Dear Jackal,
take away your sentiments, and focus on reality, it helps.

Fat Ronaldo was consistently benched, both for brazil and for Real Madrid last year. Why? Because he is NO LONGER a great football player. Beckham is still a good footballer, but he's no longer great, yet he still enjoys far more press time than any other English footballer.

Nobody is saying that David Beckham was never a good footballer, we are simply saying that he's no longer good enough to dominate the news as a footballer.


And Oh yes, Stevie has also saved the English team several times as well.


By the way, if titles are the correct measure of a footballer's abbility, then Ole Gunnar Solskjaer with 14 titles is a better footballer than Thierry Henry with a mere 11. Your logic, my dear friend is sadly flawed.

Even at Beckham's peak he can't stand with the greats of the game. He is just a creation of the English media.

I stiil maintain that even in his class he is still wacked. In which tournament was he England's best player? Not to talk of Europe.

All those trophies Figo did not win it nor did Luiz ronaldo so in essence Beckham is better than them?

@banderas
u are on target man.

Dayo, Becks was an exceptional footballer. Exceptional. In his prime he would have played for ANY soccer team in the world. The world's greats however is an exclusive club, populated by the likes of Zidane, Pele, Maradona, and maybe Ronaldinho (when he's playing well), some dutch players (I don't know which ones), George Best, and maybe Eusebio. As English greats, I actually rate Gazza, Lineker and possibly Shearer a bit higher than Becks, but I have NO doubts that he will definitely make the English all time greats if that list were made today.


Jeje - thanks mate.

@Banderas,
In which tournament did Beckham excel for England or in which crucial game against a top national team did he excel?

Dutch players like Johann Cryuff, Ruud Gullitt, Van Basten.

But the English all time great won't have any say in the world I mean which English great would play in Europe all time 11 not to talk of the world all time 11. Little wonder no English player has ever been world footballer of the year.

Do you know that Becks enjoy more rave and acclaim even more than these best you name why? the hype of the media makes him.

@ Dayokanu,

You seem to be missing the points like free-throw shots.
21 Premiership titles for player A and 1 premiership title for player B is the same thing.
They have both won the Premiership. The amount is purely academic!!!!!!!!!!
Why did Jose Mourinho throw his Premiership medal into the crowd? He said he threw it away because he has won it before and it does not matter how many times.
Technically, Luiz Ronaldo has won more than Beckham. Most of Beckham's titles are club titles.
Ronaldo has won for country and club. I won't waste space to start listing what he has won but i can tell u one thang.
Luiz Ronaldo is the best striker ever to have played the round leather game.


@ Banderas,
Basically, u are saying Beckham shouldn't be mentioned in the news because he is no longer a good player?
Maradona stopped playing ages ago and he still gets mentioned everytime. What about Pele that stopped playing 3 decades ago?
What Beckham gets is off-field papparazzi and what do u expect from a footballer that married a spice girl.
If Drogba marries Paris Hilton today, he would get more publicity and thats a known fact.

Stevie Gerrard has saved the English team? Yea right.
Like he did against Portugal during the world cup.
Gerrard's penalty miss was the most crucial. You expect a player like him to take responsibility when it matters most but he didn't.
Lets just see Gerrard as a great club player not a national hero.

Ole Gunnar Solskjaer winning more titles than Henry? You need to check your facts right.
Solskjaer has won the Premiership, FA Cup, Carling Cup, UEFA Champions league, Intercontinental cup and Community Shield-----6 titles.
Henry has won the Premiership, FA cup, Carling Cup, Community Shield, World Cup, European Cup, Confederations cup, French Ligue 1 and French Super cup.-------------8 titles.
You can do the math and tell me who has won more.

Dayo, dayo, dayo, you've impressed me so far, please don't stop now. Becks dominated in SEVERAL foorball matches for england - a game against germany, and another against greece are good examples. he was also runner up for the FIFA footballer of the year award TWICE.


Regarding the footballer of the year award, this was only started in 1991, and since then only players from 7 or 8 countries have won it - Italy (Quite controversially last year), Brazil, France, Netherlands, Germany, Portugal and Liberia. The lack of an English player there doesn't quite make them such a bad team (Liberia has never even played in the world cup finals)

But I do agree that the Engish media is quite frantic about football, and hence tend to affect the ratings of their national players.


Oh Jackal, Jackal, where is thy maths?

Ole Gunnar:
Premiership -1996-97, 1998-99, 1999-00, 2000-01, 2002-03, 2006-07 (6)
FA cup 1999, 2004 (2)
Carling cup 2006
Champions league 1998
Intercontinental cup 1999
Community Shield 1996, 1997, 2003 (3)
Total: 14

Thierry:
World cup 1998
Uefa nations 2000
Ligue 1 1996
Super cup 1997
Premiership: 2001-02, 2003-04 (2)
FA cup: 2002, 2003, 2005 (3)
Community shield: 2002, 2004 (2)
Total: 11

And no, I didn't say he deserved no mention because he was no longer good, stop misinterpreting my posts. What I said was that He is no longer good enough to dominate the presss as he does.


And why, why why and why would you curse Aderogba (Drogba) by marrying him off to Paris Hilton?

If the numbers don't count, then Blackburn Rovers (1 Premiership title) can be rated with Chelsea, afterall, they have both won the premiership?


Absolute rubbish mate, numbers DO matter.

Quick question Jack,
how is Ronaldo the best player to have played the leather game? What makes him so? I'm afriad I disagree.

Jackal,

Kindly check your statistics about Henry vis a vis the Carling cup

They would have both won the premiership right but why is Real Madrid and AC Milan considered to be better than Aston Villa or Marseile. As of them have won the European cup ?

Dayo help me ask the man o, Nottingham Forest, Madrid and AC Milan have now been placed on the same level in the gospel according to St Jack.

In the 5-1 win over Germany Gerrard and Owen were more prominent than Becks and Do you consider Greece (not minding their status as European champion) a strong team. Becks has played several tournament for England which one did he emerge not as the Tournament best player but a mere best player for England or is that too much to ask for?

Well, you see, personally I beleive that Stevie G has been England's best player for some time now, so I can't argue with that last statement,

@ Banderas,

I said Luiz Ronaldo is the best striker ever to have played the round leather game.
His records speak for itself. There will be no need for me to start writing what he has done.
He is a true legend.

On the Solskjaer and Henry issue, Lets be realistic here.
As u can see, Solskjaer only beats Henry on the frequency not the number of different medals they have won.
Henry has won in different leagues and for country, Solskjaer won everything in one team and Zilch for country.
What about individual accolades? Does Solskjaer get a mention anywhere? Correct me if i am wrong.

Blackburn Rovers and Chelsea can be mentioned in the same breath.
There's no difference between the 2 clubs.
Remember, there's a difference between Chelsea and Chelski.
Chelski is what we have today. The Roman revolution winning back to back league titles.
Chelsea is what we had before 2003. One league  title in 50 years. Geddit?

Jackal,

Kindly check your statistics about Henry vis a vis the Carling cup

They would have both won the premiership right, but why is Real Madrid and AC Milan considered to be better than Aston Villa or Marseile. As of them have won the European cup ?

Jack, I'll also like to know why Ronaldo is the best striker ever in football. If his records speak, they definitely don't speak english because I can't hear them. Please be so kind as to name some of his acheivements, so that we can compare and contrast, and possibly be enlightened, as you already are.

Jack, on a personal level, beckham has only won the PFA young footballer of the year,
while Gerrard has won an MBE, UEFA most valueable player, PFA player of the year, as well as PFA young footballer of the year.
In this category he has far outperformed Beckham. Can you tell me again why Becks has been better than Stevie G?

Think Ronaldo is great too

C.Ronaldo
Wayne Rooney

Deco
Torres
Villa
SWP

Thank u very much Mr Antonio Banderas.

Luiz Ronaldo as a footballer has won nearly everything.
Winning everything sometimes as a player means just being a squad player like Wright-Phillips of Chelsea but LUIZ RONALDO has won these laurels and accolades because he has been a performer week in week out in any team he has played for.
His goal tally speaks for itself. He is known as the phenomenom.
He has scored 15 goals in 19 world cup games becoming the all time top goal scorer.
Need i say more?


Gerrard might have out-performed Beckham in the individual awards kizzack but Beckham out-classes Gerrard if u look at it overall.
Beckham sometimes gets on the news for the wrong reasons but whenever u see Gerrard on the news,its always about football.
At the end of the day, the 2 guys here are English so why is Beckham a brand name and people dont even know who Gerrard is in some parts of the world.
Beckham took his game to Spain and still won La Liga title plus the several Premiership titles he won in England but Gerrard is yet to win a league title.
Did u hear that? Lemme say it again, Gerrard is yet to win a league title----------That is enough to discredit Gerrard in the English hall of fame.
What title has Gerrard won that Beckham hasn't won? ZILCH.
What has Beckham won that Gerrard hasn't won? Premiership and La Liga.
Have i answered ur query?

Naah, that point is moot. Beckham didn't win the premiership, United won the premiership. Beckham played for united. I insist that Gerrard's performance for liverpool over the last 2-3 years are far beyond Beckhams contributions for man U at his peak. He is the top scorer in the world cup, I accept that,



Ronaldinho is yet to score as many goals as some footballers (Pele, Maradinho). He is a great striker, but far from the best. Before that is was Muller (we all know him I think), followed by Some guy called Fontaine who scored 13 goals in 1958. Pele scored 12, but Pele won MORE world cups than your fav striker did.

Oga, we're not buying this one o.

Beckham's contributions for Man Utd at his peak cannot be compared to anyone's in the next 30 generations.
David Beckham's 2 extratime corner-kicks against DAYOKANU'S Bayern Munich gave United the Champions league title.
Beckham's numerous assists made Andy Cole and Dwight Yorke the best strike partners in the whole Europe.
This duo are only equalled by Shevchenko and Rebrov in that generation so lets give him the credits.
Can i simply add that Beckham contributions ensured United's treble in 1999, something Steven Gerrard or any player in this generation might NEVER win?

Granted, Pele won more world cups.
Let it be known that Ronaldo would have also won 3 world cups if he was fit for the France 98 finals.
By a stroke of fate, his illness gifted France the world cup and the issue still generates controversy in Brazil.
Ronaldo has won a lot for club and country. Scored a staggering 47 league goals in 49 games for Barcelona in 1996/97 season.
Won the FIFA player of the year at the tender age of 20.
He has scored a total of 62 goals in 97 games for Brazil.
Won the Confed cup, Copa America, La Liga titles, 3 times World player of the year.

david beckham of course !

Beckham is better than Stevie G

The people saying that becks is a better player than Cpt. fantastic, only watch fantasy football

Becks better tha Fantastic?

Not in this world.

All anti-Kops sould seat tight and see how fantasitc gets better for Liverpool and England, While Becks enjoys his retirement in galaxy

Nobody is yet to give me Beck's best performance in a tournament for England.

@ Jackal, On that night in Nou camp, Yorke, Cole and Beckham were pocketed easily it was the 2 subtitutes that made the difference Sheringham and Solskjaer.

Jack, let it also be known that if those awards had existed back in those days, Pele too would have won Player of the year multiple times. Pele won the world cup at the even more tender age of 17.

@ Dayokanu,

United fell apart in that game because Roy Keane and Paul Scholes did not feature.
Its like Chelsea missing Lampard and Essien in a crucial match.
Sheringham and Solskjaer only scored . . . . . .They had no bearing or stamping any authority in the match.
As a matter of fact, the only thing i remembered Ole doing in that match was that goal. Apart from that Zilch.
Beckham's contribution in that match to me was immense and very valuable.
David Beckham is the only Englishman to have scored a goal in 3 successive world cup tournaments. Deal with it!!!!!!!!!!


@ Banderas,

Unfortunately for Pele, there were no awards like that in his days. Big deal!!!!!!!
Football in the times of Pele were easier.
No defensive schemes. No ambiguous offside rules and goals were relatively easier to score in those days than now.
As football developed, managers and players began to devise and strategise on how to lock defenses up so it gets harder to score.
In 'em days of Pele there was nothing like that. The traditional formation was 2-3-5.
2 full backs, 3 midfielders and 5 attackers(2 wingers and 3 strikers)
In the days of Pele, Yisa Sofoluwe and Bright Omokaro never leaves the 18-yard box to protect Rufai's goal.
A defender has no business bombing forward to join the attackers.



These days its 4-3-3 or 4-4-2 or even 4-5-1
The whole game dynamics have changed. It is common to see Ashley Cole and Gary Neville bombing forward to join the attack.
Keeping the line and catching players offside. Different defensive strategies to make life harder for strikers and attackers.
Pele would have been an ordinary player like Craig Bellamy or Juninho of Lyon if he had been born in this generation.
Lets look at it, Pele has no pace. He can only dribble, create goals with crisp passes and score free-kicks.
Technically, he is not as skilful or gifted like Ronaldinho or J-J Okocha.
It got so bad that FIFA had to modify some laws to favour strikers so more goals will be scored.
Pele in this generation will be seized by the John Terrys, The Sammers and The Ben Irohas of our time.
Dont even compare 'em days to these days.

You are horrificly spots on about Pele, Jackal!!!

Sometimes i wonder how Pele Scored 1000 career goals _{(Pls no one shud include romarios fictious & imaginary golas).} No F$%king offside rules or what?.  Strikers were overtly protected. Peles era popularised the kick and follow syndrome. All what defenders needed to do was to play 'em chelsea-like long balls. Its what they call "police ball" in Ajegunle.

Not to take anything away from pele, but i think his career and repuatation was a product of "Test-running football". Now that the rules are stiff and compact, every playa on the field need to be a tactical devil and even possess a mental alertness  otherwise they end up sabotaging their teams!!!.

Thats why No other playa can ever score Pele's amount of goals and prolly win accolades as Pele did!!!

The Nigerian "Chicken Eagles"

Yak

Infact all the Nigerian players ^{apart from shittu though}