 2014 |
frosbel: Again you are hiding from your shame. Answer my questions or forever carry the shame of your inability to answer them. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 12:15am On Dec 14, 2014 |
honourhim: Is shame the only word left in your vocabulary ? |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Goshen360(m): 12:23am On Dec 14, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU: Noted.... |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by honourhim: 12:28am On Dec 14, 2014 |
frosbel: No. Its exactly what you are displaying. When you display another thing i will tell you. Deal with your shame first. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 12:29am On Dec 14, 2014 |
frosbel:The Drunkard begin's to agree
You're extremely stupid if you think I'd restrict myself to a single source of information. And thanks for the link you posted I'll be sure to read on what they have there. I would have listed sources, but the last time I did, I got banned. *Modified* I've gone through the link you posted and I can't find anythin' related to my posts. Do you smoke weed? Or is atheism driving you nuts. Please do see a doctor quicly you need medication Dude I know the page where you copied most of your rebuttals from, the fact that I am not posting it here means I'm trying at best to turn you off your stupidity. Now back to the argument The bolded confirms my first assertion that you lack cognitive and deductive skills. Where did I state that Paul's letter came after the gospels? I think I'll take the attack approach which 'lld yeild this question If Paul did not write about the virgin Birth, does it prove the other accounts where it was written in the bible wrong?
Your Insanity is quite annoying to say the least. Yes the virgin birth conforms that Jesus is a Diety but his ressurection is what brought about salvation. Paul did not have to mention the foundation of the doctrines because someone else had. If you're a physics students and you're in your final year, would your lecturer go back to teaching you basic elementary physics? No, why? Because someone has taught you before. Even though it was paramount that you know the origin, someone else had cleared the issue. Then you're foolish for quoting bible verses answering other person 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 12:30am On Dec 14, 2014 |
frosbel: I'd challenge you to prove this with solid facts and evidence 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 12:40am On Dec 14, 2014 |
[quote author=IanDiamonds post=28861038] Fa fa fa foul, I paste links all the time and they work. Please use your own arguments or stop plagiarising off the net. Quote your sources or I will quote them for you. Dude I know the page where you copied most of your rebuttals from, the fact that I am not posting it here means I'm trying at best to turn you off your stupidity. Nope, if you are an honest person ( which 90% of Nigerian Pastors are not ), quote my sources if you think I cced off the Internet. Pal, these are my own words and arguments. The bolded confirms my first assertion that[b] you lack cognitive and deductive skills[/b]. Where did I state that Paul's letter came after the gospels? Now you have shifted the goal post, lol. Well Paul was the apostle to the gentiles, was he not ? So why did he not mention this to his gentile church to buttress their faith ? Oh, he forgot, or did he ? And why did the CORE Apostles not mention a word about this so called MIRACLE ? Your Insanity is quite annoying to say the least. Yes the virgin birth conforms that Jesus is a Diety but his ressurection is what brought about salvation. Paul did not have to mention the foundation of the doctrines because someone else had. So who was the father of Jesus ? a. Joseph b. God the father c. God the spirit. Also, can you quote 2 prophecies from the old testament that talk about the virgin birth other than Isaiah 7. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by IanDiamonds: 1:06am On Dec 14, 2014 |
frosbel:you are foul brained liar possessed by r€tarded ghosts. You copied 90% of your rebuttals all of which you did not edit, neither di you format them properly. Don't lie to intelligent folks, it's bad for your health. the bolded don make me laugh like say tomorrow nor dey. I never forget "You and your Cohorts". Mstcheeeeeew. Now back to the argument Someone already did quote your sources so I don't have to. Same way Paul didn't have to write about the virgin birth; because someone did. @bolded, I never knew we we're playin' soccer. Believing in the death and resurrection of Jesus was what was pertinent, the Virgin birth was not a neccessity at that time. He was more concerned about the cleasing of the sins of the unbelievers and the salvation of their soul which was tied to the death and ressurection of Christ. How many times person wan repeat tis' one to you eh?. Na people like you with Low understanding dey frustrate Lecturers for class. Another Straw man's fallacy |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Nobody: 1:19am On Dec 14, 2014 |
IanDiamonds: I quoted links to any articles I posted unlike you who tried to pass them off as your own . Can you please post the links to any comments I made without references . Obviously you cannot because you are just one of those cheap fraudulent pastors with a half baked knowledge of scripture , coming here to spout total nonsense that does not add up or make any sense. Post the links to my rebuttals or remain a Liar for eternity , lol. Someone already did quote your sources so I don't have to There is nothing christ-like about plagiarism.
Mate , you are totally confused, I thought I was debating with someone who had a strong grasp of the bible or how on earth could you have come up with this strange statement ; "the Virgin birth was not a neccessity at that time" You are actually making inferences based on fallacy and not fact. You cannot assume something to be true based on ambigity. Abeg go sleep jor. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by johnw74: 2:24am On Dec 14, 2014 |
frosbel: Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. A young woman giving birth would not be a sign from God, but a virgin giving birth would be a sign from God. 1 Like |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by McSterling(m): 6:48am On Dec 14, 2014 |
Now the mystery remains, who truly shagged Mary? Who fathered Jesus? Definitely not the holy spirit cos he don't shag. Guess we'll never know. |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Joshthefirst(m): 7:07am On Dec 14, 2014 |
Good Old Frosbel now denies the virgin birth. Lol. I used to say you were like a malformed baby boy. Having so many problems but still alive. Now I realize that you are inching very close to death. If you are not dead already. For you deny the fact that Jesus is THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD. You therefore deny your salvation and have condemned yourself. Oh! Frosbel! Who did this to you? What made you this gullible and foolish to ignore the veracity of the word of God and daily fight against the very God you claim to serve...or have you been like this since? Have you always been a crafty serpent in our midst? Waiting to gain gullible trust and turn peoples hearts against truth? Truth cannot be stopped. People like me are still alive you know. Too bad. Truths victory is already won. Victory resounding through the ages. 3 Likes |
Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by Joshthefirst(m): 7:11am On Dec 14, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU:Its too late. My guy denies the fact that Jesus is the Only begotten Son of God |
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