celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

by gods grace Nigeria will get der

Keep in mind that thanks to the fall in oil prices....we no longer have enough dollars to do anything.

And while Innoson was a good manufacturer.....his Achilles heeel was the failure to develop a LOCAL source for his cars.

their is what we call law of comparative advantage.Thue to naijas undeveloped metal and steel industry,it would be cheaper for him to import licensed engines than to produce such in Nigeria. Besides we lack such research capability.if I where him I would move a section of my plant to south Africa or even the northern African countries.

fake news sauced from Afonjas Blog

The body is imported from abroad...as is the engine.

Fact is...we cannot make the body in Nigeria....because we do not have Ajaokuta working.

And you cannot have a good car manufacturing system in Nigeria if you are not making the engines in Nigeria.

My name is not Afonja...and this news means that APC should fix Ajaokuta, invest in power and do all they can to make sure Nigeria is designing and making engines at home.(So...i am also shouting at APC. Criticism means offering your ideas about what needs to be done)

Because...you cannot keep on importing engines for the cars you make WHEN your source of forex is very very poor.

Therein lies the problem.

fixing ajaokuta steel mine won't be easy.its technology is kind of backward and the cost of rebuilding is estimated to be enough to build a new one.

celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

How on earth is it possible to get all the raw materials from Nigeria to make a car; u think is banga flour or tomatoe paste he is making?. Where in Nigeria? Use ur brain next time.

celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

No vehicle manufacturer the world over produces all of its parts. They import from different manufacturers from various countries. check your vehicle parts if you have one to confirm.

hamilton62:

yes they are, it's known than innoson imports vehicle engines just as other companies like toyota etc do.
An automobile company might have a design of engine sent to an egine manufacturing company like suzuki etc but that doesn't mean it produces its engine... Innoson sources his auto engine from 1st class auto engine production companies...
For doubting- thomas, innoson is never a CKD assembler but a manufacturer
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innoson_Vehicle_Manufacturing

pls I need u to tell me this 70% components that are locally sourced and manufactured in Nigeria.
because I noticed virtually all motor vehicle spare-parts sold in this country are imported.......
if innoson manufactures these parts, why can't our ladipo brothers' patronize innoson instead of going to China to import same items we produce here......

SIRTee15:


pls I need u to tell me this 70% components that are locally sourced and manufactured in Nigeria.
because I noticed virtually all motor vehicle spare-parts sold in this country are imported.......
if innoson manufactures these parts, why can't our ladipo brothers' patronize innoson instead of going to China to import same items we produce here......

go to Nnewi, thwn you will see the products made with marque; made in china, made in japan but they are made in nnewi...
Not every made in china you see is their product dear!
Another thing is trust in the local products and OEM right s and branding rights and specification or standards, they believe that china or others are easier to do with and more profit margin, that's their believe which might not be the yardmark.
Nevertheless, remember that labour is cheap in china and power is also cheap there than here because industries depend of fuel consumption with the plants which is never cheap atleast if you were once a student or used the generator: i pass my neighbour you will ok this!

celestialAgent:
Just one question: Have you ever wondered while Apple products are assembled in China but tagged as "produced by apple in California"? This is simply because the main components are produced by Apple in California and Packaged in China.

The above explained scenerio applies to innoson operation - A dependent company (once the material source fails, the company is zilch).

bro what people like innoson and cutix cables are doing in nnewi defies business logic.for one their is no well established gas sector in anambra to power them and,in the case of innoson he has low patronage in relation to our population(6000).innoson is right in importing his engines (from america mind you) that man can build it here especially under license but,the cost of his vehicles would be costlier or close to established brands like Toyota then,he would loss more patronage(law of comparative advantage). our money is valueless because we don't export any thing considerable we are undeveloped because our technology is non existent ,which makes me more surprised that the Fed's can't extend the same olive branch the give to some cooperation to this individuals who has the potential to truly export something and earn us much needed forex-i was even suorised to learn that innoson produces components for the airforce planes.expecting innoson to manufacture engines for a mere 6000 vehicles is thoughtless.he would do better to focus on his plastic and rubber factories.

celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

even if we go down to the steel required in making cars and it's parts,would he 'ave been able to obtain it here in nigeria?

eduj:

bro what people like innoson and cutix cables are doing in nnewi defies business logic.for one their is no well established gas sector in anambra to power them and,in the case of innoson he has low patronage in relation to our population(6000).innoson is right in importing his engines (from america mind you) that man can build it here especially under license but,the cost of his vehicles would be costlier or close to established brands like Toyota then,he would loss more patronage(law of comparative advantage). our money is valueless because we don't export any thing considerable we are undeveloped because our technology is non existent ,which makes me more surprised that the Fed's can't extend the same olive branch the give to some cooperation to this individuals who has the potential to truly export something and earn us much needed forex-i was even suorised to learn that innoson produces components for the airforce planes.expecting innoson to manufacture engines for a mere 6000 vehicles is thoughtless.he would do better to focus on his plastic and rubber factories.

Thumbs up at the bolded.

With the situation in Nigeria now, of what essesce will companies like innoson be if they still rely on CBN for forex to import her needed material for local productions? Apparrently, the price of the products here will be contingent on the foreign expenses, hence resulting in higher prices.

Don't you think it will be better if Innoson just limit her production cap to what its raw materials can be gotten from Nigeria? Take for example, If Innoson could produce only car tyres with 90% of the materials from Nigeria for local use and export, that will not only benefit the citizens financially (very cheap), but also be a source of forex for Nigeria. Through the proceeds from the tyre exports, Innoson can then conviniently import stuffs to further enhance her production.

In short, a company that does no generate forex the country but instead rely on forex from other exports to finance her heavy importation expenses is not suppose to be reckon with at this time of insufficient forex.

nedu2000:
even if we go down to the steel required in making cars and it's parts,would he 'ave been able to obtain it here in nigeria?

See the immediate above

freshvine:


Let me help your ignorance.

TOYOTA CAMRY is a Japanese model.

It might interest you that only engine is formulated and made by Toyota Japan. Every other parts from radio, tyre, glasses, battery, spark plugs etc are manufactured by different companies.

Motor corporation are known to couple vehicles made according to their specifications

Pls try and understand the guy, he is telling u DAT the real deal is the engine which up till now, no African can independently manufacture. U just said it yourself, engine produced by Toyota, please understand, no hating here just stating the obvious truth

celestialAgent:
[s]Quit being tribalistic! This is an issue that concerns me and you as a Nigerian.

At this time, we need creativity to make something from our many raw materials for exports (be it common bolt and nuts). Not some heavy expenses on importation from the insufficient forex[/s].

Typical hogwash...

Fawklicant:


The challenge is not lack of funds but limited forex. The SE govts do not mint dollars. The federal govt while placing restrictions on forex supply, freely and dubiously provides same to one individual. Approximately 10% of the nations forex earnings are given to one person alone at official rates (most likely less). Importers and manufacturers cannot sustain activity at black market rates and even if they attempt it, there is not enough forex in circulation either in the parrallel market. Govt officials corner the little available forex meant for BDC operators and round trip for personal gains. It is a catch 22 situation for manufacturers and importers.

So basically, the same conditions millions of Nigerians go through.

I'm not happy about the Dangote concessions. I'm perfectly happy to limit it at that person alone. There is no reason to extend it to Innoson and others.

Forex isn't really that scarce. It's just pricey in the parallel market. Innoson can go there, and pass the costs on to consumers like everyone else is doing. AFterall, the imported components were supposedly just about 20% of each vehicle. Given that the delta between the official and parallel rates is about 1.2x, let him adjust the prices of his vehicles by a multiplier of 1.2 to compensate.

I think the far bigger issue is that consumers are not buying Innoson vehicles in sufficient enough numbers to compensate for the current economic conditions, and that is 100% down to failings of IVM in marketing and branding.

You cannot build a business that seemed perennially focused on securing Government patronage.

Clinton9000:


Typical hogwash...

It is obvious how minute your intel is.

monumental Tweft!

Oya All of una wey read mech engineering 4 skul, na ur chance 2 shine b ds. Y una no fit come 2geda 4 una association 2 produce vehicle engine 4 9ja? No complaints o! Abi metal no boku 4 9ja? Una don get raw materials b dt. All of una wey get 1st class & 2.1 4 mech engineering, where una dey? Who ur degree dey epp if we still dey import vehicle engine? Wetin b d difference btw una & person wey no come go skul nw? All those profs & Drs of mech engineering wey dey call demselves expert dey use tym wey dem suppose use dey solve ds wahala dey plot hw 2 f**k students up & make dem courses harder. Any education wey no fit solve problems 4 our country na waste IMO.

DjAndroid:


I'm neither GEJ's fan nor Buhari’s. all we advocate for is good governance. simple!

And youv've not been seeing good governance since 2015? If it's about economy recession it is affecting all oil producing states globally except those that safe when crude oil was at $100 per barrel and that what we are blaming GEJ. Instead of saving the money then they are sharing it.

Fawklicant:


Too much CNN is deceiving this one. Your assertion above is not only preposterous, but ludicrous. Billions of dollars? Hehehe! Bros! Easy on the hashish mehn! Research costs money but nothing out of the ordinary like you make it seem. New machines will not be built, only new moulds for existing machines. It is all about modifying operational principles most of the time and not about complete change of processes,

For example, a 6 cylinder engine vs a 6 cylinder dual inline plug system engine. The former uses 6 plugs with each piston firing a plug per cylinder while the latter uses 12 plugs with each cylinder firing 2 plugs thereby doubling its efficiency. Same base technology(pistons, plugs etal) same production machines, different moulds.

Besides there are numerous ways to fund a research of that scale and it can also be done in partnerships without one party having exclusivity of ownership of the technology.

You dont gerrit do you
check this
https://www1.eere.energy.gov/hydrogenandfuelcells/pdfs/28890yy.pdf
this was done 2000, 2005, I was at a show where they exhibited the research so far, guess waht 5 years the already spent £900M,I guess you know howmuch that is.

tdayof:
BMW manufacture its brake pads.Obviously Others should have the capability.

Giving other companies chance to manufacture your car part doesn't mean you do not have the capability. As for Innoson it doesn't have the full capability yet and I will consider funding as the issue. Our government should try and invest more in ours.

Plz show me one BMW brake pad on sale, I'm waiting.
Heard of a company called BOSCH??

erico2k2:

Plz show me one BMW brake pad on sale, I'm waiting.
Heard of a company called BOSCH??

I know BOSCH. I can tell you BMW manufactures brake pad. I have got friends on internship in BMW Shenyang who claimed so. A lecturer once told me he works on a break pad and Tyre sososo research there.

erico2k2:

You dont gerrit do you
check this
https://www1.eere.energy.gov/hydrogenandfuelcells/pdfs/28890yy.pdf
this was done 2000, 2005, I was at a show where they exhibited the research so far, guess waht 5 years the already spent £900M,I guess you know howmuch that is.

Oga stop trying to sound half smart. You sent me a link about fuel cell technology, a completely different approach to ICE. What is this one saying? It is just like bringing up space travel when we are still trying out helicopter travel.I studied a lil of fuel cell technology in my undergraduate years so note that the document has no bearing with what we are trashing out here. That is a technology that is still many years from maturity, a paradigm shift.

The amount you are brandishing here was not even spent by just one entity, stop trying to win an argument and get educated with the facts. I have no interest in winning an argument with you, all I care is to reduce the amount of ignorance by at least a factor of ONE.

We are discussing R& for ICE engines, let us keep it within scope.

erico2k2:

Plz show me one BMW brake pad on sale, I'm waiting.
Heard of a company called BOSCH??

Brake pads are everywhere. Even in Nnewi, there are many companies that manufacture brake pads. I remember many years back when 'Power Mike's'(the wrestler) company was producing fan belts(Power rope fan belt),brake pads etc there in Nnewi and this was even in the 80s/early 90's. They had many variants including the ones that were produced using palm kernel shells. Brake pad production is not rocket science.

redcap:



The guy you quoted doesn't know what he's saying. I was at innoson plant several times last year and I can tell you that all thebody parts (metal/plastics) are wholly made in that factory. The tires are brought in from his other factory in the east.People don't travel all they do is lazy around and busy creating a mental picture of how successful people made their money.

U seem not to understand what we are saying about the supposed African technology. Now let me break it down for you
When next you visit in no son factory, kindly ask to be shown the different stages of the body part manufacture. Pay particular attention on the heavy duty/ light machines used in the manufacture of those parts/ components, and sincerely ask yourself how many of them(machines) arew wholly manufactured in Nigeria.Think my brother, think!

celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

How do u think manufacturers in other countries started? Overnight and directly? U have to stabilise first as an assembler, then graduate, particularly when steel becomes locally available....

texazzpete:


So basically, the same conditions millions of Nigerians go through.

I'm not happy about the Dangote concessions. I'm perfectly happy to limit it at that person alone. There is no reason to extend it to Innoson and others.

Forex isn't really that scarce. It's just pricey in the parallel market. Innoson can go there, and pass the costs on to consumers like everyone else is doing. AFterall, the imported components were supposedly just about 20% of each vehicle. Given that the delta between the official and parallel rates is about 1.2x, let him adjust the prices of his vehicles by a multiplier of 1.2 to compensate.

I think the far bigger issue is that consumers are not buying Innoson vehicles in sufficient enough numbers to compensate for the current economic conditions, and that is 100% down to failings of IVM in marketing and branding.

You cannot build a business that seemed perennially focused on securing Government patronage.

Sir, Forex is scarce, not just pricey. Getting huge amounts of forex from the parallel market is difficult. I know small scale manufacturers that require upwards of $200,000 almost every other month. It is pricey as well as scarce.

There is diminished inflow of forex into the system from exports, travel and trade, hence closure of foreign companies. Airlines, manufacturers etc are closing shop because the Naira they earn is next to useless if they cannot convert to forex for continued operations. Those who have tried to source from the parallel market and pass the cost to consumers have not been successful at it because the purchasing power of the consumer is diminished by the day via draconian policies.

We keep talking about diversifying the economy whereas the instruments of diversification are stiffled. Mind you, Dangote is building an oil refinery which thus further increases our dependency on oil. Not saying it is a bad thing to build a refinery, just that diversification of an oil dependent economy needs providing the enabling environment for other ventures to thrive.
You cannot ask me to slice up some meat and then proceed to provide a hammer as the tool for the job.

Kaysalas:

U seem not to understand what we are saying about the supposed African technology. Now let me break it down for you
When next you visit in no son factory, kindly ask to be shown the different stages of the body part manufacture. Pay particular attention on the heavy duty/ light machines used in the manufacture of those parts/ components, and sincerely ask yourself how many of them(machines) arew wholly manufactured in Nigeria.Think my brother, think!

I don't want to assume you are sending me on errant, Go there and see things for yourself.

celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

You slowpoke, every company has to start somewhere. Do you think Mercedes and Toyota became billion dollar businesses over night? No, both actually had heavy support and resources from the government. Unlike this useless country where folks will find every reason to NOT support local businesses likes Innosun.

Your a classic example of a stupid Nigerian. Since people like you are in the majority, I have very little hope for this nation.

Fawklicant:


We keep talking about diversifying the economy whereas the instruments of diversification are stiffled. Mind you, Dangote is building an oil refinery which thus further increases our dependency on oil. Not saying it is a bad thing to build a refinery, just that diversification of an oil dependent economy needs providing the enabling environment for other ventures to thrive.
You cannot ask me to slice up some meat and then proceed to provide a hammer as the tool for the job.

An oil refinery does not 'increase our dependency on oil'. It will provide jobs for tens of thousands of Nigerians, reduce fuel scarcity and drastically reduce pressure for dollars by stripping away the need to import refined petroleum products.

The worry is a dependence on oil exports, not a dependence on refined petroleum products.

You should even pray fervently that the refinery kicks off on time.

celestialAgent:
I'm not supprised.

Innoson has never occured to me as a car manufacturing company but a car part compilation company. Hence the reason for reliance on forex to import the parts to be coupled...

let's not embrace dependency, we need real productions!

Before you quote me, bear in mind that i'm not tribalistic, this is channelled at all Nigerians..

Nigeria doesn't yet have the technology to manufacture whole car engines and electronic components, so Innoson imports those parts, but they are made in his name.
How can a country that can't manufacture pencils make complete cars?
But you still won't call it car assembly. A car assembly plant imports ALL the parts of a car, and fixes them in their plants to make cars. Innoson on the other hand doesn't import all the rubber, plastic and glass components of his vehicles. Even the bodies and chassis of his vehicles are constructed in Nnewi.

local production cannot work without electricity. If FG wants to empower anybody, they should provide electricity...simple. Unfurtunately, bad belle pple no go still gree private person generate the electricity

erico2k2:

He cannot, quote me anywhere, No country in Africa can as it stands, teh required funds for research is too much for most entrepreneurs in Africa, it requires Billions of Dollars.That man has not that kind of money to pay for such research.
Dont forget you also have to build teh machines that will build the Engines.He should start with things as simple as welding machine then I will give your suggestion a thought my friend.

My broda, see ehn! It will be easier for a cow to pass thru a needle's eye than for you to convince some ppu about africa' s true tech. State. I met an Igbo guy today @ lekki and we got talking. Guess what? This same line of argument. His words: only the igbos are helping this con3, by manufacturing things independently. I asked him some questions, and the next thing he asked me was: what tribe are you?. He he he!
Thank God that after seeing sound logical reasoning, he changed his earlier confession to; but you know the igbos are trying.
Which I definitely agree with. But fact remains, Africans are still way behind tech wise, for those if you calling Cummins engine but Nissan body, you make me laugh in ishan. Have you forgotten that these companies you mentioned are wholly owned by the races we all know to be technologically established? All you have said so far is just comparative advantage at work.