^^Your brain needs to mature  fully to understand the concept of this thread

^^ Insincere, vacuous, daft

^Until you are spiritually mature you just will not understand the concept of the thread.

Now vamos

nothing to say, ehn? Sorry

I cannot say anything to someone whom's head is blocked

@ newmi

Since you ask for it, you can start with my question earlier in the thread; it is post no 8.

@nuke

You'd better ignore the latest ignoramus.

Anyway sha, something more worthwhile below:

Before the throne of God above
I have a strong, a perfect plea:
A great High Priest, whose name is Love,
Who ever lives and pleads for me.

My name is graven on his hands,
My name is written on his heart;
I know that while in heaven he stands
No tongue can bid me thence depart
No tongue can bid me thence depart.

When Satan tempts me to despair,
And tells me of the guilt within,
Upward I look, and see him there
Who made an end of all my sin.

Because a sinless Savior died,
My sinful soul is counted free;
For God, the Just, is satisfied
To look on Him and pardon me
To look on Him and pardon me

Hallelujah! Hallelujah! Praise the One,
Risen Son of God!

Behold him there, the risen Lamb
My perfect, spotless righteousness,
The great unchangeable I am,
The King of glory and of grace!

One in himself, I cannot die
My soul is purchased by his blood
My life is hid with Christ on high,
With Christ, my Savior and my God
With Christ, my Savior and my God

ETA Youtube link (one of many for the song)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fq4eObqVdX0&feature=fvst

Ignorance on a whole new level

Nice piece on the hymn including scripture references http://cbumgardner./2008/05/08/before-the-throne-of-god-above-charitie-bancroft/

One of the more outstanding hymn texts with which I am familiar is “Before the Throne of God Above.” The author, Charitie Lees Smith, was born in 1841 in the vicinity of Dublin, Ireland. She was the daughter of a minister of the Church of Ireland. Not much is known about her life, but it appears that she was widowed twice: although she married Arthur Bancroft in 1869, she died under the name Charitie de Cheney in California in 1923. Charitie published her poetry in leaflet form as early as 1860, and a number of her collected works were eventually published as Within the Veil in 1867. “Before the Throne” was written in 1863 under the title “The Advocate.”

Before the throne of God above
I have a strong and perfect plea. (Heb 4:15-16)
A great High Priest whose Name is Love (Heb 4:14)
Who ever lives and pleads for me. (Heb 7:25)
My name is graven on His hands, (Isa 49:16)
My name is written on His heart.
I know that while in Heaven He stands
No tongue can bid me thence depart. (Rom 8:34)

When Satan tempts me to despair (Luke 22:31-32)
And tells me of the guilt within,
Upward I look and see Him there (Acts 7:55-56)
Who made an end of all my sin. (Col 2:13-14)
Because the sinless Savior died
My sinful soul is counted free.
For God the just is satisfied
To look on Him and pardon me. (Rom 3:24-26)

Behold Him there the risen Lamb, (Rev 5:6)
My perfect spotless righteousness, (1 Cor 1:30; 1 Peter 1:18-19)
The great unchangeable I AM, (Heb 13:8; John 8:58)
The King of glory and of grace,
One in Himself I cannot die.
My soul is purchased by His blood, (Acts 20:28)
My life is hid with Christ on high, (Col 3:3)
With Christ my Savior and my God! (Ti t 2:13)

“Before the Throne of God Above” draws heavily from Scripture for its pictures and language. It is a hymn which finds its theme in the perfect security which believers find in Christ, Who intercedes for them “before the throne of God above.” The following Scriptures find echoes in the song, whether Charitie is drawing conceptually from them or merely using their language. . . . . . . .

@ kandiikane

kandiikane:

@Nuclearboy, like you said Jesus was the bridge and that means we can walk straight unto God.
Before the bridge we could not pass, people had to make sacrifices and go through the holy of holies to get to God but since he came and built the bridge, there are no more killings of lambs or offerings of food and then going straight to the holy of holies to talk to God on our behalf. He came and died for our sins so we can approach God without any intermediary.

Please read first before you type.

Thank you so much for your contribution. The message is simple. Jesus has brought us into union with the father.  That's what the thread is about . Jesus said in that day. (which we are now) we don't need to go through him. Since we are one with him. Praying in his name means , in his stead. We are in him. The father loves us as he loves Jesus . That's the point.

John 16:23
And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you


Union with christ and God doesn't mean we have stolen Gods glory.  But rather our oneness with him . We in him and he in us.

Enigma:


“Before the Throne of God Above” draws heavily from Scripture for its pictures and language. It is a hymn which finds its theme in the perfect security which believers find in Christ, Who intercedes for them “before the throne of God above.” The following Scriptures find echoes in the song, whether Charitie is drawing conceptually from them or merely using their language. . . . . . . .

Nice piece on the hymn including scripture references http://cbumgardner./2008/05/08/before-the-throne-of-god-above-charitie-bancroft/

There is a difference between intermediary and the intercessory ministry of jesus . I intercede for fellow christian but im not their intermediary. . It's an issue of language. Religiously taught wrongly . We pray in his name . Not through him. "bless this food oh lord FOR CHRIST SAKE amen " you were taught from child but have you checked it's scriptural accuracy . It's still conveys sense of unworthiness . We have become one with him.

Another one is the idea of praying through the name of Jesus. This is different from praying IN the name of Jesus . The bible never said to pray through the name but In the name. I represent his name as a police man represents the authority of the  law.I stand in the authority of his name,  If you don't understand this you can't cast out devils.

Mark 16:17
17  In my name shall they cast out devils. . .;

Not "through his name"  We pray in his name. A policeman arrests in the name of the law. He stands in the authority o the law.

John 16:23
And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you

In order to understand the above, let us go back to 16:16

In a little while you won't see me anymore. But a little while after that you will see me again

How come?

John 16:20
I tell you the truth, you will weep and mourn over what is going to happen to me, but the world will rejoice. You will grieve, but your grief will suddenly turn to wonderful joy --------------->>> Vs 22 "So you have sorrow now, but I will see you again; then you will rejoice, and no one can rob you of that joy.

What Joy? Why?

John 16:23
"At that time you will not NEED to ask me (Jesus) for anything. ----->>> I TELL U THE TRUTH, ------->>>> you will ask the Father DIRECTLY, and he will grant your request because of my name"

John 16:26
"Then you will ask IN my name. I am NOT SAYING I will ask the father on your behalf----(what Jesus is saying is in VERSE 27 ----------- " For the Father himself loves YOU dearly because you love me and believe that I came from God.

The notable effect is the joy of undestanding the authority given to us and the joy of successful prayer.

^^

All through the Scriptures, there’s no place where the Christian is asked to pray to Jesus or through Jesus. [s]Neither do you ask the Father to grant your request for “Jesus’ sake,” for God wouldn’t answer your prayers for Jesus’ sake. [/s] He loves you as much as He loves Jesus. So when you pray to the Father in the Name of Jesus, it’s as though Jesus Himself were praying, because you stand in His stead.

Edited

so if you want to cast out a demon from a demon possessed person
will you say "come out through the name of Jesus"

@Enigma:

Thanks. As I said, "after" head criminal speaks, they now try to fit the Bible to his words. Imagine Jo talking about "Through the Name" and "In the Name" in a shitty attempt at damage control! I wonder who the baby is here who prays "through" the Name of Jesus. Rather than keep quiet and accept fault, these ones who will call Jesus a coward cannot accept that Oyaks can even make a mistake.

If anyone wishes to be honest, then ask yourselves - why is Jesus alive today? Then where is He today? Finally, what is He doing there today? The Bible tells us that He is seated at the Hand of the Father INTERCEDING for us. But you say we do not need an intermediary with the Father and that it is wrong to make Jesus an intermediary. So what is Jesus doing in heaven on our behalf?

All Joagbaje had to say here was that the choice of words of his earthly surrogate father suggested the wrong thing THEN he could find something to say the man meant. But the spirit of pride doesn't allow simplicity, does it?

Jesus intercedes for us. He is an intermediary for us in Heaven. That is Biblical. Any human saying otherwise is daft or unknowledgeable or is a plain out and out criminal. The fact that we can approach mercy with boldness does not mean we do not need Christ.

^^^ Precisely, nuke!


@yommyik

yommyuk:

All through the Scriptures, there’s no place where the Christian is asked to pray to Jesus or through Jesus. [s]Neither do you ask the Father to grant your request for “Jesus’ sake,” for God wouldn’t answer your prayers for Jesus’ sake.[/s] He loves you as much as He loves Jesus. So when you pray to the Father in the Name of Jesus, it’s as though Jesus Himself were praying, because you stand in His stead.

Edited

Oh ho, I see you disagree with Oyakhilome regarding the above!  {I am still waiting for newmi's response on the same question}

OK then question 2 for you.

Do you agree that Jesus is not a medium or intermediary to the Father as quoted below from the piece in the opening post?

To pray through Jesus is to make Him a medium or intermediary to the Father, and that’s wrong.

@Joagbaje and co

If you can ask anything as long as it is "in Jesus' name" and it will be granted, why don't you people or opaks Oyaks himself ask for "supernatural" security, so that he does not need earthly security through bouncers, mai-guards and "armour bearers"? Or is that not included in your own "anything" or you people cannot approach the Father directly for that?

who knows how many that jo and oyaks have led astray with this lies.
If Jesus Christ is in heaven interceding for us, I wonder the degree of delusion and foolishness in the person of jo to say that Jesus is not the medium to God.

For there is one God and one mediator between men and God the man Christ Jesus - 1Tim 2:5

@OP,
Thanks for the insight.
It needed a study of the word to initially understand this but thanks for the Holy Spirit, it is truly a 'meat' message and not for 'milk-drinkers' at all.
If only we Christians know the authority given to us in Christ Jesus, we would stop living apologetic lives. Wow!

I likened it to a judge/justice and a lawyer/advocate in the law court.
Christ interceeds for us while we stand before God and Satan accuses us. Christ is our advocate to The Lord God Almighty (our supreme justice/judge).
What would have been the case if we had no advocate (those without Christ), we would most likely not present our case well and might not get justified.
However, Christ who came in human flesh understands us men and He therefore pleads our case to God while we commune with God directly by the blood of Jesus and through faith in Him.


Ephesians 3:12 In him and through faith in him we may approach God with freedom and confidence.

Hebrews 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus

I John 2:1 My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One

John 16:26 Then you will ask in my name. I'm not saying I will ask the Father on your behalf,


That is why He also showed us how we should pray 'Our Father, who art in Heaven, ', while He (Christ) is our defense when the devil accuses us for God not to hear us.


However@OP,
you might need to state that this message is for those who are in Christ as it is they that have this authority. Paul & Christ were not just talking to anyone here.
Though a lot of those that 'drink milk' (babes) too will never understand this message either till they grow.

for the 'bone-eaters' why is it so difficult even impossible for u to admit ur wrongs?
Why are u bringing Jesus down to ur level?
Why are u so willing to swallow every bit of rubbish oyaks spews without bringing such to the light of scriptures?

WHY ARE DECEIVING PEOPLE JOAGBAJE ET AL?

Don't mind them jare, free123.

They are looking for ways to twist round the obvious - that the message is idiotic and anti-Christ because, at the end of the day, what the message boils down to is: "you do not need Jesus Christ"! In other words, "you do not need Jesus Christ because you are now equal to him as long as you mention his name".

A sensible person would take time to consider the following carefully and compare it to what the dumbass author of the piece wrote.

1. "Father hear my prayer, in the name of Jesus Christ"

2. "Father hear my prayer, through Jesus Christ"

3. "Father hear my prayer, because of Jesus Christ"

4. "Father hear my prayer, for the sake of Jesus Christ"

Honestly Enigma, the message is clearer now, they are trying to substitude Jesus Christ.

I mean!!! Again, don't mind them. Funny they don't talk about standing in stead of Jesus when it comes to helping people.

Funny also, they can say people should go to the father directly but when it comes to "tithes" they don't tell the people to go to God direct; that one can only get to God through the "pastors"!

:rolleyes:

Enigma:

Don't mind them jare, free123.

They are looking for ways to twist round the obvious - that the message is idiotic and anti-Christ because, at the end of the day, what the message boils down to is: "you do not need Jesus Christ"! In other words, "you do not need Jesus Christ because you are now equal to him as long as you mention his name".

A sensible person would take time to consider the following carefully and compare it to what the dumbass author of the piece wrote.

1. "Father hear my prayer, in the name of Jesus Christ"

2. "Father hear my prayer, through Jesus Christ"

3. "Father hear my prayer, because of Jesus Christ"

4. "Father hear my prayer, for the sake of Jesus Christ"

I think you should do a study on the principles of substitution. We would have been nothing on our own. But the Jesus life in us makes us one with him. We are now brothers. As long as you see yourself lesser than jesus in authority . You can't fulfil his purpose in you. You must accept what he died for. Even in his earthly life ,he Walked at different level of revelation with his disciples. At one time he told them that's long as they relate only as servants to him ,they would be limited in revelation .

John 15:15
15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

Don't dwell where Jesus has left. Stay where he has brought you.

There is a difference between speaking in the name of the president And speaking through the president. They are not the same . Get it?


To make us one. You can't continue in the

Joagbaje:

I think you should do a study on the principles of substitution. . . .

Thank you for your kind suggestion. I too would like to make my own suggestion to you: I think you should work hard on seriously improving your English comprehension; that would help you to see through the deceit of an anti-Christ message like that in the opening post.

Good luck as you try to improve as recommended.

free123:

Honestly Enigma, the message is clearer now, they are trying to substitude Jesus Christ.

You are close to it. But not in your negative perspective. He was our substitute ,we are his representative. God accepts me on the bases of Jesus in me. He sees me as Jesus . That's eternal life. Christ in me. Jesus is divided into all of us.
That's what God sees. That's what the devil sees. But sadly that's what religious men don't see.

Until you see your self in christ and christ in you. You will never work miracle or cast devils out. Because you don't understand authority. God and satan relates to you on the bases of how much truth you kniw.

could u jo, admit that u were wrong when u said we dont need Jesus as an intermidiary

I wonder why this is so difficult to understand, anyway d bible said it that because many have rejected d truth (holdin on to yrs of ignorant religious misinterpretations) He gave them strong delusion that they should believe a lie.
With the absence of the Holyspirit in your life u cant understand this message! no wonder many christians stay stagnant & keep suffering. Many christians make the mistake of praying to Jesus to foward their petitions to God but D right way is to ask God directly IN HIS NAME!

One of them quoted Ephesians 3:12 In him and through faith in him we may approach God with freedom and confidence.

Yet they say you should not go to God through Jesus as though "through faith in Jesus" is not the same as "through him".

Their problem is that they need to do gyrations because of their loyalty to Oyaks instead of admitting that the fellow was talking through his ass.

Enigma:

Thank you for your kind suggestion. I too would like to make my own suggestion to you: I think you should work hard on seriously improving your English comprehension; that would help you to see through the deceit of an anti-Christ message like that in the opening post.

^^
I will work on my English comprehension. But is the bible wrong. Have you cross checked those scriptures.

John 16:23
And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you


He has taken away our unworthiness . That's why some still pray through Mary. Because in human sense. They feel we are unworthy to approach Jesus direct.  That's the same religious sense they taught us. We have come through Jesus at new birth. We don't come through him again. We have crossed the bridge.

Is there any place in the bible where the church ever prayed through Jesus?

Joagbaje:

^^
I will work on my English comprehension. But is the bible wrong. . . .

Is there any place in the bible where the church ever prayed through Jesus?  

When your English has improved, go back and read the prayers of Christians in the New Testament ---- then try to answer your own question.

^^^
what question?

Enigma:

One of them quoted Ephesians 3:12 In him and through faith in him we may approach God with freedom and confidence.

Yet they say you should not go to God through Jesus as though "through faith in Jesus" is not the same as "through him".

Their problem is that they need to do gyrations because of their loyalty to Oyaks instead of admitting that the fellow was talking through his backside.

Let's not give it our own meaning . Let's read other version for clarity.

Ephesians 3:12
12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.

Ephesians 3:12
12 In Whom, because of our faith in Him, we dare to have the boldness (courage and confidence) of free access (an unreserved approach to God with freedom and without fear).

This verse is rather a confirmation of the truth we are talking about. Why should we keep beating Ourselves down.

So it has already come to "play the version/translation card" again?

Even sticking to your own translation your English is so poor that you don't know that "in him" also means "through him"?

It really is important that you take those English classes.

Actually a question for you: if we want to give glory to God do we do it directly or can we do it through Jesus Christ?