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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 3:19pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
Mrs.Chima: Dry as usual. |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by MrsChima(f): 4:22pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
bigfrancis21: Like your personality and brain. You are the epitome of a drought desert. 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 6:39pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
Hello all. Here is another interesting video from Geneticist Dr Kittles who explains the Genetic structure of the African American Population. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYv5Ig7WglA If you go back 14 generations you have 16,384 Ancestors. The Y DNA TEST and Mt DNA test only show DNA from Father to Son or from Mother to Daughter. It will not show you what Mothers pass to their Sons or what Fathers have passed to their daughters therefore missing thousands of persons DNA in your ancestry. Mt and Y DNA is only a small Fraction of your Ancestry and by NO MEANS all of it. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 7:02pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
What does it say please? I'm currently using my mobile and data plan doesn't allow video streaming. |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 7:42pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
bigfrancis21: What does it say please? I'm currently using my mobile and data plan doesn't allow video streaming. Just some information on the History of African Americans and the DNA tests and how they work 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 8:24pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
Jayvarley: Hello all. That's true. No one was disputing that. That is why you have autosomal testing. I already discussed this earlier before on another thread. The autosomal testing helps to show you other possible ancestries in your make up. However, at the end of the day, paternal and maternal ancestries are the most important of all. We live in a patriarchal world whereby we identify paternally. We take on our father's surname, who took his surname from his own father and so on. Most countries, tribes, and societies identify paternally, not maternally. Only a minute number of them are matriarchal societies. In Africa where we have a thousand more tribes than the select few that were taken to the Americas, paternal identity has helped to preserve our identities. In Africa today you'd commonly see someone who is proud Ijaw(let's call him Tonye), for example, yet his mother was Ibibio from her father(Tonye's maternal grandfather). Then his maternal grandmother could probably have been Efik. Then his father's mother could probably have been Igbo while his paternal grandfather is Ijaw, who passed his paternal Ijaw ancestry, genes and family name down to Tonye's father and down to Tonye. As you can see, Tonye is phenotypically a mix of Ibibio, Efik, Igbo and Ijaw but at the end of the day, Tonye is Ijaw. Former Niger Delta militant, Asari Dokubo is a clear example of this. According to him, all his grandmothers except one to 5 generations back were Igbo but today, Asari is a proud Ijaw man who identifies with Ijaw causes and issues, even though genetically he's a mix of Ijaw and Igbo. While some people decide to stick to their paternal side despite having other ancestries, some others decide to acknowledge both or all possible sides. At the end of the day it all boils down to the side you choose to affiliate with. However, one can never fully know all the different ancestries he's had so far since his first ancestors because genetics can be complex. African Ancestry.com confirmed this. Wanting to know all ancestries would entail knowing your father's ancestry, father's mother's father and mother's ancestries, paternal grandmother's both parents ancestries, maternal grandmother's both parents' ancestries and so on. This will lead you to very complex maze. Another difficulty that you also encounter is the fact that in an admixture the genes of a tribe could be dominant and overshadow the genes of another tribe which happens to be recessive, thus making it difficult to detect that recessive-gene ancestry in DNA tests. In every human being there are 46 chromosomes. Two of these chromosomes are XX(for females) or XY(for males) and these two chromosomes are called the Sex chromosomes as they determine the sex of an individual and they play no part in determining one's physical looks. The remaining 44 chromosomes come from both parents(22-22 each) are called Autosomal Chromosomes and it is the natural unique mixture of the 44 chromosomes from both parents that determines our physical characteristics and make up, which of our parents we look like etc. It is also here that other possible ancestries show up which DNA genealogy testing takes care of. It is also the unique admixture of the same 44 chromosomes that explains why someone will fail to look like both his Igbo-Igbo parents but look like his maternal Idoma grandmother because the Idoma autosomal chromosomes, which his maternal grand mother passed on to her daughter(his mom) which she then passed down to him, may have been stronger than the Igbo autosomal chromosomes from his father's side thus showing up in his physical make-up, thus giving him Idoma looks. Yet he remains Igbo but looks like the Idoma people instead. History has not been wrong so far in the affiliation of one to one's paternal side. Nature has indicated that one's most important ancestries are paternal and maternal and went further to confirm this by providing us with the unique Y-Chromosome Father to Son transfer and Mitochondrial mother to child transfer. By so doing, Nature has confirmed that paternal ancestry is the first and foremost important ancestry, followed by the maternal ancestry next, after which all other possible ones follow. If it didn't deem these two sides important, it wouldn't have come up with this unique genetic phenomenon. You next question might be how I'm able to know all these. I took genetics(biology) classes in both semesters of my first year in college, which I really enjoyed. |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 9:03pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
bigfrancis21: A very interesting post. I have noticed that most African people are very patriarchal and are very much into lineage. When asked about my parentage by African people, I tell them my Mother is Jamaican and my Dad is Barbadian, then they will reply "Then you are from Barbados" As it seems they hold less value to Mt DNA. Denying thousands of my ancestors of their contribution to my existence and also denying HALF of the genes my Mother made me with. Now suppose I were to do a Y DNA test and it were found that my Y Chromosome is from Europe, Would those same people consider me WHITE? Though Phenotypically I am clearly a black man, with a tiny Percentage of White ancestry that would never had been known about without the DNA test. The example you gave also relates to me. I resemble my Maternal Grandfather, who I suspect was of IGBO stock mainly because that is what Nigerian people see in me. I have also learnt recently that my Maternal Grandfather's own paternal Grandfather was an African American free slave who fled the states to Jamaica to escape the cruel racism in the states. I have seen some pictures of that line of family and my Mother and I still look like them unchanged. Also there are an increasing number of African Americans who DNA tests are found to match tribes that are NOT WEST AFRICAN. But rather from Northern and Eastern Africa. This tells us that during the slave trade, WEST AFRICA at some stage would have become exhausted. So slave raiders would have had to search deeper in land to find more slaves. I once had a conversation with an older white guy who I use to work with around ten years ago. In brief he said to me "West Africa was just the sending off point, it does not mean all slaves were West African." Now I can agree with you that MOST African Americans and Caribbean people are of WEST AFRICAN ANCESTRY. But as more and more people are being tested some are found to have matches in places like Uganda and Sudan and the Nubian Kingdom area. As more people are tested we will have a bigger picture. |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:23pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
The examples below show a clear case of clueless person who, without thinking before replying, would rather shout and spew nonsense just to feel she won an argument without even bothering to do some research. The examples below are classical examples. 1) In her bid to discredit anything Igbo in the slave trade this is what she arrogantly claimed out of utter sheer ignorance. *Kails*: --This was Blyss trying to educate her on her ignorance: Blyss: Blyss: Instead of doing a little common research, she replied with her typical ignorance, *Kails*: She even went on to call Blyss a liar. She continued again with her usual ignorance, this time saying it with all the energy and fervour she could muster. *Kails*: This is the same Ignoramus who then confessed with her very own mouth: Kails: This is someone who claims she's all knowing who would reply even when she's totally clueless because to her she's fighting 'some internet battle' which she must win. https://www.nairaland.com/1099473/caribbean-indigenes-speak-igbo-yoruba/6 https://www.nairaland.com/636061/african-americans-igbo-roots/14 2 Likes |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:23pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
2) Next, evidence was brought forward that records indicates that a few african americans still bear 'eboe' as surname in line with their eboe ancestry:
Then In her bid to prove she's all-knowing rather than research properly before concluding, she responded *Kails*: Even when modern Igbo people still bear 'Igbo' as surname or its derivatives such as Igbokwe, Igboamaeze, etc To which somebody responded to her ignorance: ezeagu: She realized she slayed herself woefully *Kails*: And my response after going all was bigfrancis21: This is clearly a case of ego problems running here. 2 Likes |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:24pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
3) Next She debunked the DNA TESTING by claiming that African americans and caribbean people were too mixed to be traced to specific individual tribes. She also went on to lie that DNA testing only stops 5 generations back and CANNOT be one further. The funny thing is that despite the fact that she's clueless she still takes pride in her nauseating ignorance and will resort to profanity just to prove a banal point *Kails*: [size=14pt]Then she continues to slay herself, using profanity to prove her clueless points [/size] MsDarkSkin: This is me trying to educate her on the DNA testing with the truth and real facts: bigfrancis21: [size=14pt]Someone else then slayed her![/size] ezeagu: Rather than accept the truth, she resorted to use of profanity to cover her inferiority complex: MsDarkSkin: lmao@ the igbo-centric ode oshi TRYING to convince me. This is a clear case of ego problems. 2 Likes |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:35pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
Jayvarley: @Bold...yes. Not every AA has a complete black ancestry. Some AAs who submitted their DNA samples for testing hoping they'd find an African ancestor were shocked to find their paternal ancestry pointing to Europe instead. Don't forget that some white slave masters tended to have black concubines with whom they had children with. Some had European maternal ancestries turn up in their result. Also, some white women seduced black men and had children by them which explains why some AAs have DNA results turning up with European maternal ancestry. A few black men had white women ad their wives as well. |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 9:49pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
The term "RED IBO" is an OLD JAMAICAN TERM and is not often used today except by the older Generation. This is simply because the tribal affiliations have become practically non existent in todays Jamaican society . A fair skinned person may be referred to as simply "RED" The IBO/IGBO part and meaning had been lost/forgotten by todays generation. 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:00pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
Jayvarley: I noticed that. Yet, this is what she claimed: *Kails*: 2 Likes |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:14pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
4) Another big lie told by Kails all in the same delusion to prove that she must win her internet battle. *Kails*: @Bold> I have never heard that one before. She didn't even drop any facts to verify her claims. Imagine her utter false claims even when african americans keep turning up with partial/full igbo ancestries in their DNA tests. If most of these slaves died in the sea or due to murder, why not explain how a substantial amount of these results keep turning up Igbo? [size=16pt]Even with such massive evidence as shown below? [/size] 2 Likes
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:16pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
5) She even went on to defend her lies and fact peddling after being confronted severally with evidence of her massive lies *Kails*: [size=16pt]LIAR![/size] 2 Likes |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by kweenchi(f): 10:54pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
Interesting thread thanks to @bigfrancis21!! 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Nobody: 11:16pm On Sep 08, 2013 |
LOL @ all the comments. Una still dey here? . What are we still arguing, pray tell? |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by MrsChima(f): 2:32am On Sep 09, 2013 |
Radoillo: LOL @ all the comments. Una still dey here? . What are we still arguing, pray tell? No one is arguing...we are trying to pacify a grown dummy who can't accept the facts and truth that Igbos do not dominate the world nor do they have greatest influence on Western Blacks. He is posting articles and blogs claiming every Western Black has Igbo DNA. 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Crayola1: 3:26am On Sep 09, 2013 |
Mrs.Chima: The problem is that he is not saying any of those things. 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 7:52am On Sep 09, 2013 |
@Bigfrancis21 There is truth in what Kalis is saying though. If you go back (350 years ago) 14 generations in your family you will have 16, 384 ancestors Which is roughly the time period of slavery in the US. Out of those 16,384 ancestors it is highly likely that some of them were from different African ethnicities. Once African slaves were taken to their colonies, they began to leave their tribal differences behind them for OWN SURVIVAL. Tribes who were usually enemies with each other became friends because they shared a common enemy the European. This is the reason why African American and Caribbean people are so genetically diverse groups. If you also include the European and Native American/Arawak contribution to those peoples you have a unique genetic signature |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 8:25am On Sep 09, 2013 |
You still don't get. She claimed you people were too mixed for DNA testing to locate each specific tribe in your ancestry, in her bid to discredit the DNA testing that has recorded enormous success in fields such as paternity cases and murder cases. What you just described above can also be attributed to the people of Africa, Europe and even India. In those places, when you go 14 generations back you'll get 16,384 different people with possible different ethnicities. After she then modified it to claim that DNA testing CANNOT go beyond 5 generations back while the same testing has successfully been able to go 10 generations back or more down to the very first ancestor. Finally, africa has a thousand more tribes than the select few, say 20 or 30, that were shipped to America and a lot of inter tribal marriages occur everyday. If you're talking about people who are mixed with excessive ancestries more than ever, you are likely to find them in Africa. So I don't see why that of AAs/Caribs should be so unique anyway. If AAs/Caribbean peeps had kept their tribal affiliations all these while like Africans do, identity crises like this would not have been there and there would practically have been no need for DNA testing. Take a look around you. You are unlikely to find somebody who is 100% pure of only onee ancestry. In Europe, Asia etc. Even within a tribe in Africa. Even some whites were shocked to have native american, and even African ancestries pop up in their DNA testing on their maternal sides and autosomally yet today they are whites. Europeans tend to have so many ancestries in their DNA. Its common to find an English man with Italian, german, french, spanish ancestries. Yet at the end of the day he's an English man. Nobody is reputing the fact that people around the world are likely to be more mixed than ever. However, paternal ancestry still remains the most important because at the end of the day, your fatherland is where you belong and where you have the most rights. Little wonder when Blair Underwood was interviewed concerning his ancestry, despite having 3 ancestries(Igbo, Yoruba and Bamoun), he went on to specifically mention Igbo exclusively(Igbo being his paternal line). At the end of the day where would you yourself properly belong to and have more rights, in Barbados(your maternal land) or Jamaica(your paternal land)? |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 8:25am On Sep 09, 2013 |
The term "DUNDUS" is a derogatory term used for Albino's in Jamaica. However some Jamaicans incorrectly use the term to refer to anyone who is very fair skinned. However an Albino lack of pigmentation in their hair and eyes make them very distinguishable from other faired skinned persons. Here is KING YELLOW MAN one of my Favourite Jamaican Reggae dancehall Artistes. Who is Albino https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NdqsIeA6mU |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 8:40am On Sep 09, 2013 |
Nobody ever disputed the Dundus part. I don't see why you should be bringing that up. The bone of contention was 'red ibo' probably because to her it contained 'ibo' as a word and she has a phobia against anything 'ibo'. She's a fulani. I don't see why she should be jumping from this Igbo thread to that Igbo thread on nairaland disputing anything Ibo with all the energy she can muster. |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by Jayvarley(m): 8:46am On Sep 09, 2013 |
@Bigfrancis21 One of the earlier posts by Kalis made references to the term DUNDUS. So I made further clarifications for the education of the forum |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:36am On Sep 09, 2013 |
@Jayvarley Below is a snapshot image of excerpts from africanancestry.com on the two main types of DNA testing confirming the same thing i've been saying earlier. They Notice that they indicated that Y DNA testing and Mt DNA testing are more specific.
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:43am On Sep 09, 2013 |
@Jayvarley DNA testing has continued to prove Dr. Chambers Douglas', who concluded that "My research suggests that perhaps 60 percent of black Americans have at least one Igbo ancestor...'', research conclusion very right. Below is Chris Tucker, the famous black american hollywood actor's DNA testing result by african ancestry.com. His own DNA testing was more comprehensive as it included paternal, maternal and autosomal DNA results. Despite having a paternal ancestry pointing to Cameroon, he result came out showing partial Ibo ancestry popping out in both paternal and maternal sides of his ancestry. Clearly, he must have had more than one partial Ibo ancestor in his history for Ibo to pop out on both sides of his history. 2 Likes
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:50am On Sep 09, 2013 |
@Jayvarley Despite having Ibo ancestries pop out more in his ancestries than other discovered ethnicities in his ancestry, at the day his paternal ancestry is the most important, and that is the Bamileke tribe in Cameroon. Chris Tucker is Bamileke and he has chosen to identify with that. He has even visited Cameroon to meet with his tribesmen. Whether he chooses to acknowledge other tribes in his ancestry is a choice left to him to make. 1 Like |
Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 9:52am On Sep 09, 2013 |
Even Quincy Jones', the American record producer, conductor, arranger, composer, television producer, and trumpeter, DNA testing result indicates a partial Ibo ancestry. 1 Like
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:00am On Sep 09, 2013 |
@Jayvarley Bishop TD Jakes' DNA test confirmed his family's oral historical paternal Ibo ancestry. He also has hausa, fulbe and fulani ancestries. 1 Like
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:02am On Sep 09, 2013 |
Oprah Winfrey's DNA test indicates she has Kpelle, Kru and Kissi ancestries. 1 Like
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:05am On Sep 09, 2013 |
bigfrancis21: You still don't get. She claimed you people were too mixed for DNA testing to locate each specific tribe in your ancestry, in her bid to discredit the DNA testing that has recorded enormous success in fields such as paternity cases and murder cases. @Bold...below is a DNA autosomal(44 chromosomes) testing result done on a white man, Mark Shriver, which showed he has some African(West African) ancestry despite being white. 1 Like
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Re: Nigerian (igbo) & African American by bigfrancis21: 10:06am On Sep 09, 2013 |
The link to the evidence given above can be found here: http://www.healthdisparity.tuskegee.edu/8thSymposium/Presentations/8BMRS-RK-DNA-AA7x.pdf Peace out. |
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