A political storm over visas threatens to derail trade relations between South Africa and Nigeria, and has already obliged Business Unity South Africa (BUSA) to call off a high-profile visit to Abuja over the weekend.
Deputy President Kgalema Motlanthe and various ministers have been in Nigeria, one of the most important African markets, since Friday, to participate in the 10-year celebrations of the South Africa-Nigeria Bi-National Commission (BNC). The objective is to strengthen co-operation between the countries, but the visit is being totally overshadowed by the visa debacle.
Ojo Maduekwe, Minister of Foriegn Affairs
A couple of weeks ago the Nigerian government introduced visa requirements for South African businesspeople, by now calling for a R6 000 deposit per application, the equivalent of demands made of Nigerians by the South African high commission for over a year. Although this is refundable, the attached conditions are obscure, says BUSA director Catherine Grant.
Passports may be handed in on Monday mornings only and the process takes two weeks, causing difficulties for business people who travel regularly. In addition, the stickers for Nigerian visas ran out this week, putting paid to BUSA chief executive Jerry Vilakazi's plan to visit the conference.
Observers reckon that the timing of the new requirements, shortly before Motlanthe's visit, is intended to give South Africans a stiff dose of their own medicine. Nigerian businesspeople have for years had to comply with similar demands, which are designed to prevent them from remaining in South Africa illegally.
Complaints about waiting for hours to apply in Nigeria, and month-long delays in issuing the visas are also common.
Multinational companies, including MTN and KPMG, experience huge problems in sending Nigerian staff here to work or for training, says Dianna Games, manager of the South Africa-Nigeria Chamber of Business.
Although this was an item on the BNC agenda last year, South Africa's Department of Home Affairs is believed not to have bothered to turn up for the discussions on the issue.
"The relationship between South Africa and Nigeria is fairly hostile on various counts, and this will certainly not help. One has to ask whether Nigeria perhaps regards it as insulting to see that President Jacob Zuma visits countries like Angola and Equatorial Guinea with great fanfare, but does not accompany Motlanthe for this conference," commented another source.
Although BUSA has withdrawn from the conference, about 13 small companies will accompany the Department of Trade & Industry to Nigeria. The visa problems have had a negative impact on the number of companies that will eventually attend, declared an official.

Thank God Mr foreign Affairs Minister is begining to see that our foreign policies are so flawed that even common apartheid SA give us shit in the name of Visas.it's high time our diplomacy is geared towards our own benefits,afterall,Nigeria more than any african country has sacrificed enormously for peace and emancipation in Africa but what do we get,shit,scorn and hostile diplomacy from our so-called African brothers,they see us as brothers only when they need our help or need us to commit soldiers over some stupid civil wars going on in their countries.bloody greedy ingrates! It's time we gave them a taste of their own harsh diplomacy and hostile policies.

That's a good one. That was the style of Abacha and Momoh - reciprocal foreign policy and it works best.

U are right Afam,sometimes the hawkish method is the best solution,'Do me I do U,man no go vex'. whoever said give and take is robbery?

Yaaaaaahooooooooooooooo. I love this, This is moses law and should be extended to every country that gives up shit. Come to think of it, if we continue to give them a dose of their medicines, i think they will start changing some stupid and stringent visa requirements for Nigerians.

rhymz:

U are right Afam,sometimes the hawkish method is the best solution,'Do me I do U,man no go vex'. whoever said give and take is robbery?

Sebi na bible talk say make we do unto others as we go want make dem do unto us?

We must begin to demand respect from others if they expect us to respect them.

If not that our AG in my opinion seems to be protecting some of the governors being tried for corruption I would have written articles to support his stand on not granting the request of the UK concerning Ibori since UK and I think France have not granted the request he made to them concerning the Harliburton problem.

If we have bi lateral agreements then the 2 parties must respect such agreements. So, if the UK cannot grant a request from our AG then the AG is 100% correct in refusing to grant a request from them.

The only problem in this case is that the facts on the ground tend to help shield someone who is being investigated for corruption.

Its in times like this that i miss Abacha!!!

Its in times like this that i miss Abacha!!!

And that is why they labelled him all sort.

All he stole was $3bill.

OBJ in just one sector stole $16bill and he is a darling!!!

@back2back

Where is the evidence that OBJ stole 16 billion?

In Brainwashing to establish a truth you just need to repeat a lie thousand of times The Nazi used it.
With abacha the funds are founds

rethink:

@back2back

Where is the evidence that OBJ stole 16 billion?

In Brainwashing to establish a truth you just need to repeat a lie thousand of times The Nazi used it.
With abacha the funds are founds

You must realize that sometimes people say things to make them feel better or justified for their actions.

The lie about $16 billion has been dismantled, corrected, rubbished by facts and yet you still get to see people use this lie as a basis to discuss or debate issues.

It would be interesting to see FG's policy on South African investments in Nigeria.
MTN Group still controls 80% of MTN Nigeria. Local content policies relating to some of these investments should also be defined.
It doesn't stop at visa.

rethink:

@back2back

Where is the evidence that OBJ stole 16 billion?

In Brainwashing to establish a truth you just need to repeat a lie thousand of times The Nazi used it.
With abacha the funds are founds

Ok, she made a mistake. OBJ and/or his government mismanaged 16 billion and allowed all kinds of things to happen in his administration with Ibori and co - buying and selling multinational companies, receiving bribes and allowing them to have a field day in naija.

Epiphany:

Ok, she made a mistake. OBJ and/or his government mismanaged 16 billion and allowed all kinds of things to happen in his administration with Ibori and co - buying and selling multinational companies, receiving bribes and allowing them to have a field day in naija.

There was never anything like $16 billion and that is the issue. Somebody was fired for attempting to correct the president's figure. Senate and House of Reps had different figures and the media was agog with $16 billion.

After all the noise died down figures in the neighborhood of $5 billion were reported as the independent power project.

So, when $16 billion never existed then every single comment based on the lie becomes null and void.

We must learn to respect facts and demand from the media to feed us facts, just facts.

rethink:

@back2back

Where is the evidence that OBJ stole 16 billion?

In Brainwashing to establish a truth you just need to repeat a lie thousand of times The Nazi used it.
With abacha the funds are founds

Because he's dead, if he was alive would it have been the same story?

While I agree that $16billion is not the accurate representation of the amount mismanaged by OBJ and his cronies and the topic is not abt OBJ's regime,I dare to say the amount in question is close to that,OBJ's tenure saw a lot of corrupt practices that crippled almost everything in this country,he legalized it,rebranded it and made it the darling indulgence of the elite class.So am not even interested in the true figure,it doesn't make the crime any less jare!make I die the issue here biko b4 i go start to dey para bcoz of that Ape!
As for this new regime,they had better do sth fast coz nigeria is loosing face faster than an obesse woman is losing weight.

China built 3-Gorges Dam for $25bn in 4 years and added 10,000mW.Obj spent $16bn and reduced the power generation capacity to below 2000mW.What other evidence do you need?

There was never anything like $16 billion and that is the issue. Somebody was fired for attempting to correct the president's figure. Senate and House of Reps had different figures and the media was agog with $16 billion.

After all the noise died down figures in the neighborhood of $5 billion were reported as the independent power project.

So, when $16 billion never existed then every single comment based on the lie becomes null and void.

We must learn to respect facts and demand from the media to feed us facts, just facts.

Yaradua is the President of Nigeria.

He clearly said OBJ wasted $16bill

I would believe Yaradua statement over anyone else!

This is not first time OBJ has been 'dabaru everything'; Fela sang about this even way back in 1978.

OBJ stole our $16billion!

back2back:

Yaradua is the President of Nigeria.

He clearly said OBJ wasted $16bill

I would believe Yaradua statement over anyone else!

This is not first time OBJ has been 'dabaru everything'; Fela sang about this even way back in 1978.

OBJ stole our $16billion!

The content in bold refers, can you point us to any evidence, statement or article where Yaradua made that statement about OBJ wasting $16 billion?

I guess this should be a simple thing to prove considering the interest the issue generated.

So, just educate us on that statement before we muddle things up with other diversions.

http://www.internationalrivers.org/en/node/2588

In this article, it is said that Yar'Adua himself made it known that btw 1999 and 2007, the administration of his predecessor spent $10 billion on the power sector without building any new power plants.
However, for the fun of it, if you google "$16 billion + Nigeria + Yar'Adua + Obasanjo", you will come up with so many news clippings and stories of that exact amount from different news sources. So who do we believe? Or are we to say that ALL these stories are fabricated? ALL?

I understand that this thread is digressing so instead of taking it further away from its topic, lets just agree that OBJ Mismanaged SOME BILLIONS OF DOLLARS. It does not matter what the amount was. If ever he (or his administration) is found guilty, mismanaging 1billion or 10billion will still fetch those involved some stiff penalties.

Epiphany:

http://www.internationalrivers.org/en/node/2588

In this article, it is said that Yar'Adua himself made it known that btw 1999 and 2007, the administration of his predecessor spent $10 billion on the power sector without building any new power plants.
However, for the fun of it, if you google "$16 billion + Nigeria + Yar'Adua + Obasanjo", you will come up with so many news clippings and stories of that exact amount from different news sources. So who do we believe? Or are we to say that ALL these stories are fabricated? ALL?

I understand that this thread is digressing so instead of taking it further away from its topic, lets just agree that OBJ Mismanaged SOME BILLIONS OF DOLLARS. It does not matter what the amount was. If ever he (or his administration) is found guilty, mismanaging 1billion or 10billion will still fetch those involved some stiff penalties.

Different amounts were reportedly spent or wasted from $10 billion to $16 billion with the law makers and presidency claiming $13 billion at a time. An economic adviser who attempted to correct the mistake by the presidency was fired. At the end of the day the same law makers put the amount to about $5 billion.

Now, this is about the amount quoted.

What did they consider wastage?

Most of the comments that nothing were on ground based on trips and tours of the law makers were based on complete ignorance on what constituted EPC contracts.

Many wondered why over 60% of funds were given out to relevant contractors without seeing anything on ground forgetting that you can as well spend over 70% of the total project amount without seeing anything on ground and this is perfectly normal in such contracts where the bulk of the time and money goes into engineering design and procurement which usually includes custom fabrication of components based on small but important things as little as soil texture and gas composition for the gas fired power plants.

Imported (completed) turbines were even laying waste at different ports while the ongoing probe was on and the projects were still within the stipulated time frame and yet close to 1 year was wasted in the process.

However, there were irregularities in the award of some contracts and those responsible should be made to face the music.

My point is that love OBJ or hate him when it comes to solving the power problem in this country no president or head of state has done more than this man who has his own faults and made some mistakes while he was in power.

We must avoid blanket commendation or commendation and instead admit the positive or the negative actions of anyone without any sentiments based on facts.

STOLE, WASTE, FRAUD, MISS-MANAGED, CORRUPTION etc = end of the day, the purpose for the money was not achieved!!!

$16billion gone only to bring us MORE DARKNESS!

OBJ stolen our $16billion!

back2back:

STOLE, WASTE, FRAUD, MISS-MANAGED, CORRUPTION etc = end of the day, the purpose for the money was not achieved!!!

$16billion gone only to bring us MORE DARKNESS!

OBJ stolen our $16billion!

You see why I stated that you cannot stand facts? Your lie about $16 billion remains a lie and even a bigger lie was that you claimed Yaradua made the claim.

Please, learn to have some respect for facts and truth, it really helps in life.

A simple task for you to prove a statement that has been repeated over and over could not be completed because a lie cannot stand any serious scrutiny.

I agree with Afam on the issue relating to attempts made by the OBJ's administration to improve power generation through IPP and other projects. It was at least the beginning of something positive in the power sector.

And now back to the scheduled program. . . . . .  .

Na for all these kind do me, i do you  Ojo maduekwe go raise him ugly head.

Nice one though

back2back,

You are not doing yourself any favours by using emotive language like ' OBJ stole $ 16 Billion '  The facts do not support such loose talk.

There is a world of difference between someone stealing $ 16 Billion and mis-management of power projects.

kuramo:

back2back,

You are not doing yourself any favours by using emotive language like ' OBJ stole $ 16 Billion ' The facts do not support such loose talk.

There is a world of difference between someone stealing $ 16 Billion and mis-management of power projects.

Indeed.

In January, Nigeria’s new President Umaru Yar’Adua announced that between 1999 and 2007, the administration of his predecessor Olusegun Obasanjo spent $10 billion on the power sector without building any new power plants. A leading legislator soon raised the figure to $16 billion and started a parliamentary investigation into the matter

OBJ was given $16bill and all he provided was DARKNESS!

Yet his moribound farm in 1999 is now blossing!

OBJ stolen our $16billion.

We shouldn't stop at making visa's difficult. Nigeria should nationalise MTN the way Murtala Mohamed nationalised Shell. . . Then they will know.

Beaf:

We shouldn't stop at making visa's difficult. Nigeria should nationalise MTN the way Murtala Mohamed nationalised Shell. . . Then they will know.

Yes, you are correct, it is pay back time!
Tit for tat.

Beaf:

We shouldn't stop at making visa's difficult. Nigeria should nationalise MTN the way Murtala Mohamed nationalised Shell. . . Then they will know.

eh take am easy o. Which Boko Haram advice be this?

back2back:



And that is why they labelled him all sort.

All he stole was $3bill.

OBJ in just one sector stole $16bill and he is a darling!!!

just 3billion? Not many people consider OBJ a darling by the way. It doesn't matter how much abacha stole, he was responsible for one of the darkest periods in Nigerian history.

I am very happy about this. Make dem taste their own broth, I cannot stand South Africans, black or white, they have this superiority complex that bother the hell out of me.