Sorry for the late reply, had a low battery;

Its either you didn't read my reply properly or you didn't understand it.

Maverick7901:
It is true dat abu israeel in sohih bukhari falls into bidha.....but his bidha is in the ahkam not aqeedah and their is excuse of ignorance in ahkam.....dat is y d prophet did not call him kafir, and after he was told, he did not remain adamant, he left the sun......so definitely wen a bidha falls into ahkam, you explain for the doer b4 you can call him anything after the perfection of shurut....walohu ahlam

Firstly, Islam is a religion that has isnad, whatever knowledge you are bringing shouldn't be a new one, rather we should be able to trace it back to the sahabas, because Allaah said he is pleased with them and those who follows their understanding of Islam, now I ask, this explanation of this hadith you are giving now, telling us he was excused because he was ignorant of the ahkam, where did you get it from? Sahaba? Tabi'een or tabi tabi'een?

Secondly, If we are to accept that reply for argument sake, why didn't the prophet tell Abu israil that his good deed(i.e fasting) is invalidated instead he asked him to continue, atleast we know that once act of kufr enters a good deed, it invalidates it(as ibn taymiyyah highlights), so if we are to accept that "all bid'ah is kufr" then that bid'ah Abu israil did should've invalidated his fasting, so why didn't the prophet invalidate it?

Thirdly, the argument you are bringing is an invalid one, the man who did not prayed well was ignorant of the ahkam, yet the prophet invalidated his salaah and asked him to pray again, why didn't the prophet excused him that he was ignorant? Whereas this is an ahkam issue and not aqeedah issue.

lexiconkabir:


the prophet said;

“Beware of newly-invented matters, for every newly-invented matter is an bid'ah(innovation), every innovation is a going astray, and every going astray will be in the Fire"

if you disobey the prophet's words it becomes what?

U are saying exactly what am saying, note the word 'EVERY'. from that hadith no exception.... Ao can u now say some of it would be consider as sin.

hapheeyxz:

U are saying exactly what am saying, note the word 'EVERY'. from that hadith no exception.... Ao can u now say some of it would be consider as sin.

Read this reply;

Well there are many evidences that all bid'ah is not shirk, a very glaring evidence is the situation of Abu israil found in sahih bukhari;

While the Prophet (ﷺ ) was delivering a sermon, he saw a man standing, so he asked about that man. They (the people) said, "It is Abu Israil who has vowed that he will stand and never sit down, and he will never come in the shade, nor speak to anybody, and will fast.'' The Prophet (ﷺ ) said, "Order him to speak and let him come in the shade, and make him sit down, but let him complete his fast."{sahih bukhari no. 6704}

1.) This man was standing under the sun with the belief that he is worshipping Allaah.

2.) What he did was clearly bid'ah!

3.) The prophet didnt call him a kafir

4.) The prophet just rejected his bid'ah and told him to continue his fasting.

5.) The prophet himself has made it clear that not all bid'ah takes you out of Islam.

Now if all bid'ah was shirk, then the prophet would've told Abu israil that all his deed including the fasting has become invalid because the ijma' of the scholars is, shirk(done knowingly or unknowingly) dismantles good deeds, here is their proof;

Say: Spend (in Allaah’s Cause) willingly or unwillingly, it will not be accepted from you. Verily, you are ever a people who are Faasiqoon (rebellious, disobedient to Allaah).”
And nothing prevents their contributions from being accepted from them except that they disbelieved in Allaah and in His Messenger (Muhammad), and that they came not to As-Salaah (the prayer) except in a lazy state, and that they offer not contributions but unwillingly”
[al-Tawbah 9:53-54]

As we can see Allaah says he wont accept the disbelievers good deeds because of their kufr.

Ibn Taymiyah (rahimahullaah) said:
Nothing cancels out good deeds except kufr, because the one who dies as a believer will inevitably enter Paradise, and he will be brought out of Hell if he does enter it, but if all his good deeds are cancelled out, he will never enter Paradise. Good deeds can only be cancelled out by that which is their opposite, and nothing can be the opposite of all good deeds except kufr. This is well known from the principles of Sunnah.{ Al-Saarim al-Maslool (p. 55) }

1.) I have shown that Abu israil did bid'ah

2.) If his bid'ah was kufr,then the prophet would've told him that his good deed(which is fasting) has been destroyed

3.) But the prophet did not, rather he rejected only the bid'ah and asked him to continue.

4.) Quran says All kufr destroys your good deeds and this is the aqeedah of the salaf as-solih

5.) So if Abu israil bid'ah was kufr, the good deed he was doing(i.e fasting) would've been destroyed.

lexiconkabir:


Read this reply;

Don't u get, the prophet was among them and he was there to correct them and also to teach us our Deen.. assuming they refuse when he corrected them now, that is when u can use all that as deleel. Or better still, give me one hadith from the prophet that says there is one bidia that is SIN. just 1 hadith.
YOU CAN ALSO GO THROIGH THIS....
*NO EXCUSE OF IGNORANCE IN MATTER OF BELIEF (AQEEDAH)*

Surah Al-Araf, Verse 172:
وَإِذْ أَخَذَ رَبُّكَ مِن بَنِي آدَمَ مِن ظُهُورِهِمْ ذُرِّيَّتَهُمْ وَأَشْهَدَهُمْ عَلَىٰ أَنفُسِهِمْ أَلَسْتُ بِرَبِّكُمْ قَالُوا بَلَىٰ شَهِدْنَا أَن تَقُولُوا يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ إِنَّا كُنَّا عَنْ هَٰذَا غَافِلِينَ

And (remember) when your Lord brought forth from the Children of Adam, from their loins, their seed (or from Adam's loin his offspring) and made them testify as to themselves (saying): "Am I not your Lord?" They said: "Yes! We testify," lest you should say on the Day of Resurrection: "Verily, we have been unaware of this."
(English - Mohsin Khan)

via iQuran


Surah Al-Araf, Verse 173:
أَوْ تَقُولُوا إِنَّمَا أَشْرَكَ آبَاؤُنَا مِن قَبْلُ وَكُنَّا ذُرِّيَّةً مِّن بَعْدِهِمْ أَفَتُهْلِكُنَا بِمَا فَعَلَ الْمُبْطِلُونَ

Or lest you should say: "It was only our fathers afortime who took others as partners in worship along with Allah, and we were (merely their) descendants after them; will You then destroy us because of the deeds of men who practised Al-Batil (i.e. polytheism and committing crimes and sins, invoking and worshipping others besides Allah)?" (Tafsir At-Tabari).
(English - Mohsin Khan)

via iQuran


Allah تعالى says:

✅ قُلْ أَرَأَيْتُم مَّا أَنزَلَ اللَّهُ لَكُم مِّن رِّزْقٍ فَجَعَلْتُم مِّنْهُ حَرَامًا وَحَلَالًا قُلْ آللَّهُ أَذِنَ لَكُمْ أَمْ عَلَى اللَّهِ تَفْتَرُونَ

Say (O Muhammad) to these polytheists): "Tell me, what provision Allah has sent down to you! And you have made of it lawful and unlawful." Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Has Allah permitted you (to do so), or do you invent a lie against Allah?"

[Surah Yunus, 10:59]


حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو بَكْرِ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ، حَدَّثَنَا عَفَّانُ، حَدَّثَنَا حَمَّادُ بْنُ سَلَمَةَ، عَنْ ثَابِتٍ، عَنْ أَنَسٍ، أَنَّ رَجُلاً، قَالَ يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ أَيْنَ أَبِي قَالَ ‏"‏ فِي النَّارِ ‏"‏ ‏.‏ فَلَمَّا قَفَّى دَعَاهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ إِنَّ أَبِي وَأَبَاكَ فِي النَّارِ ‏"‏ ‏.‏

Anas reported: Verily, a person said: Messenger of Allah, where is my father? He said: (He) is in the Fire. When he turned away, he (the Holy Prophet) called him and said: Verily my father and your father are in the Fire.


Sahih Muslim
Reference: Sahih Muslim 203 (The Book of Faith)
In-book reference: Book 1, Hadith 408


حَدَّثَنَا يَحْيَى بْنُ أَيُّوبَ، وَمُحَمَّدُ بْنُ عَبَّادٍ، - وَاللَّفْظُ لِيَحْيَى - قَالاَ حَدَّثَنَا مَرْوَانُ، بْنُ مُعَاوِيَةَ عَنْ يَزِيدَ، - يَعْنِي ابْنَ كَيْسَانَ - عَنْ أَبِي حَازِمٍ، عَنْ أَبِي هُرَيْرَةَ، قَالَ قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏"‏ اسْتَأْذَنْتُ رَبِّي أَنْ أَسْتَغْفِرَ لأُمِّي فَلَمْ يَأْذَنْ لِي وَاسْتَأْذَنْتُهُ أَنْ أَزُورَ قَبْرَهَا فَأَذِنَ لِي ‏"
‏ ‏.‏
Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger, (ﷺ) as saying: I sought permission to beg forgiveness for my mother, but He did not grant it to me. I sought permission from Him to visit her grave, and He granted it (permission) to me.


Sahih Muslim
(The Book of Prayer - Funerals)
Reference : Sahih Muslim 976 a
In-book reference : Book 11, Hadith 134


حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو بَكْرِ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ، وَزُهَيْرُ بْنُ حَرْبٍ، قَالاَ حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ عُبَيْدٍ، عَنْ يَزِيدَ بْنِ كَيْسَانَ، عَنْ أَبِي حَازِمٍ، عَنْ أَبِي هُرَيْرَةَ، قَالَ زَارَ النَّبِيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم قَبْرَ أُمِّهِ فَبَكَى وَأَبْكَى مَنْ حَوْلَهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ اسْتَأْذَنْتُ رَبِّي فِي أَنْ أَسْتَغْفِرَ لَهَا فَلَمْ يُؤْذَنْ لِي وَاسْتَأْذَنْتُهُ فِي أَنْ أَزُورَ قَبْرَهَا فَأُذِنَ لِي فَزُورُوا الْقُبُورَ فَإِنَّهَا تُذَكِّرُ الْمَوْتَ ‏"
‏ ‏.‏
Abu Huraira reported: The Apostle of Allah (ﷺ) visited the grave of his mother and he wept, and moved others around him to tears, and said: I sought permission from my Lord to beg forgiveness for her but it was not granted to me, and I sought permission to visit her grave and it was granted to me so visit the graves, for that makes you mindful of death.


Sahih Muslim
(The Book of Prayer - Funerals)
Reference : Sahih Muslim 976 b
In-book reference : Book 11, Hadith 135

lexiconkabir:


Read this reply;

Don't u get, the prophet was among them and he was there to correct them and also to teach us our Deen.. assuming they refuse when he corrected them now, that is when u can use all that as deleel. Or better still, give me one hadith from the prophet that says there is one bidia that is SIN. just 1 hadith.
YOU CAN ALSO GO THROIGH TH.....
*NO EXCUSE OF IGNORANCE IN MATTER OF BELIEF (AQEEDAH)*

Surah Al-Araf, Verse 172:
وَإِذْ أَخَذَ رَبُّكَ مِن بَنِي آدَمَ مِن ظُهُورِهِمْ ذُرِّيَّتَهُمْ وَأَشْهَدَهُمْ عَلَىٰ أَنفُسِهِمْ أَلَسْتُ بِرَبِّكُمْ قَالُوا بَلَىٰ شَهِدْنَا أَن تَقُولُوا يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ إِنَّا كُنَّا عَنْ هَٰذَا غَافِلِينَ

And (remember) when your Lord brought forth from the Children of Adam, from their loins, their seed (or from Adam's loin his offspring) and made them testify as to themselves (saying): "Am I not your Lord?" They said: "Yes! We testify," lest you should say on the Day of Resurrection: "Verily, we have been unaware of this."
(English - Mohsin Khan)

via iQuran


Surah Al-Araf, Verse 173:
أَوْ تَقُولُوا إِنَّمَا أَشْرَكَ آبَاؤُنَا مِن قَبْلُ وَكُنَّا ذُرِّيَّةً مِّن بَعْدِهِمْ أَفَتُهْلِكُنَا بِمَا فَعَلَ الْمُبْطِلُونَ

Or lest you should say: "It was only our fathers afortime who took others as partners in worship along with Allah, and we were (merely their) descendants after them; will You then destroy us because of the deeds of men who practised Al-Batil (i.e. polytheism and committing crimes and sins, invoking and worshipping others besides Allah)?" (Tafsir At-Tabari).
(English - Mohsin Khan)

via iQuran


Allah تعالى says:

✅ قُلْ أَرَأَيْتُم مَّا أَنزَلَ اللَّهُ لَكُم مِّن رِّزْقٍ فَجَعَلْتُم مِّنْهُ حَرَامًا وَحَلَالًا قُلْ آللَّهُ أَذِنَ لَكُمْ أَمْ عَلَى اللَّهِ تَفْتَرُونَ

Say (O Muhammad) to these polytheists): "Tell me, what provision Allah has sent down to you! And you have made of it lawful and unlawful." Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Has Allah permitted you (to do so), or do you invent a lie against Allah?"

[Surah Yunus, 10:59]


حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو بَكْرِ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ، حَدَّثَنَا عَفَّانُ، حَدَّثَنَا حَمَّادُ بْنُ سَلَمَةَ، عَنْ ثَابِتٍ، عَنْ أَنَسٍ، أَنَّ رَجُلاً، قَالَ يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ أَيْنَ أَبِي قَالَ ‏"‏ فِي النَّارِ ‏"‏ ‏.‏ فَلَمَّا قَفَّى دَعَاهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ إِنَّ أَبِي وَأَبَاكَ فِي النَّارِ ‏"‏ ‏.‏

Anas reported: Verily, a person said: Messenger of Allah, where is my father? He said: (He) is in the Fire. When he turned away, he (the Holy Prophet) called him and said: Verily my father and your father are in the Fire.


Sahih Muslim
Reference: Sahih Muslim 203 (The Book of Faith)
In-book reference: Book 1, Hadith 408


حَدَّثَنَا يَحْيَى بْنُ أَيُّوبَ، وَمُحَمَّدُ بْنُ عَبَّادٍ، - وَاللَّفْظُ لِيَحْيَى - قَالاَ حَدَّثَنَا مَرْوَانُ، بْنُ مُعَاوِيَةَ عَنْ يَزِيدَ، - يَعْنِي ابْنَ كَيْسَانَ - عَنْ أَبِي حَازِمٍ، عَنْ أَبِي هُرَيْرَةَ، قَالَ قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏"‏ اسْتَأْذَنْتُ رَبِّي أَنْ أَسْتَغْفِرَ لأُمِّي فَلَمْ يَأْذَنْ لِي وَاسْتَأْذَنْتُهُ أَنْ أَزُورَ قَبْرَهَا فَأَذِنَ لِي ‏"
‏ ‏.‏
Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger, (ﷺ) as saying: I sought permission to beg forgiveness for my mother, but He did not grant it to me. I sought permission from Him to visit her grave, and He granted it (permission) to me.


Sahih Muslim
(The Book of Prayer - Funerals)
Reference : Sahih Muslim 976 a
In-book reference : Book 11, Hadith 134


حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو بَكْرِ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ، وَزُهَيْرُ بْنُ حَرْبٍ، قَالاَ حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ عُبَيْدٍ، عَنْ يَزِيدَ بْنِ كَيْسَانَ، عَنْ أَبِي حَازِمٍ، عَنْ أَبِي هُرَيْرَةَ، قَالَ زَارَ النَّبِيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم قَبْرَ أُمِّهِ فَبَكَى وَأَبْكَى مَنْ حَوْلَهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ اسْتَأْذَنْتُ رَبِّي فِي أَنْ أَسْتَغْفِرَ لَهَا فَلَمْ يُؤْذَنْ لِي وَاسْتَأْذَنْتُهُ فِي أَنْ أَزُورَ قَبْرَهَا فَأُذِنَ لِي فَزُورُوا الْقُبُورَ فَإِنَّهَا تُذَكِّرُ الْمَوْتَ ‏"
‏ ‏.‏
Abu Huraira reported: The Apostle of Allah (ﷺ) visited the grave of his mother and he wept, and moved others around him to tears, and said: I sought permission from my Lord to beg forgiveness for her but it was not granted to me, and I sought permission to visit her grave and it was granted to me so visit the graves, for that makes you mindful of death.


Sahih Muslim
(The Book of Prayer - Funerals)
Reference : Sahih Muslim 976 b
In-book reference : Book 11, Hadith 135

hapheeyxz:

Don't u get, the prophet was among them and he was there to correct them and also to teach us our Deen.. assuming they refuse when he corrected them now, that is when u can use all that as deleel. Or better still, give me one hadith from the prophet that says there is one bidia that is SIN. just 1 hadith.
YOU CAN ALSO GO THROIGH THIS....
*NO EXCUSE OF IGNORANCE IN MATTER OF BELIEF (AQEEDAH)*

SubhanAllaah, I can confidently say you didn't read my post properly;

The hadith I brought clearly shows that not all bid'ah takes you out of Islam, how bout when Uthman ibn madhun was corrected more than once about refraining from sexual activities, that his wife came to report to Aaishah, why didn't the prophet declared uthman ibn madhun a kafir because he was corrected more than once?

Again Abu Israil did bid'ah and according to you "all bid'ah is kufr", if that's the case, the prophet would've told him that his fasting is invalidated, because once act of kufr enters a deed, it invalidates it.

Lastly, it is the ijma' of the ummah, the salafs and the sahabah that bid'ah has types, the prophet said his ummah can't agree on misguidance, implying the ijma' of scholars is infallible, and ijma' says; bid'ah is two.

.

RABIUSHILE04:


That is a Jabata thinking o.. It is like LexiconKabir said. Not all bidia takes one out of Islaam. But underrating small bidia leads to more bidia, until one commits bidia mukafirah, wallaahu allaam.

The question is not about Jabata thinking. Are u telling me that it is only Jabata that preaches it. You need to see other sunni imam that said the same thing.

gearcoin:

The question is not about Jabata thinking. Are u telling me that it is only Jabata that preaches it. You need to see other sunni imam that said the same thing.

Have you seen the proof I gave? BTW what's the name of this sunni imam?

FriendChoice:


Let me Logically answer your question in few sentences.

What is Shirk? Associating partner of any kind with God or performing act of worship to someone beside Allah.

Maulud: is there any form of worship or association to anyone beside God in Maulud (Prophet Birthday) ? No

How can maulud (Prophet Birthday) be shirk. It's rather prohibited but not shirk.

The problem is that people do not know the implication of bidiah.

Read this full text:
Dangers of Bid’ah:



1) Thinking you are getting closer to Allah – Allah accepts theactions of those who make their intentions for Him alone and accordingto His ways.Shaytan loves Bid’ah because people rarely repent from it thinkingthey are on the right path getting closer to Allah.



2) Dividing the Ummah – Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) said:



“…my Ummah will be fragmented into seventy-three sects. All of themwill be in Hell Fire except one sect. They (the Companions) said:Allah’s Messenger, which is that? Whereupon he said: It is one towhich I and my companions belong.” [At- Tirmidhi]



A Muslim of the Sunnah will be forced to stay away from the practiceof Bid’ah and will therefore be separated from other Muslims



3) Destruction of the Sunnah – Ibn Abbas said, “When Bid’ah is createdthen the Sunnah dies and this continues until that Bid’ah is livingand the Sunnah is dead.”



And also, the Prophet (peace be upon him) said: “Islam began assomething strange, and it shall return as something strange as itbegan. So give glad tidings to the strangers.” It was asked, “Who arethe strangers?” He replied, “Those that purify and correct what thepeople have corrupted of my Sunnah” [at-Tabarani]



This corruption is Bid’ah, where people have changed the religion ofAllah until the Sunnah has become corrupted.



4) Committing Shirk – An example from one Muslim country when they laythe foundation of a new house they put up a flag pole and raise apiece of cloth like a scarf or something to protect the house from theevil eye during the time it is being built. Some even place a tire(yes a car tire) on the pole to protect them. They also dip their handin henna and make a hand print with the henna on the new walls of thehouse to protect it from the evil eye. This is Shirk!!



5) Damaging the image of Islam – For the Ummah as a whole, Bid’ahhurts the spreading of Islam and Dawah for the sake of Allah. Honourkillings (the killing of a daughter for committing fornication) is anexample. There is nothing in Islam that allows a family to execute the

Islamic Shari’ah their own way. There is a process for dealing withadultery, and for the unmarried person it is in fact 100 lashings, notdeath. People, ignorant of Islam believe that this is how our religionis and those guilty of this form of Bid’ah, in fact guilty of one ofthe worst of major sins, taking the life of a Muslim, are harming theway the non Muslims view Islam.



6) Bid’ah is the cause of Fitnah or severe punishment for this Ummah -

As Allah says: “For those people who are differing from the commandsof Prophet, there will come to them either a Fitnah (test or trialfrom Allah) or a severe punishment.” [Noble Quran 24:63]



And you can look in the Muslim countries where Bid’ah is rampant.



- Celebrating the Prophet’s Birthday

- Reading Quran for the dead e.g. Chapter Yasin or celebrate 40 daysafter a person’s died

- Putting head stones or monuments over the grave

- Asking the dead to make Du’a for them or relay the message to Allah



7) Bid’ah is a stepping stone to disbelief – Allah says:



“The way of those on whom Thou hast bestowed Thy Grace, those whose

(portion) is not wrath, and who go not astray.” [Noble Quran 1:7]



This verse refers to the Christians and the Jews. They introduced newlaws into the religion and this took them away from the true messageof the Prophets Musa and Issa (peace be upon them). They took torulings of their priests and rabbis over the words of Allah and hisMessengers.

Individually, Bid’ah destroys the Hereafter of the person -

Narrated Ayshah: Allah’s Apostle said, “If somebody innovatessomething which is not in harmony with the principles of our religion,that thing is rejected.”



9) May lead to lying on Allah and His messenger – The Prophet said:



“Whoever knowingly lie upon me, then let him occupy his seat in theFire (of Hell)”. [Bukhari, Muslim & others]



People will twist or fabricate Hadiths or reference.


-------------------------------------------------------------
Conclusion: no single bidiah is small. Bidiah is bidiah.

^^ yes, bid'ah is bidah......but not all takes you out of Islam!

lexiconkabir:


Well there are many evidences that all bid'ah is not shirk, a very glaring evidence is the situation of Abu israil found in sahih bukhari;

While the Prophet (ﷺ ) was delivering a sermon, he saw a man standing, so he asked about that man. They (the people) said, "It is Abu Israil who has vowed that he will stand and never sit down, and he will never come in the shade, nor speak to anybody, and will fast.'' The Prophet (ﷺ ) said, "Order him to speak and let him come in the shade, and make him sit down, but let him complete his fast."{sahih bukhari no. 6704}

1.) This man was standing under the sun with the belief that he is worshipping Allaah.

2.) What he did was clearly bid'ah!

3.) The prophet didnt call him a kafir

4.) The prophet just rejected his bid'ah and told him to continue his fasting.

5.) The prophet himself has made it clear that not all bid'ah takes you out of Islam.

Now if all bid'ah was shirk, then the prophet would've told Abu israil that all his deed including the fasting has become invalid because the ijma' of the scholars is, shirk(done knowingly or unknowingly) dismantles good deeds, here is their proof;

Say: Spend (in Allaah’s Cause) willingly or unwillingly, it will not be accepted from you. Verily, you are ever a people who are Faasiqoon (rebellious, disobedient to Allaah).”
And nothing prevents their contributions from being accepted from them except that they disbelieved in Allaah and in His Messenger (Muhammad), and that they came not to As-Salaah (the prayer) except in a lazy state, and that they offer not contributions but unwillingly”
[al-Tawbah 9:53-54]

As we can see Allaah says he wont accept the disbelievers good deeds because of their kufr.

Ibn Taymiyah (rahimahullaah) said:
Nothing cancels out good deeds except kufr, because the one who dies as a believer will inevitably enter Paradise, and he will be brought out of Hell if he does enter it, but if all his good deeds are cancelled out, he will never enter Paradise. Good deeds can only be cancelled out by that which is their opposite, and nothing can be the opposite of all good deeds except kufr. This is well known from the principles of Sunnah.{ Al-Saarim al-Maslool (p. 55) }

1.) I have shown that Abu israil did bid'ah

2.) If his bid'ah was kufr,then the prophet would've told him that his good deed(which is fasting) has been destroyed

3.) But the prophet did not, rather he rejected only the bid'ah and asked him to continue.

4.) Quran says All kufr destroys your good deeds and this is the aqeedah of the salaf as-solih

5.) So if Abu israil bid'ah was kufr, the good deed he was doing(i.e fasting) would've been destroyed.

Am still expecting a single verse or hadith from you that support your claim that bidiah can be categorize after all, there is numerous evidences that show where Allah categorize the shirk into types.


Since Allah did not categorise bidiah into types, he only categorize the shirks so stop twisting happenings to suit your belief.

lexiconkabir:
^^ yes, bid'ah is bidah......but not all takes you out of Islam!

With due respect, can u give me an example of bidiah that doesn't take someone out of Islam.
Remember we all agreed bidiah is bidiah

gearcoin:


The problem is that people do not know the implication of bidiah.

Read this full text:
Dangers of Bid’ah:



1) Thinking you are getting closer to Allah – Allah accepts theactions of those who make their intentions for Him alone and accordingto His ways.Shaytan loves Bid’ah because people rarely repent from it thinkingthey are on the right path getting closer to Allah.



2) Dividing the Ummah – Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) said:



“…my Ummah will be fragmented into seventy-three sects. All of themwill be in Hell Fire except one sect. They (the Companions) said:Allah’s Messenger, which is that? Whereupon he said: It is one towhich I and my companions belong.” [At- Tirmidhi]



A Muslim of the Sunnah will be forced to stay away from the practiceof Bid’ah and will therefore be separated from other Muslims



3) Destruction of the Sunnah – Ibn Abbas said, “When Bid’ah is createdthen the Sunnah dies and this continues until that Bid’ah is livingand the Sunnah is dead.”



And also, the Prophet (peace be upon him) said: “Islam began assomething strange, and it shall return as something strange as itbegan. So give glad tidings to the strangers.” It was asked, “Who arethe strangers?” He replied, “Those that purify and correct what thepeople have corrupted of my Sunnah” [at-Tabarani]



This corruption is Bid’ah, where people have changed the religion ofAllah until the Sunnah has become corrupted.



4) Committing Shirk – An example from one Muslim country when they laythe foundation of a new house they put up a flag pole and raise apiece of cloth like a scarf or something to protect the house from theevil eye during the time it is being built. Some even place a tire(yes a car tire) on the pole to protect them. They also dip their handin henna and make a hand print with the henna on the new walls of thehouse to protect it from the evil eye. This is Shirk!!



5) Damaging the image of Islam – For the Ummah as a whole, Bid’ahhurts the spreading of Islam and Dawah for the sake of Allah. Honourkillings (the killing of a daughter for committing fornication) is anexample. There is nothing in Islam that allows a family to execute the

Islamic Shari’ah their own way. There is a process for dealing withadultery, and for the unmarried person it is in fact 100 lashings, notdeath. People, ignorant of Islam believe that this is how our religionis and those guilty of this form of Bid’ah, in fact guilty of one ofthe worst of major sins, taking the life of a Muslim, are harming theway the non Muslims view Islam.



6) Bid’ah is the cause of Fitnah or severe punishment for this Ummah -

As Allah says: “For those people who are differing from the commandsof Prophet, there will come to them either a Fitnah (test or trialfrom Allah) or a severe punishment.” [Noble Quran 24:63]



And you can look in the Muslim countries where Bid’ah is rampant.



- Celebrating the Prophet’s Birthday

- Reading Quran for the dead e.g. Chapter Yasin or celebrate 40 daysafter a person’s died

- Putting head stones or monuments over the grave

- Asking the dead to make Du’a for them or relay the message to Allah



7) Bid’ah is a stepping stone to disbelief – Allah says:



“The way of those on whom Thou hast bestowed Thy Grace, those whose

(portion) is not wrath, and who go not astray.” [Noble Quran 1:7]



This verse refers to the Christians and the Jews. They introduced newlaws into the religion and this took them away from the true messageof the Prophets Musa and Issa (peace be upon them). They took torulings of their priests and rabbis over the words of Allah and hisMessengers.

Individually, Bid’ah destroys the Hereafter of the person -

Narrated Ayshah: Allah’s Apostle said, “If somebody innovatessomething which is not in harmony with the principles of our religion,that thing is rejected.”



9) May lead to lying on Allah and His messenger – The Prophet said:



“Whoever knowingly lie upon me, then let him occupy his seat in theFire (of Hell)”. [Bukhari, Muslim & others]



People will twist or fabricate Hadiths or reference.


-------------------------------------------------------------
Conclusion: no single bidiah is small. Bidiah is bidiah.

Yeah Bidi'a is Bidi'a No Bid'a is small and at the same time not all Bid'a is Shirk.

Bidi'a (innovations) is what corrupted the older Scripture of Ingeel, Taura etc

FriendChoice:



Yeah Bidi'a is Bidi'a No Bid'a is small and at the same time not all Bid'a is Shirk.

Bidi'a (innovations) is what corrupted the older Scripture of Ingeel, Taura etc

Kindly give one example of bidiah that is not shirk?
Thanks.

.

gearcoin:
Kindly give one example of bidiah that is not shirk? Thanks.

Kindly read my older post that you quoted. Thanks

FriendChoice:


Kindly read my older post that you quoted. Thanks

Since bidiah is bidiah, all bidiah is the same no matter how small it is. No strong sunnatic evidence from both hadith and Quran to support a notion that one bidiah is shirk or not shirk. In fact for every one to categorising bidiah into types is not encouraging. Leave it like that since Allah did not categorise it like he did for shirk.

gearcoin:

Since bidiah is bidiah, all bidiah is the same no matter how small it is. No strong sunnatic evidence from both hadith and Quran to support a notion that one bidiah is shirk or not shirk. In fact for every one to categorising bidiah into types is not encouraging. Leave it like that since Allah did not categorise it like he did for shirk.

Sir I don't want this type of your argument. Shirk is defined. Maulud is Bid'a but not shirk. And all form of Bidi'a should be avoided.



Is a person who Celebrate Maulud become Mushrik (Kafirun) ? Answer me.

FriendChoice:


Sir I don't want this type of your argument. Shirk is defined. Maulud is Bid'a but not shirk. And all form of Bidi'a should be avoided.



Is a person who Celebrate Maulud become Mushrik (Kafirun) ? Answer me.

That person is alubidiah and will surely out of Islam if such person is adamant in such belief because every bidiah is a stepping stone to disbelief.
“Every innovation is a misguidance, and every misguidance goes to Hell fire. (Sahih Muslim).”
Allah know best.

gearcoin:

That person is alubidiah and will surely out of Islam if such person is adamant in such belief because every bidiah is a stepping stone to disbelief.
“Every innovation is a misguidance, and every misguidance goes to Hell fire. (Sahih Muslim).”
Allah know best.

I don't understand too much grammar sir. Let me put the question in place again.

Answer the following question with True or False and nothing else.

A person who Celebrate the Maulud (Birthday) of prophet peace be him has become non believer (Kafirun) ? True or False

FriendChoice:


I don't understand too much grammar sir. Let me put the question in place again.

Answer the following question with True or False and nothing else.

A person who Celebrate the Maulud (Birthday) of prophet peace be him has become non believer (Kafirun) ? True or False

Read my recent post again and draft the answer from it.
It is clearly enough sir.
Thank you.

RABIUSHILE04:
Also yah ikhwan, every thing you do as a muslim, especially acts of worship. We MUST know the daleel, not just do things that r alien in Islaam just bcuz u met ur parents doing it. And when you're corrected, confirm abt d correction very well, don't say, "we met our fathers doing it", like those Allaah(subhanahu wata'allah) told us abt in the Qur'an. Rasullullaah brought from Allaah guidance from Allaah dat has to do with every aspect of LIFE..EVERY aspect, I tell u. Did you know a thief has a right over you in some circumstance? Even when you're in doubt, there is guidance... Allaahu musta'an.

I am very wary of all these talks about bid'a this and bid'a. It is one subtle way salafists and wahabist brainwash people and gradually introduced their violence and intolerance. I celebrate maulid and it cannot be bid'a because the prophet used to fast on Mondays because according to him he was borne that day. So I see no harm if I celebrate his birth. Salatil fatih on the other hand is salatil nabiy like many other salawats. So pls let's be wary of this so called salafists because is just a name there is nothing salaf about them rather the preach hatred, violence and intolerance. I keep them at arms length

gearcoin:

Read my recent post again and draft the answer from it.
It is clearly enough sir.
Thank you.

As I said earlier I don't understand too much grammar. If you're sure of what you said answer this question below, except you're arguing blindly and don't want to take corrections when it's clear you're wrong. It's more easier to answer this question than long English.


A person who Celebrate the Maulud (Birthday) of prophet peace be him has become non believer (Kafirun) ? True or False

blantyre:

I am very wary of all these talks about bid'a this and bid'a. It is one subtle way salafists and wahabist brainwash people and gradually introduced their violence and intolerance. I celebrate maulid and it cannot be bid'a because the prophet used to fast on Mondays because according to him he was borne that day. So I see no harm if I celebrate his birth. Salatil fatih on the other hand is salatil nabiy like many other salawats. So pls let's be wary of this so called salafists because is just a name there is nothing salaf about them rather the preach hatred, violence and intolerance. I keep them at arms length

From what you write now, prophet peace be upon him celebrate Maulud the way it's done today? Yes or No.


Please don't deviate in giving me long grammar. I don't understand that. You said he used to fast, ist what we are doing today as Maulud? Yes or No.


He used to fast on Monday. Do all 12th of Rabi"ul awwal falls on Monday? True or False.

Do his companion practice maulud after his death? Yes or No


Do you love the prophet (SAW) more than sayyid Abubakar (A.s) ? Yes or No


Go straight to the point please.

FriendChoice:


As I said earlier I don't understand too much grammar. If you're sure of what you said answer this question below, except you're arguing blindly and don't want to take corrections when it's clear you're wrong. It's more easier to answer this question than long English.


A person who Celebrate the Maulud (Birthday) of prophet peace be him has become non believer (Kafirun) ? True or False

How did I argue blindly? All your claim lack sunnatic evidence backing. I ask you u shld give me a single hadith of Quran verses that categorise bidiah, uptill now ,u havnt brought one. Instead you continue bringing ideas from your thinking.


Read again and again below:
That person is alubidiah and will surely out of Islam if such person is adamant in such belief because every bidiah is a stepping stone to disbelief.
“Every innovation is a misguidance, and every misguidance goes to Hell fire. (Sahih Muslim).”

gearcoin:


How did I argue blindly? All your claim lack sunnatic evidence backing. I ask you u shld give me a single hadith of Quran verses that categorise bidiah, uptill now ,u havnt brought one. Instead you continue bringing ideas from your thinking.


Read again and again below:
That person is alubidiah and will surely out of Islam if such person is adamant in such belief because every bidiah is a stepping stone to disbelief.
“Every innovation is a misguidance, and every misguidance goes to Hell fire. (Sahih Muslim).”

You're not confident of what you're saying otherwise you would have answered my question with True or False.

I have answered your question that all bidi'a is prohibited but not all bidi'a rendered your Islam invalid. Why? we already know what can lead someone Out of Islam in Suratul Nisa'i.

The Quran must not necessarily and categorical tells you bidi'a is of this and that. But Quran clearly tell us what takes a person ourlt of Islam.


If you're sure of what you claim that a person that do Bid'a no matter it weight is kafirun answered the colored red question with true or false. I conclude you cannot because you know you're wrong but cannot keep ur pride to accept the truth.

By the grace of God I wouldn't quote you on this issue again


May Allah guide you in the knowledge of Islam. Bye

FriendChoice:


You're not confident of what you're saying otherwise you would have answered my question with True or False.

I have answered your question that all bidi'a is prohibited but not all bidi'a rendered your Islam invalid. Why? we already know what can lead someone Out of Islam in Suratul Nisa'i.

The Quran must not necessarily and categorical tells you bidi'a is of this and that. But Quran clearly tell us what takes a person ourlt of Islam.


If you're sure of what you claim that a person that do Bid'a no matter it weight is kafirun answered the colored red question with true or false. I conclude you cannot because you know you're wrong but cannot keep ur pride to accept the truth.

By the grace of God I wouldn't quote you on this issue again


May Allah guide you in the knowledge of Islam. Bye

You're not confident of what you're saying otherwise you would have answered my question with True or False

I am very confident of it , it was you that doesnt understand it . I even support it with a strong hadith . what else you want ? you can read it again.

I have answered your question that all bidi'a is prohibited but not all bidi'a rendered your Islam invalid.

You hav not answer the question at bolded. You need to give an exact verse from quran or hadith that support the claim at bolded. Since you said it , then you need to support it with evidence. responsibilty lie on you bro .

we already know what can lead someone Out of Islam in Suratul Nisa'i.

Please kindly tell us. everybody is learning.

The Quran must not necessarily and categorical tells you bidi'a is of this and that. But Quran clearly tell us what takes a person ourlt of Islam

.

please try to know that quran and hadith categorise the shirk but did not categorise the bidiah. So therefore, no body can categorise the bidiah from his thinking.

If you're sure of what you claim that a person that do Bid'a no matter it weight is kafirun answered the colored red question with true or false. I conclude you cannot because you know you're wrong but cannot keep ur pride to accept the truth.

No bidiah is small. Bidiah can lead someone out of islam if such person is adamant to it Nobody can know more than the messenger of Allah. and Islam has been completed

By the grace of God I wouldn't quote you on this issue again

please, i need your quote if you can back your point with genuine evidence.

May Allah guide you in the knowledge of Islam. Bye

I pray the same for you too.

Ma-salam.

gearcoin:


Am still expecting a single verse or hadith from you that support your claim that bidiah can be categorize after all, there is numerous evidences that show where Allah categorize the shirk into types.


Since Allah did not categorise bidiah into types, he only categorize the shirks so stop twisting happenings to suit your belief.

Twisting? Pls, why was he not called a kafir since to you all bid'ah is kufr.

gearcoin:

Kindly give one example of bidiah that is not shirk?
Thanks.

Doing wudhu and washing 4times instead of 3 is bidah, does that take you out of Islam?