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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit (4321 Views)
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Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 7:08pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
GoodMuyis:Seriuosly!!! what the hell is this? integrity would be passed down?? dont make me laugh. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 7:13pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
Ken4Christ:True but misleading. Jesus has existed before the devil was created, do you think it would be possible to tempt him into sinning Jesus came to restore back what man lost in the Garden of Eden. And one day, a new earth will be created that life will go on as originally planned by God even in greater glory.I agree.. but then I though jesus said we were going to heaven?? |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 7:14pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
hopefulLandlord:this is what ive been trying to pass across to muttleylaff. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 7:16pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
chemystery:Most of my postings will either attract a strong mind or put off a weak one The strong mind will head upstream along with me against the flow, whilst the weak one will go with the regular and usual flow If all you do is follow the herd, then you've already before any of my posts, like the one you brought up, been stepping on centuries old, shipload of mistranslation horseshit or crap Now recognising the truth from the different regular load of horseshit or crap you're used to is a challenge 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 7:19pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
GoodMuyis:the tree of life was not the integrity test but the tree of knowledge. God took away the tree of life. this particular scene leads me to ask the question, if man was created immortal why would he need to eat daily from the tree of life? if you have read the book of enoch you would understand where am coming from |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Wilgrea7(m): 7:43pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff:then of what purpose was the fruit? Adam already understood the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, is a tree of good and adversity,i understand you're making a good point.. but adding *experience* to that line has no basis nor backing.. the verse clearly states that he would know what is good and evil.. it did not mention experiences.. rather, it indicates that man would be able to know what is good and what is bad Just like he saw animals and recognised each according to the name he gave each one.why did you expatiate on the synonyms of evil and not that of good? knowledge is different from experience.. You must think Adam was unintelligent and also didnt receive orientationso saying that man had somewhat orientation of good and evil, then why isn't the tree supposed to expand his knowledge of good and evil instead of giving him the knowledge He knew that he was not supposed to eat the fruit because he was explicitly told not to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evili agree How do you mean, Adam didnt know eating the fruit was wrong, when the name of the tree is a dead giveaway.you're trying to equate knowing what good and evil is to opening a door to evil only.. knowledge is knowledge.. experience is different.. knowing something is different from bringing forth something.. knowing something is poisonous won't make you die of poison by just knowing.. also.. not knowing something is poisonous won't also save you from dying if you eat it Punished? Isnt that an unfair and strong word to useAdam was deceived.. in fact.. from the story, my guess is that he didn't know the fruit until he ate it.. but that's not my point.. You seem to have missed the part where the Lord God said:i believe I've tackled the issue of the meaning of knowledge above.. also.. I'm interested in knowing why you expatiate on the synonyms of evil and not of good.. bearing in mind that knowledge, experience and opening a door to something are entirely different things 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by GoodMuyis(m): 8:23pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
kkins25: Have you study Law of Inheritance/Behavioural_genetics NO? Go and do it |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 8:27pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
GoodMuyis:LOL.. you finally made me laugh!!!! what has spiritual issue have to do with genes?? 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 11:10pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
Wilgrea7:You accept that, if the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is no longer left in the garden then it must have served its purpose and a purpose? Wilgrea7:Ah-ha haba Chief? Did Adam and Eve have an enjoyable experience after eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil? Wilgrea7:Which verse said: ''man would be able to know what is good and what is bad'' What verse are you talking about that said: ''man would be able to know what is good and what is bad''? Tell, so we'll both be on the same page, otherwise retract that remark and correctly quote it Experience is an event or occurrence which leaves an impression on someone Eating the fruit surely left a lasting sour tasting experience on Adam and Eve's tongue Wilgrea7:I could have but didnt because I was more foucused and interested in driving home the point that a complete range or scope of evil was brought forth from eating the fruit of tree of the knowledge of good and evil Wilgrea7:Adam had knowledge from God that eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil constitutes getting a death sentence Adam knew that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, even by its name alone, is a dead giveaway that, the tree is capable of giving good and unpleasant experiences There is knowledge based on experience. One becomes experienced from merely knowing quite a lot Wilgrea7:Hold on, what are you on about now? Did God tell anyone that eating from the tree will expand Adam's knowledge of good and evil? Adam was given the know, enough for him to have an edge and not to fall for Satan Did you not read what Eve's justifications are (e.g. eating the fruit will make one wise) Knowledge and wisdom always comes from above. God gives them They dont come from trees, and certainly not from the tree of knowledge of good and evil The tree of the knowledge of good and evil wasnt going to expand Adam's knowledge of good and evil instead the eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil is like flicking on a switch that activates and turns on the tree's floodlights of good and evil for Adam to experience Wilgrea7:It was in Adam's good interest, that he was made to know, it is fatal to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil You do accept that evil, is the absence of good and accept that death, is a separation from God Knowledge and experience are part of a same tag team Its impossible to have experience without knowledge When Adam ate the fruit, he would have experienced a knowledge of an instant separation from God (i.e. spiritual death) rapidly followed with another experience of the knowledge of the absence of good (i.e. strange unpleasant emotions) Wilgrea7:Adam was deceived? Really? Your guess is wrong because Adam certainly and fully knew the fruit before he ate it Who coached Eve and exaggerated the truth claiming that a sheer touch of fruit of the tree will cause death? Of course, it couldnt be anyone else than Adam told Eve this now Adam was not deceived Adam's DMZ effort didnt work, Satan had infiltrated his security so leaving Adam with no choice than to resort to kamikaze. I guess he rather the degeneration start from him than be from any other male but that's for another discussion time and not today's Wilgrea7:I believe to a certain degree, I've addressed your quibble over my use of the terms; knowledge and experience and also the reason for the synonyms of evil and not of good Knowledge is: 1. facts, information, and skills acquired through experience or education; the theoretical or practical understanding of a subject. 2. awareness or familiarity gained by experience of a fact or situation - Google Dictionary I am increasingly now becoming very interested in knowing why people dont seem to with great care and thoroughness read my post(s) It beggars belief, why you bring up this: ''why you expatiate on the synonyms of evil and not of good...''' after I 've already alluded to merism in the post section you mentioned In law, a merism is a figure of speech by which a single thing is referred to by a conventional phrase that enumerates several of its parts or lists several synonyms for the same thing - Google search meaning of merism 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 11:11pm On Aug 06, 2017 |
GoodMuyis: kkins25:GoodMuyis is right, you ought to do a studious reflection if not the joke will actually be on you because the physical is a shadow of the spiritual and often mimic the logic and principles of something spiritual How do you think you successfully get to compose and write a Word document? If the Normal Dot Dot template file is corrupted/compromised, it is becomes impossible to edit, compose, write Word documents, because it is upon it's pre-formatted settings like font size etcetera that all new blank and old documents are based The old new and blank word document inherits from the Normal Dot Dot template file There isnt any need to go into servers Access Control List (ACL) and inherited permissions |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Nobody: 12:25am On Aug 07, 2017 |
chemystery: you could be just right, but man, did you think eve had disobeyed God before being tempted by the devil? remember they onced lived a life of righteousness before the devil came. therefore, you are literally wrong with the symbol × for your claims. why? first, you need to define disobedience and second, you could as well reason your subject of matter well. Again, ask yourself "is temptation sin?" if you say yes, you're absolutely ignorant to the core, if you say no, then lemme ask you my own question, "how did they disobey God if temptation is not sin?" However, to conclude that when eve was tempted by the devil, it was not sin, but while she obeyed the devil rather than God made her commit sin, thus eve had sinned after the temptation and not before the temptation. sorry to mention that YOU ARE ACCENTUATING YOUR IGNORANCE HERE because you're confused on high levels. because you're confused, you probably think that; 1. temptation is sin 2. disobedience is also temptation. halt confusing 'temptation and disobedience' in your context. i benevolently beg you to contextualize your error by NOT confusing us please. Finally, go ahead to read or reread the book of Genesis for the betterment of your understanding mercie! 2 Likes |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Nobody: 12:32am On Aug 07, 2017 |
chemystery: and to mention that the bolded really seems confusing rather than convincing did not eating the fruit make man disobey? then if they hadn't eat the fruit, in what way did they disobey God? you are probably intuiting that temptation is sin in the course of eve being tempted 2 Likes |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 12:35am On Aug 07, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: clears throat... la illah illalahu. I did not graduate with 4.+ CGPA in Biological sciences to be told this shit... Nontheless congratulations. you just recieved an award for dumbness. goodmuyis could learn alot from you.. if you want to prove that sin is transferred through genes in biological terms - then my friend you also have to tell me who God is- in biological terms. if sin is tranferred through genes then Humanity is nothing but a biological machine that is governed by the interactions of atoms and therefore the matter creates mind. if matter creates mind then The idea of a creator God is nullified. and if God exist then matter is eternal and God begotten. if sin is genetically inheritable then jesus should have inherited the original sin and could not have been born without the Y chromosome supplied by a male- his alleged father.... again I must ask you, what happens to enviromental factors which influence " Learning"which in turn determines "behaviour"- in biological terms. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 12:40am On Aug 07, 2017 |
Jhaytee4all:I think what the OP was trying to convey is not perceivable to your senses right now. when you mind develops more come back and re-reply him. as for now SHARRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 12:42am On Aug 07, 2017 |
GoodMuyis:this joke is so good I had to quote it again. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Nobody: 12:48am On Aug 07, 2017 |
kkins25: as i suppose you to be an atheists, remain ignored. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by edicied: 2:24am On Aug 07, 2017 |
Haha see as wuna day argue Adam and eve like say them be real figure |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by SmartMugu: 3:02am On Aug 07, 2017 |
To be frank, all this stuff don't make any sense anymore. So, because someone somewhere in Europe or the Middle East eat a piece of Apple, mango or whatever both of them eat, the entire world's population are now sinners? Does that even make any sense to anyone? |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by hopefulLandlord: 4:10am On Aug 07, 2017 |
NPComplete: chemystery: "The bible" begs the question - which bible? There are many diverse and different, confused and internally contradictory editions of the bible that can be traced back as being written by men from the 4th century onward. The oldest bible ( " Codex Sinaiticus" ) was written by a team of four men in the late 4th century and is significantly different to those we know today. The message of Christianity is whatever you want it to be. The big book of multiple choice can and does validate any position anybody wants it to. I keep telling people that "the bible, as written, is either the word of god, or it is not. If it requires interpretation, it becomes useless, because it then devolves in a war of interpretations, and one interpenetration is every bit as good as another." And then look at the number of Christian sects and cults today.....................! 4 Likes |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by chemystery: 5:53am On Aug 07, 2017 |
Jhaytee4all:No what I'm saying is that Adam and Eve are inclined to disobey god in every other occasion asides eating the fruit. Meaning disobedience is already borne in on them by default |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Wilgrea7(m): 8:00am On Aug 07, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff:no Ah-ha haba Chief?is it the fruit from the tree that gave them the enjoyable experience? Which verse said: ''man would be able to know what is good and what is bad''Genesis 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever please examine the bolded and tell me where experience was written there or where it doesn't mean that man would know good and evil.. what does it mean to know good and evil Experience is an event or occurrence which leaves an impression on someonetongue i.... you... what? this does not relate I could have but didntwhere does knowing something equate to experience?... you're trying to forcefully put experience in place of knowledge in that verse then change the tree of knowledge of good and evil to the tree of experience of evil.. the gods said that man is like unto us.. does that mean that the gods are experiencing famine. plague etc etc?? Adam had knowledge from God that eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil constitutes getting a death sentenceexperience.. knowledge.. different There is knowledge based on experience.and where is it stated that the knowledge of good and evil was gotten from experience?.. it was gotten from eating the fruit.. what bible are you using ? One becomes experienced from merely knowing quite a lotits actually the other way round Hold on, what are you on about now?you are the one that clearly stated that everyone has limits or boundaries or somewhat orientation of something the tree was said to give knowledge of good and evil.. its written right there in the bible.. just as the tree of life was said to give eternal life.. or tress can't give eternal life? its what is written in the bible right there instead the eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evilexperience.. knowledge.. different It was in Adam's good interest, that he was made to know, it is fatal to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evilyes You do accept that evil, is the absence of good and accept that death, is a separation from Godno . i don't totally accept .. but let us proceed Knowledge and experience are part of a same tag teamit is very possible.. experiencing something can give you knowledge of it.. not the other way around.. someone whose finger got burnt by fire has knowledge of what fire does to the finger through his experience.. but someone who knows what fire does only knows.. he has not experienced it. When Adam ate the fruit, he would have experienced a knowledge of an instant separation from God (i.e. spiritual death)please refer to my points above.. Adam was deceived? Really?ok. agreed.. Adam is as guilty as eve Adam's DMZ effort didnt work, Satan had infiltrated his securityok I believe to a certain degree, I've addressed your quibble over my use of the terms; knowledge and experiencei will attach a screenshot of the dictionary meaning of knowledge.. there are different ways to get knowledge I am increasingly now becoming very interested in knowing why people dont seem to with great care and thoroughness read my post(s)i know what merism is.. i was just pointing out your desire to acknowledge only the bad and leave out the good... stressing as if the tree of knowledge(not experience) of good and evil entails knowing(not experiencing) evil alone
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Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 8:26am On Aug 07, 2017 |
Wilgrea7:I am currently on the road but will asap respond to each of your responses I have already seen the few "odds and out of places" in your posts to address |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by GoodMuyis(m): 9:22am On Aug 07, 2017 |
I dont like your reasoning pattern. For the fact that you disbelieved in God doesnt meant ITS A MUST you must reject any fact/point presented to you. You out to asked questions w/o planing to give feedback of accepting again I must ask you, what happens to enviromental factors which influence " Learning"which in turn determines "behaviour"- in biological terms. kkins25:=> Seun is a programmer who use code to created Nairaland, Yet Their is noting as code aspect of seu.n he is human being as we are [s]if sin is tranferred through genes then Humanity is nothing but a biological machine that is governed by the interactions of atoms and therefore the matter creates mind. if matter creates mind then The idea of a creator God is nullified. and if God exist then matter is eternal and God begotten. [/s] [s]if sin is genetically inheritable then jesus should have inherited the original sin and could not have been born without the Y chromosome supplied by a male- his alleged father.... [/s] => How did babies/infant realise that crying will attract attentiion to them, yet all were not born from same parent, or same country. I common factor to them all is that they are all Adam/Eve or Noah offspring, This Logical Reason |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 11:40am On Aug 07, 2017 |
GoodMuyis:I AM NOT AN ATHEIST however I do understand that the bible was WRITTEN by MAN of his own accord. I rejects fact with no facts in them => Seun is a programmer who use code to created Nairaland, Yet Their is noting as code aspect of seu.n he is human being as we are my pattern of reasoning is difficult for you to understand because you simply cannot comprehend it. take seu.ns brain and scan youd see that the part of his brain responsible for understanding patterns is more active than that of a person who doesn't program so in a sense, seun is code... => How did babies/infant realise that crying will attract attentiion to them, yet all were not born from same parent, or same country.smiles. simple. from a biological perspective "crying" (form of communication/signal) developed over millions of years. chicks cry, calfs cry, cubbs cry. "cry" is the term we use to understand the 'need' of the baby. cry is passed down through genes- yes- Exactly. from scientific point of view this is true.. But from your religious point of view this is FALSE because Adam didnt pass through childhood. he never cryed so how do you know it was in his genes?? |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 9:01am On Aug 08, 2017 |
Wilgrea7:No? What exactly are you no-ing to? You're aware, as well as I am, that eventually, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, when being used up and having served its purpose, wouldnt anymore be present in the garden The tree of the knowledge of good and evil would have served the reason for which it was created and so it removed The tree of life however stays remaining to serve its purpose You must have heard it said: The best teacher in life is experience Wilgrea7:Seems you're latching on my comment to make it ambiguous, so let me rephrase the question using ''pleasant'' instead of enjoyable Did Adam and Eve have a Experience (i.e. the tree of the knowledge of good and evil) is a hard teacher because she gives the test (i.e. to eat the fruit, or not to eat the fruit) first, then the lesson (i.e. to know or knowing good and evil) afterwards. Experience is not always the kindest of teachers, but it is surely the best. Experience is the best teacher, it is because of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, we get to know good and evil Wilgrea7:The only source of knowledge is experience - Albert Einstein You see my friend, you're just over-reacting and unnecessarily being unhappy with me using knowledge and experience interchangeably Please tell, is it possible to have knowledge without experience? OK, examining the bolded reveals it is talking of posteriori knowledge (i.e. empirical knowledge) Genesis 3:5's ''to know'' and/or Genesis 3:22's ''knowing'' is knowledge based on experience First-hand experience and not them-say experience or a God-said experience You will personally know what good and evil is, will have personal experience(s) of it Wilgrea7:No worries, I will edit or rephrase the comment Experience is an event or occurrence which leaves an impression on someone The experience of eating the fruit, surely left a bad taste in Adam & Eve's mouth The memory of the sour taste whilst the fruit was ate would be an unpleasant one The point is, eating the fruit, left them with an opposite impression to one they were expecting Wilgrea7:Here you go again overreacting C'mon, stop incorrectly and falsely being pedantic. I have, above, already put forward, how, when and where knowing something equate to experience Does that mean that the gods are experiencing famine, plague etc etc, is a non question Is it necessary for me to remind you that, God knows that the absence of good is the presence of evil? Wilgrea7:Not necessarily all the time Wilgrea7:SMH. This has been addressed above Wilgrea7:This too has been addressed above Wilgrea7:so saying that man had somewhat orientation of good and evil, then why isn't the tree supposed to expand his knowledge of good and evil instead of giving him the knowledge - Wilgrea7 Yes, I did so responding to your remark reproduce above Adam was orientated and told about the tree of knowledge of good and evil Contrary to your remark, Adam wasnt told the tree of knowledge of good and evil will expand his knowledge of good and evil but rather as the tree's name signifies, it is a tree that will give whoever eats of it, the knowledge of good and evil Eating the fruit of the tree will give the opportunity to experience the knowledge of good and evil Part of the orientation was about letting it be known that the tree of knowledge of good and evil is off limts That's your boundary there, the tree is out of bounds to Adam and Eve Wilgrea7:The tree of knowledge of good and evil makes it possible to know of good and evil. Without eating from the tree, it was not possible for man to experience good and evil Same with the tree of life, eating or partaking of the tree of life, makes it possible for man to have or experience eternal life Wilgrea7:Again, not necessarily all the time Wilgrea7:Smiling Wilgrea7:If you dont totally accept, how far are you accepting then? What of, you do accept darkness is the absence of light? Wilgrea7:Well that is why the bible Genesis 3:5's ''to know'' and/or 3:22's ''knowing'' is knowledge based on experience It is talking of first-hand experience, not a second-hand, third-hand, them-say experience or a God-said experience To know what good and evil is, talking of posteriori knowledge (i.e. empirical knowledge) You will have personal experience(s) of knowing. You will personally experience the know So in the above context, I reiterate, its impossible to have experience without knowledge Wilgrea7:I had and still stand by my original comment You now, need to go over and reconsider my points Wilgrea7:And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression - 1 Timothy 2:14 Adam though wasnt deceived, is no doubt as guilty as Eve I am glad, you agree and arent anymore saying Adam was deceived Wilgrea7:Smiles Wilgrea7:Attaching a screenshot of the dictionary with an alternative meaning of knowledge is unnecessary, when what the bible is talking about is posteriori knowledge (i.e. empirical knowledge) Wilgrea7:If you admit to knowing what merism is, why then are you pulling me up for highlighting and giving a flavour of what experiencing the range or scope of the knowledge of evil is? I gave an inexhaustible list of experiences of the knowledge of evil following eating the fruit Now here's me being fair, please give me three lists, Adam & Eve had, of experiences of the knowledge of good, following eating the fruit Reiterating, experience is the best teacher and the worst experiences teaches the best lessons Via the tree of the knowledge of good and evil comes the worst experiences (i.e. instant and an anti-climax death, trouble, misadventure, suffering, affliction, sorrow, distress, hardship, difficulty, pain, misery etcetera) 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Wilgrea7(m): 9:36pm On Aug 09, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff:you're drifting.. this does not relate.. the tree served the reason for which it was created? .. what was the reason? to aid the fall of man or to give man knowledge of good and evil.. if it was to aid the fall of man, then man is not to be blamed.. so let me ask.. what is the purpose of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil? Seems you're latching on my comment to make it ambiguous, so let me rephrase the question using ''pleasant'' instead of enjoyableyou're starkly ignoring what i said earlier.. is it the tree that gave Adam and eve the unpleasant experience or it was the punishment for their disobedience.. you're trying to paint the tree as a bad tree which it is not Experience (i.e. the tree of the knowledge of good and evil) is a hard teacherputting experience countless times in the place of knowledge will not make experience equal to knowledge.. the bible stated knowledge and knowledge.. why specify that its by experience when evidence says the contrary? The only source of knowledge is experiencechoose one.. Albert Einstein or the bible.. a quote from Albert Einstein doesn't change what knowledge is.. a science student has knowledge of the boiling point of water.. doesn't mean he experienced it You see my friend, you're just over-reacting and unnecessarily being unhappy with me using knowledge and experience interchangeablyboth are not the same.. refer to my point above.. knowledge can be gotten irrespective of experience OK, examining the bolded reveals it is talking of posteriori knowledge (i.e. empirical knowledge)how many times will i say it?... how does “to know" equate to “knowledge by experience" ? you're not making any point.. you're further proving my point that experience is not stated anywhere there No worries, I will edit or rephrase the commentmemory of what .. good lord.. where in the bible did it state that the fruit was bitter? i ask again.. what bible are you using? Here you go again overreactingit was a wrong comparison as i have already showed you countless times Does that mean that the gods are experiencing famine, plague etc etc, is a non questionwhat i.. this.... this does not relate Adam was orientated and told about the tree of knowledge of good and evilagain with this your forceful injection of experience The tree of knowledge of good and evil makes it possible to know of good and evil.ok... let me explain it for you... the tree of knowledge of good and evil gives the eater knowledge of good and evil.. simple... plain... the tree of life gives you eternal life.. simple.. plain.. the experience philosophy is just trying to put what isn't there If you dont totally accept, how far are you accepting then?yes Well that is why the bible Genesis 3:5's ''to know'' and/or 3:22's ''knowing'' is knowledge based on experienceno premise for this It is talking of first-hand experience, not a second-hand, third-hand, them-say experience or a God-said experienceit is very possible.. in fact.. in that verse its the only possibility.. what is good is good and what is evil is evil... knowing it is knowing it.. knowing the boiling point of water is knowing it.. as long as God defines what is good and what is evil(as the creator of the world) then knowing what is good and evil does not involve experiencing it.. experience is experience.. it being bitter doesn't mean it is evil.. taking aloe vera is bitter due to the taste.. but medicinal .. God defines what is good and bad adam and eve only need to know it.. simple .. no need for this complicated philosophy.. the bible wasn't written like that so its best to avoid it.. you can have a better knowledge of something through experience.. yes.. but having knowledge of something is also possible without experience.. plus.. you still try to be biased by wanting to paint the tree of knowledge as bad.. when it was not Attaching a screenshot of the dictionary with an alternative meaning of knowledge is unnecessary, when what the bible is talking about is posteriori knowledge (i.e. empirical knowledge)attaching philosophical terms that were invented after the bible was written is also invalid.. also noting that you quoted from google dictionary.. or at least claimed to I gave an inexhaustible list of experiences of the knowledge of evil following eating the fruitwhy did you leave out the good? did they experience good before eating the fruit? if yes.. then what good did the tree offer and why wasn't it called tree of experience of evil?.. if no.. then why wasn't the good evident after eating the fruit? how do you expect me to give you experiences when I'm clearly against the experience claim?... or did God lie when calling the tree that name? refer to points above |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 11:05pm On Aug 09, 2017 |
Wilgrea7:You cant come to terms with it Wilgrea7:The tree opened the door for all sorts of experiences The punishment for the disobedience was death, Death being the possible highest form of punishment for treason (i.e. for the betrayal of God, man will pay with his life) No one is painting the tree of the knowledge of good and evil bad I am just stating the facts of the matter and reality about it The tree isnt neccesarily bad but if you're comfortable with the term, the tree is a necessary evil and after serving its purpose, ultimately gets removed from the garden (i.e. when Eden is restored the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is nowhere to be found) Wilgrea7:If you really want to know how ''to know'' equate to ''knowledge by experience'', you'll have to meet me further down then Wilgrea7:Are you really this plain and unsophisticated? I use all and/or every available bible translations I can lay my grubby hands on but honestly speaking, knowing what bible I use, ought to be the least of your concern because it's seems you have a lot of familiarity to do, catching up on what poetic license is about Wilgrea7:You cant even refer to posteriori knowledge properly If philosophy is a stumbling block, then cancel it out and forget philosophy. It doesnt matter, nor make any differences, whether philosophy is in there or not, What matters, is accepting that, the knowledge is empirical Most of, if not all my points, understandably, went over the head anyway. so sorry for the overestimation Wilgrea7:''attaching philosophical terms that were invented after the bible was written is also invalid''? SMH Please meet me further down Wilgrea7:Same questions Adam and Eve asked themselves repeatedly after eating Wilgrea7:Sorry for asking the question Wilgrea7:Nope! No can do. You reconsider my points, after, you'll realise, the tree, considering the circumstance, was the best teacher for Man ''also noting that you quoted from google dictionary.. or at least claimed to'' - Wilgrea7 © I found the scepticism in your above mentioned remark unfortunate and hilarious. SMH Anyway, as seen above, I have reproduced my earlier definition of knowledge but you ignored & countered it, by giving an alternative definition of knowledge, in the screenshot you provided, that hasnt a mention of experience I have allowed you to have a good run with your obsessive interest in and/or disingenuous feeling about knowledge and experience but I guess now is one of those, when push comes to shove moments Please check Genesis 3:5 and Genesis 3:22, to confirm what kind of part of speech ''knowing'' and ''to know'' are? In other words, are ''knowing'' and ''to know'' used as nouns, adjectives or verbs? Also what is experience and/or how does one get experience? Thank you 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Wilgrea7(m): 8:04am On Aug 10, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: this back and forth is pointless.. you are hell bent on attaching experience as a compulsory means for acquiring knowledge .. you're criticizing me for using a dictionary yet you compulsorily make reference to Google dictionary.. nowhere does “to know" or knowing imply experience... experience is a way to acquire knowledge and it was not listed anywhere... you seem to be eager to add to the Bible .. goodluck with that.. you went from accepting what is plain and written there to adding google and philosophy that didn't exist when Genesis was written.. once again.. good luck.. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by MuttleyLaff: 10:07am On Aug 10, 2017 |
Wilgrea7: I am no match for your level of ignorance(s) and you've realised you're caught out, that's why instead of obliging the questions, you rather, throw a tantrum and spit dummy out. 1 Like |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by Nobody: 10:41am On Aug 10, 2017 |
simplex2:"Some" angels were bored and they rebelled against Yahweh. These angels were Belial and Leviathan which we mistakenly attributed them to Satan himself. They told Lucifer that he should be "God". |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 11:52am On Aug 10, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff:LIES!!! SMHMORE LIES You're clutching straws mate,We gave ecerything names. we named the Angels, we named the devils, we named God. Refusing to obey the command not to eat the fruit is the disobedienceif they disobeyed in other to eat the fruit then how the bleep was "disobedience" activated after eating the fruit I'll give you the ''God created man sinless until the forbidden fruit was consumed'' partIF THE CREATION IS IMPERFECT THEN THE CREATOR IS IMPERFECT. your logic is a myth. |
Re: Man Was Inclined To Committing Sin Even Before Eating The Forbidden Fruit by kkins25(m): 12:01pm On Aug 10, 2017 |
asuustrike2009:Another thing is that jesus said the devil is the father of evil "right from the beginning" .. ? right from the beginning? does that mean he was created evil? ? or is he simply the God of darkness. but I dont understand where you said Belial and leviathan are take for satan. according to the book of enough there is no lucifer or the ultimate devil. |
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