Joagbaje:

The bible is clear on how to know false teachers etc : it has to do with their doctrine of salvation what do they profess. Who is christ to you. You are the one acting like a false teacher. You don't have a pastor , You can't understand spiritual things until you're born again ,come out of whatever unspiritual religious organisation .join a living church and submit yourself to a pastor.

From this your last post i would hence forth no longer be grudge you, infact i now have deep sympathy for you as you are evidently into Idol worship. [Idolizing Pastors] Did your bible teach you to submit yourself to your fellow man or to the will of God My brother you are seriously lost and you desperately need deliverance. i suggest you pray fervently and ask christ to reveal his truth to you, you also carry out an indepent reading of the new testament in detail to know and understand what the gospel of christ really is as opposed to the jargon you are being fed in what ever sect or cult you belong to. I have already posted enough to show you that the bible teaches that false teachers would be more interested in our money but your pentecostal delusions won't allow you understand that, the bible says we shall know false teachers by the fruits they display and NOT the doctrine of salvation they profess. Any false teacher can preach the correct doctrine of salvation but the real test is if he practises it and abides by it or is it a case of do as i say and not as i do? You know hypocrisy and deceit is one of the hallmarks of the pentecostal movement.

[b]From this your last post i would hence forth no longer be grudge you, infact i now have deep sympathy for you as you are evidently into Idol worship. [Idolizing Pastors] Did your bible teach you to submit yourself to your fellow man or to the will of God My brother you are seriously lost and you desperately need deliverance. i suggest you pray fervently and ask christ to reveal his truth to you, you also carry out an indepent reading of the new testament in detail to know and understand what the gospel of christ really is as opposed to the jargon you are being fed in what ever sect or cult you belong to. I have already posted enough to show you that the bible teaches that false teachers would be more interested in our money but your pentecostal delusions won't allow you understand that, the bible says we shall know false teachers by the fruits they display and NOT the doctrine of salvation they profess. Any false teacher can preach the correct doctrine of salvation but the real test is if he practises it and abides by it or is it a case of do as i say and not as i do? You know hypocrisy and deceit is one of the hallmarks of the pentecostal movement.
[/b]

Joagbaje:

The bible is clear on how to know false teachers etc : it has to do with their doctrine of salvation what do they profess. Who is christ to you. You are the one acting like a false teacher. You don't have a pastor , You can't understand spiritual things until you're born again ,come out of whatever unspiritual religious organisation .join a living church and submit yourself to a pastor.

Mr Agbaje, your name has exposed you! And you will fail in your endeavour. You will not gain a single penny from us here.

Mr Agbaje, your name has exposed you! And you will fail in your endeavour. You will not gain a single penny from us here.

@pastorAIO a man of light has notin to hide, is only fakes that answer names like pastor AIO bc they are liars and haters.

Pastor AIO:

Mr Agbaje, your name has exposed you! And you will fail in your endeavour. You will not gain a single penny from us here.

childish nonsense. AGBAJE means profit maker. I make and give to God. if the name offend you what you make of Creflo DOLLAR. Im sure it will want to make you run mad. Money is my servant , money serves me. I use money recklessly for the gospel. I have because i give. if youre offended , join the wiining team . stabut get BORN AGAIN first.

In my father's house there are lots of mansion, ", but no Nigerian i know wants to go to that mansion yet because DEATH is going to be involved, even my pastor wants to ride an Escalade first before rapture,

tbaba83:

In my father's house there are lots of mansion, ", but no Nigerian i know wants to go to that mansion yet because DEATH is going to be involved, even my pastor wants to ride an Escalade first before rapture,

@tbaba what is wrong wit that, why dont u stay inside forest waiting for paradise.

nuella2:

@tbaba what is wrong wit that, why dont u stay inside forest waiting for paradise.

HA u have shown me ur way of thinking. am sure u are familiar that money is the root of all evil. a man of God should not concern himself with earthly pleasures of the world.

tbaba83:

HA u have shown me your way of thinking. am sure u are familiar that money is the root of all evil. a man of God should not concern himself with earthly pleasures of the world.

@tbaba what do u mean by earthly pleasures, why dont u be sleepin on the floor instead of bed, why dont u stop using the internet too and go back to the garden of Eden and use donkey for transport. When we own the world what is common escalade.

my dear, i am not a pastor and even if i was then God has called me to leave behind these earthly pleasures of the world  in order to fulfill the righteous destiny HE has designated for me.  look at your mouth like common escalade. THIEF.  an escalade is a full-size luxury sport utility vehicle (SUV) sold by the General Motors luxury brand, Cadillac. Why is it that whenever you see celebrities, spotlights and red carpets, there's so often an Escalade in the shot? Artfully framed by jewel-like Xenon High-Intensity Discharge (HID) headlights, the signature Cadillac grille goes beyond bold all the way to audacious. A steeply raked windshield signals impressive performance capability while layer upon layer of chrome gleams from roof to road. How dare u put common beside escalade.  . No on a serious note i am not saying a man of God should not drive a car but driving a posh car like an escalade is not reasonable. Abi is it not the same Jesus who told the rich chap to give all his money to the poor and follow Him. Why would JESUS say that?

@tbaba
These deluded pentecostal customers of the prosperity gospel preching merchants are too deluded to understand the gospel of Christ. They would rather believe thier pastors than the teachings of christ. Here is how the bible explains their situation:

1 John 4:5:
5 Those false teachers belong to this world, so they speak from the world’s viewpoint, and the world listens to them.

Joagbaje:

childish nonsense. AGBAJE means profit maker. I make and give to God. if the name offend you what you make of Creflo DOLLAR. Im sure it will want to make you run mad. Money is my servant , money serves me. I use money recklessly for the gospel. I have because i give. if youre offended , join the wiining team . stabut get BORN AGAIN first.

I prefer Fatai Rolling Dollar.

Anyway, as I told you before, yoruba don talk am say, 'oruko li on ro eni'. Na name dey herald person. You name has exposed you.

Joagbaje:

childish nonsense. AGBAJE means profit maker. I make and give to God. if the name offend you what you make of Creflo DOLLAR. Im sure it will want to make you run mad. Money is my servant , money serves me. I use money recklessly for the gospel. I have because i give. if youre offended , join the wiining team . stabut get BORN AGAIN first.

Hmmm so your name means profit maker no wonder you are bent on making profit out of the gospel, i am sure it was your likes that Peter was talking about in the scripture below:

2 Peter 2:1-3:
1But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2And many shall follow their pernicious ways, by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evilly spoken of.
3And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you -- they whose judgment now for a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

@ KunleOshob
Hypocrite! So what's the meaning of your own name "Kunle"? It means something fills the house. You're aware it doesn't stand alone . Either it's OlaKunle ( wealth fills the house) can you see your hypocrisy . But since you hate prosperity I hope it's not. PovertyKunle or Deathkunle . If it is , I simpathise with you . Just change the name. To success or Agbaje !

By the way I want to know what your concept of salvation is
what do you understand by the gospel?
Are you born again.

Mr Agbaje you might learn a thing or two from the scriptures below, peace.

Amplified Bible (AMP)

Passage 1 Timothy 6:3-11:
3But if anyone teaches otherwise and does not assent to the sound and wholesome messages of our Lord Jesus Christ (the Messiah) and the teaching which is in agreement with godliness (piety toward God),

4He is puffed up with pride and stupefied with conceit, [although he is] woefully ignorant. He has a morbid fondness for controversy and disputes and strife about words, which result in (produce) envy and jealousy, quarrels and dissension, abuse and insults and slander, and base suspicions,

5And protracted wrangling and wearing discussion and perpetual friction among men who are corrupted in mind and bereft of the truth, who imagine that godliness or righteousness is a source of profit [a moneymaking business, a means of livelihood]. From such withdraw.

6[And it is, indeed, a source of immense profit, for] godliness accompanied with contentment (that contentment which is a sense of [d]inward sufficiency) is great and abundant gain.

7For we brought nothing into the world, and obviously we cannot take anything out of the world;

8But if we have food and clothing, with these we shall be content (satisfied).

9But those who crave to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and into many foolish (useless, godless) and hurtful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction and miserable perishing.

10For the love of money is a root of all evils; it is through this craving that some have been led astray and have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves through with many [e]acute [mental] pangs.

11But as for you, O man of God, flee from all these things; aim at and pursue righteousness (right standing with God and true goodness), godliness (which is the loving fear of God and being Christlike), faith, love, steadfastness (patience), and gentleness of heart.

@ KunleOshob
I wish I always have time to attend to you. You're still dodging the question . what is your concept of salvation? Someone has rightly alleged that all you guys that are Anti-miracle ,anti-pastors ,Anti-prosperity on this Forum are Jehovahs witneses . If it's true then you have to get born again first. Because it takes the spirit of God to understand . You don't have the holyghost , you don't believe in the supernatural , you lack the power of the spirit. You mix scriptures together , either delibrately to confuse others so you could win argument. I don't argue . Because I can't argue a man into salvation. God didn't call us to be witnesses of Jehovah! But witneses of Christ resurrection.Jehovahs name can't save ! All power is given to the name of Jesus. Accept the the lordship of Jesus christ you will understand the purpose of his death. He died for our pain , poverty, etc
luke4:18 , " he has anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor,
What the poor need is gospel. You love the poor so much that you force them to by watchtower books. While others are giving gospel materials free. "For God so love the world that he GAVE, " Judas was like that, when they give expensive things to Jesus , will campaing for the poor and the bible has this to say of him
John 12:5,6 , "This he said , not that he cared for the poor but because he was a thief "
givers don't talk or have time to criticise , they give!!. What does your organisation do ? Gather you guys spend your whole day in business centre with bottle of minerals and start typing nonsense about the church of christ. if you're not born again you're not a Christian and you're not part of The church!. You guys planned to use this forum to propagate your false doctrines that has been termed occultic.
If you are genuinly seeking the truth I guaratee you , you will find it. But if you try to confuse maliciously , God will resist you.
" I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

@ kunleoshob
yes o! the gates of hell can never prevail against it.

@Mr Agbaje
For the record, i am not a Jehovah witness neither do i subscribe to any church denomination as church denomnations cuases divisions in the body of christ which is against the will of God. My views and understanding of christianity/ salvation is strictly new testament based with special emphasis on the direct teachings of christ and the explainations of the apsotles. And as i expected you could not even address the scripture i quoted for you, that is one part of the bible pentecostal preachers would like to see deleted from the bible. Any way a word is enough for the wise you can't worship God and at the same vein worship Marmon you hae to choose as the two don't mix.

@KunleOshob
I dont have any issue answering on those scriptures you raised. I asked first are you born again?. If youre born again my response will be different and you are born not born again I have another response. I cant be explainig spiritual things to a man that is not part of the church, what I owe him is explanation of steps to salvation. But i will respont to the scriptures in the next few minutes

Joagbaje:

@KunleOshob
I dont have any issue answering on those scriptures you raised. I asked first are you born again?. If youre born again my response will be different and you are born not born again I have another response. I cant be explainig spiritual things to a man that is not part of the church, what I owe him is explanation of steps to salvation. But i will respont to the scriptures in the next few minutes

Whilst i don't particularly like using that terminology becos of it's abuse by your penterascal movement who have no clue what exactly it is, i would for the sake of this discousre use it state categorically that i am truely born again in the true sense of it as opposed to the hypocritical version that abounds in your pentecostal movement.

@KunleOshob

Joagbaje:

KunleOshob:

Mr Agbaje you might learn a thing or two from the scriptures below, peace.

Amplified Bible (AMP)

Passage 1 Timothy 6:3-11:
3But if anyone teaches otherwise and does not assent to the sound and wholesome messages of our Lord Jesus Christ (the Messiah) and the teaching which is in agreement with godliness (piety toward God),

4He is puffed up with pride and stupefied with conceit, [although he is] woefully ignorant. He has a morbid fondness for controversy and disputes and strife about words, which result in (produce) envy and jealousy, quarrels and dissension, abuse and insults and slander, and base suspicions,

5And protracted wrangling and wearing discussion and perpetual friction among men who are corrupted in mind and bereft of the truth, who imagine that godliness or righteousness is a source of profit [a moneymaking business, a means of livelihood]. From such withdraw.

6[And it is, indeed, a source of immense profit, for] godliness accompanied with contentment (that contentment which is a sense of [d]inward sufficiency) is great and abundant gain.

7For we brought nothing into the world, and obviously we cannot take anything out of the world;

8But if we have food and clothing, with these we shall be content (satisfied).

9But those who crave to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and into many foolish (useless, godless) and hurtful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction and miserable perishing.

10For the love of money is a root of all evils; it is through this craving that some have been led astray and have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves through with many [e]acute [mental] pangs.

11But as for you, O man of God, flee from all these things; aim at and pursue righteousness (right standing with God and true goodness), godliness (which is the loving fear of God and being Christlike), faith, love, steadfastness (patience), and gentleness of heart.

The begginning of the chapter is clear   on who Paul was making reference to "unruling servants" the only verse I know could sumarise your pionts is verse 6-11

KunleOshob:


6[And it is, indeed, a source of immense profit, for] godliness accompanied with contentment (that contentment which is a sense of [d]inward sufficiency) is great and abundant gain.

7For we brought nothing into the world, and obviously we cannot take anything out of the world;

8But if we have food and clothing, with these we shall be content (satisfied).

9But those who crave to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and into many foolish (useless, godless) and hurtful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction and miserable perishing.

10For the love of money is a root of all evils; it is through this craving that some have been led astray and have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves through with many [e]acute [mental] pangs.

11But as for you, O man of God, flee from all these things; aim at and pursue righteousness (right standing with God and true goodness), godliness (which is the loving fear of God and being Christlike), faith, love, steadfastness (patience), and gentleness of heart.

The first thing we need to understand is that God is against worldliness and I am against worldliness too , but there is difference between prosperity and worldliness . The prosperity of the Christian is having more than enough to reach out to others , Not for gratifying the flesh.

Philip. 3:18-19
(For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: [19] Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)

I have several people whos education i am responsible for, nursery,secondary and university. If im just living an average life how will I get to do this? money is merely a servant in our hand. I have empowered some others to start business and be financialy indpendent. Money is a tool.

Many Churches have their different visionss that God gave them. Some are into Prison ministry, Hospital ministry, Tv ministry, Radio ministry and internet ministry, which cost millions . through this outreaches ,they are able to bring the gospel to their homes and offices. Lives are touched. We must support Christian ministries.

Now the problem is a misunderstanding of verse 6.
1 Tim. 6:6
But godliness with contentment is great gain.

contentment is not poverty . It is a state of being . A man that is contented is not moved by either he has or not, just like Paul

Philip. 4:12
I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.

But a man that lacks contentment. if You give him millions, he will still not be satisfied.

Eccles. 5:10
He that loveth silver shall not be satisfied with silver; nor he that loveth abundance with increase: this is also vanity.

The bible didnt say "money is the root of evil" as some claim . But it says "the LOVE of money is the root of evil"

People gave to churches that sent missionaries to africa. There is no true pastor that will use church money for himself. There is different between pastor's money and church account. A pastor recieves gifts from people. You cant do anything about that. Most pastors that drives big carss didnt buy them. they were gifts. I have given jeep to my pastor. How will i not appreciate the man that has built my life when the bible clearly taught this.

Gal 6:6 TLB
Those who are taught the word of God should help their teachers by paying them.
Galatians 6:6 KJV
Let him that is taught in the word communicate unto him that teacheth in all good things.

So nobody should be mad at the prosperity of a pastor. They are busy labouring day and night for others if a pastor is a giver he must recieve. It is not every pastor that is recieving money. If he doesnt give he wont receive. It is a law.

But if theres any pastor that misapropriate church funds . It is between him and God . But i can gurantee you ,he wont last long. People's seed to God is holy sacrifice which he prays over. but if he attend to it irrreverently he will die before his time. That was what happened to Eli sons. They saw the meat people offered as "suya" God ended the entire family in one day. It is not your duty or mine to judge such matters .they are too high for you. You dont know the motive of a pastor to judge his action.

Romans 14:4
Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

ofcourse there are false apostle or prophets and teachers. But you cant change them through Nairaland. You only end up distabilizing inocent souls and ridicle the church of christ in the sight of the world and the unconverted. Youre not figthing a just fight. Jesus knows how to purge his church.

Matthew 13:24-30
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: [25] But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. [26] But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. [27] So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares? [28] He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? [29] But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. [30] Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Matthew 7:19-22
Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. [20] Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
[21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?


you mostly dwell on verse 22 and 23 of this scripture. but look at the begining of it verse 19.

Matthew 7:19
Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

It is Jesus that does it ,not KunleOshob. You are attacking Christ indirectly without knowing it. If you are born again go out there and win souls to Christ. not attacking those who are spending day and night praying for men to be saved.

John 15:2
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Jesus received money from partners , Paul recived money .it is not an sin.We must continualy support church projects.

Joagbaje have u written a dissertation or a research before?
If 3 people make reference to a research journal each persons interprtation of the journal might be different  to suite each owns plight hence a debate arises.
The 7day adventist believe that the sabbath should be on a saturday (7th day) not sunday(1st day)
The Jehovahs withness dont beleieve in birthdays because they believe it is pagan practice since the only Herod and Pharaoh's birthdays are mentioned
For you to say yes u are right and everyone else is wrong is just pure ignorance. I am a christian and no i am not Jehovah's withness but a methodist. i was brought up to belive that God's ways are unquestionable and uncomprehendable. People die, businesses fail, war arises but behold lies a better world ahead if u give your life to Christ. If you think pastor's offerings is going to save you from all this well good luck 2 u. The 10 richest men of this world are not even christians. U can quote all u want all day to satisfy your arguements and say your church is the best, but for you to accuse someone that he is not of the holy spirit because he does not believe in your way of doing things is just biasness. How can u sell a poor man christian magazines when he has not eaten in the morning. Do u think he will be intrested. Tell me something, when u come out of church do u see poor people standing outside begging? Do you offer them food and clothes? I guess not. When u are so busy waiting for God's tresures to come why would you care about anyone else.

Joagbaje:



But a man that lacks contentment. if You give him millions, he will still not be satisfied.

Eccles. 5:10
    He that loveth silver shall not be satisfied with silver; nor he that loveth abundance with increase: this is also vanity.

The bible didnt say  "money is the root of evil" as some claim . But it says "the LOVE of money is the root of evil"

People gave to churches that sent missionaries to africa. There is no true pastor that will use church money for himself. There is different between pastor's money and church account. A pastor  recieves gifts from people. You cant do anything about that. Most pastors that drives big carss didnt buy them. they were gifts. I have given jeep to my pastor. How will i not appreciate the man that has built my life when the bible clearly taught this.

Would you say that many churches that preach prosperity from morning to night actually sow discontentment in people?  Are people not left feeling that they ought to make money or that means that they don't have God's love and God's blessing.  Is the Love of money not actually encouraged in penterascal churches? 

Are people not taught to tithe in order to be blessed with more financial prosperity?

My friend said, poster are you there in the church? M.A.D man.

I am not against prosperity .The gospel is a gospel of prosperity. Poverty is a spirit. God has set us free from bondage of poverty. A poor christian cant help anyone not even himself.  
Salvation is a total package " well being, health deliverance, etc.
Luke 4:18
   The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
The word gospel means Good news. What is Good news to a poor man ? He can be rich. What is good news to the blind He can have sight, To the sick , he can be healed.
The gospel is about fulness of  life , well being .Prosperity .inheritance.

God is in the business of making men rich.The purpose is for us to be a blessing. Not for personal greed.
Genesis 12:2
   And , I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

Psalm 35:27
   Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the Lord be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.


The error is when a man receives and refuse to give. It is called covetousness. Giving is a law, especially for the work of God.
David said he would build God a house God said just for that thinking alone ,he would build for David an everlasting house.
God gives special attention to givers in the Kingdom. especially those who sponsor church projects
Luke 7:3-6
   And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant. [4] And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this: [5] For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue. [6] Then Jesus went with them,
This man didnt deserve anything because he was gentile, but Jesus changed his mind because the man built a house of worship.
What did God demand for building project even in the wilderness.
Exodus 25:2-3
   Speak unto the children of Israel, that they bring me an offering: of every man that giveth it willingly with his heart ye shall take my offering. [3] And this is the offering which ye shall take of them; gold, and silver, and brass,
Are we going to call Moses thief here for demanding gold? from refugees!

Church money does not belong to Pastor. People give willlingly out of love for God. No pastor forces anybody to give
He only teach what the bible says.
Jesus died for us to prosper.
2 Cor. 8:9
   For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

Acts 26:18
   To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Ephes. 1:18
   The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

Acts 20:32
   And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified.
The gospel message makes a man rich if he believe.The poor man does not need pity, but teaching .

Luke 4:18
   The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;
Luke 7:22
   Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached.

One the the things to teach a poor man is ,He must learn to give, To God and to others.
Ephes. 4:28
   Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

BRAINWASHING OF THE HIGHEST ORDER,

@tbaba83. You need this brainwashing I tell you.

thanx 4 d offer but i'll pass. Rather give my money to orphans and beggars than sponsor a black man's greed for flashy cars and jetplanes