This message is by no means exhaustive in it’s discourse on the doctrine of perseverance. It examines only one scriptural reference in refuting unconditional eternal security. However, this message does unmask the plot of Satan to lull the American church to sleep by sedating them with the heresy of once saved always saved. It is a sinister belief that must constantly amend the scriptures in order to defend it’s position.

It requires years of theological training in scriptural manipulation to believe in Calvinism. Whereas the common man given access to the word of God comes away from his study knowing beyond all academic maneuvering that one must endure, abide, and keep your hands firmly gripped to the plow handle of God.

Paul, unfortunately was not a Calvinist, he considered his greatest triumph to be, “I have kept the faith.” Despite the overwhelming Biblical evidence that points to the necessity of continued perseverance thousands of preachers stand by the coffin’s of blatant sinners and proclaim that they are in heaven. Their life and fruit are set aside because they prayed at a VBS and or were baptized by a traveling evangelist.

The fruit of the this false teaching is a one time, no renewal fire insurance gospel. Our churches are inundated with people who do not have a clue what it means to be a disciple of the Lord Jesus Christ. They are not even aware that there is an opportunity through the cross to know Him. The emphasis is placed on the birth not the life of the believer. Rom 8:14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.
TLB

Jesus told the woman at the well that if you drink of the water that I speak of you will never thirst again. This is where the ”once saved always saved” ends their study and draws the wrong conclusion. But Jesus went on to say that it will be a well springing up into everlasting life. Jesus didn’t give us a drink-He gave us a well that we can continually drink from. Stop perpurtrating a theological crime upon the people of God.

This liscense to a lukewarm walk must be revoked and the truth declared, ”those that endure to the end the same shall be saved!” Backslider, your soul is at risk. Lukewarm preacher return to your first love or God will vomit you out. Stiff necked and hard hearted Deacon the flames of hell chase after thee. Run home to the Father’s house where he awaits with open arms and he will declare, “this is my son which was dead and now he is alive again.”

http://jamesmcfadden./2007/12/03/the-devils-greatest-lie-is-once-saved-always-saved/

When a man get saved ,he is saved. Except he falls out of faith.

frisbel the problem is that you have seen bible verses quoted to you, I have at least 50 verses that support calvinism, wat other kind of evidence do u want?

God said he saves who He wills and hardens whom he wills for His glory. God said explicitly in Acts 13:48

"And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

The Bible is precise here. In enumerating the numbers it says only as many as were ordained to life believed there was no going over that number. Sorry but thats what the Bible says.

Again i quote below

Acts 18: 9 And the Lord said to Paul one night in a vision, “Do not be afraid, but go on speaking and do not be silent, 10 for I am with you, and no one will attack you to harm you, for I have many in this city who are my people.” 11 And he stayed a year and six months, teaching the word of God among them.

Coming down to your question of once saved always saved, yes it is true that ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED BUT:

1.) There are still consequences for sin in this world.
2.) There is no possibility of the christian going to hell - why? Because "Jehova hath laid on Him the iniquity of us all"

I propose that should any fall away from the faith including myself then it is God who also decided that to happen.

It is very clear,once saved,is always saved.

don33310:

It is very clear,once saved,is always saved.

So you be Calvinist too?

don33310:

It is very clear,once saved,is always saved.

Amen i am ONCE SAVED always SAVED! because the blood of Jesus is not the blood of goats and bull.[color=#770077][/color]

@ Poster,
"saved"is a past tense. If you have been saved are you now unsaved? That is on a lighter note.

My brother if you have been saved you are!However there is a word of caution in scripture that those of us who are saved might not fall away. We are therefore encouraged to watch and pray. Can a saved man fall away? YES. If he does fall away is he still saved? NO because he ceases to believe in his salvation. Except he returns to the Lord he shall likewise perish.

There are two types of salvation talked about in scripture and one is related to the other.
1. Salvation of our soul from sin, and
2. the salvation of our soul from pains, trouble, sin, mourning, crying, weeping, persecution etc which is often referred to as "perfect sanctification" by evangelical Christians. This is why Christians are not in the mad chase of money because they await the second salvation which would not be obtained in this life ( those who serve Mammon are not Christians for they have another master, and they are opening up several business centres daily which they nickname church. Jesus said "You cannot serve both God and Money."

The first salvation is obtained by grace through faith.

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast."- Ephesians 2: 8 -9

Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.” (Acts 4: 12)

The grace is available to all and those who believe shall be saved. All who believe in the Son of God and accept the gift of salvation he offers shall be saved. Remember the condition is faith.


The second salvation is obtained if you stay through to your faith. i.e if you keep believing what you first confessed ( first salvation). It is one thing to claim I believe in something and another thing to keep believing in that particular thing. "Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed--not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence--continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling,- Philipians 2: 12

The second salvation is what those who have accepted Christ awaits. Not all who embraced the call to the first salvation would eventually be saved. Jesus when explaining the second salvation said “For many are invited, but few are chosen.” - Matthew 22:14

Of the second salvation Paul wrote "And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed." - Romans 13: 11

Peter also noted in his letter "Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, and into an inheritance that can never perish, spoil or fade—kept in heaven for you, who through faith are shielded by God’s power[b] until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time[/b]." - 1 Peter 1: 3 - 6

Why would some miss out on the second salvation?

Because many are called and few chosen but particularly because they would fall away i.e they stopped believing in their salvation. They think there are some other things to be done to be saved. To these men the finished work of Christ is no longer considered sufficient for the salvation of their soul. Jesus describe these men in his parable of the sower ( which demons have demoted to money manipulation on pulpits today)

Those on the rock are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away.- Luke 8: 13

The bible warns us about the dangers of the end time.

The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. - 1 Timothy 4: 1

Such is the danger of falling away that the bible declared:

"It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace." - Heb. 6: 4 -6

In conclusion remember that if if you have been saved from your sins you are saved by grace (available to all) and through faith ( your responsibility). Do not be like many who take the grace of God with contempt and continue living in sin

"What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? By no means! We died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? Or don’t you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death?" - Romans 6: 1-3

Whatever denomination we may belong let us remember these words

"Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For if you do these things, you will never fall, and you will receive a rich welcome into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ." - 2 Peter 1: 10 -11

even with biblical jesus in the driver seat, christian safety is not guaranteed? i am shocked the blood can't keep you from falling out of safety. what good is the blood, then if it can't keep what he got already?

each one of you is therefore responsible for yourself, is what i am thinking each one of you is saying, if there is any time you bounce out of the safety. calvinist or not, imagine if you die when you happen to be unsafe?

your condition will be just the same as that of an infidel, like me.


you will worse than me, if when you are dying and suddenly it is revealed that jesus son of virgin mary was no more than an apostle, and you have worshiped him instead of worshiping God Who sent him.

@ Sweetnecta,
I pray the Lord would open your eyes for the Lord desires that you be saved. You just stressed the point we are making on this thread that you are saved only if you believe in God and his son Jesus Christ. From your comment you consider Jesus an apostle and how shall you stand before him when he returns to judge the world. Why are you not weary to slander the son of God? For I tell you even Satan and the demons would never say of Christ what you just described. For they which are in heaven and on earth and under the earth know that Jesus is the son of God and he his worshipped.

"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God."- 1 Corinthians 1:18

Obalende:

frisbel the problem is that you have seen bible verses quoted to you, I have at least 50 verses that support calvinism, wat other kind of evidence do u want?

God said he saves who He wills and hardens whom he wills for His glory. God said explicitly in Acts 13:48

"And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

The Bible is precise here. In enumerating the numbers it says only as many as were ordained to life believed there was no going over that number. Sorry but thats what the Bible says.

Again i quote below

Acts 18: 9 And the Lord said to Paul one night in a vision, “Do not be afraid, but go on speaking and do not be silent, 10 for I am with you, and no one will attack you to harm you, for I have many in this city who are my people.” 11 And he stayed a year and six months, teaching the word of God among them.

Coming down to your question of once saved always saved, yes it is true that ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED BUT:

1.) There are still consequences for sin in this world.
2.) There is no possibility of the christian going to hell - why? Because "Jehova hath laid on Him the iniquity of us all"
I propose that should any fall away from the faith including myself then it is God who also decided that to happen.

GBAM!!! my thoughts exactly. Fellows, there is no hell to go to. The consequences of your sins, you will reap them in this life and learn from it. The bible says 'if u sow to the flesh, you will corruption IN THE FLESH (not when you die). the concept of hell fire is man made.

1 Corinthians 5
1 It is actually reported that there is intimate immorality among you, and such intimate immorality as is not even named[a] among the Gentiles—that a man has his father’s wife! 2 And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he who has done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
According to Paul, this guy banging his father's wife is not even going to hell. when his flesh is destroyed - that is when he dies, his spirit will be saved.

[b]Ecclesiastes 12:7
and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it. This happens to everybody, christian, muslim, buddhist, atheist, whatever. God is not messed up in your religion you hypocrites!!!! Nowhere does it say in this passage that this is for christians. This happens to everybody, when u shed that flesh, the spirit that the creator blew into that flesh returns back to the creator. The spirit inside all 6.2 billion people on this earth was blown in there by the almighty creator. If you want to judge people to hell, then keep that in your little closed religion and let people live their lives

Idi-Amin:

GBAM!!! my thoughts exactly. Fellows, there is no hell to go to. The consequences of your sins, you will reap them in this life and learn from it. The bible says 'if u sow to the flesh, you will corruption IN THE FLESH (not when you die). the concept of hell fire is man made.

1 Corinthians 5
1 It is actually reported that there is intimate immorality among you, and such intimate immorality as is not even named[a] among the Gentiles—that a man has his father’s wife! 2 And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he who has done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
According to Paul, this guy banging his father's wife is not even going to hell. when his flesh is destroyed - that is when he dies, his spirit will be saved.

[b]Ecclesiastes 12:7
and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it. This happens to everybody, christian, muslim, buddhist, atheist, whatever. God is not messed up in your religion you hypocrites!!!! Nowhere does it say in this passage that this is for christians. This happens to everybody, when u shed that flesh, the spirit that the creator blew into that flesh returns back to the creator. The spirit inside all 6.2 billion people on this earth was blown in there by the almighty creator. If you want to judge people to hell, then keep that in your little closed religion and let people live their lives

For how long will you run away from the truth? HELL IS REAL AND THERE ARE SOULS THERR RIGHT NOW AS I TYPING THIS.

Have you thoroughly studies the bible? Rev 20 vs 13 ", and death and HELL gave up the dead that were in them them , "

Then go read these bible verse
Mt 5 vs 22, 29,30
Mt 10 vs 28
Mt 18 vs 9
Mt 23 vs 15, 33
Mk 9 s 43,45,47
Lk 12 vs 5
Lk 16 vs 23
James 3 vs 6
2peter 2 vs 4.

So how does your reasoning of the non existence of hell stack up with these scriptures?

May God help us all.

Omo_Tier1:

For how long will you run away from the truth? HELL IS REAL AND THERE ARE SOULS THERR RIGHT NOW AS I TYPING THIS.

Have you thoroughly studies the bible? Rev 20 vs 13 ", and death and HELL gave up the dead that were in them them , "

Then go read these bible verse
Mt 5 vs 22, 29,30
Mt 10 vs 28
Mt 18 vs 9
Mt 23 vs 15, 33
Mk 9 s 43,45,47
Lk 12 vs 5
Lk 16 vs 23
James 3 vs 6
2peter 2 vs 4.

So how does your reasoning of the non existence of hell stack up with these scriptures?

May God help us all.

LAIR!!! There are people there as you are typing? really? How do u know? Oh, you went there and saw them, or God took you there like that liar Morros Cerullo keeps deceiving prople that God took him to hell. Beleive what you like peace

Idi-Amin:

LAIR!!! There are people there as you are typing? really? How do u know? Oh, you went there and saw them, or God took you there like that liar Morros Cerullo keeps deceiving prople that God took him to hell. Beleive what you like peace

I pray you will not be found wanting when your breathe finally departs.

If you have read through those scriptures you certainly would have realized that, yes, there are people already in HELL as I type and you have the very opportunity NOW not to join them when you depart this world!

When you die, you are either received unto God or you are separated from God.

FYI, HELL is the place where God's MANIFESTED PRESENCE is not found because those in there have taken up the nature of evil -by reason of thier choice to reject Jesus and exchange thier life for his life and be born anew of Gods Spirit- and God can not behold evil.

Remember, you are only condemed to HELL because you chose NOT to BELIEVE GOD'S TESTIMONY IN JESUS.

Omo_Tier1:

I pray you will not be found wanting when your breathe finally departs.

If you have read through those scriptures you certainly would have realized that, yes, there are people already in HELL as I type and you have the very opportunity NOW not to join them when you depart this world!

When you die, you are either received unto God or you are separated from God.

FYI, HELL is the place where God's MANIFESTED PRESENCE is not found because those in there have taken up the nature of evil -by reason of thier choice to reject Jesus and exchange thier life for his life and be born anew of Gods Spirit- and God can not behold evil.

Remember, you are only condemed to HELL because you chose NOT to BELIEVE GOD'S TESTIMONY IN JESUS.

my guy, you are delusional, you are suffering from a psychosis. All the rubbish you are blabbing here is just the religious programming that has been programmed into your brain. All what u are writing is not from YOUR mind. It's from religious programming. You don't need to pray for me, pray for yourself so that you will not be shocked when you die and your spirit evolves to the next phase, and you discover all the doctrines religion put into your mind are all man-made ideas.
Your problem is that your are bible bound, you have been deceived in believing the bible is the word of God. God did not write any book, human beings wrote it. There are stages in life, you have not gotten to the stage where[b] YOU START TO THINK[/b]. It's not illegal to THINK. So if u have time, sit down and THINK, Religion is designed so that people DON'T THINK, that is why when you ask a religious person like yourself about anything, first thing they say is 'THE BIBLE SAYS, so and so' well don't you have a mind of your own - what do YOU think?
the moment you start to think, then religion has no hold on you.

Now back to your fear tactics about HELL FIRE. pls feel free to believe in hell if you want to. Well I don't, I don't believe in Jesus (as a saviour) or christianity either. I believe in myself and in my creator, the almighty. The almighty has nothing to do with religion. My religion is LOVE, I love myself, my creator and my neighbour. I dont need some jewish carpenter intermediary to come between me and the almighty, and I dont need a book either, the words of God are written in my essence.

You say: 'you are only condemed to HELL because you chose NOT to BELIEVE GOD'S TESTIMONY IN JESUS'. So every single person that lived before Jesus came 2,000 years ago are all in Hell fire according to your belief?

Bro, THINK!!! It's not illegal yet, but they are working on it.