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Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission - Car Talk (3) - Nairaland

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Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by GAZZUZZ(m): 8:05am On Jan 08, 2016
mastro:
Very informative,
Another task that I know not to even think of trying grin

You read my mind.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 9:21am On Jan 08, 2016
mastro:
Very informative,
Another task that I know not to even think of trying grin

Surely not for everyone.

GAZZUZZ:

You read my mind.

LOL! But you told me earlier that you would like to get into it cheesy
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by kingreign: 10:21am On Jan 08, 2016
mastro:
Very informative,
Another task that I know not to even think of trying grin

Me too tongue cheesy grin
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Piyke: 6:27pm On Jan 08, 2016
And lo, a brand new transmission is born! smiley
Will actually prefer doing this than buying a belgium tranny. Just that I don't have the competence for now sad
Any updates on the test?
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by abuhubaidah: 9:01pm On Jan 08, 2016
Boss welldone oooo
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 10:05am On Jan 12, 2016
Tested the valvebody on Saturday. Worked like a charm before warm up. Then after warming up, shuttle and flare on 2-3 set in! I pulled the apply chart and located the solenoid(s) responsible for making the 3rd gear happen. Swapped it out with the ones on my working valvebody, problem continues.

On Sunday, asked mechanic to return solenoids to original valvebody and install. I was not there, and in the process, considerable atf was lost. On testing later, the flare on 3 remained, in addition to delayed shift. Apart from this issue, all other functions are perfect. I had the TCM 'reset' but erratic engagement is still there. I could not get atf on Sunday so, was able to top up yesterday, which corrected the delayed shift as expected. Now, am not sure if the reset worked as Toyota said only Techstream could do it tongue.

Is there anyone who has a Win7 compatible mini-vci?
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by GAZZUZZ(m): 1:28pm On Jan 12, 2016
You have installed the transmission already?
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 2:30pm On Jan 12, 2016
GAZZUZZ:
You have installed the transmission already?

Nope. For problem isolation in case of failure, I decided to test the valve body first. Any idea where to get the mini-vci?
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by GAZZUZZ(m): 2:49pm On Jan 12, 2016
Kashif:


Nope. For problem isolation in case of failure, I decided to test the valve body first. Any idea where to get the mini-vci?

I don't have. But kehinde garutec sells and might hire. 08080311100
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by GAZZUZZ(m): 9:38pm On Jan 12, 2016
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by mployer(m): 9:49pm On Jan 12, 2016
GAZZUZZ:


Wrong place to post.


ok. Edited.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 12:26pm On Jan 13, 2016
GAZZUZZ:


I don't have. But kehinde garutec sells and might hire. 08080311100

He is asking for much. I am sourcing from another means. Economy no pure; eye dey red everywhere! Thanks bro.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 6:37pm On Jan 15, 2016
I have procured a cable, which appears to do everything else apart from reset my TCM memory. Initializes the reset with 45 seconds remaining, and then at 39 seconds tells me reset failed. Reset memory not available for this vehicle.

GAZZUZZ, have you undertaken this procedure successfully with Techstream before? angry angry
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by GAZZUZZ(m): 11:47pm On Jan 15, 2016
Kashif:
I have procured a cable, which appears to do everything else apart from reset my TCM memory. Initializes the reset with 45 seconds remaining, and then at 39 seconds tells me reset failed. Reset memory not available for this vehicle.

GAZZUZZ, have you undertaken this procedure successfully with Techstream before? angry angry

hope you are using the most recent version? Disconnect car battery for 10mins and try again, if it does not work try another TCM
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Desmied(m): 5:23pm On Jan 17, 2016
Very interesting, I'm following.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 4:21pm On Jan 19, 2016
GAZZUZZ:


hope you are using the most recent version? Disconnect car battery for 10mins and try again, if it does not work try another TCM

I have version 9, but even version 8 does this well. I have one final confirmation to make - drive without the TCM cable, but will be during the weekend. Bros, disconnecting the battery alone, no matter how long will not cut this one.

The last time I had this issue, I remember the mechanic swapping my ECU after installing the replacement transmission, thinking the ECU was bad. When the 'new' one did not work, he reset mine and put is back, and the thing worked! My one-touch up window also received anointing. That is what I need to do again. Ogbanje transmission. tongue
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Hugoboi(m): 10:04pm On Feb 01, 2016
Following keenly.

I'd love to see the end of this rebuild.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 5:05pm On Feb 02, 2016
Hugoboi:
Following keenly.

I'd love to see the end of this rebuild.

We are now down to the '13 pin enigma'. I need to get under the vehicle myself!
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Hugoboi(m): 9:05pm On Feb 02, 2016
Kashif:


We are now down to the '13 pin enigma'. I need to get under the vehicle myself!

Lol. I went to change my faulty CV joints sometime last year only for the transmission to fail immediately the job was completed. The car couldn't even make it out of the workshop. Reverse was perfect, forward gears would engage but the car would remain static. No movement whatsoever.
After numerous consultations, the bottom line I got was that the 13 pin transmission was unfixable. I jejely parted with almost 300K for a toks to save myself from HBP. Still kept the old granny till this day. I hope you can pull this off. I really do!!
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 10:05pm On Feb 02, 2016
Hugoboi:


Lol. I went to change my faulty CV joints sometime last year only for the transmission to fail immediately the job was completed. The car couldn't even make it out of the workshop. Reverse was perfect, forward gears would engage but the car would remain static. No movement whatsoever.
After numerous consultations, the bottom line I got was that the 13 pin transmission was unfixable. I jejely parted with almost 300K for a toks to save myself from HBP. Still kept the old granny till this day. I hope you can pull this off. I really do!!

Wow! I have heard this a couple of times - U151/250/660/760 freaking out after Shaft replacement. Was the valve body dropped in the process? Do you have details of the job done? Acting up is common but losing all forward gear is bizarre.

I am neck deep; only a solution will do.

1 Like

Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Hugoboi(m): 10:25pm On Feb 02, 2016
Kashif:

Wow! I have heard this a couple of times - U151/250/660/760 freaking out after Shaft replacement. Was the valve body dropped in the process? Do you have details of the job done? Acting up is common but losing all forward gear is bizarre.
I am neck deep; only a solution will do.

Nothing was touched all through except the CV joints themselves. I was there the entire time. One Auto tech whom I was recommended to suggested that my technician pulled out the shaft from the transmission without letting the vehicle cool down. He was the opinion that cold air rushing into the tranny force-cooled the delicate gears within and subsequently ruined the tranny. While that sounded plausible, I didn't really believe if it was the case cos if it was, the reverse gear would have been ruined as well.

Another point was that I changed the atf after d CV replacement as some were lost when the shafts were removed. Everything went downhill after the joints were refixed. Right now the current tranny has thrown a CEL. Scanned and it showed Transmission Pressure Solenoid issue. Whatever that means!
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 10:00am On Feb 03, 2016
Hugoboi:


Nothing was touched all through except the CV joints themselves. I was there the entire time. One Auto tech whom I was recommended to suggested that my technician pulled out the shaft from the transmission without letting the vehicle cool down. He was the opinion that cold air rushing into the tranny force-cooled the delicate gears within and subsequently ruined the tranny. While that sounded plausible, I didn't really believe if it was the case cos if it was, the reverse gear would have been ruined as well.

Another point was that I changed the atf after d CV replacement as some were lost when the shafts were removed. Everything went downhill after the joints were refixed. Right now the current tranny has thrown a CEL. Scanned and it showed Transmission Pressure Solenoid issue. Whatever that means!

The service manual of this transmission states that the ring gear of the final drive if disassembled, be heated in atf to 95 degrees C before assembly. The bolts must not be tightened when this ring is hot. That is the only thing I have found since studying these transmissions that mentions temperature management (well, we know the effect of cold atf on hot transmission though). I am sure this part of the transmission was not touched in your case so, what happened?

If it was with the final drive, why did it not kill the reverse like you have correctly observed. I will research some more; hope you will provide further details if prompted.

Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Hugoboi(m): 2:05pm On Feb 03, 2016
Kashif:


The service manual of this transmission states that the ring gear of the final drive if disassembled, be heated in atf to 95 degrees C before assembly. The bolts must not be tightened when this ring is hot. That is the only thing I have found since studying these transmissions that mentions temperature management (well, we know the effect of cold atf on hot transmission though). I am sure this part of the transmission was not touched in your case so, what happened?

If it was with the final drive, why did it not kill the reverse like you have correctly observed. I will research some more; hope you will provide further details if prompted.

All you need to do is just ask. Like i said earlier, i still kept the old transmission. Any positive outcome from your rebuild project will be of immense benefit to me as well.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 11:21am On Feb 06, 2016
Yesterday, I went under the vehicle and dropped the valve body myself. I needed to be sure there was nothing wrong with the installation. Reinstalled and torqued everything to spec. (Getting that checkball body and spring to align with the separator plate is not easy o).

Reset TCM memory and tested. Same hickup on 2-3 WTH! grin undecided

Anyone with original Techstream? Not sure if mine is doing the job.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 1:10pm On Jul 19, 2016
Thread revival... grin

I did not abandon this quest; have been working in the background, but decided not to post anything anymore until I have gotten it to work. Over five months, I have been checking one thing or the other, buying one tool or the other, taking my time. I was buying the tools as the need arose. Each time hoping that one would pinpoint the issue. If it doesn't, an order is placed for another, which usually takes time. I eventually got it to work! However, two standard procedures were not followed - replacement of torque converter, and flushing of cooler line. lipsrsealed lipsrsealed lipsrsealed I have my fingers crossed!

One thing I know for sure is this - Toyota 13pin (U150/250) can be repaired successfully.

I will post my undertakings so far, as I remember them. Where possible/necessary, there will be picture(s). Stay tuned.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by MPVGoddess: 2:06pm On Jul 19, 2016
Kashif:
Thread revival... grin

I did not abandon this quest; have been working in the background, but decided not to post anything anymore until I have gotten it to work. Over five months, I have been checking one thing or the other, buying one tool or the other, taking my time. I was buying the tools as the need arose. Each time hoping that one would pinpoint the issue. If it doesn't, an order is placed for another, which usually takes time. I eventually got it to work! However, two standard procedures were not followed - replacement of torque converter, and flushing of cooler line. lipsrsealed lipsrsealed lipsrsealed I have my fingers crossed!

One thing I know for sure is this - Toyota 13pin (U150/250) can be repaired successfully.

I will post my undertakings so far, as I remember them. Where possible/necessary, there will be picture(s). Stay tuned.

Why didn't you do the cooler line flush?

No Kooler Kleen?

How about a combination of

Air compressor?

water using garden hose with low pressure?

And completing with air compressor?

Allow to dry properly then using?

What are your thoughts
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 3:32pm On Jul 19, 2016
MPVGoddess:


Why didn't you do the cooler line flush?

No Kooler Kleen?

How about a combination of

Air compressor?

water using garden hose with low pressure?

And completing with air compressor?

Allow to dry properly then using?

What are your thoughts

I did not want to disturb the system that much because I know the history of my problems. There were also no debris in the sump. I have air compressor, but not kooler kleen. I used it extensively on the valve body, which has been my area of concentration.

Was avoiding dropping the box also because I do not have a new torque converter. grin

You have kooler kleen?
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 3:55pm On Jul 19, 2016
After the reset did not work, I started looking for a 'better' VCI cable. Imported one, and the one I had appeared to fare better; seemed I just wasted my money.

Meanwhile, I have VCI cable(s) for sale at good price o grin grin wink

Note: There might be a little chronological variation, since I did not record these activities.

I was inclined to believing that my problem was electrical so I was expending effort in making sure I get the TCM reset. Techstream kept telling me there was not reset available for my vehicle. I would try and try again, only for it to say done, bla bla bla.

I started looking for Toyota's original Techstream scanner, which I got my friend from a dealership to arrange for me. They brought it home, and initially struggled with it because there was a communication error with the ECU. At that moment, I was like aha! that must be why my own software was not doing it. I was already drooling!! After everything, the memory was 'reset'.

I took off for a test and after the the second ratio came the rhythm I have become very used to. Shoulders and head dropped. I paid for the service, and set them on their way! sad sad

My question remained - why should two different valve bodies have same symptoms if there is no electrical fault? I was dead sure it was not in the box!

I checked all grounds - everything was ok. I checked for EMI, nothing. Wetin remain na to check for radioactive materials grin grin My ECU was increasingly becoming a suspect....

Then I started looking for hydraulic pressure gauge, to see what was actually going on hydraulically inside the transmission. Getting one was almost impossible locally but, Gazzuzz supplied one.
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Inception(m): 5:11pm On Jul 19, 2016
Kashif:
After the reset did not work, I started looking for a 'better' VCI cable. Imported one, and the one I had appeared to fare better; seemed I just wasted my money.

Meanwhile, I have VCI cable(s) for sale at good price o grin grin wink

Note: There might be a little chronological variation, since I did not record these activities.

I was inclined to believing that my problem was electrical so I was expending effort in making sure I get the TCM reset. Techstream kept telling me there was not reset available for my vehicle. I would try and try again, only for it to say done, bla bla bla.

I started looking for Toyota's original Techstream scanner, which I got my friend from a dealership to arrange for me. They brought it home, and initially struggled with it because there was a communication error with the ECU. At that moment, I was like aha! that must be why my own software was not doing it. I was already drooling!! After everything, the memory was 'reset'.

I took off for a test and after the the second ratio came the rhythm I have become very used to. Shoulders and head dropped. I paid for the service, and set them on their way! sad sad

My question remained - why should two different valve bodies have same symptoms if there is no electrical fault? I was dead sure it was not in the box!

I checked all grounds - everything was ok. I checked for EMI, nothing. Wetin remain na to check for radioactive materials grin grin My ECU was increasingly becoming a suspect....

Then I started looking for hydraulic pressure gauge, to see what was actually going on hydraulically inside the transmission.


popcorn go soon finish o!

1 Like

Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 8:36pm On Jul 19, 2016
Inception:



popcorn go soon finish o!

Oga you no want make pop corn makers chop? grin
Re: Rebuilding My '13 Pin' (toyota U151E) Transmission by Kashif(m): 10:22pm On Jul 19, 2016
Before going into the repair, it would be nice to have a little insight into the diagnosis.

One of the reasons there are issues with this transmission's 2-3 is because they are technically six speed - 1'2'3 lo,3hi,4,5. The three that is selected depends on the throttle pressure.

Initially, I thought that the flare was as a result of the 3rd engaging and disengaging but when I connected the pressure gauge to the C0 pressure tap, something else was playing out! When the TCM commands the 3rd gear, the flaring starts and at the same time, the pressure at this C0 tap, which should rise to between 54 and 60psi remains flat. It remains flat until the shift is completed. This clutch comes on from 3rd gear. There are other details I would not bore you with,

This threw up another puzzle - if the vehicle is stationary, and a scanner is used to command 3rd, the pressure rises immediately, and the shift happens and holds, no matter how hard you go on the gas. But once there is even 2mph on the dial, the flare is there! This got me pulling my hair! angry . I had to go back studying it's hydraulics. From what I was seeing, I could only blame the computer, or just electrical.

Meanwhile, I needed to travel to the east, and since I knew my direct clutch was not getting any pressure during this annoying flare, I drove it like that. The clutch would not burn! Who knows? It could clear after a long drive tongue. Well drove it to and back same way.

Then I called for replacement ECU. The first one kept the engine misfiring and started the transmission in 3rd. The second behaved just like mine - 2-3 flare. I got demoralised. So, could there be problem with these two?

It was time to get an oscilloscope!

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