yetseyi:
I need to ask some questions please about what i have observed about the catholic faith that makes me feel they are not following what the bible says.

1. Praying through/ with the rosary ; is it biblical

2. praying in front of those images (I really dont know if they are praying to them but i have seen people kneel in front of them to pray). I feel its idolatry.

3. Praying through saints e.g st Jude or better still saints should intercede for us. I once heared that in a catholic church I thought Jesus was our only mediator according to the bible.

4. why are people almost always being referred to historical books of the catholic church/books apart from the bible when trying to establish facts. I felt the bible is the final authority in all matters of faith and conduct.


I have asked these questions in the past fromcatholics and their answers mostly go in the same vein.....Saying how it is in a creed/ some courses/classes they attended or how some books other than the bible have said somethings about it or tellingme the history of how the catholic church became etc. Just a clear answer please.


I have never been a catholic though I ve attended mass before (they made it compulsory in my primary school) and I dont have any intention of being one.



I just need to know how the above relates to christainity, I am curious.
I need concrete answers please

Catholicism is an organized religion as I said earlier on. It all began in AD33 at the NICAEA COUNCIL, in Rome.
All they do is man-made.
No foundation in the bible.
Catholics claim to believe what the "church" says and not the Bible.

If you ask me, how can the Word be separated from the Author? If they truly believe in Jesus Christ, the Bible should always be their reference point and not some book or what their dogmas and creeds say.

mjblinks:


Please, do you remember the name of the books?

Nt really. It happened in 2010. Bt if u r rili interested, I can ask my mum if she has his contacts so I can ask him.

dumo1:

if u want an in depth knowledge of d bible. Take a bible study with the Jehovah's witnesses then decide on ur own if u wanna join them or not.

Pple who wld rather allow their family & loved ones die because blood transfusion is a taboo 2 dem? I tnk nt.

gemale:

Nt really. It happened in 2010. Bt if u r rili interested, I can ask my mum if she has his contacts so I can ask him.

Am interested. Thanks

yetseyi:
I need to ask some questions please about what i have observed about the catholic faith that makes me feel they are not following what the bible says.

1. Praying through/ with the rosary ; is it biblical

2. praying in front of those images (I really dont know if they are praying to them but i have seen people kneel in front of them to pray). I feel its idolatry.

3. Praying through saints e.g st Jude or better still saints should intercede for us. I once heared that in a catholic church I thought Jesus was our only mediator according to the bible.

4. why are people almost always being referred to historical books of the catholic church/books apart from the bible when trying to establish facts. I felt the bible is the final authority in all matters of faith and conduct.


I have asked these questions in the past fromcatholics and their answers mostly go in the same vein.....Saying how it is in a creed/ some courses/classes they attended or how some books other than the bible have said somethings about it or tellingme the history of how the catholic church became etc. Just a clear answer please.


I have never been a catholic though I ve attended mass before (they made it compulsory in my primary school) and I dont have any intention of being one.
2. D church doesn't teach idolatry. I have never heard a priest telling anyone 2 bow b4 any image. D presence of images in d church is 2 bring 2 our minds reminders of D articles of our faith. U understand dt 2 make xtianity seem less abstract, D use of symbols r somtyms employed eg d printed Bible is just lyk any oda book in make & appearance bt I can bet dt u dnt treat it lyk ur oda books.
3. We ask Saints 2 pray 4 us d same way non Catholic xtian ask their fellow brethren 2 raise prayers of intercession 4 Dem. D fact dey r in heaven doesn't stop dem 4rn doing dt because we blv in d communion of Saints.
4. U r referring 2 D canons of D church. Jesus didn't intend 4 his church 2 b a monolithic institution. D church is a living, growing & constantly reforming entity. As @ when Jesus ascended in2 heaven, dere was no Bible. Until d death of D apostles, dere was no Bible. So hw come d bible came in2 existence? Go & look it up. D Catholic church compiled d bible. So d church wasn't a product of D bible rather it was d oda way round. So if non Catholics accept d bible as being of God, y can't dey accept oda writings of D church as d word of God too? D fact is dt Jesus didn't in d 3 years of His earthly ministry reveal all d mysteries of D Kingdom of heaven. He gave us d basics promising 2 send d Holy Spirit, who wld reveal & teach all things. It is by d guidance of dis spirit dt d church makes subsequent revelations on spiritual matters. Attempting 2 cast aspersions 2 these revelations is d sin of apostasy because Jesus Himself assured us dt d gates of hell shall prevail against her (his church).

I just need to know how the above relates to christainity, I am curious.
I need concrete answers please

1. D rosary is biblical. It includes d Lord's prayer, hail Mary (also biblical in origin), glory be (in honor of D Trinity), the mysteries (biblically originated)... Refer 2 oda parts in d quote above. Sorry.

I recommend Grace of God mission, assemblies of God, deeper life, omega fire ministries or redeem,

I have listened to all of the arguements here and i just want to comment on those people who want to sometimes out of ignorance, and other times out of share hatred for the catholic church, blame the catholic church for the decline of christianity in the minds and hearts of some christians.

First of all, i want to say that i was born into a catholic home, but today, i do not identify as christian not to talk of catholic. Unlike the other people to the left: atheists, agnostics, skeptics etc, i still respect religion because of some of its positive contributions to the world. I am still very much interested in religion only on the intellectual level of it. On the spiritual level, count me out. The message of christianity (note, not catholic), like all the other religions, do not have profound power and effect with me. I am noy trying to be a catholic apologist here, but let me address some of the issues some of you mentioned here.

To those who say the fact that some ex-catholics are now atheists or whatever and like this lady, experiencing a 'dry moment', well there is one thing you are not understanding.

There is nothing more wrong with the catholic faith than there are with winners, jehovah's withnesses, et al. If you have more catholics losing their christian faith, then it is because there is a general trend in the christian world. Englightenment! Catholics are still the single largest christian denomination, so it makes sense that there will be more of them among the atheist converts.

Another reason is...the part of the world where the catholic church dominates, is the part of the world that has given more to education than the other parts of the christian world. The kind of edication they have given to themselves is that which lives true to its philosophy of freedom and democracy. This sort of education inculcates in the one who acquires it, the ability to think freely and question what has been taught before. This education makes it almost impossible for the christian faith and all other kinds of faith to have so much convincing power with the student.

If you want to continue to insist there is something wrong with the catholic faith, then i would ask you to look more closely at the UK, a protestant Anglican country. The UK has some of the most radical atheists you can ever find. Is the catholic church responsible for their lack of christain faith too, especially when they do not have a catholic root but an anglican one?

It is true that the US, a pentecostal country, is the most religious part of the developed world. But studies have shown that almost 60percent of Americans favour gay marriage and that number is up from about 40percent in the last decade. This is making a statement that the US, a pentecostal country, is embracing athiesm, agnosticism and secular humanism. So the question i ask is this: is the catholic church/faith responsible for the decline of the christian power in the US? Obama and Hilary clinton believe gay people should get married. These people have a pentecostal background, but they also believe that gay people should also get married! Is the catholic faith what's responsible for these two politican's belief?

Anyone who says the outflock of catholic christians from the christian Ummah only shows the falsehood of the catholic church, is either ignorant or just a hateful person.

Mariner007:
ersdd


Catholicism is an organized religion as I said earlier on. It all began in AD33 at the NICAEA COUNCIL, in Rome.
All they do is man-made.
No foundation in the bible.
Catholics claim to believe what the "church" says and not the Bible.

If you ask me, how can the Word be separated from the Author? If they truly believe in Jesus Christ, the Bible should always be their reference point and not some book or what their dogmas and creeds say.

it seems you don't even know your history enough. The council of Nicea was not in the year AD33. It was inm the year AD325. You can look up this info on google and if you discover your mistake, then i want you to be sure that all the other assertions you made here are wrong too.

craziebone:


it seems you don't even know your history enough. The council of Nicea was not in the year AD33. It was inm the year AD325. You can look up this info on google and if you discover your mistake, then i want you to be sure that all the other assertions you made here are wrong too.

Sorry, meant AD325. Don't know why I got AD33 stuck in my head

The Trinity
The word "trinity" is a term used to denote the so-called Christian doctrine that God exists as a unity of three distinct persons or personalities: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. If this is the case, then which of the three do we worship and which one do we pray to?

You will hear the answer: “Pray to the Father in the Name of the Son.” But then most denominations pray “in the name of the Father, Son, AND Holy Ghost?”

Where’s the truth in all this?

A bit of history:

The “Holy Trinity” was introduced to Christianity by Constantine, a Roman Emperor, in the year 325 AD. Constantine had the appearance of being a Christian because he stopped the mass slaughter of Christians, painted a cross on the shields of his army, and erected a cross on top of St. Sophia’s Church. In reality, he was not a Christian, but a master politician.



Just before a battle with the rival Roman, Maxentius, Constantine had a dream in which he was instructed to paint a cross on the shields of his soldiers. He was against overwhelming odds, being outnumbered two-to-one, but he followed the instructions and won the battle. He saw that there was something special about Christianity, and recognized the prayers of Christians as a powerful ally as emperor.

Constantine, a practicing pagan, hosted the first ecumenical council in Nicaea Rome, AD 325, where he brought Christian sects and pagan idolatry together. The meeting, dubbed the “Nicene Council,” worked out the differences between competing groups of Christianity, joined church and state, and gave power to a universal church. There were primarily two rival Christian factions that Constantine was bringing together. One faction considered Jesus divine. The other considered Jesus a created being, and therefore less than God. After heated arguments and a lot of political wrangling, the result was the agreement that the Son was the true God, co-eternal with the Father, and begotten from the same substance as the Father. This made Jesus “co-equal” with God. The platform was set for the “Holy Trinity” to be accepted by most sects of Christianity.


Here is the first “Nicene Creed” drafted and implemented by the Nicene Council.


We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of all things visible and invisible.

And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, begotten of the Father [the only-begotten; that is, of the essence of the Father, God of God,] Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father;

By whom all things were made [both in heaven and on earth];

Who for us men, and for our salvation, came down and was incarnate and was made man;

He suffered, and the third day he rose again, ascended into heaven;

From thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.

And in the Holy Ghost.

[But those who say: ‘There was a time when he was not;’ and ‘He was not before he was made;’ and ‘He was made out of nothing,’ or ‘He is of another substance’ or ‘essence,’ or ‘The Son of God is created,’ or ‘changeable,’ or ‘alterable’—they are condemned by the holy catholic and apostolic Church.]

With the newly-given power, the creeds were enforced with the penalty of banishment, torture, and death. Soon, the world plunged into the Dark Ages, where more than 68 million people were killed in the titles of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost (The Glorious Reformation, Schmucker, 1838).



Here is a short explanation of the Godhead from the book, “An Exposition Of The Seven Church Ages,” Chapter 1.


They didn't believe in three Gods in the beginning of the church. You can't find that sort of belief amongst the apostles. It was after the apostolic age that this theory came in and really became an issue and a cardinal doctrine at the Nicene Council. The doctrine of Godhead caused a two way split at Nicaea. And from that split there came two extremes. One actually went into polytheism, believing in three Gods, and the others went into unitarianism. Of course that was a little while in coming about, but it did, and we have it right today. But the Revelation through John by the Spirit to the churches was, "I am the Lord Jesus Christ, and I am ALL of it. There isn't any other God". And He put His seal on this Revelation.

Consider this: Who was the Father of Jesus? Matthew 1:18 says, "She was found with child of the Holy Ghost". But Jesus, Himself, claimed that God was His Father. God the Father and God the Holy Ghost, as we often express these terms, make the Father and the Spirit ONE. Indeed they are, or else Jesus had two Fathers. But notice that Jesus said that He and His Father were One--not two. That makes ONE God.

Since this is historically and Scripturally true, people wonder where the three came from. It became a foundational doctrine at the Nicene Council in 325 A.D. This trinity (an absolutely unscriptural word) was based upon the many gods of Rome. The Romans had many gods to whom they prayed. They also prayed to ancestors as mediators. It was just a step to give new names to old gods, so we have saints to make it more Biblical. Thus, instead of Jupiter, Venice, Mars, etc., we have Paul, Peter, Fatima, Christopher, etc., etc. They could not make their pagan religion work out with just one God, so they split Him up into three, and they made intercessors of the saints as they had made intercessors of their ancestors.

Ever since then people have failed to realize that there is just one God with three offices or manifestations. They know there is one God according to Scripture, but they try to make it the fantastic theory that God is like a bunch of grapes; three persons with the same Divinity shared equally by all. But it plainly says here in Revelation that Jesus is "That Which Is", "That Which Was", and "That Which Is to Come". He is the "Alpha and Omega", which means that He is the "A to Z" or THE ALL OF IT. He is everything--the Almighty. He is the Rose of Sharon, the Lily of the Valley, the Bright and Morning Star, the Righteous Branch, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. He is God, Almighty God. ONE GOD.

I Timothy 3:16 says, "And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into Glory". This is what the Bible says. It doesn't say a thing about a first or second or third person here. It says God was manifest in flesh. One God. That ONE GOD was manifested in flesh. That ought to settle it. God came in a human form. That didn't make Him ANOTHER GOD. HE WAS GOD, THE SAME GOD. It was a revelation then, and it is a revelation now. One God.

Although “The Holy Trinity” has endured through the ages by the merciless hand of the Catholic Church, it is never mentioned in the Bible and neither was this concept taught anywhere in Scripture. In fact, separating God into three different persons would have gotten you stoned in the Old Testament for breaking the first two Commandments.

Note that the Catholic Church renumbered the Ten Commandments, in essence removing the Second Commandment to line up with the doctrine of the Trinity and worshipping of saints (but that’s another study).

Scripture References

Exodus 20:3
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Exodus 20:4
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image , or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

Exodus 20:5
Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God , visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Deuteronomy 4:35
Unto thee it was shewed, that thou mightest know that the LORD he is God; there is none else beside him .

Deuteronomy 6:4
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

Deuteronomy 10:14
Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the LORD'S thy God , the earth also, with all that therein is.

[Hebrews 1:2 says: Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things , by whom also he made the worlds;]

II Samuel 7:22
Wherefore thou art great, O LORD God: for there is none like thee, neither is there any God beside thee, according to all that we have heard with our ears.

I Kings 8:60
That all the people of the earth may know that the LORD is God, and that there is none else .

Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel .

[“Immanuel” means “God with us.”]

Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given : and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father , The Prince of Peace.

Isaiah 37:16
O LORD of hosts, God of Israel, that dwellest between the cherubims, thou art the God, even thou alone , of all the kingdoms of the earth: thou hast made heaven and earth .

[Hebrews 1:2 says: Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son , whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds ;]

Isaiah 43:10-11
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour .

[Luke 2:11 says: For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord . AND John 4:42 says: and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world .]

Hosea 13:4
Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is no saviour beside me.

Zechariah 14:9
And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one .

Matthew 28:19
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

[What is the Father’s name? Son’s Name? Holy Ghost’s Name?]

John 1:1 and 1:14
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...

14...And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

John 5:43
I am come in my Father's name , and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

[If He comes in His Father’s Name, then what is His Name?]

John 10:30
I and my Father are one.

John 12:45
And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.

John 14:8-9
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father ; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

John 20:28
And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God .

[Thomas was speaking to Jesus]

Acts 20:28
Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood .

[Were we saved by the blood of the Holy Ghost or the blood of Jesus?]

Ephesians 4:5
One Lord , one faith, one baptism,

Colossians 1:12-20
12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:

13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood , even the forgiveness of sins:

15 Who is the image of the invisible God , the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him :

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell ;

20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Colossians 2:8-10
8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily .

10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

I Timothy 3:16
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh , justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Hebrews 1:3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person , and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

I John 5:7
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one .

Culled from [url]branham.org/biblestudy/thetrinity[/url]

Mariner007:


Sorry, meant AD325. Don't know why I got AD33 stuck in my head

maybe that's because there is an honest part of you that doesn't believe what the elders of your kingdom hall told you is when the church began, but that it actually began in AD33, the year of the death, resurection and the famous pentecost sunday.

Mariner007:


Yes, Really.
Do some home work.

u mean read up on the lies written about the catholic church.
U can paste d catholic creed here and show us d section that is man made.

@ gemale, you are even confusing me more.


You said this
. " Catholic church compiled d bible. So d church wasn't a product of D bible rather it was d oda way round. So if non Catholics accept d bible as being of God, y can't dey accept oda writings of D church as d word of God too?
"


okay you are saying since the bible was compiled (note my word) by the Catholic church, non catholics should accept other writings that are not the bible.

Who is the author of the bible ( who inspired the writings in the bible) are those books also written under the same inspiration or just church doctrines written by men.

Saying the bible is a product of the church sounds somehow to me.

I still believe the bible is the final authority in all matters of faith and conduct.

Ubenedictus:
u mean read up on the lies written about the catholic church.
U can paste d catholic creed here and show us d section that is man made.

We really need to be open-minded. I'm not attacking you.

Okay. A simple question. Do you believe the bible?

Mariner007:


We really need to be open-minded. I'm not attacking you.

Okay. A simple question. Do you believe the bible?

I believe d bible, i have already told u to paste d catholic creed and show us d antibiblical part.

Ubenedictus:
I believe d bible, i have already told u to paste d catholic creed and show us d antibiblical part.

Trinity, first of all is anti-biblical.

Could prove it to you based on the Bible that you believe in.

yetseyi:
@ gemale, you are even confusing me more.


You said this
. " Catholic church compiled d bible. So d church wasn't a product of D bible rather it was d oda way round. So if non Catholics accept d bible as being of God, y can't dey accept oda writings of D church as d word of God too?
"


okay you are saying since the bible was compiled (note my word) by the Catholic church, non catholics should accept other writings that are not the bible.

Who is the author of the bible ( who inspired the writings in the bible) are those books also written under the same inspiration or just church doctrines written by men.

Saying the bible is a product of the church sounds somehow to me.

I still believe the bible is the final authority in all matters of faith and conduct.

D church is d final authority on all matters as she was created by Christ & is His bride. His spirit is always present 2 guide her 4rm spiritual error. The Bible is a result of D ministration of D Holy spirit in d church. Oda subsequent writings r addenda 2 scripture. If u say d bible is supposed 2 D final authority on all things xtianity, den d 1st 300 yrs of xtianity was a sham because dere was no Bible then. Just go & research on d origin & compilation of D bible.

Mariner007:


Trinity, first of all is anti-biblical.

Could prove it to you based on the Bible that you believe in.

HAHAHA, i already made a request stop diverting me. post d creed and show me d unbiblical part.

Ubenedictus:
HAHAHA, i already made a request stop diverting me. post d creed and show me d unbiblical part.

That's the most popular of all your man-made creeds. Why don't we start with that. Before we go into the prayers to saints and other what-nots. Should I post bible verses to prove that the "trinity" is false? I believe you said you believe in the bible. So let's make it our common ground, because I believe God is in his Word.

Mariner007:


That's the most popular of all your man-made creeds. Why don't we start with that. Before we go into the prayers to saints and other what-nots. Should I post bible verses to prove that the "trinity" is false? I believe you said you believe in the bible. So let's make it our common ground, because I believe God is in his Word.

The trinity is not the creed, i repeat my previous request, paste d creed and show me d unbiblical parts.

Ubenedictus:
The trinity is not the creed, i repeat my previous request, paste d creed and show me d unbiblical parts.

What is trinity then?
Let's talk about that in terms of "Water Baptism".
Which catholics do it based on the trinitarian doctrine.

"But there never was a person ever in all the pages of the Bible, ever baptized in the name of the Father, Son, Holy Ghost. There never was a person baptized in the name of Father, Son, Holy Ghost until the early Catholic church. It's not in the Bible nowhere. And if anybody can find a piece in there, and tell me and show me where one person was baptized using the name of the Father, Son, Holy Ghost please show me, for I've went through and through and through and through and through it for twenty-some-odd years now. And it's an error. It's a Catholic creed and not a Bible command."

[quote author=Mariner007 post=42

Please can u answer this question sincerely, continuous recall of events and the texts of the bible, which is older .
If u say that the church is in error, why do u use a product of error, because the church is older than the Bible.
And for ur above question, the Father, the Son and the Spirit are one except u say its not true and what happened to "go into the world and make disciples of all nations baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" Matt 28:19

Mariner007:


What is trinity then?
Let's talk about that in terms of "Water Baptism".
Which catholics do it based on the trinitarian doctrine.

"But there never was a person ever in all the pages of the Bible, ever baptized in the name of the Father, Son, Holy Ghost. There never was a person baptized in the name of Father, Son, Holy Ghost until the early Catholic church. It's not in the Bible nowhere. And if anybody can find a piece in there, and tell me and show me where one person was baptized using the name of the Father, Son, Holy Ghost please show me, for I've went through and through and through and through and through it for twenty-some-odd years now. And it's an error. It's a Catholic creed and not a Bible command."

The same bible the catholics compiled for u abi? Thats the irony of it all....you already have your beliefs,stick to it....na plenty talk you dey find.

the public toilet started to stink too much or what...??...

dukum:


The same bible the catholics compiled for u abi? Thats the irony of it all....you already have your beliefs,stick to it....na plenty talk you dey find.

The bible is not a product of the church. That is just like saying that the CREATOR is the product of the CREATION. The Bible is God's Word and not of man.

By the way if catholics compiled the bible I believe they should look at the book they claim to have compiled and believe on that same book. Or is the book an error now?

If they compiled the bible, they should show me one person, just one person that was baptized based on the trinitarian doctrine. i.e Father, Son and Holy Ghost.

The bible was written by men inspired of the Holy Ghost. The acts of apostles were not the acts of men but the acts of the Holy Ghost in men.

Let's look at your water baptism in the first place.

I believe cathoilcs refer to the scripture of Matthew 28:19
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
[What is the Father’s Name? Son’s Name? Holy Ghost’s Name?]

Mark 16:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

John 5:43
I am come in my Father’s name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
[If He comes in His Father’s Name, then what is His Name?]

John 10:30
I and my Father are one

John 12:45
And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.

John 14:8-9
Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

John 20:27-28
Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

Acts 2:38-39
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Acts 4:12
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 8:12
But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ , they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 19:3-6
And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism.

Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

[size=13pt]When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus[/size].

And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Ephesians 4:5
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Colossians 3:17
And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

I John 5:7
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.



So, why did the disciples baptize in the Name of Jesus when Jesus, Himself, told them to baptize in the Name (not “names”) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost? (Matt 28:19) Did they make a mistake? No! They did exactly as they were instructed.

As you read this article, think about your name. Are you a son? Is your name, “Son”? Are you a mother? Is your name, “Mother”? Of course not, those are simply titles. You have a real name, and so does God.

And there is no such a thing in the Bible as anybody ever being baptized in the name of the Father, Son, Holy Ghost; because there is no such a thing. Father’s no name; and Son’s no name; and Holy Ghost is no name; but the Name of the Father, Son, Holy Ghost is the Lord Jesus Christ.

Jesus Christ is God! He is the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost.

Mariner007:


The bible is not a product of the church. That is just like saying that the CREATOR is the product of the CREATION. The Bible is God's Word and not of man.

By the way if catholics compiled the bible I believe they should look at the book they claim to have compiled and believe on that same book. Or is the book an error now?

If they compiled the bible, they should show me one person, just one person that was baptized based on the trinitarian doctrine. i.e Father, Son and Holy Ghost.

The bible was written by men inspired of the Holy Ghost. The acts of apostles were not the acts of men but the acts of the Holy Ghost in men.

Yea yea......more mumble jumble trying to shy away from the truth,since you agree the church compiled the bible why don't you question why they left out some books afterall they were all inspired by the holy ghost,right? As a Christian If you question the catholic church,question your faith.......if you still don't get this well

Oh!and since you know ur bible so well you don't need to be shown anything i guess.

Speechless3:
If someone had told me i will be making a life changing decision like this many years ago i would have been enraged, not at he or she but at the force that would dare cause that.

Was born a catholic, baptised by a priest and cofirmed by the state bishop. I annexed to this by becoming a member of the legion of mary (tho left at one time) i was still faithful to the blessed virgin mary with my bead ritual.

The truth is i only had to do this and that and then the other and relax. By relax, i mean do what ever i wanted. Club, have sex, drink, curse, lie, cheat, disobey other authorities, go nude etc as long as i came back for confession all the time and obtained mercy from God through the priest, i was fine. Maybe they didnt think it was fine i.e my lifestyle but the silence and indifference they showed, gave me the wrongest impression. After all i was always encouraged to go for confession like my life was hanging on it.

This is something that all catholics will understand. After confession we feel a bit unburdened with guilt...for a while. I dont know about others, but mine was not always more than an hour and i would be back to square one (or may be i never left there but thought i did). I was not freaky about the sunday communion thing like others cos i didnt think i was worthy.

Going to the university exposed me to other religious groups. I didn't like the way they shouted while praying but i admired the way they reverred the bible and talked about Christ more.
I thought the catholic church was doing little in the teaching of biblical truths but was still a good model for other churches, mushroom churches.

There were times i made resolutions to turn a new leaf but they always never came to a fruition.
Up till now. I couldn't, i cant keep them. All the rules of right living get lost on me. I just cant change. Talked with our priest every day about this after our doctrinal classes (joined the Opus dei) He suggested i read books of saints who had lived and overcame evil and of course by following the many laid down rules and rituals of the church. I read about mother Theresa, Pope John Paul the II, Saint José maria. Still nothing. It only made me feel unworthy but no power in them.

I decided to read the bible at last after so many procrastinations. I started with John and i have not seen any slight resemblance with the Church. I will continue with Matthew, Mark and Luke this month.

So many things in this old boring book are startling me.

Its a good thing that u'v identified yr problem.Work on it! If u feel leaving d Catholic is d solution, thats a big lie. What sect are u going to join- MFM,RCCG, Winners, Deeperlife, Christ Embassy, etc? Well its good to acquir knowledge, but Its all fantasy. I tell u, 'cos u will gradually see other things u never knew.


Being a Catholic shldnt keep u away frm other meaningful men of God's teachings.

dukum:


Yea yea......more mumble jumble trying to shy away from the truth,since you agree the church compiled the bible why don't you question why they left out some books afterall they were all inspired by the holy ghost,right? As a Christian If you question the catholic church,question your faith.......if you still don't get this well

Oh!and since you know ur bible so well you don't need to be shown anything i guess.

Get me right o!! I said based on your belief that you compiled the bible, you should not therefore argue with what the Bible says..

As a matter of fact, Catholicism is a big No, and I'll keep questioning it all my life.

Explain where you get your water baptism from. Let's know if it's the same bible we talk about.

oglalasioux:

Good suggestions. Why won't the three churches you mentioned come together in the love of Christ and form one church? Because they will be on each other's juggler over money before long like the Assemblies of God church drama. By the way is it not Lord's Chosen accused of fake miracles? Is it not Deeper Life that asked their people not to use TV but the children of G.O are partying in USA? Is it not Living Faith that built mega universities with tax I mean tithe payers money but their children can't afford it?

I am sorry the devil is busy giving many people reasons why they should not go to churches where they can hear the raw gospel of Jesus Christ and repent of their sins and receive power from Jesus to live life as children of God (Jn.1:12) Someone suggestd Chosen but this man is asking whether it is not Chosen they are accusing of fake miracles. Devil at work to deceive people like him. Go to Chosen. You wl see things urself and confess u are sorry

syffng:
I am sorry the devil is busy giving many people reasons why they should not go to churches where they can hear the raw gospel of Jesus Christ and repent of their sins and receive power from Jesus to live life as children of God (Jn.1:12) Someone suggestd Chosen but this man is asking whether it is not Chosen they are accusing of fake miracles. Devil at work to deceive people like him. Go to Chosen. You wl see things urself and confess u are sorry

You are simply advertising your church. That's the ultimate problem with religion.

Mariner007:


Get me right o!! I said based on your belief that you compiled the bible, you should not therefore argue with what the Bible says..

As a matter of fact, Catholicism is a big No, and I'll keep questioning it all my life.

Explain where you get your water baptism from. Let's know if it's the same bible we talk about.

Ok bye!