malvisguy212:
■PASSAGES THAT SAY CHRIST DIED FOR ALL MEN;
■ WHICH IS TRUE? Well, they both are true (when these scriptures are used together), and they both are false (if one claims either one is true or the other). To say that Christ died only for His elect is to contradict the verses that say he died for all men, in addition to contradicting what Peter says by inspiration in 2 Peter 2:1-4. Peter talked about false teachers who were "even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves." He clearly states that those who teach such "destructive heresies" and those who follow after them will be lost, even though Jesus had paid the price for their salvation.
Others argue that if Christ died for all,
then all are saved. If He paid the price for all, then all have been redeemed. If Christ is truly the propitiation for all, then God's demands are satisfied for all. But they forget one vital detail: not all accept the gift! The debt has surely
been paid for all by Christ, but not all
choose to put on Christ (Galatians
3:26-27).
■ LET US LOOK INTO THE VERSE THAT BRING THIS TWO TOGETHER;.... Yes, You see, salvation is conditional. Christ died for all men, but not all believe and accept His gift of salvation. [/b]Therefore, this answers the dilemma of how Christ died for all men and for his people at the same time! Yes, he died for all men, and salvation is a gift offered to all men, but only those who choose Christ will have salvation.

1. I am afraid none of those verses actually say what you claim since Jesus Christ made it clear to His followers that He was sent by the Father only to the Lost sheep of Israel - [b]Matthew 15 vs 22 - 26. You see, the Kingdom of God which Jesus Christ brought with Him is in fact God's special Kingdom of Priests which He, God, promised to make of the people of Israel - Exodus 19 vs 6 - God's special Nation of Priests with which He will rule over the world with. So this is the reason why God sent His New Covenant and agreement and Law — the National Constitution in the Kingdom of God aka God's Nation of Priests — only to the sinners of the House of Israel. And in case you are thinking it cannot be true, remember that God does not lie and He does not change His mind.

2. Salvation is not conditional at all. And salvation, as explained by Jesus Christ Himself is from the curse of God's Old Law of Moses — Death. That salvation does not erase one's sin-debt however.

If Jesus died for our sins, only to come back again to save mankind, did he really save us in the first place? Heck! Did he really die in the first place?

What? A lot of what these doctrines have no bearing in Scripture let alone God's Truth.

malvisguy212:
■Jesus told some Jews, "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye
will do.... He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God." (John 8:44, 47). And later still, He told them plainly, "Ye are not of MY SHEEP" (John 10:26).
■ You see, Christ died for both the goats and the sheep. That is the gift he offers to all men, to the world. He offers everybody salvation. But not everybody has salvation. Only those who accept His gift will become "His sheep," and only His sheep will have salvation.if you chose to reject the free gift of God, is your choice.

1. The reason Jesus Christ told them that has to do with the fact they were steeped in sin with no way available for them to turn from it given they were under God's curse as a result of their sin deficit. The same Jesus Christ, in that very same context from which you clearly lifted those verses also taught them that if they would continue instead to submit to His teachings and commandments, God's Truth and Law in the Kingdom of God, they would come to Know the truth and the Truth would set them free from the sin debt they owed to God - John 8 vs 31 - 36.

2. I am afraid this is the wrong way of dealing with scripture — ignoring the context of the message in order that you can assert yours as you chose. In Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46 it is instead written that the goats and sheep in the Kingdom of God will be judged and either rewarded or condemned by Jesus Christ when He returns. Jesus Christ did not die for goats and sheep. No, He died for the sinners of the world, the Lost sheep of Israel, and those of them who become born-again go on to become sheep or continue as goats — stiffnecked unchanging sinners.

Did he not already die for our sins? Chill, what does he want again? What's the point of dying for people's sins only to come back alive again? How can someone in his right mind believe this fraud?

If your question is whether Jesus Christ was a sin offering, the answer to that is NO. However, it is true that Jesus Christ died for the sins of the Lost sheep of Israel... in order to afford them a path to redemption and eventually everlasting salvation.

First, what is sin? Sin is disobedience of God's direct commandment or teaching as indicated in His Law/agreement. It is a transgression of the Law because God's Law is all-or-nothing meaning that by disobeying one command, one is guilty of disobeying the entirety of the Law. In the Old Law, God provided for the people bonus tickets by which to have their sins erased — their debt cleared so to speak — and this on one day of the year, the day of Atonement, and this via the offering of the sin-offering. In the Old Law, we find the clearly expressed purpose and application of Sin-offering in Exodus 30 and Leviticus 4.

7 “Aaron must burn sweet-smelling incense on the altar every morning. He will do this when he comes to care for the lamps. 8 He must burn incense again when he checks the lamps in the evening so that incense will be burned before the Lord every day forever.
9 Don’t use this altar for offering any other kind of incense or burnt offering or for any kind of grain offering or drink offering.
10 “Once a year Aaron must make a special sacrifice. He will use the blood of the sin offering to erase the people's sins. He will do this at the horns of this altar. This day will be called the Day of Atonement, and it will be a very special day for the Lord.” - Exodus 30 vs 7 - 10

A sin-offering is meant to completely erase the sins of the people once every year.

To qualify as a sin-offering, Jesus Christ ought to offer His followers an instant fix to the sin debt which they come to Him with. Jesus Christ, God's New agreement, would need to be able to erase all of their sins without much effort on their path to be considered a sin-offering candidate. However, a close look at His Gospel reveals that this is not the case at all.

31 So Jesus said to the Jews who believed in him, “If you continue to accept and obey my teaching, you are my followers.
32 You will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”
33 They answered, “We are Abraham’s descendants. And we have never been slaves. So why do you say that we will be free?”
34 Jesus said, “The truth is, everyone who sins is a slave—a slave to sin.
35 A slave does not stay with a family forever. But a son belongs to the family forever.
36 So if the Son makes you free, you are free.
37 I know you are Abraham’s descendants. But you want to kill me because you don’t want to accept my teaching.
38 I am telling you what my Father has shown me. But you do what your father has told you.” - John 8 vs 31 - 38

In the passage just above, we see that the path to forgiveness of sins in Jesus Christ —for those who are followers of Jesus Christ — does not in any way mirror the sin-offering described in the Old Law, as those who follow Jesus Christ are individually responsible for:
■ putting an end to their bad ways,
■ repenting from a life of disobedience(transgression of God's Law), choosing instead obedience to His Truth
■ following continuously in the path of obedience to the Truth until one is made pure from sin — set free from slavery to sin — by the Truth
■ Attaining everlasting righteousness through the process of obedience to the Truth of God
see Daniel 9 vs 24

Jesus Christ does not erase sins. Instead, He is a path to redemption for all those who seek to be made free from the curse and burden of God's Old Law or Moses. The onus is on those who follow Him to use that path in achieving a life free from slavery to sin. Those who refuse to live in continuous submission and obedience to His teachings and commandments remain slaves to sin and are destined for eternal damnation as a result. This brings us back to what is stated in Matthew 26 where Jesus Christ reveals that He is the New agreement from God to the people.

27 Then he took a cup of wine, thanked God for it, and gave it to them. He said, “Each one of you drink some of it.
28 This wine is my blood, which will be poured out to forgive the sins of many and begin the new agreement from God to his people.
29 I want you to know, I will not drink this wine again until that day when we are together in my Father’s kingdom and the wine is new. Then I will drink it again with you.”
30 They all sang a song and then went out to the Mount of Olives. - Matthew 26 vs 27 - 30

Jesus Christ never insinuated that He is a sin-offering. Instead, He said His blood was poured out for the forgiveness of sins, a path to redemption for the defaulters of the Old Law of Moses — sinners of the House of Israel. Jesus Christ is not some sort of price paid for sins, neither is He a sin-offering nor a sin-eater.

An2elect2:
■ Well you using NIV to get another interpretation of the verses against the KJV, even when the KJV is more accurate...and reliable. The scripture says those who received Christ were born of the Spirit. They received Christ because they were born again. I should ignore this and settle for NIV "wrong interpretation" hehehe epic
■ Okay, Where does faith unto salvation and righteousness come from? How come one believes and the other does not (for example)?

1. Scripture also explains that those who are bound for the fires of hell are equally born-again. No matter what translation you choose, the Words of Jesus Christ, the Truth of God, does not change. It had not changed in almost 2000 years.

2. Faith refers to a life lived in continuous submission and obedience of the teachings and commandments of Jesus Christ. Only those who have resolved their sin debts are able to live truly by faith.

Righteousness refers to holy works one is only capable of only after one has settled ones sin debts.

An2elect2:
■ well this is simply not true. Yes there are archaic translations of KJV alongside modern translations that are simple to comprehend and have the same meaning. I don't have any problem undersranding the KJV and so do so many...so i don't see your point.You started talking about working out righteousness, first.

1. You seem trapped by the meaningless things. Why not go read the manuscripts instead if you believe so much that God is limited by human language.

An2elect2:
■ He is saying Christ died for every human being, and now it is left for them to accept or reject Him and His finished work. In other words God has made salvation available for every man and only those with some self produced faith can choose to believe and be saved while the rest can keep tasking themselves until they can manufacture enough faith to believe. He and others may not have said it exactly like this but this is what they are saying. I am saying that Christ died not for every man because if he did all men will be saved for salvation was bought by His blood through death for all those chosen in Him. There are so many scriptures that talk about God's chosen people and our redemption secured through the eternal sacrifice of God and not our wills. To say otherwise is to handle God's word ignorantly or treacherously. It is mutually exclusive to believe and teach that God has a peculiar chosen people for salvation and at the same time believe and teach he wants everybody saved. Not possible! No matter how hard men try to hide the doctrine of election, it cannot be hidden. It was expressly taught in the scriptures. If there was election then everybody is not going to be saved. Election means selection, making a choice. And this choice is made by no man or their deeds but God. Believe what you may that is what it is.
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

1. Your pastors and mogs don use lie blaskata una heads so tey, the kain wey they come out of una mouth no dey make sense at all!

Wetin be self-produced faith? Wetin be finished work again? Did you actually believe Jesus Christ had unfinished work that He didn't do even after He declared it all finished on the cross?