Dtruthspeaker:


So, Noah, Job and Daniel who earned God's praise will not get eternal life? (Obviously, you did not know that God Honoured these men)

As I said, you do not know what you say.



Nope!

"Paul's Writings are Law Documents with Lawyers not theologians being the only ones who can give you the proper Interpretation of all he wrote.

Which is where you people make the errors. "End" in English means finished or terminated. In Law, it means "Destination" or "Goal" or "Purpose".

Same for "Without The Law", "not The Law", "By Law" etc

Paul's Writings can only be properly interpreted by Lawyers.

And the purport of all he said is Romans 8: 4 "That The Righteousness (bet you do not know that "Righteousness" means "Right Fullness" ) OF THE LAW MIGHT be fulfilled in us"!

So as you see, you have too many 'dont knows"

Before we can move forward, you'll have to explain what you mean by lawyers. Are you talking about people that studied law in the university?

Image123:


So the Bible doesn't say but you somehow affirmatively say what you think as what he did/didn't. Toh.
We're talking about sin, you want to engage in vain word jangling about "born again". Sorry i hardly spend that much time these days to be so entertained. Maybe the people you saw in hell would rather they had fled from sin or engage in rhymes about "born again".
It was quite funny but pathetic you refer to Ananias family as some random folk. Guess it's because they were the casualty there. If you had read from v32 and other verses, you'd know the multitude of them that believed was being referred to. BTW, Aquila and Apollos also have that introduction tag so perhaps they are just church goers too. Is that the way your church burys random people without even consulting their families or how they sell their propertys. Brother, listen to Bible, IF you sin and don't repent, judgment awaits you even if you are Jesus.

Please stop making the bolded statement, don't compare God to man to emphasize your point, its disrespectful.

If you'll be honest with yourself the Bible gave more informations about the beliefs of Aquila and Apollos.

I think, is not affirmative. There's simply not enough information to be definitive.

michaelwestern:

Before we can move forward, you'll have to explain what you mean by lawyers. Are you talking about people that studied law in the university?

Yes!

Like you, if you spoke Truly, we found it difficult to understand Paul's writings especially as it was not that hard in understanding Mathew, Mark and co.

But here comes Romans and gbam, it was a case of "what is this man saying now?"

It was while I was in the University trying to Study Law (whilst they were teaching "Not Law", Pastor Bakare, then pointed it out that "you know Paul is a Lawyer and trust lawyers, they know how to go into places no one has gone".

I did not know what that meant then but I held it in mind, until I became a Lawyer.

And it was then I re-visited Romans and co and then, gbam! I then saw, that Paul's Letters, "are Law Documents". Exactly how we, lawyers Write. Word for word, meaning for meaning, ensuring that we capture "every relevant issue" that is within the Scope of the Subject Matter.

And I am quite Angry that Pastors who are Lawyers do not teach these things.

michaelwestern:

People mean the whole world, saved and unsaved.

If people means the whole world, is the whole world "born again"?

michaelwestern:

I don't get this. Try to indicate exactly what you mean, I don't like making unnecessary assumptions.

For not "getting this" you really are too too young to attempt preaching.

As I said, "you know not what you say".

Dtruthspeaker:


If people means the whole world, is the whole world "born again"?

I don't honestly believe that you bothered to read the post. Please do. And if you did, then go back to re-read it. Your question has nothing to do with my post.

Dtruthspeaker:

For not "getting this" you really are too too young to attempt preaching.

As I said, "you know not what you say".

Lol, are you referring to my age or my years as a Christian? The fact that you think that those are the two things that give Biblical and Spiritual knowledge says a lot about you?

There are people that have been Christians for over 40 years and still don't have the basic knowledge of the word of God. Change your mentality.

Dtruthspeaker:


Yes!

Like you, if you spoke Truly, we found it difficult to understand Paul's writings especially as it was not that hard in understanding Mathew, Mark and co.

But here comes Romans and gbam, it was a case of "what is this man saying now?"

It was while I was in the University trying to Study Law (whilst they were teaching "Not Law", Pastor Bakare, then pointed it out that "you know Paul is a Lawyer and trust lawyers, they know how to go into places no one has gone".

I did not know what that meant then but I held it in mind, until I became a Lawyer.

And it was then I re-visited Romans and co and then, gbam! I then saw, that Paul's Letters, "are Law Documents". Exactly how we, lawyers Write. Word for word, meaning for meaning, ensuring that we capture "every relevant issue" that is within the Scope of the Subject Matter.

And I am quite Angry that Pastors who are Lawyers do not teach these things.

Now this is funny. This actually made me laugh.

Let me help you. Let's start from the basics, what do you mean by the phrase; Paul was a Lawyer? Do you think that Paul was going to Court to argue cases? Which type of law do you think paul studied?

Davenks:
Dear OP, hold on to what you have learned so far, but stop arguing with fools. The only thing you got wrong here is that one can lose their salvation. A believer cannot lose his salvation. He promised us eternal life. You cannot reject Jesus Christ after salvation as you are bone of His bone and flesh of His flesh. Will you pluck out your eyes because it refused to shed tears? Will you chop off your arm because it refused to be part of your body? We are the body of Christ. You can’t lose your salvation but you could lose your rewards at the judgement seat of Christ (1 Cor. 3:9-15; 2 Cor. 5:10-11; Rom. 14:10), or your right to rule and reign with Him at His millennial reign (2 Tim. 2:11-13; Rom. 8:14-16…”and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.” So the condition of earning rewards is suffering. Putting down your flesh from sinning is part of suffering. Living a holy Christian life, studying your Bible every day are part of suffering as they wear the flesh out.

1 John 5:12-13 “He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.”

Thank God for the blood of Jesus Christ. A believer is simply a saved sinner.

Even so, come, Lord Jesus. Amen.

I actually do believe that you can lose your salvation, but it won't be because of sin. You can lose your salvation by denying or rejecting Jesus Christ.

This is why it's always good to seek God regularly, by reading the word of God, listening to godly messages and musics, by praying, praising and thanking God regularly etc.

The problem is when you don't seek God regularly but you still continue to live in sin. You can get to a point that, if for example, somebody puts a gun to your head and say deny Christ or I will kill you, you might be tempted to deny Jesus.

Very interesting Topic . . . .

petra1:
Very interesting Topic . . . .

What are your thoughts?

the devil is the father of all lies.verily verily i say unto you if your righteosnes is not greater than that of the pharisee you cant enter the kingdom of heaven..verily verily i say unto you not everbody that calls me lord,lord will enter the kingdom of heaven,you will say lord did i not preach on nairaland.go to church,heal the sick and cast out demons,the lord will away from me you worker of iniquity.

when they find sin hard to let go,because of their hardened heart,then they twist the gospel to feel comfortable in sin.instead of crying out to the lord for help..GOD CANNOT BE MOCKED.if only you know how sweet holiness is,if only you know.

REPENT NOW,AND CRY OUT TO GOD FOR MERCY.

Gointo:
when they find sin hard to let go,because of their hardened heart,then they twist the gospel to feel comfortable in sin.instead of crying out to the lord for help..GOD CANNOT MOCKED.if only you know how sweet holiness is,if only you know.

Holiness is sweet when it comes by grace. The sweetness you're referring to is most likely self righteousness. But do you know the problem, even with all your self righteousness you still don't deserve eternal life. Eternal life can only be gotten by grace.

Gointo:
the devil is the father of all lies.verily verily i say unto you if your righteosnes is not greater than that of the pharisee you cant enter the kingdom of heaven..verily verily i say unto you not everbody that calls me lord,lord will enter the kingdom of heaven,you will say lord did i not preach on nairaland.go to church,heal the sick and cast out demons,the lord will away from me you worker of iniquity.

I agree. The righteousness gotten by grace from God is greater than that of the Pharisees or the one you hope to get by works.

Gointo:
REPENT NOW,AND CRY OUT TO GOD FOR MERCY.

God has already shown me mercy by dying for me. I have therefore obtained the mercy of God when I gave my life to Jesus Christ

no man speak by the spirit of God trivalize sin,lol he said conventional sin.....nations and generations of people were destroyed because of what you called convention...in the last days false teaching shall abound,sponsored by lying spirit seducing men into inquity(spiritual leprosy and death).
i know your type it all started by learning praying in tongues..its written verily,verily i say unto you if a man is not born of water and of the spirit he can by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.you can ascribe the title of christian to yourself but i tell you the door of heaven is opened to those who do the will of my father in heaven to the very end,and its written blessed are those who hunger and thirst for the kingdom and its righteoness for they shall filled, with what? With the holyspirit. A word is enough for the wise.

Do you know that your teaching here(sin doesn't take you to hell) is the same thing Satan did to deceive mankind, when God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die and the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die..

What brought sin that we now talk about is disobedience to the word of God. .
Now the consequence of the disobedience is death.
Now GRACE which you've been falsely taught, is that by the fall of man ,man had been sentenced to death.

Now lord JESUS CHRIST offered himself as the LAMB for the atonement of sin to overrule the curse of death..
That is why he said to Mary when he went to raise lazarus from the dead in John 11:25
Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

Also inRevelation 1:18
I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

So grace is not pardon to sin .
But grace is that we sin no more ,because we have been given power to subdue the flesh by his spirit, that is why every believer main priority is to be filled with the holy spirit.

1 John 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

I agree if a believer commit an error and is truly bitter about it and determined not to go back to his vomit ,he will be forgiven and will not be denied his rightful place in heaven...

michaelwestern:


Now this is funny. This actually made me laugh.

Let me help you. Let's start from the basics, what do you mean by the phrase; Paul was a Lawyer? Do you think that Paul was going to Court to argue cases? Which type of law do you think paul studied?

O boy! It is very unhealthy for me to argue with a growing child like you.

See, what Paul did in Acts 17:16-31.

Sorry, son, you too little for me to be arguing with you as your "you do not know is making us move from one issue to another to another.

And since you think you know, then we should not be moving. But your movements clearly show, you know too little to amount to any tangible knowledge!

Dtruthspeaker:


O boy! It is very unhealthy for me to argue with a growing child like you.

See, what Paul did in Acts 17:16-31.

Sorry, son, you too little for me to be arguing with you as your "you do not know is making us move from one issue to another to another.

And since you think you know, then we should not be moving. But your movements clearly show, you know too little to amount to any tangible knowledge!

You always dodge my questions

Gointo:
Do you know that your teaching here(sin doesn't take you to hell) is the same thing Satan did to deceive mankind, when God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die and the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die..

What brought sin that we now talk about is disobedience to the word of God. .
Now the consequence of the disobedience is death.
Now GRACE which you've been falsely taught, is that by the fall of man ,man had been sentenced to death.

Now lord JESUS CHRIST offered himself as the LAMB for the atonement of sin to overrule the curse of death..
That is why he said to Mary when he went to raise lazarus from the dead in John 11:25
Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

Also inRevelation 1:18
I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

So grace is not pardon to sin .
But grace is that we sin no more ,because we have been given power to subdue the flesh by his spirit, that is why every believer main priority is to be filled with the holy spirit.

1 John 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

I agree if a believer commit an error and is truly bitter about it and determined not to go back to his vomit ,he will be forgiven and will not be denied his rightful place in heaven...

You don't know what grace is. By definition, the Gospel of Grace is receiving forgiveness without the works of the law. This simply means that you are now righteous without having to do anything for it . Believing in Jesus life and accepting His sacrifice for sins is the only requirement to go to heaven

I'm not advocating that anybody should live a life of sin. I'm simply saying that sin cannot make you lose your salvation because you didn't get your salvation by being righteous you got it as a gift. So you should never try to work for something that has been given to you freely. All you have to do is receive the righteousness of God and stop trying to get righteousness by fulfilling the laws. There are a lot benefits obeying God's commandments but getting eternal life is not one of them.

Gointo:
no man speak by the spirit of God trivalize sin,lol he said conventional sin.....nations and generations of people were destroyed because of what you called convention...in the last days false teaching shall abound,sponsored by lying spirit seducing men into inquity(spiritual leprosy and death).
i know your type it all started by learning praying in tongues..its written verily,verily i say unto you if a man is not born of water and of the spirit he can by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.you can ascribe the title of christian to yourself but i tell you the door of heaven is opened to those who do the will of my father in heaven to the very end,and its written blessed are those who hunger and thirst for the kingdom and its righteoness for they shall filled, with what? With the holyspirit. A word is enough for the wise.

I'm not trivializing sin, I'm just saying that sin cannot take a born again Christian to hell

michaelwestern:


You always dodge my questions

It is not True I dodge them, it is rather that I answer them and 3 more stupid ones enter.

And the more I answer, the more even stupider questions seem to be coming.

And these degrading questions only come from little children for adults already know the answers to them all, but not you.

And this forum is for adults!

So you see, I am not expecting a little child here.

Dtruthspeaker:


It is not True I dodge them, it is rather that I answer them and 3 more stupid ones enter.

And the more I answer, the more even stupider questions seem to be coming.

And these degrading questions only come from little children for adults already know the answers to them all, but not you.

And this forum is for adults!

So you see, I am not expecting a little child here.

Lol

michaelwestern:


Please stop making the bolded statement, don't compare God to man to emphasize your point, its disrespectful.

If you'll be honest with yourself the Bible gave more informations about the beliefs of Aquila and Apollos.

I think, is not affirmative. There's simply not enough information to be definitive.

Brother, the man Jesus Christ was here with us and forsaken by the Father when He bore the sins of the world. So again, do not sin even if you are Jesus Christ. God forsakes sinners.
You made an affirmative statement by informing us that Ananias and his wife were mere church goers and not born again.

michaelwestern:


I'm not trivializing sin, I'm just saying that sin cannot take a born again Christian to hell

You Wish!

Gointo:

i know your type it all started by learning praying in tongues..

What has this got to do with praying in tongues? Do you have any issues against it

petra1:


What has this got to do with praying in tongues? Do you have any issues against it

i have issue with it because God has issue with it...if your speaking in tongue didnot start by the baptism of the spirit then its blasphemous..we have alot of people who have not yet encounter the holyspirit but jump to speaking in tongue that they learned or practiced carnally...imagine someone wants to get baptised,they hold your hands and begin to speak in tongue and ask the person to speak in tongue along,flow along with them,pick it as it come across his mind..good you getting it,you did 5min,now practice more and more then you can do 1hour and more...is that how it happened in d bible? Now the person will be deceived for life that he is filled with d holyghost,deceived not to receive the promise of d father.,.d devil had deceived many in dis generation...i pray in tongue in the holyghost as spi gave me utterance and im a witness dat its a wnderful gift of d holys

i pray in tongue in the holyghost as spirit gave me utterance and im a witness dat its a wnderful gift of d holyspirit....so that why i said the deceit start when fake tongues are prayed to show they are filled with the holyghost then dat same person who claims to have the holyghost and tongue in the flesh wil now fornicate with a girl and come to out and say sin doesnot take him to hell,jesus paid the price,finished work bla bla..deceit continual continual..he dat has an ear let him hear...

Image123:


Brother, the man Jesus Christ was here with us and forsaken by the Father when He bore the sins of the world. So again, do not sin even if you are Jesus Christ. God forsakes sinners.
You made an affirmative statement by informing us that Ananias and his wife were mere church goers and not born again.

I wasn't talking specifically about our conversation, I meant that generally don't compare man to Jesus Christ to emphasize your point. Jesus Christ is God, stop mentioning His name to win arguments, it's very disrespectful. I understand that you're trying to say that it applies to everyone. But it's wrong to start putting Jesus in the same category as man. You should give maximum respect to name of Jesus Christ, it is a name that is above all other names. Try to only call the name of Jesus Christ when it is absolutely necessary. Do you know that Jesus Christ was involved in the creation of the world?

About Ananias, my point is that we can't build doctrines on their story because the details given didn't even show that they were born again Christians. You don't build doctrines on assumptions. Besides, even if they were Christians you still won't have the right to build a doctrine on it because it was clearly a unique situation. How many people has God killed for lying to men of God in church. It's like taking a doctrine of not marrying because Paul never got married.

petra1:


What has this got to do with praying in tongues? Do you have any issues against it

It's shocking that a Christian will believe that praying in tongues will lead you astray, whereas, it's the exact opposite.

Gointo:
i pray in tongue in the holyghost as spirit gave me utterance and im a witness dat its a wnderful gift of d holyspirit....so that why i said the deceit start when fake tongues are prayed to show they are filled with the holyghost then dat same person who claims to have the holyghost and tongue in the flesh wil now fornicate with a girl and come to out and say sin doesnot take him to hell,jesus paid the price,finished work bla bla..deceit continual continual..he dat has an ear let him hear...

Be very careful about calling people's tongue fake except God specifically told you that it's fake. When it comes anything that involves the Holy Spirit try not to make unnecessary assumptions.

Now, about the fornication scenario you mentioned. Are you saying that if a Spirit filled person fornicates the person is definitely going hell? So since you received the baptism of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues, you've never committed any sin? Or it applies to fornication alone?

Stop deceiving yourself man

michaelwestern:
Conventional sins like; lies, murder, fornication etc do not take people to hell fire. The only sin that takes people to hell is the sin of not accepting the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Every sin, past, present and future has been dealt with by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, once and for all. When you get saved, your salvation is secured by the Holy Spirit and no sin whatsoever can make you lose your salvation and take you to hell fire.

The only way that you can lose your salvation is by rejecting Jesus Christ. Sin can never make you lose your salvation. God has forgiven you of your sins, past present and future

Now does this mean that you should go and live in sin? The Bible said God forbid. There are many negative effects of sin but losing your salvation is not one of them. Consistently living in sin can desensitize you to the things of the spirit to the point that you might actually deny Christ and lose your salvation but individual sins like murder, adultery, fornication can not and will never take anyone to hell or make you lose your salvation . Condemnation when we commit sin is one of the major tools that the devil use to keep us in the bondage of sin. The moment you are accept Jesus Christ as your lord and savior, sin is no longer a problem between you and God.

For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Hebrew 10:14

Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. Romans 3:28

Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. Romans 4:6-8